We indeed agree... and I empathise, while steering through my own personal financial mess.
I feel there is a need to separate the personal from the common. Voltaire shows the way... accept the money for now, wherever it is, as much as you can, with clear intent, from whoever it is... so that you can take up the common cause more freely. The "victim" mode is addictive, weakening, and useless. Strength is virtue, with someone of your clear intent. On Oct 8, 12:37 am, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > I agree a lot Vam - but the capitalism angle in misunderstood by > many. Capitalism can't work with monopolies or in creating a wealthy > class that simply takes advantage of money power (which it does in > spades). What we've sunk back to as a near feudal oligopoly. Much of > the point of debt jubilee is to secure what I assume rigsy's position > is. I have little debt myself and thus it would look as though I > wouldn't be e beneficiary, but I'm sure this is not the case. The > 'queezing' that's been going on is inflationary (or will be) in a way > that will be a disaster for fixed incomes. Chris' picks a great, > demonstrating the protests have a wide base. I don't know how anyone > can be bother with Democrats, Republicans or Labour and Tories - all > of them are only fit for ridicule. The 'best' of all is communist > China building 13 ghost cities that no one lives in - somewhat of a > moral contradiction one would think, even in the tiniest mind. Has > Palin gone because she was a small-minded semi-literate or because she > was laid by a black guy? > > I fancied some project management to keep my oar in Orn - found most > of the offered jobs didn't really exist. There is teaching work - but > this is because universities have cut establishment posts in order to > use 'cheaper' part-timers. I'm currently being paid from an EU > project for doing nothing because the budget has been withheld for so > long from participating universities have dropped out and didn't > include the 'fail-safe' in the contract I negotiated (EU money is > always late). The project money is being diverted to pay Eurocrats. > They have just asked me if I will take on more of this non-existent > work in order to balance their books - it looks like they want me to > claim outcomes for the whole project so it can be written off as > 'successful'. Bent doesn't begin to describe it all. The > universities concerned are now trying to get their staff to do the > work for nothing whilst billing them at $200 an hour. I sometimes go > to our local job centre and print off the available jobs - there are > one or two amidst hundreds of dross commission only and the ones I > wasted time applying for last year until I realised they were bogus. > University graduates are increasingly finding internships are unpaid. > The minimum wage is being flouted (it's £6.08 an hour) by illegal > 'self-employed' status. > > We need to go the other way and make decently paid jobs available in > public projects and force private sector competition with that - > dealing with international cheap labour issues through quality of work > life standards. > > On Oct 7, 2:22 pm, Vam <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > I do not know if there is ever a time in history when status quo is > > preferable or will ever be, except by those who are profiting from the > > situation under the arrangement and fear the chaos or "anarchy" of > > change. > > > But the historical dialogue for a compassionate society, for equal > > opportunity not skewed by mere might, financial and otherwise, for > > transparency of public interest and governance decision-making > > processes, for a life of dignity for all ... for removing corruption > > in economy, subversion in polity and disintegration in society ... > > continues through protests calling, then demanding, change. > > > Fortunately, Gandhi, King and Mandela have made it possible for > > protests to be non-violent, in democracies that do reiterate that > > value... along with others including belief in dialogue, > > responsiveness to people needs, human rights and dignity to life, etc. > > > It's time to make it real, time for elites to appreciate that > > disproportionate appropriation of Light, Freedom, Happiness and > > Dignity for themselves, unmindful of others or, worse, at their cost > > is no longer tenable... is socially a crime, yes, a crime, regardless > > of legal approval. > > > Capitalism is the need, for creating advatages. And, capitalism is the > > argument, for spreading them. > > > On Oct 7, 5:30 pm, "[email protected]" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > Jobs considered his being fired from Apple a blessing in disguise and > > > I wish you the same. Same with his dropping out of school- a waste for > > > many. > > > > What do you think retired people of moderate means are going to do in > > > this enviornment? Here come the death panels! > > > > On Oct 