Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: - heap page diagnostic functions I would like to take this review (after PGCon). Too late, Bruce applied it already :). More eyeballs on it still wouldn't hurt of course. -- Heikki Linnakangas EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Heikki Linnakangas wrote: - heap page diagnostic functions I would like to take this review (after PGCon). Zdenek ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: - heap page diagnostic functions I would like to take this review (after PGCon). Too late, Bruce applied it already :). Yes ... Never mind What's about - full page writes improvement but I will have time after PGCon. Zdenek ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: - heap page diagnostic functions I would like to take this review (after PGCon). Too late, Bruce applied it already :). Yes ... Never mind You know, the fact that it was applied does not mean that it doesn't need review. If there is a bug on it which your review can find, we would like to know before it is released. The review process is not just so that it can be flown past some evil committee. -- Alvaro Herrerahttp://www.CommandPrompt.com/ PostgreSQL Replication, Consulting, Custom Development, 24x7 support ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Alvaro Herrera wrote: Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: - heap page diagnostic functions I would like to take this review (after PGCon). Too late, Bruce applied it already :). Yes ... Never mind You know, the fact that it was applied does not mean that it doesn't need review. If there is a bug on it which your review can find, we would like to know before it is released. The review process is not just so that it can be flown past some evil committee. I forgot to add that it seems that a general feeling here is that as soon as code is committed, it is Tom Lane's problem if there is a bug, because he will track it down and fix it. So if it was committed, we can forget about it because he'll take care. -- Alvaro Herrera http://www.PlanetPostgreSQL.org/ Granting software the freedom to evolve guarantees only different results, not better ones. (Zygo Blaxell) ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Alvaro Herrera wrote: Alvaro Herrera wrote: Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: Zdenek Kotala wrote: Heikki Linnakangas wrote: - heap page diagnostic functions I would like to take this review (after PGCon). Too late, Bruce applied it already :). Yes ... Never mind You know, the fact that it was applied does not mean that it doesn't need review. If there is a bug on it which your review can find, we would like to know before it is released. The review process is not just so that it can be flown past some evil committee. I forgot to add that it seems that a general feeling here is that as soon as code is committed, it is Tom Lane's problem if there is a bug, because he will track it down and fix it. So if it was committed, we can forget about it because he'll take care. I hope that's not how people think. I try to track down bugs when they're reported when they're in areas of code that I'm familiar with, but Tom still usually beats me to it. -- Heikki Linnakangas EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
On Fri, May 18, 2007 at 12:33:11AM +0800, Cui Shijun wrote: Thank you for your suggestions, I am thinking about Full page writes improvement. It seems not so complicated, just fit for a novice like me. I'll work on it. :-) Updated on http://developer.postgresql.org/index.php/Todo:PatchStatus -- Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com 512.569.9461 (cell) ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
On Fri, May 18, 2007 at 03:21:00PM +0200, Zdenek Kotala wrote: What's about - full page writes improvement but I will have time after PGCon. Added you to the list for that at http://developer.postgresql.org/index.php/Todo:PatchStatus -- Jim Nasby [EMAIL PROTECTED] EnterpriseDB http://enterprisedb.com 512.569.9461 (cell) ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Marc G. Fournier wrote: --On Wednesday, May 16, 2007 20:09:44 -0400 Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think one of the things that is preventing urgency is that everyone knows we have large patches unapplied, so they know that their lack of activity is not holding up the release. Any way around that? Set a fixed date (ie. 3 weeks) and whatever isn't in gets punted to 8.4 ... if that means those 'large patches' don't get applied, so be it ... Meaning we lose a bunch of potentially very cool features, and seriously hack off the developers who put significant time and effort into them, in some cases producing numerous updates based on ongoing discussion and feedback over a number of months. And then in 8.4 we have the same problem... I think we just have to accept that we're gonna have a long feature freeze period, and ask people to help review whatever they can. Regards, Dave. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
I want to help the reviewing work of ctid chain following enhancement . I've been studying the souce code which related with that part recently. :-) 2007/5/17, Dave Page [EMAIL PROTECTED]: I think we just have to accept that we're gonna have a long feature freeze period, and ask people to help review whatever they can. Regards, Dave. ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 7: You can help support the PostgreSQL project by donating at http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Cui Shijun wrote: I want to help the reviewing work of ctid chain following enhancement . I've been studying the souce code which related with that part recently. :-) Please go ahead :-) Regards Dave ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
