Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 28 January 2021 16:05:05 John Dammeyer wrote:

> Hi Gene,
> I understand that.  But I also know I bought the expensive and
> theoretically high quality US Digital encoders 10 years ago for my DC
> servos.  Ultimately they were way to sensitive to noise and in fact US
> Digital discontinued that line for that reason.  So I have two useless
> encoders.  I replaced them with CUI and they work better.
>
> My point is what you see on EBAY and AliExpress are not all created
> equal.  The US Digital encoders appeared to work but eventually the
> UHU Servo drive reported a difference in counts and a move to home was
> off by a number of encoder edges.  Enough to count to a few thousands
> of an inch.
>
> The UHU CPU replacement from Sweden (Henrik Olsson) was a dsPIC and
> had better encoder support.  Even then it still had problems with the
> US Digital.  Not with the CUI.
>
> What I'm saying is that when you order an AC servo c/w drive you may
> find that because they had the lowest price it was low because they
> used the cheapest encoder.  Or maybe the cable they supplied was lower
> quality.  Whether the product is from China, Japan, USA or Germany for
> example, lower price doesn't equate to the same quality as higher
> price.
>
> The best example so far for me was the stepperonline.com 6A driver
> that had a 3.6kHz whine on two different stepper motors.  Loud enough
> to be a pain in the ear and cost with PRIME shipping from Amazon was
> $80 Cdn.  A unit from Bergerda with the same specifications and close
> to the same look ended up with FedEx and Canadian taxes to be $82
> each. (I bought 2 for the two motors I had here). No whine.  Ribs on
> the heatsink were twice as high.  A few extra features and a metal
> cover rather than plastic which might even help with electrical noise
> suppression.  And a different size connector for the control signals
> verses motor/power so no chance of accidentally plugging in the wrong
> one.
>
> So though a lot of units look the same, unless you are buying a STMBL
> with full source code and schematics and have control over everything
> including the encoder on the motor the lowest cost unit isn't always
> the best.
>
> I'd still rather buy a MESA board than some cheap clone from China for
> example.  Or if I needed something Jon Elson sold I'd buy from him
> rather than lowest cost from China.

I hear that. Loud and clear although I can sometimes argue a bit. For 
starters both are right here and answers to any problems with their 
stuff are generally same day answers.  You, I, nor Mastercard, simply 
cannot put a price on that.

> John Dammeyer.
>
> > -----Original Message-
> > From: Gene Heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> > Sent: January-28-21 12:31 PM
> > To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?
> >
> > On Thursday 28 January 2021 12:09:00 John Dammeyer wrote:
> > > Just be careful and ask the supplier what type of encoder is
> > > mounted on the servo.  There are encoders and there are encoders.
> > > My http://en.bergerda.com/ servos use a Japanese brand which they
> > > claim are better than some of the Chinese ones out there but are
> > > also considerably more expensive.   Differential output from the
> > > encoder is a must have to reduce the effects of electrical noise.
> > >
> > > John
> >
> > True, but Omron makes differential encoders with up to 1024 ppr, for
> > a $21 price on ebay.
> >
> > I have one with 1000 ppr on the rear of my GO704's spindle motor,
> > turning faster by 3 or 4x than its rated for, currently driven by a
> > piece of heat shrink tubing as the elastomer coupling has gone away
> > two years ago.
> >
> > The diff signals are made single ended to drive a 5i25's inputs by a
> > pair of rs-485 to ttl boards at nominally $2 each on ebay. I had to
> > program them for 1 way traffic though. So my spindle scale is a bit
> > over 7,000 in high gear, and a bit over 14,000 in low, and I can use
> > PID_S.Pgains of 20 or more.
> >
> > To say my speed control is stiff is the understatement of the month,
> > I only know the spindle load is high by the chirping iron in the
> > motor at around 1.8x its nameplate 9.7 amps courtesy one of Jon's
> > pwm-servo's set for around 17 amps. Up to that point, no change in
> > the machines noise as a tap digs in.
> >
> > I get my spindles index from a screw silly glued to the side of the
> > drawbar retaining cap by way of an ATS-667 watching it go by.
> >
> > > > -Original Message-
> 

Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[John Dammeyer]

Hi Gene,
I understand that.  But I also know I bought the expensive and theoretically 
high quality US Digital encoders 10 years ago for my DC servos.  Ultimately 
they were way to sensitive to noise and in fact US Digital discontinued that 
line for that reason.  So I have two useless encoders.  I replaced them with 
CUI and they work better.

My point is what you see on EBAY and AliExpress are not all created equal.  The 
US Digital encoders appeared to work but eventually the UHU Servo drive 
reported a difference in counts and a move to home was off by a number of 
encoder edges.  Enough to count to a few thousands of an inch.

The UHU CPU replacement from Sweden (Henrik Olsson) was a dsPIC and had better 
encoder support.  Even then it still had problems with the US Digital.  Not 
with the CUI.

What I'm saying is that when you order an AC servo c/w drive you may find that 
because they had the lowest price it was low because they used the cheapest 
encoder.  Or maybe the cable they supplied was lower quality.  Whether the 
product is from China, Japan, USA or Germany for example, lower price doesn't 
equate to the same quality as higher price.  

The best example so far for me was the stepperonline.com 6A driver that had a 
3.6kHz whine on two different stepper motors.  Loud enough to be a pain in the 
ear and cost with PRIME shipping from Amazon was $80 Cdn.  A unit from Bergerda 
with the same specifications and close to the same look ended up with FedEx and 
Canadian taxes to be $82 each. (I bought 2 for the two motors I had here).  
No whine.  Ribs on the heatsink were twice as high.  A few extra features and a 
metal cover rather than plastic which might even help with electrical noise 
suppression.  And a different size connector for the control signals verses 
motor/power so no chance of accidentally plugging in the wrong one.

So though a lot of units look the same, unless you are buying a STMBL with full 
source code and schematics and have control over everything including the 
encoder on the motor the lowest cost unit isn't always the best.

I'd still rather buy a MESA board than some cheap clone from China for example. 
 Or if I needed something Jon Elson sold I'd buy from him rather than lowest 
cost from China.

John Dammeyer.

> -Original Message-
> From: Gene Heskett [mailto:ghesk...@shentel.net]
> Sent: January-28-21 12:31 PM
> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?
> 
> On Thursday 28 January 2021 12:09:00 John Dammeyer wrote:
> 
> > Just be careful and ask the supplier what type of encoder is mounted
> > on the servo.  There are encoders and there are encoders. My
> > http://en.bergerda.com/ servos use a Japanese brand which they claim
> > are better than some of the Chinese ones out there but are also
> > considerably more expensive.   Differential output from the encoder is
> > a must have to reduce the effects of electrical noise.
> >
> > John
> 
> True, but Omron makes differential encoders with up to 1024 ppr, for a
> $21 price on ebay.
> 
> I have one with 1000 ppr on the rear of my GO704's spindle motor, turning
> faster by 3 or 4x than its rated for, currently driven by a piece of
> heat shrink tubing as the elastomer coupling has gone away two years
> ago.
> 
> The diff signals are made single ended to drive a 5i25's inputs by a pair
> of rs-485 to ttl boards at nominally $2 each on ebay. I had to program
> them for 1 way traffic though. So my spindle scale is a bit over 7,000
> in high gear, and a bit over 14,000 in low, and I can use PID_S.Pgains
> of 20 or more.
> 
> To say my speed control is stiff is the understatement of the month, I
> only know the spindle load is high by the chirping iron in the motor at
> around 1.8x its nameplate 9.7 amps courtesy one of Jon's pwm-servo's set
> for around 17 amps. Up to that point, no change in the machines noise as
> a tap digs in.
> 
> I get my spindles index from a screw silly glued to the side of the
> drawbar retaining cap by way of an ATS-667 watching it go by.
> 
> >
> > > -Original Message-
> > > From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> > > Sent: January-28-21 1:14 AM
> > > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?
> > >
> > > You can buy Chinese yaskawa copy ac servo drives 2.4kw for like
> > > 260usd.  So it's just not worth it now.  I just sold my fanic drives
> > > in the end.  Its so nice to just bolt on some matched servo drives
> > > that just work out of the box.
> > >
> > > On Thu, 28 Jan 2021, 14:20 Jon Elson,  wrote:
> > > > On 01/27/2021 11:35 AM, Todd Zuercher wrote:
> > > &g

Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 28 January 2021 12:09:00 John Dammeyer wrote:

> Just be careful and ask the supplier what type of encoder is mounted
> on the servo.  There are encoders and there are encoders. My
> http://en.bergerda.com/ servos use a Japanese brand which they claim
> are better than some of the Chinese ones out there but are also
> considerably more expensive.   Differential output from the encoder is
> a must have to reduce the effects of electrical noise.
>
> John

True, but Omron makes differential encoders with up to 1024 ppr, for a 
$21 price on ebay. 

I have one with 1000 ppr on the rear of my GO704's spindle motor, turning 
faster by 3 or 4x than its rated for, currently driven by a piece of 
heat shrink tubing as the elastomer coupling has gone away two years 
ago.

The diff signals are made single ended to drive a 5i25's inputs by a pair 
of rs-485 to ttl boards at nominally $2 each on ebay. I had to program 
them for 1 way traffic though. So my spindle scale is a bit over 7,000 
in high gear, and a bit over 14,000 in low, and I can use PID_S.Pgains 
of 20 or more. 

To say my speed control is stiff is the understatement of the month, I 
only know the spindle load is high by the chirping iron in the motor at 
around 1.8x its nameplate 9.7 amps courtesy one of Jon's pwm-servo's set 
for around 17 amps. Up to that point, no change in the machines noise as 
a tap digs in.

I get my spindles index from a screw silly glued to the side of the 
drawbar retaining cap by way of an ATS-667 watching it go by.

>
> > -Original Message-
> > From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> > Sent: January-28-21 1:14 AM
> > To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> > Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?
> >
> > You can buy Chinese yaskawa copy ac servo drives 2.4kw for like
> > 260usd.  So it's just not worth it now.  I just sold my fanic drives
> > in the end.  Its so nice to just bolt on some matched servo drives
> > that just work out of the box.
> >
> > On Thu, 28 Jan 2021, 14:20 Jon Elson,  wrote:
> > > On 01/27/2021 11:35 AM, Todd Zuercher wrote:
> > > > How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?  My
> > > > understanding
> > >
> > > is that it is very involved to try to force them to work with
> > > anything other than a Fanuc control
> > > I make converters for the two most common types of Fanuc
> > > encoders used on brushless motors.
> > > I also make a digital servo amp for them that can be used
> > > with my PWM controller.
> > > The older "red cap" motors had encoders with standard
> > > quadrature plus index output, but the commutation signal was
> > > proprietary.  I have a board that converts the commutation
> > > to industry-compatible "Hall" signals.
> > >
> > > The newer type is serial, but my converter produces
> > > industry-compatible quadrature plus index, plus the "Hall"
> > > signals. Note there are absolute and incremental versions of
> > > these encoders.
> > > The problem with the incremental versions, like (alpha)I64,
> > > is that they are lost when power is applied, so they need
> > > you to crank the motor past the index location by hand after
> > > every power on, before commutation is available.  So, these
> > > encoders need power-off brakes and battery backup if the
> > > control is ever turned off.
> > > The absolute version have additional low-res data tracks
> > > that allow the encoder to know the angle immediately at
> > > power-on, so no battery is needed to have commutation
> > > immediately on power on.
> > >
> > > Now, the Fanuc servo amps are more difficult, as about 1984
> > > they stopped releasing any documentation on their
> > > electronics.  So, it is essentially impossible to find any
> > > schematics or connection info for their amps.  Most of the
> > > brushless amps take SIX PWM signals per axis, so
> > > the controller sends separate PWM to EACH transistor.  This
> > > moves all the smarts to the controller, but it complicates
> > > things a bit.
> > >
> > > Jon
> > >
> > >
> > > ___
> > > Emc-users mailing list
> > > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>
&

Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[John Dammeyer]

Just be careful and ask the supplier what type of encoder is mounted on the 
servo.  There are encoders and there are encoders. My http://en.bergerda.com/ 
servos use a Japanese brand which they claim are better than some of the 
Chinese ones out there but are also considerably more expensive.   Differential 
output from the encoder is a must have to reduce the effects of electrical 
noise.

John

> -Original Message-
> From: andrew beck [mailto:andrewbeck0...@gmail.com]
> Sent: January-28-21 1:14 AM
> To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?
> 
> You can buy Chinese yaskawa copy ac servo drives 2.4kw for like 260usd.  So
> it's just not worth it now.  I just sold my fanic drives in the end.  Its
> so nice to just bolt on some matched servo drives that just work out of the
> box.
> 
> On Thu, 28 Jan 2021, 14:20 Jon Elson,  wrote:
> 
> > On 01/27/2021 11:35 AM, Todd Zuercher wrote:
> > > How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?  My understanding
> > is that it is very involved to try to force them to work with anything
> > other than a Fanuc control
> > I make converters for the two most common types of Fanuc
> > encoders used on brushless motors.
> > I also make a digital servo amp for them that can be used
> > with my PWM controller.
> > The older "red cap" motors had encoders with standard
> > quadrature plus index output, but the commutation signal was
> > proprietary.  I have a board that converts the commutation
> > to industry-compatible "Hall" signals.
> >
> > The newer type is serial, but my converter produces
> > industry-compatible quadrature plus index, plus the "Hall"
> > signals. Note there are absolute and incremental versions of
> > these encoders.
> > The problem with the incremental versions, like (alpha)I64,
> > is that they are lost when power is applied, so they need
> > you to crank the motor past the index location by hand after
> > every power on, before commutation is available.  So, these
> > encoders need power-off brakes and battery backup if the
> > control is ever turned off.
> > The absolute version have additional low-res data tracks
> > that allow the encoder to know the angle immediately at
> > power-on, so no battery is needed to have commutation
> > immediately on power on.
> >
> > Now, the Fanuc servo amps are more difficult, as about 1984
> > they stopped releasing any documentation on their
> > electronics.  So, it is essentially impossible to find any
> > schematics or connection info for their amps.  Most of the
> > brushless amps take SIX PWM signals per axis, so
> > the controller sends separate PWM to EACH transistor.  This
> > moves all the smarts to the controller, but it complicates
> > things a bit.
> >
> > Jon
> >
> >
> > ___
> > Emc-users mailing list
> > Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> > https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >
> 
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users



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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[Gene Heskett]

On Thursday 28 January 2021 04:13:39 andrew beck wrote:

> Chinese yaskawa copy ac servo drives 2.4kw

URL?

