Re: VO threw a bluetooth speaker

[Chris Moore]

Hello,
This is doable without the audio/midi setup utility.  When you connect the 
bluetooth speaker, all sound will be routed thru it.  You can reset this in the 
sounds submenu for your BT device to route all sound to the mac speakers.  Now 
VO should be coming through the mac.  The go to the sounds category in the VO 
utility and use the pop-up to select your BT speaker.  You should now hear VO 
from your BT speaker and all other sound from your mac.

I can provide additional instructions if necessary.
Chris
> On Sep 2, 2016, at 8:41 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> I believe he’s wanting to do this from the Mac which he can do now using midi 
> audio setup in the utilities section, I think it’s called audio midI and 
> gives you fine control over the audio including the sampling rate, filter bit 
> depth and type, and sources and their mappings.  This would be a place to set 
> up the mappings you need.
> 
> Hope that helps.
> 
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 3:01 AM, christopher hallsworth  
>> wrote:
>> 
>> Correct. VoiceOver is going to have multiple audio sources support in iOS10 
>> and, for your reference, tvOS 10.
>> 
>> On 2 Sep 2016, at 04:12, David Chittenden  wrote:
>>> 
>>> 
>>> According to info I have read, this will be possible in iOS 10.
>>> 
>>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On 2 Sep 2016, at 15:01, Agent086b  wrote:
 
 Hi,
 Hi,
 if I have asked this before I have forgotten the answer. Can I have VO 
 through a bluetooth speaker and music through the Mac ones? I would like 
 to play music through the house but not have VO through the house at the 
 same time. 
 Thanks for any help.
 Max.
 
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[E.T.]

   No. Life is a bowl of cherries.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 4:14 PM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

Life is like a box of chocolates.

 Shit melts everywhere in the sun!

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 10:34 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

What's really important is that I phone home and am saved. The loss of a 
headphone jack is a non-issue for me because I will continue to use it. I am 
not bloody well needing to buy a 7. So even though I am hearing impaired and 
need the jack, I also know once the 7 has been released, there will be 
solutions, either from Apple or aftermarket. So I truly fail to understand the 
the flap. Maybe I see a conspiracy here but this sure got some people royally 
worked up. And its not even full moon, just new moon.

Now I am going to call home and get some eats. And peace.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 3:17 PM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

ET,

 It's ok for you,
You can just phone home and get the other ETs and Elliott to come get you, 
these guys wont be able to hear the phone ringing!

 I love people telling me I need to be saved because the world is going to end.

 If it's going to end, why save me?

 Sorry shouldn't laugh, it's possibly a really important issue


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 2:13 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on
the iPhone seven

The end is coming, the end is coming! Ever see those signs people carry 
around? And everyone who comes to my door tell me the same thing and they want 
to let me know what to do. Really? Why is it that people cannot stay focused on 
the here and now and get the most out of life right now? When I start talking 
sense to these door knockers, they run like hell.

All this talk about the future is madness. Don't yall have a life?

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 1:42 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

Hi Folks,
 Just going to add a thought in here.

 Any one thought about the future and what's going to happen in it?

 If everyones getting upset because apple have made the first move
towards getting rid of the headphone jack in devices then what the
hell is going to happen next,

Well if this feedback we're reading is anything to go by the world for blind 
people will end!

 Remember things change for the good and the bad in life,

 But what ever happens the majority of people work on and get over the bridges 
that spring up in front of us.

Till now I prefer headphones with the 3.5 mil jack as they're small
and easy to put in a pocket to carry around,

If I have to put an adaptor in my pocket or bag or what ever then I'm going to 
have to do it.

 But lets face it we don't really know what apple will do till they do it  and 
they may have a really genius idea as a replacement for the headphones we've 
had up till now.

 Which I have to admit I have about 6 pair never used sitting in a box of 
extras  so at least at this point I've got spares for my notebook and ipad till 
they change also.

And they could change things again yet to USB C

Just thinking out of the box,

 Try thinking about now and not about tomorrow, you might not make it, no one 
can actually tell.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:06 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on
the iPhone seven

Adding one tiny bit of gear to carry around is going to be a
giant issue? Good grief. I wonder how much impact that will have on
me when I lug around 15-20 pounds of gear on a regular basis. This
little adapter just might be the straw that breaks my back. (smiles)

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/1/2016 6:08 AM, Kimber Gardner wrote:

You're sort of missing the point, I think. The point being that most
people (me included) don't think they should have to carry extra
bits around to do something as basic as plug in a set of earphones.

On 9/1/16, Saqib Hussain  wrote:

Hi. I use Bluetooth stereo headphones so this new revelation
doesn’t effect me. I wouldn’t even carry an adaptor around with me
because I’m not one for carrying extra bits around just to
accomplish a simple task like wanting to plug your headphones in.

On 31 Aug 2016, at 13:29, Michael Marshall

wrote:

hey 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

Oh it probably will come. Frankly, I'm not in that much of a rush. As I said, I 
haven't seen the killer use case that would make me go out and spend a few 
hundred more bucks. But when the next one comes out, I hope to find a detailed 
review somewhere with a slant towards what is accessible, which is hopefully 
most things if not all.
Mary
 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 4:12 PM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> Hi Mary,
> 
> 
> Like anything it will take time to get everything to work as one with good 
> battery life.
> 
> But it will come.
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
> Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 4:59 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
> iPhone seven
> 
> I saw the rumors about the LTE coming to the watch. Then subsequently, there 
> were other ones saying it wasn't going to happen because of the battery draw. 
> They're adding a GPS. That will use the larger battery that is supposedly 
> also coming. But not enough juice for both the GPS and the radio according to 
> the rumors. Rumors, rumors, rumors.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 9:27 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> Mary, there are some watches now that have this feature that simon speaks 
>> of.  You’re exactly right a radio would need to be included.  For the watch, 
>> not necessarily full LTE but HSPA+ or something may do the trick.  The 
>> Samsung Gear had a 3G radio included and I’m not sure what’s in the Gear S2. 
>>  With a Samsung you could run the watch totally separate from the phone.
>>   I personally think this is an over rated feature unless you’re like simon 
>> and want a watch only for a phone and no other device.  I like the larger 
>> devices so would always use my phone near my watch so all I care about is a 
>> good bluetooth and WiFi stack on the watch.  I’d like to see the 5 GHZ band 
>> added to the watch and the ability to set the WiFi settings separately with 
>> advanced features.  There were rumblings of adding a full cell feature to 
>> the apple watch but I don’t know if that was included in the upcoming 
>> release.
>> 
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 11:04 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Simon,
>>> What good is a Sim card slot if you don't have an LTE radio in the watch? 
>>> According to all the rumors, and of course they are just that, there's not 
>>> going to be an LTE radio in the next watch.
>>> Mary
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:53 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
 
 I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to 
 set it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.
 
 I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use 
 the watch as an independent device without the phone. 
 Or even you get both options.
 
 -Original Message-
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher 
 hallsworth
 Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
 iPhone seven
 
 Hi Mary
 
 I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 
 will have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn 
 a setting off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done 
 this, and the watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for 
 example and the watch will not go off. The setting can be found under 
 general > wake screen.
> On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or 
> at least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps 
> the next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my 
> reluctance on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the 
> few people who still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices 
> that go off at the most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at 
> Cetera. With the new 2.0, will be getting the ability to have the 
> vibrating feedback to tell the time. So that is a step in the right 
> direction. I guess I just haven't seen the killer use case yet.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now. 
>>  It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
>> watch or be able to walk away from your phone and 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Phil Halton]

Maybe Scott but I'm not the one calling people trolls and other fun little 
insulting names. I'm just recognizing your crappy behavior towards other people.

Sent from my IPhone


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 3:09 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Any time Phil I’m happy to back up any way you wish what I say.
> 
> You’ve been an equal coward for  years hiding behind your keyboard so I call 
> your BS.
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:42 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
>> 
>> David,
>> I have noticed that the person in question often speaks with the bravery 
>> that comes from being out of arms reach of those he so freely insults.
>> Not a very appealing character trait.
>> 
>> Sent from my IPhone
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll because 
>>> I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I am not at 
>>> all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply to Jonathon.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf 
>>> users.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> David Griffith
>>> 
>>> 
 On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
 
 Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just 
 nutty.  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and 
 mighty Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so 
 you have your precious 1960s technology.
  
 
 In the end, probably 3 people are going to care   about this issue 
 over all and all 3 are on this list.:)
 
 The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long 
 as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.
 
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
> 
> Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to 
> give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up 
> advocating for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with 
> efficiency and privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that 
> this need has been met, then it will in part be due to courageous people 
> like you who have spoken up.
> Jonathan Mosen
> Mosen Consulting
> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
> http://Mosen.org
> 
>> On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith  wrote:
>> 
>> As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink 
>> you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain 
>> on this list about how a wired headset was essential for me but was 
>> accused bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple 
>> innovation.
>> This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some 
>> people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing 
>>   impairments.
>> 
>> David Griffith
>> 
>>> On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
>>> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in 
>>> the same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and 
>>> require decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected 
>>> are such a minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am 
>>> considering my legal options under legislation here.
>>> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a 
>>> blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth 
>>> solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has 
>>> finished their call or isn't listening to music, the technology goes 
>>> into standby and uses very little energy. A blind person has VO talking 
>>> a lot of the time if they're using their device for tasks like reading 
>>> and creating documents, email etc, so the impact is much greater.
>>> Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of their 
>>> phone with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the adapter will 
>>> not solve the problem entirely if it means that you can't charge your 
>>> device and use headphones at the same time. I travel long distances for 
>>> example, often with flights over 12 hours long. I regularly take my 
>>> Anka battery with me and charge the phone while I use it to compensate 
>>> for the inaccessible in-flight entertainment system. It's important to 
>>> me to have a full charge when I reach my destination. Based on the 
>>> information we have, it looks like you can either listen to wired 
>>> headphones or charge, not both.
>>> That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option appears 
>>> to have to choose between privacy and charge.
>>> Jonathan 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Phil Halton]

Point well taken.


Sent from my IPhone


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:50 PM, E.T.  wrote:
> 
>   There comes a point at which we can keep the fires raging, or let them die 
> out. This might be that point, eh? Its too easy to keep taking potshots at 
> one another, much harder to pull back and let things cool off.
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  Are We Alone in the Universe?
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 9/2/2016 11:42 AM, Phil Halton wrote:
>> David,
>> I have noticed that the person in question often speaks with the bravery
>> that comes from being out of arms reach of those he so freely insults.
>> Not a very appealing character trait.
>> 
>> Sent from my IPhone
>> 
>> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith > > wrote:
>> 
>>> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll
>>> because I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so
>>> I am not at all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this
>>> reply to Jonathon.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf
>>> users.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> David Griffith
>>> 
 On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
 
 Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just
 nutty.  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great
 and mighty Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to
 exist so you have your precious 1960s technology.
 
 
 In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over
 all and all 3 are on this list.:)
 
 The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as
 long as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.
 
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen  > wrote:
> 
> Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an
> issue to give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must
> never give up advocating for recognition of our need to be able to
> use our devices with efficiency and privacy while also charging
> them. If it turns out that this need has been met, then it will in
> part be due to courageous people like you who have spoken up.
> Jonathan Mosen
> Mosen Consulting
> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
> http://Mosen.org 
> 
>> On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith > > wrote:
>> 
>> As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I
>> htink you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried
>> to explain on this list about how a wired headset was essential for
>> me but was accused bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to
>> criticise an Apple innovation.
>> This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically
>> some people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing
>> impairments.
>> 
>> David Griffith
>> 
>>> On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
>>> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf
>>> community in the same way as it affects blind people who wear
>>> hearing aids and require decent latency. And the fact that those
>>> of us who are affected are such a minority makes us more
>>> vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my legal options
>>> under legislation here.
>>> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less
>>> than a blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a
>>> Bluetooth solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid
>>> wearer has finished their call or isn't listening to music, the
>>> technology goes into standby and uses very little energy. A blind
>>> person has VO talking a lot of the time if they're using their
>>> device for tasks like reading and creating documents, email etc,
>>> so the impact is much greater.
>>> Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of
>>> their phone with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the
>>> adapter will not solve the problem entirely if it means that you
>>> can't charge your device and use headphones at the same time. I
>>> travel long distances for example, often with flights over 12
>>> hours long. I regularly take my Anka battery with me and charge
>>> the phone while I use it to compensate for the inaccessible
>>> in-flight entertainment system. It's important to me to have a
>>> full charge when I reach my destination. Based on the information
>>> we have, it looks like you can either listen to wired headphones
>>> or charge, not both.
>>> That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option
>>> appears to have to 

DAISY player

[Chris G]

Hi,
I am just wondering what is a good DAISY player for the Mac?
Thanks,



--
Chris Grabowski
Mystic Access
Where the magic is in learning.
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feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
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RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Life is like a box of chocolates.

 Shit melts everywhere in the sun!

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 10:34 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

What's really important is that I phone home and am saved. The loss of a 
headphone jack is a non-issue for me because I will continue to use it. I am 
not bloody well needing to buy a 7. So even though I am hearing impaired and 
need the jack, I also know once the 7 has been released, there will be 
solutions, either from Apple or aftermarket. So I truly fail to understand the 
the flap. Maybe I see a conspiracy here but this sure got some people royally 
worked up. And its not even full moon, just new moon.

Now I am going to call home and get some eats. And peace.

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 3:17 PM, Simon Fogarty wrote:
> ET,
>
>  It's ok for you,
> You can just phone home and get the other ETs and Elliott to come get you, 
> these guys wont be able to hear the phone ringing!
>
>  I love people telling me I need to be saved because the world is going to 
> end.
>
>  If it's going to end, why save me?
>
>  Sorry shouldn't laugh, it's possibly a really important issue
>
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of E.T.
> Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 2:13 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on 
> the iPhone seven
>
> The end is coming, the end is coming! Ever see those signs people carry 
> around? And everyone who comes to my door tell me the same thing and they 
> want to let me know what to do. Really? Why is it that people cannot stay 
> focused on the here and now and get the most out of life right now? When I 
> start talking sense to these door knockers, they run like hell.
>
> All this talk about the future is madness. Don't yall have a life?
>
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>Are We Alone in the Universe?
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>
> On 9/2/2016 1:42 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:
>> Hi Folks,
>>  Just going to add a thought in here.
>>
>>  Any one thought about the future and what's going to happen in it?
>>
>>  If everyones getting upset because apple have made the first move 
>> towards getting rid of the headphone jack in devices then what the 
>> hell is going to happen next,
>>
>> Well if this feedback we're reading is anything to go by the world for blind 
>> people will end!
>>
>>  Remember things change for the good and the bad in life,
>>
>>  But what ever happens the majority of people work on and get over the 
>> bridges that spring up in front of us.
>>
>> Till now I prefer headphones with the 3.5 mil jack as they're small 
>> and easy to put in a pocket to carry around,
>>
>> If I have to put an adaptor in my pocket or bag or what ever then I'm going 
>> to have to do it.
>>
>>  But lets face it we don't really know what apple will do till they do it  
>> and they may have a really genius idea as a replacement for the headphones 
>> we've had up till now.
>>
>>  Which I have to admit I have about 6 pair never used sitting in a box of 
>> extras  so at least at this point I've got spares for my notebook and ipad 
>> till they change also.
>>
>> And they could change things again yet to USB C
>>
>> Just thinking out of the box,
>>
>>  Try thinking about now and not about tomorrow, you might not make it, no 
>> one can actually tell.
>>
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of E.T.
>> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:06 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on 
>> the iPhone seven
>>
>> Adding one tiny bit of gear to carry around is going to be a 
>> giant issue? Good grief. I wonder how much impact that will have on 
>> me when I lug around 15-20 pounds of gear on a regular basis. This 
>> little adapter just might be the straw that breaks my back. (smiles)
>>
>>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>>Are We Alone in the Universe?
>> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>>
>> On 9/1/2016 6:08 AM, Kimber Gardner wrote:
>>> You're sort of missing the point, I think. The point being that most 
>>> people (me included) don't think they should have to carry extra 
>>> bits around to do something as basic as plug in a set of earphones.
>>>
>>> On 9/1/16, Saqib Hussain  wrote:
 Hi. I use Bluetooth stereo headphones so this new revelation 
 doesn’t effect me. I wouldn’t even carry an adaptor around with me 
 because I’m not one for carrying extra bits around just to 
 accomplish a simple task like wanting to plug your 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Mary,


Like anything it will take time to get everything to work as one with good 
battery life.

 But it will come.
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 4:59 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

I saw the rumors about the LTE coming to the watch. Then subsequently, there 
were other ones saying it wasn't going to happen because of the battery draw. 
They're adding a GPS. That will use the larger battery that is supposedly also 
coming. But not enough juice for both the GPS and the radio according to the 
rumors. Rumors, rumors, rumors.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 9:27 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Mary, there are some watches now that have this feature that simon speaks of. 
>  You’re exactly right a radio would need to be included.  For the watch, not 
> necessarily full LTE but HSPA+ or something may do the trick.  The Samsung 
> Gear had a 3G radio included and I’m not sure what’s in the Gear S2.  With a 
> Samsung you could run the watch totally separate from the phone.
>I personally think this is an over rated feature unless you’re like simon 
> and want a watch only for a phone and no other device.  I like the larger 
> devices so would always use my phone near my watch so all I care about is a 
> good bluetooth and WiFi stack on the watch.  I’d like to see the 5 GHZ band 
> added to the watch and the ability to set the WiFi settings separately with 
> advanced features.  There were rumblings of adding a full cell feature to the 
> apple watch but I don’t know if that was included in the upcoming release.
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 11:04 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Simon,
>> What good is a Sim card slot if you don't have an LTE radio in the watch? 
>> According to all the rumors, and of course they are just that, there's not 
>> going to be an LTE radio in the next watch.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:53 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to 
>>> set it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.
>>> 
>>> I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use 
>>> the watch as an independent device without the phone. 
>>> Or even you get both options.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
>>> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
>>> iPhone seven
>>> 
>>> Hi Mary
>>> 
>>> I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 
>>> will have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn a 
>>> setting off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done 
>>> this, and the watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for 
>>> example and the watch will not go off. The setting can be found under 
>>> general > wake screen.
 On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
 
 I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or 
 at least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps 
 the next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my 
 reluctance on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the 
 few people who still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices 
 that go off at the most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at 
 Cetera. With the new 2.0, will be getting the ability to have the 
 vibrating feedback to tell the time. So that is a step in the right 
 direction. I guess I just haven't seen the killer use case yet.
 Mary
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now.  
> It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
> watch or be able to walk away from your phone and just access quick data 
> nicely on your wrist.  For sited users, being able to glance down say 
> while driving even or in various settings where you don’t want to break 
> your focus for a full look at your phone.
> Another nice set of features are the health features.  Even a gentle tap 
> on the wrist to just stand up and move around and stretch hourly or 
> motivation to meet your workout goals.
> You can quick respond again from your wrist to messages or take a quick 
> call.  It’s hard to explain.  Also, the Apple watch is more 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[E.T.]

   What's really important is that I phone home and am saved. The loss 
of a headphone jack is a non-issue for me because I will continue to use 
it. I am not bloody well needing to buy a 7. So even though I am hearing 
impaired and need the jack, I also know once the 7 has been released, 
there will be solutions, either from Apple or aftermarket. So I truly 
fail to understand the the flap. Maybe I see a conspiracy here but this 
sure got some people royally worked up. And its not even full moon, just 
new moon.


   Now I am going to call home and get some eats. And peace.

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 3:17 PM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

ET,

 It's ok for you,
You can just phone home and get the other ETs and Elliott to come get you, 
these guys wont be able to hear the phone ringing!

 I love people telling me I need to be saved because the world is going to end.

 If it's going to end, why save me?

 Sorry shouldn't laugh, it's possibly a really important issue


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 2:13 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

The end is coming, the end is coming! Ever see those signs people carry 
around? And everyone who comes to my door tell me the same thing and they want 
to let me know what to do. Really? Why is it that people cannot stay focused on 
the here and now and get the most out of life right now? When I start talking 
sense to these door knockers, they run like hell.

All this talk about the future is madness. Don't yall have a life?

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 1:42 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

Hi Folks,
 Just going to add a thought in here.

 Any one thought about the future and what's going to happen in it?

