Hi Platt, >> Steve: >> I brought up the ethics of reciprocity because I could not think of >> what else you could be thinking of in saying that Christian morality >> may be intellectual. If you don't see the Golden Rule as rational, what >> else about Christian morality could be thought of as intellectual?
Platt: > Well, that's the question isn't it? Secular humanists appear to adopt many > Christian ideals in their Godless worldview such as caring, sharing, > compassion, toleration, etc. They claim to arrive at their ethical values > rationally if not scientifically, i.e., intellectually. But as we know, > Pirsig takes a rather dim view of an SOM-based ethics. Steve: You seem to be looking for a metaphysical foundation for these virtues. What does the MOQ suggest about the possibility of finding such a foundation within intellect whether based on SOM or the MOQ? Aren't these ideals apreciated or not like paintings in a gallery rather than with some basis in Truth as an essence? Who decides what is good in the Good Book? If you don't already know that caring, sharing, compassion, toleration, etc are good, do you really think that one would figure that out by reading the Bible? >> Steve: >> I think you'd have a hard time finding any data supporting the >> hypothesis that believers are better behaved than atheists even by >> believer's moral standards regarding crime, teenage pregnancy, child >> molestation, etc. In fact, countries that are the most atheistic tend >> to have the lowest crime rates, highest literacy rates, least poverty, >> etc. Platt: > I simply refer to communism, a secular tyranny which since the > Enlightenment has proved itself by far the most lethal, oppressive, > dehumanizing force on earth. Steve: Communism has been oppressive. Are you suggesting that if Communism has claimed to be true based on a divine inspriration, it would have been less so? Steve: >> It looks like teaching children to care about other people can work at >> least as well as teaching kids to fear invisible gods. Platt: > Yes, you're obviously right about that. But "caring about other people" is > Christian doctrine is it not? Steve: Are we to believe that no one had any inclination toward caring about other people prior to the birth of Jesus of Nazareth? You seem to be asking, "where does the idea that we should care about others come from?" In the MOQ, is the answer, the Church or Quality? Regards, Steve Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
