Hi Dave, ie subjects, predicates and relations between them are all concepts, whereas quality is reality. Seems fair enough.
Interesting in those selections (apart from the use of the term "squares") is this sentence: "Any philosophic explanation of Quality is going to be both false and true precisely because it is a philosophic explanation." I like the Quine-like quality. Ian On Fri, Jul 3, 2009 at 9:09 PM, david buchanan<[email protected]> wrote: > > >From chapter 20 of ZAMM: > He'd been speculating about the relationship of Quality to mind and matter > and had identified Quality as the parent of mind and matter, that event which > gives birth to mind and matter. This Copernican inversion of the relationship > of Quality to the objective world could sound mysterious if not carefully > explained, but he didn't mean it to be mysterious. He simply meant that at > the cutting edge of time, before an object can be distinguished, there must > be a kind of nonintellectual awareness, which he called awareness of Quality. > You can't be aware that you've seen a tree until after you've seen the tree, > and between the instant of vision and instant of awareness there must be a > time lag. We sometimes think of that time lag as unimportant, But there's no > justification for thinking that the time lag is unimportant...none whatsoever. > The past exists only in our memories, the future only in our plans. The > present is our only reality. The tree that you are aware of intellectually, > because of that small time lag, is always in the past and therefore is always > unreal. Any intellectually conceived object is always in the past and > therefore unreal. Reality is always the moment of vision before the > intellectualization takes place. There is no other reality. This > preintellectual reality is what Phædrus felt he had properly identified as > Quality. Since all intellectually identifiable things must emerge from this > preintellectual reality, Quality is the parent, the source of all subjects > and objects. > > > Squares, he said, because of their prejudices toward intellectuality usually > regard Quality, the preintellectual reality, as unimportant, a mere > uneventful transition period between objective reality and subjective > perception of it. Because they have preconceived ideas of its unimportance > they don't seek to find out if it's in any way different from their > intellectual conception of it. > > In answer to his colleagues at school he wrote: > "Any philosophic explanation of Quality is going to be both false and true > precisely because it is a philosophic explanation. The process of philosophic > explanation is an analytic process, a process of breaking something down into > subjects and predicates. What I mean (and everybody else means) by the word > quality cannot be broken down into subjects and predicates. This is not > because Quality is so mysterious but because Quality is so simple, immediate > and direct. > "The easiest intellectual analogue of pure Quality that people in our > environment can understand is that `Quality is the response of an organism to > its environment' (he used this example because his chief questioners seemed > to see things in terms of stimulus-response behavior theory). An amoeba, > placed on a plate of water with a drip of dilute sulfuric acid placed nearby, > will pull away from the acid (I think). If it could speak the amoeba, without > knowing anything about sulfuric acid, could say, `This environment has poor > quality.' If it had a nervous system it would act in a much more complex way > to overcome the poor quality of the environment. It would seek analogues, > that is, images and symbols from its previous experience, to define the > unpleasant nature of its new environment and thus `understand' it. > "In our highly complex organic state we advanced organisms respond to our > environment with an invention of many marvelous analogues. We invent earth > and heavens, trees, stones and oceans, gods, music, arts, language, > philosophy, engineering, civilization and science. We call these analogues > reality. And they are reality. We mesmerize our children in the name of truth > into knowing that they are reality. We throw anyone who does not accept these > analogues into an insane asylum. But that which causes us to invent the > analogues is Quality. Quality is the continuing stimulus which our > environment puts upon us to create the world in which we live. All of it. > Every last bit of it. > "Now, to take that which has caused us to create the world, and include it > within the world we have created, is clearly impossible. That is why Quality > cannot be defined. If we do define it we are defining something less than > Quality itself." > I remember this fragment more vividly than any of the others, possibly > because it is the most important of all. When he wrote it he felt momentary > fright and was about to strike out the words "All of it. Every last bit of > it." Madness there. I think he saw it. But he couldn't see any logical reason > to strike these words out and it was too late now for faintheartedness. He > ignored his warning and let the words stand. > > > > > >From chapter 28 of ZAMM: > > > Now it comes! Because Quality is the generator of the mythos. That's it. > That's what he meant when he said, "Quality is the continuing stimulus which > causes us to create the world in which we live. All of it. Every last bit of > it." Religion isn't invented by man. Men are invented by religion. Men invent > responses to Quality, and among these responses is an understanding of what > they themselves are. You know something and then the Quality stimulus hits > and then you try to define the Quality stimulus, but to define it all you've > got to work with is what you know. So your definition is made up of what you > know. It's an analogue to what you already know. It has to be. It can't be > anything else. And the mythos grows this way. By analogies to what is known > before. The mythos is a building of analogues upon analogues upon analogues. > These fill the collective consciousness of all communicating mankind. Every > last bit of it. The Quality is the track that directs the train. What is > outside the train, to either side...that is the terra incognita of the > insane. He knew that to understand Quality he would have to leave the mythos. > That's why he felt that slippage. He knew something was about to happen. > > > > > > dmb says: > > > I guess these paragraphs speak for themselves but let me say that that the > point in posting them is to show the meaning of the distinction between > concepts and reality. > > > > > > > > > > > > _________________________________________________________________ > Windows Live™ SkyDrive™: Get 25 GB of free online storage. > http://windowslive.com/online/skydrive?ocid=TXT_TAGLM_WL_SD_25GB_062009 > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ > http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/ > Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org.uk/pipermail/moq_discuss_archive/
