subject:"Re\: Anemia Issues"

I'm glad you made contact with Susan.  Now, let me try to help with the 
vegetarian thing.  Get a food processor...even a small, two cup Black and 
Decker (usually on sale at Kohl's or one of the superstores).  Get small muffin 
pans or large ice cube trays.  Buy lots of the chicken and liver...enough for a 
week or so.  This is easier to deal with once a week or every two weeks than 
every day.  Cut up what you need (the food processor will let you minimize 
handling the stuff).  Coat whatever you are going to freeze the stuff with 
olive oil (I've stopped using the Pam type sprays because I'm not really sure 
what is in them and I do know with olive oil).  Put the stuff from the blender 
into the pans and freeze them, pop the stuff out into Ziploc bags and remove as 
needed.   To clean the processor put soap in it and let water run over it until 
most of the stuff is washed off.  You may need to get a little hair strainer 
for the kitchen sink (Wal-Mart, Meijer etc in plumbing).  They run about 2 
dollars and will catch all the little pieces of food.  Emptying it is a breeze. 
 Turn it upside down over a bowl or cup and pour water thru it.  Again, it 
minimizes contact.  I know this is very elementary but, having been there with 
no guidance, here it is.  Please don't think I am talking down to you.  

Susan is a licensed vet and can provide your regular/primary vet care.  I don't 
know if she mentioned that or not but she does a very good job and might be 
able to help you avoid the pitfalls of over vaccination etc.  Her practice 
includes acupuncture, homeopathic remedies etc.  I think I sent you her 
website.  I don't know Dr. Jones but do know that a lot of vets are not happy 
sharing a patient with a holistic vet.  I'm lucky with the vets at MAC.  My 
suggestion would be to try her for all your care.  Besides (and please don't 
tell her I told you this) in an emergency she has been known to make house 
calls.  Ask Susan about remedies to lessen stress from car rides too.  

Again, she may not have told you this, but she and the techs there have had 
really good luck with a pretty big number of FeLV+ cats.  

Good luck.

You might ask Susan about adding chopped spinach and other iron/vitamin rich 
foods to Monkee's new diet.  Dixie loves them...same processor makes them 
very digestible for a cat.  Again, ask Dixie.  Also ask Susan about Primal Raw 
since I doubt you are feeding only hamburger and livers.  Metzger's (You almost 
run into the place.  It is on the other side of the stop light at Shelbyville 
Rd and Veechdale (?---the road you turn onto when you get off 64 E) has it and 
it is wonderful.  It seems pricy but Dixie gets 2-3 cubes a day and the cost 
per usable food is less than FF.  






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Gina WN 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 4:42 AM
  Subject: RE: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


  You're a good mom Caroline!!

  You made me laugh out loud with your description of feeling weak-kneed.

  :) Gina

  Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I talked to Dr. Susan Maier (holistic) yesterday.  I was having a lot of 
trouble myself remaining positive and I was doing a lot of crying this week 
about Monkee's anemia situation.  She said that Monkee's has a really strong 
life-force and he looks really good and I need to stay positive because the 
blood transfusion will buy more time for her remedies to work.  I asked about 
reversal of the anemia and asked her to look at the records of the blood 
results from his CBC on Tuesday at Dr. Daley's.  I asked if she could tell if 
he had regenerative or nonregenerative anemia based on those.  She said his 
regenerative values were all within the normal limits, but that no, she 
couldn't tell from the blood results.  However, she told me if the anemia is 
brought on by the chemo, it's usually regenerative (and can thus be reversed); 
if the anemia is brought on by his actual Feline Leukemia, it's usually 
nonregenerative (and usually irreversible).  I said, I guess that is why Dr. 
Daley talked about doing the bone marrow biopsy, because that would be the only 
way to really examine the marrow and be able to tell what is going on with the 
RBC, right?  Dr. Maier said yes.  I said, of course, we aren't doing a bone 
marrow biopsy, but now I FINALLY have a better understanding of what is going 
on.  I know Dr. Daley is a good Vet, she's just so clinical, and 
soo cerebral that I don't think she explains things the way I need 
things explained to me

Re: Anemia Issues

OK:  Here is more information to take or leave as you chose.

Dr. Daley is a very good vet and so are the people who work there.  That being 
said, they are specialists and have trouble seeing beyond the science into the 
whole.  The Royal Princess Kitty Katt had cancer that spread pretty rapidly.  
One of the doctors who works there saw her several times (she hated the place 
too and he would not let me be with her when they drew blood etc) and wanted to 
put her on chemo.  He gave her a couple of months at the outside if she didn't 
get it.  I went to my vets at MAC and we had a long conversation.  Kitty did 
not get chemo and she had 14 months of very high quality life until she left 
this world on her own.  She, too, hated car rides (especially after a school 
bus driver plowed into her side of the Jeep) and vets.  Dr. Kohler and I spent 
a long time talking about the ups, downs, rights, wrongs etc and, as I said 
before, decided against chemo and to let Kitty leave this world on her own if 
she wanted to.  I have never regretted either decision. 

Watch that carrier trick.  He could try that in a parking lot and you would 
have big trouble.  There are other places to get blood transfusions if you 
don't feel comfortable at Dr. Daley's.  They are very good at what they do and 
I would certainly go back there for treatment if the situation called for it 
but, like all of us, they have their focuses.  




 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: catatonya 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Sunday, July 01, 2007 8:54 PM
  Subject: Re: Anemia Issues 


  Hi Caroline,

  It sounds like you're doing everything you can.  I'm sure by now someone has 
mentioned taking doxy in case it's hemobartonella.  If it's not hemobart the 
anemia is hard to beat, but there are people on the list who have bought 'good' 
time for their cats with various methods.  13 pounds is a good weight, and his 
behavior sounds good too.  I hope the best for Monkee.
  tonya

  Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV pos. and 
lymphosarcoma cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet yesterday to determine whether the 
Epogen had helped his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last week, 
when the anemia started, his Red Blood cell count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 
doses of the Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%.  However, Monkee's 
White Blood Cell count is normal (it was down last week) and his lymphocyte 
count is normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his groin that is 
enlarged (but it can't be felt from the outside- it runs along the artery in 
the leg).  His Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem, or it could 
be the lymphosarcoma, but when pressed, she said that she honestly doubted it 
was the cancer.  She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow aspirate/biopsy to 
determine what is going on at the cellular level; however, it is invasive and 
Monkee would need sedation- which he couldn't get anyway while so anemic (so 
he'd need a blood transfusion 1st, just to be able to do the biospy);  However, 
the biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us it's FeLV causing the 
anemia; (2) a blood transfusion to literally buy me more time with him; (3) try 
another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is being caused by 
lymphosarcoma, although, as I said previously, she doubted it and that was a 
shot in the dark. 
My mother and I did not want to put this cat through chemo again (although 
he did very well with the first round).  But now that he is actively anemic, 
there was no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr. Daley really didn't 
think the chemo would actually help the situation.  We also didn't want to put 
him through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell us what we already 
know, but don't want to admit.that for four years, I had the healthiest, 
beefiest, toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered from a urinary 
tract infection; who was so healthy, I wanted to test him a 3rd time this 
summer for FeLV because I was sure he didn't have it..To now, out of nowhere, 
in a span of 2 months, we have gone from that, to a severely anemic, suffering, 
FeLV cat with lymphosarcoma.  
Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I were not prepared to 
hear at all.  I mean, he is eating, drinking, using the litter box, he is thick 
(he was slightly overweight to begin with, so that is helping him now).  Yes, 
he's not Monkee as I have known him, but he just doesn't look to me like he's 
on his last leg.  When we

Re: To Taylor: Re: Anemia Issues

Taylor,
Make sure and read Caroline's post on feeding raw chicken livers and lean 
hamburger to Monkee.  






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Taylor Scobie Humphrey 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 2:01 AM
  Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues 


  Caroline, I'm in the same boat with my little Sammy.  He and his two brothers 
(triplets--I raised 'em from infancy with no catmommy so they are my tiny 
kidlets--who knew they'd be cats!?) were negative for FeLV and then at nine 
months Sammy had really alarming big swollen glands like--poof!--one morning 
and after tests found out on Monday that my tough little character was FeLV+ 
and on Tuesday that he had lymphoma.  Tears, tears.  He has gone out of 
remission after nearly three very good months and now he's got at most two 
months with a new chemotherapy protocol and I am trying not to lose it here.  
At least thank God he will see his first birthday and that of his sibbies.  So 
far his sibbies remain FeLV- and I just don't know how they will be without 
their sib in a few months.  Or how I will be, for that matter.  I'm a wreck 
already, of course.


  Thinking of you, your mom and your darling Monkee, 


  Taylor and the 3 Orange Boyz (my babies)




  Consciousness is Causal 
   and Physicality is its
   Manifestation.




  On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:06 PM, wendy wrote:


P.S. Chemo can cause anemia.  I don't know if I
mentioned this or not.


:)
Wendy


--- Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:




-


Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV
pos. and lymphosarcoma cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet
yesterday to determine whether the Epogen had helped
his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last
week, when the anemia started, his Red Blood cell
count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 doses of the
Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%. 
However, Monkee’s White Blood Cell count is normal (it
was down last week) and his lymphocyte count is
normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his
groin that is enlarged (but it can’t be felt from the
outside- it runs along the artery in the leg).  His
Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem,
or it could be the lymphosarcoma, but when pressed,
she said that she honestly doubted it was the cancer. 
She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow
aspirate/biopsy to determine what is going on at the
cellular level; however, it is invasive and Monkee
would need sedation- which he couldn’t get anyway
while so anemic (so he'd need a blood transfusion 1st,
just to be able to do the biospy);  However, the
biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us
it’s FeLV causing the anemia; (2) a blood transfusion
to literally buy me more time with him; (3) try
another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is
being caused by lymphosarcoma, although, as I said
previously, she doubted it and that was a shot in the
dark. 


My mother and I did not want to put this cat through
chemo again (although he did very well with the first
round).  But now that he is actively anemic, there was
no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr.
Daley really didn’t think the chemo would actually
help the situation.  We also didn’t want to put him
through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell
us what we already know, but don’t want to admit…that
for four years, I had the healthiest, beefiest,
toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered
from a urinary tract infection; who was so healthy, I
wanted to test him a 3rd time this summer for FeLV
because I was sure he didn’t have it….To now, out of
nowhere, in a span of 2 months, we have gone from
that, to a severely anemic, suffering, FeLV cat with
lymphosarcoma.  


Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I
were not prepared to hear at all.  I mean, he is
eating, drinking, using the litter box, he is thick
(he was slightly overweight to begin with, so that is
helping him now).  Yes, he’s not “Monkee” as I have
known him, but he just doesn’t look to me like he’s on
his last leg.  When we questioned her on the “days”
prognosis she explained that due to the FeLV virus,
and the anemia, his body is not making RBC and his
brain is not getting enough oxygen and although he
seems okay now, he is dizzy, lightheaded, probably
having vertigo

Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

minimize handling the stuff). Coat whatever you are going to freeze the stuff with olive oil (I've stopped using the Pam type sprays because I'm not really sure what is in them and I do know with olive oil). Put the stuff from the blender into the pans and freeze them, pop the stuff out into Ziploc bags and remove as needed. To clean the processor put soap in it 
and let water run over it until most of the "stuff" is washed off. You may need to get a little hair strainer for the kitchen sink (Wal-Mart, Meijer etc in plumbing). They run about 2 dollars and will catch all the little pieces of food. Emptying it is a breeze. Turn it upside down over a bowl or cup and pour water thru it. Again, it minimizes contact. I know this is very elementary but, having been there with no guidance, here it is. Please don't think I am talking down to you. 

Susan is a licensed vet and can provide your regular/primary vet care. I don't know if she mentioned that or not but she does a very good job and might be able to help you avoid the pitfalls of over vaccination etc. Her practice includes acupuncture,homeopathic remedies etc. I think I sent you her website. I don't know Dr. Jones but do know that a lot of vets are not happy "sharing" a patient with a holistic vet. I'm lucky with the vets at MAC. My suggestion would be to try her for all your care. Besides (and please don't tell her I told you this) in an emergency she has been known to make house calls. Ask Susanabout remedies to lessen stress from car rides too.

Again, she may not have told you this, but she and the techs there have had really good luck with a prettybig number of FeLV+ cats.

Good luck.

You might ask Susan about adding chopped spinach and other iron/vitamin rich foods to Monkee's new diet. Dixie loves them...same processor makes them very digestible for a cat. Again, ask Dixie. Also ask Susan about Primal Raw since I doubt you are feeding only hamburger and livers. Metzger's (You almost run into theplace. It is on the other side of the stop light at Shelbyville Rd and Veechdale (?---the road you turn onto when you get off 64 E) has it and it is wonderful.It seems pricy but Dixie gets 2-3 cubes a day and the cost per usable food is less than FF.






 If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis

----- Original Message - 
From: Gina WN 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 4:42 AM
Subject: RE: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

You're a good mom Caroline!!

You made me laugh out loud with your descriptionof feeling weak-kneed.

:) GinaCaroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:


I talked to Dr. Susan Maier (holistic) yesterday. I was having a lot of trouble myself remaining positive and I was doing a lot of crying this week about Monkee's anemia situation. She said that Monkee's has a really strong life-force and he looks really good and I need to stay positive because the blood transfusion will buy more time for her remedies to work. I asked about reversal of the anemia and asked her to look at the records of the blood results from his CBC on Tuesday at Dr. Daley's. I asked if she could tell if he had regenerative or nonregenerative anemia based on those. She said his regenerative values were all within the normal limits, but that no, she couldn't tell from the blood results. However, she told me if the anemia is brought on by the chemo, it's usually regenerative (and can thus be reversed); if the anemia is brought on by 
his actual Feline Leukemia, it's usually nonregenerative (and usually irreversible). I said, I guess that is why Dr. Daley talked about doing the bone marrow biopsy, because that would be the only way to really examine the marrow and be able to tell what is going on with the RBC, right?Dr. Maier said yes. I said, of course, we aren't doing a bone marrow biopsy, but now I FINALLY have a better understanding of what is going on. I know Dr. Daley is a good Vet, she's just so clinical, and soo cerebral that I don't think she explains things the way I need things explained to me. And it's not that I am dumb, it's just that this is my first FelV+ cat- and unlike her, I haven't been through this (sadly) a million times with other FelV+ cats. Also, when I am sitting there crying my eyes out at what she is saying to me, I really need 
her to slow down and talk to me like I am a dumb baby! So, I am kind of having an issue with that right now. Dr. Maier said that I can call her anytime to "bounce ideas off" of her or ask for clarification about something so I thought that was very refreshing. 


