A provider that's outside jurisdiction of the USG? Or build/buy internal clouds (from HP, CSC etc.) or re-engineer apps to have end-to-end encryption with the keys held internally.
Doesn't stop the government getting your data - but at least you have some idea that they are. Cheers Ken From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Andrew S. Baker Sent: Friday, 7 June 2013 12:43 PM To: ntsysadm Subject: Re: [NTSysADM] Now the fertilizer hits the ventilator - or, through a PRISM darkly Leave and go where? I'll bet that it's not just Microsoft and Google in this project. The only real business risk is from foreign customers and prospects. Domestic businesses don't really have viable options if all the aforementioned are only a subset of organizations participating. Besides, all of these orgs are going to say, "We follow subpeonas and legitimate court orders" which would leave our data exactly where it is now -- with the USG. I've long stated that the real way the government will get access to everyone's data is to simply grab it from the vendors. All that hoopla about awesome technology that is being used to suck the data from across the net is pointless without hooks into vendor infrastructure. ASB http://XeeMe.com/AndrewBaker<http://xeeme.com/AndrewBaker> Providing Virtual CIO Services (IT Operations & Information Security) for the SMB market... On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 10:19 PM, Ken Schaefer <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: But we're not talking about small or even medium sized businesses here. Google and Microsoft are behemoths, who would stand to lose billions of dollars a year in revenue (plus what they've staked as their future business model - cloud computing) if they were found out to be lying about this. I can imagine they would push back very hard on this type of thing, and I'm sure they have very effective lobbying/regulator relationship teams. Every single one of their current and future business customers would leave. Plus they'd be sued out of existence by their shareholders (maybe not in the US, but I could see overseas shareholders doing so). It's one thing to comply with a draconian government law. It's another thing to lie to your owners about it. Cheers Ken From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] On Behalf Of Jon Harris Sent: Friday, 7 June 2013 11:58 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: RE: [NTSysADM] Now the fertilizer hits the ventilator - or, through a PRISM darkly Have you ever been in the cross hairs of the USG? They don't take being told "no" very well and this is from a former US state worker. I have seen a state agency ask "nicely" and when met with resistance they become very Borg like. Jon ________________________________ From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: RE: [NTSysADM] Now the fertilizer hits the ventilator - or, through a PRISM darkly Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 01:39:59 +0000 Considering the fallout if they deny this, and it turns out to be true (both due to litigation, and customers fleeing their services), I'd be inclined to think that they wouldn't willy-nilly issue untrue denials. Given how many companies are involved, and how many people would need to know (technical people, legal people, senior execs), I just don't see how you could keep this all covered up for a significant amount of time. Cheers Ken From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Jonathan Link Sent: Friday, 7 June 2013 11:28 AM To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> Subject: Re: [NTSysADM] Now the fertilizer hits the ventilator - or, through a PRISM darkly That's my operating theory. On Thu, Jun 6, 2013 at 9:10 PM, Jon Harris <[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>> wrote: Considering the fallout if they admit to allowing this type of thing to be done I would guess not them (Microsoft et. al.). Jon > From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: RE: [NTSysADM] Now the fertilizer hits the ventilator - or, through > a PRISM darkly > Date: Fri, 7 Jun 2013 01:04:08 +0000 > > Microsoft, Google and Facebook have already issued denials. I seriously > wonder who's telling the truth :-| > > -----Original Message----- > From: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > [mailto:[email protected]<mailto:[email protected]>] > On Behalf Of Kurt Buff > Sent: Friday, 7 June 2013 10:27 AM > To: [email protected]<mailto:[email protected]> > Subject: [NTSysADM] Now the fertilizer hits the ventilator - or, through a > PRISM darkly > > http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/06/us-tech-giants-nsa-data > > http://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/us-intelligence-mining-data-from-nine-us-internet-companies-in-broad-secret-program/2013/06/06/3a0c0da8-cebf-11e2-8845-d970ccb04497_print.html > > Kurt > >
