Acceptance of ENs for the OJ
Exactly who makes the determination that an approved EN is acceptable for demonstrating compliance with essential requirements of a directive and will therefore be published in the OJ? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Metric Conduit
1) Does an EN or IEC standard exist for flexible steel (bendable) electrical conduit? 2) It has been reported that the trade sizes in the UK are 16 and 20 mm with 20 mm being the more common of the two. It has also been reported that the OD is the same as the trade size. Can someone confirm this is also true in other EU member states or any other state other than the US and Canada? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Conduit entry dimensions
The metric table that Anton provided seems to say that trade size ½ inch is the same as 16 mm. However, the OD of trade size ½ inch is 20.7 mm, but EN 60950 says the OD of 16 mm conduit is 16 mm. Obviously, something does not compute. I hope its not me. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Conduit entry dimensions
Folks, all of the information on NEMA sizes is moot since the original question was regarding metric sizes - 16 mm in particular - used in Europe and most elsewhere in the world. Any information on holes for metric fittings would be appreciated. -- From: Bill Lawrence [SMTP:wlawr...@capecod.net] Sent: Thursday, October 07, 1999 10:29 AM To: Lacey,Scott; 'Jim Eichner' Cc: 'emc-p...@ieee.org' Subject: Conduit entry dimensions Some dimensions for typical sizes of knockouts: Nominal Size of Conduit Knockout Diameter 1/2 0.859 / 0.906 3/4 1.094 / 1.141 1 1.359 / 1.406 1 1/4 1.719 / 1.766 A source of the data is NEMA ICS 6. Bill Lawrence - Factory Mutual Research At 09:06 10/07/1999 -0400, Lacey,Scott wrote: Jim, I took a few quick measurements of workboxes, isolation transformers, etc. in the lab, as well as the knockout openings in the cast housings of some of our flow transmitters. 7/8 and 1 1/8 seem to be the most common for the smaller circuits, with 2 3/8 and 2 3/4 used for the heavier stuff. Check a Hubbell catalog for required sizes for cable grips, etc. Scott Lacey -Original Message- From: Jim Eichner [SMTP:jeich...@statpower.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 1999 5:49 PM To: 'EMC-PSTC - forum' Subject:RE: EN60950 - conduit entry dimensions I have received very little response to this one, so I thought I'd post it again. Aren't there any permanently connected ITE equipment mfr's on this forum?! What do you provide in the way of knockouts or ...??? Thanks, Jim Eichner Senior Regulatory Compliance Engineer Statpower Technologies Corporation jeich...@statpower.com http://www.statpower.com Any opinions expressed are those of my invisible friend, who really exists. Honest. -Original Message- From: Jim Eichner [SMTP:jeich...@statpower.com] Sent: Thursday, September 23, 1999 10:49 AM To: 'EMC-PSTC - forum' Subject: EN60950 - conduit entry dimensions Greetings all: In clause 3.2.2 allows the provision of knockouts, cable entries, etc. in lieu of a non-detachable power cord for permanently connected equipment. In Table 10, it lists the overall diameter of conduit based on the number of conductors involved, up to 16A. In my particular application, there are 2 wires plus earth, and the current (and the branch circuit protection) is less than 16A, so the table tells me I need a knockout that can accommodate a 16.0mm O.D. conduit. If things are done there anything like they are done here, this 16mm conduit will be secured in a fitting of some sort, and the knockout needs to be matched to the fitting, not the conduit (i.e. a 16mm hole is likely too small). Is there a reference, or can anyone tell me, what the appropriate sized hole will be? Is this standardized somewhere? Thanks in advance for your help, Jim Eichner Senior Regulatory Compliance Engineer Statpower Technologies Corporation jeich...@statpower.com http://www.statpower.com Any opinions expressed are those of my invisible friend, who really exists. Honest. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the
RE: Italy EMI/RFI Testing
Dick, good luck in getting a government office to assist you. Since your equipment is not licensed, you have no legal right to expect freedom from interference. Generally, the PTTs just don't care about interference with non-licensed services. Good luck. -- From: Dick Grobner [SMTP:dick.grob...@medgraph.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 1999 1:09 PM To: IEEE EMC-PSTC E-Mail Forum (E-mail) Subject: Italy EMI/RFI Testing Good Day All - Being a new member (1 mth) on this forum, I want to say it has been very informative. Some of the responses to questions asked are interesting and enlightening to say the least. Some of you have vivid imaginations - which is good! Now lets get to my question. Does anyone know of an organization within Italy (governmental or private) that could go into one of our customer sites and do a field evaluation / study as related to EMI/RFI. We have a piece of medical equipment which we suspect might be infringed upon by RF. The equipment is compliant with the requirements of EN60601-1-2 (medical EMI/RFI). Any input would be appreciated. Need responses no later than Oct 8 Thx in advance - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Plastics ratings
Perhaps you could use a metal screen behind the window. The screen would act as the fire enclosure and then the plastic could be rated HB. However, hole size in the screen could be an issue for viewing as well as complying with the fire enclosure requirements. -- From: sparaci...@andovercontrols.com [SMTP:sparaci...@andovercontrols.com] Sent: Wednesday, October 06, 1999 11:23 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Plastics ratings Hello All, I'm looking for a plastic material that can be used as a window on a fire enclosure door. This material must be available in sheet form, be able to withstand impact and be rated 94-5VA. I referenced the (1996) UL plastics R/C directory and found nada. I know, I need to buy the 1999 issue.. Anyway, if anyone knows were I can get something like this please let me know. Also any insight on other materials ie. tempered or reinforced glass etc. would be welcome. Thanks, George - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Attachment Plugs and Power Cords
I can find nothing in IEC 950 nor EN 60950 that defines the requirements for an attachment plug for equipment that is not permanently connected. Due to the silence of the standard, I conclude that an attachment plug is not required per the standard. Therefore, it appears that the plug wiring methods and strain relief must be per the national standards and/or electrical codes of each country. For example, UL 1950 has a national deviation that specifies the need for a plug. I conclude that it is acceptable to CE mark a product that has no plug and allow a certified plug to be attached in any of the EU member states. CE marking compliance will not be affected. I conclude that it is acceptable to replace a plug on a CE marked product with a nationally acceptable plug without affecting CE marking compliance. I understand that the power cord must be acceptable for use in the target country. Therefore, it is not possible to ship a single attached power cord to Asia, Eastern Europe, Africa and South America since the power cord may not be legal in the target country even if a national plug is attached. Are my conclusions and understandings correct? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Canada Transmitters
Effective May 2000, all transmitters imported into Canada will be checked for Certification. The Certification number will be required on the customs form. A short FAQ sheet is attached and the complete story can be found at http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/SSG/rz00010e.html http://strategis.ic.gc.ca/SSG/rz00010e.html . Here are some of the relative documents which are on line. You can find them using their search engine. RSS-210 Low Power License-Exempt Radiocommunication Devices RSS-212 Test Facilities and Test Methods for Radio Equipment RSP-100 Radio Equipment Certification Procedure TRC-49 Certification Service Fees RR Radiocommunication Regulations RA Radiocommunications Act faq_e.pdf faq_e.pdf Description: Binary data
RE: Coatings for Ferrite Tiles?
We have been considering adding some type of white, light weight, solid covering using Velcro or similar techniques so that the covering is removable. One thought has been ceiling tiles. Any suggestions? -- From: Lacey,Scott [SMTP:sla...@foxboro.com] Sent: Friday, October 01, 1999 2:26 PM To: 'emc-p...@ieee.org' Subject: Coatings for Ferrite Tiles? To the group, Can anyone recommend a paint or other (light colored) coating that can be applied over ferrite tiles? The lighting in the bat cave (shield room) is rather grim. It can be very difficult to see when working inside of a cabinet. Photos of test setups would also look better if there were less contrast with the background. Scott Lacey - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Warning label sizing.
I have a [brand name omitted to protect the guilty] hand scanner where the required wording on the yellow caution label is 4 x 10 mm. I can barely read it. But under that is a totally illegible FDA statement and FCC statement that I have to use a magnifier to read! Those two statements occupy 3x13 mm! I would not call this compiant. -- From: Ehler, Kyle [SMTP:kyle.eh...@lsil.com] Sent: Friday, October 01, 1999 2:34 PM To: EMC and Safety list Subject: Warning label sizing. Greetings, We have been lucky in the past, but with the real estate crunch that comes with smaller products, its getting more difficult to find space to apply a warning label. For example, a 'Class 1 Laser Product'. Just how tiny can the text/graphics in a label be and still comply? Kyle - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EN 60 950 and Denmark
Ah, the limits of the English language. In this case may not does not mean that it is forbidden. Rather, it is a warning that an outlet including one that has an earth terminal may in fact not be earthed. That is very common in Denmark. DEMKO and the other Nordic agencies require a special multi-language warning on the equipment to state that the equipment must be earthed. Therefore, it may be necessary for an earthing wire be connected to the wall outlet. -- From: pe...@itl.co.il [SMTP:pe...@itl.co.il] Sent: Monday, September 27, 1999 1:48 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: EN 60 950 and Denmark Hello Group There is a deviation in Denmark which states that earthing connection in Denmark may not be established through wall socket. My question is how do they earth Class I products in this case (if at all)? Is Class I equipment forbidden in Denmark? Thank you All, PETER S. MERGUERIAN MANAGING DIRECTOR PRODUCT TESTING DIVISION I.T.L. (PRODUCT TESTING) LTD. HACHAROSHET 26, P.O.B. 211 OR YEHUDA 60251, ISRAEL TEL: 972-3-5339022 FAX: 972-3-5339019 E-MAIL: pe...@itl.co.il Visit our Website: http://www.itl.co.il - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Argentina
Disposition 1009/98 requires that all electrical products under 50V comply with the requirements of Resolution 92/98 effective 18 August 1999. A Declaration of Conformity will be required for the first year after which the second phase (test certificate) of Resolution 92/98 will be effective. For all other electronic equipment, Disposition 499/99 extends the deadline for the second phase to 18 September 1999. A summary of the requirements in English is available at http://www.tradeport.org/ts/countries/argentina/mrr/mark0157.html http://www.tradeport.org/ts/countries/argentina/mrr/mark0157.html , and http://www.tradeport.org/ts/countries/argentina/mrr/mark0001.html http://www.tradeport.org/ts/countries/argentina/mrr/mark0001.html These documents contain Argentine contact information. -- From: roger.vi...@wwgsolutions.com [SMTP:roger.vi...@wwgsolutions.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 22, 1999 9:00 AM To: fi...@panametrics.com Cc: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Re: Argentina Argentina's resolution 92/98 is now in its second phase of application, and since 18 September all products powered from more than 50V now need either formal safety certification (eg by IRAM) or an approved Argentine conformity mark before they can be imported into Argentina. Certification can be to any appropriate IEC safety standard, including 60959, 61010-1, 60335, etc. You should check which standard applies to your product. There has been talk of a disposition concerning industrial equipment, but only where the power is supplied by other than the standard domestic mains system. You should contact IRAM concerning this: try Osvaldo Petroni there on e-mail: irame...@sminter.com.ar Roger Viles WWG fi...@panametrics.com (Paul Finn) on 20/09/99 16:12:08 Please respond to fi...@panametrics.com (Paul Finn) To: emc-p...@ieee.org cc:(bcc: Roger Viles/PLY/Global) Subject: Argentina Can anyone shed some light on the recent Argentina requirement which mandates all electrical apparatus be evaluated to IEC 60950? Would industrial apparatus also require evaluation to this verses IEC 61010? I believe this may be documented in Resolution 92, has this finally go into affect? Any comments would be greatly appreciated. Paul Finn Panametrics, Inc. tel: 781-899-2719 fax: 781-899-8968 - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Immunity Requirements for Australia
Testing by a certified lab is not mandatory; however, if your test results are ever reviewed, there is a chance that they could be challenged. We have performed our own tests on all of our products. Some of our files have been reviewed and none have been challenged. I would be interested in hearing if others have had the similar results. -- From: sparaci...@andovercontrols.com [SMTP:sparaci...@andovercontrols.com] Sent: Wednesday, September 15, 1999 9:49 AM To: mart...@panametrics.com; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: Immunity Requirements for Australia Hello Charlie, I don't believe Australia has any immunity requirements at this time. They do require emissions testing and that these tests are performed by an accredited lab e.g.. A2LA or NVLAP. Any electronic or electrical product manufactured in Australia or imported into Australia for sale must comply with the relevant EMC standard for emission as detailed in the Australian Electromagnetic Compatibility Framework, Information for Australian Suppliers. I know that for IT and telecommunications equipment this is AS/NZS 3548 OR EN 55022 OR CISPR 22. So I would suspect that it is EN55011 (CISPR 11) for ISM. To be sure, I would check with Kevin Richardson at: Stanimore Pty Limited (Australia) Specialists in Technology Requirements and Compliance Ph: 02-43-29-4070 Fax: 02-43-28-5639 Int'l: +61-2-43-2x- Email: k...@compuserve.com (Internet) or k...@technologist.com (Internet) or 100356,374 (Compuserve) Good Luck, George Sparacino -Original Message- From: mart...@panametrics.com [SMTP:mart...@panametrics.com] Sent: Tuesday, September 14, 1999 5:18 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Immunity Requirements for Australia Hi everyone, Dose anyone know what the Immunity requirements for Australia are? We are using EN 61326, for ISM equipment, for Europe. We know about the requirements for Emissions, AS /NZS 2064:1997 and that they are the same as EN 55011. Thank you in advance Charlie Martin - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: CISPR 24