I have also put a call into Monkee's original Vet, Dr. Jones at the Cat Clinic of Louisville- for him to call me to discuss us returning to him for primary care since Monkee's main problem now is anemia and not cancer. I haven't heard from him yet.

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-07-02 Thread HIDEYO YAMAMOTO

How much does he weigh? And what is the strength of epogen did your vet use?
I am emailing you the link regarding information on epogen in case you find it
helpful.

http://www.felinecrf.org/anaemia.htm#treatmentshttp://www.felinecrf.org/anaemia.htm#treatments
- Original Message -
From: Gina WNmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 3:44 AM
Subject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Great idea about the binder!

Gina

Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Monkee's HCT was 13% two weeks ago (when we first went to the Vet because I
knew something was wrong). That was on a Tuesday. They gave him .3 of Epogen
and sent me home with a tiny bottle to give him sub-cu injections of Epogen
that Thurs, and Sat. They increased his predisone (which was 5 mg- I think?
the little, small pills), every other day, to one every day; his Vet also added
the appetite stimulant, 1/2 a pill twice a day. We did the week of Epogen,
went back this Tues. and that is when his HCT count was 10% and his Vet told us
the options (marrow biopsy, transfusion, etc). We did the blood transfusion on
Wed. and they said after it, his count was up to 15%. The instructions were to
just continue the pred and the appetite stim. Nothing was said about the
Interferon or Epogen and I was too out of it to ask because I was so shocked by
the bill from the transfusion (and all I could think was that we can't afford
another one).
He was, what I call Super Monkee (it speaks for itself) on Wed., after
the transfusion. But since then, he's gone down a little bit (not with eating
though); but he's defintely less Super Monkee, and he's less bright-eyed. But
he is still sleeping better- actual sound sleeping, as opposed to the just
laying there and staring into space sleeping.
I have printed your emails and I filed them in Monkee's Care Binder- that
I have organized with ALL his information and it has dividers and everything.
I am going to ask questions from the emails when a Vet ever calls me back! But
I decided I need to bring some MAJOR organization to caring for Monkee if I
want to do this right, hence the binder! I highly suggest this to anyone who
isn't already doing something similar. I take The Monkee Binder with me
everywhere.
-Caroline

PS. Bailey had the bone marrow aspirate and that is why we very
strongly suspected cancer somewhere. He had Myloid Dysplastic
(basically there were pre-cancerous cells there). We did every test
we could think of and couldn't find the cancer, even after we got
his HCT to normal, he had no energy and wouldn't eat. He succumbed
to pancreatic cancer which we found after he passed with a necropsy.
I suspected his pancreas was involved because he always was
uncomfortable when I fed him through his feeding tube. He was on
high doses of prednisolone and was getting doxy just incase his
hemobartonella test was a false negative. The pred and the epo are
what got his HCT back to normal and stopped the bone marrow
surpression by the virus.

Belinda
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Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues









I'm all to familiar with that both in people and vets.  Dr. Maier, Dr. Boswell 
and the doctors at Middletown Animal Clinic are great and will work with you.  
There is a specialty clinic in the St. Matthews area (where I took the Royal 
Princess Kitty Katt for her last tests)...I can't think of the name but will 
see if I can get it for you.  I think they are 24/7.  They are great too and 
let you stay with your little friend.  I know you are feeling helpless.  I've 
been there too many times both alone and in support of friends.  Find a vet you 
are happy with and forget the distance.  (My feelings.)  I drove from Okolona 
to Middletown when I was in Louisville.  Now I drive from SE KY to Middletown.  
I want someone I can depend on to be straight with me.  Period.  Dixie was a 
throw away that I was going to bring to the farm as an outside cat.  I took her 
to MAC to be spayed and they tested her.  I can't tell you the feelings in Dr. 
Bishop's voice when he called to say she was FeLV+ and to ask how to handle it. 
 When I figured out how to keep Dixie alive and separate from the other outside 
cats at Mom's there was a lot of relief at MAC.  Now, over 2 years later, 
everyone thinks Dixie is the sweetest little thing around.  She rarely sees 
them (no need but they work her in when I do have a problem)  but I stop every 
time I am in town for the oral Interferon and just to say hi.  I have had their 
support thru numerous pets and several stray/throw-always/injuries.  You have 
to find something like this, hopefully in your neck of the woods.  Without it 
you will be miserable.  Again, maybe Susan is your answer.  She is 15-20 
minutes away when 64 is open.  Please keep looking for the right vet.  I think 
everyone on the list will tell you how very important that is.  I just happen 
to know something about the area you are in and am probably boring everyone 
else.  Please keep looking.  If you decide you want the names of other vets in 
what I believe to be your area I can contact friends for recommendations or 
Susan can recommend some one.  If so you may want to email off line.  I'm not 
sure how that is done but someone can tell you if you don't know.

Just keep on keeping on. 






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 9:35 AM
  Subject: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues


  Marylyn- thanks for the good advice.  These are things we will work on trying 
this week.  I do need to start Monkee on an organic cat food.  I've just been 
feeding him Brandon Farms organic that I found at Kroger this past week.  I 
have been short on cash since the blood transfusion, so I had to carefully 
choose some of my purchases for him.  He had a bad day on Saturday and it 
really got me down.  Since he was down, it made me depressed and I couldn't 
really do anything.  But on Sunday, Monkee had a really good day!  He was so 
bright in the eyes and really active and talkative.  We went outside (he no 
longer needs his harness and leash because he moves slow and stays with me).  
So, in turn, on Sun. I had a good day.  I just thought it was odd that he'd 
have a bad day on Sat. and then go up so drastically the next day?  

  I am REALLY frustrated with Monkee's doctors.  I put a call into Dr. Daley on 
THURSDAY of last week to ask if I should re-start him on Interferon on Friday.  
SHE NEVER CALLED ME BACK.  IT'S MONDAY AND I STILL HAVEN'T HEARD FROM HER.  I 
find that unacceptable.  All I needed was a call to be returned by a 
tech/receptionist answering my simple question that they should have printed 
off in the care instructions on Wednesday to begin with!  I had also called 
Monkee's original vet, Dr. Jones, on Thursday and finally heard from him on 
Friday at 5:30.  He was kind of stand-offish and said he didn't want to change 
anything we were doing for Monkee yet (I asked about giving Epogen another 
shot) and he said he wanted to talk to Dr. Daley first.  He also said Daley's 
office hadn't sent them any records since 6/22- which was before the 
transfusion- which quadrupely upsets me b/c if Monkee has an emergency and 
crashes or something, I am taking him DOWN THE ROAD- 5 mins away- to Dr. Jones, 
not 25 mins away to Daley's!!!  I talked to him about Monkee coming back to him 
for primary care since it looks like we aren't treating him primarily for his 
cancer anymore.  He said I needed to follow-up with Daley first and asked if 
Monkee had an appointment set.  I said

RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

ere too many times both alone and in support of friends. Find a vet you are happy with and forget the distance. (My feelings.) I drove from Okolona to Middletown when I was in Louisville. Now I drive fromSE KYto Middletown. I want someone I can depend on to be straight with me. Period.Dixie was a 
throw away that I was going to bring to the farm as an outside cat. I took her to MAC to be spayed and they tested her. I can't tell you the feelings in Dr. Bishop's voice when he called to say she was FeLV+ and to ask how to handle it. When I figured out how to keep Dixie alive and separate from the other outside cats at Mom's there was a lot of relief at MAC. Now, over 2 years later, everyone thinks Dixie is the sweetest little thing around. She rarely sees them (no need but they work her in when I dohave a problem) but I stop every time I am in town for the oral Interferon and just to say hi. I have had their support thru numerous "pets" and several stray/throw-always/injuries. You have to find something like this, hopefully in your neck of the woods. Without it you will be miserable. Again, maybe Susan is your 
answer. She is 15-20 minutes away when 64 is open. Please keep looking for the right vet. I think everyone on the list will tell you how very important that is. I just happen to know something about the area you are in and am probably boring everyone else. Please keep looking. If you decide you want the names of other vets in what I believe to be your area I can contact friends for recommendations or Susan can recommend some one.If so you may want to email off line. I'm not sure how that is done but someone can tell you if you don't know.

Just keep on keeping on. 






 If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis

- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 9:35 AM
Subject: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues


Marylyn- thanks for the good advice. These are things we will work on trying this week. I do need to start Monkee on an organic cat food. I've just been feeding him "Brandon Farms" organic that I found at Kroger this past week. I have been short on cash since the blood transfusion, so I had to carefully choose some of my purchases for him. He had a bad day on Saturday and it really got me down. Since he was "down," it made me depressed and I couldn't really do anything. But on Sunday, Monkee had a really "good" day! He was so bright in the eyes and really active and talkative. We went outside (he no longer needs his harness and leash because he moves slow and stays with me). So, in turn, on Sun. I had a good day. I just thought it was odd that he'd have a bad day on Sat. and then go up so drastically the next day? 

I am REALLY frustrated with Monkee's doctors. I put a call into Dr. Daley on THURSDAY of last week to ask if I should re-start him on Interferon on Friday. SHE NEVER CALLED ME BACK. IT'S MONDAY AND I STILL HAVEN'T HEARD FROM HER. I find that unacceptable. All I needed was a call to be returned by a tech/receptionist answering my simple question that they should have printed off in the care instructions on Wednesday to begin with! I had also called Monkee's original vet, Dr. Jones, on Thursday and finally heard from him on Friday at 5:30. He was kind of stand-offish and said he didn't want to "change anything" we were doing for Monkee yet (I asked about giving Epogen another shot) and he said he wanted to talk to Dr. Daley first. He also said Daley's office hadn't sent them any records since 6/22- which was before the transfusion- which 
quadrupely upsets me b/c if Monkee has an emergency and crashes or something, I am taking him DOWN THE ROAD- 5 mins away- to Dr. Jones, not 25 mins away to Daley's!!! I talked to him about Monkee coming back to him for primary care since it looks like we aren't treating him primarily for his cancer anymore. He said I needed to follow-up with Daley first and asked if Monkee had an appointment set. I said "no." Basically, Daley did the transfusion on Wed. and then it was like, okay, bye. No follow-up was set. They just left me with the news that Monkee would feel good for "about a week." 
I don't want to be "one of those people" that rants and raves about my vet (especially since my dad was a Vet and I hated those people), but I have to think that, if this were me and my medical doctors, would I be mad? And the answer is yes. I have my own autoimmune disorder (ulcerative colitis), so I have been through the ringer with doctors myself and in the past, when I was being treated this way, or my ?'s and concerns weren't being addressed or I was being kept on a medication that wasn't helping me..., I left and got a new doctor. I don't want to be this way, but I am just S

RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-07-02 Thread dede hicken

Caroline,
I hate that you are going through this emotional
abuse. It's hard enough to be so concerned about
Monkee (love the spelling BTW), and have people acting
like they don't give a *%$.  It is so very hard to
make these decisions, but like you said, Not until
he's ready  Stick with your gut feelings.  I always
say in times like this...I want no regrets, and you
don't want any either.

Bless you both in your decision.  Be firm, and feel
good about what you are doing.

Dede



--- Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:


-

There's been a lot of developments today, which have
had me crying at my desk here at work (never a good
thing!). I'll try not to bore you all with the minute
details, but I have now had two bad conversations
with Dr. Jones from The Cat Clinic.  Monkee is out of
his appetite stimulant and I called at The Cat Clinic
today to see if I could pick it up there. They put 
Dr. Jones on the phone and he said he got a report
today from Dr. Daley and she is basing her poor
prognosis for Monkee on the fact that he now has lymph
nodes in his abdomen that are enlarged. Dr. Jones said
that, based on that, he agrees with Dr. Daley and that
he would just treat Monkee palliatively. He said the
transfusion would wear off and we need to plan
accordingly.  Basically, he and Dr. Daley are
standing firm that the prognosis for Monkee is bleak. 
I was so frustrated, disheartened and angry, and what
makes those feelings even worse for me, is Monkee's
condition, which, even before the transfusion, was not
too bad!  

I made a decision and I sent a long email to Dr. Maier
detailing my conversations with Drs. Daley and Jones,
their decisions to just drop off medications, etc.  I
told her that Monkee had a bad day on Saturday where
he was lethargic and seemed really tired, but it was
not anything extreme or different from his
pre-transfusion lethargy. I thought he was starting to
go down from the transfusion already wearing off. 
However, on Sunday, he had a really good day and he
was bright-eyed, active, talkative and seemed really
happy and in no pain or distress.  So I flat-out told
Dr. Maier that I was frustrated with Drs. Daley and
Jones' poor prognosis and no hope outlook for Monkee
because at this point, even before Monkee's
transfusion last week, I don't yet have a cat in dire
distress on my hands. Yes, he's down a little and I
know we are a fighting likely a losing battle, but
Monkee just doesn't seem ready yet! I told her I
would like Monkee to treat with someone who has a more
positive attitude towards his care, and even if it's
going to be palliative care, I want it to be positive
palliative care. 

I asked her for her continued help and assistance and
if I could bring Monkee out to see her again this
week, especially since the transfusion is going to
wear off and by no means do I want Monkee to get into
a situation where he crashes due to that.  He
currently has no follow-ups with Daley or Jones and at
this point, I told Dr. Maier that I am a little more
than ambivalent about continuing Monkee's care with
either of them. I told her I didn't know if they are
unhappy with me as a client for not totally accepting
their difficult-to-decipher prognosis and/or the fact
that I went to a Holistic Vet for a second/additional
opinion. I don't know if I ruffled feathers or
something, but at this point, I don't care! I told
her I just want Monkee to be taken care of and kept
happy. 

Dr. Maier immediately sent back a reply email that I
found surprisingly candid.  She said she felt bad that
his Drs. are giving me such a hard time and that she'd
be happy to see Monkee this week.  She said she
doesn't have much experience with Epogen in the past
(and I am not married to the Epogen by far, I just
couldn't understand why Monkee treated with it for one
week and then, Dr. Daley was like, well it didn't
work- when everyone says it needs more than one
week/one dose to work!)- WHICH Dr. Maier said the same
thing about it!  She said she doesn't see any reason
to give up prematurely.  She also said that she's
worked with other Dr. Jones patients and the whole
Holistic thing has never been a problem with him (so
that is good to know b/c I do like Dr. Jones as vet
and would like to return to him at some point, maybe
with another pet, but for Monkee, it's time to move
on).  

