No I'm saying that projects which some committers are bound by Sun's NDAs and are on the specification commmittees do not
have meritocratic consensus based communities. The committers engaged in the legal agreement with sun cannot talk to the other
committers about important decisions affecting the project and secondly the major decisions are made in the specification committee and
not in the project itself. Committers are promoted to the decision making process by an outside entity (sun) and not by their own community.
The communication bonds twart collaboration which degrades innovation. The JCP does not encourage innovative processes which Sun or
the Spec lead might disagree with.

So I'll say it more clearly "JCP NDAs are anti-communalistic and twart innovation."

Lets talk about what a great thing the portlet specification committee has done for the Jetspeed project.


Geir Magnusson Jr. wrote:

On Tuesday, March 11, 2003, at 06:08 PM, Andrew C. Oliver wrote:

Note that Sun's JCP NDA agreements burn the second and third completely.

Utter nonsense. Are you saying that there's a dearth of innovation at apache? Or that Apache doesn't support strong communities?


And possibly the first (though i'm not a big fan of long standing deprecations.. ).


Thanks Pier.  I had wondered when someone would point this out.
Having clarity on the facts is very important, because all too
often non-reasons distract us from the really important reasons.

With respect to having multiple projects doing the same thing, I believe
Apache's approach has been very balanced and laudable. You've got 3
fundamental forces at play:
+ The need to maintain backwards compatibility so you don't burn your
existing users.
+ The desire to continue innovation, advancing our designs and APIs.
+ The desire to support and recognize strong, healthy developer
communities which share the Apache values of innovation, open
software, community, and meritocracy.

Apache has met all three of these forces in it's decisions to adopt
additional projects, such as Struts and Tapestry.

Whereas businesses aim to maximize profit, and academia structures to
maximize ego, Apache and open source have routinely demonstrated
a true commitment to maximizing community.  And we are all better
off for it.


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