It seems like this should be the case already: https://issues.apache.org/jira/browse/LOG4J2-801
What about AsyncLogger though? On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 12:07 PM, Mikael Ståldal <mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: > That deserialized loggers work (given that all needed dependencies are on > classpath) is a reasonable expectation. If we cannot guarantee that, then > we should not declare that loggers are serializable. > > On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 11:45 AM, Remko Popma <remko.po...@gmail.com> > wrote: > >> Sure. What is the expectation here? >> Do deserialized Loggers work? >> >> Sent from my iPhone >> >> On 2016/07/26, at 17:26, Mikael Ståldal <mikael.stal...@magine.com> >> wrote: >> >> Can we at least document that we guarantee that Loggers from log4j-impl >> are always serializable? >> >> On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 1:52 AM, Remko Popma <remko.po...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> >>> On 2016/07/26, at 1:43, Mikael Ståldal <mikael.stal...@magine.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>> The purpose is that the user of Log4j can be sure that the Logger is >>> serializable. >>> >>> >>> If that is a consideration, the user can select an implementation that >>> is fit for purpose. >>> >>> I generally prefer not to make too many guarantees in an interface to >>> give implementations more flexibility. >>> >>> On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 6:38 PM, Gary Gregory <garydgreg...@gmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> But to what purpose? Does Log4j itself need this? Is this a case of >>>> YAGNI? >>>> >>>> If I have a Logger in an object I serialize, and the class implementing >>>> Logger is serializable, then I am good to go. >>>> >>>> Making Logger Serializable, would make this obvious to users and might >>>> make some developers warm and fuzzy. It just seems like an odd requirement >>>> for ALL implementors of Loggers to be serializable. As a third party Logger >>>> implementor, that does not mean it would be done properly. Implementing the >>>> interface is no guarantee of proper behavior. >>>> >>>> Overall, it seems like it would make Log4j less friendly to 3rd party >>>> implementors. Are there even any? >>>> >>>> Gary >>>> >>>> On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 9:07 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>> >>>>> But maybe we actually want to force all implementations to be >>>>> serializable? >>>>> >>>>> On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 6:01 PM, Remko Popma <remko.po...@gmail.com> >>>>> wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> I think the theory is it is preferable to let implementors of an >>>>>> interface implement java.io.Serializable instead of letting the interface >>>>>> extend java.io.Serializable. That gives future implementors the freedom >>>>>> to >>>>>> choose to either implement Serializable or not. >>>>>> >>>>>> On Tue, Jul 26, 2016 at 12:49 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>>> It seems like serializable logger is useful in Apache Spark, which >>>>>>> is popular to use from Scala. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 4:20 PM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>>>> wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>>> Do Scala programmers use Serializable a lot, or is there a better >>>>>>>> mechanism there? Because if there's a more Scala way of doing it, that >>>>>>>> would make more sense. Otherwise, you can always add Serializable >>>>>>>> later, >>>>>>>> but you shouldn't remove it once it's part of the public API. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> On 25 July 2016 at 03:06, Mikael Ståldal <mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> I am asking this since I'm considering making the Scala Logger >>>>>>>>> wrapper Serializable. Would that be a good idea? >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 25, 2016 at 10:00 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Users can rely on the fact that loggers are always Serializable. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> I guess we could also document that fact if we don't want to mark >>>>>>>>>> the interface Serializable. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 22, 2016 at 7:16 PM, Ralph Goers < >>>>>>>>>> ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> What advantage is gained by declaring the interface Serializable? >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Ralph >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 22, 2016, at 9:38 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> I don't think we should limit ourselves to what we add to the >>>>>>>>>>> API just for the sake of alternative implementations. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 22, 2016 at 6:09 PM, Gary Gregory < >>>>>>>>>>> garydgreg...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> I do not think you want to _force_ all implementation to be >>>>>>>>>>>> serializable. Serialization is not a main feature of loggers, >>>>>>>>>>>> logging is. >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> Gary >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Jul 22, 2016 at 12:45 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> But if this is a feature that is useful for some users, why >>>>>>>>>>>>> not fully advertise it by making the Logger interface >>>>>>>>>>>>> Serializable? >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 7:53 PM, Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com >>>>>>>>>>>>> > wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's Serializable because there was a feature request for it. >>>>>>>>>>>>>> The jira ticket is internal (reported by Gary), but I recall >>>>>>>>>>>>>> either another >>>>>>>>>>>>>> bug or a mailing list post where the justification was so that >>>>>>>>>>>>>> serializable >>>>>>>>>>>>>> classes can still use a Logger instance field (not everyone uses >>>>>>>>>>>>>> a static >>>>>>>>>>>>>> field for the Logger for some reason). >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> On 21 July 2016 at 11:32, Ralph Goers < >>>>>>>>>>>>>> ralph.go...@dslextreme.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I asked myself the same question and I guess the answer is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that Logger is included in lots of classes, many of which are >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Serializable. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It would be easier for us to make AbstractLogger Serializable >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then for all >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the users to mark it as transient and have to manually >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instantiate the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Logger during de-Serialization. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Ralph >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 2016, at 9:29 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So then why is AbstractLogger, and our implementation in >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> log4j-core, Serializable? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 6:18 PM, Gary Gregory < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> garydgreg...