Generally, Dr. Maier makes me feel better, so that is
the route Monkee and I are going to go for now.  We
maybe heading into the end game, I am capable of
recognizing that, but I am certainly not putting that
cat down until he's ready and I just want to be
treating with someone who supports that decision and I
feel that I am now.  But it's been a bumpy ride
getting there!

-Caroline 

 

 



 

-
From: Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia
Issues
Date: Mon, 2

Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 4:20 PM
  Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

  You will know when Monkee is ready to leave this world.  It may be today or 
in 10 years.  You are not God and neither am I.we can't see the future.  
Every one of us dies ...sorry.  That is the way the system works.  Just 
don't live your life looking at death.  First, it isn't a bad thing and second, 
you are wasting lots of really good fun time fearing Death.  Monkee knows this 
and is probably trying to teach you much as the Royal Princess Kitty Katt and 
others have tried to teach me.  People are basically very hard 
headed..just ask our little friends.  The stories Dixie could tell 
you!!

  Relax.  Spend wonderful time with Monkee and find and keep a vet that 
respects you.  I have been very lucky that way.  I hope Susan is that vet for 
you.  If not, keep looking.  He or She does exist for you.   

   If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
   from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
   will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
St. Francis
- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 3:23 PM
Subject: RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

There's been a lot of developments today, which have had me crying at my 
desk here at work (never a good thing!). I'll try not to bore you all with the 
minute details, but I have now had two bad conversations with Dr. Jones from 
The Cat Clinic.  Monkee is out of his appetite stimulant and I called at The 
Cat Clinic today to see if I could pick it up there. They put  Dr. Jones on the 
phone and he said he got a report today from Dr. Daley and she is basing her 
poor prognosis for Monkee on the fact that he now has lymph nodes in his 
abdomen that are enlarged. Dr. Jones said that, based on that, he agrees with 
Dr. Daley and that he would just treat Monkee palliatively. He said the 
transfusion would wear off and we need to plan accordingly.  Basically, he 
and Dr. Daley are standing firm that the prognosis for Monkee is bleak.  I was 
so frustrated, disheartened and angry, and what makes those feelings even worse 
for me, is Monkee's condition, which, even before the transfusion, was not too 
bad!  

I made a decision and I sent a long email to Dr. Maier detailing my 
conversations with Drs. Daley and Jones, their decisions to just drop off 
medications, etc.  I told her that Monkee had a bad day on Saturday where he 
was lethargic and seemed really tired, but it was not anything extreme or 
different from his pre-transfusion lethargy. I thought he was starting to go 
down from the transfusion already wearing off.  However, on Sunday, he had a 
really good day and he was bright-eyed, active, talkative and seemed really 
happy and in no pain or distress.  So I flat-out told Dr. Maier that I was 
frustrated with Drs. Daley and Jones' poor prognosis and no hope outlook for 
Monkee because at this point, even before Monkee's transfusion last week, I 
don't yet have a cat in dire distress on my hands. Yes, he's down a little and 
I know we are a fighting likely a losing battle, but Monkee just doesn't seem 
ready yet! I told her I would like Monkee to treat with someone who has a 
more positive attitude towards his care, and even if it's going to be 
palliative care, I want it to be positive palliative care. 

I asked her for her continued help and assistance and if I could bring 
Monkee out to see her again this week, especially since the transfusion is 
going to wear off and by no means do I want Monkee to get into a situation 
where he crashes due to that.  He currently has no follow-ups with Daley or 
Jones and at this point, I told Dr. Maier that I am a little more than 
ambivalent about continuing Monkee's care with either of them. I told her I 
didn't know if they are unhappy with me as a client for not totally accepting 
their difficult-to-decipher prognosis and/or the fact that I went to a Holistic 
Vet for a second/additional opinion. I don't know if I ruffled feathers or 
something, but at this point, I don't care! I told her I just want Monkee 
to be taken care of and kept happy. 

Dr. Maier immediately sent back a reply email that I found surprisingly 
candid.  She said she felt bad that his Drs. are giving me such a hard time and 
that she'd be happy to see Monkee this week.  She said she doesn't have much 
experience with Epogen in the past (and I am not married to the Epogen by far, 
I just couldn't understand why Monkee treated with it for one

RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

I am happy to report that I am home from work and now able to assess Monkee's condition today- what with him being off the appetite stim. He ate while I was at work and then my mom came to check on him around 5:30 and fixed him chicken livers. He did not eat them at first, but as soon as I came home, he ate! Then he had a BM!!! And it was a totally normal one. He hadn't gone in a while, so I was starting to get worried and that was a load off (haha). AND, he's clearly having another "good" day- he's all bright and perky and he was doing a little running (which I told him not to do- he doesn't listen). So, we are both doing much better-- me- emotionally, Monkee-physically.

Dede- that made me really happy to hear that someone "got" the name! People (well, and by people I mean Monkee's past vets), are always spelling it "Monkey." And I have to say, no, it's Monkee- like the "The Monkee's"- the band! He was named that because he looks like a Monkey in the face- he has a black batman cap around his head and ears, and a white patch just in the very middle of his face that covers his nose and mouth just over the brow, so it has the effect of him having a "monkey-face." But I wanted to make it extra cute by adding a twist to the spelling (plus, I had a slight Monkee's obsession as a kid thanks to syndication on Nickelodeon!).
-Caroline

From:dede hicken [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgTo:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject:RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia IssuesDate:Mon, 2 Jul 2007 15:32:09 -0700 (PDT)Caroline,I hate that you are going through this emotionalabuse. It's hard enough to be so concerned aboutMonkee (love the spelling BTW), and have people actinglike they don't give a *%$.It is so very hard tomake these decisions, but like you said, "Not untilhe's ready"Stick with your gut feelings.I alwayssay in times like this...I want no regrets, and youdon't want any either.Bless you both in your decision.Be firm, and
feelgood about what you are doing.Dede--- Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]wrote:-There's been a lot of developments today, which havehad me crying at my desk here at work (never a goodthing!). I'll try not to bore you all with the minutedetails, but I have now had two "bad" conversationswith Dr. Jones from The Cat Clinic.Monkee is out ofhis appetite stimulant and I called at The Cat Clinictoday to see if I could pick it up there. They putDr. Jones on the phone and he said he got a reporttoday from Dr. Daley and she is basing her poorprognosis for Monkee on the fact that he now has lymphnodes in his abdomen that are enlarged. Dr. Jones
saidthat, based on that, he agrees with Dr. Daley and thathe would just treat Monkee palliatively. He said thetransfusion would wear off and we need to "planaccordingly."Basically, he and Dr. Daley arestanding firm that the prognosis for Monkee is bleak.I was so frustrated, disheartened and angry, and whatmakes those feelings even worse for me, is Monkee'scondition, which, even before the transfusion, was nottoo bad!I made a decision and I sent a long email to Dr. Maierdetailing my conversations with Drs. Daley and Jones,their decisions to just drop off medications, etc.Itold her that Monkee had a "bad day" on Saturday wherehe was lethargic and seemed really tired, but it wasnot anything extreme or different from
hispre-transfusion lethargy. I thought he was starting togo down from the transfusion already wearing off.However, on Sunday, he had a really "good day" and hewas bright-eyed, active, talkative and seemed reallyhappy and in no pain or distress.So I flat-out toldDr. Maier that I was frustrated with Drs. Daley andJones' poor prognosis and "no hope" outlook for Monkeebecause at this point, even before Monkee'stransfusion last week, I don't yet have a cat in diredistress on my hands. Yes, he's down a little and Iknow we are a fighting likely a losing battle, butMonkee just doesn't seem "ready" yet! I told her Iwould like Monkee to treat with someone who has a morepositive attitude towards his care, and even if it'sgoing to be palliative care, I want it to be
"positivepalliative care."I asked her for her continued help and assistance andif I could bring Monkee out to see her again thisweek, especially since the transfusion is going towear off and by no means do I want Monkee to get intoa situation where he "crashes" due to that.Hecurrently has no follow-ups with Daley or Jones and atthis point, I told Dr. Maier that I am a little morethan ambivalent about continuing Monkee's care witheither of them. I told her I didn't know if they areunhappy with me as a client for not totally acceptingtheir difficult-to-decipher prognosis and/or the factthat I went to a Holistic Vet for a second/additionalopinion. I don't know if I ruffled feathers orsomething, but at this point, I don't care! I
toldher I just want Monkee to be taken care of and kepthappy.Dr. Maier immediately sent

Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-07-02 Thread laurieskatz

Perfectly said. Thanks for this. I try so hard not to let my kittys see me cry 
or upset when someone is sick.
Laurie
  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 5:16 PM
  Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

- Original Message - 
From: Marylyn 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 4:20 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

You will know when Monkee is ready to leave this world.  It may be today or 
in 10 years.  You are not God and neither am I.we can't see the future.  
Every one of us dies ...sorry.  That is the way the system works.  Just 
don't live your life looking at death.  First, it isn't a bad thing and second, 
you are wasting lots of really good fun time fearing Death.  Monkee knows this 
and is probably trying to teach you much as the Royal Princess Kitty Katt and 
others have tried to teach me.  People are basically very hard 
headed..just ask our little friends.  The stories Dixie could tell 
you!!

Relax.  Spend wonderful time with Monkee and find and keep a vet that 
respects you.  I have been very lucky that way.  I hope Susan is that vet for 
you.  If not, keep looking.  He or She does exist for you.   

 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
  St. 
Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 3:23 PM
  Subject: RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

  There's been a lot of developments today, which have had me crying at my 
desk here at work (never a good thing!). I'll try not to bore you all with the 
minute details, but I have now had two bad conversations with Dr. Jones from 
The Cat Clinic.  Monkee is out of his appetite stimulant and I called at The 
Cat Clinic today to see if I could pick it up there. They put  Dr. Jones on the 
phone and he said he got a report today from Dr. Daley and she is basing her 
poor prognosis for Monkee on the fact that he now has lymph nodes in his 
abdomen that are enlarged. Dr. Jones said that, based on that, he agrees with 
Dr. Daley and that he would just treat Monkee palliatively. He said the 
transfusion would wear off and we need to plan accordingly.  Basically, he 
and Dr. Daley are standing firm that the prognosis for Monkee is bleak.  I was 
so frustrated, disheartened and angry, and what makes those feelings even worse 
for me, is Monkee's condition, which, even before the transfusion, was not too 
bad!  

  I made a decision and I sent a long email to Dr. Maier detailing my 
conversations with Drs. Daley and Jones, their decisions to just drop off 
medications, etc.  I told her that Monkee had a bad day on Saturday where he 
was lethargic and seemed really tired, but it was not anything extreme or 
different from his pre-transfusion lethargy. I thought he was starting to go 
down from the transfusion already wearing off.  However, on Sunday, he had a 
really good day and he was bright-eyed, active, talkative and seemed really 
happy and in no pain or distress.  So I flat-out told Dr. Maier that I was 
frustrated with Drs. Daley and Jones' poor prognosis and no hope outlook for 
Monkee because at this point, even before Monkee's transfusion last week, I 
don't yet have a cat in dire distress on my hands. Yes, he's down a little and 
I know we are a fighting likely a losing battle, but Monkee just doesn't seem 
ready yet! I told her I would like Monkee to treat with someone who has a 
more positive attitude towards his care, and even if it's going to be 
palliative care, I want it to be positive palliative care. 

  I asked her for her continued help and assistance and if I could bring 
Monkee out to see her again this week, especially since the transfusion is 
going to wear off and by no means do I want Monkee to get into a situation 
where he crashes due to that.  He currently has no follow-ups with Daley or 
Jones and at this point, I told Dr. Maier that I am a little more than 
ambivalent about continuing Monkee's care with either of them. I told her I 
didn't know if they are unhappy with me as a client for not totally accepting 
their difficult-to-decipher prognosis and/or the fact that I went to a Holistic 
Vet for a second/additional opinion. I don't know if I ruffled feathers or 
something, but at this point, I don't care! I told her I just want Monkee 
to be taken care of and kept happy. 

  Dr. Maier immediately sent

Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 8:24 PM
  Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

  A thought:  Check with Susan re probiotics if BMs are/become an issue.  Also 
Apple Pectin (ok, one for each extreme).  The thing is if you have relatively 
inexpensive things at hand you will feel better.  More prepared and in control. 

  Cats seem to like things at room temperature or a little warmer (like setting 
a bowl of livers in a bowl of hot water for a few minutes---I don't use a 
microwave with Dixie's food--ask Susan about that).  Monkee may just have 
thought they were too cold to eat.   

   If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
   from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
   will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
St. Francis
- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 7:25 PM
Subject: RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

I am happy to report that I am home from work and now able to assess 
Monkee's condition today- what with him being off the appetite stim.  He ate 
while I was at work and then my mom came to check on him around 5:30 and fixed 
him chicken livers.  He did not eat them at first, but as soon as I came home, 
he ate!  Then he had a BM!!!  And it was a totally normal one.  He hadn't gone 
in a while, so I was starting to get worried and that was a load off (haha).  
AND, he's clearly having another good day- he's all bright and perky and he 
was doing a little running (which I told him not to do- he doesn't listen).  
So, we are both doing much better-- me- emotionally, Monkee-physically.  

Dede- that made me really happy to hear that someone got the name!  
People (well, and by people I mean Monkee's past vets), are always spelling it 
Monkey.  And I have to say, no, it's Monkee- like the The Monkee's- the 
band!  He was named that because he looks like a Monkey in the face- he has a 
black batman cap around his head and ears, and a white patch just in the very 
middle of his face that covers his nose and mouth just over the brow, so it has 
the effect of him having a monkey-face.  But I wanted to make it extra cute 
by adding a twist to the spelling (plus, I had a slight Monkee's obsession as a 
kid thanks to syndication on Nickelodeon!).  

-Caroline

Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

Oh my god! Great idea! I will warm his chicken livers using a bowl of warm water! That seems so simple, I can't believe I didn't think about it! Yeah, I don't own a microwave, so I almost never feed him re-heated food. If and when I do reheat, I use my gas oven because it heats so nicely and so fast. But there was NO WAY I was going to put chicken livers in the gas oven (eww), so thank you so much for the tip!