6, 11:30 pm, Chris Jenkins <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > Actually, we all brought garbage bags, and cleaned up after ourselves. > > > > As > > > > for finding a job, I've been on the market for over 18 months, with a > > > > solid, > > > > industry professional resume, and have found nothing. Meanwhile, many > > > > of my > > > > former colleagues have joined my ranks. > > > > > On Fri, Oct 7, 2011 at 12:19 AM, [email protected] > > > > <[email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > The biased media and comics have been trashing conservatives and > > > > > ridiculing the Tea Party and various candidiates so you have to expect > > > > > some payback. > > > > > > How do these protestors expect to find a job or stay in school if they > > > > > spend all their time protesting? Who will pay for the clean-up? What > > > > > business would risk hiring these people? > > > > > > Most loot is not easily transported. :-) > > > > > > On Oct 6, 9:40 pm, Don Johnson <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > I scanned it and agree, a bit bullshitty but one must admire the > > > > > > hopeful > > > > > > tone the writer emits. So the Occupiers are all about coming > > > > > > together if > > > > > not > > > > > > completely cogent on their reasons for doing so. Where the Tea > > > > > > Party, to > > > > > me, > > > > > > has mostly been about tax and spending cuts Tthe Occupiers seem, > > > > > > again to > > > > > > me(it's a shame it's still so unclear) to be all about political > > > > > corporate > > > > > > favoritism. I would hesitate to label the 99%ers as Class Warriors > > > > > although > > > > > > many of their organizers seem to have this at the top of their > > > > > > agenda. > > > > > > > I'm disappointed in the rhetoric from Conservative mouthpieces like > > > > > Limbaugh > > > > > > that are trashing the movement. Ridiculing the protestors and so > > > > > > forth. > > > > > It > > > > > > would make more sense to recognize that there are those that are > > > > > > having > > > > > some > > > > > > tough times and try to help educate those disaffected folks on the > > > > > > real > > > > > > problems which isn't rich people per se. It's bad government. By > > > > > > both > > > > > > Republicans and Democrats. In a nutshell, too much wasteful > > > > > > spending and > > > > > not > > > > > > enough pin-pointed economic stimulus spending. > > > > > > > Thanks for the link to the Boston Group Arch I'll probably read it > > > > > > again > > > > > > soon. These economist make sense but the real problem is going to be > > > > > coming > > > > > > up with something everyone can swallow. We sure don't need our very > > > > > > own > > > > > > Reign Of Terror. Nobody wants to give in here. If I was rich I'd be > > > > > > tired > > > > > of > > > > > > being called the bad guy all the time unless I really was the bad > > > > > > guy in > > > > > > which case I wouldn't care a fig. I'd take my loot and go somewhere > > > > > > else. > > > > > > God help us all. > > > > > > > dj > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 12:02 PM, archytas <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > There's a take on Occupy Wall Street at > > > > > > > >http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/10/matt-stoller-the-anti-politics. > > > > > .. > > > > > > > - that sounds like Allan - a bit bullshitty (sorry Al - not you) > > > > > > > Chris > > > > > > > but an interesting take. > > > > > > > > I can't stand any standard politics now. It's madness. > > > > > > > > On Oct 6, 8:36 am, Allan H <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > I think there is where the problem lies,, several decades ago > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > > revolution was bassed off ideology differences (the Little Red > > > > > > > > Book) > > > > > > > this > > > > > > > > really was not a valid reason.. > > > > > > > > > today I see > > > > > >http://www.nakedcapitalism.com/2011/10/matt-stoller-the-anti-politics...,, > > > > > especially in the US also to a > > > > > > > > lesser extent Europe.. in the US there are other problems > > > > > > > > there are > > > > > > > > existing undergrounds outside of police intelligence,, there > > > > > > > > are > > > > > massive > > > > > > > > amounts of weapons out of site and out of mind and other than > > > > > > > > the > > > > > owner > > > > > > > no > > > > > > > > one knows about them.. Even I still have guns and I no longer > > > > > > > > live > > > > > > > there.. > > > > > > > > > The US is extremely Large,, there is also a large community of > > > > > > > > motor > > > > > > > homes > > > > > > > > which have the ability move and potentially lower the cost of > > > > > living.. > > > > > > > > and organize.. the police are not unsympathetic either as they > > > > > > > > often > > > > > > > times > > > > > > > > in the same or similar situation.. > > > > > > > > > I