You can order the standard at the IEC web site, http://www.iec.ch/ http://www.iec.ch/ . -- From: Guy Story [SMTP:gst...@iphase.com] Sent: Friday, September 10, 1999 11:19 AM To: Emc-Pstc (E-mail) Subject: CISPR 24 Hello everyone. I am looking for a source for a copy of CISPR 24. A search on the web ahs not yielded much so I think I am not looking in the right places. Guy Story Compliance Technician Interphase Corporation phone: 214.654.5161 fax: 214.654.5406 gst...@iphase.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
EN50133-1, Access Control Systems
Section 7 of EN50133-1 requires that access control components be marked with the product type and the manufacturing reference. In other specifications, I have understood that both of these statements refer to the model number, but obviously something else is required. Would someone please decipher these two requirements into plain English. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
EN61000-4-2
The CENELEC web site lists A1:1998 as having a dop of 1999-01-01 yet the amendment and the amended document is missing from the BSI web site. Was this amendment actually adopted, delayed or recalled? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Down Under
Everything you ever wanted to know about EMC can be found at http://www.sma.gov.au/ http://www.sma.gov.au/ . Basically, the product must comply with CISPR 22. In-country testing is not required. A local representative/importer must apply for authority to apply the C-tick mark. There are no fees. The local person must publish a Declaration of Conformity. It is my understanding that , other than the power cord assembly, safety certification is not mandatory. However, voluntary safety certifications are issued by the provincial power authorities. The national safety standard is based upon IEC950 with some national deviations. Australia is a CB member. -- From: lfresea...@aol.com [SMTP:lfresea...@aol.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 11, 1999 12:45 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Down Under Hi, I'm helping a client prepare to market a product in Australia. It is intended to be installed in public places for the purpose of entertainment. It is electrical and contains, not accessable to any user, a PC. Can anyone tell me the procedure that should be followed for EMC and Safety? Thanks, Derek. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Upgrades
Brian, I have to assume that as the manufacturer, your company has taken on the responsibility of ensuring compliance with the directives, applied the CE mark and issued the Declaration. Now you want to sell an upgrade to the equipment. Nothing has changed. You the manufacture are still responsible for ensuring compliance of the upgraded equipment. If the original Declaration did not cover these options, then a new Declaration will be required for the upgraded equipment. Since the upgrades are expressly intended for use with your equipment and not sold on the open market, I don't believe that they need to be CE marked. -- From: Brian Harlowe [SMTP:bharl...@vgscientific.com] Sent: Monday, August 02, 1999 11:57 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Upgrades Please can you give me some opinions on the following. I have a customer who has one of our Scientific instruments that he wishes to upgrade. If I supply him with CE marked everything to allow him to carry out this up grade and I also provide him with a detailed manual on how to install and connect up these items to be emc compatible. Do my responsibilities end there and does the customer have to get the instrument re tested and CE mark it? Regards Brian Harlowe * opinions expressed here are personal and in no way reflect the position of VG Scientific - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EMC Safety Standards
My comments are embedded below. -- From: Muriel Bittencourt de Liz [SMTP:mur...@grucad.ufsc.br] Sent: Monday, August 02, 1999 2:43 PM To: Lista de EMC da IEEE Subject: EMC Safety Standards Dear Group, I'm making a study on EMC Safety Standards, and some questions appeared. I'd like to post them to the group to see if someone can help me. The questions are: # Safety standards seem only to aim the protection the equipment... And the operator/user of the equipment? Is there any standard for protection of the user/operator? The international safety standard that is used for Information Technology Equipment and Business Equipment is IEC950. Many countries have adopted this standard as their national standard. The objective of the standard is to prevent all types of hazards including electrical shock, fire, mechanical, chemical, thermal and radiation hazards. The protection applies to the operator and to service persons. # The VCCI Standard is more restrictive than the European Norms (ENs)?? I understand that the VCCI standards are EMC standards. Japan has adopted IEC safety standards including IEC950. However, as many countries do, they have introduced national deviations. You would have to compare Japan's deviations to those of the EU to determine how they affect your equipment. All of these deviations may be found in the CB Bulletin which is published by the IEC. # Is there any standard which covers the effects of Non-Ionizing Radiation (Electromagnetic Radiation) on the human health? ICNIRP Guidelines:1998 IEEE C95.1:1991 ENV 50166-1:1995 ENV 50166-2:1995 NRPB Vol 4. No. 5:1993 VDE 0848-2:1982 VDE0848-4:1989 ACGIH Guidelines:1999 I think that's all... Thanks in advance for those who can help! Best Regards, Muriel -- == Muriel Bittencourt de Liz GRUCAD - Grupo de Concepção e Análise de Dispositivos Eletromagnéticos Universidade Federal de Santa Catarina Caixa Postal - 476 88040-900 - Florianópolis - SC - BRASIL Fone: +55.48.331.9649 - Fax: +55.48.234.3790 e-mail: mur...@grucad.ufsc.br ICQ#: 9089332 - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Public Telephone access
Doug, virtually every country in the world has its own regulations. My recommendation is that you obtain an external modem in each target country/area. The best source of information would be to contact a large modem company. Check Compliance Engineering magazine. I have seen some consultants listed there. -- From: POWELL, DOUG [SMTP:doug.pow...@aei.com] Sent: Friday, July 30, 1999 7:19 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Public Telephone access Hello group, Recently I was reviewing a new product that my company plans to manufacture. It has an industrial CPU board and a modem daughter board. During the review my safety consultant brought up the concept that not all public access telephone systems are the same and we would need a modem card that is approved for use in each country where we sell our product. My compliance experience is mainly in power delivery system and this is new to me. The consultant said that an ISDN compatible card would take care of most of Europe but was unsure about the rest of the world. I was hoping one (or more) of you could tell me where I can begin searching for information on this topic, web or otherwise. Thanks, -doug === Douglas E. Powell, Compliance Engineer Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. Fort Collins, Colorado 80525 USA --- 970-407-6410 (phone) 970-407-5410 (e-fax) mailto:doug.pow...@aei.com http://www.advanced-energy.com === - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
NSA
Thanks for all the comments. Some have suggested that the screen joints are not the problem. So I have the following question. Our NSA is too low at 30 MHz and acceptable at 35 MHz. As I published in my table, we all have identified many issues that can affect NSA. Of those, what can drive the NSA down at 30 MHz? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
NSA
After completing an exhaustive set of diagnostics, we suspect a problem with ground screen solder joints near our table. We suspect that many of these joints were not properly heated and/or that flux was not used. Someone other than my team finished this portion of the pad before we fired them for incompetent work. So now we are faced with soldering a five year old galvanized screen. One thought is that we will have to use a wire brush to remove the dirt and oxide. The second thought is that a flux (rosin, acid, other?) may be sufficient. The third idea, and the least acceptable, is to start over with a new screen. What are your recommendations? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Magnetic Reed Switches
Silver oxide must be broken by a voltage. If you have a dry circuit, that won't happen. Selection of the material depends on your application. -- From: Paul McCoy [SMTP:pmc...@lsr.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 27, 1999 7:19 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Re: Magnetic Reed Switches I apologize in advance for going off on a tangent since my forthcoming question is not on the original reed switches but an apparent misconception I have had concerning material properties. Is silver oxide really a problem on contacts, and if so how much? I had been told that although silver will tarnish (oxidize) more readily than gold it was still a good choice for many applications since silver oxide was also conductive. Has somebody sold me a bill of goods? - Paul McCoy - WOODS, RICHARD wrote: Reed switches are available with a variety of contact materials (silver, gold, platinum) depending upon the voltages and currents used and the reliability required. Silver is only recommended for applications where the voltage and currents will cut through the oxidation film that forms. For dry contacts, use gold or platinum. However, these materials will wear off if too much voltage or current is applied. The manufacture should be able to guide you on materials and reliability. Any of these devices can stick if the ratings are not properly observed. -- From: pitt...@pmifeg.com [SMTP:pitt...@pmifeg.com] Sent: Monday, July 26, 1999 2:54 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Magnetic Reed Switches Hello Group: A number of you, I assume, have experience specifying use of magnetically-operated reed switches for use in products such as telephone equipment and burglary alarm systems. I also understand that they're used in automotive air bag systems. These switches tend to have a transparent glass body with the reeds visible inside. Have you had any problems, in your experience, with this type of switch sticking in the closed position, particularly after storage periods or periods of time without use such as the case might be in burglar alarms? Anything you can share with your experiences would be appreciated. Richard Pittenger PMI Food Equipment Group - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Magnetic Reed Switches
Reed switches are available with a variety of contact materials (silver, gold, platinum) depending upon the voltages and currents used and the reliability required. Silver is only recommended for applications where the voltage and currents will cut through the oxidation film that forms. For dry contacts, use gold or platinum. However, these materials will wear off if too much voltage or current is applied. The manufacture should be able to guide you on materials and reliability. Any of these devices can stick if the ratings are not properly observed. -- From: pitt...@pmifeg.com [SMTP:pitt...@pmifeg.com] Sent: Monday, July 26, 1999 2:54 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Magnetic Reed Switches Hello Group: A number of you, I assume, have experience specifying use of magnetically-operated reed switches for use in products such as telephone equipment and burglary alarm systems. I also understand that they're used in automotive air bag systems. These switches tend to have a transparent glass body with the reeds visible inside. Have you had any problems, in your experience, with this type of switch sticking in the closed position, particularly after storage periods or periods of time without use such as the case might be in burglar alarms? Anything you can share with your experiences would be appreciated. Richard Pittenger PMI Food Equipment Group - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
NSA
Thanks to each of you who responded. I have created a table listing possible contributing factors and recommended diagnostic actions. Comments would be appreciated. Contributing Factor Diagnostic Action Antenna Factors Are antennas calibrated? Calibrated at same lab as last time? Same standard procedure? Antenna balance Does reading vary significantly when antenna is rotated 180 degrees? Rotate both antennas one at a time. Currents on Tx cableAdd ferrites on cable near antenna VSWRAdd 6-10 dB pad at both antennas. A 3 dB pad may work. Dipole length Verify length is set per manufacturer's instructions Damaged elementsCheck for loose, bent or corroded elements Mutual coupling factors Verify that factors are applicable to your antenna and distance Antenna spacing Verify dimension. For other than dipoles, verify where measurement point should be on antenna. Antenna height Verify height is per ANSI C63.4 Receiver and signal generator calibration Verify calibration date. Perform calibration self-check if available. Calibrate tracking when using tracking generator. Internal attenuator and scale tolerance Verify manufacturer's specified tolerance is no more than 1 dB for scale(s) used. Drift Allow sufficient warm-up time per manufacturer's specifications. Check direct connection reading before and after test. Size of ground screen Oversized pad is recommended especially when elevated or a 3m pad. Consider increasing size. Also reference Ground screen edge transition below. Bonding of ground screenCheck solder joints for cold joints. Check bolted/pressure connections for tightness, weathering and corrosion. Ground screen edge transition Extra screen may be required for undersized pads. This may be in the form a buried section of screen. Earthing of ground screen Add salt-water solution at ground points if weather is dry. Check solder joints for cold joints. Check bolted/pressure connections for tightness, weathering and corrosion. FlatnessHas screen stretched such that flatness is out of spec? RF conductivity from table to screenCheck solder joints for cold joints. Check bolted/pressure connections for tightness, weathering and corrosion. Check brushes. Reflecting objects within ellipse Wash down mast, covers and other non-conductive objects. Reflecting objects outside ellipse Trim trees and shrubs. Park cars away from site. Check for new fences. Move location of measuring equipment, if possible. Human factors Verify all steps in test procedure. Have second person perform setup, tests, readings and calculations. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Root Causes of NSA non-compliance
