“Many Public Schools have been turning out idiots, kids that can't read or read at a poor level. Kids can enhance their socialization skills in extra curricular activities, sports events and other social functions. Home schooled children are not isolated prisoners confined to parental control.” – SD
I have no doubt about the reading ability or lack thereof of some kids… whether the cause is innate, a lack of ability, ADD caused, diet caused or just due to lack of interest…whether ‘taught’ in public, private or ‘home’ schools. In fact, I am a good example of a failed experiment in a teaching method for both reading and spelling from back in the 40s and 50s. So, first hand, I know the result. However, I do not attribute this issue to a nonsectarian education vs a sectarian one nor do I see any reason to do so…unless perhaps the recent trend in a lack of willingness to support the general welfare. So yet again, the issues are much more complex than many wish to see. Simplistic comments like Slip’s first sentence while pointing towards a possible fact (difficult to tell its veracity), in truth says little to nothing about cause/effect…just unexamined opinion. And, I agree about socialization skills being available in almost any place and/or type of interaction. However, yet again, isolating kids from public contact with a wider range of people than what is ‘normal’ for the fundamentalist family seems to have obvious consequences. At first, I wasn’t sure of the reason for the links provided…in fact, I’m still not positive. However, I’m glad they were given. If anything, they support my aversion to such treatment of kids…similar to the current day view against imposing faith healing on kids is seen as being abuse. Both are founded on non-secular tenets and all too often result in the sort of fanaticism that has been railed against here at ME by many, Slip included. A simple quote from one of the links, from one Tim Echols may be instructive: “…Spiritually, TeenPact teaches Biblical principles of government and family, going hand-in-hand with the values of families who participate. It is very important that our young people see that spiritual revival is the answer to America's problems - not politics. We teach students that every Christian must pray and vote according to Biblical principles….” - http://www.teenpact.com/ If anything, this sort of thinking is divisive rather than unifying. And, with little imagination the flaws in such an approach can be seen. Further, the links shared along with other resources I’ve examined over the years expose the litigious and sectarian view(s) not only imbedded within such groups but that are at the very core of the entire movement. No, most kids are not isolated prisoners, true. However, most kids who are forced into sectarian ‘education’, being too naïve to know better let alone wise enough, powerful enough or savvy enough to fight parental control in such situations, I suggest are being brainwashed in an even more disastrous way than those who are educated by the state…at least here in the USA. And we aren’t even talking about what sort of health care they may be receiving without public scrutiny or support nor other associated issues yet. The term Madrasah comes to mind. On Feb 2, 1:28 am, Slip Disc <[email protected]> wrote: > http://www.hslda.org/laws/default.asp > > http://www.hslda.org/legislation/state/default.asp > > http://www.hslda.org/orgs/default.asp > > Many Public Schools have been turning out idiots, kids that can't read > or read at a poor level. Kids can enhance their socialization skills > in extra curricular activities, sports events and other social > functions. Home schooled children are not isolated prisoners confined > to parental control. > > On Feb 1, 9:52 pm, ornamentalmind <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > “…Any thoughts?” – fran > > > Yes fran…I have a few although don’t claim lucidity for this topic. > > First, my gut as the US started to fully embrace what euphemistically > > is called ‘home schooling’ said that it was a mistake. In other > > words, without much analysis, my intuition is against it. There are a > > few thoughts wafting across my mind that says parents should > > absolutely have the right to organize and deliver the education for > > their own children especially when there is concern about the bias > > being imposed by a governmentally run educational system. Yet, should > > such parents have some sort of standardized education and teaching > > ability themselves? It would seem appropriate too. Yet, if so, who > > would make such a determination…the same government they fear for > > whatever reason? In the specific case, being prejudiced against > > fundamentalism in general and most manifestations of Christianity in > > particular, I believe that the children are being abused in that they > > will be handed beliefs in a sort of nepotism …just reinforcing > > whatever blind beliefs and/or ignorance the specific family has. > > Whereas, in a public educational environment, since most that I am > > familiar with are influenced by all aspects of society from the PTA to > > governmental directives, resulting in a more homogeneous and well > > rounded set of instructions. Of course, in most cases, I would guess > > that there will be little instruction in how to think or use logic so > > what we are talking about in general is training, right? So, what sort > > of information and abilities should be imparted? I’m sure many have > > their own views. I’m not sure about it myself. As a kid, it all seemed > > natural …the topics were well rounded and included everything from the > > arts and civics to local, state, country and world history to > > languages and maths and…well…mostly standard stuff. Although these > > days in the US, as I understand it, there is precious little imparted > > about civics let alone about music, art and dance. Even physical > > education seems to be declining …perhaps. In all cases, for a societal > > input and support for the general good when it comes to education, > > funding is needed. Today, too many of the rich wish to keep their > > money for personal usage rather than for the common good…as I see it. > > Whew!...guess my soap box came out…I’ll take a breath. > > > Overall, in my youth, there were both public schools and religious > > schools. Parents had a choice between them and apparently didn’t need > > to home school. I do understand that for a long time there have been > > people who assign a higher value to what they see as god’s law, > > adoration and instruction than is assigned to that of the state. > > Somehow, I don’t remember this being a problem for the first few > > decades of my life…all seemed to go along fairly well. Somehow, by no > > accident I’s posit, there has been an increase in religious influence > > when it comes to what used to be nonsectarian issues, education > > included. Of course, I just may have been ignorant. > > > Overall, in Germany and the US…I’d personally prefer kids to receive a > > good, well rounded and well funded education and do away with home > > schooling. My guess is that if this were done in even more > > fundamentalist and religious societies/countries, there would be a > > little less polarization…not sure, just a guess again. > > > Of course, we haven’t discussed other options…and I’m sure there are > > ME members with ‘em….Neil comes to mind. Personally, I’d add a little > > of the Socratic method to education…more even than testing covers. > > > Well, this is most likely worth what you pay for it!....you asked…I > > answered. > > > On Feb 1, 9:52 am, frantheman <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > A German family has been given political asylum in the US because of > > > their refusal to send their children to school in Germany and the > > > subsequent, according to the US judge granting the application, "well > > > founded fear of persecution." > > > > http://www.spiegel.de/international/germany/0,1518,674492,00.html > > > > Germany does not allow home schooling. The article in "der Spiegel" > > > explains: "Mandatory school attendance is based on "the idea that > > > group learning in school also helps develop social skills," says > > > Martina Elschenbroich, an expert on education law with the Culture > > > Minister Conference, an assembly that brings together education > > > ministers from Germany's 16 states. Children learn how to interact > > > with people who hold different views, which serves as the basis of a > > > democratic society, says Elschenbroich." The German position has been > > > upheld by the European Court of Human Rights in 2006. > > > > I am aware that the radical libertarian tradition in the US (and the > > > impossibility of mandatory school attendance for many chidren in the > > > legendary frontier days of the 19th. Century) gives home-schooling a > > > certain cachet. On the other hand, it seems to me that it harbours > > > great dangers in giving all kinds of - sorry to be so blunt - nuts the > > > chance to indocrinate their children with rubbish. > > > > Any thoughts? > > > > Francis- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups ""Minds Eye"" group. To post to this group, send email to [email protected]. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to [email protected]. 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