do believe co-op-s will become more plentiful, underground > > > > > > > > work > > > > > will > > > > > > > > become more prevalent.. it will change,, I think the start is > > > > > > > > in > > > > > > > > eliminating the political corruption that is so embedded.. > > > > > > > > sigh > > > > > > > > Allan > > > > > > > > > I hate change .. but greed is so wide spread.. a tremendous > > > > > > > > lose > > > > > > > > of spirituality ,, but fundamentalism may have some perks in > > > > > > > > the > > > > > end,, > > > > > > > > > On Thu, Oct 6, 2011 at 5:59 AM, Chris Jenkins < > > > > > > > [email protected]>wrote: > > > > > > > > > > I see BoA as an infinitely powerful entity, and can't imagine > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > > > behemoth > > > > > > > > > falling. > > > > > > > > > On Oct 5, 2011 10:18 PM, "archytas" <[email protected]> wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Pruning ain't the metaphor I'd choose Chris. Dexia Bank has > > > > > > > > > > just > > > > > gone > > > > > > > > > > belly-up - it was 'worth' more than Belgium's GDP. The > > > > > > > > > > 'money' in > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > banking scam is at factors of ten in comparison with the > > > > > > > > > > world of > > > > > > > real > > > > > > > > > > work. My view is that it's in the way of capitalism and > > > > > democracy. > > > > > > > > > > The informed guess is they've been lending to crooks on a > > > > > > > > > > scale > > > > > > > vastly > > > > > > > > > > bigger than the barrel-loads of dollars gone in Iraq and > > > > > Afghanistan > > > > > > > > > > without securing any 'mineral rights'. The kleft stick is > > > > > > > > > > that > > > > > they > > > > > > > > > > can only make money through the same old scams, so whatever > > > > > > > > > > we > > > > > put > > > > > > > > > > back in (and I mean we) just does it all over again. In an > > > > > > > > > > oversimplified way, much of the debt is like you owing me $2 > > > > > million, > > > > > > > > > > Don owing 'Francois' $5 million, me owing Molly (etc.) in an > > > > > equation > > > > > > > > > > in which, if we cancelled out we're all solvent and I owe > > > > > > > > > > Orn a > > > > > beer > > > > > > > > > > he won'r drink. What goes in the cancelling is the banks - > > > > > > > > > > the > > > > > debts > > > > > > > > > > are so networked it's almost like the $2 million you owe me > > > > > > > > > > is > > > > > > > > > > balanced by $1.99 million I owe to people who owe you. I've > > > > > > > > > > been > > > > > > > > > > teaching the EU figures if anyone is interested (they just > > > > > > > > > > tell > > > > > this > > > > > > > > > > story between EU countries). > > > > > > > > > > > We've finally seen some reporting here. A Wall Street guy > > > > > > > > > > came on > > > > > and > > > > > > > > > > said he was amazed more people weren't protesting as he > > > > > > > > > > thought > > > > > true > > > > > > > > > > unemployment was at 15% - which is what I reckon here. The > > > > > > > > > > real > > > > > issue > > > > > > > > > > to me is jobs and wages. A key figure for me is that the > > > > > > > > > > bottom > > > > > 50% > > > > > > > > > > back in 1980 had 14% of liquid assets (cash more or less) > > > > > > > > > > and > > > > > that's > > > > > > > > > > down to 1% now. Wages have fallen. The debt problem starts > > > > > > > > > > around > > > > > > > > > > 1965 and it's similar in form to similar ones around gold > > > > > > > > > > rushes > > > > > in > > > > > > > > > > history. Most people I've seen on television or met in > > > > > > > > > > Manchester > > > > > > > > > > don't know much of the economics but are sick of the lack of > > > > > > > > > > opportunity. > > > > > > > > > > > I was left a house when my cousin died and had to drop the > > > > > > > > > > price > > > > > by a > > > > > > > > > > fifth to sell. There's no decent unskilled or engineering > > > > > > > > > > work > > > > > around > > > > > > > > > > here and jobs are being lost at some rate. Just up the road > > > > > > > > > > we > > > > > have > > > > > > > > > > 64 years of UK energy supply as shale gas about to be > > > > > > > > > > exploited. > > > > > I > > > > > > > > > > worked on the survey 25 years back. You'd think we'd have a > > > > > > > > > > plan > > > > > > > > > > around this but there isn't one. > > > > > > > > > > > Political blather is just about getting the economy moving, > > > > > > > > > > our > > > > > > > people > > > > > > > > > > working. It's all dross. Interestingly, our Republicans > > > > > > > > > > couldn't > > > > > > > > > > even fill the seats for the Prime Minister's speech. He's > > > > > > > > > > not a > > > > > half- > > > > > > > > > > wit like Palin but he's claiming his government has dealt > > > > > > > > > > with > > > > > the > > > > > > > > > > banks - yet two of the one's we bailed out are > > > ... > > > read more »
