Your honeypot is more about you feeling like you have control than it is about bettering the community or "taking a stand".
I am not missing the point of a honeypot. I am a degree-wielding computer scientist, I know full well what a honeypot is. I also know that actual honeypots are looked down upon in the security sector and are pretty much useless (legally) when it comes to actually following through and taking action. They are a useful approach in terms of improving security (through statistical research), but since you're not Valve you're not really going to improve the core problem, are you? It's obvious you haven't thought things through. You state (I believe it was in your A-M thread) that the only reason people join servers running achievement maps is to farm. This is an incorrect assumption, but, even taking it to be true: -Why wait for people to earn an achievement before banning them? Just ban them on join. --The answer is because you want it to be full so you can get more to join and thus ban more. -So why not just report false clients? Perhaps Dan from Circle-X can help you out. He posts here. Though he still maintains that their servers are vanilla and absolutely don't report fake clients have fast respawns or shuffle you off to other servers. --The answer is because you actually want to toy with people and then deny them things. You enjoy wielding your power, and you will do so arbitrarily and with an inflated sense of self-righteousness. You are the worst kind of admin. You are as much of a problem to TF2 as the farmers, griefers, and exploiters. As to why your assumption is incorrect: Many people will simply join an achievement box to meet up with friends (right click friend, view game info, join!). Many people will simply join a server based on ping and player count, and not the map. Many people will not know what an achievement box map is, or that is considered a bad thing. If your argument is that people should know better, then I'd like to ask you about all the NEW players that will be playing TF2. If a free weekend is upon us, then there will be a lot of new players. Should someone be banned from your servers just because they joined your honeypot? Should they be banned from other servers who have picked up your list? Apparently you think it is an acceptable price to pay for maintaining what you think is a desirable decorum and behavior among your players. That's fine. What's not fine is you trying to push your beliefs on others, or you calling these people cheaters, detrimental, or other such things for having a differing opinion about how to play a game. If you had your way, those players would be banned from TF2 entirely. You are actively trying to spread your list of over 2000 bans. Do you really think that all those people deserve to be banned? (Yes, you do: "These are known achievement farmers! Ban them NOW!") What you claim is dubious. Your intentions are not noble. Your methods are detrimental to TF2 as a whole. I will be looking for and joining your honeypot, then earning some achievement, so I never have to deal with your servers. > From: [email protected] > To: [email protected] > Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 16:45:10 -0500 > Subject: Re: [hlds] Achievement Farmer Honeypot > > I'm doing this because somebody needs to take a stand. People are numb > to the cheating, and nothing will every change when everyone is being > complacent about it. > > Lastly, you are missing the point of a honeypot. Look up the definition: > > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Honeypot_(computing) > > The entire purpose of this is to make it looks like any other > achievement server, to make farmers feel "safe" by joining it. > > I'm not going to respond to the personal attacks. > > > > On Wed, 2009-02-25 at 13:35 -0800, Blood Letter wrote: > > If your server is full, and people are earning achievements then being > > banned from YOUR servers, you're being a hypocritical, selfish ass. > > > > You're running an achievement server that DOES let people farm achievements > > - they get one (maybe 2 or 3 depending on delay / simultaneous > > achievements) achievement (and probably progress towards others) before > > being banned. > > > > You claim your server is full, so it's turning out just as many > > achievements as other full achievement farming servers (maybe a little less > > due to overhead - since they have to go find another server afterward, > > etc.). > > > > You're banning these people from YOUR servers. You do provide a public > > list, but your list is NOT authoritative and I (and many other admins) > > would be hesitant to just import a list of 2000 bans. The vast majority of > > servers will NOT benefit from this list because most will never be aware of > > the list, let alone be able to import it easily (most servers are NOT > > running sourcebans/sourcemod with sql/etc.). > > > > You're playing vigilante because you think the game should be a certain > > way. That's fine, but you won't get much support for your "cause", > > especially with the way you are doing things. Simply setting up another > > server (instead of the honeypot) would be a far more beneficial to the TF2 > > community as a whole. > > > > The fact is there are a LOT of player who prefer to farm or unlock than to > > grind for achievements. > > I for one absolutely hate achievements, gamer cards, trophies, and whatever > > other crap is added to games to make them longer, force grinding, or > > promote social/web 2.0/e-peen crap. The mere fact that a GAME is > > intentionally turned into a chore to keep players playing is a slap in the > > face. It works though, because people feel they need that epic mount, that > > extra costume for Chun-Li, and the Ubersaw. > > > > It's a difference in opinion. You hate farmers, I don't care how people > > enjoy their game. You imposing your view of the game on your servers is > > fine, but I hope you realize that you're providing an achievement server > > which has let thousands of achievements be farmed, and that those farmers > > (who you claim to despise, hypocrite) are then set loose on the rest of the > > TF2 community (ass), while you and your servers are walled off from them > > (selfish). > > > > > From: [email protected] > > > To: [email protected] > > > Date: Wed, 25 Feb 2009 16:07:22 -0500 > > > Subject: Re: [hlds] Achievement Farmer Honeypot > > > > > > My server has been full since the moment I set it up. There is a delay > > > between achievement earned and banning, so the farmers don't know what > > > is going on. My server looks 100% like any other farming server. > > > > > > > > > On Wed, 2009-02-25 at 22:01 +0100, Bengt Rosenberger wrote: > > > > Great, I gonna install that on my 24/7 achievement farming server... Or > > > > wait... No, I won't. > > > > Have fun with an empty server. > > > > > > > > Stuff like this encourages me to open up another farming server... > > > > > > > > msleeper schrieb: > > > > > I have written a honeypot plugin for SourceMod that will autoban > > > > > anyone > > > > > who earns an achievement in the server. If there is any other admins > > > > > out > > > > > there who think that complacency towards farming needs to end, this is > > > > > step one. > > > > > > > > > > I have been running this since the moment the Scout update came out > > > > > last > > > > > night and, at time of writing this, 1890 farmers have been caught and > > > > > stopped. > > > > > > > > > > The plugin is here: > > > > > http://forums.alliedmods.net/showthread.php?t=86402 > > > > > My publicly available list of farmers is here: > > > > > http://www.msleeper.com/tf2-achievement-farmers.html > > > > > > > > > > I'm really not interested in mucking up the list with personal > > > > > opinions > > > > > about whether or not farming is right, or honeypotting farmers is > > > > > wrong, > > > > > but if you want to discuss you can always join IRC. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Sent from my honeypot > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list > > > > > archives, please visit: > > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > > > please visit: > > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > > > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > > please visit: > > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > > Windows Live™ Hotmail®:…more than just e-mail. > > http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t2_hm_justgotbetter_explore_022009 > > _______________________________________________ > > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, > > please visit: > > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds > > > _______________________________________________ > To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please > visit: > http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds _________________________________________________________________ Windows Live™ Hotmail®:…more than just e-mail. http://windowslive.com/explore?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_t2_hm_justgotbetter_explore_022009 _______________________________________________ To unsubscribe, edit your list preferences, or view the list archives, please visit: http://list.valvesoftware.com/mailman/listinfo/hlds
