[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: First I will go to Vizag, Calcutta, and Assam, and visit Devipuram, Khalighat, and Kamakhya. And also probably Babadham and the very powerful Tarapeeth. It will be a great yatra I am sure. I have been to none of these places myself, the most east I ever was, was Amarkanthak, were Guru Dev once has been and that is not too far away from Puri or Calcutta. (I saw a cave now closed, from which I later heard through another friend, that this was probably one of the caves where GD has been). And I have a friend in Vizag, it must be a great city, but I have never been. Since I spend now more time in Andhra, I will try to go to Sri Sailam one day.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Mr. Ed [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: India vs. LSD I latched on to that comparison immediately..Both are full of vibrant colors, in both trips everything seems intensely significant, and then there's the bugs crawling on ya...sorrya little off topic, but unfortunate nonetheless. A mosquito net protects you from such surprises during sleep. Seriously while I don't know that the author of the Gita intended for it to pave the way for the caste system, so many great ideas, so much inspiration and beauty have come from the subcontinent that I'd thoroughly dig a visit there. Any culture that could produce Buddha is cool by me.Has anyone else made the connection of Buddha being to Hinduism what Jesus was to Judaism? I think I have read that somewhere, or maybe a comparision between Buddhism and Protestantism, I am not sure, but Buddhism has been seen as a reformatory movement to Hinduism by many. Buddhism has a much greater appeal to westerners,as it is more rational, and obviously less discriminatory. Hinduism OTOH is irrational, colorful, manifold and difficult to comprehend. Or am I just non retardedly challenged? Not entirely the same.but they were both well versed in their culture's religious traditions but both kinda said..this might be simpler than all this superfluous ceremonial stuff yer doin. And in both cases their followers created their own superfluous ceremonial mummery and far out religious groups and organizations that are often hard to connect with the life and actual teachings of these two people. Don't get me wrong.I LOVE what Japan has done with Buddhism..Like the Nichiren Sect that teaches it's adherents to chant Nam Myoho Renge Kyo because these syllables are so sacred that merely uttering them brings you into alignment with the deeper underlying energy of the universe .I KNOW! I'm like, what a coincidence! WHere have I heard that kinda thing? By the way, I would never advocate the use of ANY drugs.I've NEVER done any of them so I'm SURE they have NOTHING to offer. :) I've 'heard' that LSD makes everything colorful and significant.and makes you think you've got bugs crawling on ya.Just remember..If drugs were Flinstone Vitamins, LSD would be the 'Great Gazoo'.NEVER mix yer Gazoos with yer Dinos..justjus' DON'T... Now, if religions were Flinstone Vitaminsyeah, this is stoopit.good night y'all. I haven't done LSD either or hallucinogenic drugs. I had marihuana first in India 93 - was sorta nice but gave me a headache later. And probably one inhale which I coughed out immediately at the Kumbh in Allahabad, which I had, just to be nice to a Naga Baba - but that had a great effect.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: then he said the words that pierced me: It would be BAD KARMA for MAHARISHI for you to be here, and it would be BAD KARMA FOR YOU to be here. You must leave... snip yep, I thought that was 24 karat pure bullshit too-- sounded like the boogey-man's gonna get you. real crap. WEll, it WAS announced days before the cremation on the Maharishi Channel that it would be a strictly tradtional Vedic ceremony, fully segregated by sex. I try not to crash other people's religious ceremonies if they have a bias against me being there unless I'm secretly doing an expose on segregated religious ceremonies. Obviously, the proper thing was to turn around and walk off as it was a strictly observed men-only ceremony and regardless of the karmic issues for MMY, refusing to honor the religious ceremonial wishes of the deceased seems less than respectful. When in Rome, and all that. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
When in Rome, and all that. Cultural relativism is very popular today, but not with me. I am Rome. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 sandiego108@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: then he said the words that pierced me: It would be BAD KARMA for MAHARISHI for you to be here, and it would be BAD KARMA FOR YOU to be here. You must leave... snip yep, I thought that was 24 karat pure bullshit too-- sounded like the boogey-man's gonna get you. real crap. WEll, it WAS announced days before the cremation on the Maharishi Channel that it would be a strictly tradtional Vedic ceremony, fully segregated by sex. I try not to crash other people's religious ceremonies if they have a bias against me being there unless I'm secretly doing an expose on segregated religious ceremonies. Obviously, the proper thing was to turn around and walk off as it was a strictly observed men-only ceremony and regardless of the karmic issues for MMY, refusing to honor the religious ceremonial wishes of the deceased seems less than respectful. When in Rome, and all that. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: When in Rome, and all that. Cultural relativism is very popular today, but not with me. I am Rome. So if you walk into a Jewish temple munching on a regular pepperoni pizza (meat + cheeze), you don't apologize for your ignorance and walk out if someone points out to you that you are in a kosher establishment? Sheesh. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 sandiego108@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: then he said the words that pierced me: It would be BAD KARMA for MAHARISHI for you to be here, and it would be BAD KARMA FOR YOU to be here. You must leave... snip yep, I thought that was 24 karat pure bullshit too-- sounded like the boogey-man's gonna get you. real crap. WEll, it WAS announced days before the cremation on the Maharishi Channel that it would be a strictly tradtional Vedic ceremony, fully segregated by sex. I try not to crash other people's religious ceremonies if they have a bias against me being there unless I'm secretly doing an expose on segregated religious ceremonies. Obviously, the proper thing was to turn around and walk off as it was a strictly observed men-only ceremony and regardless of the karmic issues for MMY, refusing to honor the religious ceremonial wishes of the deceased seems less than respectful. When in Rome, and all that. Lawson No problem with the respect for other cultures, at all, no issue there. It was this warning of the possible bad karma that rankled me- - plays on imagined fears (treats the person spoken to like a child) , vs. just explaining the situation clearly (treats the person spoken to like an adult).
