It is also felt that faith comes out of religious practice. It is also felt that faith is bestowed by God upon true believers and one is in mortal/spiritual peril to doubt and lose faith.
Don't you feel dharma can also just be an expression of personality or character- or even natural talents- as well as something to do with religion or religious virtue? On Sep 14, 10:13 am, RP Singh <[email protected]> wrote: > Lee , I would conjecture an explanation : Religious practice is > something which comes out of your Faith and dharmic practice is > something which comes out of your soul and has no human reason as such > a mortal reason would dilute it. If you start laughing without any > reason, which I very much doubt , you can put it down to dharmic > practice. > > > > On Wed, Sep 14, 2011 at 7:38 PM, Lee Douglas <[email protected]> wrote: > > Heh rejoice, naaa man I'm not like that. > > > No sir I agreed with your definitions, and then I said I see no > > differance between what I have called dogma and what you call dharma. > > > Let me ask agian what is the point of dharmic practice, what is the > > point of religious practice? > > > The point of both you understand, not any further definintion. > > > Those who think that religion is a root of morality are deluding > > themselves Vam. My own morality was there ever before I was old > > enough to even hear about the concept of God, wasn't yours? So nope > > religon is no reason for being honest. > > > By labeling me 'less than' honest, what does this say about the level > > of discourse now Vam? > > > On Sep 14, 1:41 pm, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > >> On Sep 13, 2:46 pm, Lee Douglas <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > Meh! Vam giving in so easily? > > >> Rejoice, Lee ! > > >> > Yes Panth and Amrit is religous dogma, and Ik onkar is the root of the > >> > faith so could be called dharma. But I say that religous practices, > >> > or dogma if you wish is the same as dharma. > > >> You saw the difference but did come back to say there is no > >> difference ! So, whilst you can say anything, check up on yourself for > >> the contradictions you are dishing out. > > >> > As I asked you Vam, what is the point of dharmic practice, what is the > >> > point of religious practice? > > >> Dharma is truth. Religion is claim of truth. > > >> Dharma is honesty without a reason. Religion is reasons for being > >> honest. > > >> In fact, in my view, your recent posts are less than honest, less than > >> true ( to your own self !). > >> Which you can only cover up, in truth, by situating yourself in Dharma > >> and not on religion, whatever it be. > > >> > On Sep 12, 6:27 pm, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > I'll be a little sharp here, Lee. > > >> > > The Panth, Akal Takht, and the Amrit rituals in Sikhism is religion, > >> > > Lee. > > >> > > Eko Onkar... kindness, compassion, unity in diversity, honesty, > >> > > truthfulness... is dharma. > > >> > > Religion claim dharma but are not. Dharma claims no religion. It just > >> > > is. > > >> > > There is nothing more to be said on the topic, to those who may > >> > > appreciate and to those who cannot. > > >> > > Lee Douglas wrote: > >> > > > Heh yep I disagree with Vam, clearly. I see no differance and see > >> > > > this as a purely semantic issue. Perhaps Vam simply does not like > >> > > > the > >> > > > conitations of the word religion (for some) in his own religion. > > >> > > > I agree that perhaps the word Dharma is not a straight translation of > >> > > > the word Religion or indeed the other way around. But the concepts > >> > > > are exaclty the same. See RP Singhs post, he has it right I belive. > > >> > > > On Sep 12, 4:49 pm, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > > > Vam is referring to the old concept of dharma and that has > >> > > > > nothing at all > >> > > > > to do with religion,, as wit all things in evolution meaning of > >> > > > > words also > >> > > > > change evolve. Well Lee you and I have different concepts than > >> > > > > other > >> > > > > people. > >> > > > > Allan > > >> > > > > On Mon, Sep 12, 2011 at 11:40 AM, Lee Douglas > >> > > > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > >> > > > > > I'll say it again. I find no differance between the concepts of > >> > > > > > dharma and religoin. > > >> > > > > > What is the point of dharmic practice, what is the point of > >> > > > > > religious > >> > > > > > practice? > > >> > > > > > On Sep 10, 8:32 am, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > > > > > Therefore ? I didn't see the logic. > > >> > > > > > > Dharma is universal values... I agree that isn't very > >> > > > > > > universal ! > > >> > > > > > > rigsy03 wrote: > >> > > > > > > > How is one instructed by Dharma except by tradition? > >> > > > > > > > Therefore it does > >> > > > > > > > not exist as a Universal. > > >> > > > > > > > On Sep 9, 10:12 am, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > > > > > > > A post elsewhere... which cud be juxtaposed with thoughts > >> > > > > > > > > generally > >> > > > > > > > > expressed here : > > >> > > > > > > > > " ... the word " religion " itself is a Western construct, > >> > > > > > > > > meaning as > >> > > > > > > > > it came to be practiced by people - looking for salvation, > >> > > > > > > > > believing > >> > > > > > > > > what they were told, and launching on their conversion > >> > > > > > > > > drives > >> > > > > > > > > everywhere they went with their gun and swords and > >> > > > > > > > > recycled loot. > > >> > > > > > > > > " Dharma is a totally different construct... the whole > >> > > > > > > > > universe of > >> > > > > > > > > values and truths in and of which all beings are born, in > >> > > > > > > > > and of > >> > > > > > which > >> > > > > > > > > they live, in and of which they depart, and in and of > >> > > > > > > > > which they are > >> > > > > > > > > reborn. It is life and living itself, which exhorts us to > >> > > > > > > > > do the > >> > > > > > > > > needful and the right, even while leaving us with the > >> > > > > > > > > freedom and the > >> > > > > > > > > choice to do otherwise, as we please but with their > >> > > > > > > > > respective > >> > > > > > > > > consequences. > > >> > > > > > > > > " Dharma is life itself, and the way of living in accord > >> > > > > > > > > to universal > >> > > > > > > > > values and truths." > > >> > > > > > > > > ornamentalmind wrote: > >> > > > > > > > > > Yet, are those traditions in any way strictly > >> > > > > > > > > > monotheistic? Most > >> > > > > > that > >> > > > > > > > > > I am aware of do not make such a claim; although as you > >> > > > > > > > > > say some > >> > > > > > do. > > >> > > > > > > > > > When it comes to the presentation of an argument, the > >> > > > > > > > > > terms used > >> > > > > > are > >> > > > > > > > > > often important as Vam knows. Making a claim for all > >> > > > > > > > > > cases in such > >> > > > > > a > >> > > > > > > > > > case is asking for rebuttal. Of course, that may have > >> > > > > > > > > > been his > >> > > > > > intent! > > >> > > > > > > > > > On Sep 9, 4:16 am, Molly <[email protected]> wrote: > >> > > > > > > > > > > I would disagree in that there are mystical traditions > >> > > > > > > > > > > to many > >> > > > > > eastern > >> > > > > > > > > > > and western religions that do none of those three. > > >> > > > > > > > > > > On Sep 9, 6:34 am, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Monotheistic Religions, as they are, do three things > >> > > > > > > > > > > > : > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 1 Assure salvation, the power for which is entirely > >> > > > > > > > > > > > with > >> > > > > > another > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 2 Demand Belief in a defined presentation of > >> > > > > > > > > > > > thought and > >> > > > > > ideology > >> > > > > > > > > > > > 3 Convert others to their fold through material > >> > > > > > > > > > > > lure, physical > >> > > > > > and > >> > > > > > > > > > > > mental fear and reward. > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > Atheistic disciplines, pantheistic and polytheistic > >> > > > > > > > > > > > ways of > >> > > > > > living do > >> > > > > > > > > > > > none of these. > > >> > > > > > > > > > > > They are therefore not religions as the people in > >> > > > > > > > > > > > the West and > >> > > > > > Middle > >> > > > > > > > > > > > East believe in and understand !- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > > > - Show quoted text - > > >> > > > > -- > >> > > > > ( > >> > > > > ) > >> > > > > |_D Allan > > >> > > > > live is for moral, ethical and truthful living.- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> > > - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > >> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text - > > - Show quoted text -
