Re: [EVDL] leaf blowers

[Peri Hartman via EV]

Please bear in mind that most municipalities (Seattle, at any rate) 
aren't going to mandate corded electric blowers.  The most it seems they 
would be willing to go is electric with battery.  Personally, I don't 
like leaf blowers and don't use them myself.  My motivation in this is 
to find a practical way to reduce the noise - which is often around 75db 
at my windows.  (Avoiding the dust would be fantasitc, but it's not 
going to happen.)  If I can find a product or some other solution that 
is practical for commercial use, the city might listen.


Peri

-- Original Message --
From: "Robert Bruninga" 
To: "Rush Dougherty" ; "Electric Vehicle 
Discussion List" 
Cc: "Peri Hartman" ; "Robert Bruninga" 


Sent: 23-Jul-14 9:50:54 PM
Subject: Re: [EVDL] leaf blowers

I hate em too!  I only use one as a last-resort since I swear I can 
actually RAKE leaves and finishe the job in shorter time wtih a rake 
onto tarps and carry to the mulch pile than all the time going back and 
forth with the stupid blower which then you still have to rake into 
some kind of carrying system.


But Electric is the ONLY way to go.  They always work, they  always 
start and they are cheaper.  Sure they have cords, But DEAL WITH it.  
Messing with the cord is sure cleaner and easy and repeatable 
compareedd to fussing with gas and oil!


Oh, and hey are quieter (but only somwhat, so they are still a 
detestible intrusion on the neighborhood).


Bob, Wb4APR


On Thu, Jul 24, 2014 at 12:09 AM, Rush Dougherty via EV 
 wrote:
This is a little off subject, but personally I detest Leaf Blowers 
all they
do is push the dirt/leaves into the air and off of your property on to 
my

property. I put it in the same category as littering.

Rush
www.TucsonEV.com


> -Original Message-
> From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Peri 
Hartman via EV

> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2014 6:16 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: [EVDL] leaf blowers
>
> My city (Seattle) is studying leaf blower noise and other mal 
effects and is

> interested in the viability of electric powered models.  I have the
opportunity to
> help supply them with information and am wondering if anyone has any 
knowledge
> or other info on what electric powered models are available and 
suitable for
> professional use.  Any studies by other jurisdictions, such as a 
lifetime cost

> comparison between gas and electric, would be welcome too.
>
> Since this is off topic, please respond to me directly.
>
> Peri
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Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?

[Ben Goren via EV]

On Jul 23, 2014, at 3:45 AM, Ben Apollonio via EV  wrote:

> On the contrary.  Tesla cells discharge at a very LOW current.  When you have 
> 85kWh of battery, you only need 3.5C to make 300kW, and C/5 to cruise at 
> 55MPH.  Even the 120kW 'supercharger' tops out at about 2C (for the smaller 
> 60kWh battery).
> 
> I would hazard this is why larger cells are not designed for large currents.  
> RC cars are designed to run for 2 minutes and are trying to maximize 
> power/weight.  Most real world applications need more capacity and have to 
> optimize energy/weight, so there's significantly less market for cells at 
> 100Ah and 300C (not to mention that you would then have to find a way to 
> manage 30,000 amps!!).

You would seem to be correct. Judging by the battery packs I've found being 
sold for BEVs at the types of places listed as authorized dealers for Netgain 
and HPEVS, it looks like the assumption is that you're going to be throwing 
lots of batteries at the car so you don't need to worry much about individual 
battery discharge capability.

I haven't by any stretch of the imagination done any sort of thorough 
investigation, but the first pass suggests that something along these lines 
might be the direction I'd have to head in:

http://www.all-battery.com/tenergy3.2v1300mah4.16whlifepo4ifr18650prechargeablebattery-30065.aspx

It's a single 18650-sized cell (Wikipedia says that's what the Tesla uses; 
looks to be a bit bigger than a AA) with a 1.35 Ah capacity. If my math is 
right, to get to ~10 kWh I'd need 1 kWh / (1.35 Ah * 3.2 V) ~= 2300 cells. 
Each cell supports up to 10 A continuous discharge...and 23,000 A is not only 
wy more than I'd need, it sounds positively terrifying. 2300 * 3.2 V ~= 
7,400 V, which is again scary overkill -- and, obviously, they'd have to be 
wired in combinations of series and parallel banks to get that down to a 
reasonable range. Make the math easy, and do it as 50 packs of 45 batteries 
each for 144 V, 9.7 kWh, and  maximum current draw...and 
~200 pounds of batteries. And about $9000 in batteries (almost 4x the cost of 
144 V of CALB 40 Ah packs), before the cost of the hardware to wire them up and 
the time that would go into doing the wiring. At that point, what I was 
thinking of as the advantage of a small pack is long gone. This kind of a
 n homebrew system still might make more sense for this particular project than 
an off-the-shelf product, but it would mean a bunch of re-thinking

Has anybody here already done this type of research? Is there a graceful way to 
get to high current capacity with a small pack size? Maybe a different size 
cell to build the packs from? I'm obviously not an expert on battery 
technology

Thanks again,

b&
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Re: [EVDL] leaf blowers

[Rush Dougherty via EV]

This is a little off subject, but personally I detest Leaf Blowers all they
do is push the dirt/leaves into the air and off of your property on to my
property. I put it in the same category as littering.

Rush
www.TucsonEV.com


> -Original Message-
> From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Peri Hartman via EV
> Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2014 6:16 PM
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: [EVDL] leaf blowers
>
> My city (Seattle) is studying leaf blower noise and other mal effects and is
> interested in the viability of electric powered models.  I have the
opportunity to
> help supply them with information and am wondering if anyone has any knowledge
> or other info on what electric powered models are available and suitable for
> professional use.  Any studies by other jurisdictions, such as a lifetime cost
> comparison between gas and electric, would be welcome too.
>
> Since this is off topic, please respond to me directly.
>
> Peri
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Re: [EVDL] Hybrid Mustang: Motor control

[Ben Goren via EV]

On Jul 23, 2014, at 6:52 PM, Collin Kidder  wrote:

> You might keep in mind the GEVCU project which can be purchased from EVTV

Ooooh...I like!