-Caroline 


From: "Marylyn" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgTo: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia IssuesDate: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 20:43:46 -0500




- Original Message - 
From: Marylyn 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 8:24 PM
Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

A thought: Check with Susan re probiotics if BMs are/become an issue. Also Apple Pectin (ok, one for each extreme). The thing is if you have relatively inexpensive things at hand you will feel better. More prepared and in control. 

Cats seem to like things at room temperature or a little warmer (like setting a bowl of livers in a bowl of hot water for a few minutes---I don't use a microwave withDixie's food--ask Susan about that). Monkee may just have thought they were too cold to eat. 








 If you have men who will exclude any of God's creatures from the shelter of compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their fellow man. St. Francis

- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 7:25 PM
Subject: RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues


I am happy to report that I am home from work and now able to assess Monkee's condition today- what with him being off the appetite stim. He ate while I was at work and then my mom came to check on him around 5:30 and fixed him chicken livers. He did not eat them at first, but as soon as I came home, he ate! Then he had a BM!!! And it was a totally normal one. He hadn't gone in a while, so I was starting to get worried and that was a load off (haha). AND, he's clearly having another "good" day- he's all bright and perky and he was doing a little running (which I told him not to do- he doesn't listen). So, we are both doing much better-- me- emotionally, Monkee-physically. 


Dede- that made me really happy to hear that someone "got" the name! People (well, and by people I mean Monkee's past vets), are always spelling it "Monkey." And I have to say, no, it's Monkee- like the "The Monkee's"- the band! He was named that because he looks like a Monkey in the face- he has a black batman cap around his head and ears, and a white patch just in the very middle of his face that covers his nose and mouth just over the brow, so it has the effect of him having a "monkey-face." But I wanted to make it extra cute by adding a twist to the spelling (plus, I had a slight Monkee's obsession as a kid thanks to syndication on Nickelodeon!). 
-Caroline 

 Need a brain boost? Recharge with a stimulating game. Play now!

Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues

You would have thought of it but you are extremely stressed.  That is why I am 
being so detailed on some things.  I know how I am when my little friends are 
having problems.  

Be very gentle with yourself right now.  Very gentle.  






 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 9:07 PM
  Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues


  Oh my god!  Great idea!  I will warm his chicken livers using a bowl of warm 
water!  That seems so simple, I can't believe I didn't think about it!  Yeah, I 
don't own a microwave, so I almost never feed him re-heated food.  If and when 
I do reheat, I use my gas oven because it heats so nicely and so fast.  But 
there was NO WAY I was going to put chicken livers in the gas oven (eww), so 
thank you so much for the tip!

  -Caroline 





From: Marylyn [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues
Date: Mon, 2 Jul 2007 20:43:46 -0500


  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 8:24 PM
  Subject: Re: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues


  A thought:  Check with Susan re probiotics if BMs are/become an issue.  
Also Apple Pectin (ok, one for each extreme).  The thing is if you have 
relatively inexpensive things at hand you will feel better.  More prepared and 
in control.  

  Cats seem to like things at room temperature or a little warmer (like 
setting a bowl of livers in a bowl of hot water for a few minutes---I don't use 
a microwave with Dixie's food--ask Susan about that).  Monkee may just have 
thought they were too cold to eat.   








   If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
   from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
   will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
St. 
Francis
- Original Message - 
From: Caroline Kaufmann 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Monday, July 02, 2007 7:25 PM
Subject: RE: Fw: Re:TO CAROLINE RE MONKEE: Re: Anemia Issues


I am happy to report that I am home from work and now able to assess 
Monkee's condition today- what with him being off the appetite stim.  He ate 
while I was at work and then my mom came to check on him around 5:30 and fixed 
him chicken livers.  He did not eat them at first, but as soon as I came home, 
he ate!  Then he had a BM!!!  And it was a totally normal one.  He hadn't gone 
in a while, so I was starting to get worried and that was a load off (haha).  
AND, he's clearly having another good day- he's all bright and perky and he 
was doing a little running (which I told him not to do- he doesn't listen).  
So, we are both doing much better-- me- emotionally, Monkee-physically.  

Dede- that made me really happy to hear that someone got the name!  
People (well, and by people I mean Monkee's past vets), are always spelling it 
Monkey.  And I have to say, no, it's Monkee- like the The Monkee's- the 
band!  He was named that because he looks like a Monkey in the face- he has a 
black batman cap around his head and ears, and a white patch just in the very 
middle of his face that covers his nose and mouth just over the brow, so it has 
the effect of him having a monkey-face.  But I wanted to make it extra cute 
by adding a twist to the spelling (plus, I had a slight Monkee's obsession as a 
kid thanks to syndication on Nickelodeon!).  

-Caroline 



  
  
  
  
  
  
  
  




--
  Need a brain boost? Recharge with a stimulating game. Play now!

Re: Anemia Issues

2007-07-01 Thread catatonya

Hi Caroline,
   
  It sounds like you're doing everything you can.  I'm sure by now someone has 
mentioned taking doxy in case it's hemobartonella.  If it's not hemobart the 
anemia is hard to beat, but there are people on the list who have bought 'good' 
time for their cats with various methods.  13 pounds is a good weight, and his 
behavior sounds good too.  I hope the best for Monkee.
  tonya

Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV pos. and 
lymphosarcoma cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet yesterday to determine whether the 
Epogen had helped his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last week, 
when the anemia started, his Red Blood cell count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 
doses of the Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%.  However, Monkees 
White Blood Cell count is normal (it was down last week) and his lymphocyte 
count is normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his groin that is 
enlarged (but it cant be felt from the outside- it runs along the artery in 
the leg).  His Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem, or it could 
be the lymphosarcoma, but when pressed, she said that she honestly doubted it 
was the cancer.  She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow aspirate/biopsy to 
determine what is going on at the cellular level; however, it is invasive and 
Monkee would need sedation- which he couldnt get anyway while
 so anemic (so he'd need a blood transfusion 1st, just to be able to do the 
biospy);  However, the biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us its 
FeLV causing the anemia; (2) a blood transfusion to literally buy me more time 
with him; (3) try another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is being 
caused by lymphosarcoma, although, as I said previously, she doubted it and 
that was a shot in the dark. 
  My mother and I did not want to put this cat through chemo again (although he 
did very well with the first round).  But now that he is actively anemic, there 
was no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr. Daley really didnt think 
the chemo would actually help the situation.  We also didnt want to put him 
through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell us what we already know, 
but dont want to admitthat for four years, I had the healthiest, beefiest, 
toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered from a urinary tract 
infection; who was so healthy, I wanted to test him a 3rd time this summer for 
FeLV because I was sure he didnt have it.To now, out of nowhere, in a span of 
2 months, we have gone from that, to a severely anemic, suffering, FeLV cat 
with lymphosarcoma.  
  Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I were not prepared to hear 
at all.  I mean, he is eating, drinking, using the litter box, he is thick (he 
was slightly overweight to begin with, so that is helping him now).  Yes, hes 
not Monkee as I have known him, but he just doesnt look to me like hes on 
his last leg.  When we questioned her on the days prognosis she explained 
that due to the FeLV virus, and the anemia, his body is not making RBC and his 
brain is not getting enough oxygen and although he seems okay now, he is dizzy, 
lightheaded, probably having vertigo, and all of that will continue to get 
worse because his body is not manufacturing RBC- which carry oxygen in the 
blood, and eventually, his eating/drinking and making it to the litter box will 
all drop off.  
  We asked what could be done and she said, if you are not ready yet, she 
recommended the blood transfusion, which will give him about two weeks, and 
then the benefits of the transferred blood will wear off and he will start 
suffering the anemia symptoms again because his body is not producing its own 
RBC.  She also said that morally, with FeLV cats, she will do 2 blood 
transfusions, and then that is it.  It is fighting a losing battle and that is 
as far as she will take it.
  I was wrecked and my mother was crying too.  I decided to pull myself 
together and still take Monkee to the Holistic Vet, Dr. Susan Maier, after we 
left Dr. Daleys.  It was our first visit and I thought, I am so desperate 
right now, it cant hurt.  A funny story about this visit: Monkee totally 
perked up as soon as we left Dr. Daleys (he hates it there!).  Dr. Maier has a 
few black and white clinic cats that roam around and as soon as we walked in, 
Monkee, in his carrier, freaked out (he hates other catswhich is probably why 
he ended up with FeLV to begin with!).  I was carrying his carrier on my 
shoulder to an exam room and I instantly felt the carrier get completely light- 
there was no longer 13 lbs of weight on my shoulder!  I didnt understand what 
happened, but I turned around and all I saw was black and white x 3 (Monkee is 
black and white), and I just grabbed the first black and white form that was 
closest to me, and thank god, it was Monkee!  He had opened
 the front flap of his pet

Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-30 Thread Taylor Scobie Humphrey


Thank you, Hideyo

Consciousness is Causal
 and Physicality is its
 Manifestation.


On Jun 29, 2007, at 8:00 AM, HIDEYO YAMAMOTO wrote:

Indeed - I know it's hard -- but we need to do our best to give all  
the love and joy we can give as they certainly deserve it-- when I  
was losing eight kitties one after the other.. I was overwhelmed  
with the depression --and eventually, I learned to live in the  
moment.. I loved all of them like there is no tomorrow -- hold them  
and tel them how beautiful they are.. the pain we are going through  
is only temprary and we will always be together no matter what --  
there is nothing that can separate us --


There was a quote I saw some place goes something like.
Stop telling God how big strom is, but start telling storm, how big  
god is.. something like that..
I just try not to think of how big the pain and sorrow is.. but  
strated to think how big and powerful our love and bond with each  
other is..  much love,


Hideyo
- Original Message -
From: Susan Dubose
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 5:40 AM
Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

Wise words, Marylyn...

Wise words...


Susan J. DuBose  ^..^
www.PetGirlsPetsitting.com
www.Tx.SiameseRescue.org
www.shadowcats.net
  As Cleopatra lay in state,
   Faithful Bast at her side did wait,
   Purring welcomes of soft applause,
   Ever guarding with sharpened  
claws.

 Trajan Tennent




- Original Message -
From: Marylyn
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 4:07 AM
Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

Please do not grieve too much before it is timeit will take  
the joy of having Sammy and the others with you now away.  It is so  
very difficult but try.  Live each moment with the wonderful little  
ones.  That is how they do it.  One moment at a time.  When it is  
time to grieve go ahead and loose it .  There is no shame in  
tears.  If we live every minute dreading the death of a loved one  
we have no time for joy.  And we are all dying.  Everyone of us  
started dying the minute we took our first breathe.


Bless you and Sammy and his brothers.bless all the  
little ones and their best friends.






 If you have men  
who will exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter  
of compassion and pity, you will have men who
 will deal likewise  
with their fellow man.
   
St. Francis

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-30 Thread Taylor Scobie Humphrey

, is going to increase his life force ten-fold!

From:  wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To:  felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
To:  felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject:  To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues
Date:  Fri, 29 Jun 2007 07:46:49 -0700 (PDT)
Hi Belinda,

In response to your post below, I felt the need to
clarify for Caroline's sake.  Bailey's situation
should be considered a miracle in my book.  As we have
seen too many times here, most cats do not respond as
Bailey did with that type of anemia; it claims the
lives of many.  While I do not wish to play a part in
taking away Caroline's hope, I also want to be
completely upfront about non-regenerative anemia.  It
can be reversed, but not usually.  I should have made
this statement earlier.  So That being said, it may be
wise to keep her kitty on Epogen considering Bailey's
case, as we never know when a situation might be
reversed.

Respectfully,
Wendy

--- Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

  Everytime I hear this I post this, Bailey's anemia
  was non regenerative
  and we DID reverse it.

   and it is not a good anemia to have.  It means the
  leukemia is probably active in the bone marrow,
  which is, as far as I know, irreversable.

  --

  Belinda
  happiness is being owned by cats ...

  Be-Mi-Kitties
  http://bemikitties.com

  Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
  http://adopt.bemikitties.com

  FeLV Candlelight Service
  http://bemikitties.com/cls

  HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
  http://HostDesign4U.com

  BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
  http://bmk.bemikitties.com

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens  
can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever  
has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~

_ 
___

Finding fabulous fares is fun.
Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find  
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Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-30 Thread Susan Dubose

Living for the day is very important.

After I took in 4 felv+ cats I realized this even more.

Now whenever anyone of my cats comes up to me and meows, or paws @ me, I drop 
whatever it is that I am doing and they either get a kiss, a petting or  I pick 
them up  hug them.

And I tell them how much I love them a lot more often.

I think they are trying to tell you something when they solicit your attention.

Susan J. DuBose  ^..^
www.PetGirlsPetsitting.com
www.Tx.SiameseRescue.org
www.shadowcats.net
  As Cleopatra lay in state,
   Faithful Bast at her side did wait,
   Purring welcomes of soft applause,
   Ever guarding with sharpened claws.
 Trajan Tennent




  - Original Message - 
  From: Taylor Scobie Humphrey 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Saturday, June 30, 2007 1:05 AM
  Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues


  Thank you, Hideyo


  Consciousness is Causal 
   and Physicality is its
   Manifestation.




  On Jun 29, 2007, at 8:00 AM, HIDEYO YAMAMOTO wrote:


Indeed - I know it's hard -- but we need to do our best to give all the 
love and joy we can give as they certainly deserve it-- when I was losing eight 
kitties one after the other.. I was overwhelmed with the depression --and 
eventually, I learned to live in the moment.. I loved all of them like there is 
no tomorrow -- hold them and tel them how beautiful they are.. the pain we are 
going through is only temprary and we will always be together no matter what -- 
there is nothing that can separate us --

There was a quote I saw some place goes something like.
Stop telling God how big strom is, but start telling storm, how big god 
is.. something like that..
I just try not to think of how big the pain and sorrow is.. but strated to 
think how big and powerful our love and bond with each other is..  much love,

Hideyo

To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-30 Thread wendy

Hi Caroline,

Well, considering that it is rare, but possible, for
Monkee to start making RBC's again, I would start the
Epogen today if it were my kitty.  He doesn't have
time for you to wait, as transfusions buy precious but
little time, and I don't think Monkee has a shot
without something like the Epogen to stimulate RBC
production.  I would call your vet and even if she's
not crazy about it, tell her it won't hurt and she
might possibly learn something new.  You may also need
to consider one more transfusion to give the Epogen
time to work, if it's going to.  I am praying for
another miracle, like Belinda had with her furbaby
Bailey.  And I am so happy to hear that Monkee is his
old self again.  Isn't it just wonderful to witness
that?  It's like a miracle in and of itself.

