Thinking further on Guru Dev's biography, it occurs to me that it 
would be a good project to make an accurate translation of the Hindi 
text, or at least those quotations of Guru Dev contained within the 
text. I say this as I note that neither of the translaters have 
properly translated the phrase 'isa prakaara malamuutra ke bhaa.NDa 
meM nau mahiine biita gaye'
The Hindi word 'malamuutra' seems to mean mal+muutra i.e. 'excrement 
and urine'. That is to say, Guru Dev was saying that for nine months 
he was confined in his own filth. Neither translator thinks to 
include mention of this remark.



--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, "Premanand Paul Mason" 
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>
> RE: Guru Dev's nine months upside down in a woman
> 
> There are two published translations of the Hindi biography of Guru
> Dev. The most widely available is 'The Whole Thing The Real Thing'
> which is a 'transcreation' (not necessarilly a precise translation)
> into English of material previously only available in Hindi. Raj
> Varma (MMY's uncle) later published 'Strange Facts about a Great
> Saint' in which he offered a closer translation of many of the
> stories of Guru Dev. The tale referring to the time spent in the 
womb
> is a case in point, comparison of the two texts is revealing:-
> 
> "I spent nine months in intimate contact with you womenfolk. How
> shabbily was I treated? Hung upside down in solitary confinement in 
a
> dark, damp, dingy cell - I can never forget those days. That is the
> reason why I have lost all desire for your company." TWTTRT
> 
> "I lived in the company of you people for nine months. What was my
> condition at that time? It was reverse. I was tightly bounded from
> all sides and there were sufferings beyond limits. In this
> troublesome way I had passed nine months. Those days, I still
> remember. This is the reason why I do not have the least desire to 
be
> in the company of women folk." TSTaaGS
> 
> Perhaps they appear similar, but Raj's rendering, the more accurate,
> is free of the criticism that Guru Dev was treated 'shabbily', 
which 
> colours the reading somewhat. For those with Hindi speaking 
friends, 
> I offer Guru Dev's actual words, as given in an ashram publication:-
> 
> "main aap logon ke samsarg men nau mahine raha. us samay meri kaisi
> dasha thi! ulate tange the, bandhanon men jakadaa tha kashta ka
> paravar na tha. is prakar malamutra ke bhanda men nau mahine bit
> gaye. ve dina mujhe aaj bhi nahin bhulate. yahii karana hai ki aap
> logon ke sampark ki ichchha nahiin karata."
> 
> 'Itrans' version of the Hindi:-
> " maiM aapa logoM ke saMsarga meM nau mahiine rahaa . usa samaya
> merii kaisii dashaa thii ! ulaTe Ta.Nge the , bandhanoM meM jaka.Daa
> thaa kashhTa kaa paaraavaara na thaa . isa prakaara malamuutra ke
> bhaa.NDa meM nau mahiine biita gaye . ve dina mujhe aaja bhii nahiiM
> bhuulate . yahii kaaraNa hai ki aapa logoM ke samparka kii ichchhaa
> nahiiM karataa ." - shrii jyotirshhpiiThoddhaaraka
> 
> 
> 
> --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Rick Archer <fairfieldlife@> 
> wrote:
> >
> > Hi Rick, still have no account on FFL.
> > But would like to suggest this.
> > 
> > In the 70s, someone in germ-any brought some stuff from India, 
which
> > was
> > "sermons by GD", and printed them. mmy asked him not to do that 
and
> > not to distribute.
> > He agreed on that, and later said, he was hugged on the inner 
level
> > by mmy, saying, "this is my realm", (or area or responsibility...)
> > 
> > On two quotes from GD, I would say, he also was limited.
> > One was your quote about being nine months upside down in a woman.
> > But if we look at it, it`s not the woman`s design. Every woman, if
> > she had the choice, would hold the child nine months to her heart.
> > As far as I know, that is the design of...... I forgot, really...
> > 
> > 2nd quote was, that he allowed himself to be whorshipped, since 
the
> > vedas accepted that for a teacher.
> > This is nice, but for me not adequate for our time.
> > Authority is based (for me) either on love or
> > competence. Not written somewhere....
> > 
> > As I wrote to Premanand:
> > If enlightenment is a "science", than for sure we are here to
> > unfold it, even improve it.
> > like math or space science, or whatever....
> > 
> > cheers
> >
>







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