On 5/17/07, Cui Shijun [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I want to help the reviewing work of ctid chain following enhancement . I've been studying the souce code which related with that part recently. :-) Tom had objected to this patch on the grounds that it adds complexity without any significant gains. Though I don't completely agree with the first part, the second part is indeed debatable since the code is touched only for infrequently. Thanks, Pavan -- EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Pavan Deolasee wrote: On 5/17/07, Cui Shijun [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I want to help the reviewing work of ctid chain following enhancement . I've been studying the souce code which related with that part recently. :-) Tom had objected to this patch on the grounds that it adds complexity without any significant gains. Though I don't completely agree with the first part, the second part is indeed debatable since the code is touched only for infrequently. Right. The reason the patch was kept in the queue is that there was discussion that HOT will exercise that part of the code a lot more than it does currently. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
I see... I checked part of HOT patches(patch1), and found that it involves too many things I am not currently familar with. Maybe I should change an item to work. :-( Since I only studied part of source codes about transaction processing(lmgr/MVCC/xact but without xlog.c), I want to study Group Commit patch and try to review it, any suggestions? 2007/5/17, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Pavan Deolasee wrote: On 5/17/07, Cui Shijun [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I want to help the reviewing work of ctid chain following enhancement . I've been studying the souce code which related with that part recently. :-) Tom had objected to this patch on the grounds that it adds complexity without any significant gains. Though I don't completely agree with the first part, the second part is indeed debatable since the code is touched only for infrequently. Right. The reason the patch was kept in the queue is that there was discussion that HOT will exercise that part of the code a lot more than it does currently. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 6: explain analyze is your friend
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Cui Shijun wrote: I see... I checked part of HOT patches(patch1), and found that it involves too many things I am not currently familar with. Maybe I should change an item to work. :-( Yeah, that's one big patch.. Since I only studied part of source codes about transaction processing(lmgr/MVCC/xact but without xlog.c), I want to study Group Commit patch and try to review it, any suggestions? There's no group commit patch, just some discussion, and probably won't be until 8.4. Maybe one of these would interest you: - deferred transaction/waitless COMMIT - full page writes improvement - maintaining cluster order on insert - heap page diagnostic functions Make sure you look at the latest version of the patches. -- Heikki Linnakangas EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Thank you for your suggestions, I am thinking about Full page writes improvement. It seems not so complicated, just fit for a novice like me. I'll work on it. :-) 2007/5/17, Heikki Linnakangas [EMAIL PROTECTED]: Cui Shijun wrote: I see... I checked part of HOT patches(patch1), and found that it involves too many things I am not currently familar with. Maybe I should change an item to work. :-( Yeah, that's one big patch.. Since I only studied part of source codes about transaction processing(lmgr/MVCC/xact but without xlog.c), I want to study Group Commit patch and try to review it, any suggestions? There's no group commit patch, just some discussion, and probably won't be until 8.4. Maybe one of these would interest you: - deferred transaction/waitless COMMIT - full page writes improvement - maintaining cluster order on insert - heap page diagnostic functions Make sure you look at the latest version of the patches. -- Heikki Linnakangas EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Bruce Momjian wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. We have *alot* of people (comparatively) who can assist in reviewing code that are not committers. Even if they can not commit, they can help insure that patches are in a state that can be more easily reviewed for committers to actually test and apply. Joshua D. Drake ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Bruce, where can I take a look at the patch list in order to find out if I can be of some help? Regards, g.- On 5/16/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match -- Guido Barosio --- http://www.globant.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
It is all on the developer roadmap page: http://momjian.us/cgi-bin/pgpatches --- Guido Barosio wrote: Bruce, where can I take a look at the patch list in order to find out if I can be of some help? Regards, g.- On 5/16/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match -- Guido Barosio --- http://www.globant.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Bruce Momjian wrote: It is all on the developer roadmap page: http://momjian.us/cgi-bin/pgpatches There is also a slightly more readable one here: http://developer.postgresql.org/index.php/Todo:PatchStatus Joshua D. Drake --- Guido Barosio wrote: Bruce, where can I take a look at the patch list in order to find out if I can be of some help? Regards, g.- On 5/16/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match -- Guido Barosio --- http://www.globant.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Bruce Momjian wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. I at least feel uncomfortable about reviewing code that deals with areas I have not touched much, and where I feel the author probably knows a lot more than me. The chance of my catching errors/problems in such a case is much lower. Looking at the list on the wiki, that rules out most of the things that don't have a reviewer already listed. I can look at the following items: . UTF8 text matching performance improvements . concurrent psql . PL/PSM If Tom gets around to per-function search paths I'll look at that too, but I don't actually recall seeing a patch for that. cheers andrew ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 5: don't forget to increase your free space map settings
