Don you are right even though we have low subsidized rates there seems to be a greed factor.
Doing things for personal gain is the only honest way to live your life. I do things all the time because I know loved ones appreciate it and love me back and do stuff for me. I'm selfish to the core. I love the attention. I agree doing things for personal gain is of value,, when the personal gain harms your fellow man, it is not and can not be morally considered honest. Can you consider excessive bonuses to people who's actions caused a corporation to fail honest especially when this comes out of taxpayers pockets?. On Wed, Apr 8, 2009 at 7:37 AM, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > A possible solution may be for the state to subsidise the cost of > > study and training, so that doctors are not under such pressure to > > make " so much " in the shortest possible time ( yesterday ! ). > > We do that already through very low interest rate loans for collage > students and grants and scholarships. > > dj > > On Tue, Apr 7, 2009 at 10:47 PM, Vamadevananda <[email protected]> > wrote: > > > > You may be missing the point. Is a doctor moral if he chooses to let a > > patient die if he is not paid " so much," when he is actually in a > > position to save the life ? > > > > A possible solution may be for the state to subsidise the cost of > > study and training, so that doctors are not under such pressure to > > make " so much " in the shortest possible time ( yesterday ! ). > > > > I recall Dr Rieux's character in The Plague, written by Albert Camus. > > > > On Apr 7, 7:32 pm, Michael Berkovits <[email protected]> wrote: > >> Agree with Molly. I don't understand any of the financial arguments > >> presented. > >> > >> Some people cut trees down for a living, and make a certain amount of > >> money per year doing it. Some people lend money for a living, and > >> make a certain amount of money per year doing it. In the former case, > >> you trade the trees for money. In the latter case, it's the > >> difference between what the borrowing rate and the interest rate that > >> lets you make money. Nothing immoral about it. Only reason some > >> people, and various religions, feel that charging interest is immoral > >> is because of the fact that we didn't really evolve to understand > >> abstract ways of making money. Sell wood? Sure. Make a living off a > >> spread? Harder to understand. But why immoral? > >> > >> As for medicine: Why are doctors paid so much? Because they're among > >> the more talented people in society (i.e., intelligent - look at > >> medical school acceptance rates), and they spend much longer in > >> training than other people, so they have to be compensated by a lot to > >> make the profession economically worthwhile. If doctors were paid > >> less, more people who would otherwise be doctors would become lawyers, > >> and medical care wouldn't be as good as it is now. So where would the > >> morality be in that? Is every potential doctor who chooses to be a > >> lawyer because the pay's better an immoral person? > >> > >> On Apr 7, 2:55 am, iam deheretic <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> > Frayed knot is an interesting way of putting it. > >> > >> > I think society is more immoral than moral. I think most people agree > that > >> > killing some one is wrong. My problem with morality is when some one > >> > charges excessive interest like in credit cards (my wife and I have > one -- > >> > and it is for emergencies only -- then immediately paid off ) > justifying > >> > this as sound business when in reality to me it seems like this greed > is a > >> > way of slowly killing some one, or Like ( i do have a very good > health > >> > insurance.) when I ended up in the hospital a few years back in the > USA and > >> > the bill exceeded $8,000. for 24 hour stay.. basically to get my > heart beat > >> > stabilized and watched. I saw 2 doctors for a total of 10 minutes.. > >> > If I did not have insurance i would have an huge medical bill and to > pay it > >> > I would have had to take food of my table to pay the bill. To me if a > person > >> > is forced to pay an excessive amount to cover a bill cutting back on > normal > >> > expenses to pay it,, the hospital is killing that person. > >> > >> > or by charging excessive rent.. or a myriad of other ways of killing > some > >> > one legally .. the slower the better.. > >> > >> > On my savings account I am paid a meager 2.6 % but if I want to borrow > money > >> > I have to pay 9.8% If I depended upon that interest for my living > again > >> > corporate greed would be killing me.. and this difference is immoral > yet it > >> > is easily justified as business. > >> > >> > I think people many people only want to appear to be moral yet at the > same > >> > time want to use business or corporations to hide their immorality. > >> > >> > The only conclusion I can reach is people prefer to be immoral. Just > talking > >> > the talk not walking the walk of morality. > >> > >> > On Mon, Apr 6, 2009 at 12:21 PM, Molly Brogan <[email protected]> > wrote: > >> > >> > > Evil reconciled to good? Frayed knot! > >> > >> > > On Apr 5, 10:18 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > > Why is evil always so hard to nail down or why does it seem that > no > >> > > > one really wants to identify it but simply dissect the > potentiality of > >> > > > what it may define. You don't consider anything on the video as > evil > >> > > > but do recognize it as bad, horrifying and obscene, which > basically > >> > > > covers the face of evil, but rather bypass evil representation to > >> > > > bring attention to religious aspects, which by the way I agree > with > >> > > > 100%, don't burn your steak here. The dark ages are still upon us > >> > > > brother and while technology creates a vision of advancement, > >> > > > attitudes and behaviours create a different picture, the picture > of > >> > > > reality, of good and of evil. I feel we must somehow find resolve > in > >> > > > the issue of what is evil. We have here a collection of brilliant > >> > > > minds, myself excluded lol, and so we can somehow be assertive in > our > >> > > > resolve. I find too many threads wind up as fray ends. Which > reminds > >> > > > me of a thread that walked into a bar, the bartender said "we > don't > >> > > > serve threads", so the thread walked out, shredded out it's end > and > >> > > > tied itself into a loop, walked back into the bar, the bartender > >> > > > noticed and immediately and irately said, "damn, I told you we > don't > >> > > > serve threads in here", the thread responded "I'm not a thread" at > >> > > > which the bartender scowled, "you are so" and so the thread having > the > >> > > > last word said "nope, I'm a frayed knot". > >> > >> > > > On Apr 5, 12:26 pm, gruff <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > > > > Thanks Slip. I don't really consider what is going on in the > video > >> > > > > and what it represents as evil. It is bad, it is horrifying, it > is > >> > > > > obscene, but it is also no more than religion battling it's > fiercest > >> > > > > foe -- education and enlightenment. On the other hand, religion > >> > > > > considers education and enlightenment evil -- the work of the > devil. > >> > >> > > > > On Apr 4, 2:05 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > > > > > Thanks for the video gruff, it was overwhelmingly sad but very > >> > > > > > enlightening as to the seriousness and the dilemma of these > people. > >> > > It > >> > > > > > takes me back over to the other thread, Does Evil Exist. One > only > >> > > > > > needs to watch this video for the answer. > >> > >> > > > > > On Apr 4, 3:38 pm, gruff <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > >> > > > > > > Here is a good reason for moral behavior -- call it what you > like > >> > > (we > >> > > > > > > are our brother's keeper, the golden rule, do unto others, > etc.) -- > >> > > > http://video.nytimes.com/video/2009/02/22/world/asia/1194838044017/cl... > >> > >> > -- > >> > ( > >> > ) > >> > I_D Allan- Hide quoted text - > >> > >> - Show quoted text - > > > > > > > > > -- ( ) I_D Allan --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Minds-Eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