> Currently it works with DMOC645, Brusa, and Coda UQM controllers.

What would be involved in support for the typical Curtis or Zilla controllers 
used with the HPEVS or WarP motors? Could one, for example, reasonably create a 
generic controller that just put out a digested 5v signal to feed to the 
controller?

b&
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: Renault 16ton Electric Delivery Lorry/Truck

[Al via EV]

- Original Message - 
From: "brucedp5 via EV" 

To: 
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2014 6:17 AM
Subject: [EVDL] EVLN: Renault 16ton Electric Delivery Lorry/Truck


Since when is Renault renowned for its electric cars?

Al




Renowned for its electric car range, Renault is now turning its attention 
to
electric lorries, with the new two year trial of experimental fully 
electric

truck, run in association with Speed Distribution Logistique and the
prestigious fragrance brand.





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Re: [EVDL] Hybrid Mustang: Motor control

[Collin Kidder via EV]

You might keep in mind the GEVCU project which can be purchased from EVTV (
http://store.evtv.me/proddetail.php?prod=gevcu&cat=23) It is open source
and has enough I/O to do what you want. Of course, what you want is rather
custom so some coding would have to be done. But, the nasty low-level stuff
would already be done for you. Currently it works with DMOC645, Brusa, and
Coda UQM controllers. More devices are being added every so often.

It's in the spirit of Arduino and, full disclosure, I helped make it.


On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 5:12 PM, Ben Goren via EV  wrote:

> This is actually a pair of interrelated questions: electric motor
> controllers, and how to tell said controllers how to control the motors.
>
> To recap, I have a chance to buy a 1964 1/2 Mustang in good shape for not
> much money. The goal is to get something not unlike the driving experience
> of a Volt, with an all-electric range of roughly a couple dozen miles and a
> "traditional" Prius-style hybrid range limited only by the gas tank. The
> thought is to replace most or all of the driveshaft with one or more
> electric motors.
>
> This would obviously require at least two different drive modes, and
> possibly more, dependent on various input sources. There seems general
> consensus that, in hybrid mode, using the combustion engine's vacuum
> pressure to set the electric motor's throttle is a good idea. Obviously,
> that's not an option in pure electric mode. In hybrid mode, I might want to
> change how eager the electric motor is based on battery charge, or have
> "eco" and "performance" modes, or various other options.
>
> That's obviously a somewhat more complex set of input parameters than is
> typical, and it seems like it might be more than most motor controllers are
> designed to accept.
>
> I do database and application and Web development for the day job, and I'm
> not afraid to sink my teeth into a new language. I'm also aware that
> embedded controller programming is a much different beast than what I'm
> used to.
>
> So...are there motor controllers that can reasonably handle this kind of
> complexity? If not, how 'bout some other device (in the spirit of an
> Arduino?) that can accept all the various control inputs and output a
> single signal that the motor controller thinks is a "regular" throttle
> request? Or is there some other approach that's typical that I'm not aware
> of, or...?
>
> Thanks again,
>
> b&
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[EVDL] leaf blowers

[Peri Hartman via EV]

My city (Seattle) is studying leaf blower noise and other mal effects 
and is interested in the viability of electric powered models.  I have 
the opportunity to help supply them with information and am wondering if 
anyone has any knowledge or other info on what electric powered models 
are available and suitable for professional use.  Any studies by other 
jurisdictions, such as a lifetime cost comparison between gas and 
electric, would be welcome too.


Since this is off topic, please respond to me directly.

Peri
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[EVDL] Hybrid Mustang: Motor control

[Ben Goren via EV]

This is actually a pair of interrelated questions: electric motor controllers, 
and how to tell said controllers how to control the motors.

To recap, I have a chance to buy a 1964 1/2 Mustang in good shape for not much 
money. The goal is to get something not unlike the driving experience of a 
Volt, with an all-electric range of roughly a couple dozen miles and a 
"traditional" Prius-style hybrid range limited only by the gas tank. The 
thought is to replace most or all of the driveshaft with one or more electric 
motors.

This would obviously require at least two different drive modes, and possibly 
more, dependent on various input sources. There seems general consensus that, 
in hybrid mode, using the combustion engine's vacuum pressure to set the 
electric motor's throttle is a good idea. Obviously, that's not an option in 
pure electric mode. In hybrid mode, I might want to change how eager the 
electric motor is based on battery charge, or have "eco" and "performance" 
modes, or various other options.

That's obviously a somewhat more complex set of input parameters than is 
typical, and it seems like it might be more than most motor controllers are 
designed to accept.

I do database and application and Web development for the day job, and I'm not 
afraid to sink my teeth into a new language. I'm also aware that embedded 
controller programming is a much different beast than what I'm used to.

So...are there motor controllers that can reasonably handle this kind of 
complexity? If not, how 'bout some other device (in the spirit of an Arduino?) 
that can accept all the various control inputs and output a single signal that 
the motor controller thinks is a "regular" throttle request? Or is there some 
other approach that's typical that I'm not aware of, or...?

Thanks again,

b&
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Re: [EVDL] Hybrid/Mustang

[Dennis Miles via EV]

Ben, I am acquainted with Steve Clunn & Audrey,  they told me, several
months ago, that the Ford Explorer transmission had a removable tailpiece,
that with some work, can be used to fit a motor, to a drive shaft at the
universal. Steve did not volunteer, but he and Audrey drive all over the
USA, doing conversions, and he is certainly the one person I would
recomend, he could do the power train assembly for you including adapters
and all. you would just have to do the finish painting and cleanup and the
job would be done right! (I believe he bills by the hour, but less than
most plumbers...)

