---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <LEnglish5@...> wrote :

 So you're saying that an enlightened person loses the ability to descriminate 
between a flower and a duck? 

 Or loses the ability to name things because they see the fundamental unity in 
the diversity?

 That reads like you've responded to the wrong post. What are you expecting as 
a reward for all this meditation?

 What I mean is that things don't change a whole bunch. Sure you get a bit more 
of something as well as what you've got now but it doesn't change what your 
senses are capable of perceiving. And this "fundamental unity" may just be a 
fancy name for a type of perceptive change similar to certain hallucinogenic 
states. I've experienced both, the TM one is nice but "fundamental" is 
stretching it as it isn't giving you any secret knowledge, just presenting what 
we all get a bit differently.


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <no_re...@yahoogroups.com> wrote :


---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <LEnglish5@...> wrote :

 The way Maharishi explained the "illusion of Maya" is rather different than 
what a lot of people understand. 

 Consciousness is not an illusion, nor is what most people call "reality."

 The illusion is that there is a fundamental difference between them.


 This is the "veil of maya": a thin, non-existent membrane that separates the 
two which is merely an artifact of our perception of things based on having a 
nervous system. Full enlightenment is when you can full see on both sides of 
that non-existent veil.

 I'll go along with that, except for the bit about seeing everything on both 
sides after enlightenment. 



---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, <inmadison@...> wrote :

 This may be above my pay-grade, but if one is a transcendentalist/idealist, 
then belief in classic cause and effect is incompatible with that belief . . . 
or one has to significantly qualify what is meant by cause and effect.   Many 
folks who refer to them selves as transcendentalists/idealists are actually 
dualists, or simply rebranded materialists (I am not suggesting you are)

Regarding the 'illusion' - when you pick up an object, like an apple for 
example, what does your experience tell you?    When I pick up an apple, I see 
it's color and shape, I feel the texture and if pressed with a fingernail - I 
can sense the sticky juice, I taste the tart sweetness . . . and I remember 
apple pies and so forth.  My experience of the apple is passionate and lively - 
Where is the illusion?  Toss in more awareness and all you get is more passion 
- there is no illusion.  'Illusion' is just India of old - we don't need no 
stinking illusion in the 21st century.

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