 If everyones getting upset because apple have made the first move
towards getting rid of the headphone jack in devices then what the
hell is going to happen next,

Well if this feedback we're reading is anything to go by the world for blind 
people will end!

 Remember things change for the good and the bad in life,

 But what ever happens the majority of people work on and get over the bridges 
that spring up in front of us.

Till now I prefer headphones with the 3.5 mil jack as they're small
and easy to put in a pocket to carry around,

If I have to put an adaptor in my pocket or bag or what ever then I'm going to 
have to do it.

 But lets face it we don't really know what apple will do till they do it  and 
they may have a really genius idea as a replacement for the headphones we've 
had up till now.

 Which I have to admit I have about 6 pair never used sitting in a box of 
extras  so at least at this point I've got spares for my notebook and ipad till 
they change also.

And they could change things again yet to USB C

Just thinking out of the box,

 Try thinking about now and not about tomorrow, you might not make it, no one 
can actually tell.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:06 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on
the iPhone seven

Adding one tiny bit of gear to carry around is going to be a giant
issue? Good grief. I wonder how much impact that will have on me when
I lug around 15-20 pounds of gear on a regular basis. This little
adapter just might be the straw that breaks my back. (smiles)

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/1/2016 6:08 AM, Kimber Gardner wrote:

You're sort of missing the point, I think. The point being that most
people (me included) don't think they should have to carry extra bits
around to do something as basic as plug in a set of earphones.

On 9/1/16, Saqib Hussain  wrote:

Hi. I use Bluetooth stereo headphones so this new revelation doesn’t
effect me. I wouldn’t even carry an adaptor around with me because
I’m not one for carrying extra bits around just to accomplish a
simple task like wanting to plug your headphones in.

On 31 Aug 2016, at 13:29, Michael Marshall

wrote:

hey all,
I know there have been many leaks of supposed schematics and things
on the new iPhone seven and if or not it will have a 3.5mm jack.
The latest leak I believe has credence.
In the box with the iPhone seven, you will get a lightning to 3.5
mm adapter witch is what i guessed apple would do if they did take
the jack from the phone.
If this is indeed the case I am quite satisfied because at least
they have made an adapter readily available.

Michael

To post messages to this 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Mary,

 Most likely but I'm still allowed to dream,

 It will come out with time once they shrink the devices they need to make it 
happen.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 3:04 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

 Simon,
What good is a Sim card slot if you don't have an LTE radio in the watch? 
According to all the rumors, and of course they are just that, there's not 
going to be an LTE radio in the next watch.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:53 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to 
> set it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.
> 
> I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use the 
> watch as an independent device without the phone. 
> Or even you get both options.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
> iPhone seven
> 
> Hi Mary
> 
> I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 will 
> have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn a 
> setting off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done 
> this, and the watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for 
> example and the watch will not go off. The setting can be found under general 
> > wake screen.
>> On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or at 
>> least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps the 
>> next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my reluctance 
>> on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the few people who 
>> still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices that go off at 
>> the most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at Cetera. With the new 
>> 2.0, will be getting the ability to have the vibrating feedback to tell the 
>> time. So that is a step in the right direction. I guess I just haven't seen 
>> the killer use case yet.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now.  
>>> It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
>>> watch or be able to walk away from your phone and just access quick data 
>>> nicely on your wrist.  For sited users, being able to glance down say while 
>>> driving even or in various settings where you don’t want to break your 
>>> focus for a full look at your phone.
>>>  Another nice set of features are the health features.  Even a gentle tap 
>>> on the wrist to just stand up and move around and stretch hourly or 
>>> motivation to meet your workout goals.
>>>  You can quick respond again from your wrist to messages or take a quick 
>>> call.  It’s hard to explain.  Also, the Apple watch is more independent 
>>> than people think.  Since version 2.1 I believe it was given WiFi functions 
>>> so it can join your home network or other WiFi networks with some caveats 
>>> and work independently from the phone including placing and receiving calls 
>>> if your carrier supports WiFi calling which my carrier does fully.  
>>>  To be clear, I was with you and then I got one as a gift and now I don’t 
>>> know what I’d do with out it and I’m dead excited to see watch 2.0 next 
>>> week.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sep 1, 2016, at 10:01 AM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
 
 I've never really understood the point of the Apple watch, sure it can run 
 apps, but so what, my phone does that, and the watch requires a phone 
 connection to do most things anyway, totally redundant.
 Original message:
> Hello Mary,
 
> My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
> active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have 
> alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that 
> companies pay attention.
 
> Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically 
> ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, 
> I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better will 
> make it so.
 
> I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it would 
> change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my world 
> hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.

RE: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Kristeen 

Yeah I've got a bose Bluetooth stereo headset that I use when I want to cut 
myself off from the world and chill out.it doesn't have a dongle just connects 
to what ever the BT source is.

 I have it paired by default to my iPad and iPhone as it allows for 2 devices 
but it does connect to my mac book air as well
Only problem is they are costly mine took me for about 400 NZ dollars,

Hope that helps.

Simon f

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Kristeen Hughes
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 2:32 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a dongle. 
When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting out of VO 
while doing anything involving transferring files over the network or dropbox.

Thanks.

Kristeen

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RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

ET,

 It's ok for you, 
You can just phone home and get the other ETs and Elliott to come get you, 
these guys wont be able to hear the phone ringing!

 I love people telling me I need to be saved because the world is going to end.

 If it's going to end, why save me?

 Sorry shouldn't laugh, it's possibly a really important issue 


-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 2:13 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

The end is coming, the end is coming! Ever see those signs people carry 
around? And everyone who comes to my door tell me the same thing and they want 
to let me know what to do. Really? Why is it that people cannot stay focused on 
the here and now and get the most out of life right now? When I start talking 
sense to these door knockers, they run like hell.

All this talk about the future is madness. Don't yall have a life?

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 1:42 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:
> Hi Folks,
>  Just going to add a thought in here.
>
>  Any one thought about the future and what's going to happen in it?
>
>  If everyones getting upset because apple have made the first move 
> towards getting rid of the headphone jack in devices then what the 
> hell is going to happen next,
>
> Well if this feedback we're reading is anything to go by the world for blind 
> people will end!
>
>  Remember things change for the good and the bad in life,
>
>  But what ever happens the majority of people work on and get over the 
> bridges that spring up in front of us.
>
> Till now I prefer headphones with the 3.5 mil jack as they're small 
> and easy to put in a pocket to carry around,
>
> If I have to put an adaptor in my pocket or bag or what ever then I'm going 
> to have to do it.
>
>  But lets face it we don't really know what apple will do till they do it  
> and they may have a really genius idea as a replacement for the headphones 
> we've had up till now.
>
>  Which I have to admit I have about 6 pair never used sitting in a box of 
> extras  so at least at this point I've got spares for my notebook and ipad 
> till they change also.
>
> And they could change things again yet to USB C
>
> Just thinking out of the box,
>
>  Try thinking about now and not about tomorrow, you might not make it, no one 
> can actually tell.
>
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of E.T.
> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:06 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on 
> the iPhone seven
>
> Adding one tiny bit of gear to carry around is going to be a giant 
> issue? Good grief. I wonder how much impact that will have on me when 
> I lug around 15-20 pounds of gear on a regular basis. This little 
> adapter just might be the straw that breaks my back. (smiles)
>
>  From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>Are We Alone in the Universe?
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
>
> On 9/1/2016 6:08 AM, Kimber Gardner wrote:
>> You're sort of missing the point, I think. The point being that most 
>> people (me included) don't think they should have to carry extra bits 
>> around to do something as basic as plug in a set of earphones.
>>
>> On 9/1/16, Saqib Hussain  wrote:
>>> Hi. I use Bluetooth stereo headphones so this new revelation doesn’t 
>>> effect me. I wouldn’t even carry an adaptor around with me because 
>>> I’m not one for carrying extra bits around just to accomplish a 
>>> simple task like wanting to plug your headphones in.
 On 31 Aug 2016, at 13:29, Michael Marshall 
 
 wrote:

 hey all,
 I know there have been many leaks of supposed schematics and things 
 on the new iPhone seven and if or not it will have a 3.5mm jack.
 The latest leak I believe has credence.
 In the box with the iPhone seven, you will get a lightning to 3.5 
 mm adapter witch is what i guessed apple would do if they did take 
 the jack from the phone.
 If this is indeed the case I am quite satisfied because at least 
 they have made an adapter readily available.

 Michael

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RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

There are lights?

Awesome!

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 12:35 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just nutty.  
You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and mighty 
Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so you have 
your precious 1960s technology.


In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over all and 
all 3 are on this list.:)

The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long as 
when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.


On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen 
> wrote:

Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to give 
up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up advocating 
for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with efficiency and 
privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that this need has been met, 
then it will in part be due to courageous people like you who have spoken up.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith 
> wrote:

As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink you 
will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain on this list 
about how a wired headset was essential for me but was accused bizarrely of 
being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple innovation.
This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some people 
are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing impairments.

David Griffith

On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:

Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in the same 
way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and require decent 
latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected are such a minority 
makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my legal options 
under legislation here.
A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a blind 
person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth solution is being 
used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has finished their call or isn't 
listening to music, the technology goes into standby and uses very little 
energy. A blind person has VO talking a lot of the time if they're using their 
device for tasks like reading and creating documents, email etc, so the impact 
is much greater.
Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of their phone with 
its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the adapter will not solve the 
problem entirely if it means that you can't charge your device and use 
headphones at the same time. I travel long distances for example, often with 
flights over 12 hours long. I regularly take my Anka battery with me and charge 
the phone while I use it to compensate for the inaccessible in-flight 
entertainment system. It's important to me to have a full charge when I reach 
my destination. Based on the information we have, it looks like you can either 
listen to wired headphones or charge, not both.
That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option appears to have 
to choose between privacy and charge.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten 
> wrote:

Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move, if it means 
that they' very large hard of hearing community can't use  hearing aids on 
iPhones anymore. That seems like such an incredibly stupid move on Apple's 
part, that I am tempted to just believe that they wouldn't do it if they didn't 
have a workaround that would work for people who use hearing aids. The hard of 
hearing community is orders of magnitude larger then the blind community. So 
Shirley, this adapter must be providing someway for people who use hearing aids 
to keep on doing so. What am I missing here? I remember sometime ago, when the 
idea that the headphone jack would go away first came out, Jonathan wrote a 
very impassioned piece on this subject, arguing that this was a very bad idea 
because of the use case of hearing aids. Now Apple is going to do it anyway, 
but they're offering an adapter. Why doesn't that solve the problem? I 
understand why Bluetooth is not a good alternative, given Jonathan's comments 
on battery drain and the well-known problem for voiceover users with latency. 
It's still really bad, at least on my phone 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Scott and others,

 As I've said I'm not a hearing impaired / aid user and I appreciate things 
must be more difficult for you guys and girls in that area.

 However this is going to be a new device and can you tell me that when the 
first iPhones came out that they catered for you guys first off with your 
requirements?

I can understand that hey a new device should contain these required functions 
brought forward from the older device 
But in life to go forward you often have to go backwards first.

 I would think that apple or should I say I hope apple are now looking at this 
going shit, we've got a group of users now missing out.

 Less we forget all good things take time

Apple have been very good with providing accessibility in their products and 
I'd be very surprised if they weren't now trying to correct this oversight.

 But you still have options with the older devices still allowing for your 
requirements  
But lets face it I'm more interested in the next phone than the release next 
week, 
 They will correct and add features to what comes out in 2017.

sf
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Davert
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 12:33 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Hello all. I'm going to address several messages at once on this thread.
Jonathan: you are 100% correct about the access issue for those of us who wear 
hearing aids and who are blind. Sadly, the market is rarely designed wit our 
needs being considered because, as you say, we're such a small minority. And 
within that minority, how many of us are actively reading online articles and 
tracking tech trends to even push this issue forward? I, too, have utilized my 
contacts at Apple to try and make them aware of this issue. While I doubt we 
will reverse hardware development, perhaps they will at least give our user 
case some consideration and may figure out a way to address it. Without going 
in to detail, it does seem that bluetooth audio in iOS 10 is a bit less laggy, 
but we still have all of the other issues you mentioned concerning battery life 
and so on.
Mike: regarding your question of Android accessibility, since I think it's 
somewhat relevant to this discussion, my issue isn't so much with TalkBack, but 
with BrailleBack. As someone who has taken to primarily accessing my devices 
through braille displays, Android has a long long way to go in terms of giving 
equal access to the operating system.
TalkBack has certainly come a long way, but BrailleBack has not. I have passed 
along numerous bits of feedback to Google on this issue, and all the responses 
are get are things like: then stick with iOS.
Now the standard response seems to be that since BrailleBack is open source, 
Google expects someone else to solve their problems for them.
You can have decent braille access on Android if you wish to shell out a few 
grand for a BrailleNote Touch which is already running an outdated version of 
the OS, but this, too, has many limitations.

Thanks for reading,
Scott

On 9/2/16, Devin Prater  wrote:
> Well, I've gotten rather into Android and Linux a lot lately, although 
> I still use my iPhone for reading email until I can find a mod for my 
> device that'll give me Android 6 or 7, so if Apple does something I 
> don't like, I have options I can turn to.
>
>
> On 09/02/2016 04:06 AM, Portia Scott wrote:
>> Yes, it will be interesting to see, For me as well. I am not one of 
>> those who buy the latest and greatest Devices right away anymore, 
>> either. LOL. I used to be, but I have grown a lot, and learned not to 
>> be like that anymore. As people say, only time will tell what happens.
>>
>> Take care, and have a wonderful day.
>>
>> Portia.
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:22 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>>
>>> I will be interested to see the headphones they have with the new 
>>> phones when they are released.
>>>
>>> I use my current ones for pretty much everything when I'm out and 
>>> about including using my MBA so people don't hear it talking or so I 
>>> can  hear things with out the surrounding noises
>>>
>>> If these new phones are some new form of BT then I'll be happy if 
>>> they can connect to multiple devices such as my iPhone iPad and MBA.
>>> Oh and my watch.
>>>
>>> Cheers.
>>>
>>>
>>> Simon F
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Robin
>>> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 12:59 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on 
>>> the iPhone seven
>>>
>>> I Agree
>>> With YourAssessment
>>>
>>> TimeWillTell
>>>
>>> If TheRemoval of the iPhone's HeadSet Jack deters Users from 
>>> PurchasingIt
>>>
>>> Exluding the Normal AppleFan
>>>

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

And that’s what she said!


From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 12:31 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Um, money has nothing to do with this.

What’s the real factors are size / thickness and durability.  You can seal up 
that lightning port against water and damage easily and it’s a thinner package 
than a headphone jack so you can shave a millimeter or 2 from the thickness 
which really is a big deal.  You could also almost grow the case on to the 
phone making it super durable with no joints.


On Sep 1, 2016, at 10:28 PM, Michael Marshall 
> wrote:

There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was reversed.
The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen 
> wrote:

I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a huge 
negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope the 
inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this and 
reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New Zealand. I'm 
the only blind person there, and people are justifiably livid about the removal 
of the headphone jack. Most people don't want this, and I suspect based on what 
has leaked that the benefits to most people of upgrading will be so incremental 
that the lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, because one 
thing that this process has taught me since I started blogging about the 
possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm at a time when it may have 
made a difference, is that I was naive to think that blind people might be any 
more sensitive to and respectful of the accessibility needs of others, such as 
the hearing impaired. I guess I would like to think that since we know what 
impact inaccessibility can have on our own lives, we would be sensitive to the 
needs of others, even when the issues didn't affect us directly. But that has 
proven a stupid pipe dream on my part, and I've found the whole thing really 
upsetting. For the most part, it seems like it's everyone for themselves these 
days, and if others are being thrown under the bus, well too damn bad.
As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid wearer, 
i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost all the time I 
use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for someone who moves 
through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were to improve, Bluetooth 
drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and it's difficult to get 
through an entire business day of use without the need to charge something.
And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, selfish, 
stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, which parades 
their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of honour, appears to be 
about to crap all over one segment of its accessibility market.
Something isn't automatically the future because Apple says it is. And they're 
going too far this time, alienating too many people. Perhaps, in time, a 
USB-C-based solution is going to be viable, and receive carefully managed 
industry-wide adoption. But Apple isn't using USB-C on its iDevices. It's using 
a proprietary port that it doesn't even offer on its own personal computers, 
meaning you won't be able to use the Lightning-based Ear Pods even with a Mac. 
That's two sets of headphones you're going to have to carry around with you, 
unless you don't mind having an adapter jutting out of the port you want to 
charge your phone with. Absolutely absurd.
I believe it was Samsung that recently put out a series of ads mocking Apple 
over the potential lack of a headphone jack. They know Apple has given them a 
great gift. I just wish Android accessibility were more viable for daily use. 
Because once my 6s Plus eventually expires, I'm really going to be stuck. 
Hopefully, Apple will have seen sense by then because there is certainly going 
to be a backlash.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

On 1/09/2016, at 6:15 PM, M. Taylor > 
wrote:

Hello Mary,

My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an active 
role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have alternatives and it's 
when we begin to explore these alternatives that companies pay attention.

Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically ridiculous 
decision to unilaterally put albums 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Scott,
The samsungs do use micro USB for charging,

Are you meaning that as a connection media for headphones?

I have a feeling I’ve seen something like that in a phone recently.
Talking about Samsung,

They just recalled all their note 7 devices due to some of them having burst in 
to flames,

  Wonder what apple have got for a magic trick in the iPhone 7?



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 12:29 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Mary, i could be way wrong here but I thought the Samsung S5 at least had a usb 
port where you attached the headphones with an adapter.  I could be remembering 
wrong though.

On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:26 PM, Mary Otten 
> wrote:

Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took away 
the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people complain. They 
took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring that back, despite 
complaint. They do what they want. There is no immediately efficient 
replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has never had one. People have 
complained forever about the fact that it is harder to access the whole file 
system on Apple devices. As Apple change that? No they have not.
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall 
> wrote:
There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was reversed.
The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen 
> wrote:

I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a huge 
negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope the 
inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this and 
reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New Zealand. I'm 
the only blind person there, and people are justifiably livid about the removal 
of the headphone jack. Most people don't want this, and I suspect based on what 
has leaked that the benefits to most people of upgrading will be so incremental 
that the lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, because one 
thing that this process has taught me since I started blogging about the 
possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm at a time when it may have 
made a difference, is that I was naive to think that blind people might be any 
more sensitive to and respectful of the accessibility needs of others, such as 
the hearing impaired. I guess I would like to think that since we know what 
impact inaccessibility can have on our own lives, we would be sensitive to the 
needs of others, even when the issues didn't affect us directly. But that has 
proven a stupid pipe dream on my part, and I've found the whole thing really 
upsetting. For the most part, it seems like it's everyone for themselves these 
days, and if others are being thrown under the bus, well too damn bad.
As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid wearer, 
i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost all the time I 
use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for someone who moves 
through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were to improve, Bluetooth 
drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and it's difficult to get 
through an entire business day of use without the need to charge something.
And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, selfish, 
stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, which parades 
their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of honour, appears to be 
about to crap all over one segment of its accessibility market.
Something isn't automatically the future because Apple says it is. And they're 
going too far this time, alienating too many people. Perhaps, in time, a 
USB-C-based solution is going to be viable, and receive carefully managed 
industry-wide adoption. But Apple isn't using USB-C on its iDevices. It's using 
a proprietary port that it doesn't even offer on its own personal computers, 
meaning you won't be able to use the Lightning-based Ear Pods even with a Mac. 
That's two sets of headphones you're going to have to carry around with you, 
unless you don't mind having an adapter jutting out of the port you want to 
charge your phone with. Absolutely absurd.
I believe it was Samsung that recently put out a series of ads mocking Apple 
over the potential lack of a headphone jack. They know Apple has given them a 
great gift. I just wish Android accessibility were 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Yes and no,

I have a 6s+ 128 gig  retail buy outright here in nz is approx. 1800 dollars.

Now if I asked for 900 for my phone that would be high enough that someone 
would just say  I’ll buy the 64 gig model which in most cases is only a couple 
of hundy more.

Or they get the 6s version of the 7 which wouldn’t be a lot more either.



From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Scott Granados
Sent: Saturday, 3 September 2016 12:27 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

I personally could care less what the memory size is.  All my content is 
streamed so I don’t use much of it other than for application memory.  Whether 
it’s 16, 32, or 256 GB it’s all the same.  The only thing I find is the higher 
memory units have a better resale value.




