Hi Levente,
Thanks for reviewing the import. You have many valid points, which
mostly come from the lack of documentation on my side.
0) Why do you think this import overrides any work? Adding new fuel
stations certainly does not, so does adding phones and websites hurt the
mappers? I'd be glad and more understanding of local mappers if you
elaborated on this.
1) The wiki page you link to explicitly tells to use the E.164 standard,
which mandates different notation for different countries. The wiki
specifically mentions the format for US phone numbers. For formatting
the numbers, I am using the Google's libphonenumber library. It is the
same that is used by Android phones to format numbers, and I haven't
seen any critique on these phones' formatting errors.
2) I guess these links were pointing to specific stations, but the Shell
website was changed a while ago, making these links invalid. I'll
contact NavAds about that.
3) With that gas station you have found that the source dataset has
duplicates. OSM Conflator has not means of detecting that. But I will
definitely look for any other duplicates, remove them and report back to
NavAds.
Thanks,
Ilya
07.03.2018 22:32, Levente Juhász пишет:
Hi All,
Generally, I think imports can be super useful if carefully executed.
This includes precise documentation. More importantly, as
Christoph pointed out, local communities should be involved as we just
simply don't know whether they've already put efforts into mapping gas
stations, or if they've already agreed on some country specific best
practices. I don't think overriding their previous work with a global
import is a good idea.
Also, I checked a few data points manually and have the following comments:
1) Phone number patterns should follow the same rules within the
dataset. E.g. "+36 62 464 024"
(http://audit.osmz.ru/browse/navads_fuel/NVDS353_10201112) in Hungary vs
"+1 561-544-6012"
(http://audit.osmz.ru/browse/navads_fuel/NVDS353_10008561) in the US
(dashes/no dashes in the local part of the number). See the wiki
(https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:phone#Usage) for example patterns.
2) Some urls don't point to the specific station. E.g. for this station:
http://audit.osmz.ru/browse/navads_fuel/NVDS353_10201112
website=http://www.shell.hu/products-services/on-the-road/shell-station-locator.html?id=10201112&modeselected=true will be redirected to: https://www.shell.hu/autosok/shell-station-locator.html#vanity-aHR0cHM6Ly93d3cuc2hlbGwuaHUvcHJvZHVjdHMtc2VydmljZXMvb24tdGhlLXJvYWQvc2hlbGwtc3RhdGlvbi1sb2NhdG9yLmh0bWw which is not a unique page of that station. Same thing with Shell in Poland (e.g. http://audit.osmz.ru/browse/navads_fuel/NVDS353_10034854). In these cases, a general website pointing to www.shell.hu <http://www.shell.hu> or www.shell.pl <http://www.shell.pl> would be a better choice if you want to add a website. Additional url parameters here just don't serve any purpose without the correct pattern, therefore I don't think they should be used added.
I'm not familiar with the OSM Conflator tool but it would be great to
know what parameters it uses for finding already existing OSM features.
I randomly found the following example:
http://audit.osmz.ru/browse/navads_fuel/NVDS106_1073560996PL0 which
shows a newly created feature (green) and a feature to be modified
(blue). In this case, those feature refer to the same gas station so it
should be a simple update. I'm wondering about the conflation parameters
and if you've tested different values and evaluated the differences. I'm
also wondering if you have a general idea about the number of similar
cases. This is the information that would be helpful in the import
documentation. This scenario is also related to 1) above since the phone
number is about to be updated with the same value, in a different
format. Quite possibly the updated pattern is the correct one, but I'd
ask the Polish community whether the old value was intentional or not.
All in all, this could be a great addition, but I think the import
workflow needs some more work.
Cheers,
Levente
On Wed, Mar 7, 2018 at 1:09 PM Christoph Hormann <o...@imagico.de
<mailto:o...@imagico.de>> wrote:
On Wednesday 07 March 2018, Ilya Zverev wrote:
> Hi everyone,
>
> Following the recent UK Shell stations import, I've got ahold of the
> entire NavAds dataset. A major part of it are fuel stations all
> across the world: UK, US, France, Germany, Australia, and many other
> countries. [...]
I don't want to comment on the import itself - have done so in the past,
nothing really to add - except maybe that i looked for documentation of
the mentioned UK Shell stations import on the wiki or an entry in the
import catalogue - both of which are required by the import guidelines
and neither of which seems to exist (and neither for this import
apparently).
The import guidelines also clearly state that
"You must not import the data without local buy-in"
which leads me to conclude that for a multi-country import you have to
consult with each of the local communities affected individually.
The local communities need to have the right to object to the import or
to have specific local conventions regarding tagging that the import
needs to follow in their domain. Local mappers must not be required to
write here in English to ask questions and raise concens about local
aspects to be heard.
--
Christoph Hormann
http://www.imagico.de/
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