Thanks Andrew

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty:
 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
If we desire respect for the law, we must first make the law respectable.
 - Louis D. Brandeis
Genes Web page 


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[andrew beck]

You can buy Chinese yaskawa copy ac servo drives 2.4kw for like 260usd.  So
it's just not worth it now.  I just sold my fanic drives in the end.  Its
so nice to just bolt on some matched servo drives that just work out of the
box.

On Thu, 28 Jan 2021, 14:20 Jon Elson,  wrote:

> On 01/27/2021 11:35 AM, Todd Zuercher wrote:
> > How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?  My understanding
> is that it is very involved to try to force them to work with anything
> other than a Fanuc control
> I make converters for the two most common types of Fanuc
> encoders used on brushless motors.
> I also make a digital servo amp for them that can be used
> with my PWM controller.
> The older "red cap" motors had encoders with standard
> quadrature plus index output, but the commutation signal was
> proprietary.  I have a board that converts the commutation
> to industry-compatible "Hall" signals.
>
> The newer type is serial, but my converter produces
> industry-compatible quadrature plus index, plus the "Hall"
> signals. Note there are absolute and incremental versions of
> these encoders.
> The problem with the incremental versions, like (alpha)I64,
> is that they are lost when power is applied, so they need
> you to crank the motor past the index location by hand after
> every power on, before commutation is available.  So, these
> encoders need power-off brakes and battery backup if the
> control is ever turned off.
> The absolute version have additional low-res data tracks
> that allow the encoder to know the angle immediately at
> power-on, so no battery is needed to have commutation
> immediately on power on.
>
> Now, the Fanuc servo amps are more difficult, as about 1984
> they stopped releasing any documentation on their
> electronics.  So, it is essentially impossible to find any
> schematics or connection info for their amps.  Most of the
> brushless amps take SIX PWM signals per axis, so
> the controller sends separate PWM to EACH transistor.  This
> moves all the smarts to the controller, but it complicates
> things a bit.
>
> Jon
>
>
> ___
> Emc-users mailing list
> Emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[Jon Elson]

On 01/27/2021 11:35 AM, Todd Zuercher wrote:

How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?  My understanding is 
that it is very involved to try to force them to work with anything other than 
a Fanuc control
I make converters for the two most common types of Fanuc 
encoders used on brushless motors.
I also make a digital servo amp for them that can be used 
with my PWM controller.
The older "red cap" motors had encoders with standard 
quadrature plus index output, but the commutation signal was 
proprietary.  I have a board that converts the commutation 
to industry-compatible "Hall" signals.


The newer type is serial, but my converter produces 
industry-compatible quadrature plus index, plus the "Hall" 
signals. Note there are absolute and incremental versions of 
these encoders.
The problem with the incremental versions, like (alpha)I64, 
is that they are lost when power is applied, so they need 
you to crank the motor past the index location by hand after 
every power on, before commutation is available.  So, these 
encoders need power-off brakes and battery backup if the 
control is ever turned off.
The absolute version have additional low-res data tracks 
that allow the encoder to know the angle immediately at 
power-on, so no battery is needed to have commutation 
immediately on power on.


Now, the Fanuc servo amps are more difficult, as about 1984 
they stopped releasing any documentation on their 
electronics.  So, it is essentially impossible to find any 
schematics or connection info for their amps.  Most of the 
brushless amps take SIX PWM signals per axis, so
the controller sends separate PWM to EACH transistor.  This 
moves all the smarts to the controller, but it complicates 
things a bit.


Jon


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[Todd Zuercher]

Yes, it is possible to read the encoders of of some red caps with Linuxcnc.  
But not all red caps are the same, other than they are all 3 phase motors, 
(synchronous or asynchronous).  Some have incremental encoders or some are 
serial and I'm pretty sure there are multiple kinds of serial encoders.

But what about the amps?  All the ones I've worked with (from about 2002+) were 
connected to the Fanuc control via an optical serial bus.  Are these all 
hopeless?  On the surface they don't look to be any more help than an STMBL 
drive made from unobtanium.

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street 
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031

-Original Message-
From: andy pugh  
Sent: Wednesday, January 27, 2021 3:33 PM
To: Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC) 
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 at 18:11, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
>
> How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?

The red-caps are pretty easy, I think. The 4-line commutation signal is handled 
by a Pico hardware interface, or can be handled in software (the blcd 
component) and converted to standard Hall or position.
Though possibly not as fast as you need for all applications.

I think that the STMBL supports both red-cap and yellow-cap, but there is the 
usual problem with STMBL, availability.

--
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is designed for 
the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[andy pugh]

On Wed, 27 Jan 2021 at 18:11, Todd Zuercher  wrote:
>
> How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?

The red-caps are pretty easy, I think. The 4-line commutation signal
is handled by a Pico hardware interface, or can be handled in software
(the blcd component) and converted to standard Hall or position.
Though possibly not as fast as you need for all applications.

I think that the STMBL supports both red-cap and yellow-cap, but there
is the usual problem with STMBL, availability.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1912


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[Emc-users] Fanuc Servos?

[Todd Zuercher]

How useable are Fanuc's servos and amps with Linuxcnc?  My understanding is 
that it is very involved to try to force them to work with anything other than 
a Fanuc control, if it is even possible.  With the newer it is the worse it 
gets.  What is the current lowdown on this exactly, approximately what age or 
amp models are impossible.  For the ones that are possible, how workable are 
they really.  I've seen some theoretical discussions, of how some of them might 
be controlled, but no real proof of how well it actually works in practice.

Or are we still at the point on a 20 year old machine we want to refit for use 
in a production factory setting, where we are best off stripping every thing 
with a Fanuc label off, reselling what we can on ebay, and buying something 
more generic to replace it with (or sticking with Fanuc)?

Todd Zuercher
P. Graham Dunn Inc.
630 Henry Street
Dalton, Ohio 44618
Phone:  (330)828-2105ext. 2031


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Klemen Živkovič]

Yes I see they offer:
http://www.antekinc.com/ps-8n80-800w-80v-power-supply/
but for me to import from USA is nearly the same as importing from CHINA.

Do they have european division?

On Thu, Dec 22, 2016 at 2:39 PM, Dave Cole  wrote:

> Did you see these?
> http://www.antekinc.com/
> They used to sell on Ebay as well.
>
> Dave
>
> On 12/22/2016 4:06 AM, Klemen Živkovič wrote:
> > just bought this one:
> >
> > http://m.ebay.com/itm/182385306454?_mwBanner=1
> >
> > I hate buying from china because of customs, duties and transport effect
> on
> > greenhouse gasses, but I couldnt find anything similar with producers
> like
> > meanwell - anybody knows why they dont have 80V 10A in theirs offer?
> > I think this characteristics are not so exotic right?
> >
> > Regards
> >
> > On 22 Dec 2016 12:44 a.m., "andy pugh"  wrote:
> >
> >> On 21 December 2016 at 23:05, Klemen Živkovič <
> klemen.zivko...@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> But seems to me I need additional components like gretz and capacitors.
> >> All you need is a big capacitor and bridge rectifier. I have done a
> >> few power supplies now.
> >>
> >> The current one on the lathe is a bit cleverer, I have a soft-start
> >> and power-off discharge resistor set up. I actually run the
> >> interlocking and startup sequence from HAL.
> >>
> >> --
> >> atp
> >> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> >> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> >> lunatics."
> >> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
> >>
> >> 
> >> --
> >> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
> >> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
> >> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
> >> Training and support from Colfax.
> >> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/intel
> >> ___
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> >> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
> >>
> > 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Dave Cole]

Did you see these?
http://www.antekinc.com/
They used to sell on Ebay as well.

Dave

On 12/22/2016 4:06 AM, Klemen Živkovič wrote:
> just bought this one:
>
> http://m.ebay.com/itm/182385306454?_mwBanner=1
>
> I hate buying from china because of customs, duties and transport effect on
> greenhouse gasses, but I couldnt find anything similar with producers like
> meanwell - anybody knows why they dont have 80V 10A in theirs offer?
> I think this characteristics are not so exotic right?
>
> Regards
>
> On 22 Dec 2016 12:44 a.m., "andy pugh"  wrote:
>
>> On 21 December 2016 at 23:05, Klemen Živkovič 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> But seems to me I need additional components like gretz and capacitors.
>> All you need is a big capacitor and bridge rectifier. I have done a
>> few power supplies now.
>>
>> The current one on the lathe is a bit cleverer, I have a soft-start
>> and power-off discharge resistor set up. I actually run the
>> interlocking and startup sequence from HAL.
>>
>> --
>> atp
>> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
>> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
>> lunatics."
>> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>>
>> 
>> --
>> Developer Access Program for Intel Xeon Phi Processors
>> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
>> With one year of Intel Parallel Studio XE.
>> Training and support from Colfax.
>> Order your platform today.http://sdm.link/intel
>> ___
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>> https://lists.sourceforge.net/lists/listinfo/emc-users
>>
> --
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Klemen Živkovič]

just bought this one:

http://m.ebay.com/itm/182385306454?_mwBanner=1

I hate buying from china because of customs, duties and transport effect on
greenhouse gasses, but I couldnt find anything similar with producers like
meanwell - anybody knows why they dont have 80V 10A in theirs offer?
I think this characteristics are not so exotic right?

Regards

On 22 Dec 2016 12:44 a.m., "andy pugh"  wrote:

> On 21 December 2016 at 23:05, Klemen Živkovič 
> wrote:
>
> > But seems to me I need additional components like gretz and capacitors.
>
> All you need is a big capacitor and bridge rectifier. I have done a
> few power supplies now.
>
> The current one on the lathe is a bit cleverer, I have a soft-start
> and power-off discharge resistor set up. I actually run the
> interlocking and startup sequence from HAL.
>
> --
> atp
> "A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
> designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
> lunatics."
> — George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916
>
> 
> --
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> Access to Intel Xeon Phi processor-based developer platforms.
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>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[andy pugh]

On 21 December 2016 at 23:05, Klemen Živkovič  wrote:

> But seems to me I need additional components like gretz and capacitors.

All you need is a big capacitor and bridge rectifier. I have done a
few power supplies now.

The current one on the lathe is a bit cleverer, I have a soft-start
and power-off discharge resistor set up. I actually run the
interlocking and startup sequence from HAL.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 21 December 2016 18:05:03 Klemen Živkovič wrote:

> Find one on ebay:
>
> http://m.ebay.com/itm/AC12V80VA-Power-Transformer-12V80VA-isolation-to
>roidal-transformer-Audio-sound-/182389553479?nav=SEARCH&varId=484960086
>380
>
Thats a monstrous price for that rating. You ought to, with carefull 
shopping, be able get something with the full rating you need, and get 
it in a universal voltage range input (90-250vac) for around a hundred 
USD, and a total weight of half a pound because its a switch mode 
supply.

> But seems to me I need additional components like gretz and
> capacitors. I belive it is challange on its own to build such DC power
> supply. Any good sources for diy dc ps?

Not many remain, highly efficient (85% or higher, often 90+%) switchers 
have largely replaced the old iron monsters that ran hotter than needed 
to keep your coffee warm, analog transformer power supplies.  They may 
not last 40 years, tired capacitors the usual failure trigger, but if 
you replace the caps at 4-6 year intervals, you've saved at least the 
cost of the caps over that time frame in electricity not converted to 
wasted heat.
>
> On 20 Dec 2016 5:35 p.m., "Jon Elson"  wrote:
>
> On 12/20/2016 04:15 AM, Klemen Živkovič wrote:
> > Maybe not related to this but am I seeing correctly that you are
> > using
>
> 126V
>
> > 6A DC current? I am looking for 220V AC to 80V 8A DC transformer.
> > Where
>
> can
>
> > I buy it?
>
> At least, in the US, there are things called "step down
> transformers" to give lower voltage single-phase power to
> the control equipment on larger machines. Typically, in the
> US, these have 480/240 V primary windings and 240/120 V
> secondary windings, selectable by moving some straps. By
> setting the straps right, you can get rated current at half
> voltage (and half power), so you can get 60 V AC (instead of
> 120 VAC). 60 V AC X 1.414 will give about 84 V DC. These
> transformers are often found at scrap yards for the scrap
> price. Likely, you can find similar units wherever you are.
>
> Jon
>
> 
> --
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Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Klemen Živkovič]

Find one on ebay:

http://m.ebay.com/itm/AC12V80VA-Power-Transformer-12V80VA-isolation-toroidal-transformer-Audio-sound-/182389553479?nav=SEARCH&varId=484960086380

But seems to me I need additional components like gretz and capacitors.
I belive it is challange on its own to build such DC power supply.
Any good sources for diy dc ps?

On 20 Dec 2016 5:35 p.m., "Jon Elson"  wrote:

On 12/20/2016 04:15 AM, Klemen Živkovič wrote:
> Maybe not related to this but am I seeing correctly that you are using
126V
> 6A DC current? I am looking for 220V AC to 80V 8A DC transformer. Where
can
> I buy it?
>
>
At least, in the US, there are things called "step down
transformers" to give lower voltage single-phase power to
the control equipment on larger machines. Typically, in the
US, these have 480/240 V primary windings and 240/120 V
secondary windings, selectable by moving some straps. By
setting the straps right, you can get rated current at half
voltage (and half power), so you can get 60 V AC (instead of
120 VAC). 60 V AC X 1.414 will give about 84 V DC. These
transformers are often found at scrap yards for the scrap
price. Likely, you can find similar units wherever you are.