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
So if you walk into a Jewish temple munching on a regular pepperoni pizza (meat + cheeze), you don't apologize for your ignorance and walk out if someone points out to you that you are in a kosher establishment? Again with the relativism. Are you equating religious food practices with treating woman as second class citizens? I'm not. I hang with an international crowd and am down with all their customs, up to an not including some of their backward ideas about the value of certain humans. Then I stand up like St. Amy Winehouse and say, No, No. No. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sparaig [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues curtisdeltablues@ wrote: When in Rome, and all that. Cultural relativism is very popular today, but not with me. I am Rome. So if you walk into a Jewish temple munching on a regular pepperoni pizza (meat + cheeze), you don't apologize for your ignorance and walk out if someone points out to you that you are in a kosher establishment? Sheesh. Lawson
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Again with the relativism. Are you equating religious food practices with treating women as second class citizens? Is that bad? I've always treated women as a religious food experience. Some have even thanked me for it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, TurquoiseB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I've always treated women as a religious food experience. Get a checking !
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
then he said the words that pierced me: It would be BAD KARMA for MAHARISHI for you to be here, and it would be BAD KARMA FOR YOU to be here. You must leave... snip yep, I thought that was 24 karat pure bullshit too-- sounded like the boogey-man's gonna get you. real crap. WEll, it WAS announced days before the cremation on the Maharishi Channel that it would be a strictly tradtional Vedic ceremony, fully segregated by sex. When in Rome, and all that. Well, nothing in the 'vedic scripture' proscribes this particular distinction about funeral rites. No separation by gender from scripture in Shastra and the like, hence this particular funeral part about gender Jim-crow is not 'Vedic'. It was conceived. Not vedic, it was just in the choreography and power-tripping of this unique event. Keeping the Westerners at bay in a way too. The Indian movement was respectful when they had to be, but evidently not as inclusive. Inner and outer circles. You'll notice Nadir Ram walked behind and was not in their boat? It was just part of the story there. Nobody stood up for the women when it could have been done, except those soldiers later in the story. Probably as likely that nobody wanted to deal with or work out the logistics. So it boiled down to: Just tell them its 'Vedic', and keep them out.
RE: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
I’ve been out of the loop on this discussion, but just wanted to mention that Amma officiated at mass cremations for tsunami victims, and no one seemed to mind: HYPERLINK http://www.amritapuri.org/tsunami/smriti.phphttp://www.amritapuri.org/tsun ami/smriti.php. But then she’s never been a stickler for sexist “traditions.” No virus found in this outgoing message. Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.516 / Virus Database: 269.21.5/1314 - Release Date: 3/5/2008 6:38 PM
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well, nothing in the 'vedic scripture' proscribes this particular distinction about funeral rites. No separation by gender from scripture in Shastra and the like, hence this particular funeral part about gender Jim-crow is not 'Vedic'. It was conceived. All the relations present, men and women bow to the dead. Finally the corpse is put upon a ladder-like bier of bamboo and borne by four persons on their shoulders to the crematin ground, the priest and the chief mourner (who holds the sacred fire for burning the dead body) walking in front of the bier. Women do not accompany a funeral procession. http://www.nagpuronline.com/people/rit_hndu.html Not vedic, it was just in the choreography and power-tripping of this unique event. Keeping the Westerners at bay in a way too. The Indian movement was respectful when they had to be, but evidently not as inclusive. Inner and outer circles. You'll notice Nadir Ram walked behind and was not in their boat? It was just part of the story there. Nobody stood up for the women when it could have been done, except those soldiers later in the story. Probably as likely that nobody wanted to deal with or work out the logistics. So it boiled down to: Just tell them its 'Vedic', and keep them out.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Well, nothing in the 'vedic scripture' proscribes this particular distinction about funeral rites. No separation by gender from scripture in Shastra and the like, hence this particular funeral part about gender Jim-crow is not 'Vedic'. It was conceived. All the relations present, men and women bow to the dead. Finally the corpse is put upon a ladder-like bier of bamboo and borne by four persons on their shoulders to the crematin ground, the priest and the chief mourner (who holds the sacred fire for burning the dead body) walking in front of the bier. Women do not accompany a funeral procession. http://www.nagpuronline.com/people/rit_hndu.html Not vedic, it was just in the choreography and power-tripping of this unique event. That a woman should be allowed to perform the last rites of a Hindu in one of the most holy places has a special significance. For, the authorities of Ujjain's Mahaakaal temple duly approved the act. Ashes from adjoining Shipra Ghat (cremation ground) are used to propitiate Lord Shiva in the daily morning bhasma aarati (ritual in which ashes are used) in this famous temple. Around the time Sandhya was challenging the Hindu custom of not allowing women to enter cremation grounds, another young woman was setting a similar example in Allahabad, one of the holiest of holy Hindu pilgrim centres. http://www.tribuneindia.com/2003/20030914/herworld.htm#4
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
This is good. Your encyclo source is saying then that it was a traditional Hindu funeral. Different than Vedic. Same thing i got from asking around to other sources. As in, Vedic is based on vedic scripture; and as such, older than the religion of Hinduism. Hence, the funeral was evidently 'traditional' Hindu, by these rites. Not necessarily Vedic just because they say it was. Keeping women out at Hindu funerals that way evidently is not necessarily vedic by this or universally recognized there. Is Hindu apparently. So i am told by people who seem to know these things. Enlighten me some more if you know otherwise. Thanks for your e-mails. Regardless, was odd feeling for people who had come to pay their respects. Western women and Indian women, who had come there were 'held back' in areas at a remote location. -Doug in FF --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Well, nothing in the 'vedic scripture' proscribes this particular distinction about funeral rites. No separation by gender from scripture in Shastra and the like, hence this particular funeral part about gender Jim-crow is not 'Vedic'. It was conceived. All the relations present, men and women bow to the dead. Finally the corpse is put upon a ladder-like bier of bamboo and borne by four persons on their shoulders to the crematin ground, the priest and the chief mourner (who holds the sacred fire for burning the dead body) walking in front of the bier. Women do not accompany a funeral procession. http://www.nagpuronline.com/people/rit_hndu.html Not vedic, it was just in the choreography and power-tripping of this unique event. Keeping the Westerners at bay in a way too. The Indian movement was respectful when they had to be, but evidently not as inclusive. Inner and outer circles. You'll notice Nadir Ram walked behind and was not in their boat? It was just part of the story there. Nobody stood up for the women when it could have been done, except those soldiers later in the story. Probably as likely that nobody wanted to deal with or work out the logistics. So it boiled down to: Just tell them its 'Vedic', and keep them out.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
