On 10 Jan 2015, at 06:53, John Clark wrote:
Bruno Marchal <[email protected]> wrote:
>>>But it is a simple and mudane facts that it means quite different
things according to time, place, culture
>> So is there any time place or culture where you would be willing
to say in a loud clear unequivocal voice "I do not believe in
God"? Could you ever say those words with no ifs, ands, or buts, or
would the words always stick in your throat?
> I believe in God.
Yes, I knew you'd say that. Even though you just said "God" means
many things depending on the time, place and culture you apparently
believe in every single one of them because you can't bring
yourself to say "I do not believe in God", not in any time not in
any place and not in any culture. And that tells me that you've
fallen in love with the sound your tongue makes when it makes the "G-
O-D" noise even though there is no longer any meaning behind the
sound anymore. No meaning whatsoever.
Not really, it is a belief in meaning. It is a bet on the possible
unification of our variate knowledge and beliefs. It is the motor of
the fundamental science. It is what I am exploring, with logic and
mathematics.
It is not a priori any God of any book, but there are many
similarities with many such books.
> They called themselves muslims, but [...]
To hell with the "but", the people who call themselves Muslims have
murdered millions of people just in the last few years and oppressed
a billion, and the people who call themselves Muslims won't be
satisfied until they've oppressed all 7.1 billion people on the
planet.
It seems to me that you repeat the propaganda of the fanatic muslims.
Meanwhile the so called moderate Muslim
There is no so called "moderate" muslims. There are muslims, and among
them, like among the christians, some are sort of nazis.
To put all muslims in the same bag, hide the responsibility of the
nazis, disguised in the clothe of Islam, which are responsible for the
hate and the violence, and unfortunately some amount of lies and
brainwashing of the kids.
It is just that the second war is not yet finished. The chart of the
Hamas is really more a summing up of Mein Kampf than of the Quran.
What is grave is that us, the occident continue to finance Hamas, to
have relationship with Qatar and Saoudi Arabia, and in that way, to
promote antisemitisme, antisionnisme, terrorisme and violence, for
reason of special interests, etc.
remains as hard to find as the Abominable Snowman and has about as
much effect on world events as the space alien in Roswell New
Mexico. Peaceful Muslims may exist but they share many of the same
very bad ideas as suicidal lunatic Muslims do, and as Bill Maher has
said when there are that many bad apples maybe there is something
wrong with the orchard.
>>> They performed sacrifices, human and otherwise, to gain the
favor of their "God", and they built temples to their "God", and
they built statues of their "God" that was supposed to show what
"God" looked like. In some cases the statues seems to have actually
become their "God". But how do you build a statue of the inflation
field? Does the inflation field have a beard?
>> Where are all these God believers who built no temples, made no
statues, performed no sacrifices and said no prayers that you keep
talking about?
> Most remain silent.
Yes exactly, they remained silent and thus had little or no effect
on world events, just as nearly all Muslims remain silent over the
murders committed in the name of Islam.
It is just false that they are silent. In my country they have tried
to criticize the facts that we were building only salafist mosques,
which was not representative of the Islam of the majority of belgium
muslim, and that they were developing hate discourse, etc. But they
were treated as racist! It was politically incorrect to criticize
*any* muslims, and we have continued to be on the side of the
fanatics, since long. That is grave. We help to put the fanatics into
power.
>> Where are all the leaders who say they did NOT hear God's voice
telling them what to do?
> Plato, Plotinus, etc.
And how many divisions did Plato and Plotinus command? How many
square miles did their armies conquer?
0.
I remind you that in science we use reason, not armies.
>> Where are all the nations or city-states or tribes who say God is
NOT on our side in this war?
> The same. In occident, religion has become silly,
The idea that there is a personal God and He looks sorta like us us
was not invented in the west and the idea is not new, statues of
fertility Gods have been found as early as 35,000 BC, the Venus of
Hohle Fels for example. But yes, it has always been silly, you'd
have thought we would have outgrown that sort of imbecility by now
but we have not.
That is why the greek approach was a big progress. they made theology
into science, and from this physics, mathematics and theology were
born. But then we have regressed, and with the Enlightenment Period, a
bit of science has come back, but for theology, it looks we have to
wait a bit longer, probably due to the materialist believers who seem
to be uneasy with the idea that Matter might be the last big human
superstition to go.
Bruno
John K Clark
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