On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Mary Otten 
> wrote:

Yes. I too would like to be able to plug my eye device into a PC or Mac and 
access that like I could  A thumb drive. I would also like a storage slot, so 
that damned 16 GB model they sell wouldn't be so ridiculously limited. Yes, I 
know they are supposedly upping it to 32, big deal. On the other hand, my 
android device is a nexus, because it gets timely updates, just like apples 
things do. No storage card there either. Nothing is perfect.
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:30 PM, Michael Marshall 
> wrote:
The article I read must' have been gravely misinformed.
I would just like to download files from Safari to my iPhone such as mp3 files.
viewing it as a harddrive like the Android phones.
On 2 Sep. 2016, at 1:26 pm, Mary Otten 
> wrote:

Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took away 
the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people complain. They 
took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring that back, despite 
complaint. They do what they want. There is no immediately efficient 
replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has never had one. People have 
complained forever about the fact that it is harder to access the whole file 
system on Apple devices. As Apple change that? No they have not.
Mary

Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall 
> wrote:
There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was reversed.
The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen 
> wrote:

I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a huge 
negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope the 
inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this and 
reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New Zealand. I'm 
the only blind person there, and people are justifiably livid about the removal 
of the headphone jack. Most people don't want this, and I suspect based on what 
has leaked that the benefits to most people of upgrading will be so incremental 
that the lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, because one 
thing that this process has taught me since I started blogging about the 
possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm at a time when it may have 
made a difference, is that I was naive to think that blind people might be any 
more sensitive to and respectful of the accessibility needs of others, such as 
the hearing impaired. I guess I would like to think that since we know what 
impact inaccessibility can have on our own lives, we would be sensitive to the 
needs of others, even when the issues didn't affect us directly. But that has 
proven a stupid pipe dream on my part, and I've found the whole thing really 
upsetting. For the most part, it seems like it's everyone for themselves these 
days, and if others are being thrown under the bus, well too damn bad.
As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid wearer, 
i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost all the time I 
use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for someone who moves 
through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were to improve, Bluetooth 
drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and it's difficult to get 
through an entire business day of use without the need to charge something.
And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, selfish, 
stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, which parades 
their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of honour, 

Re: Verizon Wireless launches LTE advanced in 461 cities

[Mary Otten]

Saw that. And I looked on the list of cities and lo and behold, Eugene 
Springfield is actually there. Nonetheless, I still have a very bad taste in my 
mouth from recent experience with Verizon. So I'm not going to be changing.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:08 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Posting this here as it impacts every iPhone user.
> 
> Verizon activated carrier aggregation or LTE advanced across it’s network 
> this week.  This feature bonds multiple channels together in to a single fast 
> bundle.  This allows the connection to optimize for indoor or outdoor use, 
> different bands and so forth.  The results are a 50% boost in peek speeds 
> with some readings exceeding 300 megabits when 3 connections are aggregated.
> 
> Read more here
> 
> http://www.verizon.com/about/news/mobile-users-461-cities-today-get-50-percent-faster-peak-speeds-no-extra-cost-introducing#main-content
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
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Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[matthew dyer]

hi,


I have a bluetooth headset for get what is called at the moment. It is 
great for music.  I will try to get the name of it.  I got it at 
microsenter for around $100.  HTH.



Matthew




On 09/02/2016 10:31 AM, Kristeen Hughes wrote:

I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a dongle. 
When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting out of VO 
while doing anything involving transferring files over the network or dropbox.

Thanks.

Kristeen



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list.

If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if you 
feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.

Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara Quinn 
- you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com

The archives for this list can be searched at:
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Jonathan Mosen]

hi David, there is certainly some bullying and personal attack that goes on 
here, but sadly that's the nature of a lot of email lists. People think they 
can drown people out because they have nothing better to do than to post 
multiple messages that become increasingly personal as the flaws in their 
argument are exposed. Personal attack is always the resort of those whose 
argument is weak.
What I will say to you though is that as you can see from the list, there are a 
number of us who have been trying to make a difference, hopefully to fend off a 
situation where we have to wait some time before our use case is addressed. I 
hope very much we've succeeded. If not, we keep going.
It was interesting to read a piece yesterday that backed up something I said on 
my own blog earlier this year. I feel sure that Apple has leaked the 
information about the lack of a headphone jack deliberately. They know it's a 
contentious issue, even among those who don't get their entire screen output 
via it as we do. They're hoping that by letting it leak, the majority of the 
anger will have subsided by release time. After all, it's an unusual situation 
where the thing most people are talking about is actually the removal of 
something, not a great new feature.
Apple do miscalculate from time to time and it's possible they have done so 
this time. Even if that proves not to be the case, Apple must obey the law like 
everyone else, and there is legislation like section 255 of the US 
Telecommunications Act that may make legal action possible if Apple makes 
things less accessible for a vulnerable group of users. Each country also has 
its own legislation.
In the end, what people say on this list makes not a scrap of difference and 
I've been focussing my energies on preparing for what I can do if we as blind 
hearing aid wearers can't use VO and charge our devices at the same time. I 
spoke up because I knew that there would be people here who were intimidated by 
some of the dismissive language, and I'm glad it's made you feel like you have 
people who get your needs.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

> On 3/09/2016, at 6:24 AM, David Griffith  wrote:
> 
> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll because I 
> tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I am not at all 
> surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply to Jonathon.
> 
> 
> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf users.
> 
> 
> David Griffith
> 
> On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
>> Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just nutty. 
>>  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and mighty 
>> Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so you have 
>> your precious 1960s technology.
>>  
>> 
>> In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over all 
>> and all 3 are on this list.:)
>> 
>> The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long 
>> as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to 
>>> give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up 
>>> advocating for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with 
>>> efficiency and privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that this 
>>> need has been met, then it will in part be due to courageous people like 
>>> you who have spoken up.
>>> Jonathan Mosen
>>> Mosen Consulting
>>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>>> http://Mosen.org 
 On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith > wrote:
 
 As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink 
 you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain on 
 this list about how a wired headset was essential for me but was accused 
 bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple 
 innovation.
 This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some 
 people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing impairments.
 
 David Griffith
 
 On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in 
> the same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and require 
> decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected are such a 
> minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my 
> legal options under legislation here.
> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[E.T.]

   The "wait and see" has been suggested for months. During that time, 
the doom and gloom has been rampant. Next week will either bring relief 
and sanity back, or a new wave of madness will ensue. Its a vicious cycle.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 12:50 PM, Mary Otten wrote:

I thought I made it clear, I said if it turns out that the adapter does not 
allow for this use case. If, you know, conditional. We will know in a week. 
Given all the leaks that are coming out, my guess is that the adapter is not 
going to do what is required. But since we don't know yet we have to wait and 
see.

Sent from my iPhone


On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:38 PM, E.T.  wrote:

  How is the minority being adversely affected when the 7 is not even on the 
market?! Seriously, some people are quite nervous about the future if not 
downright frightened. (smiles)

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
 Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com


On 9/2/2016 12:26 PM, Mary Otten wrote:
Hi Scott,
I agree that we don't know what the adapter will do, since it's not out.
However, should it turn out to be the case that the adapter will not
allow for simultaneous headphone usage and charging, this would be a
problem for the use case the Jonathan outlined, would you not agree?
Therefore, I don't see this as a case of arguing over nothing. It is a
case of a minority of users being seriously adversely affected by this
design decision I remember a few iterations of iOS ago, Apple broke the
driver for one of the braille displays it had been supporting. I think
it was a hymns product, but I'm not sure which one. That meant that
folks who have invested a good deal of money in a particular product
which had been working with Apple devices found themselves unable to
access the device if they were dependent on braille. The breakage was
brought to apples attention, and they did nothing about it for months
until the next major release of iOS occurred. Now you could argue that
this was a small subset of users. But the breakage effectively denied
the use of the product to that small subset of users. It seems to me
that one of the things you do when you make a serious commitment to
accessibility is you promise not to break the devices people have
invested in and make it impossible for them to use them as they have
been doing. Earlier this year, when Apple released one of its upgrades
that bricked some iPad pros, they rushed out a fix,  as they should
have.  I often hear it said that blind people complain too much. We got
what we wanted in the form of mainstream excess ability. Now we have to
wait for our bugs to be fixed along with the bugs that everybody else is
waiting to be fixed. I understand that to a point. But when you have a
bug that so adversely affects a group of users, and you say you were
serious about accessibility, then I think that you have to make good on
your commitment. Again, since we don't know what this adapter will do,
we can't say for sure whether Apple has caused a serious problem or not.
But once the adapter is out, if the group of blind users who are also
hard of hearing is seriously adversely affected, it seems to me that
Apple has in fact broken  its commitment.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:08 PM, Scott Granados > wrote:


WTF is an arrogrent?  Is that like a loud Mexican a loud immigrant?
My mother had a bunch of them move in across the street, loud parties
but man the best bbq.


That being said, yes, you were being a troll then and I’m sorry to say
you’re still under the bridge.

You’re all bitching over a product that doesn’t exist yet.  We already
know that an adapter is being provided but that’s not good enough.
We’re all supposed to hold up civilization because you won’t use a
quarter inch piece.  We’re not fighting for civil rights, we’re not
fighting over whether people are being killed in the streets by police
gone mad, we’re fighting over the fact you might have to use a small
plastic piece.  I’m just calling you and Jonathan out for the
ridiculousness of A. bitching about something that’s not out yet and
B. about such a trivial issue .
I respect Jonathan a great deal and will tell him if I disagree with
his positions and in this case I do.  They are well presented but I
think a decent means of access is being provided that doesn’t injure
the deaf blind user community so there’s a non issue. I’m sorry if
that gets your panties in a wad but there it is.  I think his points
were off base but that’s me.  I think Jonathan is a very smart well
spoken and well informed person who can defend himself if he feels the
need.  I realize under the bridge it might be hard to hear down there
but the point is while I vigorously disagree with his points and
assertions I most certainly am not saying he doesn’t have the right to
his opinion and even go so far as to say I 

Verizon Wireless launches LTE advanced in 461 cities

[Scott Granados]

Posting this here as it impacts every iPhone user.

Verizon activated carrier aggregation or LTE advanced across it’s network this 
week.  This feature bonds multiple channels together in to a single fast 
bundle.  This allows the connection to optimize for indoor or outdoor use, 
different bands and so forth.  The results are a 50% boost in peek speeds with 
some readings exceeding 300 megabits when 3 connections are aggregated.

Read more here

http://www.verizon.com/about/news/mobile-users-461-cities-today-get-50-percent-faster-peak-speeds-no-extra-cost-introducing#main-content
 


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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

I think the issue of charging and using the port though is not equivalent to 
the loss of braille access.  Loss of braille access is an all or nothing deal.  
The charging thing is an inconvenience at worst and  at best a product for 
someone to produce to solve the problem.  There are many people who might want 
to use power and this port at the same time.  Think about it, the folks at the 
charging case companies definitely want to see this problem solved.  So there 
are much larger markets who would have concerns here as well as the deaf blind.
Here’s another thing we’re not considering, with no more headphone jack 
there’s no need for an audio stage in the phone any more.  SO you’re no longer 
powering amplifiers and analog convertors, filters, no more digital signal 
processing etc.  You have the speakers of course but you don’t have to drive 
any of that stuff if you’re a deaf user any more.  Lightning all the way out to 
the end means that power is either delivered more efficiently but still powered 
by the phone or powered by an internal source like bluetooth headphones.  So we 
might actually get more battery life with out so much analog.

If it turns out that charging and audio isn’t available and other changes don’t 
offset the impact enough that it impacts the deaf blind then by all means put 
me down as against but I don’t think that’s going to be the case, I don’t think 
this community will be left out in the cold on this one.  

Here’s another thing that folks are leaving out, wireless charging. Macrumors 
has had mention on and off and on again of wireless charging.  You might be 
plugged in to your port and still charging wirelessly, that might also work.

I’m just saying this problem doesn’t require Brave Heart like speeches from 
Jonathan calling the world is going to end because progress is moving on and 
adapters are changing.  Even a few minutes of googling finds products that 
would solve this problem today.:)  It’s just a silly thing to work your self up 
over when the problem doesn’t exist until next week at a minimum, if it does at 
all and it seems to me adapters exist today that allow for power and  audio or 
did all the sound docks in the world suddenly just stop working?

This just sounds like a non problem or one that’s solved week 1.

And regardless of the rhetoric, no I do not want to see any part of our 
community cut off.


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 3:26 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Hi Scott,
> I agree that we don't know what the adapter will do, since it's not out. 
> However, should it turn out to be the case that the adapter will not allow 
> for simultaneous headphone usage and charging, this would be a problem for 
> the use case the Jonathan outlined, would you not agree? Therefore, I don't 
> see this as a case of arguing over nothing. It is a case of a minority of 
> users being seriously adversely affected by this design decision I remember a 
> few iterations of iOS ago, Apple broke the driver for one of the braille 
> displays it had been supporting. I think it was a hymns product, but I'm not 
> sure which one. That meant that folks who have invested a good deal of money 
> in a particular product which had been working with Apple devices found 
> themselves unable to access the device if they were dependent on braille. The 
> breakage was brought to apples attention, and they did nothing about it for 
> months until the next major release of iOS occurred. Now you could argue that 
> this was a small subset of users. But the breakage effectively denied the use 
> of the product to that small subset of users. It seems to me that one of the 
> things you do when you make a serious commitment to accessibility is you 
> promise not to break the devices people have invested in and make it 
> impossible for them to use them as they have been doing. Earlier this year, 
> when Apple released one of its upgrades that bricked some iPad pros, they 
> rushed out a fix,  as they should have.  I often hear it said that blind 
> people complain too much. We got what we wanted in the form of mainstream 
> excess ability. Now we have to wait for our bugs to be fixed along with the 
> bugs that everybody else is waiting to be fixed. I understand that to a 
> point. But when you have a bug that so adversely affects a group of users, 
> and you say you were serious about accessibility, then I think that you have 
> to make good on your commitment. Again, since we don't know what this adapter 
> will do, we can't say for sure whether Apple has caused a serious problem or 
> not. But once the adapter is out, if the group of blind users who are also 
> hard of hearing is seriously adversely affected, it seems to me that Apple 
> has in fact broken  its commitment.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:08 PM, Scott Granados  > wrote:
> 
>> WTF is an arrogrent?  Is that like a loud 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

I thought I made it clear, I said if it turns out that the adapter does not 
allow for this use case. If, you know, conditional. We will know in a week. 
Given all the leaks that are coming out, my guess is that the adapter is not 
going to do what is required. But since we don't know yet we have to wait and 
see.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:38 PM, E.T.  wrote:
> 
>   How is the minority being adversely affected when the 7 is not even on the 
> market?! Seriously, some people are quite nervous about the future if not 
> downright frightened. (smiles)
> 
> From E.T.'s Keyboard...
>  Are We Alone in the Universe?
> ancient.ali...@icloud.com
> 
>> On 9/2/2016 12:26 PM, Mary Otten wrote:
>> Hi Scott,
>> I agree that we don't know what the adapter will do, since it's not out.
>> However, should it turn out to be the case that the adapter will not
>> allow for simultaneous headphone usage and charging, this would be a
>> problem for the use case the Jonathan outlined, would you not agree?
>> Therefore, I don't see this as a case of arguing over nothing. It is a
>> case of a minority of users being seriously adversely affected by this
>> design decision I remember a few iterations of iOS ago, Apple broke the
>> driver for one of the braille displays it had been supporting. I think
>> it was a hymns product, but I'm not sure which one. That meant that
>> folks who have invested a good deal of money in a particular product
>> which had been working with Apple devices found themselves unable to
>> access the device if they were dependent on braille. The breakage was
>> brought to apples attention, and they did nothing about it for months
>> until the next major release of iOS occurred. Now you could argue that
>> this was a small subset of users. But the breakage effectively denied
>> the use of the product to that small subset of users. It seems to me
>> that one of the things you do when you make a serious commitment to
>> accessibility is you promise not to break the devices people have
>> invested in and make it impossible for them to use them as they have
>> been doing. Earlier this year, when Apple released one of its upgrades
>> that bricked some iPad pros, they rushed out a fix,  as they should
>> have.  I often hear it said that blind people complain too much. We got
>> what we wanted in the form of mainstream excess ability. Now we have to
>> wait for our bugs to be fixed along with the bugs that everybody else is
>> waiting to be fixed. I understand that to a point. But when you have a
>> bug that so adversely affects a group of users, and you say you were
>> serious about accessibility, then I think that you have to make good on
>> your commitment. Again, since we don't know what this adapter will do,
>> we can't say for sure whether Apple has caused a serious problem or not.
>> But once the adapter is out, if the group of blind users who are also
>> hard of hearing is seriously adversely affected, it seems to me that
>> Apple has in fact broken  its commitment.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:08 PM, Scott Granados > > wrote:
>> 
>>> WTF is an arrogrent?  Is that like a loud Mexican a loud immigrant?
>>> My mother had a bunch of them move in across the street, loud parties
>>> but man the best bbq.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> That being said, yes, you were being a troll then and I’m sorry to say
>>> you’re still under the bridge.
>>> 
>>> You’re all bitching over a product that doesn’t exist yet.  We already
>>> know that an adapter is being provided but that’s not good enough.
>>> We’re all supposed to hold up civilization because you won’t use a
>>> quarter inch piece.  We’re not fighting for civil rights, we’re not
>>> fighting over whether people are being killed in the streets by police
>>> gone mad, we’re fighting over the fact you might have to use a small
>>> plastic piece.  I’m just calling you and Jonathan out for the
>>> ridiculousness of A. bitching about something that’s not out yet and
>>> B. about such a trivial issue .
>>> I respect Jonathan a great deal and will tell him if I disagree with
>>> his positions and in this case I do.  They are well presented but I
>>> think a decent means of access is being provided that doesn’t injure
>>> the deaf blind user community so there’s a non issue. I’m sorry if
>>> that gets your panties in a wad but there it is.  I think his points
>>> were off base but that’s me.  I think Jonathan is a very smart well
>>> spoken and well informed person who can defend himself if he feels the
>>> need.  I realize under the bridge it might be hard to hear down there
>>> but the point is while I vigorously disagree with his points and
>>> assertions I most certainly am not saying he doesn’t have the right to
>>> his opinion and even go so far as to say I respect where that opinion
>>> is coming from I just disagree.
>>> 
>>> So what ever invisible 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[E.T.]

   How is the minority being adversely affected when the 7 is not even 
on the market?! Seriously, some people are quite nervous about the 
future if not downright frightened. (smiles)


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 12:26 PM, Mary Otten wrote:

Hi Scott,
I agree that we don't know what the adapter will do, since it's not out.
However, should it turn out to be the case that the adapter will not
allow for simultaneous headphone usage and charging, this would be a
problem for the use case the Jonathan outlined, would you not agree?
Therefore, I don't see this as a case of arguing over nothing. It is a
case of a minority of users being seriously adversely affected by this
design decision I remember a few iterations of iOS ago, Apple broke the
driver for one of the braille displays it had been supporting. I think
it was a hymns product, but I'm not sure which one. That meant that
folks who have invested a good deal of money in a particular product
which had been working with Apple devices found themselves unable to
access the device if they were dependent on braille. The breakage was
brought to apples attention, and they did nothing about it for months
until the next major release of iOS occurred. Now you could argue that
this was a small subset of users. But the breakage effectively denied
the use of the product to that small subset of users. It seems to me
that one of the things you do when you make a serious commitment to
accessibility is you promise not to break the devices people have
invested in and make it impossible for them to use them as they have
been doing. Earlier this year, when Apple released one of its upgrades
that bricked some iPad pros, they rushed out a fix,  as they should
have.  I often hear it said that blind people complain too much. We got
what we wanted in the form of mainstream excess ability. Now we have to
wait for our bugs to be fixed along with the bugs that everybody else is
waiting to be fixed. I understand that to a point. But when you have a
bug that so adversely affects a group of users, and you say you were
serious about accessibility, then I think that you have to make good on
your commitment. Again, since we don't know what this adapter will do,
we can't say for sure whether Apple has caused a serious problem or not.
But once the adapter is out, if the group of blind users who are also
hard of hearing is seriously adversely affected, it seems to me that
Apple has in fact broken  its commitment.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:08 PM, Scott Granados > wrote:


WTF is an arrogrent?  Is that like a loud Mexican a loud immigrant?
 My mother had a bunch of them move in across the street, loud parties
but man the best bbq.


