Re: ThRe: [RBW] ISO: Toyo Atlantis 56-58cm/26"

[Max S]

Another possibility is finding a Riv All-Rounder – many of them were 
spec'ed for 26" wheels, even in the larger frame sizes, and it should be 
just dandy for leisurely rides. Barring that, maybe you can find the 
Handsome XOXO – they take a larger tire than the OG XO-1. 

- Max "need that Clay RTP bike" in A2

On Thursday, May 16, 2024 at 11:19:02 PM UTC-4 Jerry Lynn wrote:

> Yup - saw this too - but at 6'1" a 56cm is as small as I can go. That 
> said, I thank you just the same!
>
> On Thursday 16 May 2024 at 20:13:50 UTC-7 Matthew Williams wrote:
>
>> On May 16, 2024, at 7:29 PM, Hoch in ut  wrote:
>>
>> There is a guy on Facebook Riv Marketplace that says he has a Toyo built 
>> 57-58”, 26” Atlantis. Guy named William John Spencer in a WTB: Toyo 
>> Atlantis thread. 
>>
>>
>> Link:
>>
>> https://www.facebook.com/groups/3127504017358010/
>>
>>

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[RBW] WTB: Hunqapillar 54 / 56 cm

[Max S]

Test-rode one over a decade ago at BBB, shoulda bought it then. Maybe 
someone's ready to pass theirs on to another good home?.. (Ideally just a 
frameset)

- Max "coulda shoulda woulda try againa" in A2

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[RBW] Caution: "Cuddle Bears"

[Max S]

Cuddle Bears is / are selling a Susie bike for a very good asking price, 
almost too good to be true. User has no prior posts, a few other details 
don't check out. Use caution. 

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[RBW] Re: A. Homer Hilsen Photo Thread

[Max S]

Canti Homer... Now that's a nice find! 

- Max 

On Sunday, May 5, 2024 at 9:43:12 PM UTC-4 matt miller wrote:

> I was lucky enough to find a nicely appointed canti AHH. It came with 
> upright bars, which I did enjoy, but taking it out on "longer" rides, I 
> found I was often reaching out to the curves. It also just rides so much 
> nicer than my other bike, that I wanted to try drops. So I've been 
> following the other thread with interest, even though I started looking for 
> parts for this project a few months ago. Because I'd like the option to put 
> the old bar setup back, I figured it would be simplest to get new cables 
> and everything and leave it attached. Plus, if I like this, there's always 
> another bike to put that other setup on!
>
> I just finished last night and only rode it today for a few miles. I also 
> don't love my bar tape, but it will serve its purpose while I try this out. 
> Bag could use a stiffener, too.
>
> Matt in STL
>
> [image: sm_IMG_5194.jpg]
> [image: sm_IMG_5561.jpg]
> On Sunday, May 5, 2024 at 7:17:36 AM UTC-5 Tim Bantham wrote:
>
>> [image: 9E46EC20-2450-4944-8368-4BEA1F432453_1_105_c.jpeg]
>> Here is my 58 Homer as it was finished this spring. I built this exactly 
>> how I feel a bike should be with aesthetics as the priority. To my eye this 
>> bike is perfect! 
>> On Saturday, May 4, 2024 at 10:36:15 PM UTC-4 jtlu...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I always enjoy seeing pictures of everyone's various Rivendell's, so I 
>>> figured why not start a photo thread of Homers (since that is my only Riv). 
>>> I've included a photo from my first ride on my Homer back in 2022 (with 
>>> Albatross bars) and a photo in its most recent configuration with drop 
>>> bars. 
>>>
>>> [image: Homer 1.jpg][image: Homer 2.jpg]
>>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Nitto/Riv Bullmoose thoughts

[Max S]

This thread really makes me want to find a green Hunqapillar to put that 
bullmoose bar on... 

- Max "and this is how we ended up with so many bikes..." in A2

On Thursday, April 18, 2024 at 11:38:08 AM UTC-4 larson@gmail.com wrote:

> [image: IMG_2484.jpeg][image: 
> E3DC21C4-E0AA-43EF-91A3-DF38B9CDA3DD.jpeg][image: 
> IMG_2597.jpeg]Thanks P.W. - here are three more.
> Randy in WI
>
>
> On Thursday, April 18, 2024 at 10:20:59 AM UTC-5 Matthew P wrote:
>
>> I like'em and rode them today.
>> A couple notes:
>> 1. Integrated stem - less adjustability. Can't play with stem 
>> (horizontal)length/reach nor rise/drop
>> 2. Cant slam it completely, if you wanted/needed to, bc of built in rise
>> 3. No clamp = no slippage there
>> 4. Sweep angle, reach etc. - to each their own
>>
>> I have them all the way up on an old ('84?) StumpJumper and that setup 
>> handles bad, terrible with a front load, but I blame that on the super 
>> slack head tube angle.
>>
>> Send unwanted bullmoosees to me please :)
>> Happy to trade for drops or something 
>>
>> Next build gets the chocomoose or Bosco moose I forget. 
>>
>> -Matthew P
>> San Diego / Kumeyaay
>>
>>
>>
>> On Thu, Apr 18, 2024, 6:25 AM P W  wrote:
>>
>>> Love that big boy Appa, Randy.
>>>
>>> More photos, please!
>>>
>>> P. W.
>>> ~
>>> (917) 514-2207
>>> ~
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Apr 18, 2024, at 5:38 AM, larson@gmail.com  
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> 
>>> I am a fan of the bullmoose bars. On my 62cm Appaloosa I like them when 
>>> the bike is set up as my ATB with bigger tires and more off road ready. I 
>>> initially thought they were too stiff as I had some wrist and shoulder 
>>> pain.Ergon grips solved this issue and I find them comfortable. I do set my 
>>> bike up with Billie bars during the summer for road/gravel riding, and like 
>>> them as well. I like the aesthetic of the bullmoose and probably could make 
>>> them work for all of my riding.
>>> Randy in WI
>>>
>>> On Thursday, April 18, 2024 at 12:25:56 AM UTC-5 exliontamer wrote:
>>>
>>>> Serious thanks to everyone for the photos & advice! I think I'm going 
>>>> to go for a set. Seems like looking at the photos it will suit my height, 
>>>> build, and even my setup on the Atlantis. I set my Cheviot back up with 
>>>> Albatross bars and while there's nothing wrong with having multiple bikes 
>>>> with the same bar, variety is just more fun. 
>>>> On Wednesday, April 17, 2024 at 10:14:44 PM UTC-5 Stephen wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I have a pair that i used to have on my appaloosa. I’m around 6’1-2” 
>>>>> and i really like the width and sweep. On my ‘21 appaloosa the reach was 
>>>>> good, some might consider it too long. i think itd probably be nice on an 
>>>>> older atlantis, just assuming that it would have a shorter top tube. very 
>>>>> solid bars of course, no flexy. One of the coolest looking bars, I’ll 
>>>>> always have them in the collection i think, I’m a perpetual bar swapper. 
>>>>> I 
>>>>> have the tig version, wish they were the fillet but both are good. 
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wednesday, April 17, 2024 at 10:47:03 PM UTC-4 philip@gmail.com 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Max,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I was just about to say your SimpleOne is the perfect bike.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Clearly we have overlapping tastes!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Our green bikes should be friends.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Philip
>>>>>>
>>>>>> P. W.
>>>>>> ~
>>>>>> (917) 514-2207
>>>>>> ~
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Apr 17, 2024, at 7:39 PM, Max S  wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've tried them on my (dearly departed) SimpleOne, my QuickBeam, and 
>>>>>> even my Serotta. Great bars, and I could even use the forward extension 
>>>>>> to 
>>>>>> get low and fast. I still have these bars, waiting to be put back on the 
>>>>>> QB 
>>>>>> to make it into the tracklocross hoon wagon that it wants to be. At a 
>&g

Re: [RBW] Nitto/Riv Bullmoose thoughts

[Max S]

What a lovely Bontrager you got there!! 

- Max "green bikes are cool" in A2

On Wednesday, April 17, 2024 at 8:06:28 PM UTC-4 philip@gmail.com wrote:

> Have them on an old Bontrager CX, and love everything about the fit and 
> reach:
>
> [image: image0.jpeg][image: image1.jpeg][image: image2.jpeg]
> P. W.
> ~
> (917) 514-2207
> ~
>
>
>
>
> On Apr 17, 2024, at 4:56 PM, exliontamer  wrote:
>
> Anyone have opinions/real world experience with the Nitto/Riv Bullmoose 
> bars? I've been thinking of putting them on my old Toyo Atlantis since they 
> came out. I'm a pretty broad shouldered 6'2" so the width would likely work 
> for me. Mostly curious about the reach, how high they can get, & if they're 
> comfortable for commuting.  
>
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: LA Craigslist bike purchase assist?

[Max S]

Yeah, insanely good price. I am actually wondering if it's "hot"  

- Max "caution" in A2

On Tuesday, April 9, 2024 at 11:32:24 AM UTC-4 EGNolan wrote:

> I can't help you, but I bet some locals will be all over that thing, it's 
> a beaut and an insane price. Better be quick with your payment!
> Eric
> On Tuesday, April 9, 2024 at 11:18:11 AM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>
>> Riv Folk, 
>>
>> Anyone could potentially assist with lobbing this to Michigan?.. 
>>
>>
>> https://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/bik/d/santa-monica-touring-bike-lugged-steel/7735511488.html
>>  
>>
>> - Max "my RTP ship has come in?" in A2
>>
>

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[RBW] LA Craigslist bike purchase assist?

[Max S]

Riv Folk, 

Anyone could potentially assist with lobbing this to Michigan?.. 

https://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/bik/d/santa-monica-touring-bike-lugged-steel/7735511488.html
 

- Max "my RTP ship has come in?" in A2

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[RBW] Re: FS Excellent Condition Betty Foy

[Max S]

Sounds amazing! Any photos?.. 

- MinA2

On Friday, March 29, 2024 at 11:33:32 AM UTC-4 karma...@gmail.com wrote:

> *SELLING AN EXCELLENT CONDITION RIVENDELL BETTY FOY BICYCLE—She’s a 
> Beauty!*
>
> *This hybrid road / touring bike is gorgeous and iconic! No longer sold 
> new. As you can see, the color is beautiful and the custom Betty Foy design 
> touches, including the red painted hearts. Three gears at the front and 
> eight at the back for a versatile 24 total. *
>
> Owner purchased directly from Rivendell February 2013, just after I 
> retired, but unfortunately medical care for multiple family members took 
> over my life. This Betty has been hanging in my garage, protected for all 
> these years after only light use. No scratches. The pictures reflect the 
> like-new condition with only light garage dust and deflated tires. 
>
>- Frame Size 62 cm perfect for a tall rider 
>- 28 “ wheels 
>- Build Kit - 700 - Upright Bar Sam Jumbo 
>- MKS Grip King Pedals 
>- Nitto Mark’s Rack M1 
>- Brooks B67s Saddle in Honey 
>- Wald Wire Basket 
>- No kickstand, thus the bike helmet for purposes of picture display.  
>
> *Purchased new for $2,625.00. ASKING PRICE: $ 1,800 (plus shipping) with 
> free pickup in Austin, Texas.* If shipping is needed, recommend using 
> Bike Flights at this website: 
> https://www.bikeflights.com/bicycleshops#bikeShopResults and seller will 
> work with the buyer to facilitate the process. Payment to seller will be 
> via wire transfer once the bike is professionally packed and ready for 
> shipping via UPS. Bike Flights offers extremely reasonable insurance. Sale 
> will be final. 
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: I have questions

[Max S]

Let me be a bit of a contrarian on the lighting situation. Is a dyno hub + 
phone charger worth the hassle?.. I am not sure. 

A dyno hub puts out a nominal 3 Watts. If you ride it for an hour, that's 3 
watt-hours worth of electricity. Let's say it gets split between the light 
and your phone. If you ride continuously for 10 hours, that's about 30 
watt-hours. Let's say half is used to power the light, half to power the 
phone... 

An iPhone 15 Pro has a 3,274 mA-hour / 12.70 watt-hr battery. So, half the 
energy from the dynamo will charge the phone about once. 

How large of a battery would hold that much electricity? Thanks to modern 
lithium ion polymer technology, a small power-bank like this one 

 (about 
the thickness of the iPhone but fits in the palm of your hand) can recharge 
that phone ~1.5 times (implying it's got ~19 watt-hours of useful 
capacity). A slightly larger one 

 
(say about the size of the phone in a sturdy case) holds twice as much 
energy, and even incorporates a charging plug. It's easy to chuck into a 
bag, charge your phone off of it, use it as a wall plug in a hotel / on the 
train, etc.  You don't even need to muck around with wiring on the bike or 
a dyno hub at all. If you forego a dyno-powered light altogether, a battery 
powered headlight will have 6+ hrs of its own battery life, and can be 
charged off the portable battery. 

In case you don't want to muck around with wires and connectors and all 
that. But if someone's gonna do it all for you and anodize it nice colors, 
then by all means! :-) 

- Max "trying to unplug and plug it back in again" in A2

On Friday, March 22, 2024 at 6:36:58 PM UTC-4 cz...@sonic.net wrote:

> Hi Leah -
>
> I have been riding 40mm tires on my custom and 44mm tires on my Quickbeam 
> and have noticed no difference in performance - only in comfort. I would 
> imagine 48mm tires would be no worse in performance and slightly more 
> comfortable.
>
> Regarding the light and charging your phone - I have an Edelux II on my 
> Hubbuhubbuhz. Given that my wife cannot be without her phone, we have a 
> Sinewave Revolution wired directly to the Edelux II. This may eliminate the 
> potential of wiring a taillight to the Edelux II - but we use rechargeable 
> taillights; that's not a problem for us.
>
> Hope this helps.
>
> Regards,
>
> Corwin
> On Tuesday, March 19, 2024 at 6:10:14 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
> wrote:
>
>> I have had some of the same questions tumbling about in my brain as I 
>> wait for the last of the parts for my Gravel & Travel Platy. I just got 
>> back from a warm and delightful weekend of cycling in Philadelphia. I, a 
>> newly minted Michigander, was happy to return to the shire, and for that, I 
>> was welcomed with Second Winter. 
>>
>> Michigan is over here, doing me dirty. 
>>
>> I’m prevailing upon you to humor me and answer my questions, because a 
>> lot of you are having spring and flowers and sunshine, so this is the least 
>> you could do!
>>
>> I got the 50 cm Platy to take on trips. Will fit in the van better, will 
>> fit on Amtrak, be easier to shove in elevators, that sort of thing. But the 
>> tires I have on hand are 48 mm Gravel Kings. They are almost new. I’m 
>> considering taking a train to a ride this summer, but that means no Racing 
>> Platypus, only the purple one can fit. Can 48 mm tires do a 15-17 mph road 
>> ride pace? I have 42 on all my other bikes. Would 48s be slow? The ride is 
>> a 2 day event, 100 miles total. I’d like to keep the tires if I could, 
>> because they’re new and they are fat enough to also double as gravel tires, 
>> should I decide to do a gravel ride again. But I do more road rides than 
>> anything else, and if those 48s will 

Re: [RBW] Re: I have questions

[Max S]

Hmm... 

1. Fenders – if you have enough clearance with 48s with the fenders on 
there now, no problem. If anything, 42 might increase the gap to the point 
of being less useful / aesthetically pleasing?.. Dunno. But mostly I was 
wondering which type of fenders you're using. If metal, consider that the 
front usually is best when fixed at 3 points – bottom, fork crown, and 
front/top. If you have a rack, then the front/top of the fender usually can 
be bolted to the bottom of the rack. If no rack, consider running a second 
set of fender stays over the front. 

2. Bags – fewer is better, IMO, and large panniers or a saddlebag is prob. 
easier to deal with on a trip than a bunch of smaller ones. Again, ATMO. 
Front vs. rear – per item 1 above, if using a front rack to hold the 
fender, then consider how the rack might end up down on the tire... The 
propensity to collapse downward really depends on how sturdy the struts are 
and how the struts are fixed to the fork and to the rack. Draw / daruma 
bolts are not my favorite way to secure the struts to the front rack, 
because vibrations can loosen them over time, and the draw bolt will slide 
down along the strut. One way to reduce the probability of that happening 
is to really crank on the nut of the draw bolt, so that the latter "bites" 
into the strut. Another way is to carefully pre-bend the strut just below 
the spot where the draw bolt will be tightened. The strap that Riv uses is 
a good precaution, but generally, a braised / welded strut on the front 
rack is a better configuration – e.g., Nitto M12, NF21/22, 32F, 34F, F20, 
etc. are generally better than Mark's Rack / M1, M18 
<https://www.benscycle.com/nitto%20front%20rack?_q=nitto%20front%20rack=ft> 
for 
any front load over 5 lbs. 

- Max "it's all greek innit?" in A2

On Thursday, March 21, 2024 at 7:20:52 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Max,
>
> 1. Yes. I try to live without them. I never can.
> 2. I need a Randi Jo bag on the stem/bar. I was planning to put the front 
> rack on because I have it and because it might be useful for travel. I’ll 
> also have a rear rack that can take the Backabike Bags. This bike is kind 
> of set up for multiple things, I guess… 
>
> The bags would be sent with the support vehicles for the 2 day Chicago-New 
> Buffalo ride. I’d just have the bags on the bike until I got to the ride.
>
> Does that make sense?
>
> On Mar 21, 2024, at 4:36 PM, Max S  wrote:
>
> Leah, 
>
>
> Coupla questions back to you... 
> 1) is the travel set-up going to use fenders? 
> 2) do you need the front bag, or could you get away with just a saddlebag, 
> and/or bar bag strapped to the handlebars? 
>
> - Max "simplicate, simplicate, simplicate" in A2
> On Thursday, March 21, 2024 at 2:45:54 PM UTC-4 divis...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> This sounds very interesting; sort of an updated version of the B Luxos 
>> U, with a higher power collection from the dynamo, brighter standard and 
>> highbeam lights (have LEDs improved that much in the last decade? I know 
>> that batteries have), and a MagSafe-type connecter for USB peripherals. The 
>> ability to run the light and charge a USB device simultaneously - that's 
>> huge.
>>
>> I trust you'll report back when you've tried one out. Being a neighbor 
>> and a gadget cheapskate, I hope I'll get the chance to see it in action 
>> before I buy a $200+ headlight. But this could address a lot of problems.
>>
>> Peter "доверяй, но проверяй" Adler
>> Berkeley, California/USA
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 20, 2024 at 8:49:13 PM UTC-7 Collin A wrote:
>>
>>> SON is supposed to be releasing a light that has a charger and has a 
>>> "high beam" function in "Spring 2024"
>>> Update: New version of the Edelux USB-FL – SON Hub Dynamos 
>>> (nabendynamo.de) 
>>> <https://nabendynamo.de/en/new-edelux-headlight-with-high-beam-function-2/>
>>>
>>> I'll be eager to try it out when it gets released...
>>>
>>> Collin in Berkeley
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, March 19, 2024 at 6:10:14 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> I have had some of the same questions tumbling about in my brain as I 
>>> wait for the last of the parts for my Gravel & Travel Platy. I just got 
>>> back from a warm and delightful weekend of cycling in Philadelphia. I, a 
>>> newly minted Michigander, was happy to return to the shire, and for that, I 
>>> was welcomed with Second Winter. 
>>>
>>> Michigan is over here, doing me dirty. 
>>>
>>> I’m prevailing upon you to humor me and answer my questions, because a 
>>>

[RBW] Re: Abomination? Riv Road "upgrades"

[Max S]

Sometimes it's nice to fuss, and sometimes it feels good to just dirt-bag 
it! For full effect, you should do mismatched bar tape and water bottles! 

