> On 3 May 2019, at 08:26, [email protected] wrote: > > > > On Thursday, May 2, 2019 at 8:03:52 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: > > > On 5/2/2019 4:55 PM, [email protected] <javascript:> wrote: >> >> >> On Thursday, May 2, 2019 at 5:37:26 PM UTC-5, Brent wrote: >> >> >> On 5/2/2019 11:39 AM, [email protected] <> wrote: >>> >>> Apparently matter is not "reducible" to just the physics a couple of >>> particles. >> >> Then you're not a materialist. You think there is matter plus something >> else, that everyone calls "mind", but you're going to call it "matter" and >> add it to everyone else's list of matter so you can still call yourself a >> materialist. >> >> Brent >> >> >> >> >> But everything reducing to the physics of particles is thought of as >> physicalism (not materialism): >> Physicalism and materialism >> >> Reductive physicalism >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Reductive_physicalism>...is normally assumed >> to be incompatible with panpsychism. Materialism >> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Materialism>, if held to be distinct from >> physicalism, is compatible with panpsychism insofar as mental properties >> > > What mental properties? intention? reflection? remembering? That's what I > mean by saying attributing "experience" to matter is an unprincipled > half-measure. > > Brent > > > Brains are matter, just as livers, legs, trees, tables, rocks, comets, > planets, stars, cockroaches, galaxies, bacteria .. are matter. > > Brains produce intentions, reflections, remembrances, ... . > > So (at least some) matter of the cosmos has psychical (mental) properties. > > The body+mind idea, the idea that mind is something separate from body, is > perhaps the worst idea ever invented.
At least we agree on this. That is dualism, and is easily shown insane. Now, what can be proved is that Mechanism is incompatible with weak materialism (that is with both dualism and physicalism/materialism). I have shown that we can test mechanism, and that up to now, thanks to Quantum Mechanics which confirms Mechanism and its consequences. Materialisme/physicalism have problem of its own: - what is it? - why does it seem to obey mathematical laws - why consciousness? How matter is related to consciousness? Materialist tends to either eliminate consciousness, or dismiss it as a unimportant details, or introduce identity thesis which requires strong ontological infinity axioms, or Oracle, for which we have no evidences today. Bruno > > @philipthrift > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To post to this group, send email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list > <https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list>. > For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout > <https://groups.google.com/d/optout>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to [email protected]. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. Visit this group at https://groups.google.com/group/everything-list. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/21FDED54-0E1C-4185-9B1C-6265429F76D8%40ulb.ac.be. For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