:)
Wendy

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the 
world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~



 

Now that's room service!  Choose from over 150,000 hotels
in 45,000 destinations on Yahoo! Travel to find your fit.
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Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-29 Thread Taylor Scobie Humphrey

Caroline, I'm in the same boat with my little Sammy.  He and his two  
brothers (triplets--I raised 'em from infancy with no catmommy so  
they are my tiny kidlets--who knew they'd be cats!?) were negative  
for FeLV and then at nine months Sammy had really alarming big  
swollen glands like--poof!--one morning and after tests found out on  
Monday that my tough little character was FeLV+ and on Tuesday that  
he had lymphoma.  Tears, tears.  He has gone out of remission after  
nearly three very good months and now he's got at most two months  
with a new chemotherapy protocol and I am trying not to lose it  
here.  At least thank God he will see his first birthday and that of  
his sibbies.  So far his sibbies remain FeLV- and I just don't know  
how they will be without their sib in a few months.  Or how I will  
be, for that matter.  I'm a wreck already, of course.


Thinking of you, your mom and your darling Monkee,

Taylor and the 3 Orange Boyz (my babies)


Consciousness is Causal
 and Physicality is its
 Manifestation.


On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:06 PM, wendy wrote:


P.S. Chemo can cause anemia.  I don't know if I
mentioned this or not.

:)
Wendy

--- Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:


-

Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV
pos. and lymphosarcoma cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet
yesterday to determine whether the Epogen had helped
his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last
week, when the anemia started, his Red Blood cell
count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 doses of the
Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%.
However, Monkee’s White Blood Cell count is normal (it
was down last week) and his lymphocyte count is
normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his
groin that is enlarged (but it can’t be felt from the
outside- it runs along the artery in the leg).  His
Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem,
or it could be the lymphosarcoma, but when pressed,
she said that she honestly doubted it was the cancer.
She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow
aspirate/biopsy to determine what is going on at the
cellular level; however, it is invasive and Monkee
would need sedation- which he couldn’t get anyway
while so anemic (so he'd need a blood transfusion 1st,
just to be able to do the biospy);  However, the
biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us
it’s FeLV causing the anemia; (2) a blood transfusion
to literally buy me more time with him; (3) try
another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is
being caused by lymphosarcoma, although, as I said
previously, she doubted it and that was a shot in the
dark.

My mother and I did not want to put this cat through
chemo again (although he did very well with the first
round).  But now that he is actively anemic, there was
no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr.
Daley really didn’t think the chemo would actually
help the situation.  We also didn’t want to put him
through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell
us what we already know, but don’t want to admit…that
for four years, I had the healthiest, beefiest,
toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered
from a urinary tract infection; who was so healthy, I
wanted to test him a 3rd time this summer for FeLV
because I was sure he didn’t have it….To now, out of
nowhere, in a span of 2 months, we have gone from
that, to a severely anemic, suffering, FeLV cat with
lymphosarcoma.

Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I
were not prepared to hear at all.  I mean, he is
eating, drinking, using the litter box, he is thick
(he was slightly overweight to begin with, so that is
helping him now).  Yes, he’s not “Monkee” as I have
known him, but he just doesn’t look to me like he’s on
his last leg.  When we questioned her on the “days”
prognosis she explained that due to the FeLV virus,
and the anemia, his body is not making RBC and his
brain is not getting enough oxygen and although he
seems okay now, he is dizzy, lightheaded, probably
having vertigo, and all of that will continue to get
worse because his body is not manufacturing RBC- which
carry oxygen in the blood, and eventually, his
eating/drinking and making it to the litter box will
all drop off.

We asked what could be done and she said, if you “are
not ready yet,” she recommended the blood transfusion,
which will give him about two weeks, and then the
benefits of the transferred blood will wear off and he
will start suffering the anemia symptoms again because
his body is not producing it’s own RBC.  She also said
that morally, with FeLV cats, she will do 2 blood
transfusions, and then that is it.  It is fighting a
losing battle and that is as far as she will take it.

I was wrecked and my mother was crying too.  I decided
to pull myself together and still take Monkee to the
Holistic Vet, Dr. Susan Maier, after we left Dr.
Daley’s.  It was our first visit and I thought, I am
so desperate right now, it can’t hurt.  A funny story
about this

Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-29 Thread Marylyn

Please do not grieve too much before it is timeit will take the joy of 
having Sammy and the others with you now away.  It is so very difficult but 
try.  Live each moment with the wonderful little ones.  That is how they do it. 
 One moment at a time.  When it is time to grieve go ahead and loose it .  
There is no shame in tears.  If we live every minute dreading the death of a 
loved one we have no time for joy.  And we are all dying.  Everyone of us 
started dying the minute we took our first breathe.

Bless you and Sammy and his brothers.bless all the little ones and 
their best friends.





 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of compassion 
and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with their 
fellow man.
  St. Francis
  - Original Message - 
  From: Taylor Scobie Humphrey 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 2:01 AM
  Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues 


  Caroline, I'm in the same boat with my little Sammy.  He and his two brothers 
(triplets--I raised 'em from infancy with no catmommy so they are my tiny 
kidlets--who knew they'd be cats!?) were negative for FeLV and then at nine 
months Sammy had really alarming big swollen glands like--poof!--one morning 
and after tests found out on Monday that my tough little character was FeLV+ 
and on Tuesday that he had lymphoma.  Tears, tears.  He has gone out of 
remission after nearly three very good months and now he's got at most two 
months with a new chemotherapy protocol and I am trying not to lose it here.  
At least thank God he will see his first birthday and that of his sibbies.  So 
far his sibbies remain FeLV- and I just don't know how they will be without 
their sib in a few months.  Or how I will be, for that matter.  I'm a wreck 
already, of course.


  Thinking of you, your mom and your darling Monkee, 


  Taylor and the 3 Orange Boyz (my babies)




  Consciousness is Causal 
   and Physicality is its
   Manifestation.




  On Jun 28, 2007, at 12:06 PM, wendy wrote:


P.S. Chemo can cause anemia.  I don't know if I
mentioned this or not.


:)
Wendy


--- Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:




-


Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV
pos. and lymphosarcoma cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet
yesterday to determine whether the Epogen had helped
his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last
week, when the anemia started, his Red Blood cell
count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 doses of the
Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%. 
However, Monkee’s White Blood Cell count is normal (it
was down last week) and his lymphocyte count is
normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his
groin that is enlarged (but it can’t be felt from the
outside- it runs along the artery in the leg).  His
Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem,
or it could be the lymphosarcoma, but when pressed,
she said that she honestly doubted it was the cancer. 
She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow
aspirate/biopsy to determine what is going on at the
cellular level; however, it is invasive and Monkee
would need sedation- which he couldn’t get anyway
while so anemic (so he'd need a blood transfusion 1st,
just to be able to do the biospy);  However, the
biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us
it’s FeLV causing the anemia; (2) a blood transfusion
to literally buy me more time with him; (3) try
another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is
being caused by lymphosarcoma, although, as I said
previously, she doubted it and that was a shot in the
dark. 


My mother and I did not want to put this cat through
chemo again (although he did very well with the first
round).  But now that he is actively anemic, there was
no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr.
Daley really didn’t think the chemo would actually
help the situation.  We also didn’t want to put him
through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell
us what we already know, but don’t want to admit…that
for four years, I had the healthiest, beefiest,
toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered
from a urinary tract infection; who was so healthy, I
wanted to test him a 3rd time this summer for FeLV
because I was sure he didn’t have it….To now, out of
nowhere, in a span of 2 months, we have gone from
that, to a severely anemic, suffering, FeLV cat with
lymphosarcoma.  


Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I
were not prepared to hear at all.  I mean, he is
eating

Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-29 Thread Susan Dubose

Wise words, Marylyn...

Wise words...


Susan J. DuBose  ^..^
www.PetGirlsPetsitting.com
www.Tx.SiameseRescue.org
www.shadowcats.net
  As Cleopatra lay in state,
   Faithful Bast at her side did wait,
   Purring welcomes of soft applause,
   Ever guarding with sharpened claws.
 Trajan Tennent




  - Original Message - 
  From: Marylyn 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 4:07 AM
  Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues


  Please do not grieve too much before it is timeit will take the joy 
of having Sammy and the others with you now away.  It is so very difficult but 
try.  Live each moment with the wonderful little ones.  That is how they do it. 
 One moment at a time.  When it is time to grieve go ahead and loose it .  
There is no shame in tears.  If we live every minute dreading the death of a 
loved one we have no time for joy.  And we are all dying.  Everyone of us 
started dying the minute we took our first breathe.

  Bless you and Sammy and his brothers.bless all the little ones 
and their best friends.





   If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
   from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
   will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
St. Francis

Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

Indeed - I know it's hard -- but we need to do our best to give all the love 
and joy we can give as they certainly deserve it-- when I was losing eight 
kitties one after the other.. I was overwhelmed with the depression --and 
eventually, I learned to live in the moment.. I loved all of them like there is 
no tomorrow -- hold them and tel them how beautiful they are.. the pain we are 
going through is only temprary and we will always be together no matter what -- 
there is nothing that can separate us --

There was a quote I saw some place goes something like.
Stop telling God how big strom is, but start telling storm, how big god is.. 
something like that..
I just try not to think of how big the pain and sorrow is.. but strated to 
think how big and powerful our love and bond with each other is..  much love,

Hideyo
  - Original Message - 
  From: Susan Dubosemailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 5:40 AM
  Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues


  Wise words, Marylyn...

  Wise words...


  Susan J. DuBose  ^..^
  www.PetGirlsPetsitting.comhttp://www.petgirlspetsitting.com/
  www.Tx.SiameseRescue.orghttp://www.tx.siameserescue.org/
  www.shadowcats.nethttp://www.shadowcats.net/
As Cleopatra lay in state,
 Faithful Bast at her side did wait,
 Purring welcomes of soft applause,
 Ever guarding with sharpened claws.
   Trajan Tennent




- Original Message - 
From: Marylynmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 4:07 AM
Subject: Re: To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues


Please do not grieve too much before it is timeit will take the joy 
of having Sammy and the others with you now away.  It is so very difficult but 
try.  Live each moment with the wonderful little ones.  That is how they do it. 
 One moment at a time.  When it is time to grieve go ahead and loose it .  
There is no shame in tears.  If we live every minute dreading the death of a 
loved one we have no time for joy.  And we are all dying.  Everyone of us 
started dying the minute we took our first breathe.

Bless you and Sammy and his brothers.bless all the little ones 
and their best friends.





 If you have men who will 
exclude any of God's creatures
 from the shelter of 
compassion and pity, you will have men who 
 will deal likewise with 
their fellow man.
  St. 
Francis

To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-29 Thread wendy

Hi Belinda,

In response to your post below, I felt the need to
clarify for Caroline's sake.  Bailey's situation
should be considered a miracle in my book.  As we have
seen too many times here, most cats do not respond as
Bailey did with that type of anemia; it claims the
lives of many.  While I do not wish to play a part in
taking away Caroline's hope, I also want to be
completely upfront about non-regenerative anemia.  It
can be reversed, but not usually.  I should have made
this statement earlier.  So That being said, it may be
wise to keep her kitty on Epogen considering Bailey's
case, as we never know when a situation might be
reversed.

Respectfully,
Wendy

--- Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Everytime I hear this I post this, Bailey's anemia
 was non regenerative 
 and we DID reverse it.
 
  and it is not a good anemia to have.  It means the
 leukemia is probably active in the bone marrow,
 which is, as far as I know, irreversable.
 
 -- 
 
 Belinda
 happiness is being owned by cats ...
 
 Be-Mi-Kitties
 http://bemikitties.com
 
 Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
 http://adopt.bemikitties.com
 
 FeLV Candlelight Service
 http://bemikitties.com/cls
 
 HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
 http://HostDesign4U.com
 
 
 
 BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
 http://bmk.bemikitties.com
 
 
 


Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the 
world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~



 

Finding fabulous fares is fun.  
Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel 
bargains.
http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097

RE: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

I talked to Dr. Susan Maier (holistic) yesterday. I was having a lot of trouble myself remaining positive and I was doing a lot of crying this week about Monkee's anemia situation. She said that Monkee's has a really strong life-force and he looks really good and I need to stay positive because the blood transfusion will buy more time for her remedies to work. I asked about reversal of the anemia and asked her to look at the records of the blood results from his CBC on Tuesday at Dr. Daley's. I asked if she could tell if he had regenerative or nonregenerative anemia based on those. She said his regenerative values were all within the normal limits, but that no, she couldn't tell from the blood results. However, she told me if the anemia is brought on by the chemo, it's usually regenerative (and can thus be
reversed); if the anemia is brought on by his actual Feline Leukemia, it's usually nonregenerative (and usually irreversible). I said, I guess that is why Dr. Daley talked about doing the bone marrow biopsy, because that would be the only way to really examine the marrow and be able to tell what is going on with the RBC, right?Dr. Maier said yes. I said, of course, we aren't doing a bone marrow biopsy, but now I FINALLY have a better understanding of what is going on. I know Dr. Daley is a good Vet, she's just so clinical, and soo cerebral that I don't think she explains things the way I need things explained to me. And it's not that I am dumb, it's just that this is my first FelV+ cat- and unlike her, I haven't been through this (sadly) a million times with other FelV+ cats. Also, when I am sitting there crying my eyes out at
what she is saying to me, I really need her to slow down and talk to me like I am a dumb baby! So, I am kind of having an issue with that right now. Dr. Maier said that I can call her anytime to "bounce ideas off" of her or ask for clarification about something so I thought that was very refreshing.

I have also put a call into Monkee's original Vet, Dr. Jones at the Cat Clinic of Louisville- for him to call me to discuss us returning to him for primary care since Monkee's main problem now is anemia and not cancer. I haven't heard from him yet. But his office is only 5 minutes away, so the stress on Monkee is decreased. Plus, he only treats cats and so the stress of the sound of dogs barking is also eliminated for Monkee. Dr. Jones just has a really good bedside manner that I think Monkee and I both really need right now.
Dr. Maier suggested that I feed Monkee raw, lean hamburger meat and chicken livers to help his anemia. I was shocked because I am a vegetarian so I NEVER buy meat, much less handle it, but I had to suppress my disgust and do it for Monkee.Our first foray into this realm was traumatic- for me. The chicken livers really freaked me out. When I was cutting them up the first time, my legs got weak and my knees felt like they might buckle, but Monkee was sitting on the floor looking up at me licking his chops, so I had to pull through, so as not to faint and fall on top of him Needless to say, he LOVES it! I think I gave him too much last night- probably because I was losing my mind while cutting everything up- and I was worried that I overdid it and he couldn't eat it all,
but he cleared his plate! The same this morning. It's hilarious to watch him eat the livers because, even though I have been coating the place with paper towels, he will pick up a piece and shake his head around to help break it up (like a dog) and he so he gets blood and liver "juice" (yuck) everywhere! I swear he's doing it just to freak me out! But he is so happy getting raw food, I think that, in and of itself, is going to increase his "life force" ten-fold!

From:wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgTo:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject:To Belinda: Re: Anemia IssuesDate:Fri, 29 Jun 2007 07:46:49 -0700 (PDT)Hi Belinda,In response to your post below, I felt the need toclarify for Caroline's sake.Bailey's situationshould be considered a miracle in my book.As we haveseen too many times here, most cats do not respond asBailey did with that type of anemia; it claims thelives of many.While I do not wish to play a part intaking away Caroline's hope, I also want to becompletely upfront about non-regenerative anemia.Itcan be reversed, but not usually.I
should have madethis statement earlier.So That being said, it may bewise to keep her kitty on Epogen considering Bailey'scase, as we never know when a situation might bereversed.Respectfully,Wendy--- Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Everytime I hear this I post this, Bailey's anemia was non regenerative and we DID reverse it.and it is not a good anemia to have.It means the leukemia is probably active in the bone marrow, which is, as far as I know, irreversable. -- Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ... Be-Mi-Kitties http://bemikitties.com Post

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

I know that it's not very common - but I did hear from two other people from
anemia list who responded to epogen who had non-regenerative anemia but who was
not a CRF kitty -- I have my kitty, ayumi who has non regenerative anemia with
unknown cause is also suffering from anemia -- she was coping with anemial
pretty well, until I started using epogen (though it seems to have worked for a
tiny bit --), then she might have developed antibody reaction as her anemia got
worse than before she started treatment -- so I stopped epogen therapy
completely and she got her first transfusion -- my hope is that, after several
weeks, antibody reaction will go away and her PCV will go back to where it was
before the therapy...

I do however, recommend due to antibody reaction possibility (up to 30% to 50%
of cats in some study), using aranesp over epogen... and sometimes, it works
among kitties who developed antiboy to epogen, and antibody reaction % is much
less than epogen.. if I had researched a bit more regarding the real % of
epogen, I would probably have used aranesp over epogen in a heartbeat.. as I
feel that she never really got benefit of epogen, but it may have harmed her
more -- aranesp is a bit more expensive.. but I am considering using it for
ayumi soon.
- Original Message -
From: wendymailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 8:46 AM
Subject: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Hi Belinda,

In response to your post below, I felt the need to
clarify for Caroline's sake. Bailey's situation
should be considered a miracle in my book. As we have
seen too many times here, most cats do not respond as
Bailey did with that type of anemia; it claims the
lives of many. While I do not wish to play a part in
taking away Caroline's hope, I also want to be
completely upfront about non-regenerative anemia. It
can be reversed, but not usually. I should have made
this statement earlier. So That being said, it may be
wise to keep her kitty on Epogen considering Bailey's
case, as we never know when a situation might be
reversed.

Respectfully,
Wendy

--- Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED]mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

Everytime I hear this I post this, Bailey's anemia
was non regenerative
and we DID reverse it.

and it is not a good anemia to have. It means the
leukemia is probably active in the bone marrow,
which is, as far as I know, irreversable.

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.comhttp://bemikitties.com/

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.comhttp://adopt.bemikitties.com/

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/clshttp://bemikitties.com/cls

HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting web design]
http://HostDesign4U.comhttp://hostdesign4u.com/

BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.comhttp://bmk.bemikitties.com/

Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change
the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade
~~~

Finding fabulous fares is fun.
Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and
hotel bargains.

http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

I am in a very similar boat, Caroline - please stay positive - my first every 
rescued kitty, ayumi whom I brought from Japan, is fighting against anemial.. 
like Monkee -- she is not clinically ill, but her PCV went down to 8 last week 
and she had her first tansfusion -- unless there is a huge treatment 
difference, please don't put him go through bone marrow biopsy -- that's very 
stressful for him.

I suggested in my previuos email.. but please consdier aranesp for anemia 
teatment.  and you might be already, but if you are not, please join feline 
anemia list as there are lots of people with experience there as well.
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmannmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 9:17 AM
  Subject: RE: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


  I talked to Dr. Susan Maier (holistic) yesterday.  I was having a lot of 
trouble myself remaining positive and I was doing a lot of crying this week 
about Monkee's anemia situation.  She said that Monkee's has a really strong 
life-force and he looks really good and I need to stay positive because the 
blood transfusion will buy more time for her remedies to work.  I asked about 
reversal of the anemia and asked her to look at the records of the blood 
results from his CBC on Tuesday at Dr. Daley's.  I asked if she could tell if 
he had regenerative or nonregenerative anemia based on those.  She said his 
regenerative values were all within the normal limits, but that no, she 
couldn't tell from the blood results.  However, she told me if the anemia is 
brought on by the chemo, it's usually regenerative (and can thus be reversed); 
if the anemia is brought on by his actual Feline Leukemia, it's usually 
nonregenerative (and usually irreversible).  I said, I guess that is why Dr. 
Daley talked about doing the bone marrow biopsy, because that would be the only 
way to really examine the marrow and be able to tell what is going on with the 
RBC, right?  Dr. Maier said yes.  I said, of course, we aren't doing a bone 
marrow biopsy, but now I FINALLY have a better understanding of what is going 
on.  I know Dr. Daley is a good Vet, she's just so clinical, and 
soo cerebral that I don't think she explains things the way I need 
things explained to me.  And it's not that I am dumb, it's just that this is my 
first FelV+ cat- and unlike her, I haven't been through this (sadly) a million 
times with other FelV+ cats.  Also, when I am sitting there crying my eyes out 
at what she is saying to me, I really need her to slow down and talk to me like 
I am a dumb baby!  So, I am kind of having an issue with that right now.  Dr. 
Maier said that I can call her anytime to bounce ideas off of her or ask for 
clarification about something so I thought that was very refreshing.  

  I have also put a call into Monkee's original Vet, Dr. Jones at the Cat 
Clinic of Louisville- for him to call me to discuss us returning to him for 
primary care since Monkee's main problem now is anemia and not cancer.  I 
haven't heard from him yet.  But his office is only 5 minutes away, so the 
stress on Monkee is decreased.  Plus, he only treats cats and so the stress of 
the sound of dogs barking is also eliminated for Monkee.  Dr. Jones just has a 
really good bedside manner that I think Monkee and I both really need right 
now.  

  Dr. Maier suggested that I feed Monkee raw, lean hamburger meat and chicken 
livers to help his anemia.  I was shocked because I am a vegetarian so I NEVER 
buy meat, much less handle it, but I had to suppress my disgust and do it for 
Monkee.  Our first foray into this realm was traumatic- for me.  The chicken 
livers really freaked me out.  When I was cutting them up the first time, my 
legs got weak and my knees felt like they might buckle, but Monkee was sitting 
on the floor looking up at me licking his chops, so I had to pull through, so 
as not to faint and fall on top of him  Needless to say, he 
LOVES it!  I think I gave him too much last 
night- probably because I was losing my mind while cutting everything up- and I 
was worried that I overdid it and he couldn't eat it all, but he cleared his 
plate!  The same this morning.  It's hilarious to watch him eat the livers 
because, even though I have been coating the place with paper towels, he will 
pick up a piece and shake his head around to help break it up (like a dog) and 
he so he gets blood and liver juice (yuck) everywhere!  I swear he's doing it 
just to freak me out!  But he is so happy getting raw food, I think that, in 
and of itself, is going to increase his life force ten-fold!

  






From:  wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To:  felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
To:  felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject:  To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

yikes... Dr. Daley may not be familiar with how epogen works, Caroline-- how 
long ago did Monkee get an epogen?  It usually takes two to three weeks for 
epogen to show any effect --the meantime, his PCV will continue to go down.. 
but you don't know yet if he was only give a week ago,

 again, since he is not sure whether epogen works or not, I would so very much 
recommend that you switch to aranesp from epogen.. again 30% to 50% of cats 
will develop antibody, once it does, epogen will destroy human erytheipoten 
(produced by epogen) as well as natural erytheiopoeitn that Monkee produces on 
his own, and his anemia will become more severe, and it will take two months to 
a year before antibody reactions goes away from his body --the meantime, you 
have to give him multiple transfusion to tie his life.. I am advising this to 
you, that's exactly what happened to ayumi and I regeret that I did not use 
aranesep -- aranesp works a similar way to epogen, but much less possibility of 
him getting antibody reactions - lots of vet schools now uses aranesp over 
epogen due to the risk mentioned earilier.  This antibody reaction can be fatal.

Epogen needs to be injected in cats three times a week initially and you need 
to monitor his PCV weekly and also his BP, epogen will cause high BP in cats 
(hypertension) and will cause a cat to be blind.. my hannibal became blind 
after one week therapy of epogen due to high BP -- make sure you check his BP 
now and regularly during epogen therapy, anything over 150 to 160 is high, and 
he needs to be on norvasc to control hypertension.  and pay attention to his 
pupils to make sure that it does not look dilated.. if it does, you need to 
take him to emergency to get norvasc, as there is a chance to reversre blindess 
if you catch it with in 24 to 48 hours or so.  thank you.

Hideyo
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmannmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 10:32 AM
  Subject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


  Monkee only had one week's treatment of Epogen.  Dr. Daley didn't say 
anything about continuing Epogen or trying a second dose.  When I asked on 
Tues. if the Epogen helped him at all, she said no, because his red blood cell 
count was actually lower.  So, I don't know if we should try it again (meaning, 
if I should ASK for Monkee to be able to try it again)?  I was also not 
instructed as to whether or not we should re-start his 7-days-on of Interferon, 
which would start today?  I put a call into Dr. Daley yesterday about that and 
haven't heard back yet.  





From: HIDEYO YAMAMOTO [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 09:03:12 -0600


I know that it's not very common - but I did hear from two other people 
from anemia list who responded to epogen who had non-regenerative anemia but 
who was not a CRF kitty -- I have my kitty, ayumi who has non regenerative 
anemia with unknown cause is also suffering from anemia -- she was coping with 
anemial pretty well, until I started using epogen (though it seems to have 
worked for a tiny bit --), then she might have developed antibody reaction as 
her anemia got worse than before she started treatment -- so I stopped epogen 
therapy completely and she got her first transfusion -- my hope is that, after 
several weeks, antibody reaction will go away and her PCV will go back to where 
it was before the therapy...

I do however, recommend due to antibody reaction possibility (up to 30% to 
50% of cats in some study), using aranesp over epogen... and sometimes, it 
works among kitties who developed antiboy to epogen, and antibody reaction % is 
much less than epogen.. if I had researched a bit more regarding the real % of 
epogen, I would probably have used aranesp over epogen in a heartbeat.. as I 
feel that she never really got benefit of epogen, but it may have harmed her 
more -- aranesp is a bit more expensive.. but I am considering using it for 
ayumi soon.
  - Original Message - 
  From: wendymailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 8:46 AM
  Subject: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


  Hi Belinda,

  In response to your post below, I felt the need to
  clarify for Caroline's sake.  Bailey's situation
  should be considered a miracle in my book.  As we have
  seen too many times here, most cats do not respond as
  Bailey did with that type of anemia; it claims the
  lives of many.  While I do not wish to play a part in
  taking away Caroline's hope, I also want to be
  completely upfront about non-regenerative anemia.  It
  can be reversed

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Monkee only had one week's treatment of Epogen. Dr. Daley didn't say anything about continuing Epogen or trying a second dose. When I asked on Tues. if the Epogen helped him at all, she said no, because his red blood cell count was actually lower. So, I don't know if we should try it again (meaning, if I should ASK for Monkee to be able to try it again)? I was also not instructed as to whether or not we should re-start his 7-days-on of Interferon, which would start today? I put a call into Dr. Daley yesterday about that and haven't heard back yet. 



From: "HIDEYO YAMAMOTO" [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgTo: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia IssuesDate: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 09:03:12 -0600




Iknow that it's not very common - but I did hear from two other peoplefrom anemia list who responded to epogen who had non-regenerative anemia but who was not a CRF kitty -- I have my kitty, ayumi who has non regenerative anemia with unknown cause is also suffering from anemia -- she was coping with anemial pretty well, until I started using epogen (though it seems to have worked for a tiny bit --), then she might have developed antibody reaction as her anemia got worse than before she started treatment -- so I stopped epogen therapy completely and she got her first transfusion -- my hope is that, after several weeks, antibody reaction will go away and her PCV will go back to where it was before the therapy...

I do however, recommend due to antibody reaction possibility (up to 30% to 50% of cats in some study), using aranesp over epogen... and sometimes, it works among kitties who developed antiboy to epogen, and antibody reaction % is much less than epogen.. if I had researched a bit more regarding the real % of epogen, I would probably have used aranesp over epogen in a heartbeat.. as I feel that she never really got benefit of epogen, but it may have harmed her more -- aranesp is a bit more expensive.. but I am considering using it for ayumi soon.

- Original Message - 
From: wendy 
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 8:46 AM
Subject: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues
Hi Belinda,In response to your post below, I felt the need toclarify for Caroline's sake. Bailey's situationshould be considered a miracle in my book. As we haveseen too many times here, most cats do not respond asBailey did with that type of anemia; it claims thelives of many. While I do not wish to play a part intaking away Caroline's hope, I also want to becompletely upfront about non-regenerative anemia. Itcan be reversed, but not usually. I should have madethis statement earlier. So That being said, it may bewise to keep her kitty on Epogen considering Bailey'scase, as we never know when a situation might bereversed.Respectfully,Wendy--- Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
wrote: Everytime I hear this I post this, Bailey's anemia was non regenerative  and we DID reverse it.   and it is not a good anemia to have. It means the leukemia is probably active in the bone marrow, which is, as far as I know, irreversable.  --   Belinda happiness is being owned by cats ...  Be-Mi-Kitties http://bemikitties.com  Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens http://adopt.bemikitties.com  FeLV Candlelight Service http://bemikitties.com/cls  HostDesign4U.com 
[affordable hosting  web design] http://HostDesign4U.com    BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites] http://bmk.bemikitties.com   "Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful committed citizens can change the world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has!" ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~Finding fabulous fares is fun. Let Yahoo! FareChase search your favorite travel sites to find flight and hotel bargains.http://farechase.yahoo.com/promo-generic-14795097 Make every IM count. Download Messenger and join the im Initiative now. Its free.

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

   Epogen should be given 3 times a week to start *one dose will do 
nothing*, It sounds like your vet isn't familiar with how to use 
epogen.  It should be given 3 times a week and ONLY once the cat is in 
the normal range should that number be lowered.  Bailey got it 3 times a 
week for about 8 weeks, then it went to twice a week for a few weeks and 
then we went to once a week.  He was still getting it once a week when 
he passed from cancer.  He had been getting it for about 5 months and 
his HCT was still normal at 33% when the cancer took him.


Like I said *almost ALL* cats will have a drop in their HCT when they 
start epogen for the first 2 to 5 weeks, it can take 2 to 5 weeks to 
work, average is 2 or 3 weeks for it to kick in and in that time the HCT 
almost always drops, many vets will stop the epogen at that point 
thinking it's an antiboby reaction.  But I do know of a cat that took 
over 5 weeks and the standard starting dose wasn't enough for this cat, 
luckily her vet figured it out and upped the dose, the cat reversed it's 
anemia.


Another cat I know on the feline lymphoma list who had CRF related 
anemia problems along with his cancer lived 2 years on epogen before the 
cancer came out of remission for a 3rd time and took him.


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
http://HostDesign4U.com



BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.com

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

I am going to talk to Monkee's regular vet (Dr. Jones) about this because I am worried. And I don't like how I was pretty much told to give up on a cat that doesn't look clinically sick! What dying cat eats a human-sized portion of raw hamburger meat and chicken livers (with gusto!)?! And has enough energy to rip the chicken livers to shreds! Come on! 


Thanks for your insight- both of you. I didn't know there was a feline anemia list serve. I will try that too...
-Caroline 


From: Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgTo: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia IssuesDate: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 10:20:45 -0700
ÂÂÂ Epogen should be given 3 times a week to start one dose will do nothing, It sounds like your vet isn't familiar with how to use epogen.Â It should be given 3 times a week and ONLY once the cat is in the normal range should that number be lowered.Â Bailey got it 3 times a week for about 8 weeks, then it went to twice a week for a few weeks and then we went to once a week.Â He was still getting it once a week when he passed from cancer.Â He had been getting it for about 5 months and his HCT was still normal at 33% when the cancer took him.Like I said almost ALL cats will have a drop in their HCT when they start epogen for the first 2 to 5 weeks, it can take 2 to 5 weeks to work, average is 2 or 3 weeks for it to kick in and in that time the HCT 
almost always drops, many vets will stop the epogen at that point thinking it's an antiboby reaction.Â But I do know of a cat that took over 5 weeks and the standard starting dose wasn't enough for this cat, luckily her vet figured it out and upped the dose, the cat reversed it's anemia.Another cat I know on the feline lymphoma list who had CRF related anemia problems along with his cancer lived 2 years on epogen before the cancer came out of remission for a 3rd time and took him.--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Yes, please please see another vet -- how insulting-- Ayumi is very much the 
same -- she jumps and eat and she is not clinically ill!! I have heard kitties 
who were anemic and clinically ill - and I thought anemia killed them -- but 
now looking at Ayumi, there must be something else besides anemia that killed 
my babies because PCV 8, and Ayumi does not look ill ---

I am so glad that you are not letting this stupid vet convince you about what 
he is saying --- don't give up, Caroline.. let's fight together for both Monkee 
and Ayumi.. 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmannmailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 11:51 AM
  Subject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


  I am going to talk to Monkee's regular vet (Dr. Jones) about this because I 
am worried.  And I don't like how I was pretty much told to give up on a cat 
that doesn't look clinically sick!  What dying cat eats a human-sized portion 
of raw hamburger meat and chicken livers (with gusto!)?!  And has enough energy 
to rip the chicken livers to shreds!  Come on!  

  Thanks for your insight- both of you.  I didn't know there was a feline 
anemia list serve.  I will try that too...

  -Caroline 





From: Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Reply-To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org
Subject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues
Date: Fri, 29 Jun 2007 10:20:45 -0700

Â Â Â Â Â Â Â  Epogen should be given 3 times a week to start one dose will 
do nothing, It sounds like your vet isn't familiar with how to use epogen.Â  It 
should be given 3 times a week and ONLY once the cat is in the normal range 
should that number be lowered.Â  Bailey got it 3 times a week for about 8 
weeks, then it went to twice a week for a few weeks and then we went to once a 
week.Â  He was still getting it once a week when he passed from cancer.Â  He 
had been getting it for about 5 months and his HCT was still normal at 33% when 
the cancer took him.

Like I said almost ALL cats will have a drop in their HCT when they start 
epogen for the first 2 to 5 weeks, it can take 2 to 5 weeks to work, average is 
2 or 3 weeks for it to kick in and in that time the HCT almost always drops, 
many vets will stop the epogen at that point thinking it's an antiboby 
reaction.Â  But I do know of a cat that took over 5 weeks and the standard 
starting dose wasn't enough for this cat, luckily her vet figured it out and 
upped the dose, the cat reversed it's anemia.

Another cat I know on the feline lymphoma list who had CRF related anemia 
problems along with his cancer lived 2 years on epogen before the cancer came 
out of remission for a 3rd time and took him.

--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

PS.  If it were me I would either find a vet who knows how to work with 
epogen or ask your vet to research it, or take research you've done to 
him and ask him to work with you.  Along with the epogen a cat should be 
getting blood builders, nutrived is a good source for this.  It has the 
iron, vitamin b needed to build blood.  Fred's HCT got as low as 24% and 
the nutrived got him back up to 30%.  Nutrived wouldn't be enough for a 
cat with an HCT of 18% or less.  I can't remember what is Monkee's HCT?


PS.  Bailey had the bone marrow aspirate and that is why we very 
strongly suspected cancer somewhere.  He had Myloid Dysplastic 
(basically there were pre-cancerous cells there).  We did every test we 
could think of and couldn't find the cancer, even after we got his HCT 
to normal, he had no energy and wouldn't eat.   He succumbed to 
pancreatic cancer which we found after he passed with a necropsy.  I 
suspected his pancreas was involved because he always was uncomfortable 
when I fed him through his feeding tube.  He was on high doses of 
prednisolone and was getting doxy just incase his hemobartonella test 
was a false negative.  The pred and the epo are what got his HCT back to 
normal and stopped the bone marrow surpression by the virus.


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

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http://bemikitties.com

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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


again 30% to 50% of cats will develop antibody,



I believe this is a very high estimate, where did you get this number 
Hideyo??


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


  Hideyo,
  We both belong to the amenia list and the number when considering how 
many cats on the list have been on it is nowhere near that high.  I have 
never seen this number anywhere, I have seen 30% quoted but many vets 
who regularly work with epogen have said in their experience the number 
is closer to 10%, where are you getting these numbers???



again 30% to 50% of cats will develop antibody,


--

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happiness is being owned by cats ...

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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Monkee's HCT was 13% two weeks ago (when we first went to the Vet because I knew something was wrong). That was on a Tuesday. They gave him .3 of Epogen and sent me home with a tiny bottle to give him sub-cu injections of Epogen that Thurs, and Sat. They increased his predisone (which was 5 mg- I think? the little, small pills), every other day, to one every day; his Vet also added the appetite stimulant, 1/2 a pill twice a day. We did the week of Epogen, went back this Tues. and that is when his HCT count was 10% and his Vet told us the options (marrow biopsy, transfusion, etc). We did the blood transfusion on Wed. and they said after it, his count was up to 15%. The instructions were to just continue the pred and the appetite stim. Nothing was said about the Interferon or Epogen and I was too out of it to ask
because I was so shocked by the bill from the transfusion (and all I could think was that we can't afford another one).
He was, what I call "Super Monkee" (it speaks for itself) on Wed., after the transfusion. But since then, he's gone down a little bit (not with eating though); but he's defintely less Super Monkee, and he's less bright-eyed. But he is still sleeping better- actual sound sleeping, as opposed to the justlaying there and staring into space "sleeping."
I have printed your emails and I filed them in "Monkee's Care Binder"- that I have organized with ALL his information and ithas dividers and everything. I am going to ask questions from the emails when a Vet ever calls me back! But I decided I need to bring some MAJOR organization to caring for Monkee if I want to do this right, hence the binder! I highly suggest this to anyone who isn't already doing something similar. I take The MonkeeBinder with me everywhere.
-Caroline