That being said, yes, you were being a troll then and I’m sorry to say
you’re still under the bridge.

You’re all bitching over a product that doesn’t exist yet.  We already
know that an adapter is being provided but that’s not good enough.
 We’re all supposed to hold up civilization because you won’t use a
quarter inch piece.  We’re not fighting for civil rights, we’re not
fighting over whether people are being killed in the streets by police
gone mad, we’re fighting over the fact you might have to use a small
plastic piece.  I’m just calling you and Jonathan out for the
ridiculousness of A. bitching about something that’s not out yet and
B. about such a trivial issue .
I respect Jonathan a great deal and will tell him if I disagree with
his positions and in this case I do.  They are well presented but I
think a decent means of access is being provided that doesn’t injure
the deaf blind user community so there’s a non issue. I’m sorry if
that gets your panties in a wad but there it is.  I think his points
were off base but that’s me.  I think Jonathan is a very smart well
spoken and well informed person who can defend himself if he feels the
need.  I realize under the bridge it might be hard to hear down there
but the point is while I vigorously disagree with his points and
assertions I most certainly am not saying he doesn’t have the right to
his opinion and even go so far as to say I respect where that opinion
is coming from I just disagree.

So what ever invisible man in the sky you believe in help us if we
don’t agree and fall in to your little troll shaped mold!
I’d rather live in a world where we can all hash it out, beat around
our ideas and have a beer after, some of you are so thin skinned, so
literal and so brainwashed it makes me sad.


On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith > wrote:

I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll
because I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so
I am not at all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this
reply to Jonathon.


Heaven help us if this is how members of our 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

Hi Scott,
I agree that we don't know what the adapter will do, since it's not out. 
However, should it turn out to be the case that the adapter will not allow for 
simultaneous headphone usage and charging, this would be a problem for the use 
case the Jonathan outlined, would you not agree? Therefore, I don't see this as 
a case of arguing over nothing. It is a case of a minority of users being 
seriously adversely affected by this design decision I remember a few 
iterations of iOS ago, Apple broke the driver for one of the braille displays 
it had been supporting. I think it was a hymns product, but I'm not sure which 
one. That meant that folks who have invested a good deal of money in a 
particular product which had been working with Apple devices found themselves 
unable to access the device if they were dependent on braille. The breakage was 
brought to apples attention, and they did nothing about it for months until the 
next major release of iOS occurred. Now you could argue that this was a small 
subset of users. But the breakage effectively denied the use of the product to 
that small subset of users. It seems to me that one of the things you do when 
you make a serious commitment to accessibility is you promise not to break the 
devices people have invested in and make it impossible for them to use them as 
they have been doing. Earlier this year, when Apple released one of its 
upgrades that bricked some iPad pros, they rushed out a fix,  as they should 
have.  I often hear it said that blind people complain too much. We got what we 
wanted in the form of mainstream excess ability. Now we have to wait for our 
bugs to be fixed along with the bugs that everybody else is waiting to be 
fixed. I understand that to a point. But when you have a bug that so adversely 
affects a group of users, and you say you were serious about accessibility, 
then I think that you have to make good on your commitment. Again, since we 
don't know what this adapter will do, we can't say for sure whether Apple has 
caused a serious problem or not. But once the adapter is out, if the group of 
blind users who are also hard of hearing is seriously adversely affected, it 
seems to me that Apple has in fact broken  its commitment.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:08 PM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> WTF is an arrogrent?  Is that like a loud Mexican a loud immigrant?  My 
> mother had a bunch of them move in across the street, loud parties but man 
> the best bbq.
> 
> 
> That being said, yes, you were being a troll then and I’m sorry to say you’re 
> still under the bridge.
> 
> You’re all bitching over a product that doesn’t exist yet.  We already know 
> that an adapter is being provided but that’s not good enough.  We’re all 
> supposed to hold up civilization because you won’t use a quarter inch piece.  
> We’re not fighting for civil rights, we’re not fighting over whether people 
> are being killed in the streets by police gone mad, we’re fighting over the 
> fact you might have to use a small plastic piece.  I’m just calling you and 
> Jonathan out for the ridiculousness of A. bitching about something that’s not 
> out yet and B. about such a trivial issue .  
>   I respect Jonathan a great deal and will tell him if I disagree with 
> his positions and in this case I do.  They are well presented but I think a 
> decent means of access is being provided that doesn’t injure the deaf blind 
> user community so there’s a non issue. I’m sorry if that gets your panties in 
> a wad but there it is.  I think his points were off base but that’s me.  I 
> think Jonathan is a very smart well spoken and well informed person who can 
> defend himself if he feels the need.  I realize under the bridge it might be 
> hard to hear down there but the point is while I vigorously disagree with his 
> points and assertions I most certainly am not saying he doesn’t have the 
> right to his opinion and even go so far as to say I respect where that 
> opinion is coming from I just disagree.
> 
> So what ever invisible man in the sky you believe in help us if we don’t 
> agree and fall in to your little troll shaped mold!
> I’d rather live in a world where we can all hash it out, beat around our 
> ideas and have a beer after, some of you are so thin skinned, so literal and 
> so brainwashed it makes me sad.  
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith  wrote:
>> 
>> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll because 
>> I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I am not at 
>> all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply to Jonathon.
>> 
>> 
>> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf users.
>> 
>> 
>> David Griffith
>> 
>>> On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
>>> Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just 
>>> nutty.  You make it like some 

Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Scott Granados]

Hi there,

So the model I saw I believe was the pro.  To take you back a ways, I was a big 
fan for a long time of the over the ear 590 type which these were similar but 
more modern.

I just went over to the plantronics site itself to try to find you some more 
useful info and there are many backbeat types now.  The fit seems to be a 
waterproof flexible model for the gym, the pro seems to be more around ear.  I 
would suggest checking that site out.

Mark may have tried some of the backbeat models as well as I know he’s a 
bluetooth enthusiast.  He might have something to add.


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:59 PM, Erik Burggraaf  wrote:
> 
> Hi Scott, I am sort of in the market for a stereo headset for my cell phone 
> but I have never been able to find quite what I want. are you talking about 
> the Plantronics BackBeat Fit? it's a little more money than the Logitech but 
> it looks like it might be close to what I need. unfortunately the description 
> on Amazon is a bit weak. any information you could give me about this headset 
> would be very much appreciated if it's the one you were talking about. thanks 
> very much,
> 
> Erik
> 
> Sent with AquaMail for Android
> http://www.aqua-mail.com
> 
> 
> On September 2, 2016 12:24:47 PM Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
>> Logitech makes great wireless headsets.  We used them all the time at my 
>> employer for audio and video conferencing and they were very solid with 
>> laptops and desktops.
>> 
>> For a more cell phone type stereo bluetooth headset option check out the 
>> Plantronics Backbeat for stereo and the voyager Legend for single ear mono 
>> use.
>> 
>> Good luck
>> 
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 10:31 AM, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that 
>>> is bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
>>> dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
>>> out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the 
>>> network or dropbox.
>>> 
>>> Thanks.
>>> 
>>> Kristeen
>>> 
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>> 
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>>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners 
>>> or moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>>> 
>>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>>> 
>>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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>> 
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>> Visionaries list.
>> 
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>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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> 
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
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> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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> --- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, 

Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Scott Granados]

I’ve heard back and forth the construction on these is dodgy and then I hear 
it’s improved.  What’s your feelings on them?  Do the Aftershocks hold up to 
heavy use?


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:24 PM, Cheree Heppe  wrote:
> 
> This is okay for music and allows clear hearing of ambient and generated 
> sound simultaneously.
> Try the Aftershocks products.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 07:31, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
>> 
>> I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
>> bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
>> dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
>> out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the network 
>> or dropbox.
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Kristeen
>> 
>> -- 
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

Any time Phil I’m happy to back up any way you wish what I say.

You’ve been an equal coward for  years hiding behind your keyboard so I call 
your BS.

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:42 PM, Phil Halton  wrote:
> 
> David,
> I have noticed that the person in question often speaks with the bravery that 
> comes from being out of arms reach of those he so freely insults.
> Not a very appealing character trait.
> 
> Sent from my IPhone
> 
> 
> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith  > wrote:
> 
>> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll because 
>> I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I am not at 
>> all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply to Jonathon.
>> 
>> 
>> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf users.
>> 
>> 
>> David Griffith
>> 
>> 
>> On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
>> 
>>> Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just 
>>> nutty.  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and 
>>> mighty Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so 
>>> you have your precious 1960s technology.
>>>  
>>> 
>>> In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over all 
>>> and all 3 are on this list.:)
>>> 
>>> The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long 
>>> as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen > wrote:
 
 Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to 
 give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up 
 advocating for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with 
 efficiency and privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that this 
 need has been met, then it will in part be due to courageous people like 
 you who have spoken up.
 Jonathan Mosen
 Mosen Consulting
 Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
 http://Mosen.org 
> On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith  > wrote:
> 
> As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink 
> you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain on 
> this list about how a wired headset was essential for me but was accused 
> bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple 
> innovation.
> This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some 
> people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing impairments.
> 
> David Griffith
> 
> On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
>> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in 
>> the same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and 
>> require decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected 
>> are such a minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am 
>> considering my legal options under legislation here.
>> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a 
>> blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth 
>> solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has finished 
>> their call or isn't listening to music, the technology goes into standby 
>> and uses very little energy. A blind person has VO talking a lot of the 
>> time if they're using their device for tasks like reading and creating 
>> documents, email etc, so the impact is much greater.
>> Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of their 
>> phone with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the adapter will 
>> not solve the problem entirely if it means that you can't charge your 
>> device and use headphones at the same time. I travel long distances for 
>> example, often with flights over 12 hours long. I regularly take my Anka 
>> battery with me and charge the phone while I use it to compensate for 
>> the inaccessible in-flight entertainment system. It's important to me to 
>> have a full charge when I reach my destination. Based on the information 
>> we have, it looks like you can either listen to wired headphones or 
>> charge, not both.
>> That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option appears 
>> to have to choose between privacy and charge.
>> Jonathan Mosen
>> Mosen Consulting
>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>> http://Mosen.org 
>>> On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, just to be clear, I 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

WTF is an arrogrent?  Is that like a loud Mexican a loud immigrant?  My mother 
had a bunch of them move in across the street, loud parties but man the best 
bbq.


That being said, yes, you were being a troll then and I’m sorry to say you’re 
still under the bridge.

You’re all bitching over a product that doesn’t exist yet.  We already know 
that an adapter is being provided but that’s not good enough.  We’re all 
supposed to hold up civilization because you won’t use a quarter inch piece.  
We’re not fighting for civil rights, we’re not fighting over whether people are 
being killed in the streets by police gone mad, we’re fighting over the fact 
you might have to use a small plastic piece.  I’m just calling you and Jonathan 
out for the ridiculousness of A. bitching about something that’s not out yet 
and B. about such a trivial issue .  
I respect Jonathan a great deal and will tell him if I disagree with 
his positions and in this case I do.  They are well presented but I think a 
decent means of access is being provided that doesn’t injure the deaf blind 
user community so there’s a non issue. I’m sorry if that gets your panties in a 
wad but there it is.  I think his points were off base but that’s me.  I think 
Jonathan is a very smart well spoken and well informed person who can defend 
himself if he feels the need.  I realize under the bridge it might be hard to 
hear down there but the point is while I vigorously disagree with his points 
and assertions I most certainly am not saying he doesn’t have the right to his 
opinion and even go so far as to say I respect where that opinion is coming 
from I just disagree.

So what ever invisible man in the sky you believe in help us if we don’t agree 
and fall in to your little troll shaped mold!
I’d rather live in a world where we can all hash it out, beat around our ideas 
and have a beer after, some of you are so thin skinned, so literal and so 
brainwashed it makes me sad.  

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith  wrote:
> 
> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll because I 
> tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I am not at all 
> surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply to Jonathon.
> 
> 
> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf users.
> 
> 
> David Griffith
> 
> On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
>> Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just nutty. 
>>  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and mighty 
>> Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so you have 
>> your precious 1960s technology.
>>  
>> 
>> In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over all 
>> and all 3 are on this list.:)
>> 
>> The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long 
>> as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to 
>>> give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up 
>>> advocating for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with 
>>> efficiency and privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that this 
>>> need has been met, then it will in part be due to courageous people like 
>>> you who have spoken up.
>>> Jonathan Mosen
>>> Mosen Consulting
>>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>>> http://Mosen.org 
 On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith > wrote:
 
 As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink 
 you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain on 
 this list about how a wired headset was essential for me but was accused 
 bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple 
 innovation.
 This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some 
 people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing impairments.
 
 David Griffith
 
 On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in 
> the same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and require 
> decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected are such a 
> minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my 
> legal options under legislation here.
> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a 
> blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth 
> solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has finished 
> their call or isn't listening to music, the 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[E.T.]

   There comes a point at which we can keep the fires raging, or let 
them die out. This might be that point, eh? Its too easy to keep taking 
potshots at one another, much harder to pull back and let things cool off.


From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 11:42 AM, Phil Halton wrote:

David,
I have noticed that the person in question often speaks with the bravery
that comes from being out of arms reach of those he so freely insults.
Not a very appealing character trait.

Sent from my IPhone


On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith > wrote:


I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll
because I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so
I am not at all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this
reply to Jonathon.


Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf
users.


David Griffith

On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:


Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just
nutty.  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great
and mighty Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to
exist so you have your precious 1960s technology.


In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over
all and all 3 are on this list.:)

The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as
long as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.



On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen > wrote:

Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an
issue to give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must
never give up advocating for recognition of our need to be able to
use our devices with efficiency and privacy while also charging
them. If it turns out that this need has been met, then it will in
part be due to courageous people like you who have spoken up.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org 


On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith > wrote:

As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I
htink you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried
to explain on this list about how a wired headset was essential for
me but was accused bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to
criticise an Apple innovation.
This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically
some people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing
impairments.

David Griffith

On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:

Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf
community in the same way as it affects blind people who wear
hearing aids and require decent latency. And the fact that those
of us who are affected are such a minority makes us more
vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my legal options
under legislation here.
A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less
than a blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a
Bluetooth solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid
wearer has finished their call or isn't listening to music, the
technology goes into standby and uses very little energy. A blind
person has VO talking a lot of the time if they're using their
device for tasks like reading and creating documents, email etc,
so the impact is much greater.
Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of
their phone with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the
adapter will not solve the problem entirely if it means that you
can't charge your device and use headphones at the same time. I
travel long distances for example, often with flights over 12
hours long. I regularly take my Anka battery with me and charge
the phone while I use it to compensate for the inaccessible
in-flight entertainment system. It's important to me to have a
full charge when I reach my destination. Based on the information
we have, it looks like you can either listen to wired headphones
or charge, not both.
That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option
appears to have to choose between privacy and charge.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org 


On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten > wrote:

Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move,
if it means that they' very large hard of hearing community can't
use  hearing aids on iPhones anymore. That seems like such an
incredibly stupid move on Apple's part, that I am tempted to just
believe that they wouldn't do it if they didn't have a workaround
that would work for people who use hearing aids. The hard of
hearing community is orders of magnitude larger then 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Phil Halton]

David,
I have noticed that the person in question often speaks with the bravery that 
comes from being out of arms reach of those he so freely insults.
Not a very appealing character trait.

Sent from my IPhone


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:24 PM, David Griffith  wrote:
> 
> I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll because I 
> tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I am not at all 
> surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply to Jonathon.
> 
> 
> Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf users.
> 
> 
> David Griffith
> 
>> On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:
>> Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just nutty. 
>>  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and mighty 
>> Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so you have 
>> your precious 1960s technology.
>>  
>> 
>> In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over all 
>> and all 3 are on this list.:)
>> 
>> The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long 
>> as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to 
>>> give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up 
>>> advocating for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with 
>>> efficiency and privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that this 
>>> need has been met, then it will in part be due to courageous people like 
>>> you who have spoken up.
>>> Jonathan Mosen
>>> Mosen Consulting
>>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>>> http://Mosen.org
>>> 
 On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith  wrote:
 
 As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink 
 you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain on 
 this list about how a wired headset was essential for me but was accused 
 bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple 
 innovation.
 This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some 
 people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing impairments.
 
 David Griffith
 
> On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in 
> the same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and require 
> decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected are such a 
> minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my 
> legal options under legislation here.
> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a 
> blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth 
> solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has finished 
> their call or isn't listening to music, the technology goes into standby 
> and uses very little energy. A blind person has VO talking a lot of the 
> time if they're using their device for tasks like reading and creating 
> documents, email etc, so the impact is much greater.
> Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of their 
> phone with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the adapter will 
> not solve the problem entirely if it means that you can't charge your 
> device and use headphones at the same time. I travel long distances for 
> example, often with flights over 12 hours long. I regularly take my Anka 
> battery with me and charge the phone while I use it to compensate for the 
> inaccessible in-flight entertainment system. It's important to me to have 
> a full charge when I reach my destination. Based on the information we 
> have, it looks like you can either listen to wired headphones or charge, 
> not both.
> That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option appears 
> to have to choose between privacy and charge.
> Jonathan Mosen
> Mosen Consulting
> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
> http://Mosen.org
> 
>> On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move, if it 
>> means that they' very large hard of hearing community can't use  hearing 
>> aids on iPhones anymore. That seems like such an incredibly stupid move 
>> on Apple's part, that I am tempted to just believe that they wouldn't do 
>> it if they didn't have a workaround that would work for people who use 
>> hearing aids. The hard of hearing community is orders of magnitude 
>> larger then the blind community. So Shirley, this 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[David Griffith]

I believe this is the arrogrant person  who described me as a troll 
because I tried to represent the issues of hearing impaired issues so I 
am not at all surprised by the ignorance and callousness of this reply 
to Jonathon.



Heaven help us if this is how members of our community turn of on deaf 
users.



David Griffith

On 02/09/2016 13:35, Scott Granados wrote:

Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just 
nutty.  You make it like some huge personal assault against the great 
and mighty Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to 
exist so you have your precious 1960s technology.


In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over 
all and all 3 are on this list.:)


The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as 
long as when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.



On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen > wrote:


Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an 
issue to give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must 
never give up advocating for recognition of our need to be able to 
use our devices with efficiency and privacy while also charging them. 
If it turns out that this need has been met, then it will in part be 
due to courageous people like you who have spoken up.

Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org 

On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith > wrote:


As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I 
htink you will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to 
explain on this list about how a wired headset was essential for me 
but was accused bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to 
criticise an Apple innovation.
This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically 
some people are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing 
impairments.


David Griffith

On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community 
in the same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids 
and require decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are 
affected are such a minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be 
sure I am considering my legal options under legislation here.
A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less 
than a blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a 
Bluetooth solution is being used, after a standard hearing aid 
wearer has finished their call or isn't listening to music, the 
technology goes into standby and uses very little energy. A blind 
person has VO talking a lot of the time if they're using their 
device for tasks like reading and creating documents, email etc, so 
the impact is much greater.
Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of 
their phone with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the 
adapter will not solve the problem entirely if it means that you 
can't charge your device and use headphones at the same time. I 
travel long distances for example, often with flights over 12 hours 
long. I regularly take my Anka battery with me and charge the phone 
while I use it to compensate for the inaccessible in-flight 
entertainment system. It's important to me to have a full charge 
when I reach my destination. Based on the information we have, it 
looks like you can either listen to wired headphones or charge, not 
both.
That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option 
appears to have to choose between privacy and charge.

Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org 

On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten > wrote:


Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move, 
if it means that they' very large hard of hearing community can't 
use  hearing aids on iPhones anymore. That seems like such an 
incredibly stupid move on Apple's part, that I am tempted to just 
believe that they wouldn't do it if they didn't have a workaround 
that would work for people who use hearing aids. The hard of 
hearing community is orders of magnitude larger then the blind 
community. So Shirley, this adapter must be providing someway for 
people who use hearing aids to keep on doing so. What am I missing 
here? I remember sometime ago, when the idea that the headphone 
jack would go away first came out, Jonathan wrote a very 
impassioned piece on this subject, arguing that this was a very 
bad idea because of the use case of hearing aids. Now Apple is 
going to do it anyway, but they're offering an adapter. Why 
doesn't that solve the problem? I understand why Bluetooth is not 
a good alternative, given Jonathan's comments on battery drain and 
the well-known 

Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Cheree Heppe]

This is okay for music and allows clear hearing of ambient and generated sound 
simultaneously.
Try the Aftershocks products.