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Joshua D. Drake wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: It is all on the developer roadmap page: http://momjian.us/cgi-bin/pgpatches There is also a slightly more readable one here: http://developer.postgresql.org/index.php/Todo:PatchStatus note that http://momjian.us/cgi-bin/pgpatches contains a link to the wiki site at the very top ;-) Stefan ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. I at least feel uncomfortable about reviewing code that deals with areas I have not touched much, and where I feel the author probably knows a lot more than me. The chance of my catching errors/problems in such a case is much lower. Yep, that is part of our problem, but even items people have already said they _can_ review have shown little progress. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. I at least feel uncomfortable about reviewing code that deals with areas I have not touched much, and where I feel the author probably knows a lot more than me. The chance of my catching errors/problems in such a case is much lower. Looking at the list on the wiki, that rules out most of the things that don't have a reviewer already listed. I can look at the following items: . UTF8 text matching performance improvements . concurrent psql . PL/PSM added your name to the list in the wiki If Tom gets around to per-function search paths I'll look at that too, but I don't actually recall seeing a patch for that. no - tom said in is patch triage mail that this code is not even written yet but he still wants to see it in 8.3 ... Stefan ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
What about a mentoring schema in order to push up the gap that represents catching up with cases like the one Andrew posted? By the way, being a patch reviewer doesn't represents also to be able to find out potential problems in the code, which may have nothing to do with the patch functionality? g.- On 5/16/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Andrew Dunstan wrote: Bruce Momjian wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. I at least feel uncomfortable about reviewing code that deals with areas I have not touched much, and where I feel the author probably knows a lot more than me. The chance of my catching errors/problems in such a case is much lower. Yep, that is part of our problem, but even items people have already said they _can_ review have shown little progress. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq -- Guido Barosio --- http://www.globant.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 1: if posting/reading through Usenet, please send an appropriate subscribe-nomail command to [EMAIL PROTECTED] so that your message can get through to the mailing list cleanly
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
I think one of the things that is preventing urgency is that everyone knows we have large patches unapplied, so they know that their lack of activity is not holding up the release. Any way around that? --- bruce wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 - --On Wednesday, May 16, 2007 20:09:44 -0400 Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I think one of the things that is preventing urgency is that everyone knows we have large patches unapplied, so they know that their lack of activity is not holding up the release. Any way around that? Set a fixed date (ie. 3 weeks) and whatever isn't in gets punted to 8.4 ... if that means those 'large patches' don't get applied, so be it ... --- bruce wrote: In talking to people who are assigned to review patches or could review patches, I often get the reply, Oh, yea, I need to do that. Folks, we are six weeks into feature freeze and have made slim progress on getting patches reviewed and applied. As I stated earlier, we are now looking at August/September for beta, but that might be pushed back even later if we don't get more progress. It seems there is a lot of reliance on Tom to get the patches applied, but I don't think that is fair or reasonable. I think we need more urgency on the part of everyone to make faster progress. Patch reviewers and committers need to take more initiative to get things done rather than wait for some external force to prompt them. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 9: In versions below 8.0, the planner will ignore your desire to choose an index scan if your joining column's datatypes do not match - Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org) Email . [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSN . [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo . yscrappy Skype: hub.orgICQ . 7615664 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFGS6Oa4QvfyHIvDvMRAtwrAJwLasoe+jiuAqvT4Dny/dndYvKxUgCcDxiX x+vMZlGMy06D9NOfzltG/ks= =PL+8 -END PGP SIGNATURE- ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
On 5/16/07, Marc G. Fournier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Set a fixed date (ie. 3 weeks) and whatever isn't in gets punted to 8.4 ... if that means those 'large patches' don't get applied, so be it ... I disagree with that approach. Larger more complex patches required much more work and effort than small, simple ones. Not only do I think it's unfair to the authors who spent considerably more time on their work, but I think it also sets a bad precedent for future work; saying, in short, that if you want to make large strides to improve PostgreSQL, and you followed the community development process, you're still potentially last in line for review. -- Jonah H. Harris, Software Architect | phone: 732.331.1324 EnterpriseDB Corporation| fax: 732.331.1301 33 Wood Ave S, 3rd Floor| [EMAIL PROTECTED] Iselin, New Jersey 08830| http://www.enterprisedb.com/ ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Jonah H. Harris wrote: On 5/16/07, Marc G. Fournier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Set a fixed date (ie. 3 weeks) and whatever isn't in gets punted to 8.4 ... if that means those 'large patches' don't get applied, so be it ... I disagree with that approach. Larger more complex patches required much more work and effort than small, simple ones. Not only do I think it's unfair to the authors who spent considerably more time on their work, but I think it also sets a bad precedent for future work; saying, in short, that if you want to make large strides to improve PostgreSQL, and you followed the community development process, you're still potentially last in line for review. Yep. We lose a lot of credibility if we did that. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 4: Have you searched our list archives? http://archives.postgresql.org
