Dmb,
I asked you a number of times (see below) for you to clearly explain what you
understood to be RMP's reformulation. You never offered a clear explanation.
All you've ever done was through every thing you could into the dialogue
imagine hoping something would stick. For me you understanding of the MoQ is
thinner than the ink on a page.
Marsha
On Aug 3, 2011, at 6:18 AM, MarshaV wrote:
>
>
>
>
>
>> Marsha asked:
>> Have you dropped the words 'free-will' and 'determinism'?
>>
>> dmb answered:
>> No, I haven't dropped the terms.
>
> Marsha:
> Okay.
>
>
>> Marsha asked:
>> If you think within the MoQ that free-will and determinism have new
>> definitions, please offer them...
>>
>> dmb answered:
>> The MOQ framework but does not alter their basic definition.
>
>> dmb offered:
>> ("free will. noun. the power of acting without the constraint of
>> necessity or fate;
>> the ability to act at one's own discretion.")
>
> Marsha:
> Here's a dictionary definition of free will:
>
> Philosophy . the doctrine that the conduct of human beings expresses personal
> choice and is not simply determined by physical or divine forces.
> ( http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/free+will )
>
>> dmb offered:
>> ("determine |diˈtərmin|verb [ trans. ]1 cause (something) to occur in a
>> particular way;
>> be the decisive factor in")
>
> Marsha:
> According to what you've offered, you confused determine and determinism.
> Here's a dictionary definition of determinism (not determine):
>
> Compare free will Also called: necessitarianism the philosophical doctrine
> that all events including human actions and choices are fully determined by
> preceding events and states of affairs, and so that freedom of choice is
> illusory
> ( http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/determinism )
>
>
>
>> Marsha asked:
>> If you are using new words please define them clearly?
>>
>> dmb answered:
>> These terms are not new and there are many ordinary words that can serve as
>> alternatives, such as freedom and constraint.
>
> Marsha:
> Do you really think within a philosophical discussion you can replace the
> main terms with any synonym that suits you? Here's another good definition:
>
>
> weasel word
> a word used to temper the forthrightness of a statement; a word that makes
> one's views equivocal, misleading, or confusing.
>
>
>
>> Marsha asked:
>> Please clearly explain the reformulation as you understand them?
>>
>> dmb answered:
>> The MOQ puts these terms in a new metaphysical context wherein the laws of
>> causality are replaced by patterns of preference and the choice between
>> freedom and constraint are no longer mutually exclusive positions.
>
> Marsha:
> This is a clear explanation of the MoQ's reformation of the free will and
> determinism issues? Really??? Hahahah... - You stated no replacements,
> but here you replace 'determinism' with 'laws of causality', and then replace
> 'laws of causality' with 'patterns of preference'. You've dropped the words
> 'free-will' and 'determinism'. And then you state that "the choice between
> freedom and constraint are no longer mutually exclusive positions." which
> has changed the meaning. Clear explanation? I think not! More like
> failing to pull a bunny out of a hat!!!
>
> Personally, I think RMP's statement: "To the extent that one's behavior is
> controlled by static patterns of quality it is without choice. But to the
> extent that one follows Dynamic Quality, which is undefinable, one's behavior
> is free." (LILA, Chapter 12) is quite clear.
>
>
>
>
>>> On Jul 29, 2011, at 6:11 PM, MarshaV wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> FREEWILL
>>>>
>>>> I asked you these question previously, twice, but I'll try again.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Marsha:
>>>> Four questions:
>>>>
>>>> Have you dropped the words 'free-will' and 'determinism'?
>>>> If you think within the MoQ that free-will and determinism have new
>>>> definitions, please offer them...
>>>> If you are using new words please define them clearly?
>>>> Please clearly explain the reformulation as you understand them?
>>>>
>
>
>> On Jul 30, 2011, at 9:58 AM, david buchanan replied:
>>
>>>
>>> Marsha asked four questions:
>>>
>>> Have you dropped the words 'free-will' and 'determinism'? If you think
>>> within the MoQ that free-will and determinism have new definitions, please
>>> offer them... If you are using new words please define them clearly?
>>> Please clearly explain the reformulation as you understand them?
>>>
>>> dmb says:
>>> No, I haven't dropped the terms. The MOQ framework but does not alter their
>>> basic definition. ("free will. noun. the power of acting without the
>>> constraint of necessity or fate; the ability to act at one's own
>>> discretion.") ("determine |diˈtərmin|verb [ trans. ]1 cause (something) to
>>> occur in a particular way; be the decisive factor in") These terms are not
>>> new and there are many ordinary words that can serve as alternatives, such
>>> as freedom and constraint. The MOQ puts these terms in a new metaphysical
>>> context wherein the laws of causality are replaced by patterns of
>>> preference and the choice between freedom and constraint are no longer
>>> mutually exclusive positions.
>>>
>
>
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