Who specifically told you to leave? Was it a westerner? That would seem inappropriate in India FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: This is good. Your encyclo source is saying then that it was a traditional Hindu funeral. Different than Vedic. Same thing i got from asking around to other sources. As in, Vedic is based on vedic scripture; and as such, older than the religion of Hinduism. Hence, the funeral was evidently 'traditional' Hindu, by these rites. Not necessarily Vedic just because they say it was. Keeping women out at Hindu funerals that way evidently is not necessarily vedic by this or universally recognized there. Is Hindu apparently. So i am told by people who seem to know these things. Enlighten me some more if you know otherwise. Thanks for your e-mails. Regardless, was odd feeling for people who had come to pay their respects. Western women and Indian women, who had come there were 'held back' in areas at a remote location. -Doug in FF --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael soulchild@ wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, dhamiltony2k5 dhamiltony2k5@ wrote: Well, nothing in the 'vedic scripture' proscribes this particular distinction about funeral rites. No separation by gender from scripture in Shastra and the like, hence this particular funeral part about gender Jim-crow is not 'Vedic'. It was conceived. All the relations present, men and women bow to the dead. Finally the corpse is put upon a ladder-like bier of bamboo and borne by four persons on their shoulders to the crematin ground, the priest and the chief mourner (who holds the sacred fire for burning the dead body) walking in front of the bier. Women do not accompany a funeral procession. http://www.nagpuronline.com/people/rit_hndu.html Not vedic, it was just in the choreography and power-tripping of this unique event. Keeping the Westerners at bay in a way too. The Indian movement was respectful when they had to be, but evidently not as inclusive. Inner and outer circles. You'll notice Nadir Ram walked behind and was not in their boat? It was just part of the story there. Nobody stood up for the women when it could have been done, except those soldiers later in the story. Probably as likely that nobody wanted to deal with or work out the logistics. So it boiled down to: Just tell them its 'Vedic', and keep them out.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 9:09 AM, dhamiltony2k5 wrote: Then another guy came running towards us and I avoided him seeing my face, I knew him.. and I didn't want anymore of his judgements, about me being there..He started yelling at Meadow. He said it was announced to all the ladies in the hall that they could not come. Meadow said to him : Who are You? You are being so rude to me, I just arrived a couple of hours ago, and I didn't get to go in the hall, I never heard the announcement. I felt a pinch... I had not heard the announcement directly, but I knew that was the case from all the talk around the grounds. I FELT OBLIGATED TO RELINQUISH MY STRONG DESIRE AND RETREAT... I said to Meadow: Let's just go, come on...: She didn't want to leave. She wanted me to stay... But I couldn't... If there was even the SLIGHTEST, MINUTEST, CHANCE that MAHARISHI could get BAD KARMA from me being there, how could I possibly stay? How selfish would that have been??? Meadow gave in finally and we started to leave but the guards wouldn't let us. Let go inside, it's OK. I told one guard that we were just told that we couldn't come in and we didn't want to create a problem. He and several others wouldn't hear of it... THEY WANTED US TO GO IN...THEY WERE INSISTING... So what to do? Whose voice was the voice of Divinity that we were suppose to listen to, the guards, or the movement guys??? A TOUGH CALL FOR SHIVA MA... I try to take my cues innocently from NATURE... DIVINITY in the FLESH... Whoever is in front of me speaking, I try to take as the words coming from GOD. Well MY INNER VOICE finally said GO So I went. We held hands as we sadly started down the stairs. We stopped about halfway down, at the spot where we had stood holding on to the wooden pole for dear life, and just closed our eyes and went into THE PROFOUND SILENCE... Why does this whole thing have a sort of Cinderella-at-the-ball kind of feel to me? Only in this case the good fairy is a bad fairy, and Prince Charming never shows up. Sal very dramatic and ungrounded is what I got out of it.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yep-- in situations that you describe, I always end up feeling sorriest for the asshole. After all, you can work out and get over the experience, whereas the person that yelled at you number one has to live being like that and two will one day realize that his supposed closeness to Maharishi doesn't shield him from his miserable life. I sort of wondered, why no women where there, and thought its one of those patriarchical movement rules, but later heard that its a general religious Hindu injunction for funerals. The movement had built a sort of an alternative altar-room for women in the hall where Maharishis body was kept for the last 24 hours, and men were prohibited to go there. I think this was a nice move. The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Some of those Purusha guys are the biggest assholes. I remember during the Taste of Utopia when I wanted to see Maharishi up close in the field house and I has very bad vision and so I went into the purusha group to see him and one of them asked me, Are you on purusha? To which I replied, Yes. And then he yelled at me with utter righeousness, You are a liar! he yelled it at me and I felt so shaken that I went to the back of the hall and forgot about trying to get close to Maharishi again during that time. Last time he came to the US. I had never been so close to such self righteousness in my entire life, and not since. Powerful. Assholeness. yep-- in situations that you describe, I always end up feeling sorriest for the asshole. After all, you can work out and get over the experience, whereas the person that yelled at you number one has to live being like that and two will one day realize that his supposed closeness to Maharishi doesn't shield him from his miserable life.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Michael wrote: I sort of wondered, why no women where there, and thought its one of those patriarchical movement rules, but later heard that its a general religious Hindu injunction for funerals. IOW, patriarchal and misogynist--you had it right the first time. As Curtis and others have pointed out several times, hiding behind religion and slapping the term Vedic over everything doesn't make abusive traditions any less so. Sal
