One is always free not to read or revisit too. Neelan
--- On Tue, 19/8/08, salimtk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > From: salimtk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: [GreenYouth] Re: "who is a worker" in Kerala? > To: [email protected] > Date: Tuesday, 19 August, 2008, 11:25 PM > I'd a thought when dileep came up with the question > 'who is a worker in > kerala'. It was like all of us were being led to > 'cpim' track of > discussion. It is in the name of 'revolution' > 'proletarian' and 'worldwide > workers' they do all these atrocities. > > Why we 've to read/revisit marx, ram manohar lohya and > all to understand the > cruel situation in Chengara? > > On Tue, Aug 19, 2008 at 3:32 PM, neelan neelakandan < > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > I request my young friends to revisit Ram Manohar > Lohya, and his class and > > caste concepts. Read him long long back . But was too > critical and cynical > > of him those days.I too was young !!! > > Neelan > > > > > > --- On Tue, 19/8/08, C.K. Vishwanath > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > From: C.K. Vishwanath > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Subject: [GreenYouth] Re: "who is a > worker" in Kerala? > > > To: [email protected] > > > Date: Tuesday, 19 August, 2008, 3:52 PM > > > organised sector is the base of the indian > parliamentary > > > left.the sector is shrinking.informal sector is > developing > > > very fast and self-employment.manufacturing > industry was the > > > base of this left.after the collapse of the > manufacturing > > > sector,the traditional base of the indian left > had > > > disappered.all the big industrial areas of > india(from mumbai > > > to ahmadabad)has later explained the phenomenon > of > > > communalism among workers. ak.roy explained the > phenomenon > > > from the secular politics of working class to the > communal > > > politics of the workers.the classical > capital-labour > > > polarisation has lost its objective base.this is > not an > > > indian reality.it is also a world wide > reality.new > > > immaterial labour has totally disappered the > traditional > > > working class unity.new consuption pattern,life > > > style,atomisation of workers has created new > problems in > > > working class politics.the neo-liberal capital > assertion > > > pushes the producing sections of the society in > avery > > > defensive > > > position. > > > the five class divisions of the peasants are so > difficult > > > to understand .the ruruban middle class(cpim > analysis) plus > > > plantation sector has become a powerful ruling > block in > > > kerala society.it is buldozing any furher land > > > redistribution.cpim's base is this rurban > middle class. > > > > > > > > > --- On Wed, 8/13/08, Dileep Raj > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > wrote: > > > From: Dileep Raj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > Subject: [GreenYouth] Re: "who is a > worker" in > > > Kerala? > > > To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > > Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], > [email protected] > > > Date: Wednesday, August 13, 2008, 11:25 PM > > > > > > On Marxism: > > > I maintain a distinction between critique and > rejection. > > > > > > On CPIM : > > > I consider engaging with whoever is ready to > engage as > > > important. > > > It is just like engaging in critical discussions > with > > > people > > > working in Congress, BJP, Muslim League etc. > Nothing less. > > > > > > On us: > > > I consider (though I won't claim to be > c'lean') > > > engaging > > > in dialogues without branding/vulgarising the > opponent / > > > opponent's arguments > > > is pre requisite for the emergence of any sort of > > > democracy. > > > > > > What is the point in being aggressive toward > others who are > > > ready to seriously engage? > > > > > > On the subject line: > > > Will come back tomorrow > > > > > > Cheers! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Aug 13, 2008 at 11:09 PM, ranju radha > > > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > it s a pity to see that people can so > enthusiastically talk > > > abt marxism in this 21st century. > > > while looking at caste as essentialistic, they > forget to > > > de-essentialise class as well. > > > while clamouring against globalisation, they > forget that > > > workers of all countries unite has a globalising > universal > > > mission..... > > > marxism is a big joke now. do we real want to > debate on > > > it.. again and again > > > let us move ahead; dont be stuck in the muddy > water of > > > marxism > > > > > > this question :who is a worker? is important > > > who is this karshaka thozhilali? > > > > > > class question has erased the Dalits from it, and > yet they > > > are denied '"class" > > > within class they are again devoid class > status... they are > > > left with caste only > > > why? > > > bz this happened not in 20th century London, but > in India. > > > > > > caste is again not static; it has evolvd into > modern times; > > > class negotiations could not erase caste. > > > secular project did not erase religion. > > > > > > these homogenising