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I do not think there is a way to know what folks are doing >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out there... >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gary >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 9:13 AM, Mikael Ståldal < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Are there any providers not using AbstractLogger? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 21, 2016 at 6:09 PM, Gary Gregory < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> garydgreg...@gmail.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Probably to leave the decision on whether to support >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> serialization to each provider. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gary >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 21, 2016 3:14 AM, "Mikael Ståldal" < >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com> wrote: >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> AbstractLogger is Serializable, but the Logger interface >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is not. Why is it so? >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contained in this message. If you are not the addressee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated in this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> message >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> person), you may not copy or deliver this message to >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anyone. In such case, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sender by reply email. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> contained in this message. If you are not the addressee >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> indicated in this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> message >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> person), you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In such case, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sender by reply email. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> www.magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> message >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> person), you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> such case, >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> by reply email. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | >>>>>>>>>>>>> www.magine.com >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in >>>>>>>>>>>>> this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this >>>>>>>>>>>>> message >>>>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), >>>>>>>>>>>>> you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender >>>>>>>>>>>>> by reply email. >>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>>> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org >>>>>>>>>>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition >>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>>>>>>>>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition >>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>>>>>>>>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>>>>>>>>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>>>>>>>>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>>>>>>>>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in >>>>>>>>>>> this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), >>>>>>>>>>> you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by >>>>>>>>>>> reply email. >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in >>>>>>>>>> this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), >>>>>>>>>> you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by >>>>>>>>>> reply email. >>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in >>>>>>>>> this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>>>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you >>>>>>>>> may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by >>>>>>>>> reply email. >>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> -- >>>>>>>> Matt Sicker <boa...@gmail.com> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>>>> Senior software developer >>>>>>> >>>>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this >>>>>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>>>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you >>>>>>> may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by >>>>>>> reply email. >>>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> [image: MagineTV] >>>>> >>>>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>>>> Senior software developer >>>>> >>>>> *Magine TV* >>>>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>>>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>>>> >>>>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this >>>>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>>>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may >>>>> not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>>>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply >>>>> email. >>>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> -- >>>> E-Mail: garydgreg...@gmail.com | ggreg...@apache.org >>>> Java Persistence with Hibernate, Second Edition >>>> <http://www.manning.com/bauer3/> >>>> JUnit in Action, Second Edition <http://www.manning.com/tahchiev/> >>>> Spring Batch in Action <http://www.manning.com/templier/> >>>> Blog: http://garygregory.wordpress.com >>>> Home: http://garygregory.com/ >>>> Tweet! http://twitter.com/GaryGregory >>>> >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> [image: MagineTV] >>> >>> *Mikael Ståldal* >>> Senior software developer >>> >>> *Magine TV* >>> mikael.stal...@magine.com >>> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >>> >>> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this >>> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >>> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may >>> not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >>> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply >>> email. >>> >>> >> >> >> -- >> [image: MagineTV] >> >> *Mikael Ståldal* >> Senior software developer >> >> *Magine TV* >> mikael.stal...@magine.com >> Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com >> >> Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this >> message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message >> (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may >> not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, >> you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply >> email. >> >> > > > -- > [image: MagineTV] > > *Mikael Ståldal* > Senior software developer > > *Magine TV* > mikael.stal...@magine.com > Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com > > Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this > message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message > (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may not > copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, > you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply > email. > -- [image: MagineTV] *Mikael Ståldal* Senior software developer *Magine TV* mikael.stal...@magine.com Grev Turegatan 3 | 114 46 Stockholm, Sweden | www.magine.com Privileged and/or Confidential Information may be contained in this message. If you are not the addressee indicated in this message (or responsible for delivery of the message to such a person), you may not copy or deliver this message to anyone. In such case, you should destroy this message and kindly notify the sender by reply email.