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 07:31, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
> 
> I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
> bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
> dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
> out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the network 
> or dropbox.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Kristeen
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
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> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

I guess it's kind of like owning your own CDs or albums. I have ripped all of 
mine in to iTunes. And I stream on the go. But I still like having those copies.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 9:35 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> See I’m on the opposite end of that spectrum.  In fact I’m wondering why I 
> have a terabyte of storage in SSD on my laptop when I have so much attached 
> storage to the network.  I have my folders like documents for example mapped 
> on my laptops so that documents automatically drop in to iCloud and live 
> there on iCloud drive.  Everything is shared between the machines on the 
> network and doesn’t get stored locally.
>   One thing I’d like to see apple include is a cellular modem in the 
> laptops.  I know we all have the hotspot option and many of us have mobile 
> hotspots but it would be nice to be able to just connect from anywhere with 
> out an extra gadget.  I know that’s a first world problem, just turning on 
> the laptop and going would be nice though.  To  me I like the idea of 
> everything being decentralized but everyone’s use case is different.
> 
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 11:02 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Streaming is nice, but call me old-fashioned. I still like to have stuff 
>> actually on the phone. I also like to have stuff actually on the computer. 
>> Cloud is nice. Local storage is still what I like better.
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 5:26 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I personally could care less what the memory size is.  All my content is 
>>> streamed so I don’t use much of it other than for application memory.  
>>> Whether it’s 16, 32, or 256 GB it’s all the same.  The only thing I find is 
>>> the higher memory units have a better resale value.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
 
 Yes. I too would like to be able to plug my eye device into a PC or Mac 
 and access that like I could  A thumb drive. I would also like a storage 
 slot, so that damned 16 GB model they sell wouldn't be so ridiculously 
 limited. Yes, I know they are supposedly upping it to 32, big deal. On the 
 other hand, my android device is a nexus, because it gets timely updates, 
 just like apples things do. No storage card there either. Nothing is 
 perfect.
 Mary
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:30 PM, Michael Marshall  
> wrote:
> 
> The article I read must' have been gravely misinformed.
> I would just like to download files from Safari to my iPhone such as mp3 
> files.
> viewing it as a harddrive like the Android phones.
>> On 2 Sep. 2016, at 1:26 pm, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took 
>> away the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people 
>> complain. They took away the user replaceable battery. They did not 
>> bring that back, despite complaint. They do what they want. There is no 
>> immediately efficient replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has 
>> never had one. People have complained forever about the fact that it is 
>> harder to access the whole file system on Apple devices. As Apple change 
>> that? No they have not.
>> 
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall 
>>>  wrote:
>>> 
>>> There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was 
>>> reversed.
>>> The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
 On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
 
 I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a 
 huge negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to 
 hope the inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they 
 did this and reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here 
 in New Zealand. I'm the only blind person there, and people are 
 justifiably livid about the removal of the headphone jack. Most people 
 don't want this, and I suspect based on what has leaked that the 
 benefits to most people of upgrading will be so incremental that the 
 lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
 That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, 
 because one thing that this process has taught me since I started 
 blogging about the possibility of the headphone jack to raise the 
 alarm at a time when it may have made a difference, is that I was 
 naive to think that blind people might be any more sensitive to and 
 respectful of the 

Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Erik Burggraaf]

Hi Scott, I am sort of in the market for a stereo headset for my cell phone 
but I have never been able to find quite what I want. are you talking about 
the Plantronics BackBeat Fit? it's a little more money than the Logitech 
but it looks like it might be close to what I need. unfortunately the 
description on Amazon is a bit weak. any information you could give me 
about this headset would be very much appreciated if it's the one you were 
talking about. thanks very much,


Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com


On September 2, 2016 12:24:47 PM Scott Granados  wrote:

Logitech makes great wireless headsets.  We used them all the time at my 
employer for audio and video conferencing and they were very solid with 
laptops and desktops.


For a more cell phone type stereo bluetooth headset option check out the 
Plantronics Backbeat for stereo and the voyager Legend for single ear mono use.


Good luck


On Sep 2, 2016, at 10:31 AM, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:

I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that 
is bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the 
network or dropbox.


Thanks.

Kristeen

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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

I saw the rumors about the LTE coming to the watch. Then subsequently, there 
were other ones saying it wasn't going to happen because of the battery draw. 
They're adding a GPS. That will use the larger battery that is supposedly also 
coming. But not enough juice for both the GPS and the radio according to the 
rumors. Rumors, rumors, rumors.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 9:27 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Mary, there are some watches now that have this feature that simon speaks of. 
>  You’re exactly right a radio would need to be included.  For the watch, not 
> necessarily full LTE but HSPA+ or something may do the trick.  The Samsung 
> Gear had a 3G radio included and I’m not sure what’s in the Gear S2.  With a 
> Samsung you could run the watch totally separate from the phone.
>I personally think this is an over rated feature unless you’re like simon 
> and want a watch only for a phone and no other device.  I like the larger 
> devices so would always use my phone near my watch so all I care about is a 
> good bluetooth and WiFi stack on the watch.  I’d like to see the 5 GHZ band 
> added to the watch and the ability to set the WiFi settings separately with 
> advanced features.  There were rumblings of adding a full cell feature to the 
> apple watch but I don’t know if that was included in the upcoming release.
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 11:04 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Simon,
>> What good is a Sim card slot if you don't have an LTE radio in the watch? 
>> According to all the rumors, and of course they are just that, there's not 
>> going to be an LTE radio in the next watch.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:53 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to 
>>> set it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.
>>> 
>>> I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use 
>>> the watch as an independent device without the phone. 
>>> Or even you get both options.
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
>>> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
>>> iPhone seven
>>> 
>>> Hi Mary
>>> 
>>> I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 
>>> will have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn a 
>>> setting off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done 
>>> this, and the watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for 
>>> example and the watch will not go off. The setting can be found under 
>>> general > wake screen.
 On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
 
 I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or 
 at least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps 
 the next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my 
 reluctance on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the 
 few people who still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices 
 that go off at the most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at 
 Cetera. With the new 2.0, will be getting the ability to have the 
 vibrating feedback to tell the time. So that is a step in the right 
 direction. I guess I just haven't seen the killer use case yet.
 Mary
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now.  
> It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
> watch or be able to walk away from your phone and just access quick data 
> nicely on your wrist.  For sited users, being able to glance down say 
> while driving even or in various settings where you don’t want to break 
> your focus for a full look at your phone.
> Another nice set of features are the health features.  Even a gentle tap 
> on the wrist to just stand up and move around and stretch hourly or 
> motivation to meet your workout goals.
> You can quick respond again from your wrist to messages or take a quick 
> call.  It’s hard to explain.  Also, the Apple watch is more independent 
> than people think.  Since version 2.1 I believe it was given WiFi 
> functions so it can join your home network or other WiFi networks with 
> some caveats and work independently from the phone including placing and 
> receiving calls if your carrier supports WiFi calling which my carrier 
> does fully.  
> To be clear, I was with you and then I got one as a gift and now I don’t 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

See I’m on the opposite end of that spectrum.  In fact I’m wondering why I have 
a terabyte of storage in SSD on my laptop when I have so much attached storage 
to the network.  I have my folders like documents for example mapped on my 
laptops so that documents automatically drop in to iCloud and live there on 
iCloud drive.  Everything is shared between the machines on the network and 
doesn’t get stored locally.
One thing I’d like to see apple include is a cellular modem in the 
laptops.  I know we all have the hotspot option and many of us have mobile 
hotspots but it would be nice to be able to just connect from anywhere with out 
an extra gadget.  I know that’s a first world problem, just turning on the 
laptop and going would be nice though.  To  me I like the idea of everything 
being decentralized but everyone’s use case is different.


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 11:02 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Streaming is nice, but call me old-fashioned. I still like to have stuff 
> actually on the phone. I also like to have stuff actually on the computer. 
> Cloud is nice. Local storage is still what I like better.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 2, 2016, at 5:26 AM, Scott Granados  > wrote:
> 
>> I personally could care less what the memory size is.  All my content is 
>> streamed so I don’t use much of it other than for application memory.  
>> Whether it’s 16, 32, or 256 GB it’s all the same.  The only thing I find is 
>> the higher memory units have a better resale value.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Mary Otten >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Yes. I too would like to be able to plug my eye device into a PC or Mac and 
>>> access that like I could  A thumb drive. I would also like a storage slot, 
>>> so that damned 16 GB model they sell wouldn't be so ridiculously limited. 
>>> Yes, I know they are supposedly upping it to 32, big deal. On the other 
>>> hand, my android device is a nexus, because it gets timely updates, just 
>>> like apples things do. No storage card there either. Nothing is perfect.
>>> Mary
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:30 PM, Michael Marshall >> > wrote:
>>> 
 The article I read must' have been gravely misinformed.
 I would just like to download files from Safari to my iPhone such as mp3 
 files.
 viewing it as a harddrive like the Android phones.
> On 2 Sep. 2016, at 1:26 pm, Mary Otten  > wrote:
> 
> Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took 
> away the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people 
> complain. They took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring 
> that back, despite complaint. They do what they want. There is no 
> immediately efficient replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has 
> never had one. People have complained forever about the fact that it is 
> harder to access the whole file system on Apple devices. As Apple change 
> that? No they have not.
> 
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall  > wrote:
> 
>> There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was 
>> reversed.
>> The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
>>> On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a 
>>> huge negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to 
>>> hope the inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they 
>>> did this and reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here 
>>> in New Zealand. I'm the only blind person there, and people are 
>>> justifiably livid about the removal of the headphone jack. Most people 
>>> don't want this, and I suspect based on what has leaked that the 
>>> benefits to most people of upgrading will be so incremental that the 
>>> lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
>>> That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, 
>>> because one thing that this process has taught me since I started 
>>> blogging about the possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm 
>>> at a time when it may have made a difference, is that I was naive to 
>>> think that blind people might be any more sensitive to and respectful 
>>> of the accessibility needs of others, such as the hearing impaired. I 
>>> guess I would like to think that since we know what impact 
>>> inaccessibility can have on our own 

Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Scott Granados]

Definite +1, the only down side of this headset is it feels a little flimsy but 
it’s not, don’t let that fool you.  I have one that’s out lasted gear that cost 
twice as much.  Great suggestion, +1!

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 12:26 PM, Erik Burggraaf  wrote:
> 
> Hi, my girlfriend works for the I can connect program and she always 
> recommends the Logitech h800 Bluetooth headset. you can find this headset for 
> about 70 bucks here:
> http://AMZN.to/2cjNO94
> 
> This headset comes with both a dongle and a full Bluetooth radio. a switch on 
> the side allows you to flip between the dongle and the radio. Thus, you can 
> have two Bluetooth devices connected simultaneously and switch back and forth 
> on the Fly.  We have used this headset extensively and found both connections 
> to be extremely stable.  It's Logitech and so the sound is excellent for the 
> price point. the headset is a little bigger than I would like but still it's 
> much smaller than other similar headsets such as the Bose SoundLink and it 
> folds  down a little bit when it's not in use.
> 
> I hope this helps,
> 
> Erik
> 
> Sent with AquaMail for Android
> http://www.aqua-mail.com
> 
> 
> On September 2, 2016 10:32:40 AM Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
> 
>> I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
>> bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
>> dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
>> out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the network 
>> or dropbox.
>> 
>> Thanks.
>> 
>> Kristeen
>> 
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>> Visionaries list.
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>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
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>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

Mary, there are some watches now that have this feature that simon speaks of.  
You’re exactly right a radio would need to be included.  For the watch, not 
necessarily full LTE but HSPA+ or something may do the trick.  The Samsung Gear 
had a 3G radio included and I’m not sure what’s in the Gear S2.  With a Samsung 
you could run the watch totally separate from the phone.
I personally think this is an over rated feature unless you’re like 
simon and want a watch only for a phone and no other device.  I like the larger 
devices so would always use my phone near my watch so all I care about is a 
good bluetooth and WiFi stack on the watch.  I’d like to see the 5 GHZ band 
added to the watch and the ability to set the WiFi settings separately with 
advanced features.  There were rumblings of adding a full cell feature to the 
apple watch but I don’t know if that was included in the upcoming release.

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 11:04 AM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Simon,
> What good is a Sim card slot if you don't have an LTE radio in the watch? 
> According to all the rumors, and of course they are just that, there's not 
> going to be an LTE radio in the next watch.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:53 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>> 
>> I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to 
>> set it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.
>> 
>> I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use the 
>> watch as an independent device without the phone. 
>> Or even you get both options.
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
>> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
>> iPhone seven
>> 
>> Hi Mary
>> 
>> I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 will 
>> have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn a 
>> setting off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done 
>> this, and the watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for 
>> example and the watch will not go off. The setting can be found under 
>> general > wake screen.
>>> On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or at 
>>> least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps the 
>>> next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my reluctance 
>>> on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the few people 
>>> who still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices that go off 
>>> at the most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at Cetera. With the 
>>> new 2.0, will be getting the ability to have the vibrating feedback to tell 
>>> the time. So that is a step in the right direction. I guess I just haven't 
>>> seen the killer use case yet.
>>> Mary
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
 On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
 
 You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now.  
 It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
 watch or be able to walk away from your phone and just access quick data 
 nicely on your wrist.  For sited users, being able to glance down say 
 while driving even or in various settings where you don’t want to break 
 your focus for a full look at your phone.
 Another nice set of features are the health features.  Even a gentle tap 
 on the wrist to just stand up and move around and stretch hourly or 
 motivation to meet your workout goals.
 You can quick respond again from your wrist to messages or take a quick 
 call.  It’s hard to explain.  Also, the Apple watch is more independent 
 than people think.  Since version 2.1 I believe it was given WiFi 
 functions so it can join your home network or other WiFi networks with 
 some caveats and work independently from the phone including placing and 
 receiving calls if your carrier supports WiFi calling which my carrier 
 does fully.  
 To be clear, I was with you and then I got one as a gift and now I don’t 
 know what I’d do with out it and I’m dead excited to see watch 2.0 next 
 week.
 
 
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 10:01 AM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
> 
> I've never really understood the point of the Apple watch, sure it can 
> run apps, but so what, my phone does that, and the watch requires a phone 
> connection to do most things anyway, totally redundant.
> Original message:
>> Hello Mary,
> 
>> My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
>> 

Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Erik Burggraaf]

Hi, my girlfriend works for the I can connect program and she always 
recommends the Logitech h800 Bluetooth headset. you can find this headset 
for about 70 bucks here:

http://AMZN.to/2cjNO94

This headset comes with both a dongle and a full Bluetooth radio. a switch 
on the side allows you to flip between the dongle and the radio. Thus, you 
can have two Bluetooth devices connected simultaneously and switch back and 
forth on the Fly.  We have used this headset extensively and found both 
connections to be extremely stable.  It's Logitech and so the sound is 
excellent for the price point. the headset is a little bigger than I would 
like but still it's much smaller than other similar headsets such as the 
Bose SoundLink and it folds  down a little bit when it's not in use.


I hope this helps,

Erik

Sent with AquaMail for Android
http://www.aqua-mail.com


On September 2, 2016 10:32:40 AM Kristeen Hughes  wrote:

I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that 
is bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the 
network or dropbox.


Thanks.

Kristeen

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Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Scott Granados]

Logitech makes great wireless headsets.  We used them all the time at my 
employer for audio and video conferencing and they were very solid with laptops 
and desktops. 

For a more cell phone type stereo bluetooth headset option check out the 
Plantronics Backbeat for stereo and the voyager Legend for single ear mono use. 
 

Good luck

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 10:31 AM, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
> 
> I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
> bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a 
> dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting 
> out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the network 
> or dropbox.
> 
> Thanks.
> 
> Kristeen
> 
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Re: I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[jeff `greene]

Hi Kristeen, Well I love my B p5 wireless! Its the best sounding and
most comfortable set of headphones I've ever owned. Its kinda pricey,
list price is $400 but you can usually find it on ebay.com for about
half that price.
HTH Jeff


On 9/2/16, Kristeen Hughes  wrote:
> I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is
> bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a
> dongle. When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting
> out of VO while doing anything involving transferring files over the network
> or dropbox.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Kristeen
>
> --
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> Visionaries list.
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>
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

 Simon,
What good is a Sim card slot if you don't have an LTE radio in the watch? 
According to all the rumors, and of course they are just that, there's not 
going to be an LTE radio in the next watch.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:53 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to 
> set it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.
> 
> I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use the 
> watch as an independent device without the phone. 
> Or even you get both options.
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
> iPhone seven
> 
> Hi Mary
> 
> I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 will 
> have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn a 
> setting off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done 
> this, and the watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for 
> example and the watch will not go off. The setting can be found under general 
> > wake screen.
>> On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or at 
>> least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps the 
>> next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my reluctance 
>> on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the few people who 
>> still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices that go off at 
>> the most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at Cetera. With the new 
>> 2.0, will be getting the ability to have the vibrating feedback to tell the 
>> time. So that is a step in the right direction. I guess I just haven't seen 
>> the killer use case yet.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>>> 
>>> You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now.  
>>> It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
>>> watch or be able to walk away from your phone and just access quick data 
>>> nicely on your wrist.  For sited users, being able to glance down say while 
>>> driving even or in various settings where you don’t want to break your 
>>> focus for a full look at your phone.
>>>  Another nice set of features are the health features.  Even a gentle tap 
>>> on the wrist to just stand up and move around and stretch hourly or 
>>> motivation to meet your workout goals.
>>>  You can quick respond again from your wrist to messages or take a quick 
>>> call.  It’s hard to explain.  Also, the Apple watch is more independent 
>>> than people think.  Since version 2.1 I believe it was given WiFi functions 
>>> so it can join your home network or other WiFi networks with some caveats 
>>> and work independently from the phone including placing and receiving calls 
>>> if your carrier supports WiFi calling which my carrier does fully.  
>>>  To be clear, I was with you and then I got one as a gift and now I don’t 
>>> know what I’d do with out it and I’m dead excited to see watch 2.0 next 
>>> week.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Sep 1, 2016, at 10:01 AM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
 
 I've never really understood the point of the Apple watch, sure it can run 
 apps, but so what, my phone does that, and the watch requires a phone 
 connection to do most things anyway, totally redundant.
 Original message:
> Hello Mary,
 
> My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
> active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have 
> alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that 
> companies pay attention.
 
> Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically 
> ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, 
> I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better will 
> make it so.
 
> I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it would 
> change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my world 
> hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.
 
> As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to 
> follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of 
> Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when it 
> follows."
 
> My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately for 
> me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest device 
> just 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

Streaming is nice, but call me old-fashioned. I still like to have stuff 
actually on the phone. I also like to have stuff actually on the computer. 
Cloud is nice. Local storage is still what I like better.

Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 5:26 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> I personally could care less what the memory size is.  All my content is 
> streamed so I don’t use much of it other than for application memory.  
> Whether it’s 16, 32, or 256 GB it’s all the same.  The only thing I find is 
> the higher memory units have a better resale value.
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Yes. I too would like to be able to plug my eye device into a PC or Mac and 
>> access that like I could  A thumb drive. I would also like a storage slot, 
>> so that damned 16 GB model they sell wouldn't be so ridiculously limited. 
>> Yes, I know they are supposedly upping it to 32, big deal. On the other 
>> hand, my android device is a nexus, because it gets timely updates, just 
>> like apples things do. No storage card there either. Nothing is perfect.
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:30 PM, Michael Marshall  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> The article I read must' have been gravely misinformed.
>>> I would just like to download files from Safari to my iPhone such as mp3 
>>> files.
>>> viewing it as a harddrive like the Android phones.
 On 2 Sep. 2016, at 1:26 pm, Mary Otten  wrote:
 
 Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took 
 away the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people 
 complain. They took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring 
 that back, despite complaint. They do what they want. There is no 
 immediately efficient replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has 
 never had one. People have complained forever about the fact that it is 
 harder to access the whole file system on Apple devices. As Apple change 
 that? No they have not.
 