Jon


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Jon Elson]

On 12/20/2016 04:15 AM, Klemen Živkovič wrote:
> Maybe not related to this but am I seeing correctly that you are using 126V
> 6A DC current? I am looking for 220V AC to 80V 8A DC transformer. Where can
> I buy it?
>
>
>   The motor "TYPE" is A06B-0134-B002, and "NO." is G-846379.  126 V, 8
> poles, 5.8A at stall.
>
That refers to a Fanuc brushless motor, and is the 
continuous rating of one motor. This refers to the output 
from the servo amplifier. A 3-axis machine would require 
more current than that, at least for peak load.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Jon Elson]

On 12/20/2016 04:15 AM, Klemen Živkovič wrote:
> Maybe not related to this but am I seeing correctly that you are using 126V
> 6A DC current? I am looking for 220V AC to 80V 8A DC transformer. Where can
> I buy it?
>
>
At least, in the US, there are things called "step down 
transformers" to give lower voltage single-phase power to 
the control equipment on larger machines. Typically, in the 
US, these have 480/240 V primary windings and 240/120 V 
secondary windings, selectable by moving some straps. By 
setting the straps right, you can get rated current at half 
voltage (and half power), so you can get 60 V AC (instead of 
120 VAC). 60 V AC X 1.414 will give about 84 V DC. These 
transformers are often found at scrap yards for the scrap 
price. Likely, you can find similar units wherever you are.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Klemen Živkovič]

Maybe not related to this but am I seeing correctly that you are using 126V
6A DC current? I am looking for 220V AC to 80V 8A DC transformer. Where can
I buy it?

Regards

On 20 Dec 2016 4:15 a.m., "Jon Elson"  wrote:

On 12/19/2016 01:35 PM, Steve from Tube Gauge wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Dec 2016 15:56:13 -0600 Jon Elson wrote:
>
> "Depending on the size of the motors, it may be possible to
> run the machine with the Pico Systems brushless PWM servo
> amp, it is good for up to 20 A peak. If you have the model
> of the motor, I can look that up."
>
>  The motor "TYPE" is A06B-0134-B002, and "NO." is G-846379.  126 V, 8
poles, 5.8A at stall.
>
Ah ha!  Then, I think our brushless PWM servo amp might
work! 20/5.8 = 3.45 times the stall rating is just about
right.  I tried looking this motor up and was not able to
find any info on it.  But, the 126 V 5.8A stall is pretty
much all I need.  Can you see a label on the encoders?  I
have converters that handle most of the Fanuc encoders, but
there are a few that my converters will not talk to.

So, if this all is compatible, the setup would be a
Universal PWM controller (for up to 4 axes), plus one Fanuc
encoder converter and one brushless PWM servo amp per axis.

Jon


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Jon Elson]

On 12/19/2016 01:35 PM, Steve from Tube Gauge wrote:
> On Sat, 17 Dec 2016 15:56:13 -0600 Jon Elson wrote:
>   
> "Depending on the size of the motors, it may be possible to
> run the machine with the Pico Systems brushless PWM servo
> amp, it is good for up to 20 A peak. If you have the model
> of the motor, I can look that up."
>   
>  The motor "TYPE" is A06B-0134-B002, and "NO." is G-846379.  126 V, 8 
> poles, 5.8A at stall.
>   
Ah ha!  Then, I think our brushless PWM servo amp might 
work! 20/5.8 = 3.45 times the stall rating is just about 
right.  I tried looking this motor up and was not able to 
find any info on it.  But, the 126 V 5.8A stall is pretty 
much all I need.  Can you see a label on the encoders?  I 
have converters that handle most of the Fanuc encoders, but 
there are a few that my converters will not talk to.

So, if this all is compatible, the setup would be a 
Universal PWM controller (for up to 4 axes), plus one Fanuc 
encoder converter and one brushless PWM servo amp per axis.

Jon

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[Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Steve from Tube Gauge]

On Sat, 17 Dec 2016 15:56:13 -0600 Jon Elson wrote:
 
"Depending on the size of the motors, it may be possible to 
run the machine with the Pico Systems brushless PWM servo 
amp, it is good for up to 20 A peak. If you have the model 
of the motor, I can look that up."
 
    The motor "TYPE" is A06B-0134-B002, and "NO." is G-846379.  126 V, 8 poles, 
5.8A at stall. 
 
"Another option is to use AMC servo amps with our PPMC analog 
interface system."
 
  Can you elaborate on the above?  
 
Thanks
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[andy pugh]

On 19 December 2016 at 15:49, Gene Heskett  wrote:
>
> Worthless as a spindle control if there are v belts between the motor and
> the encoder.

Yes, It is for commutating motors, nothing more and nothing less.

-- 
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designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Gene Heskett]

On Monday 19 December 2016 04:33:49 andy pugh wrote:

> On 19 December 2016 at 03:33, Gene Heskett  
wrote:
> > But I have neither the module, nor that manpage. ISTR we had
> > something like that in older releases?  But the *_hall3 manpage says
> > it was created 2 weeks ago.
>
> the "bldc" module can do all that bldc_hall3 can do, and is intended
> as a replacement.
> However, the component has not (as yet) been removed in case someone
> is using it.
>
> We should probably consider removing it in 2.8.
>
> The manpages are auto-generated from the .comp files so the creation
> date is not the date written.

I see.  From the description, I assume this would be for an axis drive, 
eg a drive that is mechanically locked via timing belts or such.

Worthless as a spindle control if there are v belts between the motor and 
the encoder.

Sounds pretty complex. And probably as cpu intensive as a pid module.  I 
note that in the raspi version, the example lathe config which I am 
starting with, uses no pid modules at all. So the assumption must be 
inferred that the TP does it all, and the positioning of the steppers 
assumes they follow precisely.

Since the G33.1 for rigid tapping needs an acceleration to Z speed move, 
assuming the starting z point is some bit of air cut prior to the taps 
entry in the hole, how does this effect the maximum rpms that can be 
used as compared to the PID's ability to run it a little faster to catch 
up?  Seems to me it will be limited to some slower max rpm.

I'll find out of course once I have everything moving.

==

I am still constructing the interconnect cable, and its completed to the 
all grounds connected state. I wrote another sd card for the pi I have, 
and spent several hours last night update it, and applying the 
cmdline.txt stuff, watching dmesg to make sure they all took. Some of my 
instability was typu's as the font my browser uses, made it very 
difficult to see that the FIG stuff was in fact FIQ. That, and the 
apparent randomness of the use of a _ vs a -.  Then I installed synaptic 
and turned it loose to update it. 3 hours later I left it running as it 
wasn't done.  And I am puzzled that it never went above 3% cpu while 
doing that.  So that update of several hundred packages took lots longer 
than it needed to IMO.  And I forgot to install the amanda-client, so it 
didn't get backed up last night.

All that was done with the cable connected only to the pi. So once I get 
some caffeine installed, I'll have synaptic install the amanda bits. 
Then a shutdown, install the 7i90 end of the cable and reboot for 
effect. That will connect all the grounded stuff together in the 7i90 as 
a way to check that I didn't get a wrong pin connected.

If that has no effect, then I'll make up the last 4 signal connections in 
this adapter cable, and reboot for effect.  If none, install the rt 
kernel.  If that still works, install the linuxcnc tarball. If it won't 
run, and I get an all-balls cookie from the 7i90, then I'll have 
confirmed a blown gpio pin in this pi. But one thing at a time, with 
solid, can't hit the wrong pin cabling. Once the cable has been proved, 
cover the bottom of it so it can't short to something on the pi. The 
cable is exactly long enough so there is that possibility as it come 
across the top of the pi to get to the 7i90.

One step at a time, sure takes time...

Thanks Andy.

Cheers, Gene Heskett
-- 
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 soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
-Ed Howdershelt (Author)
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[andy pugh]

On 19 December 2016 at 03:33, Gene Heskett  wrote:
> But I have neither the module, nor that manpage. ISTR we had something
> like that in older releases?  But the *_hall3 manpage says it was
> created 2 weeks ago.

the "bldc" module can do all that bldc_hall3 can do, and is intended
as a replacement.
However, the component has not (as yet) been removed in case someone
is using it.

We should probably consider removing it in 2.8.

The manpages are auto-generated from the .comp files so the creation
date is not the date written.

-- 
atp
"A motorcycle is a bicycle with a pandemonium attachment and is
designed for the especial use of mechanical geniuses, daredevils and
lunatics."
— George Fitch, Atlanta Constitution Newspaper, 1916

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 18 December 2016 17:46:21 andy pugh wrote:

> On 17 December 2016 at 21:56, Jon Elson  wrote:
> > Well, I think the A06B-6058 is a PWM-input servo amp that
> > requires SIX PWM signals, one to drive each transistor.
> > That's six signals PER AXIS.
>
> As Jon mentioned, Mesa does have a three-phase PWM module that (in
> some configurations) has all 6 channels connected to output pins.
>
> The software "bldc" component can provide 6 separate PWM amplitudes,
> but that isn't something that you can connect to 6 separate PWM
> modules, as the PWM signals need to be running in phase with each
> other, or there is a danger of turning on both the high and low side
> drivers of the same part of the bridge:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_inverter#Three-phase_inverters
> shows why some drives need 6 PWM channels, and also shows why having
> high-side and low-side turned on at the same time is a problem.

Andy, always curious, I see I have a bldc_hall3 module and manpage, at 
the bottom of which it says to see bldc_hall6 for 6 wire unipolar 
motors.

But I have neither the module, nor that manpage. ISTR we had something 
like that in older releases?  But the *_hall3 manpage says it was 
created 2 weeks ago.  Is my wet ram lieing to me?

Cheers, Gene Heskett
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[andy pugh]

On 17 December 2016 at 21:56, Jon Elson  wrote:
> Well, I think the A06B-6058 is a PWM-input servo amp that
> requires SIX PWM signals, one to drive each transistor.
> That's six signals PER AXIS.

As Jon mentioned, Mesa does have a three-phase PWM module that (in
some configurations) has all 6 channels connected to output pins.

The software "bldc" component can provide 6 separate PWM amplitudes,
but that isn't something that you can connect to 6 separate PWM
modules, as the PWM signals need to be running in phase with each
other, or there is a danger of turning on both the high and low side
drivers of the same part of the bridge:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_inverter#Three-phase_inverters
shows why some drives need 6 PWM channels, and also shows why having
high-side and low-side turned on at the same time is a problem.

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Jon Elson]

On 12/17/2016 01:04 PM, Steve from Tube Gauge wrote:
> I was able to retrieve the titled part number from the frame of the servo amp 
> and it appears to be a version that is "difficult" to integrate with EMC2, as 
> identified by the "6058" section of the number.
>   
> What are my options for EMC2 if I want to use these Red Cap servo motors and 
> the 6058 amps?  Is there an "adapter" board or software that can be purchased 
> to allow the integration?  The machine I have is a First LC-CV305.  It is 
> basically a small bed mill with 24x12x15" XYZ travels with a mechanical 
> variable speed drive.
>   
>
Well, I think the A06B-6058 is a PWM-input servo amp that 
requires SIX PWM signals, one to drive each transistor.  
That's six signals PER AXIS.  It is not practical to do this 
on our interface hardware.  Getting info on Fanuc stuff is 
REALLY difficult.  Mesa does have the ability to drive these 
servo amps, although it uses up a lot of PWM channels, and 
CPU resources to keep up with the commutation of the motors.

Depending on the size of the motors, it may be possible to 
run the machine with the Pico Systems brushless PWM servo 
amp, it is good for up to 20 A peak.  If you have the model 
of the motor, I can look that up.
Another option is to use AMC servo amps with our PPMC analog 
interface system.

Jon

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[Emc-users] Fanuc A06B-6058-H322 Servo Amp Part Number

[Steve from Tube Gauge]

I was able to retrieve the titled part number from the frame of the servo amp 
and it appears to be a version that is "difficult" to integrate with EMC2, as 
identified by the "6058" section of the number. 
 
What are my options for EMC2 if I want to use these Red Cap servo motors and 
the 6058 amps?  Is there an "adapter" board or software that can be purchased 
to allow the integration?  The machine I have is a First LC-CV305.  It is 
basically a small bed mill with 24x12x15" XYZ travels with a mechanical 
variable speed drive. 
 
Thanks

Steve 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Frederic RIBLE]

On 10/12/2016 15:34, Peter C. Wallace wrote:

> What is the magnitude of the oscillation?
>
> can you plot it and provide a link to the plot?
>
Looks like we have a scaling mismatch somewhere in the drive between 
command and feedback.
However, that does not explain everything.
Will come back soon with a plot.


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Peter C. Wallace]

On Sat, 10 Dec 2016, Frederic RIBLE wrote:

> Date: Sat, 10 Dec 2016 01:26:02 +0100
> From: Frederic RIBLE 
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning
> 
> On 09/12/2016 21:48, Peter C. Wallace wrote:
>
>>
>> There are only some 10s of usec between reading the encoder and writing the
>> PWM value, assuming the read and write functions are in the proper order in
>> the hal file. Also Fred said that changing the servo thread from 1 to 10 KHZ
>> made little difference, so I dont think its a loop bandwith issue
>>
>>
> Good idea, we have to check the functions order.
> About original Fanuc F/V converter delay comparing to mesa,
> unfortunately we cannot measure because it is faulty.
> Another clue: we have very similar oscillations at low or high speed.
> So the problem is not coming from period/frequency mode switching in the
> velocity estimation algorithms.
>


What is the magnitude of the oscillation?

can you plot it and provide a link to the plot?

>
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Peter Wallace
Mesa Electronics

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Frederic RIBLE]

On 09/12/2016 21:48, Peter C. Wallace wrote:

>
> There are only some 10s of usec between reading the encoder and writing the
> PWM value, assuming the read and write functions are in the proper order in
> the hal file. Also Fred said that changing the servo thread from 1 to 10 KHZ
> made little difference, so I dont think its a loop bandwith issue
>
>
Good idea, we have to check the functions order.
About original Fanuc F/V converter delay comparing to mesa, 
unfortunately we cannot measure because it is faulty.
Another clue: we have very similar oscillations at low or high speed.
So the problem is not coming from period/frequency mode switching in the 
velocity estimation algorithms.


