Hi Jo/Krim
I think it is, because I think when we talk about DQ, creativity and
evolution, we are saying that we do notfind ourselves in an exclusively
mechanical
or determined situation.We find that situations have a range of
possibilities,
thaty we are notonly changed by our environment but can respond to it,
and response means enabling one set of possibilities to actualise and
foresaking other sets. Only where the possible has shrunk to a single
option, and this is rare, is anything mechanical and in any sense
determined.
Being consciousis being aware of the possibilities available and trying to
attain and avoid certain of them. Of course, we don't always avoid
or achieve what we aim for.
regards
David M
DM: All our ideas about natural processes derive from experience and our
imaginative atempts to make sense of this experience and to narrate a story
of how we have got to this point. We have to assume an understanding of
experience to understand how we can tell these stories and make these
descriptions. We start from experience to tell a story of how we got to this
point. We always have to start the story from here even if we are telling a
story that starts with the big bang but ends with how we got to the point
where we could start to imagine a big bang once began this story. Before we
can take seriously our descritions of natural processes we need to
understand how we do this, so we need to understand experience
phenomenologically, we need to describe experience and how we create notions
like natural processes.
DM
Hi DM, Krimel and all,
I recently posted a quote from Maurice Nicoll who was a student of Jung,
Gurdjieff, Ouspensky. He posits: ³Man is both in time and out of time. Now
the sensual mind is based on time and space, but not the psychological mind.
We can say that only partial truth is accessible to the sensual mind². ³In
time² I took to be a description of the consciousness at the MOQ social
level. ³Out of time² I read as a description of the consciousness at the
MOQ intellectual level.
In your opinion is this a phenomenological understanding of a description of
experience and how we create notions like natural processes? IMO
Consciousness evolves.
Joe
On 8/24/08 3:50 PM, "David M" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
Hi Krim
[Krimel]
What I have said is that experience is the product of these neural
processes. Experience emerges from those patterns of neural firings.
Understanding those physiological processes can add greatly to our
understanding of how experiences arise. You claim not to deny natural
processes but you do want to ignore them. I don't see a distinction
there.
DM: All our ideas about natural processes derive from experience and
our imaginative atempts to make sense of this experience and to narrate
a story of how we have got to this point. We have to assume an
understanding
of experience to understand how we can tell these stories and make these
descriptions. We start from experience to tell a story of how we got to
this
point. We always have to start the story from here even if we are telling
a
story that starts with the big bang but ends with how we got to the point
where we could start to imagine a big bang once began this story. Before
we can take seriously our descritions of natural processes we need to
understand how we do this, so we need to understand experience
phenomenologically,
we need to describe experience and how we create notions like natural
processes.
DM
Furthermore, for all your talk of mysticism and the perennial philosophy
you
have precious little to say about their relevance.
[dmb]
Krimel. As I see it, you've still got zero points on the board. What is
it,
four to nothing? Five?
[Krimel]
OK, you win. I don't have time for playing games and keeping score. I
love
you death man but I sincerely have bigger fish to fry. You too will be
disappearing shortly I suspect. Good luck with school. I hope you pay
attention in your social sciences classes. Let me know if I can help.
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