Again my freind teh opperative word is abnormal. Acepting that a brain is functioning normaly, then freedom of choice is certianly present.
You know even when the brain is not functioning normaly, freedom of choice is still present. A freind of mine is schizophrenic, I have seen hinm on the very worst of his days and the very best, during each time, 'He' has still been present. He know has a grip on his condition so that when an episode hits he realieses just what is occouring and takes steps to rectify it. So you see even when he is in the grip of these chemical inbalances, he enjoyes enough freedom of will to decide to take his pills, or go to bed, or call me up, or go sit with his mum, or whatever he decides there and then is the best course of action at that moment in time. Yep this includes some aspects of his self destructivity and he may instead smoke a jay or drink some beer. On Mar 4, 12:21 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > If abnormal behaviour is due to chemical imbalance or normal behavior > due to chemical balance , then keeping all things aside where is your > free will ? If will can act awry due to chemical imbalance how can you > call it free ? > > On Fri, Mar 4, 2011 at 5:26 PM, [email protected] > > > > <[email protected]> wrote: > > The opperative word here being madman. > > > The brain is the seat of the person, the personality. If the brain is > > not working correclty, like any other part of the body our medicines > > can indeed help fix this. > > > Or there is cognative therapy, where-in the madman is given tools to > > help himself get himself better. > > > If free will does not exist why does CT work? > > > On Mar 4, 2:44 am, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> A madman is dancing around the streets , his actions and thoughts are > >> bizarre but whatever he is doing it is with free will. He is given > >> medicines over a period of time and is not interfered with in any > >> other manner. Over a period of time his actions and thoughts become > >> normal , where is your free will , Lee? Actions and thoughts are made > >> rational with medicines , in other words thoughts and actions can be > >> controlled with physical or chemical administrations. In other words > >> the will is not free but controlled from within and outside the > >> organism , and from within in the sense that your very nature comes > >> into play. > > >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:43 PM, [email protected] > > >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > Again my friend I agree, man sure does interpret scripturein a biased > >> > manner. > > >> > Again I don't argue against determinisim, but I question the level of > >> > effect it has on rational, thinking beings, and I alo simply do not > >> > belive choice within a limitted scope is not free. > > >> > As I say I may wish to fly unadied by machines, but cannot due to the > >> > confineds of my body, however I can still fly if that is my wish. My > >> > choice may be restricted, but it is still ther for me to make. > > >> > Choice. > > >> > We make many choices everyday. Either do A or do not do A. The fact > >> > that my choice is limited to one of these does not negate the fact > >> > that I can still make that choice. > > >> > Undoubedlty you may question, what in my past has determined what my > >> > choice may be, unknownst to me, in my subcociouse. I say such a > >> > belife is grounded in the very act of beliefe itself. > > >> > Unless one can point to all that you say may determine choice then to > >> > take the stance of determinism based upon this is at best an educated > >> > guess, and at worst unsubstanciated belife. > > >> > On Mar 3, 4:52 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> Man interprets the Scriptures in a biased manner , but if you look > >> >> closely and take into account diverse verses you will find that the > >> >> meaning is quite clear. Science is so advanced now that the laws of > >> >> biology , genetics , psychology etc. give credence to the faith in > >> >> determinism. You say there are conditions, but I see conditions within > >> >> conditions. > > >> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 10:04 PM, [email protected] > > >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> > Quite poetic really RP. > > >> >> > I can't help but wonder how many ways this passage could be > >> >> > interpreted though. That addition of the word heart makes me think > >> >> > automaticly that the power of love can move anything. > > >> >> > Does this really suggest then God literaly controls us, or indeed our > >> >> > movments, or could it perhaps suggest that Gods love moves the hearts > >> >> > of man? > > >> >> > On Mar 3, 3:35 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> I am quoting a verse from the last chapter of the Bhagvadagita :- > >> >> >> The Lord abides in the hearts of all beings , Oh Arjuna , causing > >> >> >> them > >> >> >> to move around by His power as if they were mounted on a machine. > > >> >> >> You will find similar verses in other Scriptures as well if you take > >> >> >> the trouble to look. > > >> >> >> On Thu, Mar 3, 2011 at 7:16 PM, [email protected] > > >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> > I think you are correct in some aspects RP. I would call what you > >> >> >> > call bondage by a differant name. > > >> >> >> > I would name it condition. If your argument is that ther is no > >> >> >> > unfettered freedom, that all is dependant on other things then > >> >> >> > you'll > >> >> >> > get no argument from me. > > >> >> >> > Everything is conditional. I might like to fly unaided by > >> >> >> > mechanics, > >> >> >> > but I simply cannot. This is a condition of my body, and my > >> >> >> > species. > > >> >> >> > Reason, human reason like much else about us is not static, that > >> >> >> > is to > >> >> >> > say what resonable conclusions I may have made ten years ago, can > >> >> >> > be > >> >> >> > subject to change. > > >> >> >> > Of course there are also conditions that apply to our reasoning, I > >> >> >> > may > >> >> >> > never have a larger than avarage IQ, for example. > > >> >> >> > On Mar 2, 2:04 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> Lee why do you choose to believe in free will whereas I in > >> >> >> >> bondage? It > >> >> >> >> is because our beliefs and reasoning is different. Free will > >> >> >> >> appears > >> >> >> >> logical to you whereas to me it does not. Our reasoning is at > >> >> >> >> loggerheads because our reasoning faculties and experience is > >> >> >> >> different. We are bound by our reason , and this itself is > >> >> >> >> bondage. > >> >> >> >> Where is your free choice then? > > >> >> >> >> On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 6:56 PM, [email protected] > > >> >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> > Sorry RP I can't get with that at all, as you well know by now. > > >> >> >> >> > A persons nature is not static but moves as the person does. > >> >> >> >> > It is > >> >> >> >> > possible to shake of the products of an 'early envirmonent', > >> >> >> >> > hence we > >> >> >> >> > have so many atheists from religious households. > > >> >> >> >> > Do we all act within the scope of Gods will? > > >> >> >> >> > If this is true then no religous text would contain no words of > >> >> >> >> > punishment for denying Gods will. They do though, it is clear > >> >> >> >> > then > >> >> >> >> > that we have a choice to obey or not the will of God. There is > >> >> >> >> > a > >> >> >> >> > prayer prevalent in more than one of the worlds religions that > >> >> >> >> > runs > >> >> >> >> > basicly 'not my will ohh lord but yours' > > >> >> >> >> > What is the meaning of this? > > >> >> >> >> > Does it admit that there is one will and that is Gods, or does > >> >> >> >> > it beg > >> >> >> >> > God grant me the strenght to obey not my will but yours? > > >> >> >> >> > I would obviously plump for the latter. > > >> >> >> >> > What is religious dogma if not a list of things designed to get > >> >> >> >> > one to > >> >> >> >> > God? Why the need for it, if all was Gods will anyway? > > >> >> >> >> > On Mar 1, 1:14 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> When a person thinks or acts he does so as if he were the > >> >> >> >> >> master of > >> >> >> >> >> his will but in fact unknown to him various forces within > >> >> >> >> >> himself are > >> >> >> >> >> taking him along as a current takes along a boat in turbulent > >> >> >> >> >> waters. > >> >> >> >> >> Most of the times a man's motives are hidden to him , he acts > >> >> >> >> >> ostensibly for some reasons whereas the real motives lie in his > >> >> >> >> >> unconscious. This has been dealt in various books of > >> >> >> >> >> psychology. If > >> >> >> >> >> you act according to your nature that nature was given to you > >> >> >> >> >> by the > >> >> >> >> >> Almighty in the form of your genes and early environment , and > >> >> >> >> >> so > >> >> >> >> >> whatever you do it is not your but God's doing. > > >> >> >> >> >> On Tue, Mar 1, 2011 at 5:39 PM, [email protected] > > >> >> >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> > Is that true though? Or is it better expresed thusly: > > >> >> >> >> >> > My nature has been created by both internal and external > >> >> >> >> >> > influences > >> >> >> >> >> > yet is still my nature, and thus is me? > > >> >> >> >> >> > What is the differance between a persons nature and a > >> >> >> >> >> > person? Is not > >> >> >> >> >> > the nature of the man, the man himself? > > >> >> >> >> >> > On Feb 28, 5:31 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> My nature consists of the forces within me which bind my > >> >> >> >> >> >> freedom of > >> >> >> >> >> >> will. In that context it can be said that your nature is > >> >> >> >> >> >> separate from > >> >> >> >> >> >> you. > > >> >> >> >> >> >> On Mon, Feb 28, 2011 at 10:32 PM, > >> >> >> >> >> >> [email protected] > > >> >> >> >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> > And you and your nature is seperate? > > >> >> >> >> >> >> > On Feb 27, 3:20 pm, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> Whether you adapt or you revolt , in either case it is > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> not you but > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> your nature which makes the choice. > > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> On Sun, Feb 27, 2011 at 7:06 PM, rigsy03 > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> <[email protected]> wrote: > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Adaption may be phoney/false in order to > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > survive/prosper/get along. > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Afterall, a child is controlled in beliefs and > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > behaviors by his > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > parents. The child cannot even change its name unless > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > it goes to > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > court- even marriage only changes the last name. (I > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > was named to match > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > family monograms on linens, silver and as a bone > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > tossed to my father's > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > ego and my mother's determination to establish a stake > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > in a failing > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > marriage.) The brain is not mature until the > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > mid-twenties. > > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > We should discuss motive and its role in making > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > choices. Often motive > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > is not apparent until you are beyond the choice or > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > older and in the > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > ruminating stage. > > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > Women developed manipulation to an art form. Power is > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > another > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > important element in choice. > > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > It is human to try various adaptions on for size. I > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > thought of a line > >> >> >> >> >> >> >> > the other day: I tried on sin but found it unbecoming. > > ... > > read more »- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