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Frederic RIBLE]

On 09/12/2016 17:23, Peter C. Wallace wrote:
>
> Is the velocity loop gain in LinuxCNC set correctly?
>
> That is, is it set so you get ~+-10V at +-2000 RPM
>
The gain should be ok because we have tuned it to achieve very small 
following error when all PID parameters are 0 except FF1=1.
In that way, the axis is running in open loop.



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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Peter C. Wallace]

On Fri, 9 Dec 2016, Jon Elson wrote:

> Date: Fri, 09 Dec 2016 14:28:48 -0600
> From: Jon Elson 
> Reply-To: el...@pico-systems.com,
> "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning
> 
>
> On 12/08/2016 03:56 PM, Frederic RIBLE wrote:
>> As we can see a phase compensation circuit in the drive, we assume this
>> is to compensate for delay on velocity feedback.
>> So, we have tried to add some delay on the velocity feedback assuming
>> original F/V converter from the Fanuc control board may be slower than
>> what we have with Mesa. Not much success: that changes a little the
>> oscillation period, but we cannot cancel oscillation.
> No, it is probably FASTER.  The Mesa probably is delayed by a ms reading
> the encoder position, and then another ms sending the DAC output.  The
> circuit used by Fanuc was almost time-continuous except for the encoder
> positional granularity.  It was similar to the ST chip L290, which
> decoded  quadrature state changes into count-up and count-down pulses,
> and fed them into a pair of analog integrators. These were then fed to a
> differential summing amp.  So, the response to a movement of the encoder
> came out in some microseconds.
>>
>> Anyone knows how we can tune the drive (unfortunately we have not the
>> documentation for this part number) ?
>>
>>
> You might improve the results by decreasing the period of the servo thread.
>
> Jon

There are only some 10s of usec between reading the encoder and writing the 
PWM value, assuming the read and write functions are in the proper order in 
the hal file. Also Fred said that changing the servo thread from 1 to 10 KHZ 
made little difference, so I dont think its a loop bandwith issue

Still waiting to see if they have the velocity scaling right on the velocity 
feedback output ( ~10V at max motor speed)




Peter Wallace
Mesa Electronics

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Jon Elson]

On 12/08/2016 03:56 PM, Frederic RIBLE wrote:
> As we can see a phase compensation circuit in the drive, we assume this
> is to compensate for delay on velocity feedback.
> So, we have tried to add some delay on the velocity feedback assuming
> original F/V converter from the Fanuc control board may be slower than
> what we have with Mesa. Not much success: that changes a little the
> oscillation period, but we cannot cancel oscillation.
No, it is probably FASTER.  The Mesa probably is delayed by a ms reading 
the encoder position, and then another ms sending the DAC output.  The 
circuit used by Fanuc was almost time-continuous except for the encoder 
positional granularity.  It was similar to the ST chip L290, which 
decoded  quadrature state changes into count-up and count-down pulses, 
and fed them into a pair of analog integrators. These were then fed to a 
differential summing amp.  So, the response to a movement of the encoder 
came out in some microseconds.
>
> Anyone knows how we can tune the drive (unfortunately we have not the
> documentation for this part number) ?
>
>
You might improve the results by decreasing the period of the servo thread.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Jon Elson]

On 12/08/2016 03:56 PM, Frederic RIBLE wrote:
> Hello
>
> At Electrolab hackerspace, we are working on the retrofit of a
> Mori-Seiki SL0 CNC lathe.
> We are are using a Mesa 6i24/7i48 combination.
> The drive is a A06B-6047-H208 (double velocity control unit).
> Axis motors are A06B-0641-B011 and A06B-0642-B011 (yellow cap).
> The position feedback comes from a 2000ppr encoder.
> We use the Mesa board to convert the pulses to an analog feedback
> velocity signal.
> We have done the HAL cabling as below.
> First results are promising : we can control the position.
> But we see some oscillations on the velocity (periodic with 33 ms period).
> Oscillations start when the position command changes, and never stop,
> even when the pos-cmd becomes constant.
> Same issue if we disable the PID loop in HAL.
> So we believe the problem is coming from the drive.
> When we decrease the analog gain in the drive after the error amplifier
> (comparison between velocity command and feedback), we can decrease the
> oscillation.
> As we can see a phase compensation circuit in the drive, we assume this
> is to compensate for delay on velocity feedback.
> So, we have tried to add some delay on the velocity feedback assuming
> original F/V converter from the Fanuc control board may be slower than
> what we have with Mesa. Not much success: that changes a little the
> oscillation period, but we cannot cancel oscillation.
>
> Anyone knows how we can tune the drive (unfortunately we have not the
> documentation for this part number) ?
>
> Thanks
> Frederic.
>
>
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/16648/Mauriceservo.jpg
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Peter C. Wallace]

On Fri, 9 Dec 2016, Frederic RIBLE wrote:

> Date: Fri, 9 Dec 2016 07:53:02 +0100
> From: Frederic RIBLE 
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> To: emc-users@lists.sourceforge.net
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning
> 
> On 09/12/2016 02:21, Peter C. Wallace wrote:
>
>> Are you sure the PWMGEN output mode is set to mode 2 ?
>> (you will get very weird and unstable results otherwise)
>> Note that changing the mode may invert the feedback so beware of runaways
>>
> I think so, will double check.
> We have monitored the analog output of the 7i48 with an oscilloscope:
> looks good, both for positive and negative values.
> But there is some high frequency noise that may come from the cabling.
>> Also since you are closing a velocity loop, you may want to
>> run the servo thread faster (say 2 to 8 KHz if your PC can do it)
> We have tested 1 kHz and 10 kHz: not much difference.
>
> Thank you for your help.
> Frederic.
>

Is the velocity loop gain in LinuxCNC set correctly?

That is, is it set so you get ~+-10V at +-2000 RPM


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Peter Wallace
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Frederic RIBLE]

On 09/12/2016 02:21, Peter C. Wallace wrote:

> Are you sure the PWMGEN output mode is set to mode 2 ?
> (you will get very weird and unstable results otherwise)
> Note that changing the mode may invert the feedback so beware of runaways
>
I think so, will double check.
We have monitored the analog output of the 7i48 with an oscilloscope: 
looks good, both for positive and negative values.
But there is some high frequency noise that may come from the cabling.
> Also since you are closing a velocity loop, you may want to
> run the servo thread faster (say 2 to 8 KHz if your PC can do it)
We have tested 1 kHz and 10 kHz: not much difference.

Thank you for your help.
Frederic.


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Peter C. Wallace]

On Thu, 8 Dec 2016, Frederic RIBLE wrote:

> Date: Thu, 8 Dec 2016 22:56:02 +0100
> From: Frederic RIBLE 
> Reply-To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
> 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Subject: [Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning
> 
> Hello
>
> At Electrolab hackerspace, we are working on the retrofit of a
> Mori-Seiki SL0 CNC lathe.
> We are are using a Mesa 6i24/7i48 combination.
> The drive is a A06B-6047-H208 (double velocity control unit).
> Axis motors are A06B-0641-B011 and A06B-0642-B011 (yellow cap).
> The position feedback comes from a 2000ppr encoder.
> We use the Mesa board to convert the pulses to an analog feedback
> velocity signal.
> We have done the HAL cabling as below.
> First results are promising : we can control the position.
> But we see some oscillations on the velocity (periodic with 33 ms period).
> Oscillations start when the position command changes, and never stop,
> even when the pos-cmd becomes constant.
> Same issue if we disable the PID loop in HAL.
> So we believe the problem is coming from the drive.
> When we decrease the analog gain in the drive after the error amplifier
> (comparison between velocity command and feedback), we can decrease the
> oscillation.
> As we can see a phase compensation circuit in the drive, we assume this
> is to compensate for delay on velocity feedback.
> So, we have tried to add some delay on the velocity feedback assuming
> original F/V converter from the Fanuc control board may be slower than
> what we have with Mesa. Not much success: that changes a little the
> oscillation period, but we cannot cancel oscillation.
>
> Anyone knows how we can tune the drive (unfortunately we have not the
> documentation for this part number) ?
>
> Thanks
> Frederic.
>


Are you sure the PWMGEN output mode is set to mode 2 ?
(you will get very weird and unstable results otherwise)
Note that changing the mode may invert the feedback so beware of runaways


Also since you are closing a velocity loop, you may want to
run the servo thread faster (say 2 to 8 KHz if your PC can do it)



>
> https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/16648/Mauriceservo.jpg
>
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Peter Wallace
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[Emc-users] Fanuc analog drive & LinuxCNC tuning

[Frederic RIBLE]

Hello

At Electrolab hackerspace, we are working on the retrofit of a 
Mori-Seiki SL0 CNC lathe.
We are are using a Mesa 6i24/7i48 combination.
The drive is a A06B-6047-H208 (double velocity control unit).
Axis motors are A06B-0641-B011 and A06B-0642-B011 (yellow cap).
The position feedback comes from a 2000ppr encoder.
We use the Mesa board to convert the pulses to an analog feedback 
velocity signal.
We have done the HAL cabling as below.
First results are promising : we can control the position.
But we see some oscillations on the velocity (periodic with 33 ms period).
Oscillations start when the position command changes, and never stop, 
even when the pos-cmd becomes constant.
Same issue if we disable the PID loop in HAL.
So we believe the problem is coming from the drive.
When we decrease the analog gain in the drive after the error amplifier 
(comparison between velocity command and feedback), we can decrease the 
oscillation.
As we can see a phase compensation circuit in the drive, we assume this 
is to compensate for delay on velocity feedback.
So, we have tried to add some delay on the velocity feedback assuming 
original F/V converter from the Fanuc control board may be slower than 
what we have with Mesa. Not much success: that changes a little the 
oscillation period, but we cannot cancel oscillation.

Anyone knows how we can tune the drive (unfortunately we have not the 
documentation for this part number) ?

Thanks
Frederic.


https://forum.linuxcnc.org/media/kunena/attachments/16648/Mauriceservo.jpg

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

After all this back and forth, we finally realized that we had to do 
something firm, so after thoroughly look at the internals of the 
spindle, and some engineering, we are mounting an encoder with a 1:1 
belt drive off of the spindle, there was a sleeve in  the middle of the 
spindle, just long enough to mount a synchronous sheave on, so now we 
are machining up the components, and hopefully by the end of the week, 
be back in business.

Thanks for all the input guys,



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399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR (Bruce Layne)

[Greg Bentzinger]

When thread timing is critical, as others have said, its time to look at thread 
milling.

I have a repeat job for a company doing warranty retrofits, having to replace 
an out of production assy with a replacement made by a different vendor.

The replacements are mounted on the rear side of the front control panel .47" 
thick Al. I have to provide #6-32 threads with a usable depth of .400" without 
any visible change on the front.

Once you get your head straight on standard thread milling you can go for the 
bonus Migraine round and try NPT thread milling! (which I also do a fair amount 
of)

Greg

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Jon Elson]

On 05/23/2015 07:24 AM, Chris Kelley wrote:
> Rick,
>
> I'm working on a Fanuc spindle that uses that same "encoder" (my motor is a
> Model 3 PN: A06B-1003-B100 at 3.7/5.5kW) on a Burgmaster Powerhawk VTC-150.
>
> It's not actually an encoder but a magnetic pulse generator that reads the
> teeth on a gear on the top of the motor. It has six leads: +5V, 0V, PA, RA,
> PB, RB.
>
> +5V and 0V are obviously the power connections. PA is Pulse for phase A, it
> outputs a sine wave that goes from about 2.25V to 2.75V (can be less, the
> magnets in the read head lose strength over time and put out a weaker
> wave). PB is Pulse for phase-B, it is the same as PA but offset 1/4 of a
> wavelength (90 degree offset). RA and RB are Reference phase-A and
> Reference phase-B respectively. These put out a constant 2.5V signal. All
> of these signals tend to be pretty noisy. (Note that the two sine waves are
> centered at this same 2.5V.)
>
> I don't know if the Mesa card can read that sine wave, I'm pretty sure it's
> only meant to split digital square waves.
>
>
If the Mesa has differential inputs (pretty sure it does) 
then it should work fine to read the encoder.
Too bad it doesn't have an index channel, too, but this is 
likely for speed control only, as it may be on the other 
side of a gearbox from the spindle.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Chris Kelley]

Rick,

I'm working on a Fanuc spindle that uses that same "encoder" (my motor is a
Model 3 PN: A06B-1003-B100 at 3.7/5.5kW) on a Burgmaster Powerhawk VTC-150.

It's not actually an encoder but a magnetic pulse generator that reads the
teeth on a gear on the top of the motor. It has six leads: +5V, 0V, PA, RA,
PB, RB.

+5V and 0V are obviously the power connections. PA is Pulse for phase A, it
outputs a sine wave that goes from about 2.25V to 2.75V (can be less, the
magnets in the read head lose strength over time and put out a weaker
wave). PB is Pulse for phase-B, it is the same as PA but offset 1/4 of a
wavelength (90 degree offset). RA and RB are Reference phase-A and
Reference phase-B respectively. These put out a constant 2.5V signal. All
of these signals tend to be pretty noisy. (Note that the two sine waves are
centered at this same 2.5V.)

I don't know if the Mesa card can read that sine wave, I'm pretty sure it's
only meant to split digital square waves.

As soon as these signals get back to the drive, they are run through a
comparator circuit that compares the sine waves to their reference voltages
and puts out 0-5V square waves. (Why they don't do this in the encoder is
beyond me, I just chalk it up to the weird things Fanuc does.)

Assuming you are still using the Fanuc spindle drive, you could skip using
the ENCY card and feed the "encoder" straight back to the drive. There
should be two test points on the drive where you can tap into the square
wave signals after the drive has converted the sine waves. On my drive
these two points are CH7 and CH8 and they are conveniently located right
next to a 0V test point.