Dennis Lee Miles

(*evprofes...@evprofessor.com )*

* Founder:**EV Tech. Institute Inc.*

*Phone #* *(863) 944-9913 (12 noon to 12 midnight Eastern US Time)*

*Educating yourself, does not mean you were **stupid; it means, you are
intelligent enough,  **to know, that there is plenty left to learn!*

*  You Tube Video link:  http://youtu.be/T-FVjMRVLss
<http://youtu.be/T-FVjMRVLss> *


On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 4:27 PM, Ben Goren via EV  wrote:

> On Jul 21, 2014, at 6:54 PM, Steve Clunn via EV  wrote:
>
> > About 10 years ago Net Gain  was making a kit to do just this.
>
> I called NetGain yesterday, and the gentleman I spoke with was involved
> with that particular project and was quite encouraging -- with a bunch of
> caveats, of course.
>
> They don't make the 7" motor any more, but he pointed me in the direction
> of somebody who should still have a couple of them on hand if I wanted to
> go with those over the 9" model
>
> b&
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[EVDL] Hybrid Mustang: AC or DC?

[Ben Goren via EV]

I know the question of AC and DC motors is a controversial one, and probably 
done to death. But if all y'all might humor me, I'd appreciate a bit of 
guidance on this.

To recap, I have a chance to buy a 1964 1/2 Mustang in good shape for not much 
money. The goal is to get something not unlike the driving experience of a 
Volt, with an all-electric range of roughly a couple dozen miles and a 
"traditional" Prius-style hybrid range limited only by the gas tank. The 
thought is to replace most or all of the driveshaft with one or more electric 
motors.

I've now spoken with somebody at both HPEVS and Netgain.

The guy at HPEVS wasn't exactly enthusiastic about the plan, but thinks it can 
be done. He recommends a rear differential ratio in the 6:1 range to make an 
AC-51 not be miserable. That would require a new 9" rear end for the car and a 
custom transmission geared appropriately taller to keep the combustion engine 
happy. He doesn't know much about people doing direct drive or hybrid stuff 
with HPEVS motors.

The guy at Netgain was most encouraging, and has done something nearly 
identical to what I have in mind. He didn't recommend any gearing changes; 
indeed, he suggested that a higher ratio (3:1 or higher) might be better than 
stock, instead of the other way 'round. He had many very helpful suggestions, 
such as ways to couple two motors or to get the electric motor(s) to supply 
most of the power at low speeds and little power at high speeds, thereby 
maximizing overall gasoline economy.

It seems the beaten path for this type of project is therefore a Netgain DC 
motor...but I still like the regen capabilities of the AC motors and the 
reduced maintenance.

I'm aware that only limited efficiency gains are available with regen, but I 
have a secondary concern. When running in hybrid mode, once the batteries get 
depleted, the car would become a pure-gas vehicle. It'd be nice to instead use 
the combustion engine to just barely recharge the batteries enough to still 
provide acceleration assist -- the same way the Prius and the Volt do things. 
With regen, that should be straightforward. Without, I'm left thinking of 
kludges such as using the combustion engine's 12 volt system to trickle-charge 
the electric motor's batteries, and I'm not so sure that's even safe, let alone 
possible. However, as a practical matter, this might not actually be a concern 
if a full battery charge would be comfortably ample for a full day's worth of 
hybrid-mode city driving.

So...I'd appreciate a bit of insight on all this. Would a pair of AC-51s be as 
happy in a direct drive application as a pair of WarP 9s, despite the HPEVS 
guy's lack of familiarity with the matter? Am I worrying too much about regen 
and brush maintenance? Is there something else I should be worrying about 
instead?

Thanks much,

b&
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Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?

[Ben Goren via EV]

On Jul 22, 2014, at 7:47 PM, EVDL Administrator via EV  
wrote:

> On 22 Jul 2014 at 10:24, Ben Goren via EV wrote:
> 
>> Wikipedia says curb weight is 2,445. I don't see this ending up at 3,500 
>> after
>> conversion...but I also like estimating pessimistically.
> 
> I see that too.  But that's probably for an early 170 six with 3-speed stick 
> and no options.  Remember, in those days, even a radio was optional.

I'm a bit young to remember those days...but, regardless, I'll go with your 
3500 lbs after-conversion figure for estimating this stuff. Worst case, the car 
isn't that heavy and I wind up with more range and / or performance than 
expected.

b&
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Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?

[Ben Goren via EV]

On Jul 22, 2014, at 12:06 PM, Dennis Miles  wrote:

> Ben, Consider the "Micro-hybrid" with a electric motorcycle motor belt driven 
> from a belt from the harmonic balancer in the front end of the crank of the 
> ICE and placed in the location of the original alternator.

That was actually the original thought that started me on this journey. After I 
learned of the chance to buy the Mustang, I started searching for examples of 
people who had done full BEV conversions on them, and came across this site:

http://howtobuildahybrid.com/

He did exactly as you describe with a '66 Mustang and a Motenergy motor in 
place of the alternator.

I want the option to be able to do at least grocery shopping and the like in 
all-electric mode, and roughly a couple dozen miles would be enough range for 
most of my driving most of the time. I think the "micro-hybrid" idea is a great 
idea, but it's not what I'm looking for for this project. (I might toy with the 
idea for my '68 VW Westfalia, though...but one thing at a time.)

b&
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Re: [EVDL] Hybrid/Mustang

[Ben Goren via EV]

On Jul 21, 2014, at 6:54 PM, Steve Clunn via EV  wrote:

> About 10 years ago Net Gain  was making a kit to do just this.

I called NetGain yesterday, and the gentleman I spoke with was involved with 
that particular project and was quite encouraging -- with a bunch of caveats, 
of course.

They don't make the 7" motor any more, but he pointed me in the direction of 
somebody who should still have a couple of them on hand if I wanted to go with 
those over the 9" model

b&
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

[Michael Ross via EV]

I am betting there are flux guides involved however it is done.  Some iron
in the circuit does wonders for concentrating fields, though high
frequencies...is permeability of material a function of frequency?  I
always did DC magnetics.

The cores in transformers are no more or less than flux guides that are
magnetically soft to reduce loses to heat.

Maybe a simple isolation transformer (1:1) works if you can put the sending
and receiving coils on U shaped cores and the mating faces are brought
close together, preferably touching.  The core/pole faces are not electric
contacts, so no arcing, they carry the current in the flux gradients.

Still any eddies that are generated in the flux guides are a loss -  the
kind of power we are talking about might even need cooling.

