On 26 June 2015 at 14:56, Bruce Kellett <[email protected]> wrote:
> Stathis Papaioannou wrote: > > On Friday, June 26, 2015, meekerdb <[email protected] <mailto: >> [email protected]>> wrote: >> >> On 6/25/2015 11:24 AM, Stathis Papaioannou wrote: >> >>> >>> ISTM there's an equivocation here between a continuation in >>> consciousness and continuation in body. If we say "the >>> person" is just a continuum of conscious thoughts, then they >>> are both continuations of the original. If we take into >>> account the physical instantiation then we can say which is >>> the original (assuming he's not destroyed and reconstructed in >>> the duplication process) even though they are both >>> continuations, by different means, of the original. >>> >>> Surely continuation in consciousness is what we mean when >>> discussing personal identity. The atoms making up my body last >>> year have mostly dispersed in the biosphere, but I don't consider >>> that a great loss. >>> >> >> That's a logic chopping answer. Sure the atoms have dispersed, but >> the physical structural relations have persisted and these are not >> the same as conscious thoughts. >> >> But the main reason we care about the physical structural relations >> persisting is that they ensure continuity of consciousness. If the physical >> structure was mostly preserved but the subject was unconscious or radically >> different in consciousness then we would say he had not survived, whereas >> if the physical structure were different, for example if the brain were >> replaced with a computer, but consciousness similar then we (or at least I) >> would say that the subject had survived. >> > > The philosophical and metaphysical issues are deeper than this. I refer > you to the ancient Indian Tale "The Transposed Heads", especially as retold > in the novella by Thomas Mann. > > "The fact that Mann did not refer to a faithful translation of the > original tale but has referred to and is influenced by a revaluation of it > becomes a relevant factor in our reading of The Transposed Heads, because > an interpretation and a revaluation is necessarily a view point, depicting > a particular philosophy of life exposing an aspect of truth and reality. A > symbolic reinterpretation is a value judgment and not an unbiased statement > of fact. Mann, therefore, not only endeavours to retell an ancient tale but > analyses the logical and metaphysical implications posed by the story. He > imposes on the tale an extension to prove his point. If the original tale > ends with a solution to the riddle, he carries the solution to its logical > extremes to show its implications. If the head is superior to all organs, > and the man with the husband’s head becomes the husband, what happens to > the body? Is life so mechanically conceived that one can transpose heads > without it leading to serious repercussions? Can life go on as before after > that? Does the head not impose its temperament upon the body? What about > the woman, who is aware of the husband body living elsewhere? Can she > tacitly accept such a solution to the problem without reacting to it? All > these questions are implicitly posed and an attempt is made to seek answers > to them in Mann’s version. Girish Karnad claims to be influenced by Mann’s > rendering of the story rather than the original Katha Sarit Sagara story. > Mann, in his turn had referred to Zimmer’s version. Thus Karnad’s recasting > of the story is many times removed from the original. > > "Mann retells the tale from a metaphysical, yet ironic viewpoint. He > strongly reacts to the axiomatic assumption that there is a dichotomy > between spirit and life, mind and body. An ironic vision of life, > skepticism and cynicism are typical features of the 20th century mind. > Combined with this is the modern man’s search for identity in the context > of an ancient past, in myths and legends. Mann, with his ironic revaluation > of an ancient tale tries to search for relevance in time honoured values. > He, like many 20th century writers felt the necessity of reshuffling the > present scale of values and meanings by constantly juxtaposing them with > older ones." > > From a discussion of the tale and Mann's retelling, by Pratibha Umashankar. > http://www.museindia.com/viewarticle.asp?myr=2012&issid=41&id=3068 If you swapped heads and your new body caused your mind to change, that only proves the point: the mind is the important part, the body is only important insofar as it affects the mind. -- Stathis Papaioannou -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