I have a PDF copy of the maintenance manual for this drive, if you want a
copy.

I ditched the Fanuc drive on my machine (for reasons unrelated to the
encoder) and replaced it with a Hitachi WJ200 VFD that doesn't need an
encoder. I'll be building my own simple comparator circuit to convert the
signal to feed into a 7i77.

Also, to answer your initial question, the gear that the pulse generator
reads has 250 teeth. Once converted to quadrature signals, you get 1000
pulses per revolution.

-Chris K.

On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 12:57 PM,  wrote:

> Thread mill? Easy to have exact thread orientation that way.
>
>
> --Original Mail--
> From: "Bruce Layne" 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Sent: Fri, 22 May 2015 13:27:40 -0400
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR
>
> Hey Chris,
>
> Nice video!  Nice LinuxCNC VMC!
>
> I noticed that your spindle is indexed randomly at the start and end of
> each rigid tapping cycle.  This verifies Andy's assertion that LinuxCNC
> only uses the index pulse to initiate rigid tapping and uses the other
> spindle encoder signals exclusively to match the Z travel to the spindle
> rotation.  That works great for a fixture plate, but I'll be making
> parts where I need the threads to be indexed relative to the part
> geometry.  In other words, I need all of the parts to screw on to mating
> parts and radially align in approximately the same position each time.
> That's seldom the case, but it is for me.  That's why I need the spindle
> encoder on the spindle.
>
> As long as we understand the limitations, all is well.  To a large
> extent, that's the difference between doing a LinuxCNC conversion
> yourself and using a more plug-and-play solution.  It's like the
> difference between being a programmer/hacker as opposed to someone who
> uses a PC to update their Facebook status.
>
> Back on topic  If I was Rick, I'd find SOME way to put an encoder on
> the spindle, even a low resolution encoder, and avoid patching LinuxCNC
> on the software side.  I like to upgrade LinuxCNC when all of the great
> new features are added, and I don't like spending time to patch it each
> time to get it running again for my specific machine.  I try to keep the
> machine as generic as possible, but that strategy flies in the face of
> fun projects like home brewed tool changers and other stuff I want to
> do.  The best I can do is TRY to keep it simple.
>
>
> Bruce
>
>
>
>
>
>
> On 05/22/2015 11:37 AM, Chris Radek wrote:
> > On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 01:32:23PM +0100, andy pugh wrote:
> >> I believe that the cycle uses the index at most once per in-out move,
> >> so as long as you are not peck-tapping it will still work.
> > On my vmc, there is an untoothed belt drive between the spindle and
> > motor.  The spindle encoder is on the motor.  The encoder does not
> > have index.  I don't know what the belt ratio is, exactly.  I scaled
> > it by measuring, and jumpered A to Z on the mesa's input.  So, it
> > gets indexes ever

Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[pc]

Thread mill? Easy to have exact thread orientation that way.


--Original Mail--
From: "Bruce Layne" 
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
Sent: Fri, 22 May 2015 13:27:40 -0400
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

Hey Chris,

Nice video!  Nice LinuxCNC VMC!

I noticed that your spindle is indexed randomly at the start and end of 
each rigid tapping cycle.  This verifies Andy's assertion that LinuxCNC 
only uses the index pulse to initiate rigid tapping and uses the other 
spindle encoder signals exclusively to match the Z travel to the spindle 
rotation.  That works great for a fixture plate, but I'll be making 
parts where I need the threads to be indexed relative to the part 
geometry.  In other words, I need all of the parts to screw on to mating 
parts and radially align in approximately the same position each time.  
That's seldom the case, but it is for me.  That's why I need the spindle 
encoder on the spindle.

As long as we understand the limitations, all is well.  To a large 
extent, that's the difference between doing a LinuxCNC conversion 
yourself and using a more plug-and-play solution.  It's like the 
difference between being a programmer/hacker as opposed to someone who 
uses a PC to update their Facebook status.

Back on topic  If I was Rick, I'd find SOME way to put an encoder on 
the spindle, even a low resolution encoder, and avoid patching LinuxCNC 
on the software side.  I like to upgrade LinuxCNC when all of the great 
new features are added, and I don't like spending time to patch it each 
time to get it running again for my specific machine.  I try to keep the 
machine as generic as possible, but that strategy flies in the face of 
fun projects like home brewed tool changers and other stuff I want to 
do.  The best I can do is TRY to keep it simple.


Bruce






On 05/22/2015 11:37 AM, Chris Radek wrote:
> On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 01:32:23PM +0100, andy pugh wrote:
>> I believe that the cycle uses the index at most once per in-out move,
>> so as long as you are not peck-tapping it will still work.
> On my vmc, there is an untoothed belt drive between the spindle and
> motor.  The spindle encoder is on the motor.  The encoder does not
> have index.  I don't know what the belt ratio is, exactly.  I scaled
> it by measuring, and jumpered A to Z on the mesa's input.  So, it
> gets indexes everywhere.
>
> Tapping works great.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HLKXeWqTF0
>
> I have never wanted to peck tap by cnc.
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Bruce Layne]

Hey Chris,

Nice video!  Nice LinuxCNC VMC!

I noticed that your spindle is indexed randomly at the start and end of 
each rigid tapping cycle.  This verifies Andy's assertion that LinuxCNC 
only uses the index pulse to initiate rigid tapping and uses the other 
spindle encoder signals exclusively to match the Z travel to the spindle 
rotation.  That works great for a fixture plate, but I'll be making 
parts where I need the threads to be indexed relative to the part 
geometry.  In other words, I need all of the parts to screw on to mating 
parts and radially align in approximately the same position each time.  
That's seldom the case, but it is for me.  That's why I need the spindle 
encoder on the spindle.

As long as we understand the limitations, all is well.  To a large 
extent, that's the difference between doing a LinuxCNC conversion 
yourself and using a more plug-and-play solution.  It's like the 
difference between being a programmer/hacker as opposed to someone who 
uses a PC to update their Facebook status.

Back on topic  If I was Rick, I'd find SOME way to put an encoder on 
the spindle, even a low resolution encoder, and avoid patching LinuxCNC 
on the software side.  I like to upgrade LinuxCNC when all of the great 
new features are added, and I don't like spending time to patch it each 
time to get it running again for my specific machine.  I try to keep the 
machine as generic as possible, but that strategy flies in the face of 
fun projects like home brewed tool changers and other stuff I want to 
do.  The best I can do is TRY to keep it simple.


Bruce






On 05/22/2015 11:37 AM, Chris Radek wrote:
> On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 01:32:23PM +0100, andy pugh wrote:
>> I believe that the cycle uses the index at most once per in-out move,
>> so as long as you are not peck-tapping it will still work.
> On my vmc, there is an untoothed belt drive between the spindle and
> motor.  The spindle encoder is on the motor.  The encoder does not
> have index.  I don't know what the belt ratio is, exactly.  I scaled
> it by measuring, and jumpered A to Z on the mesa's input.  So, it
> gets indexes everywhere.
>
> Tapping works great.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HLKXeWqTF0
>
> I have never wanted to peck tap by cnc.
>
> --
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>


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Dave Cole]

A couple of years ago I worked with the local Fanuc service guy on  a 
couple of machines and he mentioned that he was using Mach3 to make some 
small simple routers.   I asked him if he
had heard of LinuxCNC and he hadn't.   After that, every pause waiting 
for software to load was spent talking about LinuxCNC. It didn't take 
much discussion for him to recognize LinuxCNC's better value when we 
were doing modifications to the Fanuc controlled machines ladder logic 
sequencing software and I told him that LinuxCNC also supported ladder 
logic.   The Fanuc controlled lathes were interfaced to some custom 
robotic loaders via Fanuc's ladder software.

Dave

On 5/22/2015 7:09 AM, Rick Lair wrote:
> Gave those guys a call, talked to tech support for almost a half hour, 5
> mins about my motor, the other 25 about Linuxcnc, and all of its
> advantages over "the other guys". The tech guy had vaguely heard of
> Linuxcnc, saw the webpage a few times, and heard a few things along the
> way, and also had all the components at home for a small desktop stepper
> driven mill, and didn't know what he was going to use to control it, I
> think he was going home as soon as I got off the phone to order a some
> PC components, and breakout boards to get it going with Linuxcnc.
>
>
> As for my encoder, when I went back out last night, I spun the spindle,
> while it was in gear, and saw the speed readout bar on gscreen shoot up
> over 2 rpm's, so apparently it is working, I just need to figure out
> the scale,
>
> Another question regarding this, seems how the encoder is on the motor,
> and there is a 2 speed transmission on the spindle, High is 1:1 and low
> 1:6.325, what HAL component, other than SCALE, do I need to use to
> change the ratio for the low speed feedback to the readout display, and
> controller for that matter.
>
> High gear would basically be straight into the controller, but I would
> need to reroute it, thru scale, then back into the controller for low gear.
>
> Thanks
>
> Rick
>
>
> On 5/21/2015 2:14 PM, Matt Tucci wrote:
>> I had a c axis with a 10,000 pulse coder red top fanuc motor. Call the
>> people at http://www.fanucworld.com/ , Tennesee Industrial Electronics,
>> they'll tell you what it is.
>>
>> On Thu, May 21, 2015 at 1:01 PM, Dave Caroline 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> If you have it wired, just rotate n turns and watch the variable get
>>> updated in halmeter
>>>
>>> should come to some sensible number I wouldnt be surprised to see it
>>> being n*(700 or 8000 clue in the part number)* 4
>>>
>>> Dave Caroline
>>>
>>> On 21/05/2015, Rick Lair  wrote:
 I have a Fanuc spindle motor on the VMC I am retrofitting right now,
 and  I intercepted the motor encoder cable, with an ENCY card from Mesa,
 the machine was open loop in regards to the spindle prior to this.

 Would anyone know what the PPR might be on one of these, I didn't know
 if they used a common PPR encoder on these motors, or of maybe a way to
 figure out what it is? The motor is from 1984, it is a model 8, PN:
 A06B-1008-B 700#8000. I can't find any data for it any where, and I am
 not sure what to put in INI section to try to get it going.


 --

 Thanks


 Rick Lair
 Superior Roll & Turning LLC
 399 East Center Street
 Petersburg MI, 49270
 PH: 734-279-1831
 FAX: 734-279-1166
 www.superiorroll.com



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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Chris Radek]

On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 01:32:23PM +0100, andy pugh wrote:
> 
> I believe that the cycle uses the index at most once per in-out move,
> so as long as you are not peck-tapping it will still work.

On my vmc, there is an untoothed belt drive between the spindle and
motor.  The spindle encoder is on the motor.  The encoder does not
have index.  I don't know what the belt ratio is, exactly.  I scaled
it by measuring, and jumpered A to Z on the mesa's input.  So, it
gets indexes everywhere.

Tapping works great.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9HLKXeWqTF0

I have never wanted to peck tap by cnc.

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

Maybe this thing isn't an encoder, the Fanuc PN is A02B-9000-0010, here 
is a link to a replacement,

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1PC-USED-FANUC-SPINDLE-MOTOR-SENSOR-A20B-9000-0010-/331114801033?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d17fae789

I have a square wave on the halscope, on channel B, but channel A looks 
more like a sine wave, and it is not consistent, during rotation, and 
continues to randomly signal after rotation has stopped, whereas channel 
B is only signaling during rotation. I double checked my wiring for any 
mishaps, can't find a darn thing.

Is this maybe a Hall Sensor?


-- 

Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[andy pugh]

On 22 May 2015 at 13:49, Rick Lair  wrote:
> if it comes
> to that, then I will need to get real creative with an encoder on the
> spindle itself.

Or mandate that peck-tapping is done in gear 1:1

-- 
atp
If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

On 5/22/2015 8:32 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> On 22 May 2015 at 13:21, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
>> If you add an index to the spindle then you might as well add an encoder to
>> the spindle. That would solve the rigid tapping problem.
I would rather go this route, but there is zero room to add any of the 
above, in the spindle carrier itself.

> I am not convinced that there is a rigid-tapping problem.
>
> I believe that the cycle uses the index at most once per in-out move,
> so as long as you are not peck-tapping it will still work.
>
That makes sense,

We don't really do rigid tapping in house, yet, but I want all options 
available on this bad boy, so the peck-tap isn't a big deal, if it comes 
to that, then I will need to get real creative with an encoder on the 
spindle itself.


-- 

Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[andy pugh]

On 22 May 2015 at 13:21, Stuart Stevenson  wrote:
> If you add an index to the spindle then you might as well add an encoder to
> the spindle. That would solve the rigid tapping problem.

I am not convinced that there is a rigid-tapping problem.

I believe that the cycle uses the index at most once per in-out move,
so as long as you are not peck-tapping it will still work.

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Stuart Stevenson]

If you add an index to the spindle then you might as well add an encoder to
the spindle. That would solve the rigid tapping problem.

On Fri, May 22, 2015 at 7:13 AM, Todd Zuercher 
wrote:

> What if he were to add an index to the spindle. would that fix the rigid
> tapping problem?
>
> - Original Message -
> From: "andy pugh" 
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
> Sent: Friday, May 22, 2015 7:17:52 AM
> Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR
>
> On 22 May 2015 at 12:09, Rick Lair  wrote:
> > Another question regarding this, seems how the encoder is on the motor,
> > and there is a 2 speed transmission on the spindle, High is 1:1 and low
> > 1:6.325, what HAL component, other than SCALE, do I need to use to
> > change the ratio for the low speed feedback to the readout display, and
> > controller for that matter.
>
> What do you want to use the encoder output for?
>
> If it is just spindle speed, then it will work. If you want to use it
> for spindle alignment then it won't work as the index will be at a
> different spindle position every time.
> Look at the "gearchange" component for a simple way to configure a
> 2-speed spindle. For more gears it gets more difficult.
>
> --
> atp
> If you can't fix it, you don't own it.
> http://www.ifixit.com/Manifesto
>
>
> --
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Todd Zuercher]

What if he were to add an index to the spindle. would that fix the rigid 
tapping problem?