I actually like big-assed contacts for this, not inductive.  But I am
simple minded.  I think I would rather plug it in than build all this for
induction.


On Wed, Jul 23, 2014 at 12:47 PM, Lee Hart via EV  wrote:

> From: George Tyler
> >I have done a lot of transformer and inductor design over the years,
> always
> >said "you can't focus or direct a magnetic field", apart from ordinary
> >magnetic materials of course. On day I found something that someone had
> put
> >together on the web: He pointed out that if you have a resonant coil in a
> >magnetic field then the field it creates cancels the field around the
> >outside, and enhances it in the center on the coil. The effect is just
> like
> >"sucking" in the field into the coil!
>
> That's true. You get the same effect just by having a long solenoid coil,
> where every turn has the same current in it. The magnetic flux travels all
> the way to the end, and then loops back around to the far end. Or a similar
> effect can be observed in a toroid, which can be looked at as a long
> solenoid coil, bent into a donut-shaped loop.
>
> However, that's not very helpful when you have a primary and a secondary,
> unless you can put one winding on top of the other (so all the flux lines
> link both coils).
>
> The resonance effect can make the flux lines link, because again you can
> make the current and phase in both coils identical. But then you can't
> extract any power from the second coil. :-)
>
> One other technique is to surround the transformer with a very good
> conductor; like wrapping it in thick copper sheet. The copper shorts out
> the magnetic flux, forcing it to stay away and flow along the other path
> you would prefer. You'll see this done on transformers in high quality
> audio gear, to "shield" or block the magnetic field from escaping to cause
> hum in the audio. Vicor uses this same trick to squeeze a little more
> efficiency in their switch mode transformers.
>
>
> --
> Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James
> --
> Lee A. Hart http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm now includes the GE
> EV-1
> ___
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> For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (
> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
>
>


-- 
Put this question to yourself: should I use everyone else to attain
happiness, or should I help others gain happiness?
*Dalai Lama *

Tell me what it is you plan to do
With your one wild and precious life?
Mary Oliver, "The summer day."

To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk.
Thomas A. Edison
<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html>

A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought.
*Warren Buffet*

Michael E. Ross
(919) 550-2430 Land
(919) 576-0824 <https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones> Google Phone
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

[Lee Hart via EV]

From: George Tyler
>I have done a lot of transformer and inductor design over the years, always
>said "you can't focus or direct a magnetic field", apart from ordinary
>magnetic materials of course. On day I found something that someone had put
>together on the web: He pointed out that if you have a resonant coil in a
>magnetic field then the field it creates cancels the field around the
>outside, and enhances it in the center on the coil. The effect is just like
>"sucking" in the field into the coil!

That's true. You get the same effect just by having a long solenoid coil, where 
every turn has the same current in it. The magnetic flux travels all the way to 
the end, and then loops back around to the far end. Or a similar effect can be 
observed in a toroid, which can be looked at as a long solenoid coil, bent into 
a donut-shaped loop.

However, that's not very helpful when you have a primary and a secondary, 
unless you can put one winding on top of the other (so all the flux lines link 
both coils).

The resonance effect can make the flux lines link, because again you can make 
the current and phase in both coils identical. But then you can't extract any 
power from the second coil. :-)

One other technique is to surround the transformer with a very good conductor; 
like wrapping it in thick copper sheet. The copper shorts out the magnetic 
flux, forcing it to stay away and flow along the other path you would prefer. 
You'll see this done on transformers in high quality audio gear, to "shield" or 
block the magnetic field from escaping to cause hum in the audio. Vicor uses 
this same trick to squeeze a little more efficiency in their switch mode 
transformers.


--
Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James
--
Lee A. Hart http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm now includes the GE EV-1
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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

[Cor van de Water via EV]

It is not only "how it could be done" but also how it already *is* being
done. One commercial bus line in Utrecht, the Netherlands is being
charged wirelessly at the end station of the bus line. The driver
received some training how to position the bus such that it is aligned
with the charging pad, but since bus drivers are already pretty good at
positioning a bus at a stop, this was no burden - just a matter of
knowing where to place it to make sure that the bus will be charged by
the time it is making its next trip. Indeed the bus stop has an embedded
coil in the bus bay and the bus has the (resonant) pickup.
Buses in the Netherlands also are equipped with ride-height control that
allows them to "kneel" at every stop, giving disabled passengers an
easier way than to climb in/out the bus - typically the front of the bus
is *level* with the curb while the bus is stopped. This no doubt also
helps to reduce
the distance between charging pad and pickup coil on the bus.

Cor van de Water
Chief Scientist
Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com
Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info
Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626


-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Peter C.
Thompson via EV
Sent: Wednesday, July 23, 2014 7:40 AM
To: ev@lists.evdl.org
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless
Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

Took some digging, but using the phrase "resonant magnetic induction" 
produce this paper:

http://hflab.k.u-tokyo.ac.jp/paper_2010/papers/imura/WEVJ3-2380096.pdf

For those that aren't into heavy equations, it shows how you can design 
coils to absorb resonating magnetic fields over air gaps as large as 
200mm with efficiency over 90%.

Note that larger air gaps can be acheived with different antenna designs

- this will be very useful for larger vehicles (e.g. heavy trucks or
buses).

Cheers!

