I have worn lots of "hats", Francis. My parents were extraordinary. So am I. A chip off the old block. :-)
On Jun 30, 2:02�am, frantheman <[email protected]> wrote: > I echo Slip on this one, rigsy. > > As someone who grew up in the sixties and seventies, I am frequently > amazed at the extent to which old role models, which many of us 30 > years ago assumed were on the way out, have persevered. > > Personally, I suspect that the large amount of women who chose to > remain at home and be full-time Mommies are responsible for the > perseverance of chauvenistic gender models among many young people, > particularly young men. These are the role models, the hands rocking > the cradle, who have taught their children that men are incapable of > cooking, cleaning and nurturing and that women must be dependent on > men for their material security. > > Even growing up in conservative Catholic Ireland, my experience and > rearing was different. My mother always worked (she was a music > teacher) and there were no distinctions made between boys and girls > when it came to household chores in our family. My father retired > seven years before my mother and took over the household completely > during this period. Today, at 75, my mother is the one who is in > contact with the world via internet, with an an active Facebook > presence, uploading photos from her mobile phone and sending them to > her grandchidren, enthusing about the updates in the composition > software which allows her to produce printed sheet music for the 4- > part chorales with orchestration, which she composes on the electric > piano patched into her PC. My father won't touch the thing! > > We all have our own stories, mostly resulting from the choices we made > - even if the consequences of those choices weren't always clear to us > at the time. We should be careful about generalising from our > particular personal experiences. > > Francis > > On 30 Jun., 05:16, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > I personally don't see it as an unfortunate role. � I see that some > > women see it as an unfortunate role. > > > I've always had the feeling that you, rigsy, were never all that > > thrilled with the marital/motherhood roles. Comments you have made in > > the past like........... > > > "The world belongs to men. Children are sandbags to a woman's dream." > > > It is your statement that labels it the unfortunate role. � I would > > say it is an unfortunate role for those who are unhappy with it. �The > > sandbags as you call them got in the way of your dreams. > > > You also stated; > > "I don't think men and women are equal. Men can move along. Women must > > be the good mother and nurture their children. Provide an example- > > blah-blah blah. It's > > biology or the lessons from lions. " > > > This again does not sound like you are overly joyed with it. �I just > > get the impression that you are somewhat disgruntled with the whole > > picture and my post is a reflection of that. > > > I should revise my post as to indicate it's specific nature and not a > > gender generalization. > > My apology smology! > > > On Jun 29, 9:39�pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Also religious channels. What noose? Some women do not get, want, > > > accept alimony and child support. Yes- we do have choices sometimes as > > > simple as saying "no" othertimes accepting the consequences of saying > > > "yes". And some beautiful women do not choose to use that beauty as a > > > weapon or allurement- like a marketing tool. It is no small > > > accomplishment to raise children to maturity and healthy adjustment as > > > their caretaker- if that's what you see as motherhood- it's about 24 > > > years per child by the time they can really fly on their own. I > > > enjoyed my motherhood years. Why do you see it as an "unfortunate > > > role"? > > > > On Jun 29, 3:29 pm, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > No dear woman, women use their sexuality because women are sexual > > > > creatures capable of alluring the most formidable opponent. When > > > > women realize the power of their sexuality they are not nearly women > > > > but yet girls. It is a women's unfortunate role that leads to > > > > entrapment within a circle of the offspring caretaker, and you are > > > > right, we men can just move on, like lions we are free, like bears we > > > > give the seed that gives the birth with which you are eternally > > > > connected to. Don't blame us for our lot in life for we, no more than > > > > you, have choice. It is only through legal political channels that you > > > > have put a noose on our necks. When you submit you should be well > > > > informed of the ramifications and in that sense it takes one. > > > > > On Jun 29, 2:30 pm, rigsy03 <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > I have been in those situations, as well, which are sincere friendly > > > > > gestures but I have also seen the corrupted routine both in business > > > > > and social relations which are basically a form of control. Women use > > > > > their sexuality because the culture has fostered its rewards. It takes > > > > > two. > > > > > > On Jun 29, 4:50 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > When I moved into my community the welcoming committee came by to > > > > > > drop > > > > > > off a basket full of gifts as a way of saying hello. We took the > > > > > > gifts and had a great time without feeling any need for > > > > > > reciprocation. I had a neighbor give me two tickets