- Original Message -
From: "andy pugh" 
To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)" 
Sent: Friday, May 22, 2015 7:17:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

On 22 May 2015 at 12:09, Rick Lair  wrote:
> Another question regarding this, seems how the encoder is on the motor,
> and there is a 2 speed transmission on the spindle, High is 1:1 and low
> 1:6.325, what HAL component, other than SCALE, do I need to use to
> change the ratio for the low speed feedback to the readout display, and
> controller for that matter.

What do you want to use the encoder output for?

If it is just spindle speed, then it will work. If you want to use it
for spindle alignment then it won't work as the index will be at a
different spindle position every time.
Look at the "gearchange" component for a simple way to configure a
2-speed spindle. For more gears it gets more difficult.

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[andy pugh]

On 22 May 2015 at 12:41, Rick Lair  wrote:

> Now I see what you mean, individual gearchange components for each signal,

The other way to do it is to keep the gearchange for the comand, but
for the feedback use a mux2 to choose either of the two inverse scales
and then use that mux2 output to set the gain pin of two scale
components, one for position and one for velocity.


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

Ohh,

Now I see what you mean, individual gearchange components for each signal,

That makes sense, still half to fully wrap my head around it to get it 
configured, but I see where you were going.


Rick



On 5/22/2015 7:32 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> On 22 May 2015 at 12:25, Rick Lair  wrote:
>> I already have the gearchange configured, I was just trying to get the
>> feedback correct on the visual readout on the screen,
> You might want three of them, one for spindle command, one for encoder
> velocity and one for encoder position.
>
>> Do you think that under these circumstances, it eliminates the chance of
>> rigid tapping on this machine?
> The 1:1 gear will be fine.
>
> I think (if you scale the position) it will work in the other gear,but
> _not_ for peck tapping.
>

-- 

Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[andy pugh]

On 22 May 2015 at 12:25, Rick Lair  wrote:
> I already have the gearchange configured, I was just trying to get the
> feedback correct on the visual readout on the screen,

You might want three of them, one for spindle command, one for encoder
velocity and one for encoder position.

> Do you think that under these circumstances, it eliminates the chance of
> rigid tapping on this machine?

The 1:1 gear will be fine.

I think (if you scale the position) it will work in the other gear,but
_not_ for peck tapping.

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

I already have the gearchange configured, I was just trying to get the 
feedback correct on the visual readout on the screen,

Do you think that under these circumstances, it eliminates the chance of 
rigid tapping on this machine?



On 5/22/2015 7:17 AM, andy pugh wrote:
> On 22 May 2015 at 12:09, Rick Lair  wrote:
>> Another question regarding this, seems how the encoder is on the motor,
>> and there is a 2 speed transmission on the spindle, High is 1:1 and low
>> 1:6.325, what HAL component, other than SCALE, do I need to use to
>> change the ratio for the low speed feedback to the readout display, and
>> controller for that matter.
> What do you want to use the encoder output for?
>
> If it is just spindle speed, then it will work. If you want to use it
> for spindle alignment then it won't work as the index will be at a
> different spindle position every time.
> Look at the "gearchange" component for a simple way to configure a
> 2-speed spindle. For more gears it gets more difficult.
>

-- 

Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[andy pugh]

On 22 May 2015 at 12:09, Rick Lair  wrote:
> Another question regarding this, seems how the encoder is on the motor,
> and there is a 2 speed transmission on the spindle, High is 1:1 and low
> 1:6.325, what HAL component, other than SCALE, do I need to use to
> change the ratio for the low speed feedback to the readout display, and
> controller for that matter.

What do you want to use the encoder output for?

If it is just spindle speed, then it will work. If you want to use it
for spindle alignment then it won't work as the index will be at a
different spindle position every time.
Look at the "gearchange" component for a simple way to configure a
2-speed spindle. For more gears it gets more difficult.

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

Gave those guys a call, talked to tech support for almost a half hour, 5 
mins about my motor, the other 25 about Linuxcnc, and all of its 
advantages over "the other guys". The tech guy had vaguely heard of 
Linuxcnc, saw the webpage a few times, and heard a few things along the 
way, and also had all the components at home for a small desktop stepper 
driven mill, and didn't know what he was going to use to control it, I 
think he was going home as soon as I got off the phone to order a some 
PC components, and breakout boards to get it going with Linuxcnc.


As for my encoder, when I went back out last night, I spun the spindle, 
while it was in gear, and saw the speed readout bar on gscreen shoot up 
over 2 rpm's, so apparently it is working, I just need to figure out 
the scale,

Another question regarding this, seems how the encoder is on the motor, 
and there is a 2 speed transmission on the spindle, High is 1:1 and low 
1:6.325, what HAL component, other than SCALE, do I need to use to 
change the ratio for the low speed feedback to the readout display, and 
controller for that matter.

High gear would basically be straight into the controller, but I would 
need to reroute it, thru scale, then back into the controller for low gear.

Thanks

Rick


On 5/21/2015 2:14 PM, Matt Tucci wrote:
> I had a c axis with a 10,000 pulse coder red top fanuc motor. Call the
> people at http://www.fanucworld.com/ , Tennesee Industrial Electronics,
> they'll tell you what it is.
>
> On Thu, May 21, 2015 at 1:01 PM, Dave Caroline 
> wrote:
>
>> If you have it wired, just rotate n turns and watch the variable get
>> updated in halmeter
>>
>> should come to some sensible number I wouldnt be surprised to see it
>> being n*(700 or 8000 clue in the part number)* 4
>>
>> Dave Caroline
>>
>> On 21/05/2015, Rick Lair  wrote:
>>> I have a Fanuc spindle motor on the VMC I am retrofitting right now,
>>> and  I intercepted the motor encoder cable, with an ENCY card from Mesa,
>>> the machine was open loop in regards to the spindle prior to this.
>>>
>>> Would anyone know what the PPR might be on one of these, I didn't know
>>> if they used a common PPR encoder on these motors, or of maybe a way to
>>> figure out what it is? The motor is from 1984, it is a model 8, PN:
>>> A06B-1008-B 700#8000. I can't find any data for it any where, and I am
>>> not sure what to put in INI section to try to get it going.
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> Thanks
>>>
>>>
>>> Rick Lair
>>> Superior Roll & Turning LLC
>>> 399 East Center Street
>>> Petersburg MI, 49270
>>> PH: 734-279-1831
>>> FAX: 734-279-1166
>>> www.superiorroll.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>> --
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Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Matt Tucci]

I had a c axis with a 10,000 pulse coder red top fanuc motor. Call the
people at http://www.fanucworld.com/ , Tennesee Industrial Electronics,
they'll tell you what it is.

On Thu, May 21, 2015 at 1:01 PM, Dave Caroline 
wrote:

> If you have it wired, just rotate n turns and watch the variable get
> updated in halmeter
>
> should come to some sensible number I wouldnt be surprised to see it
> being n*(700 or 8000 clue in the part number)* 4
>
> Dave Caroline
>
> On 21/05/2015, Rick Lair  wrote:
> > I have a Fanuc spindle motor on the VMC I am retrofitting right now,
> > and  I intercepted the motor encoder cable, with an ENCY card from Mesa,
> > the machine was open loop in regards to the spindle prior to this.
> >
> > Would anyone know what the PPR might be on one of these, I didn't know
> > if they used a common PPR encoder on these motors, or of maybe a way to
> > figure out what it is? The motor is from 1984, it is a model 8, PN:
> > A06B-1008-B 700#8000. I can't find any data for it any where, and I am
> > not sure what to put in INI section to try to get it going.
> >
> >
> > --
> >
> > Thanks
> >
> >
> > Rick Lair
> > Superior Roll & Turning LLC
> > 399 East Center Street
> > Petersburg MI, 49270
> > PH: 734-279-1831
> > FAX: 734-279-1166
> > www.superiorroll.com
> >
> >
> >
> --
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> > Widest out-of-the-box monitoring support with 50+ applications
> > Performance metrics, stats and reports that give you Actionable Insights
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> >
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Dave Caroline]

If you have it wired, just rotate n turns and watch the variable get
updated in halmeter

should come to some sensible number I wouldnt be surprised to see it
being n*(700 or 8000 clue in the part number)* 4

Dave Caroline

On 21/05/2015, Rick Lair  wrote:
> I have a Fanuc spindle motor on the VMC I am retrofitting right now,
> and  I intercepted the motor encoder cable, with an ENCY card from Mesa,
> the machine was open loop in regards to the spindle prior to this.
>
> Would anyone know what the PPR might be on one of these, I didn't know
> if they used a common PPR encoder on these motors, or of maybe a way to
> figure out what it is? The motor is from 1984, it is a model 8, PN:
> A06B-1008-B 700#8000. I can't find any data for it any where, and I am
> not sure what to put in INI section to try to get it going.
>
>
> --
>
> Thanks
>
>
> Rick Lair
> Superior Roll & Turning LLC
> 399 East Center Street
> Petersburg MI, 49270
> PH: 734-279-1831
> FAX: 734-279-1166
> www.superiorroll.com
>
>
> --
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[Emc-users] Fanuc Spindle Motor Encoder PPR

[Rick Lair]

I have a Fanuc spindle motor on the VMC I am retrofitting right now, 
and  I intercepted the motor encoder cable, with an ENCY card from Mesa, 
the machine was open loop in regards to the spindle prior to this.

Would anyone know what the PPR might be on one of these, I didn't know 
if they used a common PPR encoder on these motors, or of maybe a way to 
figure out what it is? The motor is from 1984, it is a model 8, PN: 
A06B-1008-B 700#8000. I can't find any data for it any where, and I am 
not sure what to put in INI section to try to get it going.


-- 

Thanks


Rick Lair
Superior Roll & Turning LLC
399 East Center Street
Petersburg MI, 49270
PH: 734-279-1831
FAX: 734-279-1166
www.superiorroll.com


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 10s ini-file

[Jon Elson]

On 02/26/2014 10:27 AM, Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
> Folks
>
> I am happy, then with the help of Jon I got my Fanuc 10s servomotor
> running with his pico-systems universal pwm board, fanuc encoder und
> servo amp. Encoder runs and the motor is turning - somewhat...
>
> I was playing around with the parameters but never got a nice motor
> movement. "following 0 error" or - when I change FERROR and MIN_FERROR -
> the motor get in a loop and starts vibrating.
>
> Does anybody has the correct ini-settings for this motors?
>
>
Here's the settings I use on my Fanuc test station:
[AXIS_0]

TYPE =  LINEAR
UNITS = 0.03937007874016
HOME =  0.000
MAX_VELOCITY =  1.20
MAX_ACCELERATION =  5.0
PID_MAX_VEL =  5
BACKLASH = 0.000
CYCLE_TIME =0.001000
INPUT_SCALE =   -16
OUTPUT_SCALE = 1.000
PWM_OUTPUT_SCALE =  -1
MIN_LIMIT = -10.0
MAX_LIMIT = 10.0
FERROR = 1.102
MIN_FERROR = 1.105
HOME_OFFSET =0.0
HOME_SEARCH_VEL =0.0
HOME_LATCH_VEL = 0.0
HOME_USE_INDEX = NO
HOME_IGNORE_LIMITS = NO
DEADBAND = 2e-05
P =  40
I =  0.3
D =0.25
BIAS = 0
FF0 =  0
FF1 =  0.08
FF2 =  0.0011

This is used with the encoder velocity estimation enabled, but
should be close even without that feature.

Jon

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[Emc-users] Fanuc 10s ini-file

[Daniel Duesentrieb]

Folks

I am happy, then with the help of Jon I got my Fanuc 10s servomotor 
running with his pico-systems universal pwm board, fanuc encoder und 
servo amp. Encoder runs and the motor is turning - somewhat...

I was playing around with the parameters but never got a nice motor 
movement. "following 0 error" or - when I change FERROR and MIN_FERROR - 
the motor get in a loop and starts vibrating.

Does anybody has the correct ini-settings for this motors?

Thank you for help!

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Daniel Duesentrieb]

Thanks for translation. I am Swiss and speak German but live in Canada


On 02/13/2014 12:54 AM, Gregg Eshelman wrote:
> On 2/12/2014 5:55 AM, Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
>> I just tried. it works like a charm.
>>
>> from the 80VAC transformer into a "flow straightener" (is this the right
>> word for the part who converts AC to DC?) and straight to the motor.
> Sounds about right. :) Translated from what language?
>
> The English term is rectifier.
>
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Peter Blodow]

A german Gleichrichter is an english rectifier, both derived from a 
latin rectificator ("straight maker").
Peter


Am 12.02.2014 13:55, schrieb Daniel Duesentrieb:
> I just tried. it works like a charm.
>
> from the 80VAC transformer into a "flow straightener" (is this the right
> word for the part who converts AC to DC?) and straight to the motor. Pin
> A is + (plus).
>
> no noise, nothing - just releases the brake.
>
> thanks, guys
>


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Gregg Eshelman]

On 2/12/2014 5:55 AM, Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
> I just tried. it works like a charm.
>
> from the 80VAC transformer into a "flow straightener" (is this the right
> word for the part who converts AC to DC?) and straight to the motor.

Sounds about right. :) Translated from what language?

The English term is rectifier.


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Gene Heskett]

On Wednesday 12 February 2014 16:09:17 Daniel Duesentrieb did opine:

> I just tried. it works like a charm.
> 
> from the 80VAC transformer into a "flow straightener" (is this the right
> word for the part who converts AC to DC?) and straight to the motor. Pin
> A is + (plus).

In English, that is a "rectifier". That size is maybe a dollar and a 
quarter in parts this side of the pond.

If you have a multimeter, what is the resistance (ohms) of this braking 
coil?

