Re: [Elecraft] K2 -- loss of output power control
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 6:59 AM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote: Brian, You have some problem with the wattmeter in the KPA100 - T4, D16, D17, R26, R27, U5, U6 or on the VRFDET signal pathway back to the K2 control board. You seem to have a somewhat normal voltage variation at U5 pin 7, which (for the moment) says everything is working through U5, but check the U6 pin 6 output under the same conditions and also check for the same voltage at K2 control board P4 pin 10. I did. I think I said that in the original message (looking ...), yes, I did check and the output of U6 pin 6 is the signal VRFDET and tracks VFWD (output of U5b). It is properly present on header for the aux-I/O cable to the control board and I have verified the same voltages on pin 10 of the Aux-I/O connector on the control board. I did disconnect the Aux-I/O cable from the control board and I tested the base K2. Power output control of the K2 without the KPA100 connected is working is working properly. Since this happened only by removing and re-installing the KPA100, be suspicious of a solder joint that is not well soldered - those may work for a while and then when touched can fail. I did carefully remove the PA board from the heatsink and check all connections visually and specifically all of those between U5, U6, and the Aux-I/O connector. I even rang out the connections. That is all good. I have also verified the entire path from U6 pin 6 (KPA100) all the way to pin 2 on the microcontroller, U6, on the control board. Voltage is present there and it does follow power output. So VRFDET is reaching the control board. Just for grins, I looked at the values for VRFDET coming form the K2 RF board RF output detector. They are *much* higher than what I am getting from VRFDET coming from the KPA100. At full output I have something like 3.5V on VRFDET from the K2 RF board output but only about 0.3V on VRFDET coming from the KPA100. I am thinking maybe D16? What kind of voltage should I see at the cathode of D16? I see about 1.7V at full power output from the PA. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN 73, Don W3FPR Brian Lloyd wrote: Our K2 was working perfectly until I opened it up, tightened the power transistor mounting screws, realigned the receiver, and put it back together. Now power output no longer follows the power setting. When set to a power output less than 10W, I hear the bypass relay but I get the High Cur display (momentarily) and the display then shows a power output of 0.3W with an SWR of 3.0. Output power as measured with a W1 is 20W. If I advance the power control, as soon as I pass the 10W point the PA comes on and the power jumps to 150W output. Turning the power level control fully CCW (0.1W setting) produces 6W of output. Looking at pin 7 of U5 on the KPA100 I can see good analog voltage that varies with power. I can see the value of VFWD change when the range changes (SCALE changes) also. I can also see varying VFWD at pin 2 of U1 so this does not appear to be an analog problem. FWIW, voltages at pin 2 of U1 for various power outputs are: 6W -- 0.15V 20W -- 0.30V 150W -- 0.29V At pin 7 of U5 (U5b): 6W -- 0.15V 20W -- 0.30V 150W -- 0.77V On the t-r menu item I have 8r hold set. I do have output on VRFDET but the value only varies from about 0.3V-0.7V so that appears to be working also. I am planning to fly to Dominica on Friday and operate from there but I can't take the K2 unless I solve this problem. Suggestions? ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 -- loss of output power control
On Thu, Dec 11, 2008 at 10:47 AM, Don Wilhelm w3...@embarqmail.com wrote: Brian, Yes, that is not enough voltage from D16. The K2 power control circuits think that there is not enough power output and ramps up the power in an effort to see more voltage on the VRFDET line. That is what I am thinking also. I would recommend that you 'bite the bullet' and remove the KPA100 board from the heat sink and check T4 carefully. I did that but now I am going to do it again. Grr. Replace D16 and D17 both. They may have been damaged by a lightning surge, but they usually just short and fail to work at all - your failure is a bit different in that you do get some voltage (and that is why you should check T4 sand the other components in the wattmeter sensing area. I have checked T4 and it shows proper continuity to the board so I believe that the soldering is good. (The solder joints look good under a magnifier too.) D16 and D17 both show the same forward and reverse resistance once they conduct which makes them suspect to me. They do show open at low voltage so they are not shorted. Seems they are the most likely culprits. If you do not care a lot about power accuracy at low power levels, you can use 1N4148 diodes in place of the 1N5711 type. The 1N4148s are a little more 'hardy'. But they are standard silicon small signal diodes. They would not work well at low power levels due to their greater forward drop. Can I sub in some other small-signal schottky diode? If I can't find a 1N5711? 73, Don W3FPR 73 de Brian, WB6RQN ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 -- loss of output power control
Our K2 was working perfectly until I opened it up, tightened the power transistor mounting screws, realigned the receiver, and put it back together. Now power output no longer follows the power setting. When set to a power output less than 10W, I hear the bypass relay but I get the High Cur display (momentarily) and the display then shows a power output of 0.3W with an SWR of 3.0. Output power as measured with a W1 is 20W. If I advance the power control, as soon as I pass the 10W point the PA comes on and the power jumps to 150W output. Turning the power level control fully CCW (0.1W setting) produces 6W of output. Looking at pin 7 of U5 on the KPA100 I can see good analog voltage that varies with power. I can see the value of VFWD change when the range changes (SCALE changes) also. I can also see varying VFWD at pin 2 of U1 so this does not appear to be an analog problem. FWIW, voltages at pin 2 of U1 for various power outputs are: 6W -- 0.15V 20W -- 0.30V 150W -- 0.29V At pin 7 of U5 (U5b): 6W -- 0.15V 20W -- 0.30V 150W -- 0.77V On the t-r menu item I have 8r hold set. I do have output on VRFDET but the value only varies from about 0.3V-0.7V so that appears to be working also. I am planning to fly to Dominica on Friday and operate from there but I can't take the K2 unless I solve this problem. Suggestions? Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] signal strength
There are really two problems here and they are not mutually exclusive so beating people up about how an s-meter should work is silly. The idea that an s-unit is 6dB has been around only since Collins decreed it as such. Prior to that it was just an indication of AGC voltage at best. But the real definition of signal strength is a subjective one. The range (by ear) from S1 to S9 really spans only about 15dB-20dB of signal-to-noise ratio. By the time the signal is 20dB out of the noise, it is S-9 by ear even though it only spans about 3 S-units from there down to where it disappears in the noise. So the s-unit as a measurement of absolute signal level is not all that useful. The advent of DSP and SDR means that we can measure both signal strength and S:N very accurately even using a piece of amateur equipment, e.g. the K3. Personally I would rather dispense with S- units altogether and have a display of S:N and of absolute signal strength in dBm. But that is the beauty of software: you don't need to change the hardware to add the feature. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Questions from a Liberal Arts Major
On Nov 14, 2008, at 10:06 AM, Joe Spencer wrote: I have several Crimper tools but do not really trust crimped power connectors so...I solder all my PowerPoles connectors. It is easy to do...they work everytime and never a crimp problem. Crimp-only connections last longer than do crimp-and-solder connections and are just as low resistance. When you solder the crimped connection the solder wicks up the wire and creates fatigue point where the wire will fail first. Of course, that does presume you have the correct crimp tool and you are using the proper terminal for the size of wire. (This information comes from having wired aircraft.) Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Sound perception
On Nov 4, 2008, at 6:12 PM, Jim Miller wrote: IMHO, Sound perception is probably one of the most variable things of all. For instance, MY hearing is 10 dB down up to about 1500 Hz and by 1700 Hz it is 50 dB down for the remainder of the spectrum. I asked the audiologist what was considered totally deaf - she said 70 dB was deaf. (and I thought I could hear just fine, almost, except for my wife (higher frequency and softer voice)and I didn't need to hear her anyway, LOL) Does anyone think the way I adjust my audio would be the same as the way they like it. I doubt it. Trying to answer a question of what is the best for audio for any one person OR situation is virtually impossible. I do use the original Heil headset with the HC4 element and the original Goldline with the HC5 and full-range elements. Well, there are two parts to this. One is a function of frequency response and the other is a function of distortion products. Many of us are suffering from varying degrees of hearing loss. I suffer from tinnitus (ringing of the ears) which can mask some of the high- frequency content from the voice, usually women's voices. (My wife occasionally accuses me of selective hearing. :-) Anyway, I do benefit from using headphones and providing a bit of a boost to the higher frequencies, e.g. starting at around 1KHz with boost increasing to around +6dB at 3KHz. You can make this sort of improvement with a graphical or parametric equalizer. (I prefer parametric myself but they are hard to come by.) Distortion products typically impart either a warm, fat sound; i.e. low order, mostly 2nd harmonic; or a hard, edgy sound; i.e. high order. Either can obscure readability to some extent. One of the reasons the old tube rigs were so pleasant to listen to is because they had almost no high-order distortion. It was almost all 2nd and a touch of 3rd. I could listen to my Hammerlund HQ-180X all day and all night very happily with no ear fatigue. If you suffer from that hard, edgy, fatiguing sound, try stealing the signal before it gets to the built-in audio amp and feed it to a good hi-fi amp to see what you hear. Get the signal right from the detector if you can. It can make a *huge* difference. (My experience is that most manufacturers of ham gear really skimp on the quality of the audio chain.) Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 --- Park Portable Antenna
On Jul 6, 2008, at 5:37 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi Vic; Your advice of launching a long wire into tree punched my lets do something button. I think I'll take my K2 out to the park next week and try getting on the air with a tree vertical as you suggested. Twenty meters should have some life in it and with this in mind, what form would this simple antenna system take? I have a KAT100 which I could take along to match it. I have done this. I use a 40' piece of wire with nylon line tied to the end. A monkey-fist around a tennis ball makes a dandy throwing- thing to get the line over a tree branch. I then string out a 45' piece of wire as a counterpoise. Works just dandy. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Computer-Headset on K2
On Jul 1, 2008, at 8:43 AM, Holger Doerschel wrote: If I connect the new headset the K2 freezes and ELEC is shown on the display. Note: the resisior has not been soldered yet. If I remove the jumper and conect my Heil Proset it works fine. You are probably shorting out the 5V mic bias supply somehow. Since I don't know how you have wired your rig internally using the jumper blocks, I don't know to which pin you have connected the bias voltage (if any). If you put the jumper blocks straight across, the 5V appears on pin 6. In that case you want to put the 5.6K resistor between pins 6 and 1 (if the mic needs its bias voltage on the mic audio pin). One thing that certainly makes this a lot easier to deal with is the Internal Mic Adaptor from the folks who bring you the un-modules. See: http://www.unpcbs.com/ It certainly makes it easy to reconfigure the K2 to work with different mics. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 on TV
The local ABC affiliate did a piece on our field day activity. We got in a good plug for the K2. ;-) See: http://www.news10.net/video/default.aspx Click on 'Roseville Hams Hit the Airwaves'. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Field Day
On Jun 24, 2008, at 6:31 AM, cloud runner wrote: W5YA will be active this coming up weekend, American Field Day. We can work anyone, from DX need only RST. Ours is a two-man (class B) catagory station, QRP, and battery power. My partner is Steve, WD9FJL. We have been partners for nine years. Our site is at 9,000 ft altitude, near Chama, New Mexico. Our antennas are three monoband Moxons that are instantly reversible with a relay, for 15, 20, and 40 meters. We will also have a dipole up for ten in case of sporadic-e openings. The station will consist of a K3, with a K2 as back-up radio. May the only Murphy you meet be a Senor with chocolates in hand ;-) Our school, K6GBM, will be operating field day too. The rig will be the K2-100, with a tuner feeding either a 100' inverted-V doublet or 40' vertical. Power is PV panels and battery. We will be single- operator, assisted with the kids doing almost all the operating. (Dale, K6PJV, and I want to get a few contacts in.) The antennas were chosen to allow kids to build them. See you on the air! -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] SMT Work In The Ham Radio Shack WHAT TOOLS Are Required..?