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Michael wrote: The movement had built a sort of an alternative altar-room for women in the hall where Maharishisbody was kept for the last 24 hours, and men were prohibited to go there. How thoughtful of them. I think this was a nice move. The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. Let them decide that, OK, Bonzo? Obviously some thought they could ascend. And Indian women apparently weren't allowed either. Sal
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
. The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. ---Yeah, their pussies get in the way. Oh wait, maybe they'll bleed on something. Or more likely some devout Hindu will get a horrible erection and inadvertantly cum themself to death. Or not having coks they can't muster the testosterone necessary for the long hike those twenty or so steps up the pire. Or maybe the urge to self immolate will be so strong given the natural tendency for Hindu women to just get all burned up over someone. Yep, so many really good reasons for women and men to be separated.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Michael wrote: I sort of wondered, why no women where there, and thought its one of those patriarchical movement rules, but later heard that its a general religious Hindu injunction for funerals. IOW, patriarchal and misogynist--you had it right the first time. I didn't mean to say that the rules are less patriarchal due to being Hindu rules - and I don't think the movement is really free to do what they want in this respect, would it have been there wouldn't have been a cremation in the first place. I think the Shankaracharya - who still is head to this particular tradition, has a big say in this. As Curtis and others have pointed out several times, hiding behind religion and slapping the term Vedic over everything doesn't make abusive traditions any less so. Not what I said, nor did I even use the word Vedic at all - I deliberately used Hindu. So please get this right madam - I am not saying Hindu things are right, I was just saying its a Hindu rule rather than a movement rule, thats all.Its so heard here to say anything without being immediately put into some kind of a box or being misunderstood. You can't just get a Hindu funeral with all the chanting etc and then change the rules - except of course if you want to reform Hinduism in a mayor way. When I was in south India, this was a big issue with the Ayyapa temple in Sabarimala. Its a temple in Kerala where only men are allowed to visit, and the must have a vow of celibacy for a period of 3 month. Women from 10 - 50 are currently disallowed to visit the temple. After the Venkateshwara temple in Tirupati, this is the 2nd most visited temple in India, with local copies in almost all cities. Alone Chennai has 3 Ayyapa temples see http://www.hindu.com/2008/02/08/stories/2008020859321400.htm New Delhi: The Kerala government on Thursday filed an affidavit in the Supreme Court favouring entry of women of all ages into the Sabarimala Ayyappa temple without restriction. At present, women in the age group 10-50 are not allowed. Ayyapa http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayyappan http://www.sabarimala.org/
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:01 AM, Michael wrote: The movement had built a sort of an alternative altar-room for women in the hall where Maharishisbody was kept for the last 24 hours, and men were prohibited to go there. How thoughtful of them. Yes, indeed it was thoughtful. I think this was a nice move. The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. Let them decide that, OK, Bonzo? Who's Bonzo? Obviously some thought they could ascend. And Indian women apparently weren't allowed either. Well I didn't keep anyone away if thats what you mean. Why is it so difficult to share some observations without being attacked for it. And isn't ascend the English word for going up? From latin as-cendere, as opposed to transcendere, going beyond.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:35 AM, Michael wrote: Its so heard here to say anything without being immediately put into some kind of a box or being misunderstood. So think before you talk, instead of coming across as an arrogant asshole. It was you, I believe, who said the ascent would be too tough for western women, or something to that effect. Who are you to make (or in this case, justify) decisions for others? Obviously, the women who wanted to go didn't think it would be too tough. But you or they know better. You can't just get a Hindu funeral with all the chanting etc and then change the rules - except of course if you want to reform Hinduism in a mayor way. Yeah, I'm sure reforming Hinduism is high on everyone's to-do list. All they wanted to do was say goodbye to MMY. Why is that so hard to understand. Sal
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:41 AM, Michael wrote: Well I didn't keep anyone away if thats what you mean. Why is it so difficult to share some observations without being attacked for it. You did more than share, you rationalized the practice of discrimination. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: . The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. ---Yeah, their pussies get in the way. Oh wait, maybe they'll bleed on something. Or more likely some devout Hindu will get a horrible erection and inadvertantly cum themself to death. Or not having coks they can't muster the testosterone necessary for the long hike those twenty or so steps up the pire. Or maybe the urge to self immolate will be so strong given the natural tendency for Hindu women to just get all burned up over someone. Yep, so many really good reasons for women and men to be separated. I said MOST western women. It was an almost stampede. I am not exaggerating, it was the toughest I was ever in. Actually I like women more who can handle such a thing, but most movement women I know wouldn't. Going up those steps meant that the whole crowd started swinging back and forth as it met against resistence of more people already standing there, and you know there is something called gravity. I must ask you, when have you last been in a crowd like this? Well I guess you prefer to sit at home in front of your TV or computer and give your live commentary from a save distance.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
see http://www.hindu.com/2008/02/08/stories/2008020859321400.htm New Delhi: The Kerala government on Thursday filed an affidavit in the Supreme Court favouring entry of women of all ages into the Sabarimala Ayyappa temple without restriction. At present, women in the age group 10-50 are not allowed. If Hindu gods listen to rules of democracies then why couldn't Maharishi?