 Mary
 
 
 Sent from my iPhone
 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall  
> wrote:
> 
> There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was 
> reversed.
> The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
>> On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
>> 
>> I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a 
>> huge negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope 
>> the inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did 
>> this and reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New 
>> Zealand. I'm the only blind person there, and people are justifiably 
>> livid about the removal of the headphone jack. Most people don't want 
>> this, and I suspect based on what has leaked that the benefits to most 
>> people of upgrading will be so incremental that the lack of a headphone 
>> jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
>> That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, 
>> because one thing that this process has taught me since I started 
>> blogging about the possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm 
>> at a time when it may have made a difference, is that I was naive to 
>> think that blind people might be any more sensitive to and respectful of 
>> the accessibility needs of others, such as the hearing impaired. I guess 
>> I would like to think that since we know what impact inaccessibility can 
>> have on our own lives, we would be sensitive to the needs of others, 
>> even when the issues didn't affect us directly. But that has proven a 
>> stupid pipe dream on my part, and I've found the whole thing really 
>> upsetting. For the most part, it seems like it's everyone for themselves 
>> these days, and if others are being thrown under the bus, well too damn 
>> bad.
>> As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid 
>> wearer, i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost 
>> all the time I use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for 
>> someone who moves through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were 
>> to improve, Bluetooth drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and 
>> it's difficult to get through an entire business day of use without the 
>> need to charge something.
>> And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't 
>> then charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, 
>> selfish, stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This 
>> company, which parades their accessibility efforts like some sort of 
>> badge of 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Mary Otten]

Scott, you might be right. I certainly don't remember anything like that. Of 
course, 2 1/2 years ago, I was not exactly following android, having an Nexus 
seven that I mostly used for just reading books. On the other hand, if Samsung 
tried that, you think there would be more talk about it in the press now that 
others are doing it a lot later than Samsung, if your recollection is correct.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 5:28 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Mary, i could be way wrong here but I thought the Samsung S5 at least had a 
> usb port where you attached the headphones with an adapter.  I could be 
> remembering wrong though.
> 
>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:26 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took 
>> away the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people 
>> complain. They took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring 
>> that back, despite complaint. They do what they want. There is no 
>> immediately efficient replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has 
>> never had one. People have complained forever about the fact that it is 
>> harder to access the whole file system on Apple devices. As Apple change 
>> that? No they have not.
>> 
>> Mary
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall  
>>> wrote:
>>> 
>>> There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was reversed.
>>> The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
 On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
 
 I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a huge 
 negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope the 
 inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this and 
 reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New Zealand. 
 I'm the only blind person there, and people are justifiably livid about 
 the removal of the headphone jack. Most people don't want this, and I 
 suspect based on what has leaked that the benefits to most people of 
 upgrading will be so incremental that the lack of a headphone jack will 
 cause a lot of people to sit it out.
 That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, 
 because one thing that this process has taught me since I started blogging 
 about the possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm at a time 
 when it may have made a difference, is that I was naive to think that 
 blind people might be any more sensitive to and respectful of the 
 accessibility needs of others, such as the hearing impaired. I guess I 
 would like to think that since we know what impact inaccessibility can 
 have on our own lives, we would be sensitive to the needs of others, even 
 when the issues didn't affect us directly. But that has proven a stupid 
 pipe dream on my part, and I've found the whole thing really upsetting. 
 For the most part, it seems like it's everyone for themselves these days, 
 and if others are being thrown under the bus, well too damn bad.
 As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid 
 wearer, i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost all 
 the time I use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for someone 
 who moves through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were to 
 improve, Bluetooth drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and it's 
 difficult to get through an entire business day of use without the need to 
 charge something.
 And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
 charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, selfish, 
 stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, which 
 parades their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of honour, 
 appears to be about to crap all over one segment of its accessibility 
 market.
 Something isn't automatically the future because Apple says it is. And 
 they're going too far this time, alienating too many people. Perhaps, in 
 time, a USB-C-based solution is going to be viable, and receive carefully 
 managed industry-wide adoption. But Apple isn't using USB-C on its 
 iDevices. It's using a proprietary port that it doesn't even offer on its 
 own personal computers, meaning you won't be able to use the 
 Lightning-based Ear Pods even with a Mac. That's two sets of headphones 
 you're going to have to carry around with you, unless you don't mind 
 having an adapter jutting out of the port you want to charge your phone 
 with. Absolutely absurd.
 I believe it was Samsung that recently put out a series of ads mocking 
 Apple over the potential lack of a 

I need a good bluetooth headset recommendation

[Kristeen Hughes]

I’m wondering if anyone knows of a good, stereo, headset for the mac that is 
bluetooth, but will use the built-in bluetooth of the mac rather than a dongle. 
When I use a headset with a dongle I get a lot of very bad cutting out of VO 
while doing anything involving transferring files over the network or dropbox.

Thanks.

Kristeen

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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[E.T.]

   The end is coming, the end is coming! Ever see those signs people 
carry around? And everyone who comes to my door tell me the same thing 
and they want to let me know what to do. Really? Why is it that people 
cannot stay focused on the here and now and get the most out of life 
right now? When I start talking sense to these door knockers, they run 
like hell.


   All this talk about the future is madness. Don't yall have a life?

From E.T.'s Keyboard...
  Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/2/2016 1:42 AM, Simon Fogarty wrote:

Hi Folks,
 Just going to add a thought in here.

 Any one thought about the future and what's going to happen in it?

 If everyones getting upset because apple have made the first move towards 
getting rid of the headphone jack in devices then what the hell is going to 
happen next,

Well if this feedback we're reading is anything to go by the world for blind 
people will end!

 Remember things change for the good and the bad in life,

 But what ever happens the majority of people work on and get over the bridges 
that spring up in front of us.

Till now I prefer headphones with the 3.5 mil jack as they're small and easy to 
put in a pocket to carry around,

If I have to put an adaptor in my pocket or bag or what ever then I'm going to 
have to do it.

 But lets face it we don't really know what apple will do till they do it  and 
they may have a really genius idea as a replacement for the headphones we've 
had up till now.

 Which I have to admit I have about 6 pair never used sitting in a box of 
extras  so at least at this point I've got spares for my notebook and ipad till 
they change also.

And they could change things again yet to USB C

Just thinking out of the box,

 Try thinking about now and not about tomorrow, you might not make it, no one 
can actually tell.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:06 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Adding one tiny bit of gear to carry around is going to be a giant issue? 
Good grief. I wonder how much impact that will have on me when I lug around 
15-20 pounds of gear on a regular basis. This little adapter just might be the 
straw that breaks my back. (smiles)

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/1/2016 6:08 AM, Kimber Gardner wrote:

You're sort of missing the point, I think. The point being that most
people (me included) don't think they should have to carry extra bits
around to do something as basic as plug in a set of earphones.

On 9/1/16, Saqib Hussain  wrote:

Hi. I use Bluetooth stereo headphones so this new revelation doesn’t
effect me. I wouldn’t even carry an adaptor around with me because
I’m not one for carrying extra bits around just to accomplish a
simple task like wanting to plug your headphones in.

On 31 Aug 2016, at 13:29, Michael Marshall

wrote:

hey all,
I know there have been many leaks of supposed schematics and things
on the new iPhone seven and if or not it will have a 3.5mm jack.
The latest leak I believe has credence.
In the box with the iPhone seven, you will get a lightning to 3.5 mm
adapter witch is what i guessed apple would do if they did take the
jack from the phone.
If this is indeed the case I am quite satisfied because at least
they have made an adapter readily available.

Michael

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To post to this 

Re: Apple to Release New MacBook Pro and Air as Early as October, AMD iMacs and 5K Display With LG Also in Works - Mac Rumors

[Scott Granados]

Oh I found a good amount on Mac Rumors and on redmond pie.  The most recent 
article was on Redmond Pie I believe and had good coverage of the changes 
coming.  Rumors of course.

> On Sep 1, 2016, at 4:02 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> So where are you seeing the info on these new devices?
>  
> I’m interested in a new MB either an air or a pro just so long as it’s light 
> powerfull and small.
>  
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Scott Granados
> Sent: Thursday, 1 September 2016 4:52 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Apple to Release New MacBook Pro and Air as Early as October, 
> AMD iMacs and 5K Display With LG Also in Works - Mac Rumors
>  
> These do look interesting.  I’m not sure about the function bar but I’d give 
> it a shot.
>  
> The only complaint I have about my MacBook pro now is the model I 
> have is a little heavy / bulky and it gets a little hot when under load so if 
> they could make it a little lighter / thinner that would be good.
>  
>  
>  
> On Aug 31, 2016, at 12:39 PM, Barry Hadder  > wrote:
>  
> Looks like new Macs are on the way and I'm sure they will be thinner than 
> ever.  :)
> It's been a while since the last refresh.
> http://www.macrumors.com/2016/08/29/new-macbook-pro-air-oct-amd-imacs-5k-display-lg/
>  
> 
>  
> 
> Barry Hadder
> bhad...@gmail.com 
>  
>  
>  
>  
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
>  
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
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> 
>  
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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> 
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Re: VO threw a bluetooth speaker

[Scott Granados]

I believe he’s wanting to do this from the Mac which he can do now using midi 
audio setup in the utilities section, I think it’s called audio midI and gives 
you fine control over the audio including the sampling rate, filter bit depth 
and type, and sources and their mappings.  This would be a place to set up the 
mappings you need.

Hope that helps.


> On Sep 2, 2016, at 3:01 AM, christopher hallsworth  
> wrote:
> 
> Correct. VoiceOver is going to have multiple audio sources support in iOS10 
> and, for your reference, tvOS 10.
> 
> On 2 Sep 2016, at 04:12, David Chittenden  wrote:
>> 
>> 
>> According to info I have read, this will be possible in iOS 10.
>> 
>> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
>> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
>> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On 2 Sep 2016, at 15:01, Agent086b  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hi,
>>> Hi,
>>> if I have asked this before I have forgotten the answer. Can I have VO 
>>> through a bluetooth speaker and music through the Mac ones? I would like to 
>>> play music through the house but not have VO through the house at the same 
>>> time. 
>>> Thanks for any help.
>>> Max.
>>> 
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To 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

Jonathan, now you’re just writing stuff to read it later, that’s just nutty.  
You make it like some huge personal assault against the great and mighty 
Jonathan Mosen, please, we’ve seen an adapter is going to exist so you have 
your precious 1960s technology.
 

In the end, probably 3 people are going to care about this issue over all and 
all 3 are on this list.:)

The average consumer doesn’t care what shape or size plug they use as long as 
when they plug it in the little light goes on and stuff works.


> On Sep 1, 2016, at 9:56 PM, Jonathan Mosen  wrote:
> 
> Keep fighting the good fight David. This is far too important an issue to 
> give up. Our money is as good as anyone else's and we must never give up 
> advocating for recognition of our need to be able to use our devices with 
> efficiency and privacy while also charging them. If it turns out that this 
> need has been met, then it will in part be due to courageous people like you 
> who have spoken up.
> Jonathan Mosen
> Mosen Consulting
> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
> http://Mosen.org 
>> On 2/09/2016, at 11:05 AM, David Griffith > > wrote:
>> 
>> As another deaf iPhone user I agree with everything you say but I htink you 
>> will probably not get that much understanding.  I tried to explain on this 
>> list about how a wired headset was essential for me but was accused 
>> bizarrely of being a troll because I dared to criticise an Apple innovation.
>> This did cause another another poster to comment that ironically some people 
>> are deaf to the concerns of those of with hearing impairments.
>> 
>> David Griffith
>> 
>> On 01/09/2016 20:07, Jonathan Mosen wrote:
>>> Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in the 
>>> same way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and require 
>>> decent latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected are such a 
>>> minority makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my 
>>> legal options under legislation here.
>>> A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a 
>>> blind person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth solution 
>>> is being used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has finished their call 
>>> or isn't listening to music, the technology goes into standby and uses very 
>>> little energy. A blind person has VO talking a lot of the time if they're 
>>> using their device for tasks like reading and creating documents, email 
>>> etc, so the impact is much greater.
>>> Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of their phone 
>>> with its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the adapter will not solve 
>>> the problem entirely if it means that you can't charge your device and use 
>>> headphones at the same time. I travel long distances for example, often 
>>> with flights over 12 hours long. I regularly take my Anka battery with me 
>>> and charge the phone while I use it to compensate for the inaccessible 
>>> in-flight entertainment system. It's important to me to have a full charge 
>>> when I reach my destination. Based on the information we have, it looks 
>>> like you can either listen to wired headphones or charge, not both.
>>> That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option appears to 
>>> have to choose between privacy and charge.
>>> Jonathan Mosen
>>> Mosen Consulting
>>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>>> http://Mosen.org 
 On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten > wrote:
 
 Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move, if it 
 means that they' very large hard of hearing community can't use  hearing 
 aids on iPhones anymore. That seems like such an incredibly stupid move on 
 Apple's part, that I am tempted to just believe that they wouldn't do it 
 if they didn't have a workaround that would work for people who use 
 hearing aids. The hard of hearing community is orders of magnitude larger 
 then the blind community. So Shirley, this adapter must be providing 
 someway for people who use hearing aids to keep on doing so. What am I 
 missing here? I remember sometime ago, when the idea that the headphone 
 jack would go away first came out, Jonathan wrote a very impassioned piece 
 on this subject, arguing that this was a very bad idea because of the use 
 case of hearing aids. Now Apple is going to do it anyway, but they're 
 offering an adapter. Why doesn't that solve the problem? I understand why 
 Bluetooth is not a good alternative, given Jonathan's comments on battery 
 drain and the well-known problem for voiceover users with latency. It's 
 still really bad, at least on my phone with my  legend. I would not want 
 to have to type on 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Davert]

Hello all. I'm going to address several messages at once on this thread.
Jonathan: you are 100% correct about the access issue for those of us
who wear hearing aids and who are blind. Sadly, the market is rarely
designed wit our needs being considered because, as you say, we're
such a small minority. And within that minority, how many of us are
actively reading online articles and tracking tech trends to even push
this issue forward? I, too, have utilized my contacts at Apple to try
and make them aware of this issue. While I doubt we will reverse
hardware development, perhaps they will at least give our user case
some consideration and may figure out a way to address it. Without
going in to detail, it does seem that bluetooth audio in iOS 10 is a
bit less laggy, but we still have all of the other issues you
mentioned concerning battery life and so on.
Mike: regarding your question of Android accessibility, since I think
it's somewhat relevant to this discussion, my issue isn't so much with
TalkBack, but with BrailleBack. As someone who has taken to primarily
accessing my devices through braille displays, Android has a long long
way to go in terms of giving equal access to the operating system.
TalkBack has certainly come a long way, but BrailleBack has not. I
have passed along numerous bits of feedback to Google on this issue,
and all the responses are get are things like: then stick with iOS.
Now the standard response seems to be that since BrailleBack is open
source, Google expects someone else to solve their problems for them.
You can have decent braille access on Android if you wish to shell out
a few grand for a BrailleNote Touch which is already running an
outdated version of the OS, but this, too, has many limitations.

Thanks for reading,
Scott

On 9/2/16, Devin Prater  wrote:
> Well, I've gotten rather into Android and Linux a lot lately, although I
> still use my iPhone for reading email until I can find a mod for my
> device that'll give me Android 6 or 7, so if Apple does something I
> don't like, I have options I can turn to.
>
>
> On 09/02/2016 04:06 AM, Portia Scott wrote:
>> Yes, it will be interesting to see, For me as well. I am not one of those
>> who buy the latest and greatest Devices right away anymore, either. LOL. I
>> used to be, but I have grown a lot, and learned not to be like that
>> anymore. As people say, only time will tell what happens.
>>
>> Take care, and have a wonderful day.
>>
>> Portia.
>>> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:22 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
>>>
>>> I will be interested to see the headphones they have with the new phones
>>> when they are released.
>>>
>>> I use my current ones for pretty much everything when I'm out and about
>>> including using my MBA so people don't hear it talking or so I can  hear
>>> things with out the surrounding noises
>>>
>>> If these new phones are some new form of BT then I'll be happy if they
>>> can connect to multiple devices such as my iPhone iPad and MBA.
>>> Oh and my watch.
>>>
>>> Cheers.
>>>
>>>
>>> Simon F
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Robin
>>> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 12:59 AM
>>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>>> Subject: RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the
>>> iPhone seven
>>>
>>> I Agree
>>> With YourAssessment
>>>
>>> TimeWillTell
>>>
>>> If TheRemoval of the iPhone's HeadSet Jack deters Users from
>>> PurchasingIt
>>>
>>> Exluding the Normal AppleFan
>>>
>>> Meaning WhetherOrNot Sales Pummet RatherQuickly At 11:15 PM 8/31/2016,
>>> you wrote:
 Hello Mary,

 My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an
 active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have
 alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that
 companies pay attention.

 Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically
 ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts,
 I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better
 will make it so.

 I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it
 would change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my
 world hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.

 As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to
 follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of
 Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when
 it follows."

 My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately
 for me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest
 device just because it is the latest.

 Mark

 -Original Message-
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

Um, money has nothing to do with this.

What’s the real factors are size / thickness and durability.  You can seal up 
that lightning port against water and damage easily and it’s a thinner package 
than a headphone jack so you can shave a millimeter or 2 from the thickness 
which really is a big deal.  You could also almost grow the case on to the 
phone making it super durable with no joints.


> On Sep 1, 2016, at 10:28 PM, Michael Marshall  
> wrote:
> 
> There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was reversed.
> The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
>> On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen > > wrote:
>> 
>> I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a huge 
>> negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope the 
>> inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this and 
>> reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New Zealand. I'm 
>> the only blind person there, and people are justifiably livid about the 
>> removal of the headphone jack. Most people don't want this, and I suspect 
>> based on what has leaked that the benefits to most people of upgrading will 
>> be so incremental that the lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of 
>> people to sit it out.
>> That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, because 
>> one thing that this process has taught me since I started blogging about the 
>> possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm at a time when it may 
>> have made a difference, is that I was naive to think that blind people might 
>> be any more sensitive to and respectful of the accessibility needs of 
>> others, such as the hearing impaired. I guess I would like to think that 
>> since we know what impact inaccessibility can have on our own lives, we 
>> would be sensitive to the needs of others, even when the issues didn't 
>> affect us directly. But that has proven a stupid pipe dream on my part, and 
>> I've found the whole thing really upsetting. For the most part, it seems 
>> like it's everyone for themselves these days, and if others are being thrown 
>> under the bus, well too damn bad.
>> As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid 
>> wearer, i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost all 
>> the time I use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for someone 
>> who moves through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were to improve, 
>> Bluetooth drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and it's difficult 
>> to get through an entire business day of use without the need to charge 
>> something.
>> And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
>> charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, selfish, 
>> stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, which 
>> parades their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of honour, 
>> appears to be about to crap all over one segment of its accessibility market.
>> Something isn't automatically the future because Apple says it is. And 
>> they're going too far this time, alienating too many people. Perhaps, in 
>> time, a USB-C-based solution is going to be viable, and receive carefully 
>> managed industry-wide adoption. But Apple isn't using USB-C on its iDevices. 
>> It's using a proprietary port that it doesn't even offer on its own personal 
>> computers, meaning you won't be able to use the Lightning-based Ear Pods 
>> even with a Mac. That's two sets of headphones you're going to have to carry 
>> around with you, unless you don't mind having an adapter jutting out of the 
>> port you want to charge your phone with. Absolutely absurd.
>> I believe it was Samsung that recently put out a series of ads mocking Apple 
>> over the potential lack of a headphone jack. They know Apple has given them 
>> a great gift. I just wish Android accessibility were more viable for daily 
>> use. Because once my 6s Plus eventually expires, I'm really going to be 
>> stuck. Hopefully, Apple will have seen sense by then because there is 
>> certainly going to be a backlash.
>> Jonathan Mosen
>> Mosen Consulting
>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>> http://Mosen.org 
>>> On 1/09/2016, at 6:15 PM, M. Taylor >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Hello Mary,
>>> 
>>> My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
>>> active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have alternatives 
>>> and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that companies pay 
>>> attention.  
>>> 
>>> Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically ridiculous 
>>> decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, I'm not so 
>>> certain that just because it decides something it better will make 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

Mary, i could be way wrong here but I thought the Samsung S5 at least had a usb 
port where you attached the headphones with an adapter.  I could be remembering 
wrong though.

