Linux-Misc Digest #814, Volume #21 Tue, 14 Sep 99 21:13:16 EDT
Contents:
Re: News su to root? (DanH)
Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie (Tom Dominico, Jr.)
Re: FREE EAST TIMOR!!! STOP THE KILLING!!! (Spike!)
Samba for Windows 2000 ("William T. Trotter")
Re: KDE default desktop regenerated: Why? (Jim Hill)
Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie (Spike!)
Re: free NCAR graphics type libraries? (Paul J. Schinder)
Re: Favorite Editor? (Peter Schaffter)
Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution (Win right-click) (Guy Macon)
Re: Are tar tapes OS dependent? (Johan Kullstam)
oddities after rpm upgrades (jim barchuk)
Re: Can only see 8Gb of 13Gb disk. (Christopher Browne)
Metro Link OSF/Motif - Does it exist? (L J Bayuk)
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
From: DanH <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.networking
Subject: Re: News su to root?
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 19:21:49 -0400
Harmon Seaver wrote:
>
> Something I've been wondering about for awhile -- I don't have
> innd or inews running, but in the logs there's a periodic "(su) session
> opened for user news by (uid=0)" then followed by "(su) session closed
> for user news". I've tried deleting the user news, but linux
> complains. I thought for a long time that it was hacker scanning a port
> or something, but it seems to be right there on brand new installs.
If you're not running a news server, delete all references to innd in
/etc/cron.* Then kill innd and take it out of your boot scripts.
Dan
--
UNIX - Not just for vestal virgins anymore
Linux - Choice of a GNU generation
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tom Dominico, Jr.)
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 23:40:35 GMT
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in <7rmg85$69r$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Tom Dominico, Jr.) wrote:
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote in <7rjom8$8gl$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:
>
>
>> >Yeah, I've got an attitute. So do you. So do all of the contemptible
>> >trolls and other MS-Defenders who post here, saying that people
>> >shouldn't hafta know nuthin' at all about 'puters but should still be
>> >able to modify them, change them, with impunity, by being able to
>> >install 100+ megabytes of data and code without knowing anything
>> >about the processes involved.
>>
>> I am by no means a troll, nor am I defending MS. I thought this ng
>> was supposed to be about intelligent debate, but you don't seem
>> willing to even listen to anyone else. What I disagree with is the
>> notion that END-USERS need to be intimately familiar with the
>> processes going on during an install.
>
>"Intimately familiar????" Where have I ever said "intimately familiar?"
Well, this is what you said...
>>"No. I maintain that
>>understanding computers in a general sense, and specifically
>>understanding what is going where, and why, should be a requirement.
>>Knowing how to do a custom install, and knowing why/when you would
>>need to do so, should also be expected. Otherwise, the bozo
see, there you go name-calling just because someone isn't as knowledgeable
as you are...
>>in question should defer to someone who *is* qualified.
Hell, I program for Windows for a living (guess that marks me as one of
your "MS-Cheerleaders" even though I'm not really fond of the OS), and even
I don't know what exactly goes where, and why, on an Office 97 install. To
me, that would require fairly high-level knowledge, bordering on that of a
sysadmin. to most end-users, that would require becoming "intimately
familiar" with the OS and install process. NOW LISTEN CAREFULLY... I
TOTALLY AGREE that it would be in a user's best interest to learn this sort
of thing. BUT... I don't believe that they should *have* to, or else
defer to a sysadmin. THAT is where you and I differ. See, I do listen.
>See? That's why I have an attitude. It's because people like you first
>accuse me of not listening to my opponents, then you give me some
>sanctimonious schpeel about "how to win debates," and then you finish up
>by putting words in my mouth!
In most cases I am directly quoting you, and in other spots it's very easy
to infer your opinion. Referring to people as bozos, idiots, etc. gives us
a pretty clear idea of how you view yourself in relation to others.
>And you wonder why I have an attitude???!?!!
No, I don't wonder. You have had to clean up after end-users, and you are
taking your aggression out on us.
>> Do you honestly know everything that goes on during an Office
>> instal, etc.?
>
>Have I claimed to "know everything?" Have I said that anyone *should*
>"know everything?" To quote President Reagan, "There you go again!"
>Putting words in my mouth.
See my above comments.
>-- snip --
>
>> Honestly, what is your beef with end users?