universal grand narratives > failes to > > > understand/analyse society. > > > the European academia has accepted this aspect. > They are > > > revisiting the question of religion; revisiting > > > Enlightenment. > > > my submission is that CPI M is so unimportant a > category in > > > this whole discourse > > > it s like a mafia gang only; dont give undue > importnace to > > > it. > > > > > > and this Gandhian reformatory appraoch to CPI M > as shown by > > > some loyal buddies can be helpful 4 V S pinarayi > kind to > > > survive some more time, nothing else > > > > > > pavangal nattukare pattichum gundayism > > > kanichum jeevichotte ennanengil > > > pavam marxinu pizhachathu nammalenthinu > edutharadanam!! > > > though people have the right to do > > > so........................but not at the cost of > PEOPLE!! > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/13/08, damodar prasad > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > > wrote: > > > > > > Before coming to the Chengara and the > 'worker" > > > projected onto the scene, let me make a brief > > > 'presentation". > > > > > > I am not sure about the primacy of one category > over > > > the other as I am doubtful about the conflation > of the two, > > > let me emphasise, in the current socio-political > context > > > when there is an unleashing of social energy from > the below. > > > > > > > > > > > > Secondly, Marxists historians, like Kosambi and > Irfan Habib > > > from the Marxist view point 'demystified > > > caste" from its essentiaist and orinetalist > moorings > > > and also brought to the fore this submerged > category from > > > the nationalistic narratives. > > > > > > > > > Marxists had enagaged with the caste as a > category and > > > understood the politcal significance of it in the > social > > > transformation. But because of their inistence on > modernity > > > and its process of social change, the caste was > considered > > > as soemthing to be overcome through class > negotiations and > > > thus they understood caste as eroding category. > > > > > > > > > Any anger against CPIM and just based on that > debasing > > > Marxism and Marxists from the enagagements with > caste I find > > > it as "intellectual zhadonovism" ( > this is an > > > oxyMORON and I refer to individual/s with same > sort of > > > content whatver their 'legitimacy" claim > may bel) > > > > > > > > > Caste is also an infrastructure in the > circulation of > > > social energies.Hence "valorizing" it > only basing > > > it on the current situation is damaging and > disastrous on > > > the long run. This is an essentalizing strategy > of identity > > > poltiics which is meant for self-seeking purpose > on a > > > long-term gains resisting any changes. No > dialogues or > > > negotitaions are permitted in such essentalist > > > udnerstandings. This is fasicstic. They may > convienently > > > keep mum on Hindutva and charge against Marxism > form their > > > own stupid understanding of Marxism. > Ineteretignly, also > > > invoke Marxist narrative of final salvation > sometimes to > > > drive their point. > > > > > > > > > Indian Communist party could never resolve and > engage with > > > caste issues. This is not soemthing new. In > Chengara, there > > > is an attempt to Privelege the worker over the > dispossessed > > > dalits and perhaps many of them 'rural > > > proletariats". CPM has been doign this with > all new > > > mobilizations. > > > > > > > > > But in particular case of Chengara , harrison > goondas > > > appear on the scene as workers and demeaning the > very notion > > > of worker itself. > > > > > > > > > > > > On 8/13/08, Dileep Raj <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > wrote: > > > > > > > > > Let me rephrase the question in a new thread. > > > > > > Who are "workers' in Kerala? > > > How come the landless people in Chengara are > > > viewed as 'lesser' beings in comparison > with the > > > valorised "worker' identity? > > > > > > How does the assertion of Dalit political > identity > > > problematise the central category of > > > Marixian politics? > > > > > > I feel there are histotrical, political and > > > historico;political answers to this question, > > > partly submerged in research papers, partly > inherent in > > > current political practice and thought. > > > > > > for instance, Sanal Mohan's anlyses of > slavery in > > > Kerala enquires about the invisibility of slave > experineces > > > in and athrough > > > communist/ Marxist discourses > > > -- > > > Dileep R I thuravoor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Dileep R I thuravoor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Unlimited freedom, unlimited storage. Get it > now, on > > > http://help.yahoo.com/l/in/yahoo/mail/yahoomail/tools/tools-08.html/ > > > > > > > > > Connect with friends all over the world. Get Yahoo! India Messenger at http://in.messenger.yahoo.com/?wm=n/ --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "Green Youth Movement" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [EMAIL PROTECTED] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/greenyouth?hl=en-GB -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