- Max "occasional dirtbag" in A2

On Wednesday, March 20, 2024 at 2:08:52 PM UTC-4 Ted Durant wrote:

> On Monday, March 18, 2024 at 9:57:32 AM UTC-5 EGNolan wrote:
>
>  Pairing the wheels with some on-sale Vittoria Corsa G2.0 in 32 width made 
> the bike smoother than with 650b x 42 GravelKings and loads faster. Is it 
> an abomination? Heresy? 
>
>
> Well, my only personal feeling about Eric's bike is that the graphics on 
> the rims are kinda loud. Love the Ritchey cranks, though!
>
> I sold my Heron Touring bike to a friend, for whom it was a perfect fit. 
> His brother-in-law, a hard-core road bike kinda guy, had a snazzy pair of 
> "last year's" carbon fiber wheels that he gave to my friend for cheap. I 
> was initially horrified by it and the cork pads he'd manage to find for the 
> cantilever brakes, but he was happy and rode it a LOT, so that made me 
> happy.
>
> I have a lovely Campagnolo Daytona group on my Rivendell Road, with wheels 
> built by Joe Young using shiny, light, skinny FIR rims. I just discovered 
> that Rene Herse 32mm tires fit with room to spare, measuring 29mm on those 
> skinny rims. I also found a NOS 13-26 cassette to replace the 12-23 that I 
> had on there. Talk about an upgrade!  All of a sudden I like this bike a 
> lot more.
>
> Ted Durant
> Milwaukee, WI USA 
>

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[RBW] Re: I have questions

[Max S]

Leah, 

Coupla questions back to you... 
1) is the travel set-up going to use fenders? 
2) do you need the front bag, or could you get away with just a saddlebag, 
and/or bar bag strapped to the handlebars? 

- Max "simplicate, simplicate, simplicate" in A2
On Thursday, March 21, 2024 at 2:45:54 PM UTC-4 divis...@gmail.com wrote:

> This sounds very interesting; sort of an updated version of the B Luxos 
> U, with a higher power collection from the dynamo, brighter standard and 
> highbeam lights (have LEDs improved that much in the last decade? I know 
> that batteries have), and a MagSafe-type connecter for USB peripherals. The 
> ability to run the light and charge a USB device simultaneously - that's 
> huge.
>
> I trust you'll report back when you've tried one out. Being a neighbor and 
> a gadget cheapskate, I hope I'll get the chance to see it in action before 
> I buy a $200+ headlight. But this could address a lot of problems.
>
> Peter "доверяй, но проверяй" Adler
> Berkeley, California/USA
>
> On Wednesday, March 20, 2024 at 8:49:13 PM UTC-7 Collin A wrote:
>
>> SON is supposed to be releasing a light that has a charger and has a 
>> "high beam" function in "Spring 2024"
>> Update: New version of the Edelux USB-FL – SON Hub Dynamos 
>> (nabendynamo.de) 
>> 
>>
>> I'll be eager to try it out when it gets released...
>>
>> Collin in Berkeley
>>
>>
>> On Tuesday, March 19, 2024 at 6:10:14 PM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>> I have had some of the same questions tumbling about in my brain as I 
>> wait for the last of the parts for my Gravel & Travel Platy. I just got 
>> back from a warm and delightful weekend of cycling in Philadelphia. I, a 
>> newly minted Michigander, was happy to return to the shire, and for that, I 
>> was welcomed with Second Winter. 
>>
>> Michigan is over here, doing me dirty. 
>>
>> I’m prevailing upon you to humor me and answer my questions, because a 
>> lot of you are having spring and flowers and sunshine, so this is the least 
>> you could do!
>>
>> I got the 50 cm Platy to take on trips. Will fit in the van better, will 
>> fit on Amtrak, be easier to shove in elevators, that sort of thing. But the 
>> tires I have on hand are 48 mm Gravel Kings. They are almost new. I’m 
>> considering taking a train to a ride this summer, but that means no Racing 
>> Platypus, only the purple one can fit. Can 48 mm tires do a 15-17 mph road 
>> ride pace? I have 42 on all my other bikes. Would 48s be slow? The ride is 
>> a 2 day event, 100 miles total. I’d like to keep the tires if I could, 
>> because they’re new and they are fat enough to also double as gravel tires, 
>> should I decide to do a gravel ride again. But I do more road rides than 
>> anything else, and if those 48s will cripple me, I’ll go back to 42s. 
>> What’s the consensus?
>>
>> Basket straps. I have the Nitto Basket Rack and even though I’ve disliked 
>> it in the past, I figure it’s pretty and I already own it and I might need 
>> a front rack for travel. But do I really have to put the ugly strap from 
>> bar to basket? Is the Nitto Basket Rack safer than the Mark’s Rack? I know 
>> Sergio was thrown when his Mark’s Rack loosened and hit the front tire and 
>> he’s missing significant chunks of front teeth! What is everyone doing 
>> about their front racks?
>>
>> Lights. I have an Edelux light. It’s not the right color for this build, 
>> but it’s perfectly good. But sometimes I think, “wouldn’t it be nice to 
>> have a light that would charge your phone?” The Sinewave Beacon 2 will do 
>> just that, but it sounds like it’s not a great road light. What are people 
>> using to charge phones on long rides away from home?
>>
>> I ordered my wheels today. This, because J at the Velocity booth in 
>> Philly talked me into them when he heard about the theme of my build. 
>> Here’s a sneak peek.
>>
>> And thanks for helping me out here! It’s good to hear people’s 
>> experiences and points of view!
>> Leah
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Best Rivendell for pavement riding

[Max S]

Ye!! We should start a separate thread of Rivendells rolling on 
tubulars... 

BTW, check out these babies 
<https://us.challengetires.com/products?product_model_ids=55110,55010,55012,55176,55136,55084,55071,_region=233>...
 
36 <https://us.challengetires.com/shop/products/strada-bianca-2/55014> and 
40 <https://us.challengetires.com/shop/products/strada-bianca-5/71439> mm 
wide tubeless tubulars. Yes, you read that right. I happen to have a set of 
the 36es, and lemme tell ya – the ride is amazing! 

- Max "totally tubular, man!" in A2

On Friday, March 8, 2024 at 6:07:20 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> Max S said "Do eet! "
>
> I did not "Do eet! " 
> I did not even do "eet!"
> but I did do "it"
>
> I finally made an offer and got an all metal tubular wheel set on eBay 
> that can go on my Rivendell Legolas.  It's another set of HED Ardennes 
> wheels, which make them interchangeable with a few other bikes.  The wheel 
> set comes with a set of cross knobbies, which need to be glued, or maybe 
> I'll use some 30mm road tires that I've already got handy.  Max made me doo 
> eeet.
>
> BL in EC
>
> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 5:54:54 PM UTC-8 Max S wrote:
>
>> Do eet! 
>>
>> - Max "Knock-knock... Hi! Have you heard the good news about carbon 
>> tubulars?.." in A2
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 2:26:30 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> I have a tubular wheel set for my Roadeo also.  We're a GANG
>>>
>>> BL in EC
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 11:15:09 AM UTC-8 cz...@sonic.net wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hey Max -
>>>>
>>>> If you are one of two people worldwide that run sew-ups on a Riv, I am 
>>>> the other one. I had Rich build a set of wheels for sew-ups so I could run 
>>>> them on any of four Rivs (my wife would not tolerate 33mm tires on the 
>>>> Hubbuhubbuh after riding 71mm tires).
>>>>
>>>> Regards,
>>>>
>>>> Corwin
>>>>
>>>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:15:09 AM UTC-8 Max S wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> *"My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:*
>>>>> *Off With 'is 'ead!!!*
>>>>> *Pure blasphemy. I love it." *
>>>>>
>>>>> Well, yes, thank you – shock and awe was part of the intent for this 
>>>>> Halloween special "Iron Pumpkin" build  :-) 
>>>>> BTW, those wheels are tubulars... I might be one of two people 
>>>>> worldwide that run sew-up tires on a Riv?.. 
>>>>>
>>>>> - Max "totally tubular" in A2
>>>>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:25:59 AM UTC-5 mathiass...@gmail.com 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> @Max
>>>>>> My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:
>>>>>> Off With 'is 'ead!!!
>>>>>> Pure blasphemy. I love it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I reckon we can't complain -- they don't make SILVER carbon wheels 
>>>>>> yet. You're forgiven.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [Extra blather: Personally, I can't get into single speed. I went as 
>>>>>> far as not shifting for a week on my commute in order to see if I wanted 
>>>>>> to 
>>>>>> go SS for that purpose. 
>>>>>> Can't do it. Even my snow bike has an IGH and I use the low and 
>>>>>> middle gears every ride.]
>>>>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 6:50:06 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now *that's* got to be the most different, unique, idiosyncratic 
>>>>>>> Rivendell build I've seen; kudos for doing things your way!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Reminds me of a mountain bike I saw parked at my WDC apartment back 
>>>>>>> about 1987 with (IIRC) Scott AT-4 bar, disc wheels, and 1.5" Fatboy 
>>>>>>> slicks.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 5, 2024 at 4:23 PM Max S  wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Here's my favorite Riv for pavement (and dirt) riding (tires and 
>>>>>>>> wheels are #1 and #2 concerns, saddle-to-bar drop is #3, and close 
>>>>>>>> behind 
>>>>>>>> that is picking a reasonably fast color): 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>

Re: [RBW] Re: Anyone else not a fan of the very long chainstays?

[Max S]

The longest chainstay Rivs I have are Yves Gomes and the HubbuhHubbuh 
tandem. The latter especially so, when I ride it without a stoker. Then I 
really feel the wheelflop. When my youngest kid rides on the back, the 
wheelflop is less noticeable, and when the oldest kid gets on, it just 
about goes away. 

So, what John said above regarding position and balance resonates with me. 

Here's how I think the design proceeds... 

Say I want a bike that will feel easier to get on and off of, and will be 
retain its line / stability over bumps and downhill. This suggests: 

   1. a relatively low bottom bracket (easier to put a foot down) 
   2. a slacker head angle (better over bumps and turn-in)
   3. a longer trail (less likely to shimmy downhill) 
   
The combo of 2 and 3 yields greater wheelflop, which would create 
troublesome handling under many circumstances (for my taste). So, now I 
want to shift the rider weight back to unload the front wheel. I'll wind up 
with more saddle setback. But if I'm just sitting over the rear wheel, 
it'll be a harsher ride. Furthermore, if I intend to run a wider tire on a 
700c wheel, yet maintain a narrow Q – that's easier to accomplish with 
longer chainstays. As the rear wheels go further back, there's more of a 
"middle of the bus" (vs. back of the bus) feeling for the rider. Of course 
I still have to fix the longer reach, which I can do with swept-back bars. 

So, I think Grant arrived at a nice design window for these "hillibikes" 
that really works well for the kinds of riding scenarios and load placement 
that they (and many of their customers) engage in. 

One more thing from my personal experience... I used to live in NorCal and 
rode on the "flowy", soft trails there. I also rode my road bike up and 
down steep hills. Then I moved East, and got a chance to race road bikes 
for a few years, including crits – lots of fast, sharp turns, etc. The 
bikes I raced had 41 cm chainstays and skinny tires, and my weight was 
pretty low and forward. Nowadays I don't race, and avoid riding on roads 
altogether. I've come to appreciate longer chainstays for the dirt roads. 
But... I'm not completely in the upright / sit up camp, because when I ride 
harder, I feel like putting more of my glutes into the pedal stroke. It's 
worth checking out these videos 
 by a cycling coach 
on pedaling technique to appreciate that, depending on which muscle groups 
you want to engage, will also dictate something about your fore-aft 
positioning, as well as the type of handlebar you're likely to want to use. 
Drop bars didn't evolve in a vacuum – they're a solution to a specific 
problem of allowing the rider to maintain control over the bike when 
lunging forward onto the pedals with greater force, but also allowing the 
rider to "chill" with their hands on the tops when they're pedaling with 
smaller downforce. Same with chainstays. As Richard Sachs likes to say, the 
frame is the frame; the frame is not the bike. 

- Max "IMHO, IME, ATMO, YMMV, horses for courses, chainstays and handlebars 
go together" in A2


On Friday, March 8, 2024 at 9:51:54 PM UTC-5 krhe...@gmail.com wrote:

> @John,
> From you have spoken about more weight distribution further back on the 
> rear wheel and the handlebars closer to the rider for a comfortable upright 
> riding position, in my case with my 52cm Clem "L" bike, I have found myself 
> very comfortable with more weight on the back wheel with a Sakae Ringyo 
> MTE-100 seat post paired with a Brooks B-66S saddle. As far as getting the 
> my Nitto Bosco bars higher and closer to me, I found a NITTO Technomic 
> NTC-280 Stem to get me there. The stem is outrageously tall, yet it all 
> works for me with everything around these long chain stays as a senior 
> cyclist.  
>
> Kim Hetzel. [image: 20240128_143701hhh.jpg]
>
> On Friday, March 8, 2024 at 8:04:12 AM UTC-8 John Johnson wrote:
>
>> I have both normal and longish chainstay bikes in my house. I like the 
>> aesthetics of both, and they both feel "normal" (like Matt from Crust said) 
>> once you're riding. 
>>
>> I know way less about bike handling and geometry than most of you, but 
>> one thing I assume that when you're riding in a more upright position, you 
>> want those long chainstays because your center of gravity is more aft than 
>> with a "traditional" bike position, where you are leaned a bit more forward 
>> on your hands and your weight is distributed more up front. It makes 
>> intuitive sense to me, and if you look at both Jones and Riv, the comfy 
>> upright position that they both aim for (albeit via different routes) 
>> involves getting the bars closer to you (high stack and short reach in the 
>> case of Jones, high handlebars in the case of Riv) and long chainstays. It 
>> would make sense that if the rider's weight is supposed to be farther back, 
>> the bike design should take this into account.
>>
>> -John 
>> On 

Re: [RBW] Best Rivendell for pavement riding

[Max S]

Do eet! 

- Max "Knock-knock... Hi! Have you heard the good news about carbon 
tubulars?.." in A2

On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 2:26:30 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> I have a tubular wheel set for my Roadeo also.  We're a GANG
>
> BL in EC
>
> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 11:15:09 AM UTC-8 cz...@sonic.net wrote:
>
>> Hey Max -
>>
>> If you are one of two people worldwide that run sew-ups on a Riv, I am 
>> the other one. I had Rich build a set of wheels for sew-ups so I could run 
>> them on any of four Rivs (my wife would not tolerate 33mm tires on the 
>> Hubbuhubbuh after riding 71mm tires).
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>> Corwin
>>
>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:15:09 AM UTC-8 Max S wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> *"My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:*
>>> *Off With 'is 'ead!!!*
>>> *Pure blasphemy. I love it." *
>>>
>>> Well, yes, thank you – shock and awe was part of the intent for this 
>>> Halloween special "Iron Pumpkin" build  :-) 
>>> BTW, those wheels are tubulars... I might be one of two people worldwide 
>>> that run sew-up tires on a Riv?.. 
>>>
>>> - Max "totally tubular" in A2
>>> On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:25:59 AM UTC-5 mathiass...@gmail.com 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> @Max
>>>> My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:
>>>> Off With 'is 'ead!!!
>>>> Pure blasphemy. I love it.
>>>>
>>>> I reckon we can't complain -- they don't make SILVER carbon wheels yet. 
>>>> You're forgiven.
>>>>
>>>> [Extra blather: Personally, I can't get into single speed. I went as 
>>>> far as not shifting for a week on my commute in order to see if I wanted 
>>>> to 
>>>> go SS for that purpose. 
>>>> Can't do it. Even my snow bike has an IGH and I use the low and middle 
>>>> gears every ride.]
>>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 6:50:06 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Now *that's* got to be the most different, unique, idiosyncratic 
>>>>> Rivendell build I've seen; kudos for doing things your way!
>>>>>
>>>>> Reminds me of a mountain bike I saw parked at my WDC apartment back 
>>>>> about 1987 with (IIRC) Scott AT-4 bar, disc wheels, and 1.5" Fatboy 
>>>>> slicks.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, Mar 5, 2024 at 4:23 PM Max S  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Here's my favorite Riv for pavement (and dirt) riding (tires and 
>>>>>> wheels are #1 and #2 concerns, saddle-to-bar drop is #3, and close 
>>>>>> behind 
>>>>>> that is picking a reasonably fast color): 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve 67 carbon wheels - drive side.jpeg]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> - Max "orange you glad I didn't say banana?" in A2
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 4:18:43 PM UTC-5 J J wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chuck, I believe the best Rivendell for pavement riding is whichever 
>>>>>>> Rivendell that fits you well and is comfortable for your body, that 
>>>>>>> pleases 
>>>>>>> you mechanically and aesthetically, that is within your budget, and 
>>>>>>> that 
>>>>>>> accomplishes whatever goals for the type of riding you hope to do. 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You said you will be riding mostly on pavement. Pavement riding is a 
>>>>>>> broad category, and there are many different modes and types of it. 
>>>>>>> Will it 
>>>>>>> be "practical" pavement riding (like commuting or hauling stuff from 
>>>>>>> the 
>>>>>>> supermarket), relaxed cruising on a weekend morning, or racing in a 
>>>>>>> group? 
>>>>>>> Will you occasionally venture off road? All of the above?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> One of the things that makes Rivs so wonderful is their versatility. 
>>>>>>> This is what I value about Rivs above all else, which is why I 
>>>>>>> gravitate to 
>>>>>>> the various All Rounders. An Atlantis, for example, can be set up many 
>>>>>>> different ways and it will be brilliant in the various guises. Swap a 
&g

Re: [RBW] Best Rivendell for pavement riding

[Max S]

*"My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:*
*Off With 'is 'ead!!!*
*Pure blasphemy. I love it." *

Well, yes, thank you – shock and awe was part of the intent for this 
Halloween special "Iron Pumpkin" build  :-) 
BTW, those wheels are tubulars... I might be one of two people worldwide 
that run sew-up tires on a Riv?.. 