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: see http://www.hindu.com/2008/02/08/stories/2008020859321400.htm New Delhi: The Kerala government on Thursday filed an affidavit in the Supreme Court favouring entry of women of all ages into the Sabarimala Ayyappa temple without restriction. At present, women in the age group 10-50 are not allowed. If Hindu gods listen to rules of democracies then why couldn't Maharishi? Well, ask Maharishi if you still can, and then the legislation is not yet through. Also I am not an Ayyappa guy, the temples I go to allow women.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Angela Mailander [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: So please get this right madam - I am not saying Hindu things are right, I was just saying its a Hindu rule rather than a movement rule, thats all. Not a TMO rule? No, a Hindu rule, I asked other people about it. That's why Purusha was so passionate about the presence of women, rather than apologetic? Can't speak for that guy and don't want to. And that's why there are no women in high places in the TMO? These are movement rules, yes, but not he above.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 12:08 PM, Michael wrote: You did more than share, you rationalized the practice of discrimination. No, I didn't. I just pointed to the source. Michael, thee were your exact words: The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. That's rationalizing a discriminatory practice. And you did it again here: I said MOST western women. It was an almost stampede. I am not exaggerating, it was the toughest I was ever in. Actually I like women more who can handle such a thing, but most movement women I know wouldn't Let them decide that, is all I'm saying. And then I reported something you didn't know yet, even though its just a minor detail. And then I didn't take a stand - and that seems to drive you mad. Projection, Michael. Sal
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:35 AM, Michael wrote: Its so heard here to say anything without being immediately put into some kind of a box or being misunderstood. So think before you talk, instead of coming across as an arrogant asshole. And I had thought there was something like a code for basic courtesy on this board. It was you, I believe, who said the ascent would be too tough for western women, or something to that effect. Who are you to make (or in this case, justify) decisions for others? Obviously, the women who wanted to go didn't think it would be too tough. But you or they know better. I said too tough for MOST women I know in the movement based on my 20 year old experience with Mother Divine. It would have been so simple to just actually read what I wrote instead of just assuming that I was all for those rules and was maybe even setting them up, no hey, I must have been this rude Purusha guy himself (wasn't I Purusha once, and aren't they all the same?) or I must have been at least in a sort of telepathic rapport with him. So much about projection. And then I even have the wits of defending myself to a feminist, a sure sign of being a chauvinist asshole, what else could I be? ;-) You can't just get a Hindu funeral with all the chanting etc and then change the rules - except of course if you want to reform Hinduism in a mayor way. Yeah, I'm sure reforming Hinduism is high on everyone's to-do list. All they wanted to do was say goodbye to MMY. Why is that so hard to understand. It is easy to understand, Sal, but its just as easy to understand that I didn't make up the rules, nor could I change them. I was actually just glad that I was allowed there myself and not chased away by either a movement guy, or some Punjabi policeman.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
So please get this right madam - I am not saying Hindu things are right, I was just saying its a Hindu rule rather than a movement rule, thats all. Not a TMO rule? That's why Purusha was so passionate about the presence of women, rather than apologetic? And that's why there are no women in high places in the TMO? Send instant messages to your online friends http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 11:41 AM, Michael wrote: Well I didn't keep anyone away if thats what you mean. Why is it so difficult to share some observations without being attacked for it. You did more than share, you rationalized the practice of discrimination. No, I didn't. I just pointed to the source. And then I reported something you didn't know yet, even though its just a minor detail. And then I didn't take a stand - and that seems to drive you mad. I just said how things there were, not what I think how they should be. Its mute to me, as I can't change them, so no need for me to judge and evaluate in a sort of an empty space.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 12:08 PM, Michael wrote: You did more than share, you rationalized the practice of discrimination. No, I didn't. I just pointed to the source. Michael, thee were your exact words: The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. That's rationalizing a discriminatory practice. And you did it again here: I said MOST western women. It was an almost stampede. I am not exaggerating, it was the toughest I was ever in. Actually I like women more who can handle such a thing, but most movement women I know wouldn't Let them decide that, is all I'm saying. I am all for that, but ITS NOT MY DECISION. I'm not in charge. I just said that many, actually most women I know wouldn't even have tried it, nor would there have been many western men either. (The Purushas were aready sitting up there) And then I reported something you didn't know yet, even though its just a minor detail. And then I didn't take a stand - and that seems to drive you mad. Projection, Michael. And when you say I come across as an arrogant asshole, that must have been projection as well I guess.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
Well I guess you prefer to sit at home in front of your TV or computer and give your live commentary from a save distance. -Yeah. It's true I prefer not to be part of stampedes. But now that you mention it, I was just one of those poor shmucks who could not afford to traipse across the globe so ooops, maybe it's due to socioeconomic factors like not one single self serving asshole in the Movement thought to try to help other lesser beings go pay tributes. And then all those smug smiles and faces and how lucky it is to be so filthy rich and wonderful. Geez. Whatever.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 1:35 PM, Michael wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 12:08 PM, Michael wrote: You did more than share, you rationalized the practice of discrimination. No, I didn't. I just pointed to the source. Michael, thee were your exact words: The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. That's rationalizing a discriminatory practice. And you did it again here: I said MOST western women. It was an almost stampede. I am not exaggerating, it was the toughest I was ever in. Actually I like women more who can handle such a thing, but most movement women I know wouldn't Let them decide that, is all I'm saying. I am all for that, but ITS NOT MY DECISION. I'm not in charge. I just said that many, actually most women I know wouldn't even have tried it, nor would there have been many western men either. (The Purushas were aready sitting up there) And then I reported something you didn't know yet, even though its just a minor detail. And then I didn't take a stand - and that seems to drive you mad. Projection, Michael. And when you say I come across as an arrogant asshole, that must have been projection as well I guess. The moral of this story is: ALWAYS bring marshmallows to a barbecue. It's a sure in, weird caste laws or not.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