I'm sure that everyone here would be VERY interested in folk's out there ideas ...know-how's ...PICTURES (hint hint !) and website links for sure... Apologies if this has been discussed previously to this depth... Just thought it an interesting Thread for everyone involved newbie's And Pro's alike.. Well, we all have our own opinions. I have built several boards using a standard iron with a small tip and small diameter solder. I was not pleased the the result as I never quite got the parts to lie perfectly on their pads. A query on the SoftRock list brought several responses. As a result I got a $20 heat embossing gun and some solder paste. Total investment: $25. It works great but the embossing gun *can* get the board too hot if you are not careful. Since I found myself working on multiple board and with the prospect for more in the future I ended up investing $80 in a temperature controlled hot-air rework gun with multiple tips to direct the hot air where I want it. I find it perfect for rework on SMT boards. I can easily remove a single component and then put it back in again. I find it even works well on through-hole boards for getting things like chips out. So, for someone starting from scratch: 1. heat gun -- an embossing tool or, better still, a temperature- controlled hot-air rework tool; 2. a syringe of solder paste. The solder paste has a shelf-life of 6+ months when kept in the refrigerator. So you can approach this any way you want to. I personally find that an $80 temperature-controlled hot-air gun with solder paste works really well for me. YMMV. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 - SMT mods
If I was 40 years younger then buying such a tool might be a good investment, like many of the tools I currently own. But failing eyesight and unsteady hands mean that construction involving SMT parts is now out of the question, and any electronic constructional activity has become more of a chore than a pleasure, so at this point in my life it would be a complete waste of money. Hence my rather abrubt dismissal of your suggestion. No worries. I didn't take it personally. I am finding that I am more shaky than I was years ago. I also discovered that I don't want to drink two cups of coffee before trying to stuff an SMT board. :-) But just as a point, the 4th and 5th year students do not have the best fine-motor coordination either. They really like the SMT work as they can be a bit sloppy and still achieve almost perfect results. When the solder paste melts, surface tension pulls the components into alignment with the pads on the board. It is amazing to watch all the little parts move around and line up where they are supposed to be. It looks like something out of a science-fiction movie. I wish I had gotten a picture of two of my 5th-year students (girls). They were stuffing a SoftRock board with the SMT parts in prep for baking. They had taped paper napkins over their faces like surgical masks and were working over my ring magnifier. One girl was applying solder paste with a syringe and the other was placing the parts with tweezers. When I came over to where they were working they shooed me away explaining that they were involved in a very delicate operation and that I was not invited into the operating room unless I had scrubbed up. The board came out perfectly after baking. Elecraft's decision to make the K3 a no-solder kit was exactly the right one for me. I am going to have to do without this modification unless I can find a way to do it without risk of harming the K3 and without requiring any special equipment. I have had enough feedback to suggest that my idea should work (though still suggesting that I should try it first on something disposable.) You might want to get a SoftRock lite board. They are cheap and very cool to play with. You can get your feet wet with both SMT and SDR all at once and all for the cost of about $30(us). -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 - SMT mods
This was the first time I had worked on surface mount, although I have more than 20 years experience of PCB work from a previous job. An amateur grade heat gun on an expensive K3 sounds like a disaster in the making to me! Proper SMD hot air re-work stations cost thousands, they cost that much for a reason. I picked up a temperature and airflow-controlled hot-air rework tool for about $100. Different tips allow me to control airflow to the precise area of the board to be worked. It makes removing parts a piece of cake. I have even used it on things like chip sockets on through-hole boards. I got it from these guys: http://circuitspecialists.com They have good, inexpensive solder and rework stations too. -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 - SMT mods
I am in no great hurry to do any mods, since the lack of them is not making any noticeable difference to my K3. My concern is that when trying to use the desoldering braid, enough solder will remain to keep the part in place, and one will end up doing it too many times and eventually lifting a trace. One list member already reported doing that. I don't have any scrap boards with SMD components to experiment on, but since all that is needed is to remove a couple of parts, I planned to try this: Instead of trying things, why not use the tools that professionals use? It just isn't that hard nor is it all that expensive. My temperature-controlled hot-air gun just wasn't all that expensive. Using a bit of stiff copper wire, wind a tight coil of 2 or 3 turns so that it is a tight fit on the end of the soldering iron bit, and turn the ends of the coil so that I end up with a bit with two prongs extending forward of it for a few mm, spaced apart by the width of the SMD part. When the iron is heated up, it will heat the copper wire extension as well. I will then apply the bit so that the wire prongs are either side of the part to be removed. The idea is that the solder will be melted on both sides of the SMD part simultaneously and the part can immediately be moved. If necessary, the solder wick can then be used to clean up the area. Does anyone think this would work? It might, and it might damage the board. I guarantee the hot-air gun will work better and be less prone to damage. And temperature control is important. Using a 500C hot-air gun is going to burn up your board. I can set the air temp on mine to 250C to melt the solder without frying the board. Look at it this way too: if you are building things you are going to start using SMT. So get the right tool before you ruin something. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 - SMT mods
On Jun 22, 2008, at 1:40 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: For many Hams today one of the most interesting parts of Amateur Radio is figuring out how to get something done without all the resources we'd expect to find in a well-financed laboratory. It isn't all about money, although most of us live on a strict budget. It's the challenge to find a way and develop the skills to do the job with the resources at hand that gives some of us as much satisfaction as a DXCC certificate or top score in a contest does for others. Certainly. Lots of people roll their own. I love vacuum tubes like to resurrect boat anchors. But I suspect that most of us own tools that we purchased rather than constructed. I suspect almost everyone here has a set of screwdrivers, a set of sockets, needle-nose pliers and various cutters, a soldering iron, a DMM, etc., that they purchased. I am betting that most people have several hundred dollars invested in tools. Of course, tools last a long time. I am still using hand tools I purchased 40 years ago. I know that I am not about to manufacture my own hot-air rework tool, especially when I can purchase one for $79(us). (http://www.circuitspecialists.com/prod.itml/icOid/9445 ) I also know that I am going to continue to encounter SMT if I continue playing with amateur radio. So far the sub-$100(us) hot-air tool has worked just fine. It has been used to build several softrock boards and even to remove components installed backwards on the K2. (11-year-old kids get in a hurry and aren't good about reading instructions carefully.) BTW, a hot-air rework tool beats the snot out of solder-wick and a solder-sucker for getting parts out of a board. So, I applaud those who manage to make do with what is on hand. OTOH, I wanted to point out that there are relatively low-cost tools designed to do the job. Now people get to decide for themselves how they want to spend their time and their money. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Ethernet to serial adapters
On Jun 21, 2008, at 7:03 AM, Manuel Maseda wrote: Hello, Anyone have any experience with Ethernet to serial adapters? Would it be possible to connect one to the K3 serial port? Yes, but the problem you face is that there is no standard way to make that device look like a standard serial port to the OS running your logging or rig control software. Make sure that the ethernet-to-serial adaptor comes with an OS-specific driver that then looks like a standard serial port to any programs running on the computer. Many of these devices are intended to accept only a TELNET or SSH connection. Some EtS device work as a virtual serial cable with one device attached to the serial port on your computer and another attached to the serial port on the controlled device (K3 in this case). That does allow you to control something over a long distance. This approach seems to work pretty well and I have used this when controlling devices that have a specific communications protocol. I have experimented with bluetooth adaptors which are much better supported in the various OS's as serial devices. Even so I have experienced mixed results. I have found that, in all my test cases, I could not change the baud rate under program control and had to use manual settings. Likewise I couldn't get the control lines, i.e. RTS and DTR, to change under program control. So you are going to have to try various devices to see if they will work. Don't expect perfection. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 Circuit Board Traces
I've watched a good training video for working with SMTs but my concern is with the board and not with the process. Even after nearly 48 years of kit-building including two all-up K2/100s, I'm still intimidated by the thought of those danged SMTs and can't decide whether or not I want to take 'em on. Soldering SMT is easier than soldering through-hole. I have now done several SMT boards and I love it. I have even taught the kids at school (we are building several softrock boards) and they like it better too. (We are talking 11-year-olds here.) We have used both the hot-air and bake it in a toaster oven techniques to solder the boards. No problem either way. You will want a good magnifier with plenty of light, tweezers, solder paste, and either a hot-air gun or a toaster oven. Apply the paste with a syringe. Pre-loaded syringes are available from Cash Olson. Here is his web site with materials and techniques: http://www.zianet.com/erg/SMT_Soldering.html I did try soldering the devices using a fine-tip soldering iron. It is *MUCH* more difficult than using solder paste with hot air or a toaster oven. (You use a toaster oven because it will heat up faster than a regular oven. You preheat the board to about 90C and then crank it up to about 250C and watch for the solder paste to turn to solder and flow out.) -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] SDR Adapter
As I understand it, the difficulty is not in feeding the IF into a Softrock, but in preventing the Softrock feeding its local oscillator into the K3 and compromising that's performance. Two words: buffer amp. Incidentally, the K3 *is* an SDR! Somewhat. It may be on the inside but to those of us on the outside it is still a monolithic radio. It is also locked into the processing power that it now has. It is difficult to take advantage of Moore's Law the way it is currently designed. (Moore's Law says that computing power per dollar doubles every 18 months. Anyone buying a PC understands this.) Also, we can't make changes. We are dependent on Lyle and Wayne to have the same interest we do in the features we want and we need them to do the work. This is the disadvantage of a closed environment. I have been on the fence for quite some time and have finally decided to go the route of a Flex 5000 instead of a K3. Even tho' I think that the K3 has a better receiver for traditional modes, I believe that the open software of the Flex and other hardware like the SoftRock will end up offering me more in the long run. Yes I give up some in BDR and IP3 but I get back huge flexibility and expandability with new modulation schemes. I can even hack the code if I want. So it is more appealing to the engineer/hacker in me. But I plan to stick with the K2 as a portable rig. I still really like that little radio. I would love to see Elecraft open up the code for the K2. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3: Power cable question
On Jun 16, 2008, at 9:59 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: A regular fuse should blow at 2.6 x the rating within 30s, in other words very slowly. It's only a short circuit that will normally blow a new fuse. Have not seen any data on old fuses which might get metal fatigue. There are faster fuses, but the fastest are rf transistors - on three legs anyway... Most people don't know that the purpose of a fuse or circuit breaker is to protect the power distribution wiring, not the electronic component itself. Wire will carry a surge without too much temperature rise. The idea is that the fuse will blow or the breaker open before there is any chance of damage to the wire. This means that a fuse or breaker cannot protect your active devices. If you want that level of protection you need something like a power supply with fold-back current limiting. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] SDR Adapter
On Jun 17, 2008, at 5:22 PM, Lee Buller wrote: Not to step on any toes herebut, could a person use one of the Softrock SDR radios tuned to the IF of the K3 and have a panoramic view of the band? Anone doing that or am I missing something? That would be cool cause the Softrocks are rather inexpensive. Yes. Tony Parks actually makes versions of the Softrock just for use with the K2 and K3. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 cellphone interference
Our K2 appears inordinately sensitive to radiation from my GSM phone. It occurs with the audio gain turned all the way down so it appears that this problem might be with the audio amp stage. Have others experienced this and, if so, has anyone come up with a fix? -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 cellphone interference
On Jun 8, 2008, at 8:14 AM, Jim Brown wrote: On Sun, 8 Jun 2008 05:00:16 -0700, Brian Lloyd wrote: Our K2 appears inordinately sensitive to radiation from my GSM phone. This is a VERY common problem in the audio world. I know. I used to make a living designing high-end audio preamps for audiophiles. EMI through the phono stage was always a problem and dealing with it with an impact on sound quality became an art. Being a ham also meant that my designs were exposed to RF from the get-go so I tended to fix things to my own satisfaction before they every saw the light of day. About four years ago, I published an AES paper showing how the cell phone can be used as a simple injection probe to find the path the RF is taking into the victim equipment. While listening to the output of the victim, put the cell phone in transmit mode and move it slowly along each individual wire or cable that is connected to the radio. Since the cell phone is operating in the 800-900 MHz range, you will see wavelength-related effects and find hot spots along the cable(s) that is(are) doing the coupling. Suspect the mic cable and the headphone cable. Except the problem occurs with mic, external speaker, and antenna disconnected. That leaves either improper shielding or ingress on the power cable. The most common cause of GSM interference is a pin 1 problem. Another common cause is coupling around the feedback loop of the output stage that drives the headphones or an external speaker. I hate to sound stupid but, what is a pin 1 problem? I can understand an improper electrostatic shield problem or a common mode RF current problem but the reference to pin 1 leaves me confused. Ah, never mind. All I needed was to read your paper listed below. Thank you. OTOH, it is using a term from the audio engineer's lexicon, one that might not be obvious to others outside that discipline. (It certainly was to me and I was already aware of the problem.) In both cases, the fix is to either correct the pin 1 problem by properly connecting the cable shield to the chassis, not the circuit board, or clamping one or more UHF ferrites onto the cable very close to the point of entry. Fair-Rite #61 is the weapon of choice at cell phone frequencies. These coupling mechanisms are described in detail in a tutorial on my website. It's a free pdf download, no cookies. http://audiosystemsgroup.com/RFI-Ham.pdf I guess that people forget that, in shielding equipment, they are building a Faraday cage around it. That means that you need to terminate your shield at the OUTSIDE of the equipment, not inside. One wants to continue the Faraday cage all the way out to the input device. This means that the shield of any wire needs to be attached to the chassis externally. That isn't hard to understand. I know that I solved the problem in my designs by using shielded twisted-pair for phono cartridge input and tying the shield to the chassis. Now, having said that, it doesn't appear to be coming in on the mic cable or the external speaker cable. I already use my cell phone as a probe and the problem seems to be a function of proximity to the radio on any side. Pickup occurs as much as 8' away from the radio with everything (except power) disconnected. Jim Brown K9YC Chair -- Technical Committee on EMC Audio Engineering Society ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3: Noise Reduction (NR) in FM Mode
