> On 16 May 2019, at 05:07, 'Brent Meeker' via Everything List > <[email protected]> wrote: > > And why should I care what the Quran says?
The neoplatonist reading of the Quran has lead to Enlightened Islam, which has lead to Averroes, and eventually European coming back to science (except for the missing theology). The Aristotelian reading of the Quran has lead to the elimination of person, the literalism in religion, obscurantism and wars. It is bit the same with the bible and the gospel, but it looks like Maimonides has prevented the jews to fall in the theological trap. Those who try to convert other people just spread their lack of belief in God, or better in <No-Name>. If they trust God, they trust it means, and let HIM/HER/IT to do the job. Bruno > > Brent > "Science flies to the moon. Religion flies into buildings." > --- Vic Stenger > > On 5/15/2019 7:47 PM, Samiya Illias wrote: >> The Quran presents a similar idea of one gigantic sky layered into seven >> skies, each with its own laws/commands/affair. Please read excerpt below >> >> ... >> Revisiting Surah alFussilat (Explained in Detail), we read: >> >> ثُمَّ اسْتَوَىٰ إِلَى السَّمَاءِ وَهِيَ دُخَانٌ فَقَالَ لَهَا وَلِلْأَرْضِ >> ائْتِيَا طَوْعًا أَوْ كَرْهًا قَالَتَا أَتَيْنَا طَائِعِينَ >> فَقَضَاهُنَّ سَبْعَ سَمَاوَاتٍ فِي يَوْمَيْنِ وَأَوْحَىٰ فِي كُلِّ سَمَاءٍ >> أَمْرَهَاوَزَيَّنَّا السَّمَاءَ الدُّنْيَا بِمَصَابِيحَ وَحِفْظًا ذَٰلِكَ >> تَقْدِيرُ الْعَزِيزِ الْعَلِيمِ >> >> Then He directed (Himself) towards the heaven while it (was) smoke, and He >> said to it and to the earth, "Come both of you willingly or unwillingly." >> They both said, "We come willingly." >> Then He completed them (as) seven heavens in two periods and He revealed in >> each heaven its affair. And We adorned the heaven, [the world] with lamps >> and (to) guard. That (is the) Decree (of) the All-Mighty, the All-Knower. >> [Al-Quran 41:11 <https://www.islamawakened.com/quran/41/11/>-12 >> <https://www.islamawakened.com/quran/41/12/>] >> ... >> excerpt from: >> http://signsandscience.blogspot.com/2018/11/separate-in-space.html >> <http://signsandscience.blogspot.com/2018/11/separate-in-space.html?m=0> >> >> On 15-May-2019, at 8:41 PM, spudboy100 via Everything List >> <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >> wrote: >> >>> Some years ago, some astronomer or cosmologist introduced the idea of One >>> Gigantic Universe, but many, many, "domains," which, for me, is the same >>> thing as Everett's-Deutsch's-Tegmark's multiverses. I am not sure if all >>> domains followed the identical laws, or varied, or..? >>> >>> >>> -----Original Message----- >>> From: Bruno Marchal <[email protected] <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> To: everything-list <[email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>> >>> Sent: Wed, May 15, 2019 11:31 am >>> Subject: Re: My book "I Am" published on amazon >>> >>> >>>> On 13 May 2019, at 08:55, Philip Thrift <[email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> On Sunday, May 12, 2019 at 9:40:12 PM UTC-5, Jason wrote: >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> Incompleteness disproves nominalism. Arithmetical truth was proven not >>>> only to be not human defined, but to be not human definable. >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> (This is something I posted a few days ago in another forum.) >>>> >>>> From Joel David Hamkins @JDHamkins - http://jdh.hamkins.org/ >>>> <http://jdh.hamkins.org/> >>>> >>>> "Truths" in the set-theoretic multiverse (slides from a talk last week): >>>> >>>> http://jdh.hamkins.org/wp- content/uploads/Is-there-more- >>>> than-one-mathematical- universe.pdf >>>> <http://jdh.hamkins.org/wp-content/uploads/Is-there-more-than-one-mathematical-universe.pdf> >>>> >>>> >>>> The final slides: >>>> >>>> ---- >>>> >>>> The Continuum Hypothesis is settled >>>> >>>> On the multiverse perspective, the CH question is settled. >>>> It is incorrect to describe it as an open question. >>>> >>>> The answer consists of our detailed understanding of how the >>>> CH both holds and fails throughout the multiverse, of how these >>>> models are connected and how one may reach them from each >>>> other while preserving or omitting certain features. >>>> >>>> Fascinating open questions about CH remain, of course, but the >>>> most important essential facts are known. >>>> >>>> Ultimately, the question becomes: do we have just one >>>> mathematical world or many >>>> >>>> ---- >>>> >>>> Mathematics is a language - with multiple dialects. >>>> >>>> Each dialect of mathematics has its own syntax (to some extent) >>>> and semantics! >>> >>> If it has a semantic, it is not just a language, there is a >>> reality/model/semantic, and we have to distinguish languages and possible >>> theories on that reality. >>> >>> It is obvious (for a mathematical logician) that there are many >>> mathematical worlds, but like in physics, this does not interfere with >>> realism, on the contrary. Now, I use only arithmetical realism, on which >>> everybody agree. The standard arithmetical truth is definable with a bit of >>> set theory, on which most people agree (as it is the intersection of all >>> models of the theories RA or PA). That is as acceptable as any theorem in >>> analysis. With Mechanism, Analysis, and physics, >>> remains full of sense, but have became phenomenological. >>> >>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> There is no settled "truth" in mathematics. >>>> >>>> For example (as Hamkins shows) the CH is true in one dialect (of set >>>> theory) and false in another. >>> >>> That was shown by Cohen and Gödel. >>> >>> Interestingly, ZFC and ZF + CH does not prove more arithmetical >>> propositions than ZF alone. The arithmetical truth is totally independent >>> of the axiom of choice or the continuum hypotheses. >>> >>> Now, ZF proves much more theorems in arithmetic than PA, which proves much >>> more than RA. >>> >>> Bruno >>> >>> >>> >>>> >>>> @philipthrift >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>>> "Everything List" group. >>>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>>> email to [email protected] >>>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/06ca3480-cdf1-426b-9f38-404bc2fa1550%40googlegroups.com >>>> >>>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/06ca3480-cdf1-426b-9f38-404bc2fa1550%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. >>>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/07CE2D6F-E36D-45E6-883E-E9A13C4812B3%40ulb.ac.be >>> >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/07CE2D6F-E36D-45E6-883E-E9A13C4812B3%40ulb.ac.be?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer> >>> . >>> -- >>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >>> "Everything List" group. >>> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >>> email to [email protected] >>> <mailto:[email protected]>. >>> To view this discussion on the web visit >>> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/1625287452.1090267.1557934879733%40mail.yahoo.com >>> >>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/1625287452.1090267.1557934879733%40mail.yahoo.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. >> -- >> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups >> "Everything List" group. >> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an >> email to [email protected] >> <mailto:[email protected]>. >> To view this discussion on the web visit >> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/F3788EBD-E91D-4264-8873-6A4BD0A8D204%40gmail.com >> >> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/F3788EBD-E91D-4264-8873-6A4BD0A8D204%40gmail.com?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. > > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "Everything List" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an > email to [email protected] > <mailto:[email protected]>. > To view this discussion on the web visit > https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/d861ab86-684d-0891-fad0-e45956c25daa%40verizon.net > > <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/everything-list/d861ab86-684d-0891-fad0-e45956c25daa%40verizon.net?utm_medium=email&utm_source=footer>. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Everything List" group. 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