Well Chris you are right it is not supprising at all that I do not agree with the philosopies of a certian eminant Russian/American philosopher. However I don't see the link between my responses around the question of Determinism as opposed to freedom of choice for sentiant creatures and Self Determinism in a Randian context.
On the surface it appears to be a thing that we, that is myself and Rand may well agree on, so I don't really understand why our apparent agreement would lead you to say this? However when I say that Rand does not say the 'right things' yes of course this comes from the way I percive things. The way I percive things is grounded in reality as Rand would have us do, and reality tells me that humans are a social creature. Pat has told us that in his view morality are rules for interacting with our fellow beings, and there is certianly a logic ring of truth about this. Rands morality ignores thi in favour of the individaul and yes she does talk about 'full respect of others rights' yet you and I have met and 'debated' enough times with enough followers of her philosphey to have seen that such a philosophy in practice makes the individual cold, arrogant, and seemingly uncaring about her fellow man. It is interesting then that both Communism and the philosophies of Rand, when put into practice simply do not work on a social level. On 27 Aug, 19:44, Chris Jenkins <[email protected]> wrote: > I'm not surprised you're set in your perspective that Rand says the wrong > things, given your responses about Determinism to Pat. Self Determinism is > not much different, no? > > On Thu, Aug 27, 2009 at 11:29 AM, [email protected] < > > > > [email protected]> wrote: > > > Umm yeah good one Chris. > > > My first instinct is that communist philosphy on paper says the right > > things, whilst of course Rand does not. > > > On 27 Aug, 16:12, Chris Jenkins <[email protected]> wrote: > > > From here: > >http://www.willwilkinson.net/flybottle/2009/08/24/what-we-are-not-emb... > > > > " > > > > Here is a good debate proposition: It ought to be less embarrassing to > > have > > > been influenced by Ayn Rand than by Karl Marx. > > > > The most powerful way to argue the affirmative is to compare the number > > of > > > human beings murdered by the devotees of each. That line of attack ought > > to > > > be decisive, but I’m afraid it won’t get you far with the multitude of > > > highly-self-regarded thinkers influenced by Karl Marx. Fact is, > > commitment > > > to some kind of socialism and fluency in the jargon of Marxism used to be > > > mandatory for serious intellectuals. And there’s something glamorous in > > the > > > very idea of the intellectual. Even for those of us who came of age after > > > 1989, Marxism, like cigarettes, remains linked by association to the idea > > of > > > the intellectual, and so, like cigarettes, shares in the intellectual’s > > > glamour. I don’t know if cigarettes or Marxism have killed more people, > > but > > > it’s pretty clear cigarettes are more actively stigmatized. Marxists, > > > neo-Marxists, crypto-Marxists, post-Marxists, etc. have an enduring > > > influence on intellectual fashion. So it is not only possible proudly to > > > confess Marx’s influence on one’s thought, but it remains possible in > > some > > > quarters to impress by doing so. It ought to be embarrassing, but it > > isn’t. > > > Being a bit of a Marxist is like having a closet full of pirate blouses > > but > > > never having to worry." > > > > This gave me pause for consideration. Rand's philosophies have been much > > > maligned as "uncompassionate", while certain "socialist" (Marxist > > Communist) > > > policies have been held up as an ideal, and yet, how many people have > > been > > > killed in the name of Randian philosophy, and how many have been killed > > in > > > the name of Marxist philosophy? > > > > What do YOU think? ;)- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~ You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected] To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected] For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/minds-eye?hl=en -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---