On Jun 5, 2008, at 8:44 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: Aaargh! I meant to say we used high level I.F. limiters so no AM would get to the detector. That included noise. Right. If you use a discriminator there was amplitude sensitivity in the detector so limiters stages were used in the IF before the discriminator. A ratio detector compensated for signal amplitude and didn't require a dedicated limiter stage. PLL-based detectors were also immune to amplitude variations. I worked my way through my last year in high-school working for an outfit that provided commercial two-way radio systems. (I did a *bunch* of installations in police cars.) We sold EF Johnson too. I hated those radios because the crystal ovens kept failing. Fixing them was not considered high on the list of fun jobs so guess who got to fix all the damned crystal ovens? :-) We did Motorola too. The Motorola stuff was just better built. We always felt that Motorola was the best, GE next, and EF Johnson was what you got when you couldn't afford anything better. I know that when I was building repeaters I preferred Motorola or GE RF decks. So blankers were never needed. Maybe Motorola didn't use good limiters. Now to see if I can pry my foot out of my mouth... Hey, you've been around linear radios for too long. It could happen to anyone. :-) -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 KAT100 and BL2 questions
Does anyone know if the KAT100 has enough range to match a radiator that is close to (or is) an end-fed 1/2 wave? What I am thinking about is feeding a dipole at twice its resonant frequency so that it is effectively two end-fed 1/2 wave sections and then feeding with ladder line. Now the ladder line will probably act as a transformer to change the matching equation. (I know it won't change the SWR but the magnitude of the resistance and reactance components will change.) This also brings up a question I asked much earlier but didn't get a good answer to. Will the Elecraft BL2 4:1 balun intended for 300/75 ohm operation still work properly when feeding the equivalent of two end-fed half-wave antennas? If I recall these would represent about an 8000 ohm impedance. I was thinking of locating the balun very near the tuner and using window line to the doublet. I am concerned about losses and arcing (100W) in the balun in that specific instance. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 KAT100 and BL2 questions
On Jun 2, 2008, at 1:32 PM, Bob Tellefsen wrote: Brian What are your expectations for this antenna? Used as a halfwave, say on 40m, its pattern will be that of a regular dipole. However, if you feed it at the end, it becomes an endfed full wave on 20m. It will not have a nice major lobe at right angles to the wire, like the dipole. Instead, it will be a four-leafed clover type of pattern. Yes, I am aware of the various patterns that occur with different lengths of radiator. That wasn't the question. The questions were (restated for clarity): 1. What is the matching range of the KAT100, i.e. will it match an antenna fed at a voltage node (multiple of a 1/2 wave) rather than a current node (odd multiple of a 1/4 wave)? Yes, I know that the ability to achieve a conjugate match depends on the capacitance and inductance range of the tuner. Also this affects the range of the real component (resistance) that can be matched and what frequency you are trying to match it on. 2. Does the BL2 have a problem when looking at a really high impedance, i.e. when center feeding a full-wave doublet? And yes, I am aware that I really wouldn't want to feed the balun with coax from the tuner but rather should put the balun as close to the tuner as possible and then run a low-loss balanced line from the balun to the doublet and that the feedline will act as a transformer to change the impedance (resistance AND reactance) as seen by the balun and, therefore, the tuner. I guess the real question is whether I want to get a KAT100 and a BL2 or just stick with my SGC-231. The nice thing about the KAT100 is that it doesn't draw power unless it is tuning. My SGC-231 draws power all the time to hold in the relays. That sucks up more battery. Also it is physically bigger. Looking at the schematics for both I can see that the SGC-231 has a greater range of C and L than the KAT100 does but maybe the KAT100 is enough, especially when ganged up with the BL2 to provide a 4:1 impedance ration to start with. I know the theory but was looking for a quick answer from the field of people here who have more experience with this than I do. If you want the pattern on the harmonic band to be at right angles to the wire, then you need to center feed it with the 450 ohm line. That will give you what is called two half waves in phase, with a nice major lobe at right angles to the wire and about 2 dB gain over a simple dipole. Right. I was aware of that. Right now I am primarily interested in what the limitations of the KAT100 and BL2 are. But I appreciate where you are going with this. You are thinking along the same lines I am but I was still back at the basic mechanics of matching using the KAT100 and then using the balun to feed the balanced line irrespective of the radiation pattern. And, yes, end feeding a 1-wave wire or greater gets you four major lobes. OTOH, take four of those and put them into a rhombus ... :-) -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 KAT100 and BL2 questions
On Jun 2, 2008, at 9:25 PM, Vic K2VCO wrote: Brian Lloyd wrote: 1. What is the matching range of the KAT100, i.e. will it match an antenna fed at a voltage node 2. Does the BL2 have a problem when looking at a really high impedance, i.e. when center feeding a full- wave doublet? Maybe I'm missing something, but the answer depends on the length of the feedline. If your feedline happens to be an odd multiple of 1/4 wl, then what the KAT100 and the BL2 will be dealing with will be a very low impedance, not a high one. A half-wave feedline will repeat the impedance at the feedpoint. And in-between lengths will give in- between values. I was aware of that too but still wondering what the worst-case is. But I guess the real answer is, if it won't match, add more feedline to move around the smith chart and try again. Good point. The balun will operate efficiently as long as the impedance is primarily resistive and in a range of a few tens to a few hundred ohms. Reactance is bad for balun efficiency. Ah. There is the answer I was looking for on the balun. Thank you. -- 73, Vic, K2VCO Fresno CA http://www.qsl.net/k2vco -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 Band changing...Devils Advocate...
The biggest problem with all of this is that different manufacturers have given different names to the same thing and the same name to different things. We can talk about band stacking registers (no clue as to what those do even tho' I have them in my Icom rig), memories, etc., until we are blue in the face but the real question is, what is the goal of this feature? When designing computer networking equipment my customers used to drive me nuts with requests for various features they had seen in other products. After much poking and prodding I would usually find out that it was some feature that someone else had been sold upon by another vendor. Getting people to tell me what problem they were trying to actually solve was like pulling teeth. OTOH, once I found out what problem they were trying to solve, it was usually quite easy to do that AND incorporate it with something else to make the whole thing simpler for everyone. So here is my guess at what people are trying to accomplish. As I tune across the band I often hear a signal that sounds interesting, e.g. a station in QSO that I want to go back to or a pile- up I don't want to try to deal with now, but I don't want to stop there. I want to keep going. So usually I quickly scribble the frequency on a piece of paper but lately I have taken to use the VFO A/ B to remember the frequency in VFO B while continuing to tune with VFO A (not much use when working split). So I think what people are asking for is a way to hit a single button to drop the frequency, mode, and filter setting in to temporary memory that will remember the last n (2? 3? 10?) button pushes. Then you can move through these by pushing some kind of go-to-previous/go-to-next button. That way you can immediately jump back to something you had previously heard. (I like the idea of a knob myself but a forward/back toggle works too.) I don't know that I would get all excited about that -- heck, I think that there are already WAY to many features on most radios and all the features make operation confusing -- but I can imagine someone wanting to do this, especially during a contest. So, is this a good problem statement? -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com P.S. -- Pet peeve -- radios with a plethora of computer features but crappy RF hardware. Now the K3 may be well on the way to the plethora of useless features but at least it has a great RF deck. ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Band stacking UI rant (was: K3 Band changing...Devils Advocate...)
for our T-hunts. The response? But this is so easy! How come the other radios aren't this easy? At least Elecraft has active hams working on the design of their radios so there is SOME hope for us. :-) So, give me a simple, obvious UI. I can dispense with most features. And while I don't think you can beat the UI on the Collins KWM2, the K2 is pretty usable. Certainly the kids and I can manage to get that radio on the air and on the proper mode to make contacts, without ever having to consult the manual. Set the band, set the frequency, set the mode, set the filter, set the keyer speed, and start. We even go from band to band and the last frequency/mode/filter for that band pops up. No huhu. Well, there is one nit -- who came up with the brilliant idea that AGC OFF is not on the AGC button? Another friend has a K2 and didn't even know there was an 'AGC Off' function! I had to explain that it was function-shift-filter-power-PTT-meta-control-alt-delete-something to turn the AGC off and to go look it up in the manual. Hello! Fast, slow, Off, Fast, Slow, Off. It isn't rocket science. (Sorry. Sometimes I get carried away.) -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] I want a blue K3
On May 29, 2008, at 11:22 AM, ON4WIX wrote: Consider your wish granted, hi http://uk.shopping.com/xPF-AEG-AEG-Fridge Where is the second receiver? -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] RE: K2: 80m 17m Weak RX, no TX
On May 27, 2008, at 9:28 PM, John Frerichs wrote: Duhh! I'm so stupid! I remember reading in the manual that some caps are marked with a zero and some aren't. I still reversed Caps: 12/15 and 35/31. Cap 12/15 values are 560. Cap 35/31 are marked 560. Guess what I did? Yup. I read value 560 and placed MARKING 560 in its place. Argh! What an idiot I am! Now I have to re-reverse them, so 80/17 will work right. Yipes! At least they're easy to get to! I'm kicking myself HARD for that idiotic blunder! Don't feel bad about that. A couple of times the students pulled that one on me when we were assembling the K2. Fortunately I caught it and was able to rectify the problem before we went any further. This is why I would insist that two students work together with one stuffing the board and the other reading parts values. That way everything got looked at twice. It helped a lot but there were still errors. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] 9MHz IF +/- 5MHz VFO -- sideband inversion
On May 25, 2008, at 7:50 AM, WILLIS COOKE wrote: It does not give the same sideband on 80 and 20. Actually, it does. Imagine you are generating your sideband at a 9MHz IF. In the IF you are generating USB, i.e. you have a 9MHz carrier and 1KHz and 1.2KHz tones injected to the mic jack. This produced a spectrum at 9MHz of: 9000.0 KHz - carrier (suppressed) 9001.0 KHz - first tone 9001.2 KHz - second tone. Now we mix subtractively with 5100 KHz to produce a result in the 80M band: 9000.0 - 5100 = 3900.0 KHz 9001.0 - 5100 = 3901.0 KHz 9001.2 - 5100 = 3901.2 KHz Notice that the spectral lines are above the carrier in increasing frequency. That is USB. Now let's repeat this using additive mixing to get 20M. 9000.0 + 5100 = 14100.0 KHz 9001.0 + 5100 = 14101.0 KHz 9001.2 + 5100 = 14101.2 KHz The spectral lines are still above the carrier indicating USB. Now if you repeat the process by setting the VFO to 5500.0 KHz you will see that the radio would tune to a lower frequency on 80M while tuning to a higher frequency on 20M thus indicating that the radio tunes backwards for 80M but in both cases it still produces an USB signal. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 FM Operation ???
On May 25, 2008, at 7:57 AM, Charles Harpole wrote: So many msg abt K3 and FM. I sit puzzled why in the world would one bother to wait and buy a K3 JUST TO RUN FM??? The K3 is a CW radio. pure and simple, and the other modes are just thrown in My point is why waste a great K3 on something virtually any radio today can do wellFM !!??!! That is, no use for vy narrow filtering in K3 on FM, nor many of its other features... and there are rcvrs more sensitive if u must have that. Sign me puzzled 73 The K3 is a great receiver for whatever mode. One problem I have always had to contend with in FM is desense from a strong in-band signal. I would hope that would not be a problem with the K3 as it is with most purpose-built 'FM' receivers. If you think about it, the receiver is a linear translator. It takes a signal at a high frequency and it translates it to a very low frequency while preserving the time, amplitude, and frequency relationship between spectral lines in the passband. In the case of SSB it translates it to baseband where the ear detects it. In the case of CW it translates it to a very low (AF) frequency where the ear again acts as a detector. In the case of digital modes like FM, PSK, MFSK, RTTY, PACTOR, etc., it translates the signal to a very low IF (about 1.5KHz) where it is detected by hardware operating there. The point is that, while the end-function is different, the mode of operation is similar. The receiver is a linear translator to either baseband or very low IF. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 USB-serial adapter recommendation
On May 23, 2008, at 6:59 PM, James C. Hall, MD wrote: Hello: Well it appears I discovered that not all serial cables are built the same. I took the Keyspan adapter and my laptop to my trusty K2, and sure enough, it polled just fine. That left me wondering 'what's the difference between the K2 and the K3?' Except for anything internal which I felt highly unlikely, the answer was the cable itself. I called myself substituting a cable earlier but later discovered that this cable was formerly used to relay status information from a UPS. They are not true serial cables apparently. When I hooked up with what I KNEW to be a true serial cable to the K3, it worked perfectly ! As for Vista - who knows ?!! It looks like it will require a purchase of an up-to-date device and drivers. Jeez, I wish ham radios had USB ports ! Actually, you don't. Here is why. Every company who wants to make their device USB Capable picks some off-the-wall USB-to-Serial adaptor (or worse). Now the one good thing about someone still using serial is that I only need one make/model of USB-to-Serial adaptor for ALL my RS-232 devices. That means one device and one driver. Now contrast that with 5 different radios with 5 different USB interface chips from 5 different vendors. Can you say, 5 different drivers, at least one chock full of bugs? I knew you could. I have standardized on USB-to-serial adaptors based on the FTDI FT232RL chip. The ones I am using I got from Parallax and they work flawlessly. They are even serialized (serial number) and *always* come up as the same device regardless of where they get plugged into the USB. So, pick one reliable USB-to-serial device and use it for everything and only have to install one driver. Think about it. 73, Jamie WB4YDL ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] USB on all bands ??