> 
> no noise, nothing - just releases the brake.
> 
> thanks, guys
> 
> On 02/11/2014 11:17 PM, Cecil Thomas wrote:
> > 80 volts is approximately what you get with half wave rectified 120 V
> > AC. Unfortunately with no filter it might make the brake into a
> > buzzer.
> > 
> > Cecil
> > 
> > On 02/11/2014 01:21 PM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
> >   > have not 80v dc. could take 120vdc.
> >   > 
> >   > witch is plus, A or B ?
> > 
> > I'm pretty sure the polarity doesn't matter.  But, if the brakes
> > are designed for 80 V DC, 120 V will likely burn out the coils.
> > Power goes up as the SQUARE of voltage, so 120 V is
> > 2.25 times more heat than 80 V.  (I have no idea what
> > the rated voltage for the brake actually is.)
> > 
> > --
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Cheers, Gene
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NOTICE: Will pay 100 USD for an HP-4815A defective but
complete probe assembly.


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Daniel Duesentrieb]

I just tried. it works like a charm.

from the 80VAC transformer into a "flow straightener" (is this the right 
word for the part who converts AC to DC?) and straight to the motor. Pin 
A is + (plus).

no noise, nothing - just releases the brake.

thanks, guys


On 02/11/2014 11:17 PM, Cecil Thomas wrote:
> 80 volts is approximately what you get with half wave rectified 120 V AC.
> Unfortunately with no filter it might make the brake into a buzzer.
>
> Cecil
>
>
>
> On 02/11/2014 01:21 PM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
>   > have not 80v dc. could take 120vdc.
>   >
>   > witch is plus, A or B ?
>
> I'm pretty sure the polarity doesn't matter.  But, if the brakes
> are designed for 80 V DC, 120 V will likely burn out the coils.
> Power goes up as the SQUARE of voltage, so 120 V is
> 2.25 times more heat than 80 V.  (I have no idea what
> the rated voltage for the brake actually is.)
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Daniel Duesentrieb]

In the video he says

80 VDC. Pin A is +

The break release at 28 VDC.




On 02/11/2014 02:21 PM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
>
> have not 80v dc. could take 120vdc.
>
> witch is plus, A or B ?
>
>
> --
> On Tue, 11 Feb, 2014 9:12 AM PST Jon Elson wrote:
>
>> On 02/11/2014 07:39 AM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
>>> video about the brake:
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXUScv7R8Ik&feature=youtube_gdata_player
>>>
>>> so i am planing to connect the brake direkt after the main transformer.
>>>
>>> ca. 80VAC
>>>
>>> is that ok?
>>>
>>>
>> I think Fanuc brakes are DC, not AC.
>>
>> Jon
>>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Cecil Thomas]

80 volts is approximately what you get with half wave rectified 120 V AC.
Unfortunately with no filter it might make the brake into a buzzer.

Cecil



On 02/11/2014 01:21 PM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
 > have not 80v dc. could take 120vdc.
 >
 > witch is plus, A or B ?

I'm pretty sure the polarity doesn't matter.  But, if the brakes
are designed for 80 V DC, 120 V will likely burn out the coils.
Power goes up as the SQUARE of voltage, so 120 V is
2.25 times more heat than 80 V.  (I have no idea what
the rated voltage for the brake actually is.)

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/11/2014 01:21 PM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
>
> have not 80v dc. could take 120vdc.
>
> witch is plus, A or B ?
>
>
>
I'm pretty sure the polarity doesn't matter.  But, if the brakes
are designed for 80 V DC, 120 V will likely burn out the coils.
Power goes up as the SQUARE of voltage, so 120 V is
2.25 times more heat than 80 V.  (I have no idea what
the rated voltage for the brake actually is.)

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Duesentrieb Yahoo]

have not 80v dc. could take 120vdc.

witch is plus, A or B ?


--
On Tue, 11 Feb, 2014 9:12 AM PST Jon Elson wrote:

>On 02/11/2014 07:39 AM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
>> video about the brake:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXUScv7R8Ik&feature=youtube_gdata_player
>>
>> so i am planing to connect the brake direkt after the main transformer.
>>
>> ca. 80VAC
>>
>> is that ok?
>>
>>
>I think Fanuc brakes are DC, not AC.
>
>Jon
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/11/2014 07:39 AM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
> video about the brake:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXUScv7R8Ik&feature=youtube_gdata_player
>
> so i am planing to connect the brake direkt after the main transformer.
>
> ca. 80VAC
>
> is that ok?
>
>
I think Fanuc brakes are DC, not AC.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/11/2014 07:23 AM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
> thank you jon
>
> there is also a 2 pin connector at the black part if the motor. right beside 
> the 4 pin power connector.
>
> what about this one? i think it is the brake. ist that right.
>
> please see here:
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-MNy6-QanI&feature=youtube_gdata_player
>
> at 2:00
>
The small connector at the "middle" of the motor is 
definitely the
brake.  The encoder there does not show the 2nd connector, it
is usually at a 45 degree angle to the larger connector.  If 
present,
that is the battery connector for an ABS-type encoder.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Duesentrieb Yahoo]

video about the brake:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXUScv7R8Ik&feature=youtube_gdata_player

so i am planing to connect the brake direkt after the main transformer.

ca. 80VAC

is that ok?

--
On Mon, 10 Feb, 2014 6:46 PM PST Jon Elson wrote:

>On 02/10/2014 03:45 AM, Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
>> Folks,
>>
>> I am trying to get this servo moving with the drivers from 
>> Pico-Systems.
>>
>> I am going to wire like this:
>> http://pico-systems.com/images/fanuc.pdf
>>
>>
>> But here is my question: What about the 2 (one on the 
>> servo, one on the "red cab" encoder) 3-pin connector?
>>
>> As I understand is the one on the motor the brake. But 
>> what is the one on the cab?
>>
>You mean a small, 2-pin connector on the red cap of the encoder?
>The early Fanuc red cap ABS encoders had an add-on battery
>feature.  Apparently, (I haven't tested this, but it was 
>described to
>me) when the controller +5V came up, these would send a stream
>of quadrature counts to tell the controller how far from the 
>index
>location the motor currently was.  That connector was for
>the backup battery for this function to work.  Assuming you have
>a way to home the robot, you don't need this feature.  If you
>don't have a way to safely home the robot, then you might
>want to explore how this feature works.
>
>Jon
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Duesentrieb Yahoo]

thank you jon

there is also a 2 pin connector at the black part if the motor. right beside 
the 4 pin power connector.

what about this one? i think it is the brake. ist that right. 

please see here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l-MNy6-QanI&feature=youtube_gdata_player

at 2:00



--
On Mon, 10 Feb, 2014 6:46 PM PST Jon Elson wrote:

>On 02/10/2014 03:45 AM, Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
>> Folks,
>>
>> I am trying to get this servo moving with the drivers from 
>> Pico-Systems.
>>
>> I am going to wire like this:
>> http://pico-systems.com/images/fanuc.pdf
>>
>>
>> But here is my question: What about the 2 (one on the 
>> servo, one on the "red cab" encoder) 3-pin connector?
>>
>> As I understand is the one on the motor the brake. But 
>> what is the one on the cab?
>>
>You mean a small, 2-pin connector on the red cap of the encoder?
>The early Fanuc red cap ABS encoders had an add-on battery
>feature.  Apparently, (I haven't tested this, but it was 
>described to
>me) when the controller +5V came up, these would send a stream
>of quadrature counts to tell the controller how far from the 
>index
>location the motor currently was.  That connector was for
>the backup battery for this function to work.  Assuming you have
>a way to home the robot, you don't need this feature.  If you
>don't have a way to safely home the robot, then you might
>want to explore how this feature works.
>
>Jon
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/10/2014 08:46 PM, Jon Elson wrote:

Oh, I should have mentioned, the encoder and Fanuc converter
will work fine if you just leave that connector with nothing
connected to it.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

On 02/10/2014 03:45 AM, Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
> Folks,
>
> I am trying to get this servo moving with the drivers from 
> Pico-Systems.
>
> I am going to wire like this:
> http://pico-systems.com/images/fanuc.pdf
>
>
> But here is my question: What about the 2 (one on the 
> servo, one on the "red cab" encoder) 3-pin connector?
>
> As I understand is the one on the motor the brake. But 
> what is the one on the cab?
>
You mean a small, 2-pin connector on the red cap of the encoder?
The early Fanuc red cap ABS encoders had an add-on battery
feature.  Apparently, (I haven't tested this, but it was 
described to
me) when the controller +5V came up, these would send a stream
of quadrature counts to tell the controller how far from the 
index
location the motor currently was.  That connector was for
the backup battery for this function to work.  Assuming you have
a way to home the robot, you don't need this feature.  If you
don't have a way to safely home the robot, then you might
want to explore how this feature works.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 7M manual

[Ron Bean]

Is it this one?

http://www.gobookee.org/fanuc-7m-mill-manual/


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 7M Manual message on Emc-users Digest, Vol 91, Issue 111

[James Isaac]

> Message: 2
> Date: Thu, 28 Nov 2013 20:14:57 -0800
> From: dave 
> Subject: [Emc-users] Fanuc 7M manual
> To: "Enhanced Machine Controller (EMC)"
>   
> Message-ID: <1385698497.2483.4.camel@d-dsk>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="UTF-8"
> 
> All I ask is that everyone doesn't die rolling on the floor laughing. 
> There might be someone out there that could use this. 
> Please respond promptly; else it goes in the trash.  
> 
> The cost is that of mailing it; probably media mail. I'll consult my
> local media specialist. ;-)
> 
> This is the operators manual with a scrounged loose-leaf binder. 
> 
> Dave
> 

Hello.

I would like the Fanuc 7M manual.

Would a U.S $10.00 money order be enough for postage,
a coffee or tea,
and the knowledge the manual was not going into the circular filing cabinet?


James Isaac.
  
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[Emc-users] Fanuc 7M manual

[dave]

All I ask is that everyone doesn't die rolling on the floor laughing. 
There might be someone out there that could use this. 
Please respond promptly; else it goes in the trash.  

The cost is that of mailing it; probably media mail. I'll consult my
local media specialist. ;-)

This is the operators manual with a scrounged loose-leaf binder. 

Dave


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Duesentrieb Yahoo]

Lol

Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Gregg Eshelman]

On 11/8/2013 7:58 AM, Duesentrieb Yahoo wrote:
> Thank youu Marius,
>
> Right now I am going with option 2 and Jon. The driver is in the way. I 
> ordered 1 for now to see if it works.
>
> I agree with your opinion that 2.2kw should be enough. I do not plan to di 
> heavy lifting - I want to mill wood with a 1" mill and chainsaw.
>
> Beeing in canada does not stop me from visiting you in Stuttgart ;)

A robotized chainsaw, in the hands of a Canadian... sounds like a movie 
tagline. ;)


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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Duesentrieb Yahoo]

Thank youu Marius,

Right now I am going with option 2 and Jon. The driver is in the way. I ordered 
1 for now to see if it works.

I agree with your opinion that 2.2kw should be enough. I do not plan to di 
heavy lifting - I want to mill wood with a 1" mill and chainsaw.

Beeing in canada does not stop me from visiting you in Stuttgart ;)

Gruss vom Basler.



Sent from Yahoo Mail on Android

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Marius Alksnys]

Daniel,

as I understand from the nameplate - these are synchronous permanent 
magnet motors?
If so, I can say - take mesa 5i20 or 5i23 or similar and you will be 
able to control your servo amps directly using bldc component.
For encoders - they are usual (or almost usual) quadrature + index, 
differential ones? If so - take some board from Mesa like 7i48 or 7i52 
(need to check though), use bldc.init for finding index and absolute 
encoders will not be needed.

Second way is to use 8i20, which IMO would be more than enough. I use 
them for my robot. One motor is 3.6kW and 8i20 is doing right job. I 
think full power is never used - motor is oversized for cases when it 
holds heavy arm for long time in one position and part of the windings 
are heating more.. And yes, my motors are rated at about 300V, so the 
currents are smaller.

Third way is to use my amps with 5i20 / 5i23 or similar.. They are 
working, but I need to test them more..

I would choose first way
Wish you were in Stutgart.. :)

Marius

On 2013.10.24 22:53, Daniel wrote:
> Hi guys
>
> complete new at linuxcnc, robotics and mailing lists. I am a software
> engineer, at least I can start up a pc from a cd. So please be nice and
> patient with me ;)
>
> Want to get our robot going with with Linuxcnc. So far I found following
> information:
>
> Motors:
> Fancu Model 10, Type A06B-0501-B751 AC Servo Motor.
> Fancu Model 20F, Type A06B-0352-B731 AC Servo Motor.
>
> (Have a red cap in the back - does that mean 'read cap' I can see
> sometimes?)
>
>
> Drivers:
> 2 x Fanuc A06B-6058-H006
> 1 x Fanuc A06B-6058-H006/J016
> 2 x Fanuc A06B-6058-H005
>
>
> Connections driver (all model same):
>
> 01PWMA (ALM1)
> 02COMA
> 03PWMB (ALM2)
> 04COMB
> 05PWMC (ALM4)
> 06COMC
> 07DRDY
> 08IR
> 09GDR
> 10IS
> 11GDS
> 12MCON
> 13GND
> 14PWMD (ALM8)
> 15COMD
> 16PWME
> 17COME
>
>
> (ALMn) means this is bidirectional and can be read as alarm when on the
> board is an alarm
>
> Pulsencoder from the motor:
>
> 010V
> 020V
> 030V
> 045V
> 055V
> 065V
> 07empty
> 08empty
> 09empty
> 10empty
> 11empty
> 12empty
> 13empty
> 14PCZ
> 15PCZ*
> 16PCA
> 17PCA*
> 18PCB
> 19PCB*
> 20empty
>
> Question:
>
> a) Can I use the mesa 6i25 + 7i77 card to run this?
> b) Can anyone help me with the wiring?
> c) Does somebody already did this and would share the hal-files with me?
>
> Thanks so much - any help is much appreciated!
> Dusko
>
>
>
>
> --
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Marius Alksnys]

Daniel,

as I understand from the nameplate - these are synchronous permanent 
magnet motors?
If so, I can say - take mesa 5i20 or 5i23 or similar and you will be 
able to control your servo amps directly using bldc component.
For encoders - they are usual (or almost usual) quadrature + index, 
differential ones? If so - take some board from Mesa like 7i48 or 7i52 
(need to check though), use bldc.init for finding index and absolute 
encoders will not be needed.

