Glenn, is THIS:
I _may_, however, be able to simulate what Robert Rosen might say. The knitter is the efficient cause of the sweater. And, hence, the sweater is NOT closed to efficient cause. Hence, the sweater is not a complex system. And, if we assume all complex systems exhibit emergence, then he would say the sweater is NOT emergent (except perhaps if we expand the "system" to include the actors which constitute the efficient cause, of course). of the form: All swans are white This bird is white This bird is a swan ? Nick ps: Re Rosen; were you around two summers ago when I was beating my gums into plough shares trying to understand Rosen's Life Itself? I am hoping to get back to Rosen as one of the people who has a highly restricted view of emergence and who is also highly enthusiastic about downward causation. Who, in fact, is trying to create a formalism -- DENSMORE ALERT-- to describe such. n PS: Nicholas S. Thompson Emeritus Professor of Psychology and Ethology, Clark University ([email protected]) http://home.earthlink.net/~nickthompson/naturaldesigns/ > [Original Message] > From: glen e. p. ropella <[email protected]> > To: The Friday Morning Applied Complexity Coffee Group <[email protected]> > Date: 9/25/2009 9:00:30 AM > Subject: Re: [FRIAM] Inquiry to Emergence Group > > Thus spake ERIC P. CHARLES circa 09/25/2009 06:08 AM: > > I was wondering how the different authors in the book would describe this > > situation. In particular, it would seem natural to say that the string isn't > > the sweater BECAUSE the sweater is "emergent". > > Just to be clear, you're asking for (at least one of) us to simulate > what (some or all of) the authors in Bedau & Humphreys would say about > whether or not the sweater emerges from the thread? I.e. you are NOT > asking for OUR opinions. > > If so, I can't respond until I've a) read the book at least once and b) > modeled each author at least to the extent that I'd be willing to > simulate them. That's a tall order! I doubt I'll ever be motivated or > incentivized to do that. But if you ask again in, say, a month, maybe > I'll have a different answer. ;-) > > I _may_, however, be able to simulate what Robert Rosen might say. The > knitter is the efficient cause of the sweater. And, hence, the sweater > is NOT closed to efficient cause. Hence, the sweater is not a complex > system. And, if we assume all complex systems exhibit emergence, then > he would say the sweater is NOT emergent (except perhaps if we expand > the "system" to include the actors which constitute the efficient cause, > of course). > > -- > glen e. p. ropella, 971-222-9095, http://agent-based-modeling.com > > > ============================================================ > FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv > Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College > lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org ============================================================ FRIAM Applied Complexity Group listserv Meets Fridays 9a-11:30 at cafe at St. John's College lectures, archives, unsubscribe, maps at http://www.friam.org