You know, there is nothing, legally or technically, preventing anyone from running USB on the bands below 10MHz if that is what they really want to do. I am sure it will annoy someone tho'. I remember when I was accused of trying to ruin packet radio by running that nasty TCP/ IP stuff over the air too. :-) -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3: Ultimate Digital (WAS: Automatic Character Spacing)
On May 23, 2008, at 1:49 PM, Lyle Johnson wrote: I wonder how far away we are from rigs in which you speak into a microphone and it transmits PSK, RTTY, CW or that ancient SSB modulation? And then, instead of a scrolling row of characters across a display, a voice of our choosing speaks whatever is being received in any of those modes. Be careful, Ron. You are then doing digital voice and must only do so in the voice sub-bands... Yes, that is so silly. Bits is bits. If you want to be literal, it is all digital down at the quantum level. So when we have a optimized adaptive protocol that adapts to available band conditions and available bandwidth and then enables or disables the codecs accordingly, what then? You might be doing digital, i.e. text mode, and then start sending voice bits multiplexed over the same stream. Heavens! Frankly, this means that the only reasonable mechanism for the future is a scheme based on transmit bandwidth. You tell the radio how much bandwidth it has to work with (or more likely it already knows based on the frequency and your class of license) and then it figures out which bit rates can be supported and enables the appropriate codecs. It can then fill the Shannon box any way it knows how. Oh yes, the future could look mighty different! Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) (Kids and teacher working diligently on the KPA100 to get the K2 ready for Field Day.) ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KIO2 stop bit oddity
The receiver's stop-bit setting needs to be greater than or equal to the stop bit setting of the transmitter. It is OK for the transmitter to You meant less than, not greater than, although, as you noted later, receivers generally don't have a stop bits setting. Yes. send two stop bits and for the receiver to be set for one stop bit. It won't hurt a thing. Most UARTs use the stop bit setting to affect only the transmitter (RS-232 sending part of the device). The receiver will Delete RS232. (In fact, historically, current loop was used for the physical interface.) True, once the mechanical teleprinters fell from grace, current loop fell by the wayside. (Unless you were connecting to DEC hardware. I have implemented more than one 20mA current loop to RS-232 converter in my life.) handle anything that is at least one bit-time long for a stop bit. Modern UARTs accept stop bits that are just over half a signalling unit in length (they sample in the nominal middle, but there is a limited sampling clock resolution. They need to accept ones that are strictly shorter than the transmitted ones, because, as we are talking about asynchronous signalling, they need to be able to cope with recovering from false start bits and cope with clock rate differences (more common on mechanical devices, but some electronic devices rely on these to allow working with convenient crystals. (When sending asynchronous data over 1200 bps synchronous modems, sometimes no stop bits could be sent over the wire, if the source clock was fast, as, being synchronous, there was no option to shorten the stop bit. Stop bits were re-inserted before creating the baseband output; I believe they ran the output clock fast to ensure that this worked.) You are, of course, correct. I should make sure that I am rigidly correct when I write and I was being sloppy. Having implemented UARTs in both software and hardware, and then the protocols to run over them (I am one of the authors of PPP and the architect for MLPPP) I do have a modicum of understanding. Longer stop bits just reduce the maximum rate (characters per second) that you can send data. And give better recovery from false start bits - not a problem you should have on a short piece of wire. Incidentally, 4800 baud is normally sent with one stop bit. As noted elsewhere, it is only really for mechanical devices that one needed longer ones, so it tends to be 110 and below (maybe 300) that uses 2, or for, 5 unit, Baudot, 1.5. -- David Woolley The Elecraft list is a forum for the discussion of topics related to Elecraft products and more general topics related ham radio List Guidelines http://www.elecraft.com/elecraft_list_guidelines.htm ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Very Dissatisfied With Elecraft Support
I can understand your frustration, but there may be a simplier solution. The K2 comes with the parts to make a simple RF probe: 1N34A diode, .01 uf cap, 47 M ohm resistor and a length of RG-174 coax. You should be able to order all of the parts from Elecraft, including the small PC board that is used - part number E100079 (it's also used as a spacing tool for mounting the front panel switches). The instructions are on page 9 of Appendix E in the K2 manual that can be downloaded from the Elecraft web site. For that matter, someone who has already built their K2 and used a 'scope instead of the RF probe probably has all the bits lying around and would send them to Jon if he asked. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KIO2 stop bit oddity
On May 14, 2008, at 6:11 AM, Joe Planisky wrote: Well, that's just it: you can't change it on the K2, and the KIO2 manual says it should be 2 stop bits. The receiver's stop-bit setting needs to be greater than or equal to the stop bit setting of the transmitter. It is OK for the transmitter to send two stop bits and for the receiver to be set for one stop bit. It won't hurt a thing. Most UARTs use the stop bit setting to affect only the transmitter (RS-232 sending part of the device). The receiver will handle anything that is at least one bit-time long for a stop bit. Longer stop bits just reduce the maximum rate (characters per second) that you can send data. What may be happening is that the KIO2 is doing the UART in software. A longer period of time between characters (as represented by the extra stop bit) gives the processor more time to process the received character before the next character starts coming. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 - KIO2 stop bit oddity
On May 14, 2008, at 6:21 AM, Ian J Maude wrote: Joe Planisky wrote: Well, that's just it: you can't change it on the K2, and the KIO2 manual says it should be 2 stop bits. You will normally find that 4800 baud tends to be set to 2 stop bits but everything else appears to be 1. I don't know why this is but it seems to be the norm. There is no reason for this. All the extra stop bit does is allow the receiver more time to process the most recently-received character before the next one arrives. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Buddipole vs. tuner and wire
Wow! Thanks for all the input. FWIW, I already own the SGC-231 tuner so it and wire cost me nothing. I would have to buy the Buddipole so it would have to be significantly easier/better to use to make it worth spending $400 on. Again, thanks for all the input. I appreciate it. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Bal[un] (was: Buddipole vs. tuner and wire)
OK, I am convinced - keep the tuner and the wire. So, that brings up a second question: balanced vs. unbalanced. Wire antennas that do not require a counterpoise are usually loops or dipoles, i.e. inherently balanced even if not resonant. Most tuners offer an unbalanced output. SGC says, just connect up the antenna. Seems to me that a balun would improve things and keep RF off the coax and power leads to the tuner. But how well do baluns handle huge mismatch? Just off the top of my head, it seems to me that the tuner at the top of a pole with two legs sloped down, i.e. inverted-V, would make a pretty good omni all-band antenna. More thinking aloud. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Buddipole vs. tuner and wire
I am heading out on a bit of a DXpedition in a month and will be dragging the K2 along with me. I will be in St. Kitts (V4) and Dominica (J7). Thinking about antennas, I was planning to take my SGC-231 tuner and some wire but am also looking at the Buddipole (which Elecraft sells so that makes it on-topic here :-) as an alternative. Would anyone care to comment on wire/tuner vs. Buddipole? -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] coaxial dipole (was: What do you have in your portable/travel kit?)
To make a coaxial dipole strip the external insulation from the end of your coax to a length about 10% longer than 1/4 wave. This leaves just shield (braid), center dielectric, and center conductor. push back a bit of the braid so it increases in diameter. Fold it back over itself and carefully stretch it backward until it covers the remaining external insulation leaving just the center conductor and center dielectric exposed. The folded-back braid should now form a cylinder over the coax. Trim this braid until it is 1/4 wave long. Trim the center conductor until it is also 1/4 wave long. You now have a dipole that is end-fed. The folded-back braid functions as both radiator and 1/4-wave stub to cancel the currents on the shield of the coax. For 2M I put this whole thing in a piece of PVC pipe and shoot in some foam insulation to keep things in place. It works just peachy. Caveat: you may find that turning the braid inside-out to make the outer element to be a real challenge. You can cheat by cutting the braid off, compressing it so it slips over the outside of the coax, and then reattaching it to the shield of the coax with solder. To be honest, that is what I usually do. ;-) Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bass in audio is good
On May 5, 2008, at 1:35 AM, G4ILO wrote: Mike Scott-7 wrote: I am surprised to hear that people don't like the extra bandwidth in the audio response in the K3. Because people use their radios in different ways. Some of us don't want to waste energy generating frequencies that add nothing to the ability to be heard when signals are weak. We don't use SSB to have armchair copy chats using hi-fi speakers. Nobody is asking that improved low frequency response should be taken away, just that it should be made an option. I'm not sure that the range of adjustment provided by TX EQ is great enough to restore the audio to the way it was before. I feel lots of heat but very little light on this subject here. There really is no problem. A SSB transmitter is just a linear translator that moves your baseband signal (audio in this case) up into the RF spectrum where you want it. When you mix to translate the signal somehow you need to get rid of the image. That means either filtering it out (filter-type SSB generator) or cancel it out (I/Q type SSB generator). Regardless, it doesn't matter whether you provide the bandwidth shaping at baseband or after your first mixer. DSP at baseband, DSP at the first IF, or a crystal filter at first IF or second IF doesn't matter. Any will solve the problem for you. I think Elecraft has already thought this out. Next we will talk about how it is ALL digital, that there is no such thing as analog. ;-) Claude Shannon for President. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Bass in audio is good
On May 5, 2008, at 9:47 AM, Lyle Johnson wrote: I feel lots of heat but very little light on this subject here. Just different wavelengths of the same thing, Brian. Well, not quite. It doesn't get to be the same thing until AFTER the vibrational energy in the bonds is reemitted as photons. And while we are on the subject, remember: 1. You can't win; 2. you can't break even; 3. you can't even get out of the game. And if you are fast enough and in the right direction, you can shift either to the other, can't you? All the time. It is how I retain my equilibrium. Next we will talk about how it is ALL digital, that there is no such thing as analog. ;-) But are the little quanta-thingies particles or waves? Yes. Richard Feynman for President, Claude Shannon for Vice President. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2- setting the filters
On May 2, 2008, at 2:12 PM, Jack wrote: Q4, The filter widths are actually much wider than that set on the K2 display. ie 2KHz filter is actually about 3KHz wide. To get the same sound as my other HF rigs I am having to set the filter widths much narrower than expected. ie set the display to 1.2KHz width to get an actual 1.8KHz width trace on spectrogram. Is this normal? Can this be adjusted? Am I worrying about nothing? :o) Interesting. On our K2 the reported filter width was narrower than reported by the K2. I set the 3dB points using an audio spectrum analyzer and found that using a setting of almost 1KHz to get a 500Hz- wide filter. No problem changing widths to anything I want but it seems that the reported widths and actual widths vary widely. The only way to know for sure is to sweep the filter or dump in noise and analyze with the audio spec-A. BTW, for people using Macs, you can do the same filter setup using CocoaModem's spec-A display. Overall i am very happy with the recievers performance. The K2 has taken over as main radio, pushing japanese sets aside. Same here. The IC-706 has been removed from the shack at school and has been replaced by the K2 and a cheap 2M mobile FM rig. But if anyone could advise on the above, that would aid my learing process. Thats one of the reasons why i bought it :o) I would really like to hear why the actual filter width varies so widely from what the radio reports too. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2- setting the filters
On May 2, 2008, at 2:12 PM, Jack wrote: Q4, The filter widths are actually much wider than that set on the K2 display. ie 2KHz filter is actually about 3KHz wide. To get the same sound as my other HF rigs I am having to set the filter widths much narrower than expected. ie set the display to 1.2KHz width to get an actual 1.8KHz width trace on spectrogram. Is this normal? Can this be adjusted? Am I worrying about nothing? :o) Interesting. On our K2 the reported filter width was narrower than reported by the K2. I set the 3dB points using an audio spectrum analyzer and found that using a setting of almost 1KHz to get a 500Hz- wide filter. No problem changing widths to anything I want but it seems that the reported widths and actual widths vary widely. The only way to know for sure is to sweep the filter or dump in noise and analyze with the audio spec-A. BTW, for people using Macs, you can do the same filter setup using CocoaModem's spec-A display. Overall i am very happy with the recievers performance. The K2 has taken over as main radio, pushing japanese sets aside. Same here. The IC-706 has been removed from the shack at school and has been replaced by the K2 and a cheap 2M But if anyone could advise on the above, that would aid my learing process. Thats one of the reasons why i bought it :o) I would really like to hear why the actual filter width varies so widely from what the radio reports too. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: can anyone tell me what 4-40 refers to (was [Elecraft] K3 #685 arrived)
On Apr 27, 2008, at 11:12 PM, Gary Hvizdak wrote: At 01:11:22 EDT on Monday 28 Apr 2008 Chris Meagher (VK2LCD) wrote ... ... K3/10 #685 basic kit arrived 28 April. Inventory done, all there but no 4-40 nuts. ... can anyone tell me what 4-40 refers to ... Size #4 screw (0.112 or 2.85mm diameter), 40 threads-per-inch. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unified_Thread_Standard -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] contest logging software
I think I have mentioned that my students and I will be running our K2 for field day. I was wondering which logging software people have used, especially if it interfaces to the K2 for getting frequency and mode info. I would prefer software that runs on MacOS but we can use Windows software. (Our Macs run both MacOS and Windows as the same time.) Thanks in advance. BTW, thank you to everyone who responded to my queries about CW operation. I really appreciate it. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] logging software for Mac
On Apr 28, 2008, at 12:45 PM, Peter Wollan wrote: Does anyone happen to know if the N1MM logger runs under Crossover Mac? (this is a MacOSX version of WINE). I don't know about WINE but I run Parallels and have had 100% success at running every Windows program I have tried to install, including off-the-wall programs that drive specific hardware through either USB or Firewire. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Concern
The K2 is an ongoing product that we'll be updating as time permits. As you may know, we're not a large company, so our engineering resources will be stretched at times. I think that after a full year of K3 development, Wayne and the rest of the Elecraft RD team should take a break from the K3 and go back to K2 development. Other than an official Elecraft-supplied buffered audio input and output for data modes, what else would you add to the K2? Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Measuring power output of an SSB transmitter
There is no substitute for an oscilloscope. There are precious few meters that will read true peak power. Also, no meter is going to show you peak compression or outright flat-topping (clipping) like a 'scope. Someone mentioned that their power output went down when they turned the compression down and would Elecraft make power output remain constant as compression is reduced. Well, the power output (average) is *SUPPOSED* to decrease when you reduce compression. When speech compression is reduced, your peak-to-average power ratio increases. The peaks remain just as high but the average power is considerably less. This is another reason to want a 'scope to check your rig. BTW, how many people have done a two-tone test or a double trapezoid test for linearity? How many people even know what I am talking about? :-) (My first HF transmitter was a Central Electronics Multi-Phase exciter with a whopping 10W of output. When I got done making that work again you can bet I understood single-sideband. :-) Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Concern
The K2 manual on page 6 states that Other CW and SSB fixed crystal filter options may be available. It would be nice to have more fixed crystal filter options available. I would like to be able to add a 1.8 KHz fixed crystal filter. Yes, the variable CW filter can be set to that bandwidth, but it has considerable ripple at 1.8 KHz. OK, yeah, the ripple is pretty bad. Sounds weird but, you know, it seems to have the ripple set just right to really pull a voice out of the mush. That ripply 1.8KHz filter is amazing! OTOH, the SSB filter is really nice and when you crank the variable filter down to 1KHz or less it is quite nice too. The noise blanker and VOX could be greatly improved. In the past there were discussions that a high performance noise blanker could be developed. The downside was that it would use mostly SMD components and not be in step with the through-hole design philosophy of the K2. Most people were willing to accept the deviation from the philosophy for the added performance. There are a lot of people building SMD stuff. The SoftRock boards have a lot of people doing SMD work. I had a workshop at the school for the kids to learn to do SMD soldering. They like it more than through- hole. We are talking 5th-graders here. If they can do it, you can too. I now have 5 SoftRock V6.2 RxTx 80/40 RxTx boards and 5 SoftRock Lite V6.2 40M boards in various stages of construction in the classroom. Flatter 160 meter bandpass filter characteristics, less harmonics in the sidetone, or built in digital mode interfaces are more examples. Is the sidetone really an issue? Also many of us have done considerable mods on our K2's, but we are limited by the firmware. With active firmware development more mods could be supported. I think this is a key point. Open the K2 firmware for others to do development on it would be a great thing. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Thank you Steve Smith
Thank you to Steve Smith who sent me a Ft. Smith QRP Group Iambic Paddle/TiCK Keyer kit. You didn't include your email address so I am going to thank you here. The kids have already seen it and are vying against each other for the opportunity to build it. BTW, I have a parent who is cutting blocks of hardwood for Clipper Keys and I have ordered some Pico Keyer kits so the kids can start doing code practice with each other and then use the keyers with their SoftRock RxTx boards. And three of my students are planning to upgrade to general immediately. One has been talking with me about purchasing an HF rig and is seriously considering his own K2. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Concern
On Apr 28, 2008, at 5:26 PM, Lyle Johnson wrote: I think this is a key point. Open the K2 firmware for others to do development on it would be a great thing. The K2 DSP firmware is and has been open since inception. Free development tools, too. DSP source code and pointers to tools have been on the Elecraft website since mid-2003. I was thinking more of the code in the main control processor but it is good to know that the DSP is open. Thanks. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Another CW question (was: CW Mistakes)
To be very honest, I have not used CW much. I used it a bit when I got my first tech ticket in 1976 but not much since then. Now I find myself teaching it to my students. I am finding this discussion on CW mistakes to be WAY off-topic for this list but WAY useful too. I do have the ARRL operating manual and I am using that to start to guide the kids through proper procedures. On voice they have cue cards with pieces of the QSO they can use; i.e. how to call CQ, how to answer a call, how to give a signal report, how to brag the station, how to clear, etc.; and that has helped them a lot. I bet that cue cards for a CW QSO would be really helpful to noobs as well. Put the most-used abbreviations and Q-sigs on there for reference. My question concerns the use of Farnsworth sending on-the-air, i.e. sending the letters at a much faster speed than the overall rate and then inserting greater spacing between letters and words. Is that an OK-practice for working new CW ops or should I have the kids slow down the keyer so that all intra-element, intra-word, and inter-word spacing is proper? As soon as they can send/copy 5WPM I plan to push them to actually get on-the-air to have some CW QSOs. I want to be sure I am giving them good advice. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Portable CW paddles for K2?