talk, instead of coming across as an arrogant asshole. And I had thought there was something like a code for basic courtesy on this board. --Assumption of the decade. It was you, I believe, who said the ascent would be too tough for western women, or something to that effect. Who are you to make (or in this case, justify) decisions for others? Obviously, the women who wanted to go didn't think it would be too tough. But you or they know better. I said too tough for MOST women I know in the movement based on my 20 year old experience with Mother Divine. --Whoah, Isn't she a bit young? It would have been so simple to just actually read what I wrote instead of just assuming that I was all for those rules and was maybe even setting them up, no hey, I must have been this rude Purusha guy himself (wasn't I Purusha once, and aren't they all the same?) or I must have been at least in a sort of telepathic rapport with him. So much about projection. And then I even have the wits of defending myself to a feminist, a sure sign of being a chauvinist asshole, what else could I be? ;-) Touchy touchy.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
then he said the words that pierced me: It would be BAD KARMA for MAHARISHI for you to be here, and it would be BAD KARMA FOR YOU to be here. You must leave... Great! One bitch doesn't know her place, and now Maharishi is gunna miss seconds on ice cream night in heaven for eternity! Nice work ladies. Oh the joy this guy must have felt upholding a made up rule over a woman. This was for every chick in high school who wouldn't give him the time of day. As our blessed Shankara from the most holy tradition on earth used to like to say: (after the first beer I guess) A wise man views women as corpses. (After the third beer he was in the waitress's face with: You should be a model baby, are you modeling? What, no? I've got to introduce you to my closest friends in L.A. they got Gisele Bündchen her Victoria Secret gig and I can totally hook you up...) When I think of the sacrifices women in the movement made fulfilling Maharishi's dreams, alongside their betters (er that would be the Sneetches with stars on their bellies, or maybe a bit lower...) The Sneetches, by Dr. Seuss Now, the Star-Bell Sneetches had bellies with stars. The Plain-Belly Sneetches had none upon thars. Those stars weren't so big. They were really so small. You might think such a thing wouldn't matter at all. But, because they had stars, all the Star-Belly Sneetches Would brag, We're the best kind of Sneetch on the beaches. With their snoots in the air, they would sniff and they'd snort We'll have nothing to do with the Plain-Belly sort! And, whenever they met some, when they were out walking, They'd hike right on past them without even talking. When the Star-Belly children went out to play ball, Could a Plain Belly get in the game? Not at all. You only could play if your bellies had stars And the Plain-Belly children had none upon thars. When the Star Belly Sneetches had frankfurter roasts Or picnics or parties or marshmallow toasts, They never invited the Plain-Belly Sneetches They left them out cold, in the dark of the beaches. They kept them away. Never let them come near. And that's how they treated them year after year. Then ONE day, it seems while the Plain-Belly Sneetches Were moping and doping alone on the beaches, Just sitting there wishing their bellies had stars, A stranger zipped up in the strangest of cars! My friends, he announced in a voice clear and clean, My name is Sylvester McMonkey McBean. And I've heard of Your troubles. I've heard you're unhappy. But I can fix that, I'm the Fix-It-Up Chappie. I've come here to help you. I have what you need. And my prices are low. And I work with great speed. And my work is one hundred per cent guaranteed! Then, quickly, Sylvester McMonkey McBean Put together a very peculiar machine. And he said, You want stars like a Star-Belly Sneetch? My friends, you can have them for three dollars each! Just pay me your money and hop right aboard! So they clambered inside. Then the big machine roared. And it klonked. And it bonked. And it jerked. And it berked. And it bopped them about. But the thing really worked! When the Plain-Belly Sneetches popped out, they had stars! They actually did. They had stars upon thars! Then they yelled at the ones who had stars at the start, We're still the best Sneetches and they are the worst. But now, how in the world will we know, they all frowned, If which kind is what, or the other way round? Then up came McBean with a very sly wink. And he said, Things are not quite as bad as you think. So you don't know who's who. That is perfectly true. But come with me, friends. Do you know what I'll do? I'll make you, again, the best Sneetches on the beaches. And all it will cost you is ten dollars eaches. Belly stars are no longer in style, said McBean. What you need is a trip through my Star-Off Machine. This wondrous contraption will take OFF your stars so you won't look like Sneetches that have them on thars. And that handy machine working very precisely Removed all the stars from their tummies quite nicely. Then, with snoots in the air, they paraded about. And they opened their beaks and they let out a shout, We know who is who! Now there Isn't a doubt. The best kind of Sneetches are Sneetches without! Then, of course, those with stars got all frightfully mad. To be wearing a star was frightfully bad. Then, of course, old Sylvester McMonkey McBean invited THEM into his Star-Off Machine. Then, of course from THEN on, as you probably guess, Things really got into a horrible mess. All the rest of that day, on those wild screaming beaches, The Fix-It-Up Chappie kept fixing up Sneetches. Off again! On again! In again! Out again! Through the machines they raced round and about again, Changing their stars every minute or two. They kept paying money. They kept running through until the Plain nor the Star-Bellies knew Whether this one was that one or that one was this one. Or which one Was what one or what one was who. Then, when every last
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I guess you prefer to sit at home in front of your TV or computer and give your live commentary from a save distance. -Yeah. It's true I prefer not to be part of stampedes. But now that you mention it, I was just one of those poor shmucks who could not afford to traipse across the globe so ooops, maybe it's due to socioeconomic factors like not one single self serving asshole in the Movement thought to try to help other lesser beings go pay tributes. And then all those smug smiles and faces and how lucky it is to be so filthy rich and wonderful. Geez. Whatever. So you say, with all the opinions you have given here recently, you would have gone if it would have cost you just, lets say 200 bucks? Well, I was already in India, and had to take only inland flights, so it was cheaper to me, then it would have been to you. But there was a risk of being too late, not getting flights in time, no flights to Allahabad or Varanasi on the net) two days in buses, planes, cars, with basically no sleep, being in a cheap hotel in a foreign city, standing 8 hours in a traffic queue, freezing virtually, getting out of the car at 6 am and starting to walk 20 kms before Allahabad, finding a rikshaw with 2 boys not speaking english, that could navigate through the traffic, driving to the other side of the river, just to realize that we are totally lost, going back, getting a basic sense of direction, finally arriving at 8.30am and getting in the crowd right away, getting back to ffl to be smacked of politically incorrect statements - what a wonderful life for us filthy rich.
