SA previously: I wondering, what's the big deal about the moq not being fully defined?
(Ron prev): I feel, the establishment of a common understanding in which to base our approach would only advance it's use and meaning. SA: Doesn't mean we need to agree, does it? Ron: Well, SA we have to agree up to a point for any syntactic expression To be logically followed, but no, I don't mean to take it that far. Ron: Certainly what MoQ talks about can not be fully defined because it is experience itself. Certainly the word (noun) Quality can not definitely be defined. The words We use change meaning in use and over time so even if it were defined it would change. I really don't think you could Fully define MoQ if you tried, I think understanding MoQ means not having to defend this aspect, its an Intellectual pattern, it exists as concept only, it is a description of experience In terms. SA: Sure. So why have some from time to time gottin' seemingly tired of dq and argue against its' use? Ron: Good question SA, I think old habits die hard. . Ron: MoQ is about a way to more accurately talk about experience and therefore a more accurate understanding of experience. It transcends our cultural/intellectual paradigm by redefining how nouns and There fore "things" are termed and conceptualized. SA: true. But you would have to want to do this. I think ZMM and Lila are full of specific ways to leap into this understanding. For the moment, you seem to be using the noun way. Ron: I think I've pin pointed the location of some of the major Conflicts We face here on the discuss. But I understand Where you are coming from. I'm not trying to sell it Just explain it. SA: We live life to only die. We eat food to only shit it out a couple days later. We relax on the weekends to only have to go back to work on Monday (if your able to have weekends off). We get a paycheck to lose in a couple days on bills. Since quality can't be defined Ron, that means you can define your heart out if you so wish and define until the day you die. A reality that is undefined means you can intellectualize forever. Is this why some people get so defensive with dq? Their afraid to lose the ability to conceptualize anything anymore? Ron: I guess it comes to the perception that mystic experience Is associated with religious or new age tripe. Good ole Objectivism wants to dominate at every turn, even here. SA: With a reality undefined you don't need to be afraid of not being able to conceptualize anymore. With an undefined reality you have all the freedom to conceptualize forever. No end-point definition to stop you. Ron: Agree. I think people get uptight when there are no Boundaries. (Ron prev): A metaphysic that can not be discussed is useless. Pirsig is not saying drop your language and culture he is saying re-examine How it interprets knowledge and experience. SA: We do that. Ron: Some times I wonder about that. I hear tea swishing often. I'm off my linguistic philosophy kick. I got bigger fish to fry at the moment. I'm scheduled for surgery the 15th and I'm going to be laid-up For 4-6 weeks after that, so I need to do some planning. I just thought it connected some MoQ dots and explained a bunch. But It's all "IMO." Quiet -Ron ________________________________________________________________________ ____________ Be a better friend, newshound, and know-it-all with Yahoo! Mobile. Try it now. http://mobile.yahoo.com/;_ylt=Ahu06i62sR8HDtDypao8Wcj9tAcJ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