- Max "totally tubular" in A2
On Wednesday, March 6, 2024 at 6:25:59 AM UTC-5 mathiass...@gmail.com wrote:

> @Max
> My first thought when I saw your RIvendell was:
> Off With 'is 'ead!!!
> Pure blasphemy. I love it.
>
> I reckon we can't complain -- they don't make SILVER carbon wheels yet. 
> You're forgiven.
>
> [Extra blather: Personally, I can't get into single speed. I went as far 
> as not shifting for a week on my commute in order to see if I wanted to go 
> SS for that purpose. 
> Can't do it. Even my snow bike has an IGH and I use the low and middle 
> gears every ride.]
> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 6:50:06 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> Now *that's* got to be the most different, unique, idiosyncratic 
>> Rivendell build I've seen; kudos for doing things your way!
>>
>> Reminds me of a mountain bike I saw parked at my WDC apartment back about 
>> 1987 with (IIRC) Scott AT-4 bar, disc wheels, and 1.5" Fatboy slicks.
>>
>> On Tue, Mar 5, 2024 at 4:23 PM Max S  wrote:
>>
>>> Here's my favorite Riv for pavement (and dirt) riding (tires and wheels 
>>> are #1 and #2 concerns, saddle-to-bar drop is #3, and close behind that is 
>>> picking a reasonably fast color): 
>>>
>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve 67 carbon wheels - drive side.jpeg]
>>>
>>> - Max "orange you glad I didn't say banana?" in A2
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 4:18:43 PM UTC-5 J J wrote:
>>>
>>>> Chuck, I believe the best Rivendell for pavement riding is whichever 
>>>> Rivendell that fits you well and is comfortable for your body, that 
>>>> pleases 
>>>> you mechanically and aesthetically, that is within your budget, and that 
>>>> accomplishes whatever goals for the type of riding you hope to do. 
>>>>
>>>> You said you will be riding mostly on pavement. Pavement riding is a 
>>>> broad category, and there are many different modes and types of it. Will 
>>>> it 
>>>> be "practical" pavement riding (like commuting or hauling stuff from the 
>>>> supermarket), relaxed cruising on a weekend morning, or racing in a group? 
>>>> Will you occasionally venture off road? All of the above?
>>>>
>>>> One of the things that makes Rivs so wonderful is their versatility. 
>>>> This is what I value about Rivs above all else, which is why I gravitate 
>>>> to 
>>>> the various All Rounders. An Atlantis, for example, can be set up many 
>>>> different ways and it will be brilliant in the various guises. Swap a 
>>>> handlebar or tires (either wider or narrower, or to or from slicks and 
>>>> knobbies) and you have a bike with different character suited for a 
>>>> different type of riding, all while retaining the Rivendell feel. 
>>>>
>>>> If you want a "road" bike strictly speaking, there are a lot of great 
>>>> suggestions in this thread. In the end it comes back to your own 
>>>> subjectivity, and your sense of the kind of riding you will be doing.
>>>>
>>>> Good luck with your search!
>>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 2:01:43 PM UTC-5 heike...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Hi Chuck--as you asked about the Appaloosa and a drop-bar alternative, 
>>>>> I'll chime in: I have a 51" 650B Appaloosa with Nitto Choco bars 
>>>>> <https://www.rivbike.com/products/nitto-choco-norm-bar-alu-ht-54cm-x-25-4-100mm-sleeve-tandem-162491>,
>>>>>  
>>>>> which Riv describes thus: "It's also good for road bikes instead of a 
>>>>> drop 
>>>>> bar, when you want a close grip and a totally perfect next-to-stem grip. 
>>>>> It's the best bar we have for that." I really like these bars, as I can 
>>>>> grab the flats when going fast, downhill, or against wind, and the 
>>>>> swept-back part is super comfortable otherwise. It's not a super wide 
>>>>> bar; 
>>>>> never feels out of place even on narrower paths or in traffic. 
>>>>>
>>>>> I bought the Appa as a mixed-terrain bike, as a true allrounder, and I 

[RBW] Re: Building a Quickbeam and wondering...

[Max S]

I should add that I always aim for as narrow of a Q-factor as I can get on 
a set-up. The best has been an old Mavic 631 "Starfish" crank with a 39t 
chainring, mated to the narrowest (103 or 107 mm) bottom bracket I could 
find. The next best – by just a couple millimeters were Sun XCD and Rene 
Herse, then DuraAce track (I've a Hollowtech spindle version in 175 mm that 
I'd be happy to sell, actually). Mind, the DA track crank gets you a Q of 
136 mm (!) so this is all going to be loads better, IMO, than any crank 
I've seen sold by Riv in recent memory. I reckon you could do well by 
finding a cheap Shimano 600 / TriColor crank on the Bay and sticking a 
generic, un-ramped 42t ring on it in the outer position, and a 
cheap-and-cheerful 103 mm bottom bracket. If you want stiff, go for a 
Hollowtech crank from Shimano. 
BTW, the bottom bracket on the QuickBeam sits a bit higher than on most of 
my other bikes, so you can clear a longer crank in fixed gear mode. Still, 
I'd recommend limiting tires to ~38 mm and eschewing fenders to minimize 
toe overlap.

- Max "narrow is aero" in A2

On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 6:07:02 PM UTC-5 Max S wrote:

> Fun! At one point, I had both a SimpleOne and a QuickBeam in the stable, 
> plus two other fixies. I'll try to attach some photos as examples. 
> On the Rivs, I've run a number of different crank and cog combinations, 
> probably 10-20 in all. Some of the more interesting ones included a 
> double-ring WI ENO crank with a WI DOS freewheel + Surly Dingle (so that's 
> potentially 8 gear ratios), an Endless cog on a freehub, and a single track 
> cog + DA track crank. I ran everything from a Paul flip-flop, to a DA 
> track, to a burly 135mm spaced Deore disc hub, to a DT Swiss 350 freehub 
> laced to 60 mm deep carbon rims. 
> My tooth combos included 53x19, 52x19, 50x18, 46x17, 45x17, 45x16, 42x16, 
> 39x15... I found the good ol' 42x16 and 46x17 to be the more sustainable 
> ratios on most days. When I was in decent form, 52x19 and 50x18 with carbon 
> wheels felt good, but I haven't had such form for a couple of years now. 
> The most recent combo was a Rene Herse crank with a 40t narrow-wide ring 
> and 18t in the back, with full metal fenders, rack, and basket, intended 
> for commuting. But I'll be changing that to a 15t cog in the back for 
> faster, shorter rides. 
> For reference, I used to do 20-50 mile long rides on these single speeds / 
> fixies, with a typical elevation gain limited to ~2,000 ft over, say, a 40 
> mile jaunt. 
>
> - Max "idee fixe" in A2
>
> [image: Rivendell Quickbeam Fall Foliage 2022 rs.jpg]
> [image: Rivendell Simple One - GOAT.jpg]
> [image: QuickBeam - Enve 67 carbon wheels - drive side.jpeg]
> [image: QuickBeam - carbon wheels - chainline.jpg]
> [image: Rivendell Simple One - portaging pastries from Boro.jpeg]
> [image: Rivendell Ride - KalHaven Trail Summer 2022.jpeg]
> On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 3:21:08 PM UTC-5 David wrote:
>
>> What are your drivetrain specs? Cranks, chainrings, etc.  Simpleones, 
>> too, if that's what you're riding. It appears Riv doesn't offer the classic 
>> single speed crankset anymore.
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Best Rivendell for pavement riding

[Max S]

Really great points made by Mathias, and also by Patrick in his post about 
iterating...  
IMO, the easiest way to find a good bike is to set your budget and then 
make a post whose subject starts with "WTB:.. " – all sorts of cool and 
awesome bikes will emerge that fit your criteria! 

- Max "it's a journey" in A2

On Tuesday, March 5, 2024 at 8:14:36 AM UTC-5 mathiass...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hi Chuck,
>
> I've never owned a Rivendell, so I believe it's important I chime in... 
> because of this:
>
> >> I tried a Roadini (which I recently listed here and sold), but I think 
> it was too big for me.
>
> It probably wasn't too "big", it was probably too long in the top tube.
>
> In the current Riv idea space, the Albatross is the handlebar of choice. 
> The one Grant says he'll ride when he's old. I'd argue you can't build a 
> bike that accomodates swept back AND drop handlebars for the same rider in 
> the same size. The difference is  only a few cm, but they matter. 
>
> I tend to pick one bike every year and build it from the frame up, to ride 
> it and see how I like it, and what I can learn from it. And since I always 
> use a Brooks B17 and a Nitto Noodle, that provides a handy size reference. 
> The distance from the saddle tip to the handlebar cross tube is always the 
> same when I'm done fitting it.. and it matches the ancient rule that if you 
> put your elbow against the tip of the saddle, the finger tips should just 
> reach the handlebar. Stem lengths go from 70 to 100 mm, on frames ranging 
> from from a 52 cm Bruce Gordon BLT to a a 25 inch (63.5 cm) Cannondale 
> ST600 to and a few in between. Top tube length (effective) ranges from 56 
> to 59 cm. 
>
> So figure out what YOUR saddle/bar distance or top tube length should be, 
> and find your size accordingly. Were I to buy a Roadini, and the thought 
> has crossed my mind, I'd have to go for a fairly small frame. For my 6 ft 
> height and 89 cm PBH, I'm between the 57 and 61 cm size for the Roadini, 
> and the 57 cm has a 59 cm top tube, so that would be my size, and the stem 
> would have to be short, which doesn't look good to my eyes.
>
> For what it's worth, our pavement here in freeze/thaw country 
> (mid-Michigan) is famously nasty, and for road riding, I like 32 mm 
> GP5000s... add some dirt roads, and I'm currently riding 35 mm Paselas, 
> which seem to roll pretty fast and do OK on loose surfaces. I see no reason 
> to go wide on asphalt.
>
> To buy any bicycle:
> - decide on the tire you want to ride, which means pick the target roads 
> and routes.
> - decide if you'll mount fenders. 
> - now look at the frames that will accomodate the first criteria, and see 
> if you can find your size.
>
> It may be that a detour through an older (~1980) Trek or Raleigh is the 
> way to find your setup... most of the parts will move right over, plus it's 
> fun.
>
> cheers -mathias
>
>
>
> To view this discussion on the web visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/43ff7469-c029-4b2a-83bf-3ce31d020790n%40googlegroups.com
>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Sam Hillborne Pictures Thread

[Max S]

Oooh... I really like the look and the idea of this one!.. How bit a 650b 
tire does it fit now? 

- Max "wish I had friends with acetylene torches" in A2

On Tuesday, February 20, 2024 at 9:27:07 AM UTC-5 brianmark...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> Here’s mine, I’ve had it for two years or so. 56cm double tt, got the 
> frame in this group, had a friend add canti bosses at 650b, and had it 
> painted at Bilenky cycles in Philly. My favorite bike aside from my cargo 
> bike, and I have to constantly convince myself it’s not the only bike I 
> need. Currently in “rando” mode, but I’ve mostly had it with a basket in 
> front and R14 in the rear. Really can do pretty much everything, and so 
> comfortably! 
>
> On Monday, February 19, 2024 at 7:17:00 PM UTC-5 Tony Lockhart wrote:
>
>> [image: IMG_3348.JPG]
>> 14 years and 4 months old...best bike I've ever had.
>> On Saturday, February 17, 2024 at 11:36:22 AM UTC-8 Bikie#4646 wrote:
>>
>>> Paul, I have a A.H. Homer for spirted mixed-surface riding. But I 
>>> figured I would get a 2015 (new) Sam Hillborne  for my touring needs. It is 
>>> a bit stouter and capable for riding fully loaded, sometimes on dirt. 
>>> Confidence-building off road, mainly rail trails. I have it set up with a 
>>> Nitto rear rack and a Rivendell HAR front rack. Two to four Ortlieb 
>>> panniers and a Sugarloaf basket bag will take me for 5-day unsupported 
>>> trips without worry..
>>> I love this bike as a dedicated tourer but often pull the rear rack for 
>>> local riding. I find the mustache bars with the 100mm stem allows for 
>>> "stretching out" on longer days in the saddle. 
>>> I'm outfitted with 35mm tires because of the VO fenders, which I find 
>>> very helpful for mid-Atlantic and mid-West multi-day touring. I'd love to 
>>> try it on the C Towpath with wider rubber, but would miss the comfort 
>>> that fenders give.
>>> Here's my "Tuxedo Sam":
>>> [image: IMG_8012.jpeg] 
>>>
>>> Also:
>>>
>>> https://www.flickr.com/photos/bikecrazy-paul/53503542529/in/dateposted-public/
>>>
>>> Paul Germain
>>> Midlothian, Va.
>>> On Saturday, February 17, 2024 at 1:24:03 PM UTC-5 velomann wrote:
>>>
 Here are some pictures of my Hillborne, 2020 model in "Dark Gold" with 
 Cantilever bosses and the seatstay "socket" lug.
 I purchased the frame new through Golden Pliers here in PDX and built 
 it up myself, including wheels.
 Build notes:
 Wheels - Rear White Industries T11 hub, front SON Dyno hub, 32h laced 
 with Sapim butted spokes to Velocity Dyed rims, currently running 
 Panaracer 
 Pasela Protite 650b x 42 tires with silver Velo Orange Wavy fenders.

 Drivetrain - 2 x 9 with 170 Sugino XD2 triple crank with homemade 
 bashguard on outer ring, 38 x 24 middle/inner rings & 11-34 cassette, 
 shifted by Microshift thumbies,  Ultegra front and rear derailleurs 
 Jagwire 
 gold braided cable housing.

 Cockpit - Bosco bars and Nitto 130mm faceplate quill stem, harlequin 
 wrapped with orange and yellow Newbaums and a few coats of clear shellac. 
 Paul Components orange Love Levers pulling Paul Motolite brakes, ESI 
 silicone grips, Spurcycle limited-edition bell with orange striker.

 Racks & Bags - Wald 137 basket mounted to Nitto Mark's rack with 
 Marigold Outershell basketbag and limited edition Swift Industries/Camp 
 and 
 Go Slow Sideaddladdlebagkick stem pouch. Matching Zeitgeist saddlebag 
 supported by rear-mounted Nitto M18  rack.

 Flickr album here: https://flic.kr/s/aHsmS7U2WY

 Mike M

 [image: IMG_1530.JPG][image: IMG_4661.jpg][image: IMG_5025.jpg]


  

 On Wednesday, February 14, 2024 at 10:35:39 AM UTC-8 Paul in Dallas 
 wrote:

> After seeing various Sam owners pictures here and there on various 
> threads I thought I would start a thread dedicated to the versatile Sam's.
>
> Perhaps such a thread already exists?
>
> No worries if it does and perhaps someone could post a link if there 
> is one out there.
>
> Here is my Sam with upright bars.
>
> I'm an older Riv owner , almost 74 and still love riding and working 
> on bikes.
>
> I managed just over 2700 miles in 2023 ( not all on the Sam)
>  and hope to top that in 2024 the Good Lord willing.
>
> My bars are the  Sunlite North Road alloy version.
> ( They also have a steel version)
> I like these North Roads so much I have them on multiple bikes 
>
> I have a very tall stem column , (forget the brand)
> and a thread less stem, Origin8 I think.
> I need the bars way up for the old back.
> It works well for me and I've done up to 73 miles on it set up this 
> way.
>
> I have a triple crank (need the granny to get up hills).
>  I'm using the more 
> modern Dia Compe thumb shifters, 
> Shimano derailers, 
> Tektro 559 brake calipers, 
> Velocity Dyad 

[RBW] Re: Production Riv with largest Stack / Reach ratio

[Max S]

Just looked on Riv's website and noticed that the 54.5 cm Homer has the 
closest to what I'm looking to try: 62 cm stack and 36 cm reach. Never 
looked at that frame size before, because I'm usually in the 59 cm and up 
range, but there it is! 
Any others I'm overlooking? 
- M

On Monday, February 5, 2024 at 3:21:48 PM UTC-5 Weston Hein wrote:

> For current production models, the 57cm Roadini seems like the perfect 
> fit. 57cm has 63cm stack, 38cm reach, and 62cm front center:
>
>
> https://bikeinsights.com/bikes/5bb29e327581960016665a2c-rivendell-bicycle-works-roadini?build=base=2023
>
> In stock at Riv too!
>
> On Monday, February 5, 2024 at 11:17:34 AM UTC-8 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> The Lemond Dutch has an enormous Stack/Reach ratio.  The Small has a 
>>  >>60cm stack (691mm) and a <38cm reach (356mm).  The Medium has almost the 
>> same stack (696mm) and a 380mm reach on the nose.  The Large has a 742mm 
>> stack and 404mm reach.  
>>
>> I imagine the Lemond Dutch is disqualified for at least 5 reasons:
>>
>> 1. It's expensive
>> 2. It's an e-bike (as delivered)
>> 3. It's carbon
>> 4. It has a proprietary handlebar assembly
>> 5. It is a step-through
>>
>> despite the disqualifiers it nails the stack/reach ratio question.  
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>> On Monday, February 5, 2024 at 10:57:45 AM UTC-8 Max S wrote:
>>
>>> Question for the RBW braintrust: 
>>>
>>> Which production Riv has the largest Stack / Reach ratio?.. 
>>>
>>> For this quest, I'm curious if there's something out there that's >60cm 
>>> stack and <38cm reach, and >61cm front-center, wondering if I can get there 
>>> without a full-on custom. If not a Rivendell, what other production options 
>>> might folks suggest? (not interested in tall stems, but am interested in 
>>> tall headtubes) 
>>>
>>> TIA! 
>>>
>>> - Max "helping a T-Rex get into the sport" in A2
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Production Riv with largest Stack / Reach ratio

[Max S]

Question for the RBW braintrust: 

Which production Riv has the largest Stack / Reach ratio?.. 