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
On Mar 5, 2008, at 12:35 PM, Michael wrote: Let them decide that, is all I'm saying. I am all for that, but ITS NOT MY DECISION. Why not? Couldn't you have said something? I'm not in charge. Couldn't you have spoken up anyway? Or did you agree with the treatment those women were getting? Or were you just following orders, so to speak? I just said that many, actually most women I know wouldn't even have tried it, But apparently *these* women did. Do you even read your own emails, Michael? nor would there have been many western men either. (The Purushas were aready sitting up there) How did they get there--magic carpet? Presumably either they walked or used some kind of powered vehicle to get there, the same way the women could have. All I'm saying is, don't rationalize or tacitly condone bad behavior, as you seem to be doing. All that is necessary for evil (or in this case, condescension) to succeed, is for good people to do nothing. Paraphrased. Sal
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
I would have loved to go. I have never been to India, never having had two dimes to rub together. - Original Message - From: Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 1:42 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Well I guess you prefer to sit at home in front of your TV or computer and give your live commentary from a save distance. -Yeah. It's true I prefer not to be part of stampedes. But now that you mention it, I was just one of those poor shmucks who could not afford to traipse across the globe so ooops, maybe it's due to socioeconomic factors like not one single self serving asshole in the Movement thought to try to help other lesser beings go pay tributes. And then all those smug smiles and faces and how lucky it is to be so filthy rich and wonderful. Geez. Whatever. So you say, with all the opinions you have given here recently, you would have gone if it would have cost you just, lets say 200 bucks? Well, I was already in India, and had to take only inland flights, so it was cheaper to me, then it would have been to you. But there was a risk of being too late, not getting flights in time, no flights to Allahabad or Varanasi on the net) two days in buses, planes, cars, with basically no sleep, being in a cheap hotel in a foreign city, standing 8 hours in a traffic queue, freezing virtually, getting out of the car at 6 am and starting to walk 20 kms before Allahabad, finding a rikshaw with 2 boys not speaking english, that could navigate through the traffic, driving to the other side of the river, just to realize that we are totally lost, going back, getting a basic sense of direction, finally arriving at 8.30am and getting in the crowd right away, getting back to ffl to be smacked of politically incorrect statements - what a wonderful life for us filthy rich. To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 12:35 PM, Michael wrote: Let them decide that, is all I'm saying. I am all for that, but ITS NOT MY DECISION. Why not? Couldn't you have said something? I'm not in charge. Couldn't you have spoken up anyway? To whom? I was in a crowd from where you couldn't even move. I didn't get in close proximity of any movement official. They had an area of there own, with chairs, ribbons etc, opposite of where I was amongst Indians. I'm not a movement person, have no dome badge, I'm a complete outsider. (but for you its probably just another rationalization) Or did you agree with the treatment those women were getting? I'm not sure you are aware of the situation: Do you think that I eye-witnessed the occassion? I just much later realized that there were no women. There were only Hindi speaking policemen all around, or Indians, it was just a pushing and shoveling from beginning to end. The story that was told I read here. Or were you just following orders, so to speak? Which orders? I followed the crowd, trying to stay in all the time. I just said that many, actually most women I know wouldn't even have tried it, But apparently *these* women did. Do you even read your own emails, Michael? No, I write them ;-) But I don't really see the contradiction between my statement and yours. That these women did it, is great, but IMO MOST movement women, especially Mother Divines, wouldn't really even want to be in such a crowd. nor would there have been many western men either. (The Purushas were aready sitting up there) How did they get there--magic carpet? Presumably either they walked or used some kind of powered vehicle to get there, the same way the women could have. Obviously they went there before everybody else - the Rajas and Purushas were not in the procession. Where this was leading up to, and who already was waiting there, I only realized after we (the crowd) had settled there, in a tight position, half kneeling sitting, half standing. All I'm saying is, don't rationalize or tacitly condone bad behavior, as you seem to be doing. Thanks for the advice. But to me this whole rant of you simply sounds a bit too absolutist, looking from the top so to say, at a situation you have obviously no idea about. (which is okay in itself, how could you.) Again, I was glad to be allowed there myself, no being sent away by police or movement people, being able to get as close as I could get to the event. I could not have talked to police-men, as they were not speaking English. Neither could I speak to any movement people until after the whole thing was over, as they were on the opposite site, closed off by ribbons, sitting on chairs. Nor would they even have listened to me , a stranger, and outsider, who was inside a movement building last 20 years ago. So I didn't take this to be an issue, as it would have been vain. I simply observed. Thats all. I was in witnessing mode. Who am I to tell the movement people what they should do? Its not my movement anymore. I have a different master, who is btw. female, a REAL Mother Divine. Maybe by the same token I should have spoken to all the muslim women in India, to remove their hijab, but then again, I don't speak their language, and they would be embarrased if a foreign man speaks to them, and they would feel this to be an intrusion into their religion, part of the white man showing his superiority in matters moral and ethic to the rest of the world.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, curtisdeltablues [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: then he said the words that pierced me: It would be BAD KARMA for MAHARISHI for you to be here, and it would be BAD KARMA FOR YOU to be here. You must leave... snip yep, I thought that was 24 karat pure bullshit too-- sounded like the boogey-man's gonna get you. real crap.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would have loved to go. I have never been to India, never having had two dimes to rub together. I believe you! I love India too, its like an LSD trip (well I don't know how that is, but I think its like being in India) There were two American girls who came last year and they said there is nothing which can prepare you for that experience. Probably from the outside it is comparable to Mexico, but then the people are different, the religion, the sounds, the colors, its all a unique blend. And then its saints...