On Apr 25, 2008, at 2:58 AM, TF3KX wrote: My K2 #6425 is now up and running, and I need good, light/small portable iambic paddles for the upcoming summer trips. Are there any good recommendations? I really like Eric's Clipper key. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 vs. K2/100
We are currently building the KPA-100 for our K2 at the school. I would like to hear from others who have incorporated the KPA100 into the K2 (K2/100) vs. keeping the KPA100 external and leaving the K2 as a QRP rig. I am waffling on the value of the K2 as a portable QRP rig, probably with the integral KAT2 and battery pack, and an external amp for base operation, and integrating the amp into the K2 and operating with an external tuner. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] simple iambic paddle
Knowing the penchant for CW that many of you have, I thought I would ask the following question here. Does anyone have a design for a very simple iambic key that can be made with simple materials and hand tools? The kids are starting to send CW and I am finding they are having a LOT of trouble with a straight key. Most immediately gravitate to the bencher so I am trying to find a way to make a $5 paddle. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] simple iambic paddle
On Apr 24, 2008, at 9:48 AM, Darwin, Keith wrote: Iambic or just paddles? I think single-lever would be easier to home brew. I envision a hack saw blade plus a couple of bolts for contacts, all on a wooden base. If you want iambic, that would be more difficult. Yes, it would. Some have discovered how much easier it is to use the iambic feature to insert an element into a string of another element. How much is the black widow kit? I'm thinking it's like $30 or something but I don't recall and haven't done the internet search. I have never heard of it. I will go look for it. When teaching my kids morse, I too found they had a much easier time with the paddles than the straight key. In fact, they were both able to learn iambic (squeeze) keying with less effort than learning the straight key. That is what I am finding as well. As a sometimes-musician I find that I personally have no problem with timing and rhythm with a straight key but most of the kids just aren't there. Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori School 9330 Sierra College Bl brian AT gbmontessori DOT com Roseville, CA 95661 +1.916.367.2131 (voice)+1.791.912.8170 (fax) PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 on school field trip
We just took a three-day field trip with the older kids from the school up to Lake Tahoe. I took the K2 along with my SGC-231 tuner and some wire. We used a 40' end-fed wire with a counterpoise. We got on the air and had reasonable luck on 80M (phone) but no luck on 40M or 20M. The problem with 10W and a good receiver is that you can hear everyone else just great but they can't hear you. Several times we answered CQs on 40 and 20 with not even a hint of response from the other station. Yes, we should have operated CW but the kids are not quite ready to copy QSO as they are only mostly through learning the alphabet and haven't covered numbers and punctuation characters. Soon. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2 not dead yet
On Apr 21, 2008, at 7:34 AM, Curt Milton wrote: Brian Fine on your progress with this fine rig. I plan to continue to enjoy my own K2 as the flagship rig of my station! On PSK31 and digital modes -- you don't need to modify your K2 -- check out the application note posted at elecraft.com. Yes, I have done that. I was going throw together a cable to go into the mic input as I have a spare 8-pin mic connector floating around. essentially all you need is a stereo cable on receive, a mic connector and a few parts on transmit, and some means to do the T/R switching. VOX. But one of the advantages of the K2 is using the narrow filter on PSK so that only the desired signal affects the AGC. That implies doing my tuning with the main tuning rather than just point-n-click on the computer. Frankly I find that being able to hear the audio is very helpful in tuning to get the signal to the center of the passband. That means I need to hear the signal at the same time I am feeding it to my computer. The kids will 'resonate' with PSK31 based upon their other PC experiences. Surprisingly they have not taken to PSK31 at all. I have one of the school computers connected to the Icom IC-706mkII through a RigBlaster. (The IC-706 sucks as a PSK rig.) I also built a 1W PSK31 rig at school (a Small Wonder PSK-20) and the kids occasionally use that as well. They would much rather get on the local repeater or call CQ on 20M. Who knows. Remember to run the K2 at approx half power when doing the digital modes !! I would expect that to prevent too much temperature rise on the finals. We are, after all, only talking 3dB. I have seen PSK31 at field day, and it tends to be rather tough in the pile-ups -- so calling CQ may be preferred if you run QRP-battery/solar. Meanwhile PSK31 may be ideal for non-contest operating with your youth. Definitely. Good point on using PSK on field day. I wasn't thinking about that. We certainly could. This is NOT the ideal time for QRP-SSB ! You just might need that amp. Definitely. The kids are already making progress on it. I hope to have it done by the end of school (May 31). As much as I like QRP, this is not the time for QRP in anything except CW, PSK, or some form of MFSK. Do check the calendar for kids-day events, as this may charm them more than an array of 599 my state-is reports. And consider scheds to other schools or kids. Here in Maryland, a contact station is KI3DS. I have been coordinating with other schools through the ARRL program. The major problem has been the bands being dead and a high noise level at the school QTH. Thanks for the reply. I appreciate it. -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] LiIon and LiPoly battery packs
Has anyone put together a LiPoly or LiIon battery pack and charger for the K2? If so, could you share your information? Thanks. -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] K2 not dead yet
OK, We just finished the K2 for our school. I was planing to teach the kids to solder and wanted a radio that the kids could build so I asked the ARRL for the K2 instead of the low-end Ikensu (Yaecomwood?) they were offering. I remember how much I learned from building Heathkits, Knight kits, and Eico kits as a kid so I thought we could do the same with the K2. Construction took much of the school year (October to April) including a few dry spells when I sat after school and slung solder just so we would keep making forward progress. (It was a big project for 10-13 year-old kids.) Regardless, the K2, KSB2, and KNB2 are finished and on- the-air. The KPA100 is now in the build area and my star builders (5th graders who think that soldering is just about as much fun as you can have) have just unpacked, taken inventory, and soldered the first parts. (I took inventory too and couldn't find the output transistors. I darned near tore my hair out until I found the drawer where they had been carefully, neatly, and incorrectly stored.) We have 5 more weeks of school so we are going to have to push to get the KPA100 done, especially with all the other end-of-year projects. (I suspect I will have to keep the momentum going. Poor me. :-) I think I have said that we will be on the air for Field Day using the K2 with solar power. I hope to have a couple who will be ready to do some slow-and-simple CW QSOs too. Gotta get those multipliers! I know everyone is dumping their K2s so they can get a K3 but, gee- whiz, the K2 is some good receiver. I *love* this radio! I have had a LOT of radios come and go in the shack (top-of-the-line Kenwood, two sets of Collins S-Line, several Icom, a Yaesu station, and a plethora of Heathkits) and I have to say that, so far, I think this is my favorite radio, even at just 10W. The only thing it is missing (stock) is a good way to do digital modes. (I have seen the mod for getting audio out before the audio amp but not sure how well it will fit after getting the KPA100 in there.) So, the K3 looks like a superb radio. I want one. But, compared to just about everything else, the K2 is still a winner. (For some reason it keeps following me home on the weekends.) -- Brian Lloyd Granite Bay Montessori brian AT gbmontessori DOT com 9330 Sierra College Blvd. +1.916.367.2131 (voice) Roseville, CA 95661, USA http://www.gbmontessori.com I fly because it releases my mind from the tyranny of petty things . . . — Antoine de Saint-Exupéry PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] troubleshooting the KNB2
Sorry to have been away for so long. I've been busy. My students (5th-8th grade) and I have finished the K2, finished the KNB2, almost finished the KSB2 (I hope we will have that done today), and haven't started on the KPA100 yet. K2 works great. Lovely receiver! But, it appears that the KNB2 is doing nothing. Our school sits practically under a 240KV power line. We have constant pulse-type power line noise that kicks the noise floor up about 6dB-8dB on 80M-30M. The NB on our IC-706MkII takes it right out. The KNB2 appears to do nothing. For testing I have been using my heat-gun's electric motor as a noise source. Noise is plainly audible. NB appears to have no effect. What I have determined: 1. 6V good (5.98V); 2. diode are good (conduct in proper direction) and installed correctly; 3. threshold line switches properly; 4. Pulse width line switches properly; 5. blanker on/off line switches properly; 6. 6NB switches properly; 7. U1 is showing good gain between input (pin 4) and output (pin 8); 8. No blanking pulse on GATE. Since the receiver works with the KNB2 installed, that implies that the BPF is OK. Gain at U1 implies U1 is OK. All the control lines switch which implies that U3 is OK. Visual inspection shows no improper component placement. Diodes, transistors, and ICs are oriented correctly. I have an HP 180A analog scope. I see signal (how I determined U1 has gain) but haven't had success getting it to trigger on the noise pulses. So, anyone have any suggestions for further trouble shooting? -- 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 RS323 and Data Modes {was YAQ - Yet Another (K3)Question}
One way of simplifying this whole process is to move the radio into the computer. This is in line with a prediction I made way back in 1995 on the CQ-Contest list -- that the radio of the future would be inside the computer. In 1995, processors were just appearing that had sufficient DSP capability to do this. 12 years later, it would take a relatively insignificant portion of the main CPU (or just a portion of a few cores, as multi-core machines are now common). What you'd end up with for the receiver would be a Mixer and clean DDS, followed by a high-speed, wide-range A/D converter. Everything else would be done in the host computer. The transmitter would go the opposite way, a D/A converter followed by a mixer fed by a DDS. Power amplification could be external to the computer (if the transceiver were a card). The interesting part of this approach is that we can re-define what we mean by a receiver. The detection portion of the radio need not resolve to the width of an audio channel. Consider a receiver that can decode every CW signal in a 50 kHz portion of the band. Simultaneously. How useful would that be? Well, you have just described the product offerings from Flex Radio. They are certainly interesting competitors to Elecraft. They are a completely different approach to constructing the radio. I am not convinced that their approach is better than Elecraft's but they are certainly interesting. It also would be good to sell the receiver and transmitters separately. That way, obtaining the two receiver, one transmitter configuration needed by SO2R operation could be inexpensively obtained. Or they could be multiple boards in the same chassis. Of course, to achieve the IMD and dynamic range of the K3, the mixer and A/D would be pretty marvelous pieces of equipment. Elecraft has exactly the same issues in the K3. My concern over the Flex Radio SDR approach compared to Elecraft's approach in the K3 is that, in order to be able to receive multiple signals simultaneously, e.g. like we do in demodulating PK31, you have to accept all the noise and cruft in the wider passband. If there is a strong signal in there you have to pass it through to the A:D and hope that the A:D has sufficient dynamic range to deal with the difference between the desired signal and the undesired signal. Elecraft gets rid of the undesired signal by using tight roofing filters. Basically you make you choice and accept the limitations. Elecraft has optimized for reception of a single signal. Want the ultimate in CW reception? I think that the K3 is probably the winner. Want the ability to demodulate several signals at once or do some new wideband mode? I think that you have to look at the Flex Radio offerings. But you give up performance in one area to get performance in the other. There ain't no such thing as a free lunch. Let me put it another way: one of the reasons that the Elecraft receivers work so well is that they do fewer conversions and use lower IF frequencies so that they can put good filtering as far forward in the chain as possible. This gets rid of products that could cause IMD in later stages. It's still possible to get good IMD characteristics with an up- conversion general-coverage receiver. There are some $10,000 radios on the market that do exactly this. But all of them upconvert to something like a 70MHz 1st IF. You aren't going to find a 200Hz roofing filter there. That means you aren't going to get the good close-in (1KHz spacing) IMD and BDR performance. So to get general coverage receiver performance you give up close-in BDR and IMD performance. Again TANSTAAFL. Elecraft has apparently mastered the art of offering high- performance gear at an excellent price point. I agree. Elecraft should be receiving the order from the ARRL for our school's K2. I plan to let the kids (4th-8th grades) build the rig under my guidance. I think that the K2 will perform a lot better than the other rigs that they were offering us, e.g. Icom IC-706, and I think that the kids will understand and appreciate the radio better if they have a hand in building, testing, and calibrating it. (Besides, it will dovetail nicely with my this is how a radio works section in science class.) I want a whole boatload of demodulators there in the K3's DSP with access coming out to me in some convenient fashion -- like on an ethernet connector. Sounds like what you really want is something more like the 1995 pipe dream. Well, it is not a pipe-dream anymore. You can have it. It all depends on what parameters you want to optimize for. Bill Coleman, AA4LR, PP-ASELMail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Quote: Not within a thousand years will man ever fly! -- Wilbur Wright, 1901 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 RS323 and Data Modes {was YAQ - Yet Another (K3)Question}