I can think of the following items that must be investigated if an OATS is not vertically NSA compliant. Can you think of others? Antennas and Cables * Antenna factors * Balance * Currents on transmit cable * Cable proximity to antenna * Dipole length * Bent elements * Mutual coupling factors (at 3m only) * Antenna spacing * Antenna height * Antenna variation from vertical orientation Receiver with tracking generator * Calibration * Internal attenuator scale tolerance * Drift Pad * Size of ground screen * Bonding of screen seams * Earthing of screen around edges * Flatness * RF conductivity from table to screen * Height above surrounding terrain Site * Reflecting objects within ellipse * Reflecting objects outside ellipse * Conductivity of surrounding earth Human Factors * Procedure * Readings * Calculations - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: NSA
Here is our present status. We added ground screen across the table and soldered it down. We now pass 3m horizontal by a fraction of a dB, but vertical is out over a dB. When we moved the receive antenna out to 10m we passed vertical! We are using tuned dipoles and have shown that they are balanced by rotating them 180 degrees. They were recently calibrated by the same lab we used last year. The sum of the antenna factors drifted by only about 0.5 dB, but our NSA has moved lower by several dB. So it appears that we can rule out antenna calibration and balance. Oh, and yes we have ferrites on the transmit cable and we have 10 dB pads at the antennas. The surface of our turntable is about 2 cm above the surface of the pad. Our brushes are mounted on the side of the table and brush against the top surface of the ring. I have noticed some rippling in our ground screen. Could these surface variations be a problem? As I indicated before, the site passed its tests over the last four years. Any other suggestions. -- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Friday, July 16, 1999 5:20 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: RE: NSA We have a 10m site, but because of high ambients, we calibrate and test at 3m. So, we have a very large ground screen for a 3m site. When we place the transmitter on the table, we fail NSA. When we move the transmitter onto the ground screen we pass. We can place the transmitter to the side of the table on in front of the table as pass. Therefore, I conclude that we are not experiencing reflections from objects near the OATS, nor do we have problems with the screen or its connection to earth. The antenna and cable setup also appears to be correct since we can pass off the table. It appears that our 1.5m table is the only unknown. We did find that the continuity between the ring and the screen (a bolted pressure connection) had deteriorated significantly. That is why we added the copper straps as a more permanent connection method. There are eight short, wide copper straps around the 1.5m table. -- From: b...@anritsu.com [SMTP:b...@anritsu.com] Sent: Friday, July 16, 1999 4:00 PM To: WOODS,RICHARD; INTERNET[ emc-p...@ieee.org]@anritsu.com Subject: re: NSA Richard, Can you detail your procedure to the conclution: The problem appears to be the turn table ? Barry - Original Text From: WOODS, RICHARD wo...@sensormatic.com, on 7/16/99 12:28 PM: Argh! For the first time in five years, our NSA is out of spec on our 3 meter OATS at 30 MHz. The problem appears to be the turn table. We can move the equipment off of the table to one side or toward the front and comply, so it does not appear to be an off site reflection problem. We have replaced marginal brushes from the table to the ring and we have added wide copper ground strips from the ring (attached with screws) to the ground screen (soldered). Still won't pass. Suggestions? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). D - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: IEC950 vs. EN 60950
When a country adopts IEC950, it is sometimes necessary for that country to introduce national deviations due to local laws or conditions. EN 60950 contains EU deviations from IEC 950. -- From: Biggs, Daniel (IndSys, GEFanuc, NA) [SMTP:bigg...@gemischova.ge.com] Sent: Monday, July 19, 1999 11:26 AM To: 'EMC forum' Subject: IEC950 vs. EN 60950 To those LVD expertshow do IEC950 and EN 60950 differ? I understand one is an international standard and one is european but are they considered the same basic standard? DB ___ Daniel W. Biggs HW Development Process Engineering Services Test Engineer GE Fanuc Automation PO Box 8106 Charlottesville, VA 22906 PH: (804) 978-6946 Fax: (804) 978-5588 - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: NSA
We have a 10m site, but because of high ambients, we calibrate and test at 3m. So, we have a very large ground screen for a 3m site. When we place the transmitter on the table, we fail NSA. When we move the transmitter onto the ground screen we pass. We can place the transmitter to the side of the table on in front of the table as pass. Therefore, I conclude that we are not experiencing reflections from objects near the OATS, nor do we have problems with the screen or its connection to earth. The antenna and cable setup also appears to be correct since we can pass off the table. It appears that our 1.5m table is the only unknown. We did find that the continuity between the ring and the screen (a bolted pressure connection) had deteriorated significantly. That is why we added the copper straps as a more permanent connection method. There are eight short, wide copper straps around the 1.5m table. -- From: b...@anritsu.com [SMTP:b...@anritsu.com] Sent: Friday, July 16, 1999 4:00 PM To: WOODS,RICHARD; INTERNET[ emc-p...@ieee.org]@anritsu.com Subject: re: NSA Richard, Can you detail your procedure to the conclution: The problem appears to be the turn table ? Barry - Original Text From: WOODS, RICHARD wo...@sensormatic.com, on 7/16/99 12:28 PM: Argh! For the first time in five years, our NSA is out of spec on our 3 meter OATS at 30 MHz. The problem appears to be the turn table. We can move the equipment off of the table to one side or toward the front and comply, so it does not appear to be an off site reflection problem. We have replaced marginal brushes from the table to the ring and we have added wide copper ground strips from the ring (attached with screws) to the ground screen (soldered). Still won't pass. Suggestions? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). D - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
NSA
Argh! For the first time in five years, our NSA is out of spec on our 3 meter OATS at 30 MHz. The problem appears to be the turn table. We can move the equipment off of the table to one side or toward the front and comply, so it does not appear to be an off site reflection problem. We have replaced marginal brushes from the table to the ring and we have added wide copper ground strips from the ring (attached with screws) to the ground screen (soldered). Still won't pass. Suggestions? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EN equivalent to UL1951
You can find the harmonized standards at http://europa.eu.int/comm/dg03/directs/dg3b/newapproa/eurstd/harmstds/index. html http://europa.eu.int/comm/dg03/directs/dg3b/newapproa/eurstd/harmstds/index .html -- From: fwhitfi...@rheintech.com [SMTP:fwhitfi...@rheintech.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 1999 12:29 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: EN equivalent to UL1951 Hi everyone, I am currently involved with safety testing of a product which I know falls under UL1951 - Safety of Electric Plumbing Accessories. The device also needs to be tested for compliance with the LVD - does anyone know what is the equivalent EN standard ? Also, is there a web site where I can find a comprehensive list of LVD standards ? Thanking you for any responses. Fowell Whitfield Safety Engineer Rhein Tech Labs - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RTTE Directive - Transitional Period
Every time I read this darn Directive, I find something new or I form a new opinion. Now I have questions about the transitional period found in Article 18.2. Member States shall not impede the placing on the market and putting into service of apparatus which is in accordance with the provisions in Directive 98/13/EC or rules in force in their territory and was placed on the market for the first time before this Directive entered into force or at the latest two years after this Directive entered into force. Assume that the product is radio equipment not subject to 98/13/EC and is currently being sold in the EU. This equipment is subject to the rules in force in the member states - the transposition of the EMC Directive and national radio regulations. Therefore, it would appear that this equipment may continue to be sold for the next two years without the need of complying with the RTTE Directive. Also, new radio equipment not subject to 98/13/EC but complying with the present national rules could be placed on the market during the next two years without the need of complying with the RTTE Directive. Am I correct? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Just safety - nnot telecomunications
I concur with Kevin. -- From: Kevin Richardson [SMTP:k...@compuserve.com] Sent: Wednesday, July 14, 1999 4:10 AM To: Gary McInturff Cc: 'emc-pstc list server' Subject: Just safety - nnot telecomunications Gary, The ACA (Australian Communications Authority) is only responsible for EMC, Radcoms and Telecommunications. It is not responsible for any other type of product. The safety of any product placed on the Australian market is controlled by trade practices type legislation and essentially requires that any product meets the appropriate and relevant standards for such products. In the case of IT equipment the relevant standard is AS/NZS 3260 (Australia's version of IEC 950). NOTE: AS/NZS 3260 is essentially the same as IEC 950 however compliance with IEC 950 by itself is not considered sufficient in many cases. If you have your product tested for IEC 950 PLUS Australian deviations in a CB accredited lab you will have no problems. In terms of electrical safety the Australian State regulatory authorities have listings of Declared Articles (used to be known as Prescribed Articles) and if the device/item is included in the Declared Articles listing, formal approval is required with an electrical authority (utility provider) in one of the Australian States (approval in one State is accepted in all other States). In essence, the only thing at the moment impacting IT equipment on the Declared Articles listing is a detachable power cord. There is not much available on the internet regarding these requirements. You could check the following URL for a very basic few paragraphs on what the State of New South Wales (Sydney is in the State of New South Wales) has available on the internet. there is no documentation however: http://www.fairtrading.nsw.gov.au/Products.nsf/All+Products+Docs/37A6ECBE54 30E7384A25677C002C04B0?OpenDocument Summary For IT equipment, no approval is required, except for the possibility of a detachable power cord. An electrical authority in any Australian State has the power however to request evidence of compliance with the appropriate electrical safety standard for any product offered for sale in that State. Usually this only occurs when a complaint is made about some equipment or an incident occurs. It is my recommendation any supplier ensure they are able to provide at short notice (10 days) a test report, by a reputable laboratory, demonstrating compliance with AS/NZS 3260 or IEC 950 plus Australian deviations. Hope this helps. For more detailed information contact me directly (see bottom of email for contact info). Best regards, Kevin I'm pretty frustrated trying to officially determine the safety requirements for Australia. I can't seem to get a handle on the ITE - but not telecommunications - stuff. The EMC I have handled but want to confirm what safety standards I need to meet. Again, I've tried the ACA URL http://www.aca.gov.au/_vti_bin/shtml.exe/search.htm http://www.aca.gov.au/_vti_bin/shtml.exe/search.htm without success. They have not responded, but there site seems to address only the EMC and safety requirements of telecommunications equipment. What is the status on just good ol' safety for ITE. Anybody have a different URL than the above. I apologize for asking this question when we just went through it not too long ago, but I took the URL and thought I was home free but I'm unable to get ACA to respond to the e-mail or find a link that doesn't tie into the telecommunications. Rat Farts! Thanks Gary - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). --- Internet Header Sender: owner-emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Received: from ruebert.ieee.org (ruebert.ieee.org [199.172.136.3]) by hpamgaab.compuserve.com (8.8.8/8.8.8/HP-1.5) with ESMTP id UAA07972; Tue, 13 Jul 1999 20:37:11 -0400 (EDT) Received: by ruebert.ieee.org (8.8.8+Sun/8.8.8)
RE: 50 ohm 75 ohm
You can buy or rent a Time Domain Reflectometer or you can build one yourself as follows. Connect a 50 ohm pulse generator and high impedance scope to one end of the cable and terminate the other end of the cable in 50 ohms. If there is a significant reflection at the far end of the cable as noted on the scope, the impedance is wrong. Change the terminator to 75 ohms to verify. -- From: Leslie Bai [SMTP:leslie_...@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 1999 1:36 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: 50 ohm 75 ohm Dear members, Anyone there can share the experience to measure cables' impedance thus to identify whether a BNC is a 50 ohm or 75 ohm cable. Thanks, Leslie _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Inherently Limited power source..