For this quest, I'm curious if there's something out there that's >60cm 
stack and <38cm reach, and >61cm front-center, wondering if I can get there 
without a full-on custom. If not a Rivendell, what other production options 
might folks suggest? (not interested in tall stems, but am interested in 
tall headtubes) 

TIA! 

- Max "helping a T-Rex get into the sport" in A2

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Re: [RBW] Brake cables and housing

[Max S]

Modern housing lined with slick polymer on the interior and polished cables 
truly minimize maintenance needs. My cables and housing die mainly because 
I reconfigure my handlebar set-ups too frequently and wind up chopping 
housing too short or crimping the cable too much. 
That said, it's still not a bad idea to check every few years how the cable 
is doing – in some tight bends you can get rubbing and abrasion, and if 
that propagates to the cable, it could lead to failure. Since I futz so 
much with my set-up, I end up seeing how the housing and cables look for 
their entire length often enough to spot any kinks or abraded spots. 

- Max "striving to futz less, work efficiently, and ride more in 2024" in A2

On Sunday, February 4, 2024 at 1:38:48 PM UTC-5 John Bokman wrote:

> Wow, I guess I'll just maintain with occasional lubricant and not bother. 
> I thought many riders changed cables and housing every year or so? Guess 
> not. For the record, my braking is fine (Shimano cx70 cantilevers mated to 
> Shimano tiagra levers and koolstop salmon pads). Just wondering how much 
> better they'd be with newly installed housing and cable. And now I see 
> there are all sorts of new (to me) specialty housing and cables on which to 
> spend money...Thanks for the replies.
>
> John
>
> On Saturday, February 3, 2024 at 5:04:06 PM UTC-8 aeroperf wrote:
>
>> Every 5000 miles the cables on my Sam get cleaned and lubed with Phils 
>> Tenacious Oil.
>>
>> John Dewey - that is an outstanding photograph.
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Roaduno and the state of single speed bikes

[Max S]

So, I've got the ol' flip-flop hub, I've got a DOS freewheel and a Dingle 
cog, and I even hand the ENO double-ring crank (that I then passed on to 
Bill). In all this time riding SS & fixed, I've never actually stopped 
mid-ride to change the gearing. I guess my area isn't all that hilly, so 
I'll suffer up the hill (or down the hill) a bit, but I don't interrupt the 
ride. I'm curious, do people with 1x2 or 2x2 "SS" or fixed-gear setups 
actually stop, unbolt / release the wheel, move the chain, re-tighten, and 
then continue up the hill?.. 

- Max "learning to let go of overprovisioned set-ups in life" in A2

On Sunday, February 4, 2024 at 1:09:46 PM UTC-5 Berkeleyan wrote:

> The paint and fancier lugs on the RoadUno are beautiful, glad to see this 
> coming. Still, I love my 66cm QuickBeam. I stick with a single ring up 
> front and a Dos ENO 17-19 freewheel on the rear, with a 16 fixed cog on the 
> other side. It gets me anywhere in Berkeley except up the steepest hills, 
> and also serves as a fine S24O steed (I rode it from Ferry Building over GG 
> Bridge to Corte Madera for Entmoot that one time. The thing maybe not clear 
> until you ride a single is the extra body english you're going to be 
> employing - I stand on the pedals a lot, and do paperboy up many slopes. 
> This is fine, the delight of not ever shifting while riding is exquisite, 
> and I enjoy the tighter bond with  the bike. It's the "one" bike I'll never 
> let go of.
>
> - Andrew, Berkeley
>
> On Friday, February 2, 2024 at 2:16:12 PM UTC-8 Edwin W wrote:
>
>> I like single speed bikes, many like single speed bikes. The simplicity, 
>> the possibility of fixed gear, it is the epitome of biking for me, I think.
>>
>> I like the idea of the roaduno. So far it looks like it will have 
>> 700c/622 wheel size, long reach side pull brakes. Rear facing drop outs. 
>> Those are the main factors to think about, because stem length, handlebar 
>> and lever type, fenders or not, dynamo or not, are flexible on most bikes.
>>
>> What is the competition, and what are they offering?
>> Crust Lightning bolt single speed. 650b wheels with anti posts. 
>>
>> BMC Monstercross. 700c wheels and cantilever posts. But that has 135mm 
>> rear spacing, so not exactly built for single speed.
>>
>> What else is out there that can take a 38mm (or so) tire with a fender?
>>
>> Edwin
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: External bottom brackets for dummies?

[Max S]

A different, but related question: 

I mistakenly bought the MTN version of a Shimano bottom bracket (external 
cups) for a recent 105 crank. Comparing to the old (road) BB, it looked to 
me like the only difference was the internal plastic sleeve length. I 
swapped in the old sleeve between the new cups, and that seemed to go in 
fine. Maybe last couple of millimeters were a little tighter than the right 
hand cup, but went in. 

Did I do something that will come back to bite me?.. 

- Max 

On Sunday, January 21, 2024 at 3:35:05 PM UTC-5 Garth wrote:

> Keith, road bike double crank chainline spec is always 43.5mm. Are you 
> measuring between the rings ? 
>
> You may hate me for saying so but it sounds like this crank would be 
> better suited for another frame with at least 135mm spacing. With the big 
> ring that far out on a 130mm spaced road frame, your available cogs(without 
> a lot of friction) diminishes by at least one, likely two. 
>
> On Sunday, January 21, 2024 at 2:57:58 PM UTC-5 iamkeith wrote:
>
>> Nick, as I mentioned in my question, I too only have experience with 
>> cranks that take spacers between the arm and the cup.  It makes more sense 
>> that way, but this bb definitely seems to require spacers next to the 
>> shell.  That's how it was assembled when it arrived.  I just cant figure 
>> out why it's asymmetrical.  Ive now learned that, even with a 73mm shell,  
>> it would still require a single 2.5mm spacer on the drive side, UNLESS 
>> there was a bb-mounted deraileur or bash gauard plate.  But you'd think the 
>> crank arms would be shaped to compensate for that.  
>>
>> As set up in my photo, I have a 50mm chainline.  Sheldon says a road 
>> double should be 47mm, so that's another reason not to add more spacers on 
>> that side.
>>
>> You probably had the best idea though.  I guess I'll take a dremel to the 
>> non-drive-side arm or spidel end, so it can slide inward a few more 
>> millimeters and at least be symmetrical.  
>>
>> It'll still be wider than necessary, but I'm not Q- factor sensitive, 
>> fortunately.  I guess this is really intended as a mtb crank, even though 
>> it doesn't say that on soma's or interloc's website?
>>
>> On Sunday, January 21, 2024 at 9:41:32 AM UTC-7 wboe...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I mostly take the number of spacers they recommend and arrange them in 
>>> whjatever fashion creates the best chainline for the bike. 
>>>
>>> Will
>>>
>>> On Sunday, January 21, 2024 at 8:26:56 AM UTC-5 aeroperf wrote:
>>>
 I’m going to stick with the spacers going as shown in the exploded view 
 - spacers going between the cup and the BB shell.  
 You’re absolutely right on the prep work.  Both bikes were chased, but 
 the Soma was not faced… probably why it gets by with the spacer stack 
 slightly smaller.



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[RBW] Re: Leo Roadini on Brevet--SFR Del Puerto Canyon 200k ride report

[Max S]

Regarding the weight of Leo... there was a thread earlier on the list 
discussing the Crust Malocchio, where Bill wrote: 

   - *"...the reported weight of the Malocchio is very low.  They claim 
   frame and fork combined are under 6 pounds.  Even with a headset it may 
   still be a hair under 6 pounds.  My Rivendell Legolas weighed 6.30 pounds 
   frame+fork+headset, and that's about as light a frame as Rivendell can 
   make.  My Roadini weighed 7.75 pounds for frame + fork + headset." *

8 lbs is quite a lot, IMO, even for a steel bike. That doesn't imply it's a 
bad ride, or worse than a lighter frame might be. Neither does this read on 
whether a given rider can tell the difference while riding... 

Now, I'm aware of the "blind" tests done with Mondonico frames having 
different tube specs, etc., and the "surprising" results of people 
preferring the thicker wall, "downspec" tubing. Like Bill, I've got enough 
bikes in my collection, and do enough tinkering with them, to do my own 
A/B/C comparisons. In contrast to Bill, I believe I can feel a difference 
between a light and a heavy bike, a given bike free of bags and with bags, 
and a given bike with baggage located in different spots (e.g., on top of 
front rack vs. low-riders vs. saddle, etc.), different tires and wheels, 
different inner tubes, and so on. 

I think that weight – and in particular, weight *distribution* on a bike – 
can make a huge difference in how the bike feels when pedaling seated, out 
of saddle, downhill or uphill, with and without hands on bars, etc. Moving 
a load from the front to the rear can easily cause a bike to shimmy even 
pedaling on flat ground – I have video to prove it. And whether my average 
speed changes or not for a given effort, I can still have personal 
preferences. It's just like people have preferences for low- vs. mid- vs. 
high trail steering, based on what they're used to, the terrain, etc. 

Speaking of bike geometry, I think one could tell differences between 
frames that are geometry-driven, more than weight, but the two aspects have 
some interplay between them. Frame flex, for example, is another attribute 
that depends on tubing diameter and wall thickness, but also quite a bit on 
frame design. The long and relatively skinny chainstays on the Roadini are 
going to flex a lot more than the thin-walled, short, light, but 
super-beefy chainstays on the Pegoretti Round, for example. How much flex 
will feel good to you depends on your weight, riding style and surface, 
etc. Plenty of riders and custom frame builders have experience with having 
a tuned / optimized flex characteristic, and one that may even change for a 
given person with time. 

Speaking of custom, it's quite possible to get custom steel frameset (frame 
+ fork) to weigh closer to 5 lbs, and then build it up into a ~16 lb bike 
with ~32-35mm tires (some titanium and carbon parts may need to be used). 
Check out the steel bikes made by Rob English – plenty of examples in that 
range! How stiff that frame will be, and how ponderously it'll ride will 
depend on how the frame is laid out. One 16 lb bike may well end up riding 
more sluggishly than a 23 lb Roadini. 

So, I think it's great to ask for and share qualitative opinions. I'd also 
add that it's helpful to specify what wheels, tires, and other attributes 
the bike had, and maybe include pictures of the set-up, too, as that could 
give a better idea of where the weight is distributed, which impacts how 
the bike feels, rider weight, etc. It's no different from the talk of 
racquets on tennis forums – a given stick in the hands of a star college 
varsity player will feel very different than in the hands of a weekend 3.5 
league doubles player. That info, along with playing / stroke style, is 
typically specified in reviews to help others make a decision. 

- Max "I wouldn't want a head tube shallower than my QB, and would not 
object to a slightly lower bottom bracket, and I sure can tell the lower 
weight with carbon wheels and titanium fixin's" in A2 

On Wednesday, January 17, 2024 at 2:10:10 PM UTC-5 four...@gmail.com wrote:

> Bill,
>
> Thank for the concise, informative replies! I really mean that.. and do 
> get what you mean, for the most part.. I have my Dad's AHH I inherited 
> that, I think, comes in around 25# (typical 2010ish RIV build) and it 
> certainly doesn't ride heavy.. 
>
> I can get totally wrapped around the axle on the perception of weight for 
> sure.. :) Appreciate the grounding truth! 
>
> Chris 
>
> On Wednesday, January 17, 2024 at 10:29:02 AM UTC-8 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> "what I don't want is a bike that feels "heavy" or "sluggish" when being 
>> ridden.. I think we all know what that means"
>>
>> I think this is where I'm the outlier because I *don't* know what that 
>> means.  Or, to be more specific, what I think that means is something 
>> different from what other people mean.  The way I always express it is that 
>> all my bikes go faster 

[RBW] Re: VBC chainring swap?

[Max S]

Yes, got a feeling this will work out!  ;-) 

- Max 

On Wednesday, December 13, 2023 at 5:05:26 PM UTC-5 saintruggler wrote:

> PM sent.
>
> On Wednesday, December 13, 2023 at 1:16:43 PM UTC-8 Michael Baquerizo 
> wrote:
>
>>
>> hi all - i took my VBC chainrings off my appaloosa and theyre going on to 
>> a bob jackson audax frame that has a braze on for front derailleur, ie i 
>> need to use a certain size ring to get my front derailleur to work. 
>> thinking anyhting from 46-50 would be ideal for the big ring, and 36-38 or 
>> so for the small ring? Mine is a 38 / 24
>>
>> TLDR I'd like to trade my not really used so much (i dunno, 200 miles 
>> MAX?) 38/24 for a bigger set, 46-50/36-38, give or take. 
>>
>> not sure why i can't get the photo to work but shows some anodizing loss 
>> but no change to shape, shark finning, etc. 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: NBOD: New Bike Ordered Day! The mythical canti-Roa!

[Max S]

Sounds like a great idea, Bill!  I really like the idea of a lower BB, what 
with the fatter tires. 
Any notes on how this will differ from the Ebisu All Purpose? 

- Max 

On Tuesday, April 5, 2022 at 1:20:20 PM UTC-4 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> There are a number of threads on which I've mentioned a desire to own a 
> Nobilette-built Roadeo with cantilever posts.  It came up in a thread about 
> the Legolas, it came up in a thread about brevets on Rivs.  I've made no 
> secret that I wanted a Canti-Roa.  There have been Canti-Roms, Canti-Rams, 
> even Canti-Homers.  I'm on record saying that my ideal Riv road bike would 
> be a Nobilette build, constructed of Roadeo/Legolas tubing, Roadeo 
> Geometry, but the clearances of my Canti-Hillborne.  Putting my money where 
> my mouth is, I'd stated a few times that if any of you would buy my 
> existing Roadeo, that I'd put all your dollars right back to Riv and order 
> a Canti-Roa.  
>
> Well, it finally happened.  Lister Corwin needed my 59 Roadeo frame and 
> fork, and today I sent all his dollars plus several of my own back to 
> Rivendell to order a Canti-Roadeo.  Mark Abele and I are ironing out the 
> details.  I've got no idea yet how long Nobilette's queue is at the moment, 
> but I'm very excited.  I have no clue whatsoever on color yet.  
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>

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Re: [RBW] Susie Longbolts – offload yours on me or talk me out of it?!

[Max S]

You all have been very, very helpful! Will ponder this and, hopefully, make 
some progress on my fitness with indoor exercise, as the cold months set 
in. 

- Max 

On Saturday, November 25, 2023 at 12:36:17 PM UTC-5 ryan.o...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> You could also wait for the new batch that's apparently a merging of Suz 
> and Gus. 
>
> On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 2:42 PM Ryan Ogilvie  wrote:
>
>> I got a 56 Suz a few months ago and experience aligns with Mack's. Really 
>> versatile--fun on road and trail. 
>>
>> Frame is pretty light, so you could do a minimalist steel frame build. I 
>> have dynamo, cliffhangers, racks, but don't mind the weight. 
>>
>> It is a looong frame. Hard to fit on car racks, trains and that sort 
>> of thing, but also hard to wipe out with those chainstays. 
>>
>> On Mon, Nov 20, 2023 at 2:05 PM Richard Rose  wrote:
>>
>>> Coming from a Gus owner who has ridden both; DO IT! For all of the 
>>> reasons mentioned here and more. My Gus is a very capable & comfortable 
>>> rigid MTB. Also a pleasure riding to the trail & superb on gravel. 
>>> Bikepacking? YES! 29 x 2.6 @ 16-18psi (tubeless) and it rolls over 
>>> everything. It’s just a great, fun as hell bike. When I rode a friend’s 
>>> Susie I really did not notice the weight difference. What I can say is the 
>>> front end might be a bit stiffer. Not in a bad way, just very precise. You 
>>> cannot go wrong.
>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>
>>> On Nov 20, 2023, at 12:06 PM, Max S  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>> Thinking of getting a fatter-tired bike going for casual Zone 2 sorties 
>>> and quiet trail riding. (Mainly need a frame as an excuse to use my idle 
>>> Bullmoose bars... so it goes.) 
>>>
>>> If you have a Susie, what's your experience been like? Would you 
>>> recommend it and for what? Should I try to find a 56 cm Susie (Riv is out 
>>> of stock), or should I get something else?.. Should I get something custom 
>>> made that'll be lighter?.. 
>>>
>>> - Max "idle lunchtime thoughts on this cool November day while not 
>>> wanting to do any work nor organize my already overflowing bike room" in MI 
>>>
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>>
>>
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>> ryan.o...@gmail.com
>>
>
>
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[RBW] Susie Longbolts – offload yours on me or talk me out of it?!

[Max S]

Thinking of getting a fatter-tired bike going for casual Zone 2 sorties and 
quiet trail riding. (Mainly need a frame as an excuse to use my idle 
Bullmoose bars... so it goes.) 

If you have a Susie, what's your experience been like? Would you recommend 
it and for what? Should I try to find a 56 cm Susie (Riv is out of stock), 
or should I get something else?.. Should I get something custom made 
that'll be lighter?.. 

- Max "idle lunchtime thoughts on this cool November day while not wanting 
to do any work nor organize my already overflowing bike room" in MI 

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Re: [RBW] Re: Are Paul brakes worth the money?

[Max S]

I'll also chime in to say that Paul brakes have some advantageous features 
(e.g., continuous spring tension adjustability), but also some features 
that I find infuriating in actual use, and a few instances of downright 
poor mechanical design. 
One design flaw is the fully threaded mounting bolt on the Racer, which I 
discussed in a slightly geeky thread on iBOB / with Mark Bulgier. It places 
a stress riser precisely at the root, front of fork crown, where it should 
be avoided at all costs. Perhaps the grade of the steel is above and beyond 
what's been used in the past, but it would fail scrutiny in a basic 
mechanical design class. 
Another flaw has to do with using a separate steel sleeve fitting over the 
canti stud. It puts the brake further out than it needs to, and the problem 
it's presumably attempting to solve (warped studs, bearing corrosion?..) 
creates problems with mounting in the first place, and is avoided entirely 
by brass bushings on the majority of other brakes. I've encountered 
problems mounting them on two frames, and a third frame I bought had one 
VERY firmly stuck on the stud... Haven't had this issue with any of the 
nearly two dozen conventional canti / V brakes I've used. 
A third design flaw, IME, is the extra lip on the brake arm, forward of and 
at 90% to the brake pad mounting hole, which limits how close the pad can 
sit in the outboard direction. When trying to use this brake on bikes with 
slightly narrower canti stud placement (which are good, from the standpoint 
of minimizing pad dive), this extra lip creates rim clearance problems. 
But hey, you can get them in lots of colors, and they're US-made, and 
they're made by an independent small shop, and they're a way to show you 
care about your bike, which I do in plenty of other ways myself... And the 
vast majority of us will not use them to the limit anyway. 

