> [DM] > Sounds OK to me, but in MOQ terms we might phrase it that the individual > is a > 4th level source of DQ... > > [Arlo] > Yeah, this to me still falls back on some S/O dichotomy that I don't like. > The > source of Dynamic change comes about, on all the MOQ levels, from patterns > on > that level responding to Quality.
DM: Yes, but the individual (as made possible by 4 levels including the social) allows a higher level of DQ to emerge, this is very important. Yes individual could be taken in SOM terms as something isolated but in MOQ terms it covers the individualised nature of 4th level human experience and the quality of this experience. Unless we can cease being finite being is some way, else we fail to recognise that we experience from a finite and specific perspective. If we place the "individual" on the 4th > level, then what is the 3rd level source of DQ? "Individuals too"? Doesn't > that > leave us saying that the MOQ is simply Inorganic-Biology-Individuals? > > Instead, I'd consider the "self-as-concept" to be an intellectual pattern > that > is capable of responding to Quality (on the Intellectual level). This kind > of > brings me back to the separation of cognition and meta-cognition (this is > one > I've been pondering lately) as how it may underscore the > social/intellectual > divide. Thus, cognizant beings (deriving cognizance from social activity) > are > 3rd level patterns capable of responding to Quality and fostering social > evolution, while "meta-cognizant constructs" (such as the "self") are what > exist as intellectual patterns and respond to Quality on this higher > level. > DM: Perhaps we agree. > The problem with the term "individual" is that it confuses these two, and > has a > long history of baggage the MOQ's understanding distances itself from > (such as > the "mind" originating from the social level). > > Does this make sense? DM I agree there is a baggage problem, as ever. Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