On Jun 19, 2007, at 1:08 AM, Julian G4ILO wrote: On 6/18/07, Toby Deinhardt [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It has always struck me as a bit silly to go from analog to digital back to analog only to return to digital, which is what you would be doing with the K3 and a sound card based solution. I think the number of conversions is the same, it's just a matter of whether the conversion is done in the computer or the radio. Since a computer has a more powerful processor, I would expect it to do a better job, if available. The value of the built-in encoder/decoder is to allow operation using popular data modes *without* a computer. Not true. The K3 converts from A:D as a step in the second IF. The final filtering takes place in the K3's DSP as does the demodulation. Don't be fooled: all the modules are still there. It is just that some of those modular functions are now performed in digitally in DSP. If you draw all the functional blocks, e.g. gain, filter, mixer, oscillator, they are all still there in DSP. If you then go to a soundcard you are now adding another conversion and a third IF. The K3's second IF (DSP) does its conversion and filtering but then does a conversion to a third IF, including a conversion from digital back to analog. We tend think of this as audio but it really is not. It is a third IF with no control over the AGC. The final amplification, filtering, and demodulation now takes place in the computer's DSP. Let me put it another way: one of the reasons that the Elecraft receivers work so well is that they do fewer conversions and use lower IF frequencies so that they can put good filtering as far forward in the chain as possible. This gets rid of products that could cause IMD in later stages. (The IMD may still be present in the stage but if you get rid of one of the offending signals you won't experience the IMD.) What you are suggesting is that we negate one of the advantages that Elecraft has built into the radio. This seems silly to me. My interest in radio is data communications. It may just be the equivalent of instant messaging, e.g. PSK31, or it may be something more complex, e.g. IP over PACTOR-III (OFDM). The K3 is [almost] unique in its ability to do the demodulation in its DSP and have that process optimally coordinate with the rest of the stages in the radio, i.e. it will do the best possible job with the signal. Frankly, I wouldn't want to give that up. I want a whole boatload of demodulators there in the K3's DSP with access coming out to me in some convenient fashion -- like on an ethernet connector. (Sorry, I just couldn't resist. :-) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 RS323 and Data Modes {was YAQ - Yet Another (K3)Question}
On Jun 18, 2007, at 1:51 PM, Toby Deinhardt wrote: Dream Ideally the K3 would stream I and Q signals at 44k samples per second... /Dream It has always struck me as a bit silly to go from analog to digital back to analog only to return to digital, which is what you would be doing with the K3 and a sound card based solution. Absolutely 100% correct. If I have to use a sound-card to do a digital mode with the K3 then there is no real advantage to the K3 over the K2. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] OT: PSK on 30M and 17M
I am not sure where to ask this question so I will ask it here. Please redirect me to a better place to ask it. I am not finding PSK31 activity on 30M or 17M even though I know the bands are open. I always check WWV on 10MHz, 15MHz, and 20MHz to give myself an idea of propagation. WWV on 20MHz was booming in here yesterday but there was no activity on 17M. Go figure. And 30M seems to me to be a great band for PSK31 but I will be darned if I can find one iota of activity. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] My K2 is unbelievable!
On Jun 15, 2007, at 11:51 AM, Gary D Krause wrote: Oh come on Kent! :-) You are missing the point. I know it's mostly about propagation but, when you build a rig yourself and it performs better than your expectations, it's hard not to react like a novice (which I am not) with your first contact. You may look at it as just progagation, a bunch of diodes, capacitors, resistors, etc., but, there is a lot more to it than just that. Yes, but it is also about propagation and components. That doesn't detract at all though. There is something very satisfying about putting a radio together, debugging it, aligning it, and putting it on the air. (It also makes you *really* appreciate what went into designing it, no?) And you know what? We forget just what a marvel radio is. I still get excited about the ability to send data, audio, and video long distances without wires. It is just friggin' amazing! ...Yep, for me there is a lot more to ham radio than just technical stuff. But for some of us it is the science and technology that just tickles us no end. Isn't it great that ham radio lets us do all this! Brian Lloyd 3191 Western Drive brianl AT lloyd DOT com Cameron Park, CA 95682 +1.916.367.2131 (voice) +1.270.912.0788 (fax) There is a time to laud one's country and a time to protest. A good citizen is prepared to do either as the need arises. PGP key ID: 12095C52A32A1B6C PGP key fingerprint: 3B1D BA11 4913 3254 B6E0 CC09 1209 5C52 A32A 1B6C 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] OT: According to the paper Don Herbert passed away
On Jun 14, 2007, at 6:54 PM, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Mr wizard was such a strong influence on most of us growing up in the 50's and into 60's it's worth mentioning here. No kidding. I loved that show, that and, Science Fiction Theatre! FYI all listening to George Nauri(sp?) he did an interview with Don two years ago when he was 87yrs old. George rebroadcast the interview a few nights ago - very good. Also mentioned that Mr Wizard did a stint on Nicolodeon and there is a set of DVDs out with his more recent shows. It was noteworthy that Don did his programs live and there were a number of interesting times when things didn't always work out the way the were supposed to. My dad was a HS Science teacher for 35 years and I have since retired from Aerospace Engineering but have kept my teaching job of twenty years in a local HS - Electronics and Computers. Our next years classes will include building Ham rigs (guess which ones) Maybe we should start the Schools that use Elecraft club. :-) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] The ultimate old-timer's CW and digital mode box
I was searching for sources of reasonably-priced (meaning cheap but useful) straight keys and came up with this gem: http://www.engadget.com/2006/10/13/steampunk-laptop-comes-complete- with-morse-key/ With this in your shack PSK31 won't really feel like cheating. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Re: Re K2 ordering!
On Jun 12, 2007, at 1:51 AM, F5UL wrote: Hi Brian, What you are trying to do for your GB Montessori School is exactly what I was going to do for a youg association here near Geneva. But I failes because I did not get any allocation for this project, as it was termed unnecessary!!! I am lucky. The school is small and I am married to the headmistress. :-) OTOH, I did apply to the ARRL and they liked my proposal so they are providing the bulk of the equipment to pull this off. Now I have to construct the facilities. Well You did right with the K2, because when you finish the kit, by the book, you know and understand the transceiver as much as their conceptors. That is what I am thinking. As technology gets more and more complex, the prevailing sense is that ordinary people cannot understand it. We are creating a society of appliance operators. I am trying to counter that by bringing technical subjects back within the grasp of kids so that they understand that they CAN understand what is going on inside a computer, a cell phone, a television, a rocket, a radio, a robot, etc. Arthur C. Clarke once stated in his third law, any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic. I think he was trying to point out that we can take things that appear magical and turn them into technology that we can understand. OTOH I can see that going back the other way. As the technology gets more complex people give up trying to understand it and it turns into magic. I want to try to stop that trend, at least for a small subset of children. The Montessori method has children learning by manipulating. All their math is done by manipulation of things. The first-year children in a Montessori school tend to have as good a grasp of geometry as most high-school (years 9-12) children do. I am just taking that one step further and applying that to their science class as well. Electricity is more difficult as one is dealing with an intangible so making it hands-on is more of a challenge. I will actually have several cathode-ray oscilloscopes for them to use. (Right now I have an HP-180A I am repairing and a Tek 465 that is working pretty well.) I taught myself to use a 'scope when I was in elementary school. I built my first 'scope from a kit (an Eico 435) when I was 11. A 'scope is the most useful tool I have ever found for working on electronic equipment. I suspect that my fascination with the 'scope played a large part in my visual understanding of electronics. I have one lab where they use a function generator and a 'scope to help the kids learn about the relationship between amplitude, time, frequency, and wavelength. It lets them view what they are learning and tie it to the geometry that has been the cornerstone of their math. (BTW, in a Montessori school kindergarten students understand the concepts of multiplication, division, squares, and square roots. By the time they hit their 4th year they are surprisingly advanced in their grasp of mathematical concepts including the beginnings of algebra so I can begin to teach them the physics from a quantitative as well as a qualitative point of view. This year they were learning about ratio and proportion as applied to simple machines. The older kids designed and built their own throwing machines, e.g. mangonels, balistas, and trebuchets.) As you intend, take the SSB module, beside fone you will be able to run digital mode too. That is the idea. I am not sure I will get to the point where I can explain modulation from a mathematical point of view but I can give them the practical idea. I am looking around for a good, old spectrum analyzer so I can show them things in the frequency as well as the time domain. I waited two years before ordering the KPA100 and it is not yet in service! Thank you. I have had a couple of private messages say that too. About a year after the K2 and SSB, I instaled the KAT2 antenna tuner. I am hearing similar things from people. So you can do lot of things whith QRP level and I will not change anything but for another K!!! :-) Good work Brian, best regards F5UL/Bob Thank you. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Getting ready to order K2
On Jun 12, 2007, at 9:41 AM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: First of all, there was substantial interest in the K2 sitting alongside the K3 at SeaPac in Oregon June 2 and 3. It's a great rig and, as several people pointed out, one is assembled at lower cost from individual parts. They are different and I certainly see value in both. I don't think that the K3 replaces the K2 or vice versa. Was it the ARRL who recommended the Yaesu, Icom or Kenwood rigs? How dare they leave Elecraft off of that list? If so, it's time to sharpen my rhetoric (don't use a pencil much any more) and shoot off a letter (er... Email) to Newington! It is probably not fair to say that they recommended them. I know they are trying to put together packages for schools and they provided a package list that would be adequate for a school. I suspect that in many cases the trustee/elmer might not be all that technical or might be a newly-minted licensee and not really familiar with what might be needed. Also consider that they want these stations to go up and get kids on- the-air. Having to build the rig would, in many cases, keep that from happening. After talking with me and knowing my background they were quite supportive of my idea to get the K2 and build it with the kids. So don't go beating up on them yet. :-) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Getting ready to order K2
On Jun 12, 2007, at 7:06 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: As a member and supporter of the ARRL since 1952 I don't beat up on them too easily. Considering the fact that many if not most Hams today would not consider picking up a soldering iron to do more than attach a connector to a cable, I agree they are probably being cautious. After all, I understand the ARRL has launched their own program of technical courses to help Hams become more technically competent. They are putting me through a one-week intensive training program to help me integrate their recommended lesson plans into my syllabus. They are also training us on the Parallax Boe-Bot robot kits. I am going to get several of those too. The kids get to build those as well and it introduces them to programming. Again, the hands-on aspect of writing a program that then causes the robot to behave a certain way in the physical world should be another reinforcing learning tool. The comparison is striking: when I was in the 6th grade our class built crystal sets as part of science. I already had a three-tube regenerative receiver so I got an A without breaking a sweat G. We didn't even do that in our classes. I am going to show kids how much fun making things can be. Oh, and I have to get T-hunting and emergency communications in there too. I want to make sure there is something for everyone. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Getting ready to order K2
So after all this discussion of the K3, here I am getting ready to purchase a K2. As I think I have mentioned before, I am setting up a science and technology center in our school, Granite Bay Montessori School. (http://www.gbmontessori.com) We have received a grant from the ARRL to help populate the center with equipment including an amateur station. We have been asked for a list of what we would like and I have decided to go against the flow and request a K2 kit. (They were recommending we choose either a Yaesu FT-897, an Icom IC-706mkIIg, or a Kenwood TS-570SG.) My plan is to have the all the kids work on the kit so that they have the feeling of both participation and accomplishment. I also plan to use the assembly and testing procedures to help cement what they are learning about electricity. The radios mentioned above all fall into the sub $1000 range so that is a calibration point for what I think we can get away with spending. So my question here is, if you were going to outfit a K2 and try to keep the price reasonable what would you get and what might you leave behind. As I see it, the absolute must-have items are: 1. the K2 itself (duh); 2. the SSB module. After that it becomes a bit fuzzy. For instance, I would like opinions as to the need for the KPA-100. Note that if I don't opt for the KPA-100 I *will* get the KIO-2. Since I expect to be using this rig mostly in in the classroom with a matched antenna (I am leaning toward the GAP Titan DX as I have one and like it), I probably would not opt for the KAT-2. What about the DSP module? The kids are learning the code and I hope/expect that there will be a fair amount of CW operation. (The kids actually think that learning the code will be a cool thing in and of itself. I am using the Code Quick system with them.) I also expect some SSB and digital (AFSK, PSK31, MFSK, SSTV, etc.) operation. Anyway, I solicit the input from the folks on this list. You have a lot of experience with the product and can help me make the right decisions. Thanks! 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Where R made ? Power Pole
On Jun 10, 2007, at 8:10 AM, Julian G4ILO wrote: Unfortunately, by the time we're all out of work or employed in the tourist industry looking after the Chinese on their holidays, it will be too late to realise the folly of seeing no further than bigger profits and lower prices. We live in a global economic market and the formula is simple: make a better product for the same price or the same quality product for a lower price. People of the western world for the most part have an over-inflated estimate of the value of their labor. Laborers in the US and the UK do not necessarily do a job that is enough better to justify a higher wage than someone in India or China. Want more money and/or more business? Learn to do something that has more value in the market. And, yes, it *is* about bigger profits and lower prices. But it is also about creating new things too. There are exceptional people who do the groundbreaking work. They cannot be replaced by a generic college graduate with a master's degree or a PhD no matter how 'learned' the latter are. These are not the people working for big companies. The goal is to find the few people who are in this creative class and work with them to create new things. Once the designs are well established you can turn them over to a generic PhD EE. BTW, the reason everyone here likes the Elecraft products is that Elecraft consists of a collection of that small group of people in that exceptional category, i.e. the people who really think and make new things. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2: Firmware Escrow