I do like their brake levers, though! 

- Max 

On Saturday, October 14, 2023 at 4:12:22 PM UTC-4 wboe...@gmail.com wrote:

> Cost was a significant part of my argument, for sure.  Also, Zestes will 
> work with the normal spring anchors on most posts.  I am not a fan of 
> Paul's spring solution - it's tidy but I found it finicky to adjust (and 
> keep adjusted) on the one set of minimotos I owned.  That said, the Zeste 
> brakes are non-trivial to install.  Took me an hour to do the first but was 
> slightly quicker with the second set.
>
> Will
>
> On Saturday, October 14, 2023 at 4:06:41 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> And!!! Zests are half the price of Pauls!
>>
>> On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 2:05 PM Patrick Moore  wrote:
>>
>>> IME the problem with the Tektros wasn't the stopping power but the 
>>> sloppy pivots. They stopped about as well as the Pauls but they squealed 
>>> and juddered. The Pauls are machined much more precisely and don't squeal 
>>> at all or judder as much.
>>>
>>> On my bike, the Pauls are no worse than any other cantilever I've used 
>>> but their braking power is hardly beyond ordinary; the high end forged 
>>> single pivot on my gofast road fixed gear gives more retardation per amount 
>>> of hand squeeze than the Touring on the front of my errand road bike or the 
>>> Neo Retro in back. Ditto for any number of single pivots, dual pivots, 
>>> centerpulls, not to mention disks and V brakes.
>>>
>>> I wish I'd known about the Zests before I bought Pauls. Perhaps they 
>>> would have been more powerful.
>>>
>>> Still, the Pauls are beautifully made, so very easy to set up, and 
>>> perfectly functional, tho' I think they are more industrial looking that 
>>> elegant. Overall, taking all with all, I'm not unhappy.
>>>
>>> BUT! I will be very interested to hear others' comparison of the Zests 
>>> with Pauls; or of other cantilevers wtih Pauls.
>>>
>>> On Sat, Oct 14, 2023 at 12:21 PM Will Boericke  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 It's not surprising to me that Pauls would be better than the 720s.  I 
 know they (Tektro 720s) have a dedicated following; I can't understand 
 why.  In my experience, they were mediocre stoppers, replaced quickly by 
 Shimano CX70s and then by mini-Vs.  

 I just replaced some budget Shimano cantis on my commuter with Velo 
 Orange Zeste brakes and they're amazing.  For the $70 I paid, miraculous 
 even.  Hard to imagine that Pauls would be better.

 Will

 On Friday, October 13, 2023 at 5:03:24 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

> I swapped Tektro C 720s for Paul cantis, Touring in the rear, Neo 
> Retro in front, after I experienced severe squeal and judder in the front 
> with the Tektros. The bike in question is a 58 cm c-c built for 26"/559 
> mm 
> bsd wheels, so the steerer is hugely long.
>
> I got the Tektros to work sufficiently well by toeing them in at an 
> absurd angle, but the Pauls (using the same salmon pads) stop a wee bit 
> better, with normal toe in, and judder in front is reduced to a fugitive 
> whisper. And 

Re: [RBW] Craigslist, etc 2023

[Max S]

Indeed... Very very tempted... but not local. Note to others interested on 
sizing of these... a "60 cm" SO will fit closer to a "58 cm" QB, IME. 

- Another Max

On Wednesday, September 27, 2023 at 7:42:12 AM UTC-4 weste...@gmail.com 
wrote:

> The 60 cm SimpleOne in AZ  is being offered by the seller on Craigslist as 
> a frame/fork/bb/headset for $500 -- that is indeed a good deal. 
>
> Julian Westerhout
> Bloomington, IL 
>
> On Wednesday, September 27, 2023 at 1:15:15 AM UTC-5 maxcr wrote:
>
>> Great deal on a 60 SimpleOne in AZ:
>>
>> [image: 00c0c_iUm87mppNAd_0CI0t2_600x450.jpg]
>>
>> Rivendell - SimplOne frame 60cm - bicycle parts - by owner - bike sale - 
>> craigslist 
>> 
>> tucson.craigslist.org 
>> 
>>
>> 
>>  
>>
>> Tempted but too many bikes, too little time.
>>
>> Hope someone here gets it
>>
>> Max
>>
>> On Aug 27, 2023, at 9:21 PM, Matthew Williams  
>> wrote:
>>
>> 
>> CUSTOM
>> 60cm
>> 2500
>> Belmont, CA
>>
>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/pen/bik/d/belmont-rivendell-custom-beautiful-60cm/7658939306.html
>>
>>
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>> 
>> .
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Craigslist, etc 2023

[Max S]

Did anyone here buy that?.. Curious about some slight geo diffs. between 
the SO and the QB, like BB drop, setback, front-center... 

- Max "curious minds" in A2

On Wednesday, September 6, 2023 at 3:28:03 PM UTC-4 Michael Morrissey wrote:

> Does this belong to someone on the list here?
>
> Simpleone 
> 58cm Green
> Brooklyn, NY
>
> https://www.ebay.com/itm/186064411809?hash=item2b524d9ca1:g:6VcAAOSwOcBk9hv3
>
>
> On Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 3:04:49 PM UTC-4 chasenl...@gmail.com 
> wrote:
>
>> happy hump day to all
>>
>> self promoting my medium gus for pickup in nyc 
>>
>>
>> https://newyork.craigslist.org/brk/bik/d/brooklyn-rivendell-gus-boots-willsen/7660623554.html
>>
>> On Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 9:21:57 AM UTC-4 eric...@gmail.com 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> An unusual Homer! Double tube, darker blue than I'm used to seeing. Nice 
>>> build. Oddly the listing makes no mention of the 3x1 drivetrain.
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, August 30, 2023 at 9:16:12 AM UTC-4 Eric Marth wrote:
>>>
 Cheviot f/f/hs
 60cm
 Tulsa, Okay 
 Auction: https://www.ebay.com/itm/115901802895

 [image: s-l1600.jpg]

 On Tuesday, August 29, 2023 at 10:23:27 PM UTC-4 Danny wrote:

> Bike Recyclery has a NOS 60cm Yves Gomez for $1499.99
>
>
> https://bikerecyclery.com/nos-rivendell-yves-gomez-betty-foy-frameset-fork-hs-br-bb-60cm-700c-fenders-racks-heart-cutout-lugs-black-white-gold/
>
>
>
> On Tuesday, August 29, 2023 at 12:50:33 PM UTC-5 Matthew Williams 
> wrote:
>
>> A. Homer Hilsen (curved 2TT!)
>> 64cm
>> 3400
>> East Hampton, NY
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/404463031464
>>
>> [image: s-l1600.jpg]
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: A College Clem

[Max S]

When I was a kid, I had a Specialized Ascent (?) MTB stolen from an 
apartment complex parking "garage". I had bought that bike with my paper 
route & other kid job money, so it really hurt! In grad school, I also had 
an XT seatpost & Ti Flite saddle stolen from my MB2 parked in front of a 
campus building at 8 am in the morning. In the first case, the thief 
snipped through a simple cable. In the second case, the thief used the seat 
quick release. These experiences taught me to use better locks and to 
replace QRs with bolts. 

I've owned decent bikes in college and grad school, and I have worked on a 
college campus for nearly two decades, and have parked my bike on campus. 
When I did use my nice MTB in college, I'd take off the front wheel and 
lock it together with the frame and rear wheel to a post. When I ride my 
nice bike to campus now, I protect my Brooks saddle and Nitto post and Phil 
Wood wheels with some security bolts, and use a good lock. 

But I also don't park my bike outside overnight, and I don't ride around in 
the slush much, without cleaning the bike after the ride. 

So, I think a lot is going to depend on the kid and their particular living 
situation, degree of awareness, and the kinds of activities they get up to 
in college... What if they want to ride dirt roads and coffeeneur on 
Wednesday mornings with the local bikies, instead of partying late at night 
and going to football games? What if they want to ride down to the farmers 
market for fresh veggies instead of eating crappy pizza 7 days a week, or 
hit up the handmade ice cream shop downtown after a day of studying for 
finals?.. Wouldn't it be nice to have a good bike on hand that can carry 
some apples and books and have lights for the way back when it gets dark? 
These bikes are meant to be used and are designed well for that. 

- Max "if it ain't got disc brakes, not many thieves will want it" in A2

On Monday, August 7, 2023 at 11:18:19 AM UTC-4 rus...@gmail.com wrote:

> I'm currently building a bike for a good friend's son who is going off to 
> college. It's a mid-1990s Mercian. Its going to Boston. I'm having second 
> thoughts and thinking of just giving him the cash and telling him to buy a 
> decent enough beater off of the local Craigslist, and having a LBS replace 
> the chain and giving it a maintenance once over. Currently, I've installed 
> pit locks, replacing the skewers and seat post bolt. I've also install Ezy 
> MKS pedals that he can remove between classes and carry in his daypack. All 
> parts are used, low to mid range and do not match. The locks and chain will 
> be Kryptonite's New York lock standard. Heavy, yes, but probably the best 
> available. these locks will at least frustrate would be thieves. I'm hoping 
> that he'll be able to keep it in his dorm with him overnight. 
>
> Russell Duncan
> Saratoga, WY
>
> On Sunday, August 6, 2023 at 8:34:18 PM UTC-6 Ryan wrote:
>
>> One thing, Leah...and believe me ,no offense meant, but I know your 
>> penchant for pretty things If that bike goes to college, you might want 
>> to dial down the bling. Just sayin'. In this wicked world, it's stressful 
>> owning nice things. Your son SHOULD be able to ride his lovely Clem to 
>> college, but I would just hate to think of it being stolen  for both your 
>> sakes. Especially given the history of the bikeso I'm leaning into the 
>> nice but understated beater more and more...worked for me when I was still 
>> commuting before I retired. My beater was the old battle-scarred, but still 
>> elegant PX-10
>>
>> On Sunday, August 6, 2023 at 8:36:41 PM UTC-5 Roberta wrote:
>>
>>> This is really tough.  A lot has to do with where he is going and how 
>>> much he will be using the bike.  Someone above said to get the lay of the 
>>> land before deciding.  I kept my bike vertical in my dorm room, but it was 
>>> outside and locked up when I went to work or class; even a long bike like 
>>> his doesn't need to take up that much room (or keep it behind the bed).
>>> Johnny above said that the Clem L will be too long for bus racks.  I can 
>>> attest that my 55cm Platypus is too long for bus racks and Amtrak, if he 
>>> needs those transportation options.  From a purely logical perspective, get 
>>> a beater.
>>>
>>> However, I know you (and you'll have to ask your son).  How much joy is 
>>> he going to get riding a nice bike to class and thinking of his grandfather 
>>> when he does?  How much will he be heartbroken IF the bike disappears?  If 
>>> a lot of joy, get him Dynolights so you'll know he's able to be seen, 
>>> Hexlocks on the wheel set, saddle and seat post and two really good 
>>> U-locks.  Take the bags off the bike when parked.  Teach him good and bad 
>>> ways to lock up the bike. Show him what to look for (like unbolted bike 
>>> stands and cut thru lock-to bars). Get good pictures of it and register for 
>>> it on bike registry sites.  Hide an air tag.   Just make it harder to 
>>> 

[RBW] Phil Rivy hub axle OLD 130->126->120 respacing

[Max S]

Question for those who might know... 
I've got a Phil hubbed wheelset, the rear uses what I believe is a Rivy 
hub, freewheel version. I could be mis-remembering, but I believe the idea 
was to use flanges and spacing that basically make front and rear use the 
same length spokes. At any rate, the rear hub is spaced for 130 mm 
over-locknut dimension. I'm shoving it into a frame that uses a narrower 
spacing, say 126 (although 120 may be it). 
Can I get a different axle or axle end caps to accomplish this? 
TIA, 

- Max "obsolete by the time I get out of bed" in A2

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Re: [RBW] Re: Yves Gomez – mustardified

[Max S]

That's a lovely looking bike, Jason! 

- Max "irrational desire to bid on the Sam to have a matching his/hers 
pair" in A2 

On Tuesday, October 25, 2022 at 7:47:08 AM UTC-4 J Schwartz wrote:

> Hi Ryan, I think we may have been in touch when I was researching the 
> Imron Harvest Gold color.
>
> I'll make a new post to detail specifics since this thread isn't about the 
> sale of this frameset, 
> but to answer your question: I didn't intend to sell it but I'm trying to 
> reduce the amount of things I have.  I have an Appaloosa and a Romulus , so 
> the Sam sort of sits in between them.  As much as it's been with me for 13 
> years or so, I am resisting the pull of emotional attachment to an object. 
>
> If anyone is thinking about working with Jack at Franklin, I can strongly 
> recommend him.  But make sure you have patience as it will take months.
> thanks
> Jason
>
> On Monday, October 24, 2022 at 12:49:43 PM UTC-4 Ryan wrote:
>
>> Yup...in 2001 I had my Riv Road (Curt Goodrich-built) painted Imron 
>> Harvest Gold. Originally I thought of red and then decided on something 
>> different...from the autumn color palette - I love fall. This was before 
>> the color became so popular. I endured some ribbing about it being the 
>> same   color as poopy diapers, etc .,  but it turned out to be a great 
>> color which changes subtly depending on lighting(sunlight/cloud/indoors). 
>>
>> Your painter did a great job on that Sam. If you don't mind me asking, 
>> why are you selling it after putting all that work into it? Too small? 
>> Another bike? Excuse me for being nosy...or curious and 
>> apologies/condolences  in advance if it's a life event forcing the sale
>>
>> On Monday, October 24, 2022 at 7:37:27 AM UTC-5 J Schwartz wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Really nice looking Yves
>>> I had my Hillborne repaired and re-painted by Jack also...I believe it's 
>>> the same color.
>>> I requested Imron Harvest Goldwhich Riv used in the early days on 
>>> some their bike...maybe the long low and some customs.
>>> Looks very similar 
>>> Jack did an amazing job.  replacing my derailleur hanger and adding a 
>>> couple rack mounts.
>>> this is my 2009 Hillborne I purchased new from Riv when they came 
>>> out...the original green/gold.
>>> it's a 56.  I've had it for a long time.  But will likely be selling it 
>>> in the coming weeks.  Probably as a frameset
>>> [image: IMG_1385.jpg]
>>> [image: IMG_2341.jpg]
>>> JS
>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 10:10:26 AM UTC-4 Jim Whorton wrote:
>>>
>>>> Beautiful bike.
>>>>
>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 5:54:49 AM UTC-4 Garth wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Max, How did you go about conveying to Jack the color you chose ?  
>>>>> Jack told me the Dupont Nason paint he applies uses the same color chart 
>>>>> as 
>>>>> the former Imron, but those charts don't translate well into digital 
>>>>> images 
>>>>> online. The actual colors in person are very different than the digital 
>>>>> chart images. 
>>>>>
>>>>> Your yellow paint is surely more mustard than candy as it has a 
>>>>> certain earthy/organic/softness in it's undertone. 
>>>>>
>>>>> Three cheers for Jack ! I have a custom frame from him and another one 
>>>>> in the works, plus he did some repair and a repaint of my Bombadil. I'm 
>>>>> thinking of a yellow of some sort for my new frame also, something that 
>>>>> conveys the deep yellows in a sunflower and compliments both the silver 
>>>>> and 
>>>>> black of the parts and tires. 
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tuesday, October 4, 2022 at 1:39:27 AM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks, Leah. I like Lemondrop, though I do like my mustard! 
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thank you all for the compliments! It's for my one-and-only, so after 
>>>>>> (re)building up the bike, I only took a short test ride around the 
>>>>>> block. 
>>>>>> Everything stayed attached, nothing rattled, and the bike handled very 
>>>>>> nicely. Single-speed, low-ish gearing, smooth and quiet. I'm divided on 
>>>>>> the 
>>>>>> black-painted wheels, but am fresh out of anything silver and 135 mm 
>>>>>> spaced, so this will have to do for now. I guess it makes the frame 
>>>>

Re: [RBW] Re: Yves Gomez – mustardified

[Max S]

Thanks, Leah. I like Lemondrop, though I do like my mustard! 

Thank you all for the compliments! It's for my one-and-only, so after 
(re)building up the bike, I only took a short test ride around the block. 
Everything stayed attached, nothing rattled, and the bike handled very 
nicely. Single-speed, low-ish gearing, smooth and quiet. I'm divided on the 
black-painted wheels, but am fresh out of anything silver and 135 mm 
spaced, so this will have to do for now. I guess it makes the frame color 
pop more. 

Y'all the best! 

- Max "pop-pop" in A2


On Monday, October 3, 2022 at 4:36:41 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> I don’t think we can call this mustard. That’s not a pretty word and this 
> color is deserving of better. It’s Lemondrop.
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Oct 3, 2022, at 4:25 PM, Bill Lindsay  wrote:
>
> MEGA APPROVE!!
>
>
> BL in EC
>
> P.S. I'm sending you a direct message also...
>
> On Monday, October 3, 2022 at 9:47:03 AM UTC-7 Max S wrote:
>
>> This here bicycle arrived damaged in shipping, and off it went to Jack 
>> Trumbull at Franklin Frame in OH to get the "top" tube and a couple of 
>> other things repaired. The damage was extensive enough that the frame 
>> needed to be repainted, so we went after a Clem mustardish color. Props to 
>> Jack for great work. 
>>
>> - Max "who among us wasn't damaged in shipping?" in A2 
>>
>> [image: Yves Gomez mustard downtube.jpeg][image: Yves Gomez mustard 
>> driveside.jpeg][image: Yves Gomez mustard headtube.jpeg][image: Yves 
>> Gomez mustard seat lug.jpeg][image: Yves Gomez mustard seat tube.jpeg]
>>
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[RBW] Re: Yves Gomez – mustardified

[Max S]

George, 
yes, luckily the shipping was via BikeFlights, who were very good about 
reimbursement, all things considered. Note that reimbursement wasn't for 
the total insured amount, but for the amount of repair & repaint. I had to 
provide first detailed photos of the exterior of the box, the damage 
itself, and the inside of the box that showed there was packing material, 
etc. I also had to provide the quote for the repair / repaint, etc. 
-Max "procedure" in A2
On Monday, October 3, 2022 at 1:32:42 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:

> Were you compensated for the damage (presumably by the shipper)  well 
> enough to pay for the frame repair and re-paint?
> Looks great now, BTW.
>
>
> On Monday, October 3, 2022 at 11:47:03 AM UTC-5 Max S wrote:
>
>> This here bicycle arrived damaged in shipping, and off it went to Jack 
>> Trumbull at Franklin Frame in OH to get the "top" tube and a couple of 
>> other things repaired. The damage was extensive enough that the frame 
>> needed to be repainted, so we went after a Clem mustardish color. Props to 
>> Jack for great work. 
>>
>> - Max "who among us wasn't damaged in shipping?" in A2 
>>
>> [image: Yves Gomez mustard downtube.jpeg][image: Yves Gomez mustard 
>> driveside.jpeg][image: Yves Gomez mustard headtube.jpeg][image: Yves 
>> Gomez mustard seat lug.jpeg][image: Yves Gomez mustard seat tube.jpeg]
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: 57cm lugged Roadini Protovelo

[Max S]

What a beauty! 