to the symphony > > > > > > because he and his wife could not go on that date, they were great > > > > > > seats. He never came by to ask any favors and a year later they > > > > > > moved > > > > > > away. I give away gifts all the time and think that giving begins a > > > > > > cycle of giving. Those that receive learn that giving can be as > > > > > > rewarding as receiving. I can see that in the business world buying > > > > > > lavish gifts for the management might be construed as a request for > > > > > > special treatment and I have seen some fine women climb the > > > > > > corporate > > > > > > ladder via their sexual prowess, if that can be considered a gift. > > > > > > > On Jun 29, 1:08 am, Vamadevananda <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > I wonder why may I accept a ' gift ' from someone who I do not > > > > > > > even > > > > > > > know, to whom I myself have never offered one ( gift ) or ( left > > > > > > > to > > > > > > > myself ) would never desire to ! > > > > > > > > " Integrity does not have to be lost upon the receipt of a gift." > > > > > > > > Read the first para. Why else would one accept a gift ? Unless it > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > token, read ' costing next to nothing,' say, flowers. > > > > > > > > On Jun 29, 9:21 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > Gifts are good, I like gifts, what's wrong with gifts? > > > > > > > > Integrity does > > > > > > > > not have to be lost upon the receipt of a gift. A gift should > > > > > > > > not be > > > > > > > > preconceived as a bribe. The corrupted have made it so because > > > > > > > > they > > > > > > > > took gifts in exchange for favor but this does not set a > > > > > > > > standard. We > > > > > > > > continually diminish our quality of life on the basis of those > > > > > > > > that > > > > > > > > are unethical, why let them ruin it for the rest of us? Give and > > > > > > > > Receive without strings! > > > > > > > > > On Jun 28, 10:56 pm, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > accepting business gifts should be > > > > > > > > > > > totally unacceptable behavior, both by the giver and the > > > > > > > > > > receiver. -iam > > > > > > > > > > I agree only in the public sector. I work for the State so > > > > > > > > > pretty > > > > > > > > > much the same thing applies to me. While people still accept > > > > > > > > > tickets > > > > > > > > > to sporting events and lunches and cases of booze on the > > > > > > > > > holidays and > > > > > > > > > complimentary fishing/hunting trips; it really is graft and > > > > > > > > > shouldn't > > > > > > > > > be done. However, in the private sector this is often how > > > > > > > > > things are > > > > > > > > > done. It's how the service provider buys access. Tax money > > > > > > > > > isn't > > > > > > > > > used to pay for the services so I don't have a problem with > > > > > > > > > it. If > > > > > > > > > large corporations didn't use this technique to gain access > > > > > > > > > to foreign > > > > > > > > > potential customers we would never get their business. > > > > > > > > > > I commend your wife on her integrity. It's a rare trait. > > > > > > > > > > dj > > > > > > > > > > On Sun, Jun 28, 2009 at 8:00 AM, iam > > > > > > > > > deheretic<[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Chomsky has my vote along with slipsky of course. > > > > > > > > > > > Well the Palestinian people elected one party and the US > > > > > > > > > > and Israel would > > > > > > > > > > only support the losers. Radical changes are going to need > > > > > > > > > > to be made,, but > > > > > > > > > > There is the lingering doubt that the will is there. I am > > > > > > > > > > hoping for health > > > > > > > > > > care, but as long as the politicians are exempt from the > > > > > > > > > > bribery laws it > > > > > > > > > > will never happen. > > > > > > > > > > > I am looking at the difference in countries. My wife is the > > > > > > > > > > officer in > > > > > > > > > > charge of quality control for the fire department.. and she > > > > > > > > > > was offered > > > > > > > > > > tickets for her and me to a polo match free. Well we had to > > > > > > > > > > turn them down > > > > > > > > > > and make a report of it. It has to do with honesty in > > > > > > > > > > government. > > > > > > > > > > > The truth is I am glad to see that there are people > > > > > > > > > > watching and much more > > > > > > > > > > of it needs to occur, every where ,, accepting business > > > > > > > > > > gifts should be > > > > > > > > > > totally unacceptable behavior, both by the giver and the > > > > > > > > > > receiver. > > > > > > > > > > Allan > > > > > > > > > > > On Sat, Jun 27, 2009 at 10:57 PM, Molly Brogan > > > > > > > > > > <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >> Here is Noam Chomsky's take on it: > > > > > > > > > > >>http://books.google.com/books?id=yDhGoR6yU8AC&dq=Noam+Chomsky+anarchy... > > > > > > > > > > >> On Jun 27, 4:27 pm, iam deheretic <[email protected]> > > > > > > > > > >> wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> > Collective anger is interesting . It leaves me wondering > > > > > > > > > >> > who is > > > > > > > > > >> > controlling > > > > > > > > > >> > it. In Red Handed discussion there is tremendous > > > > > > > > > >> > violence demonstrated > > > > > > > > > >> > and > > ... > > read more �- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/Minds-Eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