> On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:26 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took away 
> the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people complain. 
> They took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring that back, 
> despite complaint. They do what they want. There is no immediately efficient 
> replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has never had one. People have 
> complained forever about the fact that it is harder to access the whole file 
> system on Apple devices. As Apple change that? No they have not.
> 
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall  > wrote:
> 
>> There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was reversed.
>> The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
>>> On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a huge 
>>> negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope the 
>>> inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this and 
>>> reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New Zealand. 
>>> I'm the only blind person there, and people are justifiably livid about the 
>>> removal of the headphone jack. Most people don't want this, and I suspect 
>>> based on what has leaked that the benefits to most people of upgrading will 
>>> be so incremental that the lack of a headphone jack will cause a lot of 
>>> people to sit it out.
>>> That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, because 
>>> one thing that this process has taught me since I started blogging about 
>>> the possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm at a time when it 
>>> may have made a difference, is that I was naive to think that blind people 
>>> might be any more sensitive to and respectful of the accessibility needs of 
>>> others, such as the hearing impaired. I guess I would like to think that 
>>> since we know what impact inaccessibility can have on our own lives, we 
>>> would be sensitive to the needs of others, even when the issues didn't 
>>> affect us directly. But that has proven a stupid pipe dream on my part, and 
>>> I've found the whole thing really upsetting. For the most part, it seems 
>>> like it's everyone for themselves these days, and if others are being 
>>> thrown under the bus, well too damn bad.
>>> As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid 
>>> wearer, i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost all 
>>> the time I use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for someone 
>>> who moves through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were to improve, 
>>> Bluetooth drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and it's difficult 
>>> to get through an entire business day of use without the need to charge 
>>> something.
>>> And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
>>> charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, selfish, 
>>> stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, which 
>>> parades their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of honour, 
>>> appears to be about to crap all over one segment of its accessibility 
>>> market.
>>> Something isn't automatically the future because Apple says it is. And 
>>> they're going too far this time, alienating too many people. Perhaps, in 
>>> time, a USB-C-based solution is going to be viable, and receive carefully 
>>> managed industry-wide adoption. But Apple isn't using USB-C on its 
>>> iDevices. It's using a proprietary port that it doesn't even offer on its 
>>> own personal computers, meaning you won't be able to use the 
>>> Lightning-based Ear Pods even with a Mac. That's two sets of headphones 
>>> you're going to have to carry around with you, unless you don't mind having 
>>> an adapter jutting out of the port you want to charge your phone with. 
>>> Absolutely absurd.
>>> I believe it was Samsung that recently put out a series of ads mocking 
>>> Apple over the potential lack of a headphone jack. They know Apple has 
>>> given them a great gift. I just wish Android accessibility were more viable 
>>> for daily use. Because once my 6s Plus eventually expires, I'm really going 
>>> to be stuck. Hopefully, Apple will have seen sense by then because there is 
>>> certainly going to be a backlash.
>>> Jonathan Mosen
>>> Mosen Consulting
>>> Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
>>> http://Mosen.org 
 On 1/09/2016, at 6:15 PM, M. Taylor 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Scott Granados]

I personally could care less what the memory size is.  All my content is 
streamed so I don’t use much of it other than for application memory.  Whether 
it’s 16, 32, or 256 GB it’s all the same.  The only thing I find is the higher 
memory units have a better resale value.




> On Sep 1, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> Yes. I too would like to be able to plug my eye device into a PC or Mac and 
> access that like I could  A thumb drive. I would also like a storage slot, so 
> that damned 16 GB model they sell wouldn't be so ridiculously limited. Yes, I 
> know they are supposedly upping it to 32, big deal. On the other hand, my 
> android device is a nexus, because it gets timely updates, just like apples 
> things do. No storage card there either. Nothing is perfect.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:30 PM, Michael Marshall  > wrote:
> 
>> The article I read must' have been gravely misinformed.
>> I would just like to download files from Safari to my iPhone such as mp3 
>> files.
>> viewing it as a harddrive like the Android phones.
>>> On 2 Sep. 2016, at 1:26 pm, Mary Otten >> > wrote:
>>> 
>>> Samsung tried what? Samsung did not remove the headphone jack. They took 
>>> away the storage card slot. And they brought it back, because people 
>>> complain. They took away the user replaceable battery. They did not bring 
>>> that back, despite complaint. They do what they want. There is no 
>>> immediately efficient replacement for that storage card slot. Apple has 
>>> never had one. People have complained forever about the fact that it is 
>>> harder to access the whole file system on Apple devices. As Apple change 
>>> that? No they have not.
>>> 
>>> Mary
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 7:28 PM, Michael Marshall >> > wrote:
>>> 
 There will definitely be a backlash, Samsung tried this and it was 
 reversed.
 The reason Apple is doing this is simple, money.
> On 1 Sep. 2016, at 6:28 pm, Jonathan Mosen  > wrote:
> 
> I'm in full agreement with you mark. The headphone jack removal has a 
> huge negative accessibility impact for me personally, and I have to hope 
> the inconvenience factor will cause Apple to regret the day they did this 
> and reverse it. I frequent a forum for IT professionals here in New 
> Zealand. I'm the only blind person there, and people are justifiably 
> livid about the removal of the headphone jack. Most people don't want 
> this, and I suspect based on what has leaked that the benefits to most 
> people of upgrading will be so incremental that the lack of a headphone 
> jack will cause a lot of people to sit it out.
> That gives me some hope in a situation that has really affected me, 
> because one thing that this process has taught me since I started 
> blogging about the possibility of the headphone jack to raise the alarm 
> at a time when it may have made a difference, is that I was naive to 
> think that blind people might be any more sensitive to and respectful of 
> the accessibility needs of others, such as the hearing impaired. I guess 
> I would like to think that since we know what impact inaccessibility can 
> have on our own lives, we would be sensitive to the needs of others, even 
> when the issues didn't affect us directly. But that has proven a stupid 
> pipe dream on my part, and I've found the whole thing really upsetting. 
> For the most part, it seems like it's everyone for themselves these days, 
> and if others are being thrown under the bus, well too damn bad.
> As a hearing aid wearer, I can't use Apple's ear pods. As a hearing aid 
> wearer, i need to have my phone connected to the headphone jack almost 
> all the time I use it. Bluetooth latency is abysmal and not viable for 
> someone who moves through their phone at a good clip. Even if this were 
> to improve, Bluetooth drains hearing aid batteries in a profound way and 
> it's difficult to get through an entire business day of use without the 
> need to charge something.
> And if I use the provided lightning adapter, then it appears I can't then 
> charge my phone while I use my phone. This is the most senseless, 
> selfish, stupid, user-unfriendly thing Apple has ever done. This company, 
> which parades their accessibility efforts like some sort of badge of 
> honour, appears to be about to crap all over one segment of its 
> accessibility market.
> Something isn't automatically the future because Apple says it is. And 
> they're going too far this time, alienating too many people. Perhaps, in 
> time, a USB-C-based 

Re: More Questions Concerning Express VPN

[Scott Granados]

As far as the VPN software being resource hogs, no not really with the 
following caveat.  Your network will be slower because everything is being 
redirected through a host out on the network somewhere.  So it adds steps on to 
your packet’s trip.  What you lose in performance you gain in encryption and 
security features so consider that.

Also, you will still need your other software packages like antivirus and such.

And did someone say pipes?  :)

> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:33 AM, Bill Gallik  wrote:
> 
> To those recommending “Express VPN,” I have some further questions on the 
> matter.
> 
> Does Express VPN serve as a general anti-malware utility?
> 
> If I install Express VPN will I be able to get rid of any and all Avast 
> software?
> 
> Is Express VPN reasonably accessible via BoiceOver?
> 
> Is Express VPN a “resource hog” in any sense?
> 
> - Bill & Leader Dog Holland
> - "The problem with people who have no vices is that you can be pretty sure 
> they are going to have some pretty  annoying virtues."
> - Elizabeth Taylor, 20th Century Screen Actress, (1932-2011)--
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
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> 
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> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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Re: More Questions Concerning Express VPN

[Jonathan Cohn]

No, Express VPN and several other services like it are designed to encrypt and 
lock down all communication so that when you are at a coffee shop or other 
public wireless hotspot your communications with the network can't be tampered 
with.  If you consider the internet a set of pipes (Scott will get me for that 
analogy), then VPN services make the place you connect your hose to the pipes a 
different place. 

So there are two advantages:
1. People in the coffee shop can't spy on your traffic because it is all 
encrypted. This is a bit less of a deal recently since more and more web sites 
are using HTTPS instead of HTTP.
2. You appear on the Internet as being in a ExpressVpn's data center  instead 
of Joe's coffee Shop.  

Best wishes,


Jonathan



> On Sep 2, 2016, at 2:33 AM, Bill Gallik  wrote:
> 
> To those recommending “Express VPN,” I have some further questions on the 
> matter.
> 
> Does Express VPN serve as a general anti-malware utility?
> 
> If I install Express VPN will I be able to get rid of any and all Avast 
> software?
> 
> Is Express VPN reasonably accessible via BoiceOver?
> 
> Is Express VPN a “resource hog” in any sense?
> 
> - Bill & Leader Dog Holland
> - "The problem with people who have no vices is that you can be pretty sure 
> they are going to have some pretty  annoying virtues."
> - Elizabeth Taylor, 20th Century Screen Actress, (1932-2011)--
> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
> 
> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
> --- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "MacVisionaries" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to macvisionaries+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Devin Prater]

Well, I've gotten rather into Android and Linux a lot lately, although I 
still use my iPhone for reading email until I can find a mod for my 
device that'll give me Android 6 or 7, so if Apple does something I 
don't like, I have options I can turn to.



On 09/02/2016 04:06 AM, Portia Scott wrote:

Yes, it will be interesting to see, For me as well. I am not one of those who 
buy the latest and greatest Devices right away anymore, either. LOL. I used to 
be, but I have grown a lot, and learned not to be like that anymore. As people 
say, only time will tell what happens.

Take care, and have a wonderful day.

Portia.

On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:22 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:

I will be interested to see the headphones they have with the new phones when 
they are released.

I use my current ones for pretty much everything when I'm out and about 
including using my MBA so people don't hear it talking or so I can  hear things 
with out the surrounding noises

If these new phones are some new form of BT then I'll be happy if they can 
connect to multiple devices such as my iPhone iPad and MBA.
Oh and my watch.

Cheers.


Simon F
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Robin
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 12:59 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

I Agree
With YourAssessment

TimeWillTell

If TheRemoval of the iPhone's HeadSet Jack deters Users from PurchasingIt

Exluding the Normal AppleFan

Meaning WhetherOrNot Sales Pummet RatherQuickly At 11:15 PM 8/31/2016, you 
wrote:

Hello Mary,

My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an
active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have
alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that
companies pay attention.

Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically
ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts,
I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better
will make it so.

I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it
would change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my
world hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.

As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to
follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of
Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when
it follows."

My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately
for me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest
device just because it is the latest.

Mark

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 12:33 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding
3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

Hi Mark,
Of course, only time will tell. But I think you are wrong about the
disappearing headphone jack.
For one thing, Samsung put back the storage card thing, but did not put
back the user replaceable battery. Also, if the other rumor is true,
Apple will be including compatible earbuds with the new phone, as well
as an adapter to make it possible for people to use other headphones.
Given the prevalence of Bluetooth these days, I suspect that the
headphone jack will in fact be gone from iPhones forever. Other device
makers are already moving in this direction. So it isn't just Apple. In
fact, they will not be the first ones to market without a headphone
jack on the phone.


Sent from my iPhone


On Aug 31, 2016, at 11:05 AM, M. Taylor  wrote:

Well, as for me, I'm going to sit back and

see how the market accepts the new iPhone 7 trans a separate earphone jack.

When Samsung attempted to make its devices

thinner by (1) removing the removable battery and (2) removing the
ability to add auxiliary memory to its flagship phones, it soon
reversed its decision as the market, effectively, rejected the devices
in favor of other companies who kept those features.

A couple of years ago, when Apple decided to

remove the ability for iOS devices to have their photo content
immediately available to PC users upon attaching the device to the
computer, the marketplace went crazy and vowed to turn to Android if
Apple insisted on forcing people to use iTunes in order to manage
photos.

Like Samsung, Apple immediately reversed

itself by restoring this feature in the subsequent release of iTunes.

So, I'll just wait and see for, unless 7 is a

complete hit, something tells me that iPhone 8 will bring the jack
back (smile).

Mark

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com

[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill Gallik

Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 9:43 AM
To: 

RE: VO threw a bluetooth speaker

[Simon Fogarty]

This can actually be done now,

I use Sonos from my mac book air and iPhones & iPods and the music goes through 
the sonos speakerds  but the voiceover speech comes through the MBA or pod etc 
so the sonos speakers is where the music only plays even works great with a 
Bluetooth speaker where the sonos sounds play through those sonos speakers and 
I can play audio through my bt speaker as well.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 7:01 PM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: VO threw a bluetooth speaker

Correct. VoiceOver is going to have multiple audio sources support in iOS10 
and, for your reference, tvOS 10.

On 2 Sep 2016, at 04:12, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> 
> According to info I have read, this will be possible in iOS 10.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 2 Sep 2016, at 15:01, Agent086b  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> Hi,
>> if I have asked this before I have forgotten the answer. Can I have VO 
>> through a bluetooth speaker and music through the Mac ones? I would like to 
>> play music through the house but not have VO through the house at the same 
>> time. 
>> Thanks for any help.
>> Max.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
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>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
>> --- 
>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
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> 
> -- 
> The following information is important for all members of the Mac Visionaries 
> list.
> 
> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
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> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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You 

Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Portia Scott]

Yes, it will be interesting to see, For me as well. I am not one of those who 
buy the latest and greatest Devices right away anymore, either. LOL. I used to 
be, but I have grown a lot, and learned not to be like that anymore. As people 
say, only time will tell what happens.

Take care, and have a wonderful day.

Portia.
> On Sep 2, 2016, at 1:22 AM, Simon Fogarty  wrote:
> 
> I will be interested to see the headphones they have with the new phones when 
> they are released.
> 
> I use my current ones for pretty much everything when I'm out and about 
> including using my MBA so people don't hear it talking or so I can  hear 
> things with out the surrounding noises 
> 
> If these new phones are some new form of BT then I'll be happy if they can 
> connect to multiple devices such as my iPhone iPad and MBA.
> Oh and my watch.
> 
> Cheers.
> 
> 
> Simon F
> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Robin
> Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 12:59 AM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
> iPhone seven
> 
> I Agree
> With YourAssessment
> 
> TimeWillTell
> 
> If TheRemoval of the iPhone's HeadSet Jack deters Users from PurchasingIt
> 
> Exluding the Normal AppleFan
> 
> Meaning WhetherOrNot Sales Pummet RatherQuickly At 11:15 PM 8/31/2016, you 
> wrote:
>> Hello Mary,
>> 
>> My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
>> active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have 
>> alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that 
>> companies pay attention.
>> 
>> Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically 
>> ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, 
>> I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better 
>> will make it so.
>> 
>> I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it 
>> would change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my 
>> world hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.
>> 
>> As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to 
>> follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of 
>> Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when 
>> it follows."
>> 
>> My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately 
>> for me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest 
>> device just because it is the latest.
>> 
>> Mark
>> 
>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 12:33 PM
>> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding
>> 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven
>> 
>> Hi Mark,
>> Of course, only time will tell. But I think you are wrong about the 
>> disappearing headphone jack.
>> For one thing, Samsung put back the storage card thing, but did not put 
>> back the user replaceable battery. Also, if the other rumor is true, 
>> Apple will be including compatible earbuds with the new phone, as well 
>> as an adapter to make it possible for people to use other headphones.
>> Given the prevalence of Bluetooth these days, I suspect that the 
>> headphone jack will in fact be gone from iPhones forever. Other device 
>> makers are already moving in this direction. So it isn't just Apple. In 
>> fact, they will not be the first ones to market without a headphone 
>> jack on the phone.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Aug 31, 2016, at 11:05 AM, M. Taylor  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, as for me, I'm going to sit back and
>> see how the market accepts the new iPhone 7 trans a separate earphone jack.
>>> 
>>> When Samsung attempted to make its devices
>> thinner by (1) removing the removable battery and (2) removing the 
>> ability to add auxiliary memory to its flagship phones, it soon 
>> reversed its decision as the market, effectively, rejected the devices 
>> in favor of other companies who kept those features.
>>> 
>>> A couple of years ago, when Apple decided to
>> remove the ability for iOS devices to have their photo content 
>> immediately available to PC users upon attaching the device to the 
>> computer, the marketplace went crazy and vowed to turn to Android if 
>> Apple insisted on forcing people to use iTunes in order to manage 
>> photos.
>>> 
>>> Like Samsung, Apple immediately reversed
>> itself by restoring this feature in the subsequent release of iTunes.
>>> 
>>> So, I'll just wait and see for, unless 7 is a
>> complete hit, something tells me that iPhone 8 will bring the jack 
>> back (smile).
>>> 
>>> Mark
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill Gallik
>>> Sent: 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Jonathan,

I can see what your saying however are you not pushing things looking at legal 
options when other options are available to yo.

I would think that if people put it to apple abot the adaptor needing a 
lightening port for charging while using the headphone jack surely they would 
realise why the option is required.

From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Jonathan Mosen
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 7:07 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Hi Mary, unfortunately this issue doesn't affect the Deaf community in the same 
way as it affects blind people who wear hearing aids and require decent 
latency. And the fact that those of us who are affected are such a minority 
makes us more vulnerable. You can be sure I am considering my legal options 
under legislation here.
A standard hearing aid wearer uses their phone actively far less than a blind 
person who wears a hearing aid. For example, if a Bluetooth solution is being 
used, after a standard hearing aid wearer has finished their call or isn't 
listening to music, the technology goes into standby and uses very little 
energy. A blind person has VO talking a lot of the time if they're using their 
device for tasks like reading and creating documents, email etc, so the impact 
is much greater.
Even if people are willing to accept an adapter jutting out of their phone with 
its resultant potential to be lost or bent, the adapter will not solve the 
problem entirely if it means that you can't charge your device and use 
headphones at the same time. I travel long distances for example, often with 
flights over 12 hours long. I regularly take my Anka battery with me and charge 
the phone while I use it to compensate for the inaccessible in-flight 
entertainment system. It's important to me to have a full charge when I reach 
my destination. Based on the information we have, it looks like you can either 
listen to wired headphones or charge, not both.
That means that every VoiceOver user who chooses a wired option appears to have 
to choose between privacy and charge.
Jonathan Mosen
Mosen Consulting
Blindness technology eBooks, tutorials and training
http://Mosen.org

On 2/09/2016, at 4:41 AM, Mary Otten 
> wrote:

Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move, if it means 
that they' very large hard of hearing community can't use  hearing aids on 
iPhones anymore. That seems like such an incredibly stupid move on Apple's 
part, that I am tempted to just believe that they wouldn't do it if they didn't 
have a workaround that would work for people who use hearing aids. The hard of 
hearing community is orders of magnitude larger then the blind community. So 
Shirley, this adapter must be providing someway for people who use hearing aids 
to keep on doing so. What am I missing here? I remember sometime ago, when the 
idea that the headphone jack would go away first came out, Jonathan wrote a 
very impassioned piece on this subject, arguing that this was a very bad idea 
because of the use case of hearing aids. Now Apple is going to do it anyway, 
but they're offering an adapter. Why doesn't that solve the problem? I 
understand why Bluetooth is not a good alternative, given Jonathan's comments 
on battery drain and the well-known problem for voiceover users with latency. 
It's still really bad, at least on my phone with my  legend. I would not want 
to have to type on that system for anything more than a word or two, because 
the latency between when you touch a letter and when you hear it is much too 
long.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone


On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:53 AM, Scott Granados 
> wrote:

Mary, you’re exactly right and points well stated as always.  Here’s another 
point to consider, suppose we add wireless charging. Now, you could have a 
brick with no ports what so ever formed from one solid piece of material.  You 
could almost grow the casing and have a super durable waterproof phone with no 
openings at all.  The entire surface could be a screen.  Not needing ports is a 
good thing over all.




On Aug 31, 2016, at 3:33 PM, Mary Otten 
> wrote:

Hi Mark,
Of course, only time will tell. But I think you are wrong about the 
disappearing headphone jack. For one thing, Samsung put back the storage card 
thing, but did not put back the user replaceable battery. Also, if the other 
rumor is true, Apple will be including compatible earbuds with the new phone, 
as well as an adapter to make it possible for people to use other headphones. 
Given the prevalence of Bluetooth these days, I suspect that the headphone jack 
will in fact be gone from iPhones forever. Other device makers are already 
moving in this direction. So it isn't just 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

I also have this watch and the only thing I have against it is I forget to set 
it in meetings to not ring if I get a call.