>
>Talk about listening . . . if you read my posts with an open mind, and
>yes, a thicker skin would admittedly help, you will see that I have no
>"beef" with end-users. I simply think that it would be in an end-user's
>own best interest to understand what they are doing when installing
>software, because, as you noted, it does do a lot of things under the
>hood.
And I agree, it is in their best interest, but shouldn't be required, IF
the OS wants to target regular users (99% of the people out there).
[--snip redundant section...--]
>Computers *are* hard to use, fallacies from Redmond notwithstanding. It
>takes training. Thick books. CBTs. Etcetera.
No, computers are hard to administer. Computers CAN be easy to use (use
programs, install basic software, etc.) if the programmers are willing to
make them that way. What sort of future do you imagine? Think of Star
Trek. Does Picard ask the computer to bring up the commandline? No, there
is a natural language interface because it makes the crew far more
productive, and is far easier to use. Now, on the other hand, imagine how
difficult that would be to program... Get the picture? Hard to program
but easy/more satisfying for the average user to use.
>If computers were as easy to use as Redmond has you convinced they are,
>we wouldn't have all those ten-pound "Using Word 97" and "Excel 97
>Unleashed" books at your local Barnes and Noble.
You can be proficient at Excel without the books. If you want to be an
expert, then you might buy them. See the parallel?
>> This way, you can maintain your feelings of elitism. "How dare a
>> lowly end-user expect to install a program???"
[--snip more redundant text--]
>> To expect that an end-user never install a program without an intimate
>> knowledge of the processes at work is ridiculous.
>
>"Intimate knowledge" again?? Mr. "I-Listen-To-My-Opponent?"
>
>Your being a hypocrite at this stage.
We'll let the other readers be the judges. From looking at the other
posts, esp. since we are in a linux advocacy group, I would say they
disagree with you. You talk about listening and keeping an open mind, and
I have. I have openly embraced one of your points, but you refuse to even
REALLY listen to mine. why can't you just admit TMTOWTDI (There's More
Than One Way To Do It, for those not familiar with the Perl Motto) and be
done with it? I would expect a Linux advocate to embrace these words more
than anyone. Linux is supposed to be about choice, options, etc. Do what
works for you, but allow Joe User to do what works for him. Don't you get
it? Joe doesn't WANT to know a lot about computers, and advances in
technology should enable this, not push him further away from the power of
computing. Please lighten up.
Tom Dominico, Jr.
------------------------------
From: Spike! <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Re: FREE EAST TIMOR!!! STOP THE KILLING!!!
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 21:58:46 +0100
And verily, didst Jerry L Kreps <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> eloquently scribe:
> They wouldn't recognize freedom, independence, liberty or human
> rights if there houses were papered with copies of the Declaration of
> Independence, the Constitution and Bill of Rights.
> JLK
But then, most of the world [tm] doesn't place any value in those scraps of
paper. There *ARE* international human rights organisations that are far
more relevant...
(Of course, no terrorist would care about thoise either, be they from
Somalia, Indonesia or Northern Ireland)
--
______________________________________________________________________________
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] | |
| Andrew Halliwell BSc | "ARSE! GERLS!! DRINK! DRINK! DRINK!!!" |
| in | "THAT WOULD BE AN ECUMENICAL MATTER!...FECK!!!!|
| Computer Science | - Father Jack in "Father Ted" |
==============================================================================
|GCv3.12 GCS>$ d-(dpu) s+/- a C++ US++ P L/L+ E-- W+ N++ o+ K PS+ w-- M+/++ |
|PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ X+/X++ R+ tv+ b+ DI+ D+ G e++ h/h+ !r!| Space for hire |
==============================================================================
------------------------------
From: "William T. Trotter" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: Samba for Windows 2000
Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 00:06:57 GMT
Anyone out there have any experience making
Samba work with Windows 2000?
Tom Trotter
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Jim Hill)
Subject: Re: KDE default desktop regenerated: Why?
Date: 14 Sep 1999 23:59:52 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
In <7rm147$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
Martin Gelfand <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>The problem...
>
>User personalizes his desktop (deleting gimp, krpm, and
>other stuff). Logs out. Logs back in. All the desktop
>entries he deleted are now back!
I'm seeing the same problems you are; the new system is Mandrake 6.0
with the "factory installed" KDE. I have a bunch of stuff sitting
around from the previous setup which was SuSE 6.0 with a hand-built
KDE.
Given that two of us are having problems, anyone with a solution is
requested to post it rather than emailing.