- Max "if I weren't up to my ears in bikes with medium- / long-reach 
brakes..." in A2 

On Friday, September 23, 2022 at 1:23:37 PM UTC-4 amill...@gmail.com wrote:

> Accepting offers. Let’s get this go fast, lugged beauty to a happy owner. 
>
> Best,
>
> Aaron in El Paso 
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: choco-moose bar.

[Max S]

If anyone has another ChocoMoose, I'd be interested! 

- Max "bar junkie" in A2

On Saturday, August 27, 2022 at 12:54:35 AM UTC-4 Carl G wrote:

> Sold pending payment. 
>
> Thanks all.
>
> On Friday, August 26, 2022 at 7:51:36 PM UTC-7 Carl G wrote:
>
>> Hi all, 
>>
>> Doing some new-project fund-raising so I'll be selling some stuff I've 
>> been sitting on for a bit.
>>
>> I bought these bars from blue-lug a couple of years ago but used them 
>> only briefly on my Atlantis. These had once been wrapped with Newbaums, so 
>> they might have a bit of tape glue, but they've always been stored indoors 
>> and overall in very good shape.
>>
>> Due to the size of the box I expect shipping only is going to be $50+, so 
>> I'd like to get $150 shipped to continental US address, which should be a 
>> pretty decent discount from new. Prefer payment via Paypal.
>>
>>  Let me know if any additional info is needed
>>
>> Thanks!
>>
>> -- 
>> Carl
>>
>> [image: IMG_0579.jpg][image: IMG_0581.jpg]
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Max S]

As many / most of you know, carbon fiber composites have been in structural 
applications in aerospace and other fields for decades. That said, the 
frequency and thoroughness of regular inspections (and replacement) carried 
out in those applications is perhaps beyond what a typical cyclist is 
willing to do. But here's a couple of nice videos that demonstrate the 
durability of CF bike parts: 

Danny MacAskill Tests Santa Cruz Reserve Carbon Wheels: 
https://youtu.be/VfjjiHGuHoc 

Carbon vs Aluminum Frames - Which is Stronger? (you can skip to 1:40 mark 
for start of tests)
https://youtu.be/w5eMMf11uhM 

But there are also examples of frames and wheels failing... like this one: 
https://youtu.be/NVkWlsbnUZ8 

Aluminum fails too, but for different reasons:  
https://youtu.be/qKeeHDuoFq8 

- Max "horses for courses & ride what you brung" in A2 

On Wednesday, August 24, 2022 at 8:52:20 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Thanks, Max, a clear and informative response. I didn't realize one could 
> save so much time at sub 18 mph.
>
> I've only dented 1 rim that I remember, back in about 1971 or 1972 when I 
> bashed a steel 27" rim by failing to dodge a pothole at the bottom of a 
> fast hill on the way to school, but it is good to know that CF rims can 
> outlast and outwear aluminum ones and at lighter weights; the Velocity 
> Blunt SS wheels on my (disc brake) dirt road bike are very light, but I've 
> thought of replacing them with an even lighter CF-rim pair (but thin crust 
> and not deep dish!) some day, especially since I could use the Blunts for a 
> wheelset for a long-wished-for Monocog replacement.
>
> As to weight, I've had a few heavy bikes that just felt easier to pedal in 
> given gears in given conditions; a mark of these was that I naturally 
> tended to ride at cruising speed on flats 1 cog smaller / 5 gear inches 
> bigger. But I never took any measurements.
>
> To respond to Andy's remarks, I myself tend to gauge "speed" by feel, 
> first by ease of pedaling as described, and distant second, smoothness of 
> tires (I qualify "smooth" by "tires" because I've had at least 1 noodle 
> frame that felt very plush but not particularly fast; not particularly 
> slow, but not especially fast -- ancient long wheelbase Raleigh Technium). 
> But I have never, ever thought a bike faster because of it felt rode rough 
> or buzzy. 
>
> So indeed, my criteria are largely sensory. But I'd still not baulk at 
> lighter and stronger rims.
>
> On Mon, Aug 15, 2022 at 10:10 PM Max S  wrote:
>
>> Patrick, 
>>
>> This is a deeply and widely explored topic. There are some numbers and 
>> graphs to look at here:  https://www.wheelscience.com/pages/aero-v-weight
>>  
>> In my personal experience, deep rims can save me ~10-20 watts, depending 
>> on how fast and where I ride. So, it can get me from 16.5 to 17.0 mph or to 
>> 17.5 mph average over a 50 mile ride on our local gravel roads, for 
>> example. 
>> If those rims are carbon, that nets a 1.3-1.5 kg wheelset that is both 
>> aerodynamic AND sturdy. If I try to hit that weight mark with aluminum 
>> rims, I get a less aerodynamic and a flimsier wheelset. 
>> Speaking for myself, the upshot of running deep dish carbon wheels is 
>> that they let me give up an hour of sleep the night before to keep up with 
>> my riding pal... But if you're riding by yourself, and your sleep hygiene 
>> is good, and you're eating right, and you're not checking the local 
>> rankings on various "segments" on Strava, it doesn't make much difference. 
>> Well, no, let me take that back. What I've discovered of late in riding 
>> gravel roads is that half of my aluminum rims have developed dents, whereas 
>> the carbon wheels have not. I'm not a particularly heavy rider and I like 
>> to think I'm a careful rider. But running the same size tires on carbon 
>> wheels seems to not result in the same number of dents. Now this will 
>> probably at some point turn into a chipped / delaminated section on that 
>> carbon rim, but for now, they seem to suffer fewer of those dents. 
>> Carbon frames and forks do save a significant amount of weight – expect 
>> about 2-3 lbs saved over a similarly sized steel frame & fork, especially 
>> from Rivendell. The weight is felt on the hills – about 10 seconds per mile 
>> of climbing at 4-5% gradients, in my experience, but I could be 
>> mis-remembering. It's easy to stick two extra 2-liter soda bottles in your 
>> saddlebag and test the effect quantitatively and qualitatively for yourself.
>> If the above makes me sound like a carbon apologist, I'll say that all my 
>> bikes have steel frames and fo

Re: [RBW] Re: Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Max S]

Patrick, 

This is a deeply and widely explored topic. There are some numbers and 
graphs to look at here:  https://www.wheelscience.com/pages/aero-v-weight 
In my personal experience, deep rims can save me ~10-20 watts, depending on 
how fast and where I ride. So, it can get me from 16.5 to 17.0 mph or to 
17.5 mph average over a 50 mile ride on our local gravel roads, for 
example. 
If those rims are carbon, that nets a 1.3-1.5 kg wheelset that is both 
aerodynamic AND sturdy. If I try to hit that weight mark with aluminum 
rims, I get a less aerodynamic and a flimsier wheelset. 
Speaking for myself, the upshot of running deep dish carbon wheels is that 
they let me give up an hour of sleep the night before to keep up with my 
riding pal... But if you're riding by yourself, and your sleep hygiene is 
good, and you're eating right, and you're not checking the local rankings 
on various "segments" on Strava, it doesn't make much difference. 
Well, no, let me take that back. What I've discovered of late in riding 
gravel roads is that half of my aluminum rims have developed dents, whereas 
the carbon wheels have not. I'm not a particularly heavy rider and I like 
to think I'm a careful rider. But running the same size tires on carbon 
wheels seems to not result in the same number of dents. Now this will 
probably at some point turn into a chipped / delaminated section on that 
carbon rim, but for now, they seem to suffer fewer of those dents. 
Carbon frames and forks do save a significant amount of weight – expect 
about 2-3 lbs saved over a similarly sized steel frame & fork, especially 
from Rivendell. The weight is felt on the hills – about 10 seconds per mile 
of climbing at 4-5% gradients, in my experience, but I could be 
mis-remembering. It's easy to stick two extra 2-liter soda bottles in your 
saddlebag and test the effect quantitatively and qualitatively for yourself.
If the above makes me sound like a carbon apologist, I'll say that all my 
bikes have steel frames and forks, and most have aluminum rims. I just 
prefer those for now, for a variety of reasons. But sometimes I do ride 
carbon wheels and enjoy the looks and the very very slight speed benefits, 
and noticeable durability benefits for some aspects of my riding. 

- Max "who should be working on getting more sleep rather than re-gluing 
his tires" in A2
On Monday, August 15, 2022 at 12:30:36 PM UTC-4 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Pretty Sotherland, and that's one of the most interesting head badges I've 
> seen. The motto in full is "Sans peur et sans reproche" -- "Without fear 
> and without blame" or generally, "Beyond fear and reproach," the motto of 
> the ideal knight of chivalry.
>
> I'm just asking this (of the group) and not reproaching: Do carbon fork 
> and aero carbon fiber wheels make that much of a difference over a good 
> steel fork and say lightweight tubulars or RH extralight clinchers at less 
> than race speeds? 
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 12, 2022 at 2:03 PM Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! <
> jonasa...@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Today was a women’s ride. 29 miles at over 16 mph, and it was great. Such 
>> a nice group of women. Many of them ride TO the ride, and then ride home 
>> again. I come from the opposite end of the city, so I am always stuck 
>> driving. Anyway, I have some photos but first let’s take a minute to 
>> appreciate this lugged, steel bike that belongs to my ride leader. You’ll 
>> see her decals say “Sotherland.” That does happen to be her name, yes, but 
>> it is also the builder’s name. John Sotherland used to build the Rivendell 
>> frames in the Waterford days; he has since opened his own shop. John is a 
>> brother-in-law to my ride leader, and he made her this beautiful pink and 
>> white fade bike in 1988. This is the original paint job. I did not have 
>> time to ask about the fork, but aren’t her chainstays interesting? We were 
>> pulled over on a highway waiting for a rider to fix her flat, so I 
>> hurriedly took these few shots. 
>>
>> Save this one bike, all the rest were carbon.
>> Leah
>>
>
> [image: image.png]
>  
>

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[RBW] Re: Biking from Foster City to?..

[Max S]

Thanks, Al, Leslie, Zac. I've noodled around on Strava to map out a route 
to Water Dog via Ralston, returning on 3rd / Bay Trail. Also mapped 
something similar to La Honda. I'll give it a try one of these mornings 
(which seem to be getting eaten up by Zoom calls with people on East Coast 
time - ugh!). 

Open to other ideas and perhaps meeting up for a ride somewhere. 

- Max "when all-road isn't all road" in FC/BA for a week

On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 1:18:25 PM UTC-4 Al in SF wrote:

> Hi Max,
>
> I don't live on the peninsula, but what I understand is that there's only 
> four ways to get off Foster City:
>   - 3rd Ave
>   - Fashion Island Blvd
>   - Hillsdale Ave
>   - Beach Park Blvd
>
> And of those, only 3rd and Beach Park (via O'Neill Crossing near Ralston) 
> have any affordances for bikes. You can bike down Hillsdale, but you have 
> to adopt the John Forrester mindset: take the lane and ride at 20+mph to 
> stay safe.
>
> That out of the way, all the good stuff is towards the west. If you need 
> to traverse north-south, Alameda de las Pulgas is the best option. The Bay 
> Trail is better developed these days, but it still reminds you that bikes 
> are second class citizens as you cut through office park after office park 
> and wait at traffic lights.
>
> Hope this helps and welcome back!
> Al in SF
>
> On Tuesday, August 9, 2022 at 5:34:07 AM UTC-7 zac.te...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I'm not a ton of help with the longer rides but if you've got a bike 
>> capable of some fire road this is a fun one to start. Not sure if you've 
>> noodled around in waterdog but you can go up ralston, make the first left 
>> after the safeway and that gets you to the trailhead, climb to the top of 
>> waterdog and exit the top parking lot, cross the street and to the right of 
>> a little water district building is another trail, go up that, then cross 
>> the street once you get to the top again, that'll take you down to canada 
>> rd and you can go left from there to woodside and head up kings or go right 
>> and cruise around crystal springs. pretty nice way to get to canada and 
>> avoid a ton of traffic. 
>>
>> [image: Screen Shot 2022-08-09 at 5.28.35 AM.png]
>>
>> On Monday, August 8, 2022 at 10:04:33 PM UTC-7 Max S wrote:
>>
>>> Bay Area Rivsters, 
>>>
>>> This week I'm visiting some folks in Foster City, CA and will have an 
>>> all-road bike at my disposal there. I'll also be visiting people in 
>>> Cupertino and will have another all-road bike available there. Yay! 
>>>
>>> Now, I used to live in the Bay Area like 25 years ago, biked around in 
>>> some places, but a lot has changed since then... I'm looking to try biking 
>>> out to some places mentioned in Ray Hosler's "Bay Area Bike Rides" book 
>>> (e.g., Old La Honda Rd, Tunitas Creek Rd, etc.), up to say ~50 miles at a 
>>> time, preferably starting by bike from Foster City itself. There's the Bay 
>>> Trail 
>>> <https://mtc.ca.gov/operations/regional-trails-parks/san-francisco-bay-trail/bay-trail-navigational-map>,
>>>  
>>> but it seems to cut out in a few crucial spots, where one might want to 
>>> bridge to the more scenic roads, forcing to ride a lot of trafficky 
>>> streets. Do I pretty much need to take CalTrain somewhere first or bum a 
>>> ride? What other routes might folks suggest? (I should perhaps look on 
>>> Strava, but not sure I should blindly trust the heatmaps and "routes" to be 
>>> relatively light on car traffic.) 
>>>
>>> Also, if anyone lives around here and wants to do an early morning ride, 
>>> LMK. 
>>>
>>> Thx in advance for any pointers, 
>>> - Max "somewhat peripatetic" in Bay Area
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Biking from Foster City to?..

[Max S]

Bay Area Rivsters, 

This week I'm visiting some folks in Foster City, CA and will have an 
all-road bike at my disposal there. I'll also be visiting people in 
Cupertino and will have another all-road bike available there. Yay! 

Now, I used to live in the Bay Area like 25 years ago, biked around in some 
places, but a lot has changed since then... I'm looking to try biking out 
to some places mentioned in Ray Hosler's "Bay Area Bike Rides" book (e.g., 
Old La Honda Rd, Tunitas Creek Rd, etc.), up to say ~50 miles at a time, 
preferably starting by bike from Foster City itself. There's the Bay Trail 
,
 
but it seems to cut out in a few crucial spots, where one might want to 
bridge to the more scenic roads, forcing to ride a lot of trafficky 
streets. Do I pretty much need to take CalTrain somewhere first or bum a 
ride? What other routes might folks suggest? (I should perhaps look on 
Strava, but not sure I should blindly trust the heatmaps and "routes" to be 
relatively light on car traffic.) 

Also, if anyone lives around here and wants to do an early morning ride, 
LMK. 

Thx in advance for any pointers, 
- Max "somewhat peripatetic" in Bay Area

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[RBW] Re: High bars at a club ride

[Max S]

I think that's just part of the design intent for the bike, and the reason 
the drop bar is such a persistent design element. I think that on a 
properly set-up road bike, I should have at least 3 positions: 1) Chillin', 
2) Groovin', and 3) Jammin' – tops, hoods, and drops, respectively. When 
I'm "Chillin'", I want to be comfortable, and my position may not be all 
that different than when I'm riding my commuter bike with swept-back bars. 

- Max "gotta work on my flexibility as I age" in A2

On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 5:14:52 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> What the dropbar riders would tell you is they have the option of that 
> higher position plus a lower one. Which is fair if you're going to use it, 
> but in all my years of riding drops I hardly ever did. Gimme my Billies! 
>
> Joe "upright and catching wind as the Good Lord intended" Bernard
>
> On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 4:29:03 AM UTC-7 Marc Irwin wrote:
>
>> It was a normal Monday night ride with the Kalamazoo Bicycle Club.  A 
>> typical group was riding 15-16 MPH for 25 or so miles.  A good bunch of 
>> people in biking regalia on their over the counter crotch rockets with drop 
>> bars, except for me and Leah Peterson on our Rivendells. with upright 
>> bars.In the lousy cell phone shot I took from the back of the group, 
>> Leah is the second white helmet from from the front left.  Notice her 
>> posture compared to the body position of all the riders on their drop bars.
>> [image: high bars.jpg]
>> It was that way the whole ride. Most club riders assume their drop bars 
>> make them faster, after all, EVERYBODY uses them right?  
>>
>> Marc
>>
>

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Re: [RBW] Homer 6 months review and questions

[Max S]

Well, I made the mistake of purchasing a fish scale and weighing my bikes 
recently... The lightest I had was ~20 lbs, fixed gear at that, and there I 
was thinking it was crazy light. But they are all ~ 59 cm frames and 
threaded steerer forks with tall stems, fattish tires, and no krazy karbon 
bits (even the pair of carbon wheels I have are super deep and weigh ~1,500 
g). Guess what – my fastest times up some local "climbs" are on the 
lightest of my bikes, especially when I am running the aero wheels. No 
surprises there. The nicest "feeling" bike is my fixed gear – until the 
week that a dirt road gets re-graded, and then the skinny 30 mm tires make 
it a bit too... under-bikey. An

Anyhow, I think it's fun to consider what weight savings can be obtained. 
People have almost always made the mistake of conflating safety with weight 
or comfort with weight or reliability with weight. If you read Henry Ford's 
biography, he talks about this quite a bit, and one of the greatest things 
he accomplished for breaking that conventional trade-off was to use 
lighter, yet stronger steel alloys. The cars got lighter, they became more 
reliable, less expensive to operate, etc. Much the same thing happened when 
people started drawing lightweight steel tubes for bicycles – using 
heavier-walled gas pipe does nothing to help your bike be more enjoyable, 
comfortable, or reliable. Same with pneumatic tires – lighter weight, more 
comfort than solid rubber tires. 