A good example would be a transformer. The current output can be limited by the resistance of the winding as well as the mutual inductance between the windings. Of course, increasing the resistance of the windings to limit the output may cause temperature problems. But any competent transformer company can build an inherently limited unit for you. -- From: sparaci...@andovercontrols.com [SMTP:sparaci...@andovercontrols.com] Sent: Friday, July 09, 1999 9:15 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Inherently Limited power source.. Hello all, The standard that I'm working with states under Power Limited Circuits that: an Inherently Limited power source does not require overcurrent protection, while a Not Inherently Limited power source does require it. Could someone give me an explanation of what makes a power source Inherently Limited.. Thank You, George - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Product traceability for recall
Try http://www.cpsc.gov/ http://www.cpsc.gov/ for US legal requirements concerning recall -- From: Ling, Philip [SMTP:pl...@newport.com] Sent: Friday, July 09, 1999 12:03 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Product traceability for recall Couple of week age I did see someone mention regarding the Product Traceability for recall. I need some help if anybody have the information please let me know. My question is : What standards or report do we maintain regarding product traceability as required by law or applicable government authority? Do US laws cover exports as well ? Thanks. Philip Ling - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RTTE Directive
A contact was made with DG III concerning the RTTE Directive. The questions and the reply are listed below. In reference to his last remark, why is there now controversy over the definition of placing on the market after the term was clearly defined by the Commission in two explanatory documents on the EMC Directive? 1) Is there a transition period during which products which meet existing regulatory requirements can continue to be sold? They can continue to be placed on the market (but not be type approved anymore according such rules after 8/4/2000). 2) Is it necessary to upgrade products which are already placed on the market before April 2000 but will not be put into use by end users until after that date? No. There is a small legal interpretation issue to be resolved in this context: what is the meaning of placing on the market? Some people argue it relates to product types, others to individual products. we are currently studying this issue. It has consequences for the practical implications of the above. If it relates to products, then all products sold after 8/4/2001 should be compliant with the RTTE Directive, even those type approved before 8/4/2000.
CEPT/ERC RTTE Directive
Here is one person's opinion on the frequency harmonization situation in Europe. If his understanding is correct, I still don't know what is necessary and sufficient to create a harmonized frequency band under the RTTE Directive. Comments? Confusing, isn't it.. The RTTE Directive has made a fundamental change in the way the EU deals with Radio. The problem is that we know what we've changed from.. but not what we've changed to OK here's my impression of life the universe and everything. For European harmonization of a frequency band it always previously needed an ERC Decision adopted by the EC members of CEPT/ERC (CEPT/ERC being bigger than the EU). The Decision was, in effect, an instruction to the CEPT/ERC member Countries to put the content of the Decision into National Law and to create appropriate National Standards. A Recommendation was used when a Decision would be difficult to implement or they wanted to try out a Decision. The presence, or not, of EU Standards was irrelevant to the process. It is important to understand that CEPT/ERC is a joint committee(s) of National Radio Regulators designed to provide a common view across Europe. It predates the EU and has a wider membership. There was friction caused after the creation of ETSI because CEPT/ERC believed that ETSI was encroaching into the CEPT/ERC mandate. This was true and became more true as ETSI Standards were implemented by many Countries (including CEPT/ERC Members outside the EU!). In order to solve the conflict, CEPT/ERC and ETSI set up a Memorandum of Understanding and they worked closer together. CEPT/ERC Administrations were ETSI Members anyway.. (Members not Controllers) More recently the Decisions have been worded so as to provide the formal adoption of EU Standards with instructions as to how they should be used (frequencies/levels etc) when it is not specifically defined in the Standard. In this way the Decision changed its function a little, as it no longer required the creation of a National Standard. The ETSI Standards changed also: ETS (and IETS) Standards became EN (and, I guess, ENV) Standards adopted by National Weighted Voting, as before. The National Radio Agencies have a strong input into the Vote (in a lot of cases, controlling the response). EN Standards are the European Standards which form the basis for harmonization (although they do not cause the harmonization themselves). To be a harmonized Standard they must be published in the Official Journal of the EU and be associated with a Directive. Now life has changed... It looks as if CEPT has suspended the creation of some Decisions now that the RTTE Directive exists, although it is continuing with its Recommendations. Unfortunately, CEPT is as unsure as we are about how the future looks with the RTTE Directive. Their role has become unclear. Within the EU a CEPT Decision cannot provide the legal instrument for National Requirements as this function has been taken by the EU Directive. CEPT/ERC Decisions may well have become redundant, although even CEPT/ERC is unclear about this (I think). The ETSI EN Standards will be associated with the RTTE Directive as some already are with the EMC Directive. Unfortunately the RTTE Directive is a New Approach Directive (which leaves most of the detail up to the Standards) but is unclear in the detail of harmonized bands. In most cases it is clear as the radio systems are operating on common frequencies anyway. Short Range Devices is less clear as there are only a few bands which are common. The CEPT/ERC Recommendation 70-03 does clarify the situation further and we are hoping that this will be sufficient to show harmonization. It has no legal standing, however, on its own (but then neither will a Decision after April 2000). Clear as mud - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Follow Up Services/Factory Inspections
Major inspection problems I have encountered. Parts and records problems: * Manufacturer's valid code mark on PCBs not found in the current UL yellow book. The mark may be new or just hard to find in the book. * Boxes of harness and cables not marked with appropriate CSA and UL labels. Sometimes this is caused by your own factory removing the parts from the original container and moving them to another box. * Spool of re-spooled wire not UL marked * No certificates from suppliers that molded plastic parts are made with Recognized materials Inspector problems: * Uncertainty of UL inspector on what to look for and what not to look for on split inspection reports * Erroneous instructions from European agencies (especially VDE) to local in-country inspectors to also inspect for EMC compliance * Local in-country inspector acting for another agency is unfamiliar with the agency's inspection requirements. This happens all over the world. * Inspectors erroneously asking to inspect hypot pass/fail records Solutions: Most parts problems can be prevented by appropriate incoming inspection procedures. However, when inventory is dock-to-stock, the best bet is to periodically inspect the parts on the manufacturing floor and inspect the certificates for molded plastic parts. Inspectors must be controlled so they don't inspect an area not under their jurisdiction. You must understand what that jurisdiction is and be forceful if required. Complaining to the agency about an ignorant or rouge inspector is sometimes required. -- From: Jon D. Curtis [SMTP:j...@curtis-straus.com] Sent: Friday, July 02, 1999 8:54 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Follow Up Services/Factory Inspections I am writing an article on preparing for factory inspections. Please share with me your gotchas and any advice that a person should know before the inspector arrives. What did the inspector look for? What documents did you need to provide? Any references on what to expect published by the NRTLs or others such as NEMA? Thanks in advance for your comments. -- Jon D. Curtis, PE Curtis-Straus LLC j...@curtis-straus.com Laboratory for EMC, Safety, NEBS, SEMI-S2 and Telecom 527 Great Roadvoice (978) 486-8880 Littleton, MA 01460 fax (978) 486-8828 http://www.curtis-straus.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Harmonized Frequency Bands
The RTTE Directive references harmonized frequency bands for radio equipment. How can one determine if a frequency band has been harmonized for a particular use? My understanding is that it is necessary and sufficient for the appropriate ETSI standard to be published in the OJ under the directive. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Safety Incident Reporting
My company is reviewing our plans for handling safety incidents and product recalls. I would appreciate it if you could point me to documents that contain such plans or if you could forward any plans that you may have. The one plan that I do have is from Managing Product Safety Activities by Paul Hill. Thanks in advance. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
EU Official Languages
When a Directive requires information to be provided to the user, and that equipment is intended to marketed in every EU and EFTA country, what minimal set of languages must be used? I can think of the following languages that are used in these countries. Are there more languages that must be included? Can some of these be deleted? English, French, German, Spanish, Portuguese, Italian, Greek, Dutch, Danish, Swedish, Finnish, and Norwegian (EFTA) - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Draft ENs
Is there a web site that lists Draft ENs that are published for public comment? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: NRTL Listing
I am in basic agreement with Rich. My company makes two types of low voltage products. One type is permanently installed and one is movable. We always use a certified Class 2 or Limited Power Source. Normally we do not obtain certifications for our moveable devices since they are not normally subject to inspection by an electrical inspector. However, experience has shown that the electrical inspectors do ask a lot of questions about the permanetly installed devices, so to prevent the hassle, we do obtain certs on those. However, my understanding of the US and Canadian Electrical codes is that certification is not required for devices powered by a Class 2 source. I once asked the leading manufacture of home intercom/radio equipment is they obtain UL Listing and they said they have never obtained Listing for their Class 2 powered equipment. -- From: Rich Nute [SMTP:ri...@sdd.hp.com] Sent: Friday, June 25, 1999 8:03 PM To: jfinlay...@nbase-xyplex.com Cc: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Re: NRTL Listing Hi Joe: liability and such. Can anyone share some more info as to their reasons for listing or not listing such a product which is well below hazardous limits. There are two schools of thought: 1. Because of its low-voltage supply, the unit is exempt from most safety certifications throughout the world. Therefore, there is no need to obtain any safety certifications. 2. Regardless of being exempt, customers expect most electrical products to bear safety certification marks. Indeed, OSHA and NEC electrical inspectors (and customs inspectors) cannot make field judgements as to whether an electrical product is exempt from safety certification. The presence of the marks assure acceptance without your intervention. I suggest that the decision should be based on your customer base, where the product is used, your company, the product, and the possible difficulties you might encounter without the marks. Any difficulties will have a cost in (1) delaying the product to the customer, and (2) your time to resolve, for the various inspectors, the fact that the product does not require the safety certification. For example, low-voltage products going into the home are not likely to be subject to discrimination due to safety certification marks. On the other hand, products going into the workplace, being part of an electrical installation, or going across borders may very well be subject to inspection for certification marks. Have fun! Rich - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: FDA requirements
Martin, I have to say that I don't even know what you mean by FDA emission guidelines. Please elaborate. My company has installed electronic business equipment in hundreds of hospitals and medical facilities and we have never been asked to comply with FDA emission guidelines. Our equipment complies with FCC part 15 Class A or Class B limits. Also, in my previous life at a major PC manufacturer, we never considered FDA emission guidelines, and I am sure that you will find their PCs in medical environments. So, I am at a loss as to why someone within your own company is pressing this requirement. -- From: Martin Johnson [SMTP:calpe1...@yahoo.com] Sent: Friday, June 25, 1999 6:42 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: FDA requirements When producing equipment that uses flat screen (LCD) 1/4 VGA displays, is there any requirement to meet FDA emission requirements (overall equipment is not for medical use, and would never find its way into a hospital environment). I only ask as one of my collegues is quite insistent that we have to consider the requirement (because he had to in his previous job, again not medical equipment). Its the first time i've come across it and all i can find on the subject are advisory guideline requirements, no mandatory requirements. Anybody able to shed some more light on this for me. Web sites, any info. gratefully received. Many Thanks MJ. _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: audio standard
ACGIH (American Conference of Governmental Industrial Hygienists ) has voluntary limits. You can contact them at (513) 742-2020. Order the TLV booklet for $22.50. -- From: Florence Sandy-ESF003 [SMTP:sandy_florence-esf...@email.mot.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 1999 6:40 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: audio standard Is any one familiar with audio standards that may exist, other than OSHA limits? Sandy Florence Product Safety Manager Phone: 954-723-5707 Fax: 954-723-4624 - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EN 61000-4- Yet Again