Jim
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.swcp.com/~jimhill/
Death closes all; but something ere the end,
Some work of noble note, may yet be done,
Not unbecoming men that strove with Gods.
------------------------------
From: Spike! <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.advocacy
Subject: Re: General Rant from a Linux Newbie
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 21:43:51 +0100
And verily, didst K. Bjarnason <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> eloquently scribe:
>> I think you miss a fairly major point: you _don't_ install a GUI on
>> a Unix system. You install the programs for one or more on the system
>> and set each account to use at least one.
> Yes, I'm aware you can do this. So presumably, neighbour John walks
> around with a set of floppies containing the files for his preferred
> GUI, and every time he wants to use a different machine, he installs it?
> I don't think so.
Well Duh! Linux is a MULTI-USER operating system.
I know windows users might not understand that concept, but what it means is
that each user can *SELECT* the GUI of preference and have THAT start up
automatically at login. Carrying floppies to install your preferred GUI is
the most stupid thing seen in this thread so far.
--
=============================================================================
| [EMAIL PROTECTED] | Windows95 (noun): 32 bit extensions and a |
| |graphical shell for a 16 bit patch to an 8 bit |
| Andrew Halliwell BSc |operating system originally coded for a 4 bit |
| in |microprocessor, written by a 2 bit company,that|
| Computer Science | can't stand 1 bit of competition. |
=============================================================================
|GCv3.12 GCS>$ d-(dpu) s+/- a C++ US++ P L/L+ E-- W+ N++ o+ K PS+ w-- M+/++|
|PS+++ PE- Y t+ 5++ X+/X++ R+ tv+ b+ DI+ D+ G e++ h/h+ !r!| Space for hire |
=============================================================================
------------------------------
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.powerpc,comp.lang.fortran,comp.graphics.visualization
Subject: Re: free NCAR graphics type libraries?
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Paul J. Schinder)
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 00:04:13 GMT
In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Helmut Michels <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>Mike Zulauf wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> does anybody have any recommendations for freeware libraries for producing
>> plots (ie contour, line, etc) along the lines of the NCAR graphics
>> libraries? In particular, I need the routines to be callable from
>> Fortran.
>>
>> Any help is greatly appreciated!
PGPLOT. <http://astro.caltech.edu/~tjp/pgplot/>. I haven't used NCAR
in many years, but PGPLOT does most of what I remember NCAR doing.
PGPLOT is also callable from C and, with the right module, Perl.
PGPLOT is widely used in astronomy and astrophysics.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> --
>> Mike Zulauf
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
--
Paul J. Schinder
NASA Goddard Space Flight Center
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Peter Schaffter)
Subject: Re: Favorite Editor?
Date: 14 Sep 1999 22:08:31 GMT
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> I am looking for a full screen editor for Linux that doesn't suck.
Here's the weird thing. I went through the search for the
perfect editor when I migrated from DOS to Linux. I'd been
using something called VisionEdit (vedit), and it was a joy.
Nothing in Linux seemed quite right, although Fedit came close,
both in look and feel. Problem was, it had a few bugs at the
time, and I couldn't get 'em fixed without a lot of effort.
Finally, someone suggested using vi. I'd been avoiding it like
the plague because it looked so old and clunky, and was, by all
accounts "counter-intuitive." Just the same, I figured it
wouldn't hurt to learn it, at least a little bit. Well, just
like that first toke that makes you cough and cough, but then
you kind of learn to like it, vi made me want to gag at first,
but then I started enjoying it. The more I enjoyed it, the more
I used it, and the more I used it, the bigger and more powerful
it seemed to grow.
Now I'm a convert. The clone I'm using (elvis) can do amazing
things. Amazing, in this instance, means that for a writer (I'm
not a programmer), it's a godsend.
Still, I'm not sure I'd wish it on a dog.
--
PTPi
(Peter Schaffter)
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Guy Macon)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.qnx,comp.sys.amiga.misc
Subject: Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution (Win right-click)
Date: 12 Sep 1999 19:21:05 PDT
In article <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Aram
Iskenderian) wrote:
>
>On 10 Sep 1999 20:46:48 PDT,
>In article <7rcjb8$[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Guy Macon) wrote:
>>See this?
>>
>># From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Aram Iskenderian)
>># Subject: Re: Amiga, QNX, Linux and Revolution (Win right-click)
>># Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 23:50:52 GMT
>># Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>># Newsgroups: comp.os.linux.misc,comp.os.qnx,comp.sys.amiga.misc
>>
>>You crossposted.
