You are finally making some sense Ham, no pun intended.
2013/5/5 Hamilton Priday <[email protected]> > > Dear Dr. McWatt -- > > > On Sat. May 04, 2013 at 9:23 PM, Ant McWatt wrote: > > That's all very good Ham but how's the "homework" going? >> Chapter 8 of LILA ring a bell? >> >> I'd like to see a discussion about that - as far as YOU ARE concerned - >> first. >> >> Thanks anyway, >> >> Ant >> > > Oh yes, "the assignment" you hung on me (on my birthday, actually). I > have referred several times to LILA Chpt. 8, but you must realize that I > don't regard it as my Bible, as most of you folks do. As a consequence, > you won't like my critique of this chapter. > > The very first sentence is an attempt to sell a premise that makes no > sense from either a philosophical or an epistemological viewpoint -- "the > idea that the world is composed of nothing but moral value." Had Pirsig > eliminated the first paragraph and started with the second (Phaedrus > recalling an experiment involving glasses that made everything appear > upside-down) it would have made more sense, as we might assume he meant > that creation (existence?) is a valuistic construct. But "moral value" is > man's measure of things, a psycho-emotional response to experience which is > definitely not the stuff of physical reality. > > Next he states that "the Metaphysics of Quality subscribes to > ...empiricism"! Now how does empiricism -- reliance on knowledge derived > from objective experience -- in any way support Quality as the fundamental > reality? The author himself admits "it flies outrageously in the face of > common experience." Then he goes on to posit a "second principle": "A > thing that has no value does not exist," from which he concludes that > "value has created the thing", as opposed to the other way around. > > Mind you, I happen to agree that value sensibility is what creates (i.e., > actualizes) our empirical reality. My criticism here lies in the rhetoric > by which he argues the case. He talks about "substance" as a "subspecies > of value"; yet he offers no epistemology to support this thesis. It's no > wonder that the Pirsigians are confused about what SOM means. > > The reminder of this 10-page chapter is mostly a play on the "platypus" > analogy as a means of deriding substance, science, causation, the Big Bang, > and cultural evolution. > > Don't you find it inconsistent that, despite the author's need to > denigrate these concepts, he fills 24 additional chapters explaining > experiential reality in terms of "static patterns" while romancing us with > a cosmology by which Dynamic Quality continually evolves toward moral > "betterness"? Good? Bad? Better? --all subjective criteria that do not > exist in the absence of conscious awareness, yet are purported to be that > ultimate, essential Reality which, the author still insists, is indefinable. > > Incidentally, I noted that your response to my Apr 14th message was > largely a diatribe against my "right wing" views, including the 'Wicked > Witch of Westminster' quotes and characterization of Ayn Rand as a > "hippie". So, perhaps this assignment was directed toward my conservatism > as much as it was a request to provide a position statement of my > philosophy viz-à-viz Pirsig's MOQ. If you had a metaphysical purpose, > however, I'll be most happy to elaborate on any aspect of Essentialism you > don't understand. > > In either case, thanks for your interest, Ant. > > Ham > > > ------------------------------**---------- > > Ham Priday stated to Arlo et al, May 4th: > > The full heading of this thread is: >> "Putting SOM back into the MOQ by excluding SQ; let's not do that say some >> of us." >> >> It was introduced by David Morey on Apr. 30, who suggested: >> > Let's not divide reality into subjective experience and objective > >> things, >> > let's see that experience is made up of both static and dynamic quality, >> > that patterns are just part of experience and are not separate objects >> > outside of experience.... >> > > Moq_Discuss mailing list > Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. > http://lists.moqtalk.org/**listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-**moqtalk.org<http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org> > Archives: > http://lists.moqtalk.org/**pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.**org/<http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/> > http://moq.org/md/archives.**html <http://moq.org/md/archives.html> > -- parser Moq_Discuss mailing list Listinfo, Unsubscribing etc. http://lists.moqtalk.org/listinfo.cgi/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org Archives: http://lists.moqtalk.org/pipermail/moq_discuss-moqtalk.org/ http://moq.org/md/archives.html