I'd really like to see a new version have a sim card slot so I could use the 
watch as an independent device without the phone. 
 Or even you get both options.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of christopher hallsworth
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 6:20 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Hi Mary

I have the Apple Watch Sport myself and like it a lot. Yes, watchOS 3.0 will 
have some great new accessibility features, but for now you can turn a setting 
off that wakes the screen when you raise your wrist. I have done this, and the 
watch no longer interrupts my daily living. I can dine for example and the 
watch will not go off. The setting can be found under general > wake screen.
> On 1 Sep 2016, at 17:50, Mary Otten  wrote:
> 
> I guess I'm still with the folks who haven't really seen the utility, or at 
> least the really over whelming use case for having the watch. Perhaps the 
> next iteration will change my mind. Admittedly one reason for my reluctance 
> on this score has been the fact that I am probably one of the few people who 
> still uses a braille watch. I despise talking time devices that go off at the 
> most inopportune times, such as during a meeting at Cetera. With the new 2.0, 
> will be getting the ability to have the vibrating feedback to tell the time. 
> So that is a step in the right direction. I guess I just haven't seen the 
> killer use case yet.
> Mary
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:14 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
>> 
>> You have to get a watch to get it but I find my absolutely critical now.  
>> It’s so nice to be able to quickly flick and get the latest pop on your 
>> watch or be able to walk away from your phone and just access quick data 
>> nicely on your wrist.  For sited users, being able to glance down say while 
>> driving even or in various settings where you don’t want to break your focus 
>> for a full look at your phone.
>>   Another nice set of features are the health features.  Even a gentle tap 
>> on the wrist to just stand up and move around and stretch hourly or 
>> motivation to meet your workout goals.
>>   You can quick respond again from your wrist to messages or take a quick 
>> call.  It’s hard to explain.  Also, the Apple watch is more independent than 
>> people think.  Since version 2.1 I believe it was given WiFi functions so it 
>> can join your home network or other WiFi networks with some caveats and work 
>> independently from the phone including placing and receiving calls if your 
>> carrier supports WiFi calling which my carrier does fully.  
>>   To be clear, I was with you and then I got one as a gift and now I don’t 
>> know what I’d do with out it and I’m dead excited to see watch 2.0 next week.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Sep 1, 2016, at 10:01 AM, Mike Arrigo  wrote:
>>> 
>>> I've never really understood the point of the Apple watch, sure it can run 
>>> apps, but so what, my phone does that, and the watch requires a phone 
>>> connection to do most things anyway, totally redundant.
>>> Original message:
 Hello Mary,
>>> 
 My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
 active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have 
 alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that 
 companies pay attention.
>>> 
 Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically ridiculous 
 decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, I'm not so 
 certain that just because it decides something it better will make it so.
>>> 
 I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it would 
 change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my world 
 hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.
>>> 
 As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to 
 follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of 
 Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when it 
 follows."
>>> 
 My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately for 
 me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest device 
 just because it is the latest.
>>> 
 Mark
>>> 
 -Original Message-
 From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
 [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
 Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 12:33 PM
 To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
 Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
 iPhone seven
>>> 
 Hi Mark,
 Of course, only time will tell. 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Mary,

 I’m not a hearing aid user but surely the adaptor is going to allow them to 
use the aids with the phone?

 However what's going to happen when your using the adaptor plugged in to the 
lightening port and you have your headphones plugged in to the adaptor also and 
then you want to charge your device?

Will the adaptor have a second  lightening port to allow for charging while 
using?

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Mary Otten
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 4:42 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Well, just to be clear, I personally would be against this move, if it means 
that they' very large hard of hearing community can't use  hearing aids on 
iPhones anymore. That seems like such an incredibly stupid move on Apple's 
part, that I am tempted to just believe that they wouldn't do it if they didn't 
have a workaround that would work for people who use hearing aids. The hard of 
hearing community is orders of magnitude larger then the blind community. So 
Shirley, this adapter must be providing someway for people who use hearing aids 
to keep on doing so. What am I missing here? I remember sometime ago, when the 
idea that the headphone jack would go away first came out, Jonathan wrote a 
very impassioned piece on this subject, arguing that this was a very bad idea 
because of the use case of hearing aids. Now Apple is going to do it anyway, 
but they're offering an adapter. Why doesn't that solve the problem? I 
understand why Bluetooth is not a good alternative, given Jonathan's comments 
on battery drain and the well-known problem for voiceover users with latency. 
It's still really bad, at least on my phone with my Plantronics legend. I would 
not want to have to type on that system for anything more than a word or two, 
because the latency between when you touch a letter and when you hear it is 
much too long.
Mary


Sent from my iPhone

> On Sep 1, 2016, at 8:53 AM, Scott Granados  wrote:
> 
> Mary, you’re exactly right and points well stated as always.  Here’s another 
> point to consider, suppose we add wireless charging. Now, you could have a 
> brick with no ports what so ever formed from one solid piece of material.  
> You could almost grow the casing and have a super durable waterproof phone 
> with no openings at all.  The entire surface could be a screen.  Not needing 
> ports is a good thing over all.
> 
> 
> 
>> On Aug 31, 2016, at 3:33 PM, Mary Otten  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi Mark,
>> Of course, only time will tell. But I think you are wrong about the 
>> disappearing headphone jack. For one thing, Samsung put back the storage 
>> card thing, but did not put back the user replaceable battery. Also, if the 
>> other rumor is true, Apple will be including compatible earbuds with the new 
>> phone, as well as an adapter to make it possible for people to use other 
>> headphones. Given the prevalence of Bluetooth these days, I suspect that the 
>> headphone jack will in fact be gone from iPhones forever. Other device 
>> makers are already moving in this direction. So it isn't just Apple. In 
>> fact, they will not be the first ones to market without a headphone jack on 
>> the phone.
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>>> On Aug 31, 2016, at 11:05 AM, M. Taylor  wrote:
>>> 
>>> Well, as for me, I'm going to sit back and see how the market accepts the 
>>> new iPhone 7 trans a separate earphone jack.  
>>> 
>>> When Samsung attempted to make its devices thinner by (1) removing the 
>>> removable battery and (2) removing the ability to add auxiliary memory to 
>>> its flagship phones, it soon reversed its decision as the market, 
>>> effectively, rejected the devices in favor of other companies who kept 
>>> those features.
>>> 
>>> A couple of years ago, when Apple decided to remove the ability for iOS 
>>> devices to have their photo content immediately available to PC users upon 
>>> attaching the device to the computer, the marketplace went crazy and vowed 
>>> to turn to Android if Apple insisted on forcing people to use iTunes in 
>>> order to manage photos.  
>>> 
>>> Like Samsung, Apple immediately reversed itself by restoring this feature 
>>> in the subsequent release of iTunes.  
>>> 
>>> So, I'll just wait and see for, unless 7 is a complete hit, something tells 
>>> me that iPhone 8 will bring the jack back (smile).  
>>> 
>>> Mark 
>>> 
>>> -Original Message-
>>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill Gallik
>>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 9:43 AM
>>> To: MacVisionaries E-Mail List
>>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the 
>>> iPhone seven
>>> 
>>> When all the “hubbub” concerning Apple removing the earphone jack first 
>>> 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

Hi Folks,
 Just going to add a thought in here.

 Any one thought about the future and what's going to happen in it?

 If everyones getting upset because apple have made the first move towards 
getting rid of the headphone jack in devices then what the hell is going to 
happen next,

Well if this feedback we're reading is anything to go by the world for blind 
people will end!

 Remember things change for the good and the bad in life,

 But what ever happens the majority of people work on and get over the bridges 
that spring up in front of us.

Till now I prefer headphones with the 3.5 mil jack as they're small and easy to 
put in a pocket to carry around,

If I have to put an adaptor in my pocket or bag or what ever then I'm going to 
have to do it.

 But lets face it we don't really know what apple will do till they do it  and 
they may have a really genius idea as a replacement for the headphones we've 
had up till now.

 Which I have to admit I have about 6 pair never used sitting in a box of 
extras  so at least at this point I've got spares for my notebook and ipad till 
they change also.

And they could change things again yet to USB C 

Just thinking out of the box,

 Try thinking about now and not about tomorrow, you might not make it, no one 
can actually tell.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of E.T.
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:06 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

Adding one tiny bit of gear to carry around is going to be a giant issue? 
Good grief. I wonder how much impact that will have on me when I lug around 
15-20 pounds of gear on a regular basis. This little adapter just might be the 
straw that breaks my back. (smiles)

 From E.T.'s Keyboard...
   Are We Alone in the Universe?
ancient.ali...@icloud.com

On 9/1/2016 6:08 AM, Kimber Gardner wrote:
> You're sort of missing the point, I think. The point being that most 
> people (me included) don't think they should have to carry extra bits 
> around to do something as basic as plug in a set of earphones.
>
> On 9/1/16, Saqib Hussain  wrote:
>> Hi. I use Bluetooth stereo headphones so this new revelation doesn’t 
>> effect me. I wouldn’t even carry an adaptor around with me because 
>> I’m not one for carrying extra bits around just to accomplish a 
>> simple task like wanting to plug your headphones in.
>>> On 31 Aug 2016, at 13:29, Michael Marshall 
>>> 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> hey all,
>>> I know there have been many leaks of supposed schematics and things 
>>> on the new iPhone seven and if or not it will have a 3.5mm jack.
>>> The latest leak I believe has credence.
>>> In the box with the iPhone seven, you will get a lightning to 3.5 mm 
>>> adapter witch is what i guessed apple would do if they did take the 
>>> jack from the phone.
>>> If this is indeed the case I am quite satisfied because at least 
>>> they have made an adapter readily available.
>>>
>>> Michael
>>>
>>> To post messages to this group, please use the following address:
>>> mac-acc...@mac-access.net
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>>> by posting to:
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>>> mac-access-dig...@mac-access.net
>>>
>>> Please remember to keep your subscriber options current.  We are not 
>>> responsible should things go amiss when, for example, you change 
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>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> --
>>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>>> Visionaries list.
>>>
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>>> contact the owners or moderators directly rather than posting on the list 
>>> itself.
>>>
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>>>
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>>
>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>>
>> If you have any questions or 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

If you try using one you might actually change your mind about that.

And if the idea of putting a sim card in to a watch comes true with the next 
version then phone gone.

-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Mike Arrigo
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 2:01 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

I've never really understood the point of the Apple watch, sure it can run 
apps, but so what, my phone does that, and the watch requires a phone 
connection to do most things anyway, totally redundant.
Original message:
> Hello Mary,

> My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
> active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have 
> alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that 
> companies pay attention.

> Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically 
> ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, 
> I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better 
> will make it so.

> I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it 
> would change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my 
> world hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.

> As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to 
> follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of 
> Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when 
> it follows."

> My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately 
> for me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest 
> device just because it is the latest.

> Mark

> -Original Message-
> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 12:33 PM
> To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on 
> the iPhone seven

> Hi Mark,
> Of course, only time will tell. But I think you are wrong about the 
> disappearing headphone jack. For one thing, Samsung put back the 
> storage card thing, but did not put back the user replaceable battery.
> Also, if the other rumor is true, Apple will be including compatible 
> earbuds with the new phone, as well as an adapter to make it possible 
> for people to use other headphones. Given the prevalence of Bluetooth 
> these days, I suspect that the headphone jack will in fact be gone 
> from iPhones forever. Other device makers are already moving in this 
> direction. So it isn't just Apple. In fact, they will not be the first 
> ones to market without a headphone jack on the phone.


> Sent from my iPhone

>> On Aug 31, 2016, at 11:05 AM, M. Taylor  wrote:

>> Well, as for me, I'm going to sit back and see how the market accepts 
>> the new iPhone 7 trans a separate earphone jack.

>> When Samsung attempted to make its devices thinner by (1) removing the 
>> removable battery and (2) removing the ability to add auxiliary memory 
>> to its flagship phones, it soon reversed its decision as the market, 
>> effectively, rejected the devices in favor of other companies who kept 
>> those features.

>> A couple of years ago, when Apple decided to remove the ability for iOS 
>> devices to have their photo content immediately available to PC users 
>> upon attaching the device to the computer, the marketplace went crazy 
>> and vowed to turn to Android if Apple insisted on forcing people to use 
>> iTunes in order to manage photos.

>> Like Samsung, Apple immediately reversed itself by restoring this 
>> feature in the subsequent release of iTunes.

>> So, I'll just wait and see for, unless 7 is a complete hit, something 
>> tells me that iPhone 8 will bring the jack back (smile).

>> Mark

>> -Original Message-
>> From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com 
>> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill Gallik
>> Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 9:43 AM
>> To: MacVisionaries E-Mail List
>> Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on 
>> the iPhone seven

>> When all the “hubbub” concerning Apple removing the earphone jack first 
>> appeared I was certain they (Apple) was going to provide an adapter so 
>> potential customers would be able to use their existing earphones with 
>> the iPhone 7. This coming to light does not surprise me in the least.
>> 
>> - Bill & Leader Dog Holland
>> - "The problem with people who have no vices is that you can be pretty 
>> sure they are going to have some pretty  annoying virtues."
>> - Elizabeth Taylor, 20th Century Screen Actress, (1932-2011)--

>> --
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.

>> If you have any questions or concerns about the 

RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven

[Simon Fogarty]

I will be interested to see the headphones they have with the new phones when 
they are released.

 I use my current ones for pretty much everything when I'm out and about 
including using my MBA so people don't hear it talking or so I can  hear things 
with out the surrounding noises 

 If these new phones are some new form of BT then I'll be happy if they can 
connect to multiple devices such as my iPhone iPad and MBA.
Oh and my watch.

Cheers.


Simon F
-Original Message-
From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] 
On Behalf Of Robin
Sent: Friday, 2 September 2016 12:59 AM
To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
Subject: RE: Some interesting rumours regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone 
seven

I Agree
With YourAssessment

TimeWillTell

If TheRemoval of the iPhone's HeadSet Jack deters Users from PurchasingIt

Exluding the Normal AppleFan

Meaning WhetherOrNot Sales Pummet RatherQuickly At 11:15 PM 8/31/2016, you 
wrote:
>Hello Mary,
>
>My point is simply that, unlike the era of Jobbs, the market, plays an 
>active role in what the future brings.  We, as consumers, have 
>alternatives and it's when we begin to explore these alternatives that 
>companies pay attention.
>
>Given Apple's issue with iTunes for Windows and its politically 
>ridiculous decision to unilaterally put albums in its users' accounts, 
>I'm not so certain that just because it decides something it better 
>will make it so.
>
>I remember the fan fair Apple made about its watch--they thought it 
>would change the lives of the world.  Well, as far as I can tell, my 
>world hasn't changed one bit either with or without it.
>
>As far as Samsung is concerned, I don't think they'll be so quick to 
>follow Apple's lead in the coming future.  As one of the executives of 
>Samsung recently said, "Samsung is at its best when it leads, not when 
>it follows."
>
>My personal position is to just sit back, wait, and see.  Fortunately 
>for me, I no longer have the desire to run out and purchase the latest 
>device just because it is the latest.
>
>Mark
>
>-Original Message-
>From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>[mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Mary Otten
>Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 12:33 PM
>To: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
>Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours regarding
>3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven
>
>Hi Mark,
>Of course, only time will tell. But I think you are wrong about the 
>disappearing headphone jack.
>For one thing, Samsung put back the storage card thing, but did not put 
>back the user replaceable battery. Also, if the other rumor is true, 
>Apple will be including compatible earbuds with the new phone, as well 
>as an adapter to make it possible for people to use other headphones.
>Given the prevalence of Bluetooth these days, I suspect that the 
>headphone jack will in fact be gone from iPhones forever. Other device 
>makers are already moving in this direction. So it isn't just Apple. In 
>fact, they will not be the first ones to market without a headphone 
>jack on the phone.
>
>
>Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Aug 31, 2016, at 11:05 AM, M. Taylor  wrote:
> >
> > Well, as for me, I'm going to sit back and
> see how the market accepts the new iPhone 7 trans a separate earphone jack.
> >
> > When Samsung attempted to make its devices
> thinner by (1) removing the removable battery and (2) removing the 
> ability to add auxiliary memory to its flagship phones, it soon 
> reversed its decision as the market, effectively, rejected the devices 
> in favor of other companies who kept those features.
> >
> > A couple of years ago, when Apple decided to
> remove the ability for iOS devices to have their photo content 
> immediately available to PC users upon attaching the device to the 
> computer, the marketplace went crazy and vowed to turn to Android if 
> Apple insisted on forcing people to use iTunes in order to manage 
> photos.
> >
> > Like Samsung, Apple immediately reversed
> itself by restoring this feature in the subsequent release of iTunes.
> >
> > So, I'll just wait and see for, unless 7 is a
> complete hit, something tells me that iPhone 8 will bring the jack 
> back (smile).
> >
> > Mark
> >
> > -Original Message-
> > From: macvisionaries@googlegroups.com
> [mailto:macvisionaries@googlegroups.com] On Behalf Of Bill Gallik
> > Sent: Wednesday, August 31, 2016 9:43 AM
> > To: MacVisionaries E-Mail List
> > Subject: Re: Some interesting rumours
> regarding 3.5 mm jack issue on the iPhone seven
> >
> > When all the “hubbub† concerning Apple
> removing the earphone jack first appeared I was certain they (Apple) 
> was going to provide an adapter so potential customers would be able 
> to use their existing earphones with the iPhone 7.
> This coming to light does not surprise me in the least.
> > 
> > - Bill & Leader Dog Holland
> > - "The problem with people who have no vices
> is that you can be 

Re: VO threw a bluetooth speaker

[christopher hallsworth]

Correct. VoiceOver is going to have multiple audio sources support in iOS10 
and, for your reference, tvOS 10.

On 2 Sep 2016, at 04:12, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> 
> According to info I have read, this will be possible in iOS 10.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 2 Sep 2016, at 15:01, Agent086b  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> Hi,
>> if I have asked this before I have forgotten the answer. Can I have VO 
>> through a bluetooth speaker and music through the Mac ones? I would like to 
>> play music through the house but not have VO through the house at the same 
>> time. 
>> Thanks for any help.
>> Max.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
>> moderators directly rather than posting on the list itself.
>> 
>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
>> Quinn - you can reach Cara at caraqu...@caraquinn.com
>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
>> http://www.mail-archive.com/macvisionaries@googlegroups.com/
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> 
> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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Re: VO threw a bluetooth speaker

[Agent086b]

Hi,
sorry I did not ask the question correctly. It is the VO on the Mac that I wish 
to put threw the bluetooth speakers.
and music from the Mac throwout the house.
Thanks again.
Max.
> On 2 Sep 2016, at 1:12 PM, David Chittenden  wrote:
> 
> According to info I have read, this will be possible in iOS 10.
> 
> David Chittenden, MSc, MRCAA
> Email: dchitten...@gmail.com
> Mobile: +64 21 2288 288
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On 2 Sep 2016, at 15:01, Agent086b  wrote:
>> 
>> Hi,
>> Hi,
>> if I have asked this before I have forgotten the answer. Can I have VO 
>> through a bluetooth speaker and music through the Mac ones? I would like to 
>> play music through the house but not have VO through the house at the same 
>> time. 
>> Thanks for any help.
>> Max.
>> 
>> -- 
>> The following information is important for all members of the Mac 
>> Visionaries list.
>> 
>> If you have any questions or concerns about the running of this list, or if 
>> you feel that a member's post is inappropriate, please contact the owners or 
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>> Your Mac Visionaries list moderator is Mark Taylor and your owner is Cara 
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>> 
>> The archives for this list can be searched at:
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More Questions Concerning Express VPN

[Bill Gallik]

To those recommending “Express VPN,” I have some further questions on the 
matter.

Does Express VPN serve as a general anti-malware utility?

If I install Express VPN will I be able to get rid of any and all Avast 
software?

Is Express VPN reasonably accessible via BoiceOver?

Is Express VPN a “resource hog” in any sense?

- Bill & Leader Dog Holland
- "The problem with people who have no vices is that you can be pretty sure 
they are going to have some pretty  annoying virtues."
- Elizabeth Taylor, 20th Century Screen Actress, (1932-2011)--

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