>
>Nonsense.
>
>Would you mind to stop accusing me of crossposting when you have no
>collected some facts before you do that?
I just did, and posted them above. I do not know where you got the
notion that the first person to post an article into more than one
newsgroup has crossposted and that any followup articles that are
posted into the same newsgroups are not crossposted, but you are
wrong. I am crossposting. You are crossposting. So is Jeff, and
a bunch of other folks. Look up the definition of "Crossposting".
>Now who was the one who cross posted?
You. Me. Many others.
>And before you misunderstand this I am not accusing Jeff of cross
>posting, as this thread was long time here.
Crossposting is sending a post that has more than one newsgroup in
the "Newsgroups:" header line. Period. How long a thread has been
around has nothing to do with it.
(and before someone makes an anwarrented assumption, crossposting
is not, in and of itself, bad. When we are talking about QNX vs.
Linux for the new Amiga, crossposting to three goups is most
appropriate. When that discussion shifts to just Linux or just
Amiga, we should trim our headers as appropriate.)
------------------------------
Subject: Re: Are tar tapes OS dependent?
From: Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 14 Sep 1999 18:27:48 -0400
Robert Heller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Johan Kullstam <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> In a message on 14 Sep 1999 17:30:15 -0400, wrote :
>
> JK> Robert Heller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> JK>
> JK> > Note: There are versions of tar for MacOS, WinZip understands tar, tar
> JK> > is available under OS-9 and VMS. Tar *is* the cross-platform archiver
> JK> > (tape or otherwise). I wrote a version of tar for Lisp Machines (in
> JK> > lisp of course). I wrote a version of it for my CP/M-68K box.
> JK>
> JK> however windows does not understand tar format *floppies*.
> JK>
> JK> linuxbox$ tar cvf /dev/fd0 stuff
> JK>
> JK> insert floppy into ms-dos box. try to read. watch microsoft eat
> JK> flaming death.
>
> Yeah, ms-dos is dumb. But it is possible to:
>
> linuxbox$ mount -t vfat /dev/fd0 /mnt
> linuxbox$ tar czvf /mnt/foo.tgz stuff
> linuxbox$ umount /mnt
which is awful. i was trying to avoid all the mounting mess. i don't
even bother to compile microsoft operating system into my kernel. i
use mtools when i absolutely have to access that kind of partition.
at work on the sun, when you mount the floppy it takes *ages* (as in
over half an hour to fill the disk) to write to it. tar (or mtools)
completes in a few seconds.
using mtools
linuxbox$ tar cvzf /tmp/stuff.tgz stuff
linuxbox$ mmove /tmp/stuff a:
imho it's not as if floppies can hold enough information for a
filesystem to even begin to make sense.
--
J o h a n K u l l s t a m
[[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
Don't Fear the Penguin!
------------------------------
From: jim barchuk <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Subject: oddities after rpm upgrades
Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 18:37:48 -0400
Hello All!
Several oddities after upgrading a few rpms. This is RedHat 4.2, but
highly modified, nothing is 'original.' In fact for much of it I've thrown
out the rpms and gone to manual compile/install.
Recent upgrades include termcap, samba, tcp_wrappers, and a couple of
other I don't -remember- because for a few problems such as maillog
described below I didn't even -notice- oddities for a day or two after the
upgrade.
Most oddities I've fixed, some such as samba moved a few paths around
without telling anyone. Gotta luv them rpms! :) Compile/install of
procmail broke procmail because of stricter permissions, fixed, don't
think it relates to problems below.
The first and most serious problem is that maillog no longer logs mail. I
still have:
syslog.conf:
mail.* /var/log/maillog
and
-rw-rw-r-- 1 root root 0 Sep 12 01:10 maillog
... so it doesn't appear to be a permissions thing (afaik) but that file
size sure still is 0. Sysklogd is v 1.3-15 Any ideas?
The second one is more annoying than anything else, but it is very
annoying. 'Way back when' I adjusted things so I had black text on white
background for my xterms. I don't recall where/how I did that but it
worked for -everything- under xterm. Now, plain bash commands are still b
on w as they always were, but programs run under them such as pine and
taper reverse video, white on black. Not -fully- reversed, and the effects
are so weird that I really can't describe it without a lot of words, but
things are very different. My intuitive guess is that upgrading termcap
caused this, but I can't find where/how to fix it. Any clues?