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 - --On Wednesday, May 16, 2007 21:04:27 -0400 Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Jonah H. Harris wrote: On 5/16/07, Marc G. Fournier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Set a fixed date (ie. 3 weeks) and whatever isn't in gets punted to 8.4 ... if that means those 'large patches' don't get applied, so be it ... I disagree with that approach. Larger more complex patches required much more work and effort than small, simple ones. Not only do I think it's unfair to the authors who spent considerably more time on their work, but I think it also sets a bad precedent for future work; saying, in short, that if you want to make large strides to improve PostgreSQL, and you followed the community development process, you're still potentially last in line for review. Yep. We lose a lot of credibility if we did that. So, we lose no credibility if we sit in feature freeze indefinitely, with no direction, while we wait for reviewers to finish reviewing? - Marc G. Fournier Hub.Org Networking Services (http://www.hub.org) Email . [EMAIL PROTECTED] MSN . [EMAIL PROTECTED] Yahoo . yscrappy Skype: hub.orgICQ . 7615664 -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.5 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFGS7E64QvfyHIvDvMRAmW9AJ0Q75300Atm6nFOFT+1YfMRCtrcdQCffW2l htlQKO5dZRC2k2lWPGkjGvk= =BhsF -END PGP SIGNATURE- ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Marc G. Fournier wrote: Jonah H. Harris wrote: On 5/16/07, Marc G. Fournier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Set a fixed date (ie. 3 weeks) and whatever isn't in gets punted to 8.4 ... if that means those 'large patches' don't get applied, so be it ... I disagree with that approach. Larger more complex patches required much more work and effort than small, simple ones. Not only do I think it's unfair to the authors who spent considerably more time on their work, but I think it also sets a bad precedent for future work; saying, in short, that if you want to make large strides to improve PostgreSQL, and you followed the community development process, you're still potentially last in line for review. Yep. We lose a lot of credibility if we did that. So, we lose no credibility if we sit in feature freeze indefinitely, with no direction, while we wait for reviewers to finish reviewing? Well, if we stay indefinitely, then we have no release and we close up the project. I think eventually we will release. -- Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://momjian.us EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com + If your life is a hard drive, Christ can be your backup. + ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 3: Have you checked our extensive FAQ? http://www.postgresql.org/docs/faq
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
Marc G. Fournier wrote: I disagree with that approach. Larger more complex patches required much more work and effort than small, simple ones. Not only do I think it's unfair to the authors who spent considerably more time on their work, but I think it also sets a bad precedent for future work; saying, in short, that if you want to make large strides to improve PostgreSQL, and you followed the community development process, you're still potentially last in line for review. Yep. We lose a lot of credibility if we did that. So, we lose no credibility if we sit in feature freeze indefinitely, with no direction, while we wait for reviewers to finish reviewing? *cough* that is hardly what is happening. Just today we had two people step up and commit to help reviewing. One of them is a committer (AndrewD). I believe under no uncertain terms, that if we continual proactive communication over the next several weeks that we will see a marked and steady improvement to our existing status. Let's keep this on earth shall we. Sincerely, Joshua D. Drake -- === The PostgreSQL Company: Command Prompt, Inc. === Sales/Support: +1.503.667.4564 || 24x7/Emergency: +1.800.492.2240 Providing the most comprehensive PostgreSQL solutions since 1997 http://www.commandprompt.com/ Donate to the PostgreSQL Project: http://www.postgresql.org/about/donate PostgreSQL Replication: http://www.commandprompt.com/products/ ---(end of broadcast)--- TIP 2: Don't 'kill -9' the postmaster
Re: [HACKERS] Lack of urgency in 8.3 reviewing
On 5/16/07, Bruce Momjian [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Yep, that is part of our problem, but even items people have already said they _can_ review have shown little progress. For complex patches, it might help to identify and associate a core/senior community member in the early stages of design and development. This member will then have enough insight into the work as it progresses and can him/herself act as a committer and/or help the committer later. We developed HOT in a phased manner. Had each of the incremental patches been reviewed, I think the review process would have been much easier and less painful. Also that would have helped us to identify any obvious bugs/show stoppers early in the cycle and might have even generated better ideas to do things differently. Having said that, I fully understand the difficulties of the committers who need to put substantial efforts in understanding the patch and guage its overall impact. Thanks, Pavan -- EnterpriseDB http://www.enterprisedb.com