Second way is to use 8i20, which IMO would be more than enough. I use 
them for my robot. One motor is 3.6kW and 8i20 is doing right job. I 
think full power is never used - motor is oversized for cases when it 
holds heavy arm for long time in one position and part of the windings 
are heating more.. And yes, my motors are rated at about 300V, so the 
currents are smaller.

Third way is to use my amps with 5i20 / 5i23 or similar.. They are 
working, but I need to test them more..

I would choose first way
Wish you were in Stutgart.. :)

Marius

On 2013.10.24 22:53, Daniel wrote:
> Hi guys
>
> complete new at linuxcnc, robotics and mailing lists. I am a software
> engineer, at least I can start up a pc from a cd. So please be nice and
> patient with me ;)
>
> Want to get our robot going with with Linuxcnc. So far I found following
> information:
>
> Motors:
> Fancu Model 10, Type A06B-0501-B751 AC Servo Motor.
> Fancu Model 20F, Type A06B-0352-B731 AC Servo Motor.
>
> (Have a red cap in the back - does that mean 'read cap' I can see
> sometimes?)
>
>
> Drivers:
> 2 x Fanuc A06B-6058-H006
> 1 x Fanuc A06B-6058-H006/J016
> 2 x Fanuc A06B-6058-H005
>
>
> Connections driver (all model same):
>
> 01PWMA (ALM1)
> 02COMA
> 03PWMB (ALM2)
> 04COMB
> 05PWMC (ALM4)
> 06COMC
> 07DRDY
> 08IR
> 09GDR
> 10IS
> 11GDS
> 12MCON
> 13GND
> 14PWMD (ALM8)
> 15COMD
> 16PWME
> 17COME
>
>
> (ALMn) means this is bidirectional and can be read as alarm when on the
> board is an alarm
>
> Pulsencoder from the motor:
>
> 010V
> 020V
> 030V
> 045V
> 055V
> 065V
> 07empty
> 08empty
> 09empty
> 10empty
> 11empty
> 12empty
> 13empty
> 14PCZ
> 15PCZ*
> 16PCA
> 17PCA*
> 18PCB
> 19PCB*
> 20empty
>
> Question:
>
> a) Can I use the mesa 6i25 + 7i77 card to run this?
> b) Can anyone help me with the wiring?
> c) Does somebody already did this and would share the hal-files with me?
>
> Thanks so much - any help is much appreciated!
> Dusko
>
>
>
>
> --
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> Explore tips for MPI, OpenMP, advanced profiling, and more. Get the most from
> the latest Intel processors and coprocessors. See abstracts and register >
> http://pubads.g.doubleclick.net/gampad/clk?id=60135991&iu=/4140/ostg.clktrk



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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Style Offsets

[Jeff Johnson]

We are using GScreen. We will lose the ability to read any of the tool data
and have to make a new tool table with new data entered and re-apply before
Linuxcnc can recognize the tool. Returns a message "Tool not available" we
then either re-apply or in extreme cases have to make a new tool table
because it will not read any of the data for any tool.


"What version of linuxcnc are you using?" 

Using Master 2.6 Pre and we are editing the tool table with tooledit.



"What does your tool table look like?"

I attached a copy of my tool table









mytool.tbl
Description: Binary data
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Style offsets

[andy pugh]

On 1 November 2013 16:10, Jeff Johnson  wrote:

> We are using GScreen. We will lose the ability to read any of the tool data
> and have to make a new tool table with new data entered and re-apply before
> Linuxcnc can recognize the tool.

Are you editing the tool table with a text editor, or with tooledit?

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc Style offsets

[Jeff Johnson]

"We are using a system for lathe tools using a T word with the tool 
number and offset together in one number. I haven't had any trouble with 
it, so far. What user interface are you using?"

We are using GScreen. We will lose the ability to read any of the tool data
and have to make a new tool table with new data entered and re-apply before
Linuxcnc can recognize the tool. Returns a message "Tool not available" we
then either re-apply or in extreme cases have to make a new tool table
because it will not read any of the data for any tool.  




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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc style offsets

[Sebastian Kuzminsky]

On 11/1/13 07:41 , Jeff Johnson wrote:
>
>
> I am wondering if anybody on the list is using the fanuc style offset patch?
> We are using it with Gscreen and it works great 90% of the time. There are
> times however that Linuxcnc will not recognize the tool with out re-applying
> the data or in extreme cases we have to make a whole new tool table and re
> enter all of the tool data for every tool. Any thoughts?

What version of linuxcnc are you using?

What does your tool table look like?


-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc style offsets

[Kirk Wallace]

On 11/01/2013 06:41 AM, Jeff Johnson wrote:
>
>
> I am wondering if anybody on the list is using the fanuc style offset patch?
> We are using it with Gscreen and it works great 90% of the time. There are
> times however that Linuxcnc will not recognize the tool with out re-applying
> the data or in extreme cases we have to make a whole new tool table and re
> enter all of the tool data for every tool. Any thoughts?

We are using a system for lathe tools using a T word with the tool 
number and offset together in one number. I haven't had any trouble with 
it, so far. What user interface are you using?

-- 
Kirk Wallace
http://www.wallacecompany.com/machine_shop/
http://www.wallacecompany.com/E45/

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[Emc-users] Fanuc style offsets

[Jeff Johnson]

 

I am wondering if anybody on the list is using the fanuc style offset patch?
We are using it with Gscreen and it works great 90% of the time. There are
times however that Linuxcnc will not recognize the tool with out re-applying
the data or in extreme cases we have to make a whole new tool table and re
enter all of the tool data for every tool. Any thoughts? 

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Duesentrieb Yahoo]

thanks for the video.

before I can home I have to move first. lol

what drivers/controller board do you have on this?



--
On Sun, 27 Oct, 2013 9:57 AM PDT Chris Radek wrote:

>On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 10:36:48PM -0500, Jon Elson wrote:
>> LinuxCNC has a mechanism to home axes in sequence, and then move
>> to a particular position offset from the index pulse location.
>> So, this should allow the machine to be homed safely from most
>> positions.  
>
>This is how we set up homing on a puma-like robot at MPM:
>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmNlP7bm0Nc
>
>It's true you have to be a little careful about the initial position
>before starting the homing process, but it's not at all hard to
>safely home it.
>
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Chris Radek]

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 10:36:48PM -0500, Jon Elson wrote:
> LinuxCNC has a mechanism to home axes in sequence, and then move
> to a particular position offset from the index pulse location.
> So, this should allow the machine to be homed safely from most
> positions.  

This is how we set up homing on a puma-like robot at MPM:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZmNlP7bm0Nc

It's true you have to be a little careful about the initial position
before starting the homing process, but it's not at all hard to
safely home it.

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[andy pugh]

On 27 October 2013 03:48, Jon Elson  wrote:

> Possibly.  To use my (Pico Systems) gear, you would need our encoder
> converter
> board, as the commutation signals from the encoder are not industry
> standard.
> They provide 4 signals that give a Gray code approximation of absolute rotor
> position, for their own commutations scheme.  Our Fanuc converter converts
> this to an approximation of the standard Hall signals until it has seen
> the index
> pulse, then it uses the quadrature plus index to provide the most
> accurate Hall
> signals.)

It is also possible to do this in software using the "bldc" HAL
component, though it would use up a lot of IO.
You would need 4 input pins per joint for the Gray-code signals, and
then 3 output pins to the drives for the emulated Hall sensor signals.

-- 
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Gene Heskett]

On Sunday 27 October 2013 05:45:34 Jon Elson did opine:

> andy pugh wrote:
> > On 26 October 2013 21:09, Jon Elson  wrote:
> >> The ABS encoders, if battery backup
> >> is provided,  apparently put out a burst of quadrature pulses to
> >> revolve the apparent position to the offset from the index
> >> position, thereby eliminating the need to home the axis.  But,
> >> I've never tried this with my PWM system.
> > 
> > I can't see any reason for this not to "just work" if the power-up
> > sequence is correct.
> 
> Yes, that's the trick.  You'd have to wait for LinuxCNC to be fully up,
> AFTER
> it zeroes the encoder counters, and then power on the encoders so they
> send that quadrature pulse train.  It may require some control signal
> to the encoder
> to make it do this.  Fanuc, of course, doesn't have any documents on
> ANYTHING, they are more secret than the CIA.  Then, you'd have to
> have LinuxCNC clear all offsets in the .var file, so that the initial
> value in the encoder position counts are taken as the machine position
> at startup. This is certainly not the usual way of using LinuxCNC, but
> it seems like it MIGHT work without any code changes.  Clearing the
> offsets in the .var file might be handled by a startup script.
> 
> Jon

Whoever writes that startup script gets my good housekeeping seal of 
approval.

I don't know how many times I've had to stop linuxcnc on my lathe, delete 
both the .var and position.txt files, and restart it before my homing 
sequence works correctly.  If at some point, I have used a touch-off to 
adjust an error, its remembered forever till I stop, kill the files & 
restart.  Or if, in shutting down linuxcnc, it crashes the box, which seems 
to be about a 1/100 occurrence, the .var file in particular will be 
trashed, causing linuxcnc to do an error exit on the restart until the file 
is nuked.  IIRC this can be triggered for demo purposes by nuking the file, 
then touching it, leaving an empty file.

Perhaps in addition to the current "linuxcnc -l" to load the last config, 
maybe it could grow a -k option that deletes those files, truly starting 
from scratch?  Checking the current man page, it doesn't even document the
 -l.  Shouldn't that have been fixed when the -l was introduced?  The man 
page was last edited by Alex Joni in 2006.

Cheers, Gene
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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
> Thanks Andy,
>
> So I have to replace the drivers with the ones from Pica or Mesa. Do I 
> still need the encoder converter electronics?
>
>   
Possibly.  To use my (Pico Systems) gear, you would need our encoder 
converter
board, as the commutation signals from the encoder are not industry 
standard.
They provide 4 signals that give a Gray code approximation of absolute rotor
position, for their own commutations scheme.  Our Fanuc converter converts
this to an approximation of the standard Hall signals until it has seen 
the index
pulse, then it uses the quadrature plus index to provide the most 
accurate Hall
signals.)
> Yes, I can see they "only" have 2.2KW, I would need ~3KW. I do not blan 
> to lift heavy parts. In fact I want to use the robot as a 5-axis mill 
> and cut in wood. So I guess this would not be a problem.
>
>   
The problem with wood is that you may want higher feedrates, and thus
higher accelerations would be needed.
> Then would be for now to buy the pico drivers and encoder converter plus 
> the mesa controller/daughter card for now. Keep the original driver 
> until Mesa shows up with the right controller and then switch back.
>
> Sounds like a plan?
>   
That will probably also work fine.  You'd then feed just ABZ back to the 
Mesa
board, and PWM and direction to the servo amp.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

andy pugh wrote:
> On 26 October 2013 21:09, Jon Elson  wrote:
>   
>> The ABS encoders, if battery backup
>> is provided,  apparently put out a burst of quadrature pulses to
>> revolve the apparent position to the offset from the index
>> position, thereby eliminating the need to home the axis.  But,
>> I've never tried this with my PWM system.
>> 
>
> I can't see any reason for this not to "just work" if the power-up
> sequence is correct.
>   
Yes, that's the trick.  You'd have to wait for LinuxCNC to be fully up, 
AFTER
it zeroes the encoder counters, and then power on the encoders so they send
that quadrature pulse train.  It may require some control signal to the 
encoder
to make it do this.  Fanuc, of course, doesn't have any documents on
ANYTHING, they are more secret than the CIA.  Then, you'd have to
have LinuxCNC clear all offsets in the .var file, so that the initial value
in the encoder position counts are taken as the machine position at startup.
This is certainly not the usual way of using LinuxCNC, but it seems like
it MIGHT work without any code changes.  Clearing the offsets in the
.var file might be handled by a startup script.

Jon

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Re: [Emc-users] Fanuc 420F 6-axis robot

[Jon Elson]

Daniel Duesentrieb wrote:
> Like I wrote in my very first post I have absolutely no clue what I am 
> talking about. So please explain to me like to a child ;)
>
> I understand that system doesn't know in witch positions the servos are 
> because the encoders loose the values on a power off. I understand that 
> I have to jog every single axis to a specific position and adjust with 
> linuxcnc as my own homing process. This is maybe a pain in the a.. but 
> can be handled.
>
>   
LinuxCNC can home the joints.  They probably have a coarse position 
sensor, if
not, one could be added.  The encoders definitely have an index pulse, that
is accurate to one encoder count.  LinuxCNC has a mechanism to home
axes in sequence, and then move to a particular position offset from the 
index
pulse location.  So, this should allow the machine to be homed safely from
most positions.  But, there probably are some positions from which a homing
move might cause interference.  Possibly, you would have to jog the
robot to some initial position so the homing could be done without causing
a crash.  I might guess homing the outermost joint first, and working back
toward the base rotation joint as the last one, with the home offsets such
that the arm ends up folded close to the torso would be best.

> But first I need to be able to get the servos moving. Here is my question:
>
> Witch controller board do I need to use my original drivers? Or is it 
> not possible to use them and I need new ones?
>   
Your original Fanuc drives need 3 separate PWM signals per joint, with 5 
joints
that is 15 PWM drive signals.  As I think Peter said, even he may not have a
working solution at this time.
> What Hardware do I need to get this Robot moving asap?
>   
For ASAP, I think I do have a solution.  It would take :
2 Universal PWM Controllers  $250   500
5 brushless PWM servo amps150750
5 Fanuc encoder converters   150750
   
Total   
 
2000

I know that is a lot of money to spend on a speculative project.
These PWM servo amps are six-step (trapezoidal) drive, and
so not as smooth as sinusoidal drive.  But, they are simple,
and don't need powerful DSP processors to generate the
PWM commands.  I have some very similar motors here that
I use to test my drives and encoder converters.

Jon

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