Many TIA. Have a :) day!
jb
--
jim barchuk
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (Christopher Browne)
Crossposted-To: comp.os.linux.development.system
Subject: Re: Can only see 8Gb of 13Gb disk.
Reply-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 00:23:56 GMT
On Tue, 14 Sep 1999 01:12:00 GMT, Robert Heller <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Web Serf <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> In a message on Mon, 13 Sep 1999 01:05:57 +0000, wrote :
>
>WS> Hello all, A long time ago I installed RH5.1 on this box and after
>WS> trying a few things gave up on the idea of using more than 8GB of my
>WS> 13Gb disk (I understand the BIOS limitations problem). In a while I'll
>WS> be getting a new system and reformatting this one. I have tried adding
>WS> 'append hda="1647,256,63"' to the lilo.conf file. This didn't work.
>WS> Any ideas?
>
>What does your partition table look like? The Ext2 fs can only deal
>with about 9 gig/partition, but Linux has no trouble with properly
>*partitioned* disks of much larger sizes.
I don't believe you nearly as much as I believe Stephen Tweedie, who
is being paid to maintain and enhance the code of ext2.
See:
<http://www.uwsg.indiana.edu/hypermail/linux/big-linux/9602/0369.html>
From: Stephen Tweedie ([EMAIL PROTECTED])
Date: Fri, 9 Feb 1996 22:52:00 GMT
Subject: Re: Experience with a "big" linux system
Hi,
On Thu, 8 Feb 1996 23:46:56 -0500, Lee Silverman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> said:
> At 9:23 PM 2/6/96, Matt 'Panzer Boy' wrote:
>> What's the max partition size on a ext2 filesystem? I know it was 2gigs
>> a long time back, but I vaguelly remember reading that that had changed.
> I think that limitation went away with ext2fs 0.5b.
Yes, it did.
> It's probably not in the terabyte range, though, since ext2fs is a
> 32 bit filesystem.
Surprise --- the maximum ext2fs size is 1TB. This is a limit of the
underlying drivers, actually: a normal, signed 32-int goes up to 2^31,
and we use 32-bit ints to address block devices by sector offset, so
if we have 512-byte sectors we get an upper limit of 2^31 * 512 = 1TB.
With a 1K sector size we could address up to 2TB of disk. Larger
sector sizes would not help, since by default ext2fs uses a 1K block
size and you'd encounter the same limit with signed int block numbers.
However, ext2fs will cater for block sizes up to 4K, and using 4K
blocks on the filesystem on top of a 4K-sector disk drive, you could
in theory get away with a maximum filesystem size of 8TB.
Although the filesystem is *mostly* 32 bit, we do support 64-bit
addressed access to the physical block device in order to allow
programs such as e2fsck to access the full partition beyond the 32-bit
boundary.
> Then again, since there's no md driver for Linux, it's hard to get
> over a few gigabytes in a partition without an external RAID.
I know of one site where they had four 9GB drives hooked up with the
md raid driver to give a single 36GB ext2fs filesystem! ext2fs will
work quite happily at these sizes.
Cheers,
Stephen.
--
Stephen Tweedie <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Department of Computer Science, Edinburgh University, Scotland.
--
"NT 5.0 is the last nail in the Unix coffin. Interestingly, Unix isn't
in the coffin... It's wondering what the heck is sealing itself into a
wooden box 6 feet underground..." -- Jason McMullan
[EMAIL PROTECTED] <http://www.hex.net/~cbbrowne/linuxkernel.html>
------------------------------
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] (L J Bayuk)
Subject: Metro Link OSF/Motif - Does it exist?
Date: 15 Sep 1999 00:36:29 GMT
I'm posting this for a programmer I know who works for a large software
developer. He's been trying to get information about OSF/Motif and
the KL Group's XRT Widget set for a project they are working on for
the US Gov't (the customer insists on Motif) to port a system to Linux.
What he's got so far is:
1. Red Hat doesn't sell Motif anymore; they send you to Metro Link.
2. Motif is available for Red Hat 5.2 only (although this fact isn't
mentioned on Metro Link's big ads in Linux Journal). There is no
release date for Motif and XRT for Red Hat 6.0.
3. Red Hat doesn't sell 5.2 anymore, and anyway the Gov't wants 6.0.
4. He has been unable to contact Metro Link. They don't return his
phone calls or e-mail. (He's been trying for weeks now.)
Any ideas?
------------------------------
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End of Linux-Misc Digest
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