I'll take an educated guess that the Commission is only listing Generic, Product, and Family standards which does not include the -4 series. -- From: Cal Whiteley [SMTP:c...@patton.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 1999 9:03 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: EN 61000-4- Yet Again Many thanks to all for your help on my first two questions- now I have one more: on February 27th, 1999 the Official Journal of the European Communities published a list of titles and references of harmonized standards. The EN 61000-3 standards are on this list but the EN 61000-4 standards are not. Why not? Does this mean that the EN 61000-4 series are not harmonized standards? If they are not, why aren't they? They predate the 1999 list and I know of no alternative standards. Please advise. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Capacitor Failure Analysis
Can you recommend a lab in the USA that can perform failure analysis on an electrolytic capacitor? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Packaging vs. Shipping Container
Various EU Directives require certain information to be placed on the packaging of a product. However, packaging is not defined. The intent of the requirements appears to be to provide the consumer with information so that they can make an informed purchasing decision. Please put on your lawyer's hat and tell me if the following definitions are reasonable to distinguish packaging from a shipping container for compliance marking purposes. Shipping Container: A protective container in which a product is placed for shipping purposes. The container is not intended for public display of the product such as in a retail store, nor is it intended to convey product information to the consumer; therefore, displayed product information may be limited. The product in the shipping container may or may not be enclosed in packaging. Products intended to be shipped direct to the end user may not include packaging. Packaging: A container in which the product is placed for public display purposes in retail shops and similar stores. Consumer information and certain required compliance information is displayed on the packaging. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Packaging vs. Shipping Container
,mimegw6 Date:06/23/99 2:29 PM Richard, I agree. Your definitions are very rational. Regards, Mark Schmidt mschm...@xrite.com mailto:mschm...@xrite.com Phone: (616) 257-2469 X-Rite Incorporated 3100 44th Street, S. W. Grandville, Michigan 49418 USA Website - www.x-rite.com http://www.x-rite.com -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD [SMTP:wo...@sensormatic.com] Sent: Wednesday, June 23, 1999 8:49 AM To: 'emc-pstc'; 'treg' Subject:Packaging vs. Shipping Container Various EU Directives require certain information to be placed on the packaging of a product. However, packaging is not defined. The intent of the requirements appears to be to provide the consumer with information so that they can make an informed purchasing decision. Please put on your lawyer's hat and tell me if the following definitions are reasonable to distinguish packaging from a shipping container for compliance marking purposes. Shipping Container: A protective container in which a product is placed for shipping purposes. The container is not intended for public display of the product such as in a retail store, nor is it intended to convey product information to the consumer; therefore, displayed product information may be limited. The product in the shipping container may or may not be enclosed in packaging. Products intended to be shipped direct to the end user may not include packaging. Packaging: A container in which the product is placed for public display purposes in retail shops and similar stores. Consumer information and certain required compliance information is displayed on the packaging. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EN 61000-3-2 and medical equipment
Compliance or non-compliance with EN61000-3-2 will not affect the safety of the equipment. This is an economic issue, not a safety issue. The EU restricted harmonics emissions because it is believed that on a macro-economic level it will be more cost efficient to limit the generation of power line harmonics than to accommodate them by increasing the size of the distribution transformers. -- From: rehel...@mmm.com [SMTP:rehel...@mmm.com] Sent: Tuesday, June 22, 1999 6:54 AM To: jgri...@itl.co.il Cc: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: EN 61000-3-2 and medical equipment To me the Medical Device Directive is not the point...the point is.will testing to EN 61000-3-2 make your product safer? If the answer is yes then you should do it. The safety of your customer or an innocent user is the ultimate Directive that must be passed. It is usually more important to understand the spirit of the law rather than the letter. === == jgri...@itl.co.il (Jon Griver) on 06/21/99 02:48:15 PM Please respond to jgri...@itl.co.il (Jon Griver) To: George, David L george.da...@unisys.com emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org cc:(bcc: Robert E. Heller/US-Corporate/3M/US) Subject: EN 61000-3-2 and medical equipment David, I would like to add one remark about some past messages on this discussion group. EN 61000-3-2 contains limits for professional equipment. This category applies to medical equipment and any other products used in the workplace or in manufacturing activities. I would like to clarify this point about EN 61000-3-2 and medical equipment. The scope of EN 61000-3-2 may include medical equipment. This is not the point. The regulatory requirement in the EU for medical equipment is the Medical Devices Directive. The only EMC standard which is harmonized for the MDD is EN 60601-1-2, which does not call out EN 61000-3-2. See http://europa.eu.int/comm/dg03/directs/dg3b/newapproa/eurstd/harmstds/refli s t/meddevic.html So, in order to fulfil the regulatory requirements of the EU, medical equipment does NOT have to comply with EN 61000-3-2. The inclusion of a product group within the scope of an EN standard does not necessarily imply that compliance with that standard is mandatory. Jon Griver ITL (Product Testing) Ltd http://www.itl.co.il - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Pacemakers
Brian, in the EU all pacemakers must comply with the immunity requirements of EN50061/A1:1995. There are no real requirements in the US. Pacemakers must not malfunction when a 1V peak to peak sine signal with a frequency range of 20 Hz-500 Hz is applied to a tissue interface simulation circuit connected to the pacemaker. In another test, the pacemaker must continue to function normally when a modulated signal is applied. 2 mVpp, 20 Hz-1 kHz; 2 mVpp X f/1 kHz from 1 kHz-8 MHz; 16 Vpp, 8 MHz-30MHz. If you have some real concerns, Georgia Tech Research Institute can test your equipment with pacemakers. Contact Jimmy Woody at (404) 894-3535. -- From: Brian At Work [SMTP:bkundew...@qtm.net] Sent: Friday, June 18, 1999 4:01 PM To: IEEE Group Subject: Pacemakers How do I know if a product MIGHT interfere with a Pacemaker or not? What types of emissions and levels are Pacemakers sensitive to? Does a product evaluation check list exist to help determine this. I know nothing about Pacemakers. BTW, we manufacture laboratory and IT equipment. Thank you, Brian - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
ITE Requirements Chart Update
Updated for Slovenia and China. cert.pdf cert.pdf Description: Adobe PDF document
RE: ITE Equipment installed in hospitals
There is no legal requirement, but the customer may ask for it. -- From: Grasso, Charles (Chaz) [SMTP:gra...@louisville.stortek.com] Sent: Thursday, June 17, 1999 9:58 PM To: 'EMC Group' Subject: ITE Equipment installed in hospitals Does anyone know if ITE equipment is required to meet any Medical requirements if installed in a hospital. (No patient connections!!) Thank you Charles Grasso StorageTek 2270 Sth 88th Street Louisville CO 80027 Tel: (303)673-2908 Fax(303)661-7115 - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RTTE LVD Directives
The RTTE Directive says the LVD will apply with no lower voltage limit; however, it is not clear to me if internal battery operated equipment with no recharge connections is subject to the LVD. Article 1 of the LVD seems to imply that the directive applies only to devices with external power sources. Comments? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Korea
You can find the safety info at http://www.cbscheme.org/ http://www.cbscheme.org/ -- From: David Gelfand [SMTP:gelf...@memotec.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 1999 8:01 AM To: IEEE Subject: Korea Hello, Can somebody point me to the Korean safety and emc approval authority? Thank you, David Gelfand Approvals Engineer Memotec Communications Inc. Montreal, Canada - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Down Under EMC
Visit http://www.sma.gov.au/ http://www.sma.gov.au/ -- From: lfresea...@aol.com [SMTP:lfresea...@aol.com] Sent: Monday, May 10, 1999 2:52 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Down Under EMC Hi, if I want to market a product in Australia, made in the USA, can anyone tell me who I can contact to determine the requirements etc? I don't need help with EMC design or test, just the paperwork issues Thanks, Derek. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Precompliance Testing
Cortland, would you please tell us what you learned? -- From: Cortland Richmond [SMTP:72146@compuserve.com] Sent: Friday, May 07, 1999 11:21 AM To: Flinders, Randall; ieee pstc list Subject: RE: Precompliance Testing Wish I could be there, Randy. I actually did some cancellation work at the AST site at Fountain Valley, in a former life. Cortland - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Worldwide ITE Requirements
Thank you to everyone that provided comments. In some cases, the replies were contradictory, so I had to use my best judgement on the reliability of the source. It came to my attention that there are more severe requirements for equipment for domestic use, so I have restricted my chart to business use. Updates have been made to the following countries: Australia, Czech Republic, Hungary, Japan, New Zealand, Saudi Arabia and Singapore. Further comments and suggestions are welcome, especially where a question mark appears. cert.pdf cert.pdf Description: Adobe PDF document
RE: Precompliance Testing
Please elaborate, as 7 of 9 would say. -- From: Gorodetsky, Vitaly [SMTP:vgorodet...@canoga.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 8:22 PM To: 'Flinders, Randall'; 'Hans Mellberg'; 'emc-pstc' Subject: RE: Precompliance Testing In stationary case, such as OATS, there's a relatively inexpensive way of automatic cancelling ambients out . -Original Message- From: randall.flind...@emulex.com [SMTP:randall.flind...@emulex.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 12:23 PM To: 'Hans Mellberg'; 'emc-pstc' Subject:RE: Precompliance Testing I second that opinion. My experience shows SEVERE ambient issues with rooftop sites. -- Sincerely, Randall T. Flinders EMC Engineer Emulex Network Systems V: (714) 513-8012 F: (714) 513-8265 randall.flind...@emulex.com __ __ __\ /__ __/ \__ E M U L E X Chairman Orange County Chapter IEEE EMC Society r.flind...@ieee.org -- From: Hans Mellberg Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 1999 7:59 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; bogda...@pacbell.net; Gary McInturff Cc: 'Brent DeWitt'; Allen Tudor; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject:Re: Precompliance Testing Before you put a rooftop OATS, (assuming you are not located in Easter Island or the Caribean Islands!) you are going to deal with substantially higher ambient signals. It so happens that when you need a stronger signal, a common practice is to raise the antenna! I have battled those problems twice in my past and I would not reccomend rooftop OATS anymore. --- bogda...@pacbell.net wrote: May I add a note of caution: It may be worthwhile to check the permissible loading of the roof, especially when you are in the Southwest where roofs are mostly for shade and a few drops of rain. I guess that you don't want to appear suddenly in the conference room below Bogdan. Gary McInturff wrote: I'll agree with Brent, and others, the headaches of a metal room or the metal studs et al, in a building are going to make you pull your hair out. But there is an alternative to the parking lot. You may want to consider the roof. The ground reference can be put up there as well, especially if you are doing pre-compliance stuff. You don't have to give up parking space - which is sure to irate somebody. The roof gets a little hot, but that only gives you the opportunity to work in your cutoffs, and showing up to a meeting with the suits dressed like this is always good for a laugh! Gary snip === Best Regards Hans Mellberg EMC Consultant _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - This message is coming from the
RE: Alarm bell box (2)
Nick, my understanding of EN60065 is that it is more stringent in its safety requirements than EN60950 because the equipment is used by the general pubic rather than employees in a business environment. That is the only reason I believe it would be applicable. Of course, using an example of a pc blows this argument out of the water since a pc can be used in the home and at work. It makes me wonder if we will see these two standards merge someday. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Worldwide ITE Requirements
I have compiled all that I know or think I know about worldwide safety and EMC compliance requirements for ITE in the attached document. Sources for the information include personal experience, agency and CB Scheme web sites and previous e-mails from this list group. All of the information is believed to be correct, but there are no guarantees. I would appreciate any feedback that you can provide on any errors, missing information marked with a ? and additional information about countries that require certain unknown equipment to be certified. I will update the document and republish. Thanks in advance. cert.pdf cert.pdf Description: Adobe PDF document
RE: Worldwide ITE Requirements
Before anyone yells at me for the Canadian and US safety marks that I listed, yes I know that other marks are acceptable other than CSA, cUL and UL. Consider those to be examples. I will reword and/or add a note. -- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Thursday, April 29, 1999 10:26 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Worldwide ITE Requirements I have compiled all that I know or think I know about worldwide safety and EMC compliance requirements for ITE in the attached document. Sources for the information include personal experience, agency and CB Scheme web sites and previous e-mails from this list group. All of the information is believed to be correct, but there are no guarantees. I would appreciate any feedback that you can provide on any errors, missing information marked with a ? and additional information about countries that require certain unknown equipment to be certified. I will update the document and republish. Thanks in advance. File: cert.pdf - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Hungary
I found the following web site for MEEI, HUNGARIAN INSTITUTE FOR TESTING AND CERTIFICATION OF ELECTRICAL EQUIPMENTS. http://www.omikk.hu/trebag/meei/angol/meeia.htm http://www.omikk.hu/trebag/meei/angol/meeia.htm . According to the site, safety certification is mandatory for certain equipment including ITE. Does anyone have the latest status on Hungary's acceptance of the CE mark in lieu of MEEI certification? It is not mentioned on the web site. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Alarm bell box