On 7/23/14, 2:53 AM, George Tyler via EV wrote:
> I have done a lot of transformer and inductor design over the years,
always
> said "you can't focus or direct a magnetic field", apart from ordinary
> magnetic materials of course. On day I found something that someone
had put
> together on the web: He pointed out that if you have a resonant coil
in a
> magnetic field then the field it creates cancels the field around the
> outside, and enhances it in the center on the coil. The effect is just
like
> "sucking" in the field into the coil!
>   I can always learn.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Martin WINLOW
via
> EV
> Sent: Wednesday, 23 July 2014 8:19 p.m.
> To: Lee Hart; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless
Inductive
> EVSE for i3 EV
>
> "Calling Nikola Tesla! Calling Nikola Tesla! Come back! All is
forgiven!"
>
> I bet *he'd* have something to say on this subject! MW
>
>
> On 21 Jul 2014, at 20:24, Lee Hart via EV wrote:
>
>> From: Peri Hartman
>>> Is it possible to use multiple coils to focus the "beam"?
>> Magnetic fields are devilishly difficult to direct or focus.
>>
>> With electricity, we have great conductors (copper, silver, etc.) and
> great insulators (air, plastics, etc.) There are *many* orders of
magnitude
> difference in their conductivity, so we can tightly control where the
> current flows.
>> With magnetics, we have no good conductors, and no good insulators.
It's
> as if our best electrical conductor was carbon (which we make
resistors out
> of), and our best insulator was water (which conducts pretty well,
> especially if dirty). Imagine trying to make a circuit work where the
> conductors are all carbon, and it's submerged in water, which
partially
> shorts everything to everything else!
>> (Superconductors can give us good magnetic insulators; but they don't
work
> except at cryogenic temperatures).
>>> I don't know wave theory but I believe directional radio
transmitters
>>> work by having two or more antennas. Can something similar be done
with
> inductive coils?
>> Yes; sort of. Every electric field inevitably has a magnetic field,
and
> vice versa. That's why we call it "electromagnetics". However, for
these
> fields to act like waves, which we can focus and direct like light,
the
> frequencies need to be very high. The elements of a directional
antenna need
> to have dimensions on the order of 1/4 wavelength or more.
>> Wavelength (in meters) = 300 / Frequency (in MHz). At 100 MHz (the
> frequency of FM radio and the old VHF television), the wavelength is
about 3
> meters -- so a 1/4 wave antenna is about 0.75 meters or 30" long. It's
not
> too hard to make antennas with multiple elements in parallel to focus
and
> direct these frequencies (like the traditional TV antennas that look
like
> giant metal combs).
>> At 1 MHz (the AM radio broadcast band) the wavelength is about 300
meters;
> thus the tremendously high towers needed to effectively transmit it

Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

[Peter C. Thompson via EV]

Took some digging, but using the phrase "resonant magnetic induction" 
produce this paper:


http://hflab.k.u-tokyo.ac.jp/paper_2010/papers/imura/WEVJ3-2380096.pdf

For those that aren't into heavy equations, it shows how you can design 
coils to absorb resonating magnetic fields over air gaps as large as 
200mm with efficiency over 90%.


Note that larger air gaps can be acheived with different antenna designs 
- this will be very useful for larger vehicles (e.g. heavy trucks or buses).


Cheers!

On 7/23/14, 2:53 AM, George Tyler via EV wrote:

I have done a lot of transformer and inductor design over the years, always
said "you can't focus or direct a magnetic field", apart from ordinary
magnetic materials of course. On day I found something that someone had put
together on the web: He pointed out that if you have a resonant coil in a
magnetic field then the field it creates cancels the field around the
outside, and enhances it in the center on the coil. The effect is just like
"sucking" in the field into the coil!
I can always learn.

-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Martin WINLOW via
EV
Sent: Wednesday, 23 July 2014 8:19 p.m.
To: Lee Hart; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive
EVSE for i3 EV

"Calling Nikola Tesla! Calling Nikola Tesla! Come back! All is forgiven!"

I bet *he'd* have something to say on this subject! MW


On 21 Jul 2014, at 20:24, Lee Hart via EV wrote:


From: Peri Hartman

Is it possible to use multiple coils to focus the "beam"?

Magnetic fields are devilishly difficult to direct or focus.

With electricity, we have great conductors (copper, silver, etc.) and

great insulators (air, plastics, etc.) There are *many* orders of magnitude
difference in their conductivity, so we can tightly control where the
current flows.

With magnetics, we have no good conductors, and no good insulators. It's

as if our best electrical conductor was carbon (which we make resistors out
of), and our best insulator was water (which conducts pretty well,
especially if dirty). Imagine trying to make a circuit work where the
conductors are all carbon, and it's submerged in water, which partially
shorts everything to everything else!

(Superconductors can give us good magnetic insulators; but they don't work

except at cryogenic temperatures).

I don't know wave theory but I believe directional radio transmitters
work by having two or more antennas. Can something similar be done with

inductive coils?

Yes; sort of. Every electric field inevitably has a magnetic field, and

vice versa. That's why we call it "electromagnetics". However, for these
fields to act like waves, which we can focus and direct like light, the
frequencies need to be very high. The elements of a directional antenna need
to have dimensions on the order of 1/4 wavelength or more.

Wavelength (in meters) = 300 / Frequency (in MHz). At 100 MHz (the

frequency of FM radio and the old VHF television), the wavelength is about 3
meters -- so a 1/4 wave antenna is about 0.75 meters or 30" long. It's not
too hard to make antennas with multiple elements in parallel to focus and
direct these frequencies (like the traditional TV antennas that look like
giant metal combs).

At 1 MHz (the AM radio broadcast band) the wavelength is about 300 meters;

thus the tremendously high towers needed to effectively transmit it (the
whole tower is the antenna). It's hopeless to make receiving antennas this
big. We have to use far smaller antennas, that are far less efficient and
require substantial amplification to work.

The inductive chargers mentioned here are using 85 KHz. The wavelength is

on the order of 3500 meters! It's impossible to direct such frequencies with
the techniques used for radio antennas.

Vicor makes switchmode converters that operate just over 1 MHz; about the

highest practical frequency for state of the art switchmode converters. They
had to go to heroic lengths to get their transformers to operate with
reasonable efficiency (90%). Such frequencies are not yet practical for high
power converters.

Lower frequency transformers are more efficient. Conventional 60 Hz

transformers can be over 99% efficient, if you use enough copper and iron.
But to do so, they require *very* tight coupling between the primary and
secondary -- minimal gap between them. This is the opposite of the
requirement to have some separation between primary and secondary as imposed
by the wireless charging proponents.

I think the only way to make a practical "wireless" charger will be to use

more or less ordinary frequencies, and mechanically position the primary and
secondary coils as close as possible. This means either moving the car's
secondary coil or the charging station's primary coil so they touch.

--
Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James
--
Lee A. Hart http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm now includes t

Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?

