Leave it alone for this group for the time being yes.
Leave it alone for the coming months and years, no.
Just look at the LAND's END example at www.Scene7.com when you try out
the Trial.
This is Adobe competing against the developers it sells to.
This is not about me, it's about Ear-Marking what I feel could be an
unethical step in the wrong direction.
Don't let the PDF paper page flipper fool you. This is about FLEX
solutions.
And no, none of this would have been possible if it weren't for the
extremely talented developers at FutureWave who managed to create a
plug-in FutureSplash which became Flash, that was so small that not
even slow (very slow) connections noticed anything going on except a
Rich Vector Like experience.
The first to use it: MSN.com They quickly stopped using it when they
realized the implications.
FLEX 1.0 - Do you remember what it cost? Do you know how many people
are extremely outraged they spent that kind of money.
But those are not my concerns, my concerns are for THIS Community of
FLEX developers, or someone coming out of college and deciding on what
platform to program on.
Scene7.com is an indication that a developer, young and fresh out of
college, should be wary of investing their time in Adobe if they begin
to take potential FLEX contracts away from the Developers they charge
nearly $2,000 to purchase FLEX tools from.
You keep trying to personalize this as "it's up to me" / of course it
is igit. I'm not concerned about me, I'm concerned about the industry.
The little guy innovates (FutureWave; and make no doubt about it,
Adobe could not have done this in the mid 90's and they did not;
Macromedia, honorably improved the interface; Adobe purchases it,
charges an arm and a leg for the 1st version, gets more reasonable,
and now is taking a huge step in a direction that could lead to a
Popular Product that all will use to create the eCommmerce catalogs --
YES, THAT IS THEIR RIGHT....but do you want to spend all this time
waiting for that to happen?).
Additionally the FTC looks into practices like this. Riding the backs
both monetarily and market growth wise of a large community of
developers and then, virtually taking the Flash Player, and leveraging
it in a way of dominance where extremely high levels of revenue (the
best contracts 50k and greater) go to Adobe, where it's their platform
for Scene7.com or their Consulting.
Take a lesson in history, economics, and corporate behavior....or put
blinders on and let's see what happens.
-r
On Aug 27, 2008, at 1:49 PM, Battershall, Jeff wrote:
If Adobe had not acquired Macromedia, Flex would not be what it is
today, becuase if you haven't noticed, a whole bunch of money got
thrown at it to evolve the framework, not to mention the Flash
Player itself. I think there's more than enough opportunity to
create solutions that may compete with any Adobe ISV-style
offerings, be it on price or what-have-you. It is completely up to
you whether you choose to compete with their solutions. As far as
competition, contracts, bidding and all the rest - so what else is
new? It's an assumed risk of doing business! I think its time to
leave this alone because frankly I don't see the ROI in this
discussion.
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Behalf Of Robert Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 1:14 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Re: [flexcoders] Whitepaper and Webinar -- Please read the
Scene7.com posts Objectively
Looks like my thoughts have been confirmed, by someone.
Selling development tools and having a developer community is one of
the best kept secrets in the "Evangelist" style of Marketing.
The first time a FLEX developer bids on a project and the client
tells them they are using Adobe Scene7, that's when the issues
begin, and once they begin, they will get worse.
Prior to the acquisition of Macromedia, Adobe was a fairly even
player with Photoshop, Illustrator and PDF, primarily and imaging
and document firm.
Now, if Scene7.com does what I think it will be doing, and as you
seem to have confirmed below, it is going to take the momentum of
the Flash Player, begun by FutureWave Technologies (an honorable
group), Macromedia (an honorable group), and take that into the
Developer Arena Capitalizing on the all the wide-spread knowledge
that Flash and more recently FLEX developers have provided for them.
"Shortage of work" is a relative term. Ask any developer who has
bid on eLance.com and you'll understand the dynamics of bidding
against others for contracts.
If it turns out that Adobe begins to take the momentum achieved by
it's predecessors, namely it's acquisitions (which is has a right
to), and it's developers (which, if Scene7.com turns out to be as
you describe and I believe it will), then it is an ETHICAL ISSUE
that will not go away, and I'm giving fair-warning to any developer
out there (and yes, I do have the experience I've said I do to the
gentleman out there that questioned that).
I've been through thousands of pages of an unamed companies
documents to find out how they really work, and how they really look
at Developers. Adobe appears to be on that same road, and the more
signs I see of it, the more I will support other efforts.
For those inclined to be offended easily, I'd ask not to shout
against me or anyone else giving an opinion, but For your own sakes,
keep an eye on ACTIONS not WORDS. You'd be surprised what larger
corporations, especially ones that we all know the name of [not
Adobe] that gained their momentum on the backs of the developer
community, only to turn against them with hidden DLL API's, hacks
against licensed technology to make it perform poorly under their
platform, etc. (again this is not Adobe as I just said).
However, when a Consumer Software company, which Adobe was, starts
changing Acrobat to have an SDK (that's their right) and but then
goes beyond that to provide a far better Plug-in, only made possible
by the light weight plug-in efforts of FutureWave, and for the past
few years gaining momentum on the development efforts and expensive
purchases of development tools ; when that line is blurred it will
ultimately turn out bad for the developer.
For the gentleman who said "shortage of jobs" again, that's not the
issue as I just explained in eLance.com / The issue is that people
will Buy and will Trust Adobe more than a developer or even a small
development firm when it comes to bidding online. Local efforts are
different.
If the below turns out to be true of FLEX vs. Scene7.com (a
potential guise of a Consumer mid-level Product Manager), then the
FLEX, and more especially the ActionScript component and development
community as a while since Macromedia's aquisition will have at that
point been betrayed and yes, at that point, or any sign of it (in
the form of Actions, not Promises, do not trust the promises of a
large Corp. unless you've tried them true), if there is that sign or
signs, then yes it's time to get on with it and get out and support
more honorable people like Apple and Steve Jobs.
At this point I wish Macromedia never sold to Adobe.com / This isn't
looking pretty for the FLEX community. I'll certainly keep my Lexis-
Nexis handy and press contacts (and in several years, if it turns
bad, the FTC and DOJ).
-r
On Aug 27, 2008, at 11:17 AM, Battershall, Jeff wrote:
At this point, Adobe is not likely to abandon Scene7 due to
developer concerns. The way I see it, Adobe has been taking on
consulting engagements for some time, just like IBM does, and I
think having an offering of best of breed off-the-shelf solutions
fits in well with that strategy. I don't think it interferes with
the prosperity of Adobe solution providers or individual
developers, in fact having such solutions available may make more
possible to deliver on projects by not having to reinvent
functionality. It is what it is and there's no shortage of work,
so let's get on with it.
Jeff
-----Original Message-----
From: [email protected]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robert Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, August 27, 2008 11:05 AM
To: [email protected]
Subject: [flexcoders] Whitepaper and Webinar -- Please read the
Scene7.com posts Objectively
There is no harm meant in my postings.
I'm posting so we are all aware of what may be going on with
Scene7.com and it's implications to the FLEX and Flash CS3
development community.
I'm a freelance developer, not with a large corporation.
The Whitepaper is available on www.Scene7.com and I highly
recommend posting any concerns and questions to the e-mail address
of the CEO in there.
I also recommend attending the Webinar on the subject tomorrow (I
believe it's Thursday).
-r