My opinion is that EN60950 would apply if the equipment is for business use only. Otherwise, EN60065 would apply for household use and similar purposes. However, you should ask a Notified Body for an official opinion. You did not ask, but EN50130-4 would apply for immunity effective 1/2001. I assume that EN55022 would apply for emissions. -- From: Nick Williams [SMTP:n...@conformance.co.uk] Sent: Wednesday, April 28, 1999 8:39 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Alarm bell box I've been asked to give an opinion on an intruder alarm bell box. EN guidance (CENELEC report R079-001:1998) indicates that either EN60950 or EN60065 may be appropriate for safety, and sooner or later I'll have to make my own mind up as to which to choose. However, if there's anyone out there would not mind telling me which standard they applied in similar circumstances, I'd be grateful to hear from them. The unit is a box intended for exterior wall mounting and it contains a piezo sounder, xenon tube and associated circuitry including an anti-tamper switch. Incoming supply is actually 12VDC so we won't officially claim compliance with the Low Voltage Directive, but it would still be a good idea to take a standards-based approach to the design. Nick. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Characterizing a screen room
A screen room will be useful for conducted emissions but not radiated. Go with the parking lot for radiated. It's cheaper and will yield better results. -- From: plaw...@west.net [SMTP:plaw...@west.net] Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 5:00 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Re: Characterizing a screen room On Tue, 27 Apr 1999 14:58:30 -0400, WOODS, RICHARD wo...@sensormatic.com wrote: You cannot perform a characterization that will mean anything. The room will have standing waves that will be strongly dependant upon the size and placement of the unit under test, the placement of the antenna and the frequency. That was the plan - record frequencies where the room is unreliable, so we don't spend time looking at that data. Real tests would be done at an OATS. My boss is interested in adding a screen room, but I'm worried that resonances will render the room worthless. In light of that, do you think I'd be better off developing a 'parking lot procedure', and figure out how to deal with the ambients? The best that you can do is perform a pretest to find the frequencies of interest then move to the OATS for a final test. A screen room can be used for before and after comparison of EMI fixes, as long as the unit under test is not moved. But once you have a fix, you will still have to test on the OATS. Actually, you can perform diagnostic tests in a lab if you set the antenna 1 m away. Just keep other sources a few meters away from the antenna. To do what you want to do, you will need a compact semi-anechoic chamber at a cost of about $140, 000 including the turn table. We just started using one that complies with the NSA test given the constrant that we can't run the antenna up to 4 m. We have found up to 6 dB of variation between the chamber and the OATS. However the variation is small enough that we pretest and fix in the chamber and only move to the OATS once we have confidence that we have at least 6 dB of margin. So far so good, but I don't doubt that some day we will end up out of compliance at the OATS even with 6 dB of margin in the chamber. -- From: plaw...@west.net [SMTP:plaw...@west.net] Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 12:22 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Characterizing a screen room My company is planning to purchase a screen room for radiated emissions precompliance testing. I'm aware that reflections can cause resonances and drastically influence readings. What kind of testing could I do to characterize the room (aside from simple experience)? -- Patrick Lawler plaw...@west.net - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). -- Patrick Lawler plaw...@west.net - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Characterizing a screen room
You cannot perform a characterization that will mean anything. The room will have standing waves that will be strongly dependant upon the size and placement of the unit under test, the placement of the antenna and the frequency. The best that you can do is perform a pretest to find the frequencies of interest then move to the OATS for a final test. A screen room can be used for before and after comparison of EMI fixes, as long as the unit under test is not moved. But once you have a fix, you will still have to test on the OATS. Actually, you can perform diagnostic tests in a lab if you set the antenna 1 m away. Just keep other sources a few meters away from the antenna. To do what you want to do, you will need a compact semi-anechoic chamber at a cost of about $140, 000 including the turn table. We just started using one that complies with the NSA test given the constrant that we can't run the antenna up to 4 m. We have found up to 6 dB of variation between the chamber and the OATS. However the variation is small enough that we pretest and fix in the chamber and only move to the OATS once we have confidence that we have at least 6 dB of margin. So far so good, but I don't doubt that some day we will end up out of compliance at the OATS even with 6 dB of margin in the chamber. -- From: plaw...@west.net [SMTP:plaw...@west.net] Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 12:22 PM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Characterizing a screen room My company is planning to purchase a screen room for radiated emissions precompliance testing. I'm aware that reflections can cause resonances and drastically influence readings. What kind of testing could I do to characterize the room (aside from simple experience)? -- Patrick Lawler plaw...@west.net - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Heat Calculation
Multiply watts by 3.415 to obtain BTU/hour. To compute the input power you need to multiply the rms voltage, rms current and power factor. Or you can cheat and use a wattmeter. -- From: s_doug...@ecrm.com [SMTP:s_doug...@ecrm.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 27, 1999 10:47 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org Subject: Heat Calculation Hello, Does anyone know how to compute heat dissipation for a product given mains power input (volts, amps, watts)? Our spec sheets always list heat dissipation (e.g. 1,000 BTU/hour) for each product and I wonder where the number comes from and why it never changes from one product to the next. Thanks for any comments received. Scott s_doug...@ecrm.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, jim_bac...@monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: South Africa Requirements
For those that requested the WordPerfect file. COMPSPEC.WP6 -- From: WOODS, RICHARD [SMTP:wo...@sensormatic.com] Sent: Thursday, April 15, 1999 12:30 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: South Africa Requirements I received the following document from SABS. I have translated it from Word Perfect to Word. Enjoy! SACOMPSPEC.doc File: SACOMPSPEC.doc COMPSPEC.WP6 Description: Binary data
South Africa Requirements
I received the following document from SABS. I have translated it from Word Perfect to Word. Enjoy! SACOMPSPEC.doc SACOMPSPEC.doc Description: MS-Word document
Official Answers
If one has a question on an EU Directive, is there a means for obtaining an official answer? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Enclosures rated for..
George, some of our electrical equipment (IEC950) is installed in an air handling space (so called plenum). Our understanding is that UL has a special test for smoke emissions so special plastics are required. Because of that, we decided to use metal enclosures. We have to ensure that there are no openings and that all cables entrances use special fittings for the purpose. Usually, our equipment needs ventilation so we have to provide metal air ducts from the ceiling to the equipment. In the end, the construction is such that we don't need to have a UL rating for this use. It is obvious from the construction that it complies so the electrical inspectors allow it. -- From: Sparacino,George [SMTP:sparaci...@andovercontrols.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 14, 1999 3:27 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Enclosures rated for.. Hello Group, I got a request to have our future open class controller products Plenum Rated. In doing so, we could advertise that the product can be installed in a plenum.. the dead space above a drop ceiling to be exact. The controllers are housed in a plastic (polymeric) enclosure. So far, I found UL test requirements (UL935) for electric lighting ballast's that are to be installed in a similar space. These requirements are extracted from the NEC and pertain to smoke and fire (flamespread). I haven't found a specific UL (or any other) document that encompasses enclosures in a plenum specifically for the purposes of marking. I have seen specific requirements for wire wiring (cabling). If anyone in the group is familiar with the criteria for Plenum Rated Enclosures, I would like to know if I'm on the right track. Also, if you know of any more requirements or a specific standard(s) that would apply, please enlighten me. Thanks, George - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Packaging
In the wonderful world of EU Directives (RTTE for example) where information is required to be on the packaging, is there a distinction between packaging and shipping container. For example, multiple products may be shipped to a retailer in a shipping container inside of which is the product in its display packaging. Portable radios would be an example. Another type of product may ship directly to the end user in a shipping container without additional packaging. A satellite earth station would be a good example. Is the latter product exempted from having markings on its packaging since it does not have any? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Conductive Paint
When I worked for a major PC manufacturer we started out with conductive coatings on our laptops. Paint over spray was a problem that we had to address. Also, the coatings did not always touch at all points due to bowing of the plastics. We were also concerned with the long term effects of servicing on the conductivity. Many times on the OATS we had to remove and replace covers just to ensure we had good contact so we would comply. It was a pain. We found a much cheaper way of conforming with EMC. Source suppression. It is possible to suppress the noise at the sources and eliminate a metal enclosure. One good source of knowledge in this area is Ken Keenan (813) 544-2594. Other gurus are also available. Ken gave our designers a two day course specially designed for us. Once the designers finally learned - some took longer than others - that there are no short cuts in source suppression, we finally got a compliant product out the door without conductive paint. Once last remark. Conductive coatings may soon be a thing of the past in the EU due to recycling requirements. Conductive coatings cause a big problem in that area. Check it out. -- From: JENKINS, JEFF [SMTP:jeff.jenk...@aei.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 1999 12:07 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Conductive Paint Hello Group, My company is proposing to use conductive paint on our enclosures, and I would like your input as to the acceptability of this vis-a-vis protective earth bonding of enclosure panels. I am interested in the perspective of both European and North American requirements. This should be a generic question, but if it helps, here are the standards we use: EN 60950 / IEC 950 / UL 1950 / CSA 950 EN 50178 UL 1012 CSA C22.2 No. 107.1 Regards, Jeff Jenkins Senior Regulatory Compliance Engineer Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. Fort Collins, CO USA 80525 Opinions are my own and not necessarily shared by Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. or its affiliates. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
EU Languages
For those of you who are required by directives or standards to include user documentation with your equipment, what is the minimal set of official languages that are required to cover the EU? If you include the Declaration of Conformity, do you also translate it, or is it sufficient to enclose a copy of the signed original? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Country of origin
My company has for years produced products in Puerto Rico and has labeled our products as made in the USA. A couple of years ago, UK customs decided in their own wisdom that Puerto Rico is not part of the USA and that our products must be labeled made in Puerto Rico. So, to answer your question, the final assembly point is the point of manufacture. But as you can see from my example, what we really have here is a political situation. So in reality, any country can require you to label as they see fit. I have noticed that on cars sold in the US, there is an explanation on the sticker as to what was manufactured where. Other countries may have this requirement for some types of products. However, we have not encountered this need for office equipment. -- From: kim.boll.jen...@i-data.com [SMTP:kim.boll.jen...@i-data.com] Sent: Tuesday, April 13, 1999 3:39 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: Country of origin Dear groupe, This question is not a safety or EMC issue but I think that some of you have been involved in something like this before. On the label with compliance information we normally also add something like : Country of origin or Made in this is required by some of the EU directives and others (normally just the country of the main company who have the legal responsibility. ) But my questions are; -what is the rules for this information, is it just country of the company or is it the country where it is assembled, and what if it is partly made in different countries ? -which authoryties requires this informations other than EU directives (and FCC part 68) Best regards, Mr. Kim Boll Jensen i-data, Denmark - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Noise Figure
I am trying to determine the maximum noise figure that I can have for my 1-16.5 GHz EMC receiver system which includes the horn, mixer for above 18 GHz, preamp, cable and spectrum analyzer. I know the following: * Signal level received by the horn * Gain through the system * Noise figure from the horn to the spectrum analyzer * Noise floor of the spectrum analyzer I understand that noise figure is the ratio of the s/n of the input to the s/n of the output of the system, so if I need an output s/n of 6 dB and have a NF of 14 dB, I need a s/n input to the horn of 20 dB. So it appears that I have one missing piece of information - the input noise to the horn. Now I am lost. Suggestions? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Cost associated with Australian C-tick