So, let's consider the extra weight carried by some of the "comfort / 
utility" driven components and decide if it's worth it... Some ballpark 
numbers, give or take: 

Kickstand – 0.5 lb to take it off – I rarely find kickstands increasing my 
enjoyment of cycling. 
Tires – 0.3 lbs for lighter (35 mm) tires – lightweight tires *can* be more 
comfortable and faster rolling!
Dyno – 0.6 lb to switch to regular front hub – hey, 3-10 watt savings in 
drag right there! 
Lights – 0.5 lb to switch to battery powered LEDs – same brightness, less 
weight, less bulk, occasional charging, why not? 
Bars – 0.5 lb to switch to lighter (e.g., straight bar) – some people find 
non-sweepy bars more comfortable, believe it or not! 
Saddle – 1 lb to switch to modern plastic / carbon saddle – some modern 
saddles are remarkably good! 
Seatpost – 0.25 lb for lighter options – as long as it doesn't brake and 
puts your saddle in the right position... 
Cranks – 0.5-1 lb to switch to lighter crank & bb (e.g., SRAM Red) – it 
just works. 
Cassette & Derailleur – 0.5-1 lb differential for some combos – lighter 
bike, now you can pedal bigger gears for those hills! 
Everything else on a "diet" (brakes, headset, bell, skewers, levers, 
shifters, etc.) can be futzed with to get another pound. 

So, I think you can get things lighter weight, down to about 24 lbs, with 
those substitutions, and it wouldn't even cost you any net extra, if you 
sell the items you substitute – may even come out cash positive. William 
Lindsey has a thread about making his Legolas sub-20 lbs with conventional 
components. The only real difference from his build and what the above 
substitutions would produce is that the Legolas frame & fork & stem combo 
would shave ~2-3 lbs more of yours. 

But just having lighter and skinnier tires will make it feel a lot 
sprightlier. 

- Max "going fast is also fun!" in A2

On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 6:41:38 PM UTC-4 Roberta wrote:

> Jason,
>
> I often wonder how much of my lightening up project (I only did what was 
> practical) that brought me so much more joy in riding was that I got better 
> rims and tires, so the bike just rode better.  Many people in my original 
> thread pointed that out.  I'm still glad I did the full project, but none 
> of us here are weight weenies--we ride Rivs, happily, after all.  
>
> Roberta
>
> On Tuesday, July 26, 2022 at 5:49:06 PM UTC-4 Jason Fuller wrote:
>
>> Very nice!  I had the same thing happen with the Nitto parts bin :) 
>>
>> Weight plays a surprisingly small part of the experience of riding a 
>> lighter bike. Most of the benefit of the lighter tubing is how it performs 
>> due to the thinner wall thickness (resulting in a "snappy" feel from light 
>> flexing), and the geometry differences between the two. The few ounces 
>> saved in the process are quite secondary. 
>>
>> That said, the same logic tends to apply to other parts - even though the 
>> mass difference might not do a lot by itself, it can result in a quicker 
>> action (ie a derailleur with less inertia to its moving parts) or better 
>> feel (ie less rotating mass in your wheels, reducing the gyroscopic effects 
>> fighting your steering input) 
>>
>> On Tuesday, 26 July 2022 at 04:45:30 UTC-7 Steve Cole wrote:
>>
>>> Deepak,
>>> What a wonderful ride.  I have both a Homer (Toyo) and an Atlantis 
>>> (MIT).  I love them both.  First, I wonder whether the under-25 pounds 
>>> figures you have seen are for Toyo (1st gen) or Waterford (2nd gen) Homers. 

Re: [RBW] Southwest Michigan Rivendell Ride ✅

[Max S]

Pretty sure there's a photo somewhere that's proof... Oh, right here: 
[image: scorchern0825-1-72dpi.jpg]

(https://www.ibiscycles.com/our-story/history/11-the-scorcher-will-teach-you) 

- Max "just do it (already)!" in A2

On Monday, July 18, 2022 at 2:58:30 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> Hehe, knowing Leah she probably put it in the hardest gear and went like 
> blazes, with one minor downshift for the big hill at the end. I pity you 
> fellows trying to keep up with her! 
>
> On Monday, July 18, 2022 at 9:16:40 AM UTC-7 Marc Irwin wrote:
>
>> Solidarity?!?!  She doesn't shift.  That's it.
>>
>> Marc
>>
>>
>> On Sunday, July 17, 2022 at 2:32:41 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:
>>
>>> Ok so if I'm following this correctly you stayed in one gear in 
>>> singlespeed solidarity with Ben for most of the ride..and he was shifting! 
>>> I love this story! 
>>>
>>> On Sunday, July 17, 2022 at 10:37:44 AM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Wesley, I’m laughing out loud. I never looked at the drivetrain until I 
>>>> read your comment! At the start of the ride Ben was talking about his 
>>>> single speed. He rides single speed. Loves singlespeed. So, Ben has a 
>>>> singlespeed. I’m taking his word for it. I don’t look at drivetrains. But 
>>>> having been humbled here, I sure will in the future. At least before I 
>>>> wrote about them!
>>>> Leah
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 17, 2022, at 1:05 PM, Wesley  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I love all of this, and must admit being confused by Ben's custom 
>>>> being called a single-speed.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -W
>>>> On Sunday, July 17, 2022 at 7:01:30 AM UTC-7 Max S wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> [image: Leah saddlesack.jpeg][image: Platypus downtube.jpeg]
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sunday, July 17, 2022 at 10:00:57 AM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> [image: Rainbows and unicorns.jpeg][image: The bike life.jpeg][image: 
>>>>>> Rivvy Rally SW MI Jul 2022.jpeg][image: VO Adjustable Double 
>>>>>> Kickstand.jpeg]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sunday, July 17, 2022 at 10:00:27 AM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Great fun, that was! 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A few more photodetails and a plug for Josh's bike biz – get in 
>>>>>>> touch if you want your nice steel bike electrified properly and nicely. 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Max "those last 3 miles were definitely uphill!" in A2 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [image: Josh Planetary Gear.jpeg][image: Copenhagenize.jpeg][image: 
>>>>>>> Get some light in here.jpeg][image: The Rivendell Pirate.jpeg]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> -- 
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>>>> .
>>>>
>>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell Ride in SW Michigan

[Max S]

Still hoping to make it. Count me in with 85% probability, pending some 
work deadlines and timely arrival of replacement headset to be installed on 
the Rivendell Quickbeam that is to be ridden in said event. 

- Max "expectation value" in A2

On Sunday, July 10, 2022 at 12:42:35 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Hello, Friends. One week until our SW Michigan Riv Ride! I’d like to get a 
> headcount so we can reserve tables at the brewery, so please respond here 
> and let Marc and I know if you will be joining us. Please reply here or PM 
> me if you’d like to come. And tell us what Riv you’ll be planning to ride! 
>
> Once again, the details:
>
> Date: July 16. If we get stormed/rained out, we will reschedule for July 
> 30.
>
> Time: 10 am Eastern time
>
> Where: KalHaven Trailhead 4143 10th St. N Kalamazoo, MI 49009
>
> Distance: 35 mi, total. 
>
> The KalHaven Trail is a historic rail trail that travels through a wooded 
> area all the way to Lake Michigan. We will be riding from Kalamazoo to the 
> halfway point, which is Bloomingdale. There we will refresh ourselves in 
> the town’s quaint little park; you can bring refreshments or buy them at 
> the little country store across from the park. From there we will head back 
> to Kalamazoo and rendezvous at Latitude 42, a local brewery that has a 
> patio so we can eye the bikes and enjoy a meal. 
>
> The address for Latitude 42 is: 
> 6101 W Main St 
> Kalamazoo, MI 49009 
>
> Hope to see you there! Message here with questions.
> Leah and Marc
>
> On Friday, July 8, 2022 at 6:58:18 PM UTC-5 Marc Irwin wrote:
>
>> I was just on the Kal-Haven Thursday and it was in great shape.   38's 
>> are no problem at all, people ride it on 28-32's all the time.
>>
>> Marc
>>
>> On Thursday, July 7, 2022 at 10:24:10 AM UTC-4 Tom Palmer wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks Robert! Nothing like up to the minute intel.
>>> Tom Palmer
>>> Twin Lake, MI 
>>>
>>> On Thursday, July 7, 2022 at 7:12:06 AM UTC-4 Robert Blunt wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello all,
>>>> I just road the Kal-Haven trail on a non-Riv bike which has 700c X 38s 
>>>> and is was just fine. The surface is very nice all the way through to 
>>>> South 
>>>> Haven.
>>>> Best,
>>>> Robert Blunt
>>>> Pennington, NJ
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, Jul 6, 2022 at 2:07 PM Tom Palmer  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Leah and Marc,
>>>>> Thanks for organizing this, I am looking forward to it.
>>>>> What size tires are needed for this trail? My skinnies are 38mm and 
>>>>> normal dirt road in sandy West Michigan are 48mm.
>>>>> Make it a great day,
>>>>> Tom
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tuesday, June 21, 2022 at 10:03:36 AM UTC-4 Marc Irwin wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Don't forget we are in the eastern time zone.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Marc
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tuesday, June 21, 2022 at 9:54:51 AM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Alright, will have to put it on the calendar!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> - Max "drive 3-4 hours to bike 2-3 hours - that's a pretty decent 
>>>>>>> espresso-like ratio" in A2 
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Monday, June 20, 2022 at 3:07:59 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>>>>>>> Ding! wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> [image: image0.jpeg]
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Rivendell Ride on the KalHaven Trail! 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Brought to you by: the Lone Wolf and the Platypus Rider, in 
>>>>>>>> Kalamazoo, Michigan.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Date: July 16. If we get stormed/rained out, we will reschedule for 
>>>>>>>> July 30.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Time: 10 am 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Where: KalHaven Trailhead 4143 10th St. N Kalamazoo, MI 49009 
>>>>>>>> <https://www.google.com/maps/search/4143+10th+St.+N+Kalamazoo,+MI+49009?entry=gmail=g>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Distance: 35 mi, total. 
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> The KalHaven Trail is a historic rail trail that travels through a 
>>>>>>>> wooded area all the way to Lake Michigan. We will be ri

[RBW] Re: Paint codes for Lime-Olive, Mustard Clem, XO-1 burnt orange?

[Max S]

Thanks, everyone. Will try to figure out the "(sub)lime olive" code, but 
failing that may go for Pantone 132 C or a darker burnt orange... 

- Max "we've really narrowed it down to a dozen now!" in A2

On Saturday, July 2, 2022 at 1:03:17 PM UTC-4 Ray Varella wrote:

> Max,
> There are a few current model cars on the road with paint very close to 
> the lime olive, or “sublime olive” as I like to call it. 
> I was behind a Hyundai Venue the other day with a really nice green and 
> there are a couple other brands with similar shades. 
>
> I recall reading something from Rivendell that said paint codes from 
> Taiwan did not match paint codes in the U.S. and exact matches might not be 
> possible. 
>
> Getting the paint code from a car model is pretty straight forward. 
>
> Good luck 
>
> Ray 
>
> On Thursday, June 30, 2022 at 7:52:16 AM UTC-7 Carl wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>> The mustard paint on Clems and Appas is Pantone 132 C.
>>
>> On Thursday, June 30, 2022 at 8:45:31 AM UTC-4 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>>
>>> I could be wrong but I thought Riv was infamous for *not *having paint 
>>> codes or touch up paint. 
>>>
>>> And I remember reading somewhere that Grant had tried to revive the old 
>>> orange of the XO-1 but was not successful. I also seem to remember that he 
>>> said it was the best orange he'd ever seen. 
>>>
>>> I'd wager that the orange of early Hillbornes and the current orange on 
>>> Appaloosas & Roadinis is an attempt to have something close on Rivendell 
>>> frames.
>>>
>>> A paint that's close to the Clem (and Appaloosa) mustard is Devin's 
>>> glorious Rat Trap Pass frame (as seen on iBob here 
>>> <https://groups.google.com/g/internet-bob/c/HBEerIp5mO0/m/_fZfWVAwAQAJ>).  
>>> It's painted in RAL 1027, "curry." 
>>>
>>> Best of luck with your project. 
>>>
>>> [image: 3B2F6F39-F34A-4A1F-ABE8-EC1D29918C87.jpg]
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, June 29, 2022 at 10:28:57 AM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>>>
>>>> Folks, 
>>>>
>>>> I will be sending a Riv mixte frame to be repainted and am hoping to do 
>>>> it in a lime-olive color-way, as the kids say, of the Platypus. Failing 
>>>> that, we'd go for a slightly darker version of the Mustard in early Clems, 
>>>> or a burnt pumpkin orange of the XO-1. 
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone know if there's a RAL paintcode for that that I could 
>>>> supply to the painter? 
>>>>
>>>> - Max "who among us was never damaged in shipping" in A2
>>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Paint codes for Lime-Olive, Mustard Clem, XO-1 burnt orange?

[Max S]

Folks, 

I will be sending a Riv mixte frame to be repainted and am hoping to do it 
in a lime-olive color-way, as the kids say, of the Platypus. Failing that, 
we'd go for a slightly darker version of the Mustard in early Clems, or a 
burnt pumpkin orange of the XO-1. 

Does anyone know if there's a RAL paintcode for that that I could supply to 
the painter? 

- Max "who among us was never damaged in shipping" in A2

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Re: [RBW] Clem L Paint Crisis

[Max S]

Something similar just happened here, too. In my case, I'm the buyer; the 
frame was damaged enough - deep gouge in the top tube that resulted from 
something hard smacking and dragging / digging into it - that even if I 
just paint over it with nail polish, you'll see the huge dent. 

I don't know whether I'll get reimbursed by the shipping company (due to 
obvious damage to the box, which I documented in my damage claim) or by the 
seller (a facilitator who did the packing, who seems to have done a decent 
job on their end). But this bike was intended as a gift, so I'm proceeding 
with having the frame repaired and potentially repainted entirely anyway. 
It hurts financially, but I'm hoping that the years of enjoyment to follow 
will make up for it. 

- Max "dented and flawed, but hopefully not permanently damaged" in A2
On Thursday, June 23, 2022 at 2:41:43 PM UTC-4 Ian A wrote:

> +1 Matthew's advice is extremely rational. It is becoming increasingly 
> more difficult to find exact models of any bike nowadays and with a 
> skillful repair, the bike is literally as good as new, albeit with a marred 
> decal. I would say,I don't have Matthew's touch up skill and might choose 
> to go the professional touch up route, as I would somehow make it worse.
>
> IanA Alberta Canada
>
> On Thursday, June 23, 2022 at 11:56:39 AM UTC-6 Matthew Williams wrote:
>
>> Hi Kiley,
>>
>> Ouch, that hurts! The first paint chip or scratch is always the worst, 
>> especially if it’s not from a ride and you didn’t cause it.
>>
>> Over the years, my bike has suffered a lot of chips and scratches. When I 
>> first got my bike I too was upset about the damage, but I made peace with 
>> it by remembering I’m fighting entropy. Also, the chips and scratches show 
>> my bike is ridden often, and they're attached to memories of rides past: 
>> the scratch on my seat from when I leaned my bike against a barbed-wire 
>> fence, the rock chip from a railroad track, the polished paint from my 
>> jeans against the frame. The chips and scratches and scuffs are part of 
>> what make the bike mine.
>>
>> I would look for a compromise; ask for some sort of shipping refund but I 
>> would not return the frame, especially if it’s one for which you’ve been 
>> searching. I would then patch the damage with model paint, and think of the 
>> scratch as part of the bike’s history, like a scar in a well-worn leather 
>> jacket. Whenever you see your bike amongst others, you’ll always know there 
>> are many like it--but that one is yours.
>>
>> Here’s how I used to fix paint chips:
>>
>> https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/JfGHDodtmZc/m/T85s2YKWAgAJ
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jun 22, 2022, at 7:19 AM, Kiley Demond  wrote:
>>
>> As some of you know, I have been looking for an early-model 59cm Clem L, 
>> preferably orange with blue the runner-up. I preferred frame-only because I 
>> knew that I would probably replace 80% of the components. For some reason, 
>> I took the wheels too. The frame was pristine but in shipping, the wheels 
>> were lashed to the frame with a tie-wrap, the hub protector popped off, and 
>> the hub proceeded to gouge the frame for several days in transit.
>>
>> I bought this for myself for my 64th birthday and I am bitterly 
>> disappointed. I can return the frame and start my search over, or I can 
>> propose remediation. What will it take to fix this? I can live with a 
>> little bit of marking but it obviously needs to be repaired to seal the 
>> frame and reduce the cosmetic sting. I can contact Riv about touch-up 
>> paint, but the frame is from 2016, so
>>
>> Thank you in advance for your thoughts.
>>
>> -Kiley
>>
>> 
>>
>> -- 
>>
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>> 
>>
>>
>>

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Re: [RBW] Searching for bike akin to Quickbeam

[Max S]

Mark, that's very generous of you. If none of our Riv brethren here go 
after it, I may have to. I previously had a 62 SO in dark green that was a 
tad too big, but surprisingly not that much bigger than my 58 cm QB, so the 
60 cm SO may be the Goldilocks. Hmm 

- Max "optimize optimize optimize" in A2

On Monday, June 20, 2022 at 9:10:39 AM UTC-4 esoter...@gmail.com wrote:

>
> There's a 60cm SimpleOne frame on eBay right now located in Durham, NC. 
> For some reason the seller is not interested in shipping so it's local 
> pickup only. I'm in Raleigh and could help facilitate a pickup if you're 
> interested in it. Cheers,
>
> ~Mark
> Raleigh, NC
>
> On Jun 12, 2022, at 09:46, James  wrote:
>
> I have wanted a quick beam for a while now but the cost of a 3rd 
> rivendell is holding me back, so I'm looking for a similar frame.  Anyone 
> have any suggestions on a steel, lugged, horizontal dropout (front or rear 
> facing), fairly large wheel diameter bike?  One I could get for $500 max?? 
>  I have my eyes on a Schinn LeTour III and the only thing causing me pause 
> is tire clearance (35mm) .  Thanks for any suggestions.  (I have a 92cm PBH 
> for anyone between NC and RI) 
>
> -- 
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Rivendell Ride in SW Michigan

[Max S]

Alright, will have to put it on the calendar!