of openness is the Internet. There you had competitors innovating cooperatively and the results were to vastly grow the market. That is a way to make a lot more money without having to try to take market share from someone else. much in the way we still have folks experimenting with older vacuum tube (valve) kit today. The move to software and protection of software by secrecy is generally a bad thing for innovation by amateurs (in a general sense). In the past, whether or not strictly legal, non-commercial developers were not impacted by patents, but these days they cannot get the information needed to innovate. In the short term, that fits in with fact that Western economies are now intellectual property economies, but in the longer term it seems to me that it will reduce the supply of innovators and it is already resulting in a vast amount of duplicated effort. I agree. Elecraft are in the border area between amateur as learner and innovator and amateur as appliance operator. Companies selling to the latter role are just selling to yet another consumer technology product, and want good consumers, not innovators. I agree. One other possible reason for restricting the firmware is that releasing it facilitates overriding operating frequency ranges, etc. Legislating restrictions is easy for governments, although I would argue that, where national security is involved, recreating sufficient firmware from scratch is well within the capabilities of most insurgent groups who might otherwise find the hardware easy to import and better than alternatives. To some extent I agree. Unless Elecraft is actively pursuing sales in restrictive countries, they are not likely to run into the problem. I think that they are just trying to meet current demand. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2: Firmware Escrow
I am sorry to hear that this topic annoys some of you. I assure you that it is not my intention. I have been playing with amateur radio kit for about 45 years now. I also play with old airplanes. One of the things that one begins to see is that sometimes parts become unavailable. Some vacuum tubes have become more difficult to acquire. That disturbs me because I have some treasured old radios and audio equipment that I want to keep working. Likewise with airplanes. Parts for older airplanes are getting very difficult to acquire, so much so that I have started combing the junkyards for usable obscure parts just-in-case. I grab those things that I am unlikely to be able to manufacture on my own. The same goes for radios. One of the things that has come over time is that short lifetime of some systems. We don't keep our computers for years and years anymore. Five years and it is junk. But we do tend to keep our radios for a long time. All I want is to ensure that, if I have to repair or modify my radio, I will have *all* the parts I need to do so. Software is now a part. YMMV 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K2: Firmware Escrow
There is a very good alternative to software escrow: open software. Since the K3 software is hardware-specific, it is unlikely that it will give other vendors a leg up to see the Elecraft source code. So two things happen by making Elecraft's software open: 1. It solves the escrow problem by automatically creating multiple copies of the source tree. I know I would grab a copy and I am sure others would too. 2. Anyone can generate a software build. Even if Elecraft stopped developing a particular radio, owners can still enhance their equipment, much in the way we still have folks experimenting with older vacuum tube (valve) kit today. 2. Others with good ideas can add functionality and features to the radio without having to wait for Elecraft to get around to it. Elecraft can even fold good, well thought-out features back into the official source tree. YMMV 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Best Handi-Talki Out There Now?
On Jun 9, 2007, at 2:55 PM, Ron D'Eau Claire wrote: I have an Icom WM32A that I picked up in 1999. Works fine, when I can figure out how to work it. Welcome to the wonderful world of bad user interfaces (UI). One of the problems is that, in the rush to add more and more 'features' to the radio, someone forgot to ask the users if they needed or wanted 'em at the expense of being able to make the radio actually work. My favorite was an old Kenwood from the 1980's - all thumbwheel switches, FM only and simple to operate. In a moment of madness I sold it. I still have an IC-2A kicking around. I couldn't bring myself to get rid of it as it just worked too well and I never forgot how to make it work no matter how long it had been since I picked it up. I also have an Icom IC-T8A three-band handheld and an IC-706mkII. Both radios have their manuals sitting next to them as I can never remember how all the features work. Most bad UI designs come from feature overload. Once you put a computer in the box the tendency on the part of programmers is to just keep adding little features just because they can. The other source of bad UI design is the desire to make the application customizable. BTW, I am keeping my IC-2A. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: K3: S-meter calibration (redux)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 9:50 AM, Leigh L Klotz, Jr. wrote: I wholly and completely disagree. Interesting. It seems to me that we are saying the same thing. 1. S Meter standardization is a failed effort. S meters are marketing numbers. dBuV or dBmW is the measure to use. If you are filing interference reports with the FCC and cannot figure out how to convert your signal strength readings to dB relative units, you need to make better measurements. Precisely. 2. If Elecraft chooses to allow end-users to calibrate and set their S Meter readings to have a known intercept (50uV at S9) and slope (4dB, 6dB, 3dB), so much the better, as it helps number one. That Elecraft allows it to be set to a standard and that it will be consistent from day-to-day and band-to-band is fantastic. It means it CAN be used for measurement. The only question is what the calibration will be. Since we have been taught that one S-unit represents a 6dB change, new kit should adhere to that. When I sit down at your radio and see a 1 S-unit change, I should be able to know what that means without having to ask you, Hey Leigh, what are your S-meter calibration coefficients? I don't have to do that with a wattmeter or a voltmeter, do I? 3. And, although I would not hold MSFT responsible for pushing forward UI design, I certainly don't think they offer the best options in terms of user configurability! I think Microsoft has their head up their ... uh ... well, they are pretty clueless when it comes to coming up with a good UI. Their options su... are supremely suboptimal. So, seems you are agreeing with me and I with you. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Sherwood report and K3 agc
I do a fair bit of digital recording. Ticks and pops are usually a sign that the DSP engine is not processing samples fast enough, usually because of latency in the operating system. I would expect this to be a less-likely problem with dedicated DSP where the designer knows ahead of time how he/she wants to spend the CPU cycles to ensure that the CPU is never saturated. I do not for a moment believe that this is a problem inherent in the use of DSP in the IF/ demod stages. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: K3: S-meter calibration (redux)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 6:24 AM, Toby Deinhardt wrote: It is beyond me how regulators can take interference reports based on s-meter values seriously. The s-meter is for many amateurs around the world, the only way they have of selectively measuring low level signals. One can not expect an affordable s-meter to be accurate to a tenth of a dB but plus/minus one or two dBs ought to be possible. I agree 100%. I like the idea that by referencing a fixed standard, i.e. S9 = 50uV into 50ohms, and then with a fixed slope after that, i.e. 6dB/S-unit, I can get an actual calculation of path loss by knowing the rest of the kit, e.g. line loss, antenna gain, transmit power, etc. That is really useful! Randomly changing S-meter behavior because it looks good or sounds good seems pretty darned counter-productive to me. As a minimum, if someone makes a 10dB change in their signal, I should see a 10dB change on my meter. I just roll my eyes when someone kicks on their amplifier and I see a 3 S-unit change. Oh please! So this gets back to a discussion of user interface. Microsoft has convinced us that being able to change things is somehow useful and desirable when, in fact, all it really does is cause confusion and support problems. Almost nothing is more frustrating than finding that the person you are trying to help has customized their system beyond recognition and nothing you tell them is really going to help them get it to work. Sorry Wayne, but being able to change the S-meter slope and intercept strikes me as being a bad option. To me that is like changing the calibration of a voltmeter or wattmeter because you like the needle pointer to move differently. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
[Elecraft] Re: K3: S-meter calibration (redux)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 9:50 AM, wayne burdick wrote: Brian Lloyd wrote: being able to change the S-meter slope and intercept strikes me as being a bad option. To me that is like changing the calibration of a voltmeter or wattmeter because you like the needle pointer to move differently. I'd agree with you if there were a single world-wide standard for S-9, and no need to compensate for slight differences in receive gain from one unit to the next. But reality is that S-meters usually require both scale and offset calibration. Yes, they do. But they can be calibrated to a standard regardless of the gain of the radio. This is also more flexible. As I mentioned earlier, I set my S- meters up for 4 dB per S-unit. Here's why: I like a greater degree of sensitivity in the S-meter so I can see the effects of things like preamp on/off, filter changes, notch, NR, etc. It also makes band-pass filters easier to tweak when there isn't a scope or AF voltmeter handy, and you can more readily see the effect of an improved antenna during A/B testing. What you are doing is changing the calibration instead of changing the *resolution*. What you really want to do is to be able to resolve smaller changes easily. So blow up the scale. Add calibration points for half S-units. That would give you 3dB points on the meter. That is even better than your 4dB resolution! If hams wanted to be precise in assessing signal levels, we'd report them in dBm and do a lot of averaging. I agree. I would prefer to have a meter calibrated in dBm but we have used S-units for so long that it is part of the fabric. Heck, we still use the English Standard system of measurements in the US. I have to switch back and forth between metric and ES all the time. And sometimes it is convenient to measure resistance in ohms or conductance in mohs even though we know they are really the same thing. But for most operators this is a hobby, not a job :) It is a technical hobby. We measure voltage, resistance, current, and power to very accurate levels. Why should we therefore say that accurately measuring receive signal level is unimportant? You yourself say that you use the S-meter to: ...see the effects of things like preamp on/off, filter changes, notch, NR, etc. It also makes band-pass filters easier to tweak when there isn't a scope or AF voltmeter handy, and you can more readily see the effect of an improved antenna during A/B testing. Clearly you are using it as an instrument of measurement. Why not have it conform to a standard so that the readings are useful rather than just randomly relative? I think this gets back to my comment about resolution. If you are using a quantized bar-graph display it is easier to change the calibration than to change the resolution. OTOH, three digits would be nice or even an analog meter. (I actually still prefer analog meters for a lot of things, especially doing calibrations involving tweaking things.) Never mind. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: K3: S-meter calibration (redux)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 10:12 AM, Darwin, Keith wrote: I disagree with this. If S-meter cal was indeed a standard, that's one thing but the reality of S-meters is that they are all over the map. If I calibrate my rig and know how many dB per s-unit than I'm far ahead of my peers who only *think* they know. If I have 4 dB per unit I expect to see a 2.5 unit jump when the other guy kicks on the linear. I find it interesting that people say they disagree with me and then go on to agree with me. The points I am making are: 1. Most radios have S-meters that don't tell you anything useful other than, the signal is bigger or smaller. Why bother with the meter if your ear can do just as well and probably more accurately? 2. Just because everyone else has crap for a meter doesn't mean you should too. 3. Having a meter that accurately tells you the received signal strength, one that can be accurately turned into relative dB changes or, better still, changes relative to 0dBm, is a very good thing. 4. Being able to sit down at a random radio, look at its meter, and know what it is telling you without having to get a lesson from its owner would be really nice. The only question is what the calibration should be. If the FCC didn't put it on the test and if there weren't a european standard, I would say hey, knock yourself out; do what makes you happy so long as it is consistent. But we do actually have a standard and we do (finally) have a radio that can perform accurate measurement to that standard. Why throw that away? Sorry, I have carried on too long about this. When I get my K3 I can set its meter to give me real measurements in S-units. If you use my radio you will know that what you had to learn for your FCC exam is actually reflected in the behavior of the meter in my radio. Oh, and I want a meter with resolution that corresponds to the accuracy of the measurement. ;-) Uh, and can I have it for $59 too? :-) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: K3: S-meter calibration (redux)
On Jun 7, 2007, at 12:09 PM, Toby Deinhardt wrote: 4. The metering system shall be based on quasi-peak detection with an attack time of 10 msec ∀ 2 msec and a decay time constant of at least 500 msec. Hmm, peak rather than RMS voltage? If you are averaging then it needs to be something like RMS so that noise energy is properly accounted for. Peak works for an SSB signal but not so good for general measurement. I guess we need to ask Wayne for a peak/RMS switch. -- But *MUCH, MUCH* better is Wayne's plan to display dBm. Yes. I do wonder what timing Wayne will use. And don't forget attack/decay time for the peak-reading meter and integration time for the RMS meter function. :-) Oh dear, this could get SO out-of-hand. Sorry. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] ESD bags
On Jun 7, 2007, at 6:49 PM, Nancy and Bob Widmaier wrote: Where can I get or buy large ESD bags in small quantities at a reasonable price? Just wrap them in aluminum foil if you are concerned. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft: Re Radios on Networks
On Jun 6, 2007, at 2:21 AM, Mike Walkington wrote: Is this the making of a standard interface? http://rigserve.sourceforge.net/about.html It looks like it might be. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] K3 and Datamodes
On Jun 6, 2007, at 8:33 AM, Vic K2VCO wrote: Bob Nielsen wrote: The point that I'm (still) missing is how is a good AFSK signal is supposed to be different from a 'true FSK' signal as G4ILO suggested. It isn't. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Elecraft's HexKey
On Jun 6, 2007, at 5:55 PM, Ken Kopp wrote: I'm a long-time CW op (54 years) and agree it's about the best I've ever used, too. Attaching a house logo and adding a S/N is another example of Elecraft's marketing savvy. Mine's S/N 290, FWIW. (:-)) No, there's no way to buy a chrome version, from either Elecraft or Bencher, even at a premium price. So, take it apart, strip the base, and take it to your local chrome- plating shop. Then you can attach S/N 0001 to it. :-) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Sherwood Engineering and DSP
On Jun 6, 2007, at 9:16 PM, Jan Erik Holm wrote:
Lets hope Elecraft got it right!