Richard, there should be only a one time cost, if any, and that involves the application to use the c-tick mark. Only one application is required for all of your ITE. That application must be submitted by a person located in Australia, and that person may be an employee or an empowered representative. Testing for ITE may be performed by any laboratory in any country; however, the government has the right to reject test data that is not from a certified lab. The test data does not need to be submitted unless it is requested. My company is currently using our CE test data that we have taken ourselves and we have had no problems. If you are using distributors, be prepared to supply them with the information. We have had several requests from our distributors. Visit this web site to obtain more information: http://www.sma.gov.au/ http://www.sma.gov.au/ -- From: Richard Cass [SMTP:richard_c...@irisinc.scitex.com] Sent: Wednesday, April 07, 1999 4:48 PM To: EMC-PSTC (E-mail) Subject: Cost associated with Australian C-tick Can anyone tell me the APPROXIMATE cost (just need the right number of zeros) if any, in US Dollars, for obtaining the C-Tick mark under the auspices of their EMC Framework? This would include one time or recurring costs. This would be for ITE equipment. The relevant Australian emissions standard is apparently AS/NZS 3548. At the present time all of our products are verified for European Union conformity to the fully equivalent EN55022:1994+A1:1995+A2:1997. So, in theory, it should just be a paper work exercise. I am just trying to find out what the costs are associated with that exercise. Also, can we as a US based manufacturer submit our application directly to SMA or do we need an intermediary or an in country representative? If anyone in the Australian SMA is on this distribution, I'd be ecstatic to hear from you TIA. Regards, Richard Cass Iris Graphics, Inc. Bedford MA 01730 USA 781 2760-5424 - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RTTE Directive
I have several open issues with Article 6.3 of the new RTTE directive that I would like to discuss with the community. The article indicates that manufacturers must provide information for the user on the intended use of the apparatus. * Question: How in depth does this information need to be? The article indicates that a copy of the declaration of conformity must be provided to the user. * Comment: Assuming that the equipment is sold in all member states, it appears that a copy of the original signed declaration be included along with translations in all of the official languages of the EU. The article also says for radio equipment, . . .such information shall be sufficient to identify on the packaging and the instruction for use of the apparatus the Member States. . .where the equipment is intended to be used * Comment: This requirement appears to be written for devices that are sold to consumers. For example, a German native could shop for a remote control device in the UK and be assured that the product would be legal in Germany. However, as written, this article also requires the same information to be placed on the packaging of a 50 MW FM transmitter, which does not seem to be appropriate to this writer. * Question: Assuming that a radio device may be used everywhere within the EU or perhaps not, how would that be noted on the packaging without resorting to multiple languages? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Microwave Test Equipment
Help! I am entering a new world of test frequencies; 1-26 GHz. I am seeking recommendations for suppliers for: * 30 dB notch filter at 2.45 GHz * 40 dB high pass filter with a lower cutoff at about 3.5 GHz * 1-26 GHz preamp All of this equipment would be mounted on the mast and coupled to the horn receiving antenna. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EN 60950 productionline test
The original message indicated that the writer thought that this standard is under the LVD. I cannot find this standard published in the OJ as being required under the LVD; therefore, I must assume that its use is not a condition of adding the CE mark. So its use is voluntary unless an agency requires its use as a condition for use of the agency's mark. -- From: Constantin Bolintineanu [SMTP:bolin...@dscltd.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 8:31 AM To: 'kim.boll.jen...@i-data.com'; emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: RE: EN 60950 productionline test The Standard is: INFORMATION TECHNOLOGY EQUIPMENT. ROUTINE ELECTRICAL SAFETY TESTING IN PRODUCTION. The number is EN50116:1996 Respectfully yours, Constantin Bolintineanu Constantin Bolintineanu, P.Eng. Product Safety Engineer DIGITAL SECURITY CONTROLS LTD. 1645 FLINT Rd. TORONTO , ONTARIO, CANADA M3J 2J6 Phone: 1-416-665-8460 extension 2568 Fax: 1-416-665-7753 APPROVAL SERVICES E-mail: bolin...@dscltd.com -Original Message- From: kim.boll.jen...@i-data.com [SMTP:kim.boll.jen...@i-data.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 1999 4:40 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: EN 60950 productionline test Dear groupe, For a year ago I got a standard under the LVD which called for a productionline test with HV test and earth test. I have now lost that information and would like if someone can help me with the number and name of the standard, it addresses IEC 950 equipment. Best regards, Mr. Kim Boll Jensen i-data, Denmark - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
I/O Surge
EN50130-4, Immunity for alarm systems, requires that signal lines be surge tested per EN6100-4-5 using the coupler/decoupler network in figure 12 for balanced signal pairs. The equipment available on the market has a bandpass rating of 100 kHz, and the standard does not specify the type of circuits to be used for very high data rates. My question to the community is what type of network are you using for Apple Talk (circa 230 KHz) and similar high speed circuits? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Surge Testing
Other than Keytek and Shaftner, does anyone else sell surge coupler/decouplers for I/O lines per IEC 1000-4-5? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Standards
ICNIRP Guidelines: 1997 ENV50166-2:1995 NRPB vol 4 No. 5:1993 VDE0848 Part 2:1984 Draft VDE0848 Part 2:1991 -- From: Jackson, William [SMTP:wjack...@harris.com] Sent: Thursday, March 25, 1999 1:31 PM To: 'Emc-Pstc (E-mail)' Cc: Elvy, Stephen Subject: Standards Hello List, Does anyone know if there is a radio frequency voltages(rf) safety standard that would be similar in nature to the RAD HAZ stand ANSI C95.1-1994 for personnel exposure? TIA. Bill Jackson, CQE wljack...@harris.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: IEEE 519-1992
Compliance with EN61000-3-2, Limits for harmonic current emissions (equipment input current = 16 A per phase) and EN61000-3-3, Limitation of voltage fluctuations and flicker in low-voltage supply systems for equipment with rated current = 16A are required for electrical and electronic equipment effective 2001. Both of these documents are based upon the identical IEC 1000-3 series. -- From: Martin Johnson [SMTP:calpe1...@yahoo.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 1999 7:22 AM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: IEEE 519-1992 IEEE Standard 519-1992, IEEE Recommended Practices and Requirements for Harmonic Control in Electrical Power Systems, provides procedures for controlling harmonics on the power system along with recommended limits for customer harmonic injection and overall power system harmonic levels. Does anybody know of a European equivalent of 519-1992 that details recommended practices etc. Thanks MJ _ Do You Yahoo!? Get your free @yahoo.com address at http://mail.yahoo.com - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: EMC Canada
For digital devices, the emissions limits are the same for Canada as they are for the USA. Industry Canada is the controlling agency and the specification for digital devices is ICES-003 Issue 2, Revision 1. I believe that you can find the document on line. A special statement is required on the device in English and French. You may self-test and no submission is required. -- From: roger...@astec-asia.com [SMTP:roger...@astec-asia.com] Sent: Sunday, March 21, 1999 9:17 PM To: emc-p...@ieee.org Subject: EMC Canada Can anybody advise the EMC requirements for power supply units (desk top and stand alone adaptors) shipping to Canada. Is there any logo required? Should the tests be done in the accredited test lab, if so, is HOKLAS accredited lab accepted? Thanks and regards, Roger Hsu - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Surge Test Equipment
When testing I/O lines to EN61000-4-5, a coupling/decoupling network is used. One type of network is specified for unbalanced lines and one for balanced lines (figs. 10 12). Commercial networks are available for $10,000 to cover both types of circuits. OUCH! Has anyone successfully built their own networks for a much more reasonable cost? If so, what are the brand and part numbers/families of the inductors, resistors, capacitors and spark gaps? Did you have to use any special high voltage design techniques? The standard indicates that protection equipment is inserted between the decoupling network and the auxiliary equipment, but there is no indication of its design. What are you using? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Harmonized Standards
I believe the conflict arises because the Commission has moved from the old approach to the new approach and they have also been revising their own point of view on standards. Here is the latest from the RTTE Directive. Article 2(h): 'Harmonized standard' means a technical specification adopted by a recognized standards body under a mandate from the Commission in conformity with the procedures laid down in Directive 98/34/EC for the purpose of establishing a European requirement, compliance with which is not compulsory. Article 5.1: Where apparatus meets the relevant harmonized standards or parts thereof whose reference numbers have been published in the Official Journal of the European Communities, Member States shall presume compliance with those of the essential requirements referred to in Article 3 as are covered by the said harmonized standards or parts thereof. -- From: Jim Eichner [SMTP:jeich...@statpower.com] Sent: Friday, March 19, 1999 5:36 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: RE: Harmonized Standards Greetings all: I eagerly visited this site, particularly the page dealing with Harmonized Standards at http://www.newapproach.org/NewApproach/402.htm but was a bit disappointed. The description is thorough and filled with new ways of using words that I used to think I knew the meaning of, but it doesn't answer the fundamental question that was the focus of the forum discussion a while back: Is publication in the OJ a mandatory pre-requisite of a standard being considered Harmonized (and therefore providing a presumption of conformity)? I will eagerly await the update a couple of weeks from now, and any new input on this question! Regards, Jim Eichner Statpower Technologies Corporation jeich...@statpower.com http://www.statpower.com Any opinions expressed are those of my invisible friend, who really exists. Honest. -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD [SMTP:wo...@sensormatic.com] Sent: Friday, March 19, 1999 6:27 AM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Harmonized Standards The Commissions official viewpoint on the rules for the use of harmonized standards can be found at www.newapproach.org http://www.newapproach.org . Click on Concepts. According to the webmaster, The concepts text originates from the Commission, however I understand it is currently under revision and it is on the agenda for a meeting to be held next week. I expect the final official text to be on the site in the following week. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Harmonized Standards
The Commissions official viewpoint on the rules for the use of harmonized standards can be found at www.newapproach.org http://www.newapproach.org . Click on Concepts. According to the webmaster, The concepts text originates from the Commission, however I understand it is currently under revision and it is on the agenda for a meeting to be held next week. I expect the final official text to be on the site in the following week. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Re[2]: RTTE Directive
The final text of the directive can be found at http://www.ispo.cec.be/infosoc/telecompolicy/typeappr/proposed.htm http://www.ispo.cec.be/infosoc/telecompolicy/typeappr/proposed.htm -- From: ron_pick...@hypercom.com [SMTP:ron_pick...@hypercom.com] Sent: Thursday, March 18, 1999 11:10 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; jo...@exchange.scotland.ncr.com Subject: Re[2]: RTTE Directive Hi John et al, You email has raised some questions regarding this new directive. With the introduction of the RTTE directive (99/5/EC), how does it interplay with the TTE Satellite Earth Station Equipment directive (98/13/EC)? Are they exclusionary? Does one supercede the other? Can they both coexist? What is their relationship to each other? I, as well as others, would appreciate from someone intimate with both directives to answer these questions and provide us with some insight. Best regards, Ron Pickard ron_pick...@hypercom.com __ Reply Separator _ Subject: RE: RTTE Directive Author: Crabb John jo...@exchange.scotland.ncr.com at INTERNET Date:3/18/99 9:52 AM I received the following yesterday from one of my sources : Message from ETSI The much heralded RTTE Directive was adopted on the 9th March and is known as 99/5/EC. It is still to be published in the OJEC (approximately 4 to 6 weeks at the most). It comes fully into force on 10th March 2000 if the dates are constant. Claire d'Esclercs ETSI Standards Making Support Department Regards, John Crabb, Development Excellence (Product Safety) , NCR Financial Solutions Group Ltd., Kingsway West, Dundee, Scotland. DD2 3XX E-Mail :john.cr...@scotland.ncr.com Tel: +44 (0)1382-592289 (direct ). Fax +44 (0)1382-622243. VoicePlus 6-341-2289. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
AC Adapters
To all of you who market equipment worldwide using AC adapters: 1. Is it true that plug adapters similar to those used by tourist are not legal in most countries? 2. How many different adapters are required to be stocked to handle the various requirements for plugs and safety approvals? 3. Would you please identify them by the countries that use them? Or, is there a good on-line source for this information? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: US Argentina, EMC Safety Requiremnts
Ian, IRAM, the safety agency in Argentina will accept test reports based upon IEC standards from most any laboratory until 18 June 1999. After that date, you must obtain a Type Certificate from IRAM, and after 18 June 2000, marking is required. Under an MOU, IRAM will accept UL testing to IEC based standards as long as their national deviations are taken into consideration (230V and power cord). Also, until 18 June 2000, they will accept all UL Listed equipment if the national deviations have been considered. For additional information, contact Willie Janisch at UL - janis...@ul.com mailto:janis...@ul.com . -- From: Ian Ball [SMTP:ib...@ad-holdings.co.uk] Sent: Thursday, March 18, 1999 8:32 AM To: EMC and Safety NET Subject: US Argentina, EMC Safety Requiremnts Hi All, I have a client who wants to put a digital product, data loggers, into road passenger vehicles. This would be a stand alone unit with the driver having no access. I assume that CFR 47 pt 15 B and UL approval would be adequate for the US. If my assumption is correct will the Argentinean authorities also accept these results ? Many thanks for any input you can give Ian Ball Laboratory Manager AD Compliance Services UK - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Argentina's Resolution 92