[Ben Apollonio via EV]

On the contrary.  Tesla cells discharge at a very LOW current.  When you have 
85kWh of battery, you only need 3.5C to make 300kW, and C/5 to cruise at 55MPH. 
 Even the 120kW 'supercharger' tops out at about 2C (for the smaller 60kWh 
battery).

I would hazard this is why larger cells are not designed for large currents.  
RC cars are designed to run for 2 minutes and are trying to maximize 
power/weight.  Most real world applications need more capacity and have to 
optimize energy/weight, so there's significantly less market for cells at 100Ah 
and 300C (not to mention that you would then have to find a way to manage 
30,000 amps!!).

-Ben

On Jul 23, 2014, at 6:29 AM, George Tyler via EV  wrote:

> I have been looking at this, seemed to me that for the capacity, smaller
> batteries can discharge a higher current, I guess that's why Tesla uses 7000
> small cells? R/C batteries are often rated at 90C or even greater, I have
> seen 300C. Look at this:
> http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__51838__Turnigy_nano_tech_Ultimate
> _6000mah_2S2P_90C_Hardcase_Lipo_Pack.html
> 6 Ah and 90C gives 540 Amps! From a 2 Cell battery you can wrap your hand
> around.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of EVDL Administrator
> via EV
> Sent: Tuesday, 22 July 2014 8:21 p.m.
> To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
> Subject: Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?
> 
> Another factor to consider is that while power capability varies by design,
> as a general rule, smaller cells are usually capable of lower power output.
> 
> For example, the CALB 40ah cells I mentioned are rated for a maximum
> discharge of 2C (80 amps).  At 144v, 80a is 11.5kW.  Allowing for losses,
> that's only about 12hp from your motor!
> 
> Not being a lithium expert, I don't know how much more than this you can
> actually draw before voltage sag really kicks in.  But I'm pretty sure that
> pushing them too hard will shorten their lives significantly.
> 
> If you expect sporty, Mustang-y EV performance, but don't want to carry
> around much of a battery, you'll need to find some cells designed for high
> power.
> 
> The 90ah Winstons I mentioned are rated for only 1C continuous, but they say
> you can draw 10C for 10 seconds.  It looks like you then need to allow at
> least 50 seconds of either zero or much lower current for the cell to
> recover (how often you can do this isn't clear from the spec).  Other folks
> here may know how realistic this is, and/or have some recommendations for
> high power lithium cells.
> 
> David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
> EVDL Administrator
> 
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information:
> http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> = = = =
> Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me.  To
> send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage
> http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
> = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
> 
> 
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> 
> 
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> 

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Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?

[George Tyler via EV]

I have been looking at this, seemed to me that for the capacity, smaller
batteries can discharge a higher current, I guess that's why Tesla uses 7000
small cells? R/C batteries are often rated at 90C or even greater, I have
seen 300C. Look at this:
http://www.hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__51838__Turnigy_nano_tech_Ultimate
_6000mah_2S2P_90C_Hardcase_Lipo_Pack.html
6 Ah and 90C gives 540 Amps! From a 2 Cell battery you can wrap your hand
around.

-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of EVDL Administrator
via EV
Sent: Tuesday, 22 July 2014 8:21 p.m.
To: Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] How crazy am I?

Another factor to consider is that while power capability varies by design,
as a general rule, smaller cells are usually capable of lower power output.

For example, the CALB 40ah cells I mentioned are rated for a maximum
discharge of 2C (80 amps).  At 144v, 80a is 11.5kW.  Allowing for losses,
that's only about 12hp from your motor!

Not being a lithium expert, I don't know how much more than this you can
actually draw before voltage sag really kicks in.  But I'm pretty sure that
pushing them too hard will shorten their lives significantly.

If you expect sporty, Mustang-y EV performance, but don't want to carry
around much of a battery, you'll need to find some cells designed for high
power.

The 90ah Winstons I mentioned are rated for only 1C continuous, but they say
you can draw 10C for 10 seconds.  It looks like you then need to allow at
least 50 seconds of either zero or much lower current for the cell to
recover (how often you can do this isn't clear from the spec).  Other folks
here may know how realistic this is, and/or have some recommendations for
high power lithium cells.

David Roden - Akron, Ohio, USA
EVDL Administrator

= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = EVDL Information:
http://www.evdl.org/help/ = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =
= = = =
Note: mail sent to "evpost" and "etpost" addresses will not reach me.  To
send a private message, please obtain my email address from the webpage
http://www.evdl.org/help/ .
= = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = =


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[EVDL] EVLN: Tesla plans 400mi Roadster pack upgrade

[brucedp5 via EV]

http://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2014/07/18/tesla-roadster/12809975/
400 miles a charge?: Tesla plans Roadster upgrade
by Chris Woodyard  July 18, 2014

[image] Roadster (Photo: Business Wire)

Amid all the attention devoted to its Model S electric sedan, Tesla has said
little about the owners of its first model, the Roadster. Now CEO Elon Musk
appears ready to show them a little love.

Tesla is planning to offer upgrades to Roadster batteries, spokesman Simon
Sproule confirms."Improvements to battery are coming for Roadster," he said
without elaboration.

That's in line with what Musk told website AutoExpress in an interview.

He said the car's 245 mile range could be boosted to 400 miles, making it
the longest-range electric car.

"The Roadster had an old generation battery," he told the site. "We'll
upgrade it to a new generation battery pack and it should have a range of
about 400 miles, which will allow you to drive from LA to San Francisco
non-stop."

That would be a nice present for Roadster owners, who are out of the
limelight these days. Their electric two-seat convertibles, which were made
by modifying the Lotus Elise, can't use the high-speed Superchargers that
have made intercity travel possible for Model S owners.