/SM2EKM
-
Sherwood Engineering just put up their Dayton 2007
presentation on DSP and how it isn't everything it is
cracked up to be. See:
http://www.sherweng.com/documents/Dayton2007w.pdf
The thing is, what he is talking about would be very easy to fix. You
just need a smoothing algorithm to keep your AGC from responding to
transients by slewing too rapidly. Smoothing algorithms are easy to
do. Here is one:
AGC' = 0.9 * AGC + 0.1 * signal
What the above says is:
take 1/10 of the signal level (signal) and add it to 9/10 of the
previous AGC value to produce the new AGC value. We change the
response time by varying the ratio. Want faster AGC? Do this:
AGC' = 0.5 * AGC + 0.5 * signal
Want really slow AGC? Do this:
AGC' = 0.99 * AGC + 0.01 * signal
By changing the coefficients depending on whether signal is greater
or less than AGC you can change attack and decay times. Here:
if (AGC signal)
{
# Attack
AGC = 0.9 * AGC + 0.1 * signal;
}
else
{
# decay
AGC = 0.99 * AGC + 0.01 * signal;
}
This is a really simple problem and I have a hard time believing that
this is the real problem. You want the AGC to prevent the A:D from
clipping but just barely. That will give you the maximum dynamic
range. If the A:D is allowed to clip then all bets are off.
I just have a hard time believing that any competent engineer would
fail to understand this.
73 de Brian, WB6RQN
Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com
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Re: [Elecraft] Re: K3 freqs query
On Jun 5, 2007, at 8:45 AM, John GM4SLV wrote: Unfortunately the nannyless situation you find yourself in applies only to the more fortunate countries. Snip tale of authoritarian woe I'm presuming that HS has enough attractions to make up for its poor treatment of amateur radio, otherwise you wouldn't be there... ... Hang on...didn't you say that HS didn't have 6m or the WARC bands? Then how are you going to get your K3s into the country, whether they transmit out of band or not? I agree, we should be able to make our radios do whatever we want them to do. That being said, many countries have regulations that limit what a radio may do in order to be approved for sale in that country. The easy solution is to put the limits in software so that the radio passes the regulatory requirements but allows the technically-savvy owner to make it do what they want it to. (wink- wink, nudge-nudge) 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: radios on networks
On Jun 5, 2007, at 9:17 AM, Simon Brown (HB9DRV) wrote: My current digital software project is DM780 - some screenshots here: http://gallery.ham-radio.ch/main.php?g2_itemId=9832 I will write a remote agent which sends the digital data over the network, the UI will select the agent instead of the soundcard. Sounds pretty interesting. Care to share more about the protocols? Just another comment. One of the things that made the Internet successful was to standardize on the protocols going over the wire rather than standardize on the software. That means that anyone can write software to implement the protocol and be compatible with everyone else. To be quite frank, I would probably opt to use SNMP to provide control and monitoring of the devices in my shack. It is a standard so there is a lot of code already available to use. We would just need to cook up the ham-shack MIB (management information base) to include objects like: antenna operating frequency upper bound operating frequency lower bound azimuth elevation Rig transmit frequency receive frequency passband upper bound passband lower bound input selection transmitter on/off etc. It provides for gets (read) and sets (write). Some parameters are read-only. Others are read/write. We also need something standardized for the transmission of AF and IF data over the network. This requires more thought as we are addressing layering. I have protocols for the physical layer (modulation, control), link layer, etc. Splitting functionality between rig and computer is going to be more of a challenge but certainly doable. I have been out of this scene for a *LONG* time. Perhaps someone can tell me if anyone has addressed this in the TAPR/AMRAD digital conference? (Lyle?) Simon Brown, HB9DRV - Original Message - From: Brian Lloyd brian- [EMAIL PROTECTED] This is an excellent point. Imagine I am using a digital mode with a K3. The K3 performs all modulation and demodulation in DSP, i.e. in a computer. Does it make sense to generate a signal digitally in my PC, convert it to analog, transfer it to the K3 which converts it to digital, translates it to the first IF digitally, and then converts it back to analog again? 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Re: radios on networks
On Jun 5, 2007, at 9:33 AM, Doug Faunt N6TQS +1-510-655-8604 wrote: From: Brian Lloyd [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Tue, 5 Jun 2007 08:36:11 -0700 I would love to have a universal interface that would plug into the ethernet and let me sample and control things in my shack. I want to control my antenna switch. If I am doing weak-signal microwave stuff I need to coordinate the sequencing of my IF radio, my transverter, my preamp and power amp switching, etc. Lots going on. I might want to let the DSP in the radio perform the low-level modulation and demodulation while letting my computer perform more of the high- level protocol functions. We're getting pretty close to that with USB now, The problem is, USB is a bad choice in this situation. It is a short- range master-slave system. It is intended to have a single master controller control a few attached devices. That works for peripherals on your PC but it is not general purpose for our shack. We really want something that is peer-to-peer and has no limitations. There may be times when I want several devices on the network controlling several other devices. I might have two computers, three radios, two antenna controllers, a couple of amplifiers, etc. The system should not place arbitrary limits on what I might dream up. and I suspect Ethernet equivalents aren't that far away. That would be good. Of course, some people are going to want Bluetooth instead (which might happen first). The key is to be able to run higher-layer protocols over it. Bluetooth can do that better than USB can but WiFi is an even better choice. Still, I would much rather have wire, especially in a shack. Less radiation to deal with. With 100Mbps ethernet each cable can run 100Mbps. The more connections I make, the more capacity I have (using switched ethernet). With WiFi and Bluetooth all my devices have to share the same capacity and they are subject to RFI, something not all that unusual in a shack. And if the ham is trying to work the bird or do EME on 2.3GHz, they are NOT going to want WiFi and Bluetooth cruft floating around causing interference. But given the state of flux of the world, I think Elecraft has made a good, if conservative, decision. Given the cost of serial and the cost of Ethernet I would tend to disagree. Other than perhaps some backward compatibility there is no real advantage to serial RS-232 over Ethernet and a lot of disadvantages. It might even be practical to add an Ethernet to serial interface internally. No, that would be a bad decision as it would not make anything any better. Ethernet provides multiplexing already. Serial does not. Ethernet provides 1000 Mbps. Serial does not. I could go on and on. Ethernet-to-serial is just a band-aid. Better to put the ethernet controller right on the processor's bus where it belongs then you have all the features of Ethernet. And you can still emulate a serial interface if you really want to. I've done a trivial mod to add internal USB to a Z90, and it certainly looks possible to add internal Ethernet to that unit. But that takes software and perhaps some administration. Yes, and this is not a bad thing. (More below.) I note that my printer is connected by Ethernet, but required a driver for that. That is because most printer manufacturers try to move the processing into the computer rather than putting the printer processing in the printer where it belongs. This is a poor engineering decision based on reducing costs. You will find that good printers use a standard protocol on the wire and do all the processing local to the printer. And yes, it takes software. When doing something it takes effort to do the the right way the first time and doing it the right way is probably not the easy way. OTOH, once you have done it the right way it pays big dividends in the long run as you can build great things on a common base. If you want a perfect example, look at the Internet. When we were designing the protocols for the Internet we tried to make things as simple, general, and expandable as possible so that we could make new things in the future as we thought of them. Look at all the cool things that have come from that sort of thinking. It should be applied to our other communications systems as well. In the meantime, look at what N8LP has done. 73, doug 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] New Elecraft Message Board?
On Jun 4, 2007, at 5:08 AM, Arthur Gunn wrote: Fred I follow several message boards also and they are more rewarding to follow and and more efficient to use than the present Elecraft approach to communications among users. I disagree. I don't want to have to log into some other board to read messages. I want them all in one place -- my mailbox. Yes I have the various reflectors to which I subscribe split out into separate folders automatically but that is an easy thing to deal with. I too would prefer to keep the reflector the way it is. Since the messages are better organized into topics sub topics the long term topic searching is considerably better organized. In the long run this should reduce the duplicated question traffic. All of the major mail readers offer threading for topics. If people will properly alter the subject line when they alter a topic this works fine. And a BBS has no advantage there either as you won't see a new thread if people don't create one. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] USB ports and things - with corrections
On Jun 4, 2007, at 7:24 AM, lyle johnson wrote: You can buy PCMCIA or Cardbus to Parallel port adapters for $60 or less. But they don't work with many computers. None of my Dells that lack legacy ports will recognize any of the available cards (or at least the three that I located and bougfht); my Dells with legacy ports recognize and use all of them with no problems, so there is a BIOS issue you must contend with. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news, This is an interesting problem with a common thread. Much software has been written to make [mis]use of various interfaces on standard hardware. The use of a parallel port to control something is typical. What we really need is a general purpose device that interfaces on the network and may be easily addressed by software. In most systems software has easy access to the network so it seems to me to make sense to put our various bits of I/O into a bit of kit that speaks IP and plugs into an ethernet. Case in point, back in the early days of dial-up internetworking we had problems attaching many serial ports to our systems. The solution was to build a box (terminal server) that supported many serial ports but could be addressed across a network. No reason not to take that approach today. As an example, Maxim (previously Dallas Semiconductor) makes the TINI, a network-enabled interface-on-a-chip. Everything is on the one device including ethernet, IP stack, serial, CAN, and bidirectional digital I/O. It would be easy to build an interface box using this device and use it to control the various components in your station. This is a much more elegant solution than trying to force-fit USB devices. 73, Lyle KK7P ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] spectrogram for mac or linux?
For MacOS-X check out MultiMode OSX from Black Cat Systems. (http://www.blackcatsystems.com/software/multimode.html) You must purchase the software in order to transmit but you can run it in receive to see how it works. It has some very nice signal analysis tools including autocorrelation, FFT, bitrate analysis, etc. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] Spilling the HF beans .....
On Jun 3, 2007, at 4:54 AM, Fred (FL) wrote: And Bill Gates empire was launched, and IBM got its first DOS contract from Gates - and IBM's PC was launched. The way I remember it, IBM decided they wanted a version of CP/M for their new Intel 8086-based system and went to Digital Research. Somehow the folks at DR managed to really annoy the folks from IBM. (I heard it that Gary Kildall's wife wouldn't deal with them because Gary was out-of-town.) So IBM turned to the small company that was supposed to provide the BASIC interpreter for the new PC: Microsoft. Bill Gates of Microsoft assured IBM that Microsoft had a replacement for CP/M-86 even though they really didn't. (Ah, vapor-ware has been with us for a LONG time.) Microsoft then quickly purchased the rights to a CP/M lookalike called QDOS. That became IBM's PC-DOS which Microsoft then renamed MS-DOS. The rest is history. 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
Re: [Elecraft] CW practice QSOs...
On May 31, 2007, at 9:53 AM, ON4WIX wrote: Would that be Just Learn Morse Code (http:\\justlearnmorsecode.com) ? I heard a lot of my local club's members talk about how good this software is. Haven't tried it myself though. http://justlearnmorsecode.com sigh It looks really interesting but it is windows-specific. Doesn't anyone write code in Java so it can be used on multiple platforms? 73 de Brian, WB6RQN Brian Lloyd - brian HYPHEN wb6rqn AT lloyd DOT com ___ Elecraft mailing list Post to: Elecraft@mailman.qth.net You must be a subscriber to post to the list. Subscriber Info (Addr. Change, sub, unsub etc.): http://mailman.qth.net/mailman/listinfo/elecraft Help: http://mailman.qth.net/subscribers.htm Elecraft web page: http://www.elecraft.com