UL has informed me that they have signed a MOU with IRAM. IRAM will accept test results from UL where UL has demonstrated experience with IEC standards, such as IEC 950. IRAM will even issue their mark based upon those tests. As an option for Phase II only, IRAM will accept products that bear the UL Listing Mark if the Argentine deviations have been taken into consideration during the evaluation (operating voltage and power cord, for example) For additional information contact Willie Janisch at janis...@ul.com mailto:janis...@ul.com . -- From: WOODS, RICHARD Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 1999 1:51 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: Argentina's Resolution 92 Per Resolution 92, Argentina was scheduled to require a Conformity-to-Type Certificate for electronic apparatus effective 18 June, 1999. The problem, of course, was that when the resolution was published they did not have the infrastructure nor MRAs in place to accomplish this task. Has anyone heard of any change in their capabilities to test, MRAs with other agencies, or a change in the date? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Invitation to EU workshop for all CABs (Washington, D.C., Apr il 2 7-29)
According to this site, the MRA process is being delayed. http://www.cix.co.uk/~approval/n2_0199.htm http://www.cix.co.uk/~approval/n2_0199.htm -- From: Leafloor, Bob: DSI [SMTP:leafloor@ic.gc.ca] Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 1999 8:11 AM To: t...@world.std.com Subject: RE: Invitation to EU workshop for all CABs (Washington, D.C., Apr il 2 7-29) For US registration contact: jogindar.dhil...@nist.gov -Original Message- From: Scott Lemon [mailto:lem...@nortelnetworks.com] Sent: March 15, 1999 12:08 PM To: t...@world.std.com Subject: RE: Invitation to EU workshop for all CABs (Washington, D.C., Apr il 2 7-29) Sounds interesting - anyone know where to go for more details on registration, etc. (not obvious where to look once you are on DoC web page)? Regards, Scott Lemon (esn 351-4487, 919-991-4487) Fax: (919) 991-8724 Network Dependability Nortel Networks RTP, NC -Original Message- From: Victor L. Boersma [SMTP:vboer...@compuserve.com] Sent: Saturday, March 13, 1999 12:01 PM To: TREG Subject: Invitation to EU workshop for all CABs (Washington, D.C., April 2 7-29) For those who prefer to stop guessing and would like to get some information from the horse's mouthes: There will be two consecutive workshops, to be held in Washington, D.C. on April 27-29, 1999. On Tuesday, April 27, representatives of the European Commission, and other European experts, will brief interested parties from both the United States and Canada on responsibilities under relevant European directives (98/13/EC and 89/336/EEC) and the respective Canadian and US MRAs with the EU. A draft agenda for this all-day workshop is enclosed. Attendees are advised to bring copies of the relevant EU directives and the EU MRA with them to the workshop. On Wednesday, April 28, the National Institute of Standards and Technology (NIST) invites interested parties, including Canadians, to attend a workshop to develop the following two sets of criteria, for implementation purposes: (1) criteria for a sub-program under the National Voluntary Conformity Assessment Systems Evaluation (NVCASE) Program to satisfy product testing, certification and quality systems requirements of the telecommunications equipment and EMC annexes of the US/EC MRA; (2) criteria for the qualification and operation of telecommunications certification bodies (TCBs) under the FCC Report and Order 98-338 of 17 December 1998. The Tuesday and Wednesday workshops will be held from 9:00 a.m. - 5:00 p.m. in the Department of Commerce Auditorium, at 14th Street and Constitution Ave., NW, Washington, D.C. (Note: there also is a workshop on Thursday, doing much the same thing for the Canada - Switzerland MRA, in the Canadian Embassy in Washington. Since the US has no MRA with Switzerland (yet) this may be of interest only to Canadians). You must pre-register to attend any of the workshops by providing the full names and affiliations of planned participants from your organization by April 16, so that appropriate arrangements can be made. Note: I don't know where US attendees must register. Check with DoC or NIST. EU Workshop for North American CABs A.M. Overview of Practical Implementation of the MRA Transition Period (EMC and telecom/radio): - Manufacturer Responsibilities - Role of CABs - Competent Bodies' Role (EMC) - Notified Bodies' Role - both EMC and TTE - Annexes I - IV of the TTE Directive (98/13/EC) - Exchange of Test Reports, Etc. during the Transition Period - Confidence Building P.M. Overview of the Proposed RTTE Directive: - Description of the provisions of the directive - Essential requirements - Role of voluntary standards; shift from CTRs to TBRs or other ETSI standards, etc. - Availability of network technical information - Role of notified bodies - Need for quality systems The week following, ICC has arranged for a seminar and workhops that will allow for further elaboration, including full discussion on the new RTTE Directive that will replace the TTE Directive covered under the MRAs. This will provide you with valuable insights into where
RTTE Directive
My source believes that the Radio and Telecommunications Terminal Equipment Directive will be published in the OJ in April and will take effect after one year. What do you hear? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: NRTL requirement in the NEC?
Jeff, if your rack assembly including the power supply is Listed, then the inspector has no authority to investigate the components included in that Listed assembly. On the other hand, if you added a power supply to a Listed rack, then that power supply must be Listed. -- From: JENKINS, JEFF [SMTP:jeff.jenk...@aei.com] Sent: Thursday, March 11, 1999 12:48 PM To: 'emc-pstc' Subject: NRTL requirement in the NEC? Hello Group, Has anyone heard of a requirement in the National Electrical Code that power supplies which are components of larger systems be approved by an NRTL? I have an inspector telling me this, but our copy of the NEC is 20 years old, and I can't find it, anyway. In this case, the power supply is part of a rack system. It was my understanding that the supply could be evaluated as a component of the system. Is that not true? Thanks, Jeff Jenkins Senior Regulatory Compliance Engineer Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. Fort Collins, CO USA 80525 Opinions are my own and not necessarily shared by Advanced Energy Industries, Inc. or its affiliates. - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions
That's what I love about this mailing list. I learn something new most every day. Thanks Tania! -- From: Grant, Tania (Tania) [SMTP:tgr...@lucent.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 1999 4:27 PM To: 'EMC-PSTC - forum'; 'WOODS, RICHARD' Subject: RE: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions Richard, Regarding your last statement I don't believe that they [CSA UL] will accept each others marks. Certain UL and CSA component standards have been harmonized and, I believe, this effort is continuing. If you look at Appendix P.2 [be sure it is P.2 and not P.1] of UL 1950, 3rd edition, you will find a matrix of UL and CSA component standards where meeting one or the other is considered acceptable for meeting the requirements of UL1950, 3rd edition. Additionally, if you are working with an astute UL engineer, very often they will inform you of additional components that fall under that category but have not yet been published in this Appendix. Tania Grant, Lucent Technologies, Octel Messaging Division tgr...@lucent.com -- From: WOODS, RICHARD[SMTP:wo...@sensormatic.com] Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 1999 5:00 AM To: 'EMC-PSTC - forum' Subject: RE: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions As I think about this situation, there is a way of obtaining UL Listing on the rack and have other certification marks on the internal equipment. Have UL List just the rack without the equipment. Now you can mix and match the internal certified equipment as you see fit keeping in mind not to exceed the cooling and electrical capacity of the rack. This is what we use to do a decade ago at a mini-computer company. We would configure systems from Listed racks, cpus, disks, tapes, etc. Now to Jim's point. There is no law that requires one agency to accept the certification marks of another agency. For example, UL will not accept ETL marks on components and both are NRTLS. The only way one agency will accept the marks of another is if there is an agreement between them. The CB scheme is one good example. CSA and UL have an agreement to accept each others test data I believe, but I don't believe that they will accept each others marks. -- From: Jim Eichner [SMTP:jeich...@statpower.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 1999 3:23 PM To: 'EMC-PSTC - forum' Subject: RE: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions Re Richard's item 5)... 5.UL requires that all internal equipment be UL Listed or Recognized. If that is true, then the value of the CSA/NRTL mark, and conversely the cUL mark if CSA plays this way too, is highly questionable. Do you have a direct-from-UL interpretation saying that they are not accepting the CSA/NRTL mark? If so, I would expect CSA to take action to defend its mark, and UL to have no firm ground to stand on! Comments? Jim Eichner Statpower Technologies Corporation jeich...@statpower.com http://www.statpower.com Any opinions expressed are those of my invisible friend, who really exists. Honest. -Original Message- From: WOODS, RICHARD [SMTP:wo...@sensormatic.com] Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 1999 11:15 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; t...@world.std.com Subject: RE: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions 1.Peter, equipment with the standard NEMA plug is considered to be Class A.. 2.Equipment using the heavy duty Industrial plugs complying with IEC are considered to be Class B. I have never seen those used inside rack mounted equipment. 3.If the power supply is UL Listed, then temperature measurements are not required. However, most power supplies are categorized as Recognized and are therefore incomplete in construction - that is, they cannot pass the safety requirements for a stand alone power supply. Temperature measurements will be required. 4.Stability is performed in a worst case situation, but reason is also taken
RE: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions
1. Peter, equipment with the standard NEMA plug is considered to be Class A.. 2. Equipment using the heavy duty Industrial plugs complying with IEC are considered to be Class B. I have never seen those used inside rack mounted equipment. 3. If the power supply is UL Listed, then temperature measurements are not required. However, most power supplies are categorized as Recognized and are therefore incomplete in construction - that is, they cannot pass the safety requirements for a stand alone power supply. Temperature measurements will be required. 4. Stability is performed in a worst case situation, but reason is also taken into account. Most likely, you will determine that it is possible and reasonable to assume that more than one assembly can be extending at the same time. 5. UL requires that all internal equipment be UL Listed or Recognized. --- From: pe...@itl.co.il [SMTP:pe...@itl.co.il] Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 1999 11:26 AM To: emc-p...@majordomo.ieee.org; t...@world.std.com Subject: Rack System Safety (UL1950/EN 60950) Questions Dear All, I would like to know some of your professional advice on some issues reagrding rack systems to be evaluated to UL1950/EN 60 950. 1. For the North America, does a NEMA 125 V, 20 A plug meet the pluggable B definition? 2. What are some plug configurations which will meet the pluggable B equipment requirements for North America and Europe? 3. Does anyone have experience with UL and/or CSA and/or TUV when testing a unit employing a Recognized/Certified/Approved computer type totally enclosed power supply? I am interested to know if temperatures should be monitored within such a power supply. So far, I have been asked to thermocouple various points within the power supply and as you all know, it could get very crowded in there. I am interested to know if someone out there knows if such a waiver exists for totally enclosed Approved power supplies. 4. When conducting stability tests for rack systems, should all the serviceable card cages be extended out or is it enough to do it one at a time. 5. For a CSA NRTLC unit employed in the rack system, does anyone know if the CSA NRTLC Mark is automatically accepted by UL or does UL require that the unit must be re-investigated and placed under their Follow-Up Program? 6. Has the US Robotics Listed Sporster card modem been evaluated to UL1950 Third Edition? 7. Can I List/Certify a rack system to UL1950 Third Edition if the units within it have been Listed/Certified to UL1950 First and/or Second Editions? I do not think so, but am interested to hear your opinions. 8. How is a CB test report done for a rack system which consists of previously Listed/Certified/Approved units? Does the CB scheme Recognize the Approvals of the various test agencies (UL/CSA/TUV)? Thanks in advance. PETER S. MERGUERIAN MANAGING DIRECTOR PRODUCT TESTING DIVISION I.T.L. (PRODUCT TESTING) LTD. HACHAROSHET 26, P.O.B. 211 OR YEHUDA 60251, ISRAEL TEL: 972-3-5339022 FAX: 972-3-5339019 E-MAIL: pe...@itl.co.il Visit our Website: http://www.itl.co.il - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
Argentina's Resolution 92
Per Resolution 92, Argentina was scheduled to require a Conformity-to-Type Certificate for electronic apparatus effective 18 June, 1999. The problem, of course, was that when the resolution was published they did not have the infrastructure nor MRAs in place to accomplish this task. Has anyone heard of any change in their capabilities to test, MRAs with other agencies, or a change in the date? - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
RE: Saudi Arabia
My experience is about 5 years old. At that time, all you had to do was sign a Saudi supplied declaration form that the equipment complied with a national (e.g., UL) or international safety standard (IEC or EN). - This message is coming from the emc-pstc discussion list. To cancel your subscription, send mail to majord...@ieee.org with the single line: unsubscribe emc-pstc (without the quotes). For help, send mail to ed.pr...@cubic.com, j...@gwmail.monarch.com, ri...@sdd.hp.com, or roger.volgst...@compaq.com (the list administrators).