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Sal Sunshine salsunshine@ wrote: On Mar 5, 2008, at 12:08 PM, Michael wrote: You did more than share, you rationalized the practice of discrimination. No, I didn't. I just pointed to the source. Michael, thee were your exact words: The ascent to the burning place was a tough one anyway, not really suited for most western women. That's rationalizing a discriminatory practice. And you did it again here: I said MOST western women. It was an almost stampede. I am not exaggerating, it was the toughest I was ever in. Actually I like women more who can handle such a thing, but most movement women I know wouldn't Let them decide that, is all I'm saying. I am all for that, but ITS NOT MY DECISION. I'm not in charge. I just said that many, actually most women I know wouldn't even have tried it, nor would there have been many western men either. (The Purushas were aready sitting up there) And then I reported something you didn't know yet, even though its just a minor detail. And then I didn't take a stand - and that seems to drive you mad. Projection, Michael. And when you say I come across as an arrogant asshole, that must have been projection as well I guess. you sound like a decent soul passing on some information to me. thanks.
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, sandiego108 [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Projection, Michael. And when you say I come across as an arrogant asshole, that must have been projection as well I guess. you sound like a decent soul passing on some information to me. thanks. Thank you. I already got into self-doubt. I actually rather just narrate things happening than giving judgements and evaluations. Nobody is really waiting for my opinion I think - and why exactly must I have an opinion about everything?
Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
I just love India. I have had pujas done at a huge assortment of temples via online services. Just the idea of being able to worship pretty much anything. I had the five elemental temples fully abhishekaed last year. What a boost to the imagination. I just would love to feel all of those vibes first hand and find out if it was all in my mind or what?! Buddhist lamas want me to go to Nepal and Tibet and Dharamsala and Sikkim and Bhutan, but Buddhist that I am I am just so much more into simple goodness of worship of things. It just seems so pretty. I think of India like being a really sexy sweetheart, while those other places are like good hearted brothers. I can't wait to go someday. First I will go to Vizag, Calcutta, and Assam, and visit Devipuram, Khalighat, and Kamakhya. And also probably Babadham and the very powerful Tarapeeth. - Original Message - From: Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 3:13 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I would have loved to go. I have never been to India, never having had two dimes to rub together. I believe you! I love India too, its like an LSD trip (well I don't know how that is, but I think its like being in India) There were two American girls who came last year and they said there is nothing which can prepare you for that experience. Probably from the outside it is comparable to Mexico, but then the people are different, the religion, the sounds, the colors, its all a unique blend. And then its saints... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
[FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation
India vs. LSD I latched on to that comparison immediately..Both are full of vibrant colors, in both trips everything seems intensely significant, and then there's the bugs crawling on ya...sorrya little off topic, but unfortunate nonetheless. Seriously while I don't know that the author of the Gita intended for it to pave the way for the caste system, so many great ideas, so much inspiration and beauty have come from the subcontinent that I'd thoroughly dig a visit there. Any culture that could produce Buddha is cool by me.Has anyone else made the connection of Buddha being to Hinduism what Jesus was to Judaism? Or am I just non retardedly challenged? Not entirely the same.but they were both well versed in their culture's religious traditions but both kinda said..this might be simpler than all this superfluous ceremonial stuff yer doin. And in both cases their followers created their own superfluous ceremonial mummery and far out religious groups and organizations that are often hard to connect with the life and actual teachings of these two people. Don't get me wrong.I LOVE what Japan has done with Buddhism..Like the Nichiren Sect that teaches it's adherents to chant Nam Myoho Renge Kyo because these syllables are so sacred that merely uttering them brings you into alignment with the deeper underlying energy of the universe .I KNOW! I'm like, what a coincidence! WHere have I heard that kinda thing? By the way, I would never advocate the use of ANY drugs.I've NEVER done any of them so I'm SURE they have NOTHING to offer. :) I've 'heard' that LSD makes everything colorful and significant.and makes you think you've got bugs crawling on ya.Just remember..If drugs were Flinstone Vitamins, LSD would be the 'Great Gazoo'.NEVER mix yer Gazoos with yer Dinos..justjus' DON'T... Now, if religions were Flinstone Vitaminsyeah, this is stoopit.good night y'all. --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I just love India. I have had pujas done at a huge assortment of temples via online services. Just the idea of being able to worship pretty much anything. I had the five elemental temples fully abhishekaed last year. What a boost to the imagination. I just would love to feel all of those vibes first hand and find out if it was all in my mind or what?! Buddhist lamas want me to go to Nepal and Tibet and Dharamsala and Sikkim and Bhutan, but Buddhist that I am I am just so much more into simple goodness of worship of things. It just seems so pretty. I think of India like being a really sexy sweetheart, while those other places are like good hearted brothers. I can't wait to go someday. First I will go to Vizag, Calcutta, and Assam, and visit Devipuram, Khalighat, and Kamakhya. And also probably Babadham and the very powerful Tarapeeth. - Original Message - From: Michael [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com Sent: Wednesday, March 05, 2008 3:13 PM Subject: [FairfieldLife] Re: FW: eye-witness at the cremation --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Kirk kirk_bernhardt@ wrote: I would have loved to go. I have never been to India, never having had two dimes to rub together. I believe you! I love India too, its like an LSD trip (well I don't know how that is, but I think its like being in India) There were two American girls who came last year and they said there is nothing which can prepare you for that experience. Probably from the outside it is comparable to Mexico, but then the people are different, the religion, the sounds, the colors, its all a unique blend. And then its saints... To subscribe, send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Or go to: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/FairfieldLife/ and click 'Join This Group!' Yahoo! Groups Links