From:Belinda [EMAIL PROTECTED]Reply-To:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgTo:felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgSubject:Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia IssuesDate:Fri, 29 Jun 2007 11:22:31 -0700PS.If it were me I would either find a vet who knows how to work with epogen or ask your vet to research it, or take research you've done to him and ask him to work with you.Along with the epogen a cat should be getting blood builders, nutrived is a good source for this.It has the iron, vitamin b needed to build blood.Fred's HCT got as low as 24% and the nutrived got him back up to 30%.Nutrived wouldn't be enough for a cat with an HCT of 18% or less.I can't
remember what is Monkee's HCT?PS.Bailey had the bone marrow aspirate and that is why we very strongly suspected cancer somewhere.He had Myloid Dysplastic (basically there were pre-cancerous cells there).We did every test we could think of and couldn't find the cancer, even after we got his HCT to normal, he had no energy and wouldn't eat. He succumbed to pancreatic cancer which we found after he passed with a necropsy. I suspected his pancreas was involved because he always was uncomfortable when I fed him through his feeding tube.He was on high doses of prednisolone and was getting doxy just incase his hemobartonella test was a false negative.The pred and the epo are what got his HCT back to normal and
stopped the bone marrow surpression by the virus.--Belindahappiness is being owned by cats ...Be-Mi-Kittieshttp://bemikitties.comPost Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittenshttp://adopt.bemikitties.comFeLV Candlelight Servicehttp://bemikitties.com/clsHostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting web design]http://HostDesign4U.comBMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]http://bmk.bemikitties.com Picture this share your photos and you could win big!

Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

Hi, Belinda, I posted it on anemia list, I think - but here's the extract
from marvistavet site -- 

 In one study 2 out of 3 dogs treated for more than 90 days with human 
 erythropoietin
 and 5 out of 7 cats treated for more than 180 days with human 
 erythropoietin
 developed refractory anemia due to anti-erythropoietin antibodies.
 A more commonly reported statistic is a 30% incidence in development of 
 refractory anemia.

 After discontinuing erythropoietin, antibodies wane over 2-12 months and 
 the red cell count returns to its pre-treatment level. Blood transfusions 
 may be needed to keep the patient alive during this time.

here's the link
http://www.marvistavet.com/html/erythropoietin.htmlhttp://www.marvistavet.com/html/erythropoietin.html

And Dr. kathy who participated in this study 1998 quoted as follows;

Having worked on the Amgen-sponsored clinical trial of Epogen in cats I can 
clearly say that no, not all cats get antibodies to human-recombinant 
erythropoietin. Based on the clinical trial, the % varied a little between 
Ohio State, UC-Davis, and U of MN patients, but it is about 1/3. Because the 
antibodies, if they form, are cross-reactive to the cat's own endogenous 
erythropoietin, they are very serious and the anemia that result will be 
severe (generally requiring multiple transfusions) until the antibodies wear 
off. We've had cats on Epogen for over 2 years without antibodies, so I 
think the majorty of cats' immune systems never recognize it as foreign.

So, 30% came from 1/3, I believe.  I had started on epogen on Ayumi thinking 
that 5 to 10% stas which is not that bad.. but if I had known that the stats 
could be as high as 30% - I would have thought more about using epogen, but 
instead I would have used  aranesp instead.


__._,_.___ 
  - Original Message - 
  From: Belindamailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.orgmailto:felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Sent: Friday, June 29, 2007 12:44 PM
  Subject: Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues


   again 30% to 50% of cats will develop antibody,


  I believe this is a very high estimate, where did you get this number 
  Hideyo??

  -- 

  Belinda
  happiness is being owned by cats ...

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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

   Bailey was getting 20mg of pred, 10 twice a day to start once his 
hct was normal again we weaned him down over the course of several 
weeks, he was getting 2.5mgs a day when he passed.


--

Belinda
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Re: To Belinda: Re: Anemia Issues

   Wow that is really interesting because the number of list cats in 
the anemia group don't support anywhere near that number.  I'll have to 
do some more research on that.  Thank you Hideyo.


--

Belinda
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To Caroline: Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-28 Thread wendy

P.S. Chemo can cause anemia.  I don't know if I
mentioned this or not.

:)
Wendy

--- Caroline Kaufmann [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:


-

Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV
pos. and lymphosarcoma cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet
yesterday to determine whether the Epogen had helped
his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last
week, when the anemia started, his Red Blood cell
count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 doses of the
Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%. 
However, Monkees White Blood Cell count is normal (it
was down last week) and his lymphocyte count is
normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his
groin that is enlarged (but it cant be felt from the
outside- it runs along the artery in the leg).  His
Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem,
or it could be the lymphosarcoma, but when pressed,
she said that she honestly doubted it was the cancer. 
She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow
aspirate/biopsy to determine what is going on at the
cellular level; however, it is invasive and Monkee
would need sedation- which he couldnt get anyway
while so anemic (so he'd need a blood transfusion 1st,
just to be able to do the biospy);  However, the
biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us
its FeLV causing the anemia; (2) a blood transfusion
to literally buy me more time with him; (3) try
another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is
being caused by lymphosarcoma, although, as I said
previously, she doubted it and that was a shot in the
dark. 

My mother and I did not want to put this cat through
chemo again (although he did very well with the first
round).  But now that he is actively anemic, there was
no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr.
Daley really didnt think the chemo would actually
help the situation.  We also didnt want to put him
through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell
us what we already know, but dont want to admitthat
for four years, I had the healthiest, beefiest,
toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered
from a urinary tract infection; who was so healthy, I
wanted to test him a 3rd time this summer for FeLV
because I was sure he didnt have it.To now, out of
nowhere, in a span of 2 months, we have gone from
that, to a severely anemic, suffering, FeLV cat with
lymphosarcoma.  

Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I
were not prepared to hear at all.  I mean, he is
eating, drinking, using the litter box, he is thick
(he was slightly overweight to begin with, so that is
helping him now).  Yes, hes not Monkee as I have
known him, but he just doesnt look to me like hes on
his last leg.  When we questioned her on the days
prognosis she explained that due to the FeLV virus,
and the anemia, his body is not making RBC and his
brain is not getting enough oxygen and although he
seems okay now, he is dizzy, lightheaded, probably
having vertigo, and all of that will continue to get
worse because his body is not manufacturing RBC- which
carry oxygen in the blood, and eventually, his
eating/drinking and making it to the litter box will
all drop off.  

We asked what could be done and she said, if you are
not ready yet, she recommended the blood transfusion,
which will give him about two weeks, and then the
benefits of the transferred blood will wear off and he
will start suffering the anemia symptoms again because
his body is not producing its own RBC.  She also said
that morally, with FeLV cats, she will do 2 blood
transfusions, and then that is it.  It is fighting a
losing battle and that is as far as she will take it.

I was wrecked and my mother was crying too.  I decided
to pull myself together and still take Monkee to the
Holistic Vet, Dr. Susan Maier, after we left Dr.
Daleys.  It was our first visit and I thought, I am
so desperate right now, it cant hurt.  A funny story
about this visit: Monkee totally perked up as soon as
we left Dr. Daleys (he hates it there!).  Dr. Maier
has a few black and white clinic cats that roam
around and as soon as we walked in, Monkee, in his
carrier, freaked out (he hates other catswhich is
probably why he ended up with FeLV to begin with!).  I
was carrying his carrier on my shoulder to an exam
room and I instantly felt the carrier get completely
light- there was no longer 13 lbs of weight on my
shoulder!  I didnt understand what happened, but I
turned around and all I saw was black and white x 3
(Monkee is black and white), and I just grabbed the
first black and white form that was closest to me, and
thank god, it was Monkee!  He had opened the front
flap of his pet carrierwidened the zipper I guess
with his paw and then his face, and jumped outin an
effort to get the clinic cats that were following us
to the exam room!  I grabbed him just in time because
he was already facing off against them ready to
attack, and because he has FeLV, it scared me to
death!  But that is not the behavior of a cat on his

Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-28 Thread C J

I know exactly what you are going through, as I joined this list in March 
because my Tomi was anemic and tested positive for FeLV.  He received a 
transfusion, and even did well for awhile.  His red blood cells were increasing 
on their own, but then they decreased again.  They went so low, that he 
crashed and I thought he would die.  He was too weak to get up, and his 
breathing was rapid.  Suddenly he got better again, and I had another 2 months 
with him (though he never got back to normal range).

I had him on Interferon, Lysine, Transfer Factor, and Mega C Plus.  Whether 
these helped to extend his life, or did nothing, I don't know.

Never give up hope that Monkee can pull through this, as sometimes that is all 
you have, but be prepared and enjoy the time you have with him to the fullest.  
Take lots of pictures and tell him that you love him everyday.  I'm sure he 
will enjoy the extra attention, and if he is able to beat this, you will be 
closer than ever.  

Cassandra
  - Original Message - 
  From: Caroline Kaufmann 
  To: felvtalk@felineleukemia.org 
  Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED] 
  Sent: Wednesday, June 27, 2007 11:14 AM
  Subject: Anemia Issues 


  Hi everyone.  I wanted to provide an update on my FeLV pos. and lymphosarcoma 
cat Monkee.  He saw his Vet yesterday to determine whether the Epogen had 
helped his anemia.  The news was very bad.  Apparently last week, when the 
anemia started, his Red Blood cell count was 13%.  After a week ( 3 doses of 
the Epogen), his RBC count was actually worse, 10%.  However, Monkee's White 
Blood Cell count is normal (it was down last week) and his lymphocyte count is 
normal.  Dr. Daley also found a lymph node in his groin that is enlarged (but 
it can't be felt from the outside- it runs along the artery in the leg).  His 
Vet said she thinks the FeLV is causing the problem, or it could be the 
lymphosarcoma, but when pressed, she said that she honestly doubted it was the 
cancer.  She presented 3 options: (1) a bone marrow aspirate/biopsy to 
determine what is going on at the cellular level; however, it is invasive and 
Monkee would need sedation- which he couldn't get anyway while so anemic (so 
he'd need a blood transfusion 1st, just to be able to do the biospy);  However, 
the biopsy, in her opinion, would probably just tell us it's FeLV causing the 
anemia; (2) a blood transfusion to literally buy me more time with him; (3) try 
another dose of chemo in hopes that the anemia is being caused by 
lymphosarcoma, although, as I said previously, she doubted it and that was a 
shot in the dark. 

  My mother and I did not want to put this cat through chemo again (although he 
did very well with the first round).  But now that he is actively anemic, there 
was no way I would do it, especially knowing that Dr. Daley really didn't think 
the chemo would actually help the situation.  We also didn't want to put him 
through a bone marrow biopsy that would probably tell us what we already know, 
but don't want to admit.that for four years, I had the healthiest, beefiest, 
toughest cat in the world, who never even suffered from a urinary tract 
infection; who was so healthy, I wanted to test him a 3rd time this summer for 
FeLV because I was sure he didn't have it..To now, out of nowhere, in a span of 
2 months, we have gone from that, to a severely anemic, suffering, FeLV cat 
with lymphosarcoma.  

  Dr. Daley gave him days.  Days.  Which my mom and I were not prepared to hear 
at all.  I mean, he is eating, drinking, using the litter box, he is thick (he 
was slightly overweight to begin with, so that is helping him now).  Yes, he's 
not Monkee as I have known him, but he just doesn't look to me like he's on 
his last leg.  When we questioned her on the days prognosis she explained 
that due to the FeLV virus, and the anemia, his body is not making RBC and his 
brain is not getting enough oxygen and although he seems okay now, he is dizzy, 
lightheaded, probably having vertigo, and all of that will continue to get 
worse because his body is not manufacturing RBC- which carry oxygen in the 
blood, and eventually, his eating/drinking and making it to the litter box will 
all drop off.  

  We asked what could be done and she said, if you are not ready yet, she 
recommended the blood transfusion, which will give him about two weeks, and 
then the benefits of the transferred blood will wear off and he will start 
suffering the anemia symptoms again because his body is not producing it's own 
RBC.  She also said that morally, with FeLV cats, she will do 2 blood 
transfusions, and then that is it.  It is fighting a losing battle and that is 
as far as she will take it.

  I was wrecked and my mother was crying too.  I decided to pull myself 
together and still take Monkee to the Holistic Vet, Dr. Susan Maier, after we 
left Dr. Daley's.  It was our first visit and I thought, I am so desperate 
right now, it can't hurt.  A funny story about this visit: Monkee

Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-27 Thread wendy

Hi Caroline,

I'm sorry that Monkee's HCT count is not too good.  I
cried when I read your account of going to Dr. Maier's
office.  It felt like a rainbow bursting through the
clouds.  I loved the story about Monkee trying to get
at those cats.  He sounds like a hoot.

If Monkee isn't making any RBC's, which means he
doesn't have any reticulocytes, then it's called
nonregenerative anemia, and it is not a good anemia to
have.  It means the leukemia is probably active in the
bone marrow, which is, as far as I know, irreversable.
 I wish I could tell you differently.  Here is a good
website to read up on types of anemia.

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/10200.htm

Here is another link:

http://www.vet.uga.edu/vpp/clerk/tolbert/index.php

I think you are right not to put kitty through chemo
again.  The anemia is enough to deal with.  I am so
sorry your beautiful, healthy kitty is going through
this.  I truly am.  Fighting anemia is like fighting a
ghost.  You just don't know when it's really time to
let go until sometimes it's too late.  Even with the
lowered HCT, some kitties have a good quality of life.
 And no one wants to let their kitty go before their
time, even if they aren't feeling 100%.  I lost my
Cricket to the same thing.  His was regenerative
anemia, but we could not reverse it in time.  

If you do go with the blood transfusion, you will see
a different cat, even for just a few days.  He will
feel so much better.  But your vet is right in telling
you it's temporary; she is doing the right thing in
being honest.  Even though there are many good vets,
there are those out there that will not give you the
full scoop because of greed or ignorance or whatever,
and give false hope.  Your vet seems to be a good one.

It will be a good time to spend a lot of quality time
together, feed Monkee a lot of whatever he loves, let
him enjoy the outdoors and sun if that's what he
likes, takes pictures and video (After I lost Cricket,
his photos helped a lot), and prepare for good-bye.  I
hate telling you this because I never want to give up
hope.  I'm as tenacious as they come.  But if your vet
did test for reticulocytes and there are none, then
there are studies to prove the graveness of the
situation.  And I want you to be able to make the most
of it instead of looking back and wishing you'd done
this or that.  The only real hope is if the vet missed
the reticulocytes and the anemia is actually
regenerative; then the Epogen is important is helping
to stimulate need RBC's.  I pray this is the case for
Monkee.  Make sure your vet tested for these; I'm sure
she did if she's saying Monkee is not making any
RBC's.  You can ask how she came to that conclusion
and see if she mentions RBC's.  

Prayers going out for reticulocytes and that Monkee is
comfortable.  Prayers also going out for peace for you
and your mom.  Please keep us posted on sweet Monkee.
:)
Wendy

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world - indeed it is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret Meade ~~~



 

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Re: Anemia Issues

2007-06-27 Thread wendy

I meant mentions reticulocytes...sorry.

:)
Wendy

--- wendy [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

 Hi Caroline,
 
 I'm sorry that Monkee's HCT count is not too good. 
 I
 cried when I read your account of going to Dr.
 Maier's
 office.  It felt like a rainbow bursting through the
 clouds.  I loved the story about Monkee trying to
 get
 at those cats.  He sounds like a hoot.
 
 If Monkee isn't making any RBC's, which means he
 doesn't have any reticulocytes, then it's called
 nonregenerative anemia, and it is not a good anemia
 to
 have.  It means the leukemia is probably active in
 the
 bone marrow, which is, as far as I know,
 irreversable.
  I wish I could tell you differently.  Here is a
 good
 website to read up on types of anemia.
 

http://www.merckvetmanual.com/mvm/index.jsp?cfile=htm/bc/10200.htm
 
 Here is another link:
 
 http://www.vet.uga.edu/vpp/clerk/tolbert/index.php
 
 I think you are right not to put kitty through chemo
 again.  The anemia is enough to deal with.  I am so
 sorry your beautiful, healthy kitty is going through
 this.  I truly am.  Fighting anemia is like fighting
 a
 ghost.  You just don't know when it's really time to
 let go until sometimes it's too late.  Even with the
 lowered HCT, some kitties have a good quality of
 life.
  And no one wants to let their kitty go before their
 time, even if they aren't feeling 100%.  I lost my
 Cricket to the same thing.  His was regenerative
 anemia, but we could not reverse it in time.  
 
 If you do go with the blood transfusion, you will
 see
 a different cat, even for just a few days.  He will
 feel so much better.  But your vet is right in
 telling
 you it's temporary; she is doing the right thing in
 being honest.  Even though there are many good vets,
 there are those out there that will not give you the
 full scoop because of greed or ignorance or
 whatever,
 and give false hope.  Your vet seems to be a good
 one.
 
 It will be a good time to spend a lot of quality
 time
 together, feed Monkee a lot of whatever he loves,
 let
 him enjoy the outdoors and sun if that's what he
 likes, takes pictures and video (After I lost
 Cricket,
 his photos helped a lot), and prepare for good-bye. 
 I
 hate telling you this because I never want to give
 up
 hope.  I'm as tenacious as they come.  But if your
 vet
 did test for reticulocytes and there are none, then
 there are studies to prove the graveness of the
 situation.  And I want you to be able to make the
 most
 of it instead of looking back and wishing you'd done
 this or that.  The only real hope is if the vet
 missed
 the reticulocytes and the anemia is actually
 regenerative; then the Epogen is important is
 helping
 to stimulate need RBC's.  I pray this is the case
 for
 Monkee.  Make sure your vet tested for these; I'm
 sure
 she did if she's saying Monkee is not making any
 RBC's.  You can ask how she came to that conclusion
 and see if she mentions RBC's.  
 
 Prayers going out for reticulocytes and that Monkee
 is
 comfortable.  Prayers also going out for peace for
 you
 and your mom.  Please keep us posted on sweet
 Monkee.
 :)
 Wendy
 
 Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful
 committed citizens can change the world - indeed it
 is the only thing that ever has! ~~~ Margaret
 Meade ~~~
 
 
 
  


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Re: Anemia Issues

  Epogen takes anywhere from 2 to three weeks to work and they can and 
usually do go lower in the meantime.  Bailey's HCT went from 20% to 15% 
while we waited for the epogen to kick in it took a little over 2 weeks, 
and after it started working, within 5 weeks or so he was normal again.


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

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BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.com

Re: Anemia Issues

  That is *not her decision* and I would NEVER see a vet that would set 
limits on how far she will go to help *my* furkid


She also said that morally, with FeLV cats, she will do 2 blood 
transfusions, and then that is it.  It is fighting a losing battle and 
that is as far as she will take it.


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
http://HostDesign4U.com



BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.com

Re: Anemia Issues

Gee I wonder why, cats are very smart and sensitive and something tells 
me Monkee knosw this vet doesn't really care for cats (positive or 
otherwise).


A funny story about this visit: Monkee totally perked up as soon as we 
left Dr. Daley�s (*he hates it there!*). 


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
http://HostDesign4U.com



BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.com

Re: Anemia Issues

  This is flat NOT true, when Bailey became anemic we did beat that, it 
was the cancer we couldn't find that killed him, his HCT was normal for 
the rest of his life once we started the epogen (5 months), it was at 
33%.  he was still getting epo but his dose was tapered down to once a 
week and could probably been tapered down even to once every 2 weeks.


Meaning, once it�s started, all you can do is buy more time via blood 
transfusions because it is a losing battle.  *I wanted to know what 
people on this list serve thought about that?*  I know I need to work 
on my �denial�- this is my first and only FeLV cat, so it�s all new.  
But this just seemed like such a troubling response?


--

Belinda
happiness is being owned by cats ...

Be-Mi-Kitties
http://bemikitties.com

Post Adoptable FeLV/FIV/FIP Cats/Kittens
http://adopt.bemikitties.com

FeLV Candlelight Service
http://bemikitties.com/cls

HostDesign4U.com [affordable hosting  web design]
http://HostDesign4U.com



BMK Designs [non-profit animals websites]
http://bmk.bemikitties.com

Re: Anemia Issues