Tesla made about 2,500 Roadsters starting in 2008, which sold new for prices
around $109,000. The company then halted production to focus on the Model S.
It expects to sell about 35,000 Model S sedans this year.
[© usatoday.com]




For all EVLN posts use:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/template/NamlServlet.jtp?macro=search_page&node=413529&query=evln&sort=date

http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20140721006116/en/San-Jose-Host-Free-Electric-Vehicle-Test-Drive
EPRI's Plug-In 2014 Conference @McEnery Cntr 7/28-30 San Jose, CA
http://et.epri.com/

http://www.carbuzz.com/news/2014/7/14/Subaru-is-Planning-to-Build-an-EV-7721433/
Subaru plans to eventually build an all-wheel-drive EV model

http://www.autospies.com/news/SPIED-An-Auto-Spy-Nabs-The-Kia-Soul-EV-As-Its-TUCKED-AWAY-82046/
Kia Soul EV slated for sale in U.S. in Q3 2014

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/phoenix/2014/07/11/phoenix-church-becomes-first-arizona-green-sanctuary/12484859/
AZ GreenFaith Church members donated PVs & EVSE> 1st "green sanctuary"
...
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-GreenFaith-recharges-your-plugin-along-with-your-soul-tp4667959.html
EVLN: GreenFaith recharges your plugin along with your soul
+
EVLN: Renault 16ton Electric Delivery Lorry/Truck


{brucedp.150m.com}



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[EVDL] EVLN: Renault 16ton Electric Delivery Lorry/Truck

[brucedp5 via EV]

http://www.thegreencarwebsite.co.uk/blog/index.php/2014/07/21/renault-begins-trial-of-new-electric-lorry/
Renault begins trial of new electric lorry
Faye Sunderland  July 21, 2014

[image  
http://www.thegreencarwebsite.co.uk/cms-images/Renault-Truck-electric-lorry.jpg
Renault Truck electric lorry
]

Renault Trucks has begun a trial of a 16 tonne electric lorry in Paris with
one of France’s oldest perfume houses, Guerlain.

Renowned for its electric car range, Renault is now turning its attention to
electric lorries, with the new two year trial of experimental fully electric
truck, run in association with Speed Distribution Logistique and the
prestigious fragrance brand.

The vehicle will be used to make deliveries to Maison de Parfums &
Cosmétiques boutiques in the French capital over the two year trial,
gathering data on the usability of electric lorries.

Based on the Renault Trucks D model, the new electric version will be
subjected to a demanding work schedule, regularly covering delivering rounds
over 200km (124 miles).

To cope with such long journeys, the truck will be recharged several times
during each 24 hour operating cycle.

Its route between the Guerlain boutiques in Paris and its distribution
centre have been planned so that it can carry out two partial recharges
during the day and a total recharge between 7pm and 2am.

Capable of carrying a payload of around 6 tonnes, this electric truck is
fitted with two big lithium ion battery packs, weighing a total of 2 tonnes
and rated with a capacity of 170kWh. With a range of 120km (74mph) per
charge, a full recharge takes around 7 hours.

“The initial tests we’ve carried out using this technology under real
operating conditions with our customers have been very satisfying,” says
Christophe Vacquier, Renault Trucks’ project manager. “We are now going
further with Guerlain and Speed Distribution Logistique, using the vehicle
on 200 km rounds which gives us confidence in the future of this
technology.”

The test is scheduled to run until the end of 2015. A full appraisal will
then be carried out, to assess the direction of further research.

Marc Bachini, Speed Distribution Logistique’s founder explains why his
company has become involved in this project: “Based on my own convictions, I
defined an economic model that respects people and their environment. After
having invested in all-electric Renault Maxity delivery vehicles in 2013,
this civically-responsible approach naturally led me to pursue this path and
incorporate an experimental 16 t all-electric vehicle to be used for
warehouse collection. This enabled me to offer Guerlain, a pace-setting
company in sustainable development, a totally emission-free delivery cycle.”
[© thegreencarwebsite.co.uk]




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http://www.businesswire.com/news/home/20140721006116/en/San-Jose-Host-Free-Electric-Vehicle-Test-Drive
EPRI's Plug-In 2014 Conference @McEnery Cntr 7/28-30 San Jose, CA
http://et.epri.com/

http://www.carbuzz.com/news/2014/7/14/Subaru-is-Planning-to-Build-an-EV-7721433/
Subaru plans to eventually build an all-wheel-drive EV model

http://www.autospies.com/news/SPIED-An-Auto-Spy-Nabs-The-Kia-Soul-EV-As-Its-TUCKED-AWAY-82046/
Kia Soul EV slated for sale in U.S. in Q3 2014

http://www.azcentral.com/story/news/local/phoenix/2014/07/11/phoenix-church-becomes-first-arizona-green-sanctuary/12484859/
AZ GreenFaith Church members donated PVs & EVSE> 1st "green sanctuary"
...
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-GreenFaith-recharges-your-plugin-along-with-your-soul-tp4667959.html
EVLN: GreenFaith recharges your plugin along with your soul
+
EVLN: Tesla plans 400mi Roadster pack upgrade


{brucedp.150m.com}



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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

[George Tyler via EV]

I have done a lot of transformer and inductor design over the years, always
said "you can't focus or direct a magnetic field", apart from ordinary
magnetic materials of course. On day I found something that someone had put
together on the web: He pointed out that if you have a resonant coil in a
magnetic field then the field it creates cancels the field around the
outside, and enhances it in the center on the coil. The effect is just like
"sucking" in the field into the coil!
I can always learn.

-Original Message-
From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Martin WINLOW via
EV
Sent: Wednesday, 23 July 2014 8:19 p.m.
To: Lee Hart; Electric Vehicle Discussion List
Subject: Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive
EVSE for i3 EV

"Calling Nikola Tesla! Calling Nikola Tesla! Come back! All is forgiven!"

I bet *he'd* have something to say on this subject! MW


On 21 Jul 2014, at 20:24, Lee Hart via EV wrote:

> From: Peri Hartman
>> Is it possible to use multiple coils to focus the "beam"?
> 
> Magnetic fields are devilishly difficult to direct or focus.
> 
> With electricity, we have great conductors (copper, silver, etc.) and
great insulators (air, plastics, etc.) There are *many* orders of magnitude
difference in their conductivity, so we can tightly control where the
current flows.
> 
> With magnetics, we have no good conductors, and no good insulators. It's
as if our best electrical conductor was carbon (which we make resistors out
of), and our best insulator was water (which conducts pretty well,
especially if dirty). Imagine trying to make a circuit work where the
conductors are all carbon, and it's submerged in water, which partially
shorts everything to everything else!
> 
> (Superconductors can give us good magnetic insulators; but they don't work
except at cryogenic temperatures).
> 
>> I don't know wave theory but I believe directional radio transmitters 
>> work by having two or more antennas. Can something similar be done with
inductive coils?
> 
> Yes; sort of. Every electric field inevitably has a magnetic field, and
vice versa. That's why we call it "electromagnetics". However, for these
fields to act like waves, which we can focus and direct like light, the
frequencies need to be very high. The elements of a directional antenna need
to have dimensions on the order of 1/4 wavelength or more.
> 
> Wavelength (in meters) = 300 / Frequency (in MHz). At 100 MHz (the
frequency of FM radio and the old VHF television), the wavelength is about 3
meters -- so a 1/4 wave antenna is about 0.75 meters or 30" long. It's not
too hard to make antennas with multiple elements in parallel to focus and
direct these frequencies (like the traditional TV antennas that look like
giant metal combs).
> 
> At 1 MHz (the AM radio broadcast band) the wavelength is about 300 meters;
thus the tremendously high towers needed to effectively transmit it (the
whole tower is the antenna). It's hopeless to make receiving antennas this
big. We have to use far smaller antennas, that are far less efficient and
require substantial amplification to work.
> 
> The inductive chargers mentioned here are using 85 KHz. The wavelength is
on the order of 3500 meters! It's impossible to direct such frequencies with
the techniques used for radio antennas.
> 
> Vicor makes switchmode converters that operate just over 1 MHz; about the
highest practical frequency for state of the art switchmode converters. They
had to go to heroic lengths to get their transformers to operate with
reasonable efficiency (90%). Such frequencies are not yet practical for high
power converters.
> 
> Lower frequency transformers are more efficient. Conventional 60 Hz
transformers can be over 99% efficient, if you use enough copper and iron.
But to do so, they require *very* tight coupling between the primary and
secondary -- minimal gap between them. This is the opposite of the
requirement to have some separation between primary and secondary as imposed
by the wireless charging proponents.
> 
> I think the only way to make a practical "wireless" charger will be to use
more or less ordinary frequencies, and mechanically position the primary and
secondary coils as close as possible. This means either moving the car's
secondary coil or the charging station's primary coil so they touch.
> 
> --
> Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James
> --
> Lee A. Hart http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm now includes the 
> GE EV-1

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Re: [EVDL] EVLN: BMW&Daimler developing 3-Hour Wireless Inductive EVSE for i3 EV

[Martin WINLOW via EV]

"Calling Nikola Tesla! Calling Nikola Tesla! Come back! All is forgiven!"

I bet *he'd* have something to say on this subject! MW


On 21 Jul 2014, at 20:24, Lee Hart via EV wrote:

> From: Peri Hartman
>> Is it possible to use multiple coils to focus the "beam"?
> 
> Magnetic fields are devilishly difficult to direct or focus.
> 
> With electricity, we have great conductors (copper, silver, etc.) and great 
> insulators (air, plastics, etc.) There are *many* orders of magnitude 
> difference in their conductivity, so we can tightly control where the current 
> flows.
> 
> With magnetics, we have no good conductors, and no good insulators. It's as 
> if our best electrical conductor was carbon (which we make resistors out of), 
> and our best insulator was water (which conducts pretty well, especially if 
> dirty). Imagine trying to make a circuit work where the conductors are all 
> carbon, and it's submerged in water, which partially shorts everything to 
> everything else!
> 
> (Superconductors can give us good magnetic insulators; but they don't work 
> except at cryogenic temperatures).
> 
>> I don't know wave theory but I believe directional radio transmitters work
>> by having two or more antennas. Can something similar be done with inductive 
>> coils?
> 
> Yes; sort of. Every electric field inevitably has a magnetic field, and vice 
> versa. That's why we call it "electromagnetics". However, for these fields to 
> act like waves, which we can focus and direct like light, the frequencies 
> need to be very high. The elements of a directional antenna need to have 
> dimensions on the order of 1/4 wavelength or more.
> 
> Wavelength (in meters) = 300 / Frequency (in MHz). At 100 MHz (the frequency 
> of FM radio and the old VHF television), the wavelength is about 3 meters -- 
> so a 1/4 wave antenna is about 0.75 meters or 30" long. It's not too hard to 
> make antennas with multiple elements in parallel to focus and direct these 
> frequencies (like the traditional TV antennas that look like giant metal 
> combs).
> 
> At 1 MHz (the AM radio broadcast band) the wavelength is about 300 meters; 
> thus the tremendously high towers needed to effectively transmit it (the 
> whole tower is the antenna). It's hopeless to make receiving antennas this 
> big. We have to use far smaller antennas, that are far less efficient and 
> require substantial amplification to work.
> 
> The inductive chargers mentioned here are using 85 KHz. The wavelength is on 
> the order of 3500 meters! It's impossible to direct such frequencies with the 
> techniques used for radio antennas.
> 
> Vicor makes switchmode converters that operate just over 1 MHz; about the 
> highest practical frequency for state of the art switchmode converters. They 
> had to go to heroic lengths to get their transformers to operate with 
> reasonable efficiency (90%). Such frequencies are not yet practical for high 
> power converters.
> 
> Lower frequency transformers are more efficient. Conventional 60 Hz 
> transformers can be over 99% efficient, if you use enough copper and iron. 
> But to do so, they require *very* tight coupling between the primary and 
> secondary -- minimal gap between them. This is the opposite of the 
> requirement to have some separation between primary and secondary as imposed 
> by the wireless charging proponents.
> 
> I think the only way to make a practical "wireless" charger will be to use 
> more or less ordinary frequencies, and mechanically position the primary and 
> secondary coils as close as possible. This means either moving the car's 
> secondary coil or the charging station's primary coil so they touch.
> 
> --
> Excellence does not require perfection. -- Henry James
> --
> Lee A. Hart http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm now includes the GE EV-1

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