- Max "drive 3-4 hours to bike 2-3 hours - that's a pretty decent 
espresso-like ratio" in A2 

On Monday, June 20, 2022 at 3:07:59 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! wrote:

> [image: image0.jpeg]
>
> Rivendell Ride on the KalHaven Trail! 
>
> Brought to you by: the Lone Wolf and the Platypus Rider, in Kalamazoo, 
> Michigan.
>
> Date: July 16. If we get stormed/rained out, we will reschedule for July 
> 30.
>
> Time: 10 am 
>
> Where: KalHaven Trailhead 4143 10th St. N Kalamazoo, MI 49009
>
> Distance: 35 mi, total. 
>
> The KalHaven Trail is a historic rail trail that travels through a wooded 
> area all the way to Lake Michigan. We will be riding from Kalamazoo to the 
> halfway point, which is Bloomingdale. There we will refresh ourselves in 
> the town’s quaint little park; you can bring refreshments or buy them at 
> the little country store across from the park. From there we will head back 
> to Kalamazoo and rendezvous at Latitude 42, a local brewery that has a 
> patio so we can eye the bikes and enjoy a meal. 
>
> The address for Latitude 42 is: 
> 6101 W Main St 
> Kalamazoo, MI 49009 
>
> Hope to see you there! Message here with questions.
> Leah and Marc
>
> On Jun 20, 2022, at 12:28 PM, Mike K.  wrote:
>
> That would be fun! I'm in the Chicago area, but depending on the date and 
> time, I could be in for driving out. 
>
>
> - Mike
> On Sunday, June 19, 2022 at 6:55:57 PM UTC-5 rmro...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I might be up for that!
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Jun 19, 2022, at 7:36 PM, Conway Bennett  
>> wrote:
>>
>> I'm interested in a post Labor Day ride.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Saturday, June 18, 2022 at 8:13:28 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi Friends, Marc Irwin and I live in the Kalamazoo, MI area and are 
>>> hoping to round up some fellow Rivendell riders in the area and organize a 
>>> ride on the Kal Haven Trail. Date and time TBD. Will be a fun time with 
>>> like-minded riders. 
>>>
>>> Respond if you are interested!
>>>
>> -- 
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>>  
>> 
>> .
>>
>> -- 
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> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Searching for bike akin to Quickbeam

[Max S]

IME, 35 mm tires are fine on 700c, otherwise there starts to be a trade-off 
between toe overlap and wheel flop. (Although, on 62 cm sized frames that's 
minimized.) There's a reason all those slacked out modern mtbs favor wide 
handlebars, IMO. 

Anyhow, if you're ok with 35 mm tires (and no fenders), an older Trek, 
Univega, Miyata, Fuji, etc., or an older Italian bike (late '70s / early 
'80s) can give you the parameters you seek at that price range. I've owned 
& ridden all of those (and still own some), as well as a QuickBeam (still) 
and a SimpleOne (sold), and a Colnago Super. I've an ancient Fuji Supreme 
that makes for a lovely knockabout 700c fixer, and even a 650b conversion 
in 1x1 mode. The "plainiest" from recent memory was a Trek 400 in "60" cm 
size, then the Colnago, then the QuickBeam. The SimpleOne was a bit more 
stout than the QB, and that's the one I currently have and enjoy very much. 

Another option is a Mercier Kilo WT – essentially a cop of the QB / SO, but 
uses long-reach caliper 
brakes. 
http://www.bikesdirect.com/products/mercier/kilott-wt-fixie-wide-tire.htm 

... a friend of mine got one last year, and seeing it in person left me 
impressed. Maybe others can chime in how it is in use. 

- Max "1x1" in A2

On Tuesday, June 14, 2022 at 1:52:25 PM UTC-4 Dave S wrote:

> Cantilever?  I don't know what specific frame size a 92cm PBH is but if 
> you're interested in an XL 80's touring bike that checks all the boxes, I'm 
> in NJ.
>
> Dave
>
>
> On Sunday, June 12, 2022 at 9:46:23 AM UTC-4 James wrote:
>
>> I have wanted a quick beam for a while now but the cost of a 3rd 
>> rivendell is holding me back, so I'm looking for a similar frame.  Anyone 
>> have any suggestions on a steel, lugged, horizontal dropout (front or rear 
>> facing), fairly large wheel diameter bike?  One I could get for $500 max?? 
>>  I have my eyes on a Schinn LeTour III and the only thing causing me pause 
>> is tire clearance (35mm) .  Thanks for any suggestions.  (I have a 92cm PBH 
>> for anyone between NC and RI)
>
>

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[RBW] Re: How Many Bars on the Appaloosa?

[Max S]

Resurrecting an old thread, as I'm lazily pondering an Appaloosa with a 
ChocoMoose set-up (if I can find one). How's the toe overlap on this with 
~50 mm tire? 42 mm tire? Folks who are ~6' tall, what size frame are you 
riding? Drop-bar or BullMoose or ChocoMoose? 

- Max "who can't stop tinkering" in A2 

On Monday, February 21, 2022 at 1:51:09 PM UTC-5 James wrote:

> I used to ride with the Albatross but the bends in the bars were 
> uncomfortable when I wanted to put my hands in a more forwards position.  I 
> switched to Bosco bars and love them but I am ridiculously upright.  I can 
> lean forwards and rest my elbows on by bar grips, with my hands in the 
> center of the bar.  I can hardly stand and pedal though, as my hands will 
> basically be at my hips.  I'l like to switch and am considering the 
> choco-moose based off this thread.
> On Sunday, February 20, 2022 at 12:15:49 AM UTC-5 Andrew Turner wrote:
>
>> Yeah I'm a handlebar fiend. The first bar I became obsessed with was the 
>> Albatross with bar-end shifters. Truly a perfect cockpit. The second 
>> handlebar obsession was the Nitto B135 in the 45cm flavor... but then I 
>> discovered my preference for shorter reach, which led me to my third and 
>> maybe-latest favorite: Ritchey's Butano handlebar. Another perfect one: 
>> it's ridiculously comfortable with just a single layer of Green Grips 
>> cotton bar tape. HOWEVER. I'm waiting on a new pair of Albatross bars to 
>> come in the mail from Riv, so I'm going back to the beginning to see how 
>> that feels. 
>>
>> Going from drops to alt-bars is the biggest swap for me because it 
>> usually means I've completely changed the intention of the build from an 
>> endurance-focused bike (drops) to a fun, smell the roses, 
>> better-all-terrain bike (alt-bars). It's on like a 1.5-2 year rotation it 
>> seems. I romanticize spending all day on the saddle, try it, get 
>> progressively more bored for the next year and a half, then revert and/or 
>> graduate to Albatross bars until I get sick of the headwind on a paved ride 
>> in another year and a half!   
>> On Tuesday, February 1, 2022 at 8:04:27 AM UTC-6 Johnny Alien wrote:
>>
>>> Yep!
>>>
>>>
>>> https://rivbike.tumblr.com/post/135532314029/the-joe-appaloosa-saga-its-a-new-bike
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, February 1, 2022 at 12:31:54 AM UTC-5 Erik wrote:
>>>
 Were the choco moose bars original equipment on the first round of 
 Appaloosas?  

 On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 9:10:33 PM UTC-8 J Imler wrote:

> [image: 186E1CD7-3716-4BE9-A68B-A3B5D6CD2FD2.jpeg]+1 choco moose
>
>  
>
> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 7:18:11 PM UTC-8 Roberta wrote:
>
>> Same here for the choco moose bars on this bike. I switched to 
>> albatross to lighten the build, but went back to the perfect  bars for 
>> this 
>> bike—choco moose. 
>> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 12:58:54 PM UTC-5 Bones wrote:
>>
>>> I did the same thing to my Appaloosas: boscomoose, bullmoose, 
>>> chocomoose, choco, albatross, billie. All of them worked great on this 
>>> bike. At the end of the day I always come back to the chocomoose 
>>> though. 
>>> There is something magical about those bars, at least for me. Great 
>>> hand 
>>> positions. I love how they are inverted. And yes, they are tougher and 
>>> stiffer than other bars 'n stems. They work great with bar end shifters 
>>> or 
>>> thumbies. One thing I discovered is that although I think the silver 
>>> shifters are the best, the clamp is not so great for inboard thumbies. 
>>> The 
>>> microshift shifters with paul levers have a nice low profile and don't 
>>> interrupt your hand positions. With respect to the Newbaums, yes I have 
>>> used a shameful amount for bar swaps over the years. At some point I 
>>> just 
>>> started slipping oury grips on the end and leaving the forward grip 
>>> areas 
>>> permanently taped. Bike looks great!
>>>
>>> Bones
>>>
>>> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 2:57:14 AM UTC-5 Nick Payne wrote:
>>>
 I just used my standard Nitto drop bar on my Appaloosa, with a 
 shorter stem than on my other bikes because it has a longer top tube. 
 Brake 
 levers in their normal location, wrapped the bars, haven't changed 
 anything 
 since:
 [image: PXL_20201213_024100183.jpg]

 Nick

>>>

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Re: [RBW] Re: Craigslist (and others) Bikes For Sale: 3

[Max S]

Indeed... some people must be clueless. Plus, that saddle slammed all the 
way back on its rails - poor seatpost! 

On Monday, May 23, 2022 at 2:38:06 PM UTC-4 Joe Bernard wrote:

> $3700 for an XO-1. Just by literally any Rivendell and you'll have a 
> better bike 
>
> On Monday, May 23, 2022 at 11:10:01 AM UTC-7 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Two Bridgestone XOs on Northern Virginia craigslist. 
>>
>> XO-2
>> 52cm
>> $700
>> Alexandria, VA 
>>
>> https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/bik/d/alexandria-bridgestone-xo/7487241486.html
>>
>> XO-1
>> 52cm
>> $3,700 (!!!)
>> McLean, VA 
>>
>> https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/nva/bik/d/mc-lean-1993bridgestone-xo/7486737255.html
>>
>> [image: 00R0R_4dzbuWztfnjz_0ne0ne_600x450.jpg]
>> [image: 00808_5v9Ky5oUv7Iz_0CI0lN_600x450.jpg]
>>
>> On Sunday, May 22, 2022 at 1:53:36 AM UTC-4 Hetchins52 wrote:
>>
>>> New title fixes the Appaloosa spelling. (Nonetheless, Rivendell is 
>>> spelled three different ways!)
>>> Probably a good deal if the big Sackville and a rack come with it!
>>>
>>> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/berkeley-rivendell-appaloosa-46cm/7486742585.html
>>> David
>>> Berkeley
>>>
>>> On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 5:17:30 PM UTC-7 mma...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 In case you missed it, a misspelled "46cm rivendale apolusa", SF 
 gregslist.

 https://sfbay.craigslist.org/eby/bik/d/berkeley-46cm-rivendale-apolusa/7481031255.html

 [image: 00t0t_7y44sGOHEg8z_0CI0t2_1200x900.jpg]
  

 On Sat, May 21, 2022 at 1:12 PM Jason  wrote:

> Sam Hillborne
> 60cm
> $1,000
> https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1162024001299575/
> On Saturday, May 21, 2022 at 2:36:24 PM UTC-5 eric...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Sam Hillborne frame, fork, headset
>> 62cm
>> $1,100
>> Havre de Grace, MD
>>
>> https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/758797715280300/?ref=search_code=marketplace_search_story_type=post
>>
>> [image: 281757366_5077936658980492_8181435420314547667_n.jpg]
>>
>> On Friday, May 20, 2022 at 1:59:13 PM UTC-4 Eric Marth wrote:
>>
>>> Hubbuhubbuh
>>> "Large"
>>> $3,200 
>>> Washington, DC
>>>
>>> https://washingtondc.craigslist.org/doc/bik/d/washington-large-rivendell-hubbuhubbah/7484571735.html
>>>
>>> [image: 00303_1KYarzNVztQz_0jC0eI_600x450.jpg]
>>>
>>> On Thursday, May 19, 2022 at 12:09:59 AM UTC-4 Matthew Williams 
>>> wrote:
>>>
 Clementine 
 52cm 
 2000 
 San Antonio, TX 

 https://sanantonio.craigslist.org/bik/d/san-antonio-rivendell-clementine/7485092392.html
>>>
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Re: [RBW] Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Max S]

As with everything, there can be good reasons for certain practices 
initially, but people forget those reasons, and there's a slide... I can't 
speak for what / how a given set of locals is doing it. My personal 
experience with club rides has been overwhelmingly positive, whether it's 
for fun rides around the area, or training for racing. I was just 
describing that there are reasons strangers used to doing things in a 
particular way may be somewhat apprehensive about someone showing up and 
doing things in a radically different way. Nowadays I ride with 1-3 other 
people most of the time, they're non-racers, we don't do pacelines, but 
sometimes we like to go a bit faster than "party pace" – it's all good! :-) 

- Max "smoke break over" in A2 
On Wednesday, May 18, 2022 at 4:15:43 PM UTC-4 George Schick wrote:

> Something has happened to some of these local clubs over the decades.  
> When I was riding with head's down groups like the ones mentioned in this 
> thread back in the late 70's/early 80's they weren't like that.  They all 
> looked out for each other and politely pointed out different things to 
> expect on the ride, etc. and how to ride in pace lines.  I blame the 
> gradual introduction of exotic frame materials like titanium and then CF 
> and high, high end components for much of this behavior as well as an 
> elitist mindset.
>
> Couple of examples:  Ten-to-twelve years ago a local club based in a 
> Western suburb of Chicago used to sponsor a century ride centered in the 
> next county to the West of here.  All of a sudden it was no longer on the 
> yearly ride roster; it just disappeared.  So, one day I spotted a couple 
> riding through the park behind my house while I was out there with the Ram 
> doing the annual post-Winter maintenance shakedown.  They stopped near me, 
> wowed by the Ram and so we struck up a conversation.  When I found out that 
> they were members of that local club I asked about the demise of that 
> annual century ride their club had sponsored.  The guy said, "You know all 
> of those baked goods, paper cups of trail mix, etc. that were available to 
> registered riders at the sag stops?  Well, those were all voluntarily made 
> by members of the club so the money from the registration for the ride all 
> went directly to the club's treasury."  "So?" I said.  He said, "Well, as 
> it turned out, the club's treasury wound up with a lot of money in it.  
> During club meetings arguments broke out over how to use the money.  The 
> racing crowd wanted all of it to go toward "their" club racing jerseys; 
> others disagreed and the end result was a cancellation of the annual 
> century and a general break-up of the club membership."
>
> Another example involved training rides of racer-types through a very 
> picturesque and hilly Indianapolis cemetery, ideal for a criterium course.  
> The groups became so arrogant and condescending that they had their rides 
> while funeral services were being held, often riding directly through 
> groups of mourners.  The cemetery finally had to put a stop to it, limiting 
> the availability of the property's drives.
>
> I could go on and on about how these attitudes reflect on the general 
> state of our culture nowadays, but it would likely devolve into remarks 
> that would force the moderator to nuke most of the comments.  Anyway, 
> that's my two-cents on the matter.
>
> On Wednesday, May 18, 2022 at 2:49:58 PM UTC-5 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> I just hope it stays fun, or more accurately you continue to find the fun 
>> in it. Pacelines are notorious for attractng competitive grumpy people who 
>> wouldn't know fun if it cracked them over the head with a carbon fork. Stay 
>> away from those people! 
>>
>> Joe Bernard
>>
>> On Wednesday, May 18, 2022 at 9:21:08 AM UTC-7 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I see your point, Max. And I think you’re right. If I don’t fall into 
>>> line visually, then I might not be wise in their ways and therefore put the 
>>> group at risk. And that’s a fair concern because I don’t have paceline 
>>> experience (yet). We do not ride super tight or at 25 mph, and I hope we 
>>> never do. (Are we a pretend paceline?) The ride leader mentions some things 
>>> at the huddle and they say “don’t cross wheels” so I make sure never to do 
>>> that. But there have been times when things go wrong and I wonder what I 
>>> was *supposed* to have done. For instance, on the Monday Night Ride the 
>>> woman in front of me slammed on her brakes suddenly (twice, actually, and I 
>>> don’t know why). Before I even thought to do the same, I already was. This 
>>> c

Re: [RBW] Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Max S]

Here's a decent primer on pacelines by GCN:  
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HDxXRq5fo8A 
Much better to learn by doing, of course. :-) 

Also, I promise you will enjoy this read immensely:  
https://www.amazon.com/Rider-Tim-Krabb%C3%A9/dp/1582342903 
And after you read that book, please watch this little docu on that (cult) 
book:  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JiaitFPHtqw 

- Max "whose 22 is no longer clean" in A2 

On Wednesday, May 18, 2022 at 12:21:08 PM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> I see your point, Max. And I think you’re right. If I don’t fall into line 
> visually, then I might not be wise in their ways and therefore put the 
> group at risk. And that’s a fair concern because I don’t have paceline 
> experience (yet). We do not ride super tight or at 25 mph, and I hope we 
> never do. (Are we a pretend paceline?) The ride leader mentions some things 
> at the huddle and they say “don’t cross wheels” so I make sure never to do 
> that. But there have been times when things go wrong and I wonder what I 
> was *supposed* to have done. For instance, on the Monday Night Ride the 
> woman in front of me slammed on her brakes suddenly (twice, actually, and I 
> don’t know why). Before I even thought to do the same, I already was. This 
> caused the man behind me to growl. Literally growl. I still don’t know what 
> I should have done. Hit her? 
>
> It’s all very new and interesting and I would love to ride with you one 
> day soon in A2. 
>
> Staying humble but staying on my Platypus regardless of what they think,
> Leah
>
> On May 18, 2022, at 11:50 AM, Max S  wrote:
>
> 
>
> Roadies are snobby, but potentially with good reason. Let me explain... 
> While there CAN be plenty of groupthink and cultishness / exclusivity in 
> road biking and club cycling that I don't care for, there are some good 
> reasons to enforce a certain amount of conformity when riding fast on paved 
> roads in a tight formation (e.g., a paceline). 
> Going fast in a long, rotating paceline, on a narrow shoulder of a road 
> with cars zooming by, with potential for potholes causing pinch flats with 
> skinny tires, you have to be very disciplined as a group, and you have to 
> have a lot of trust in those in your paceline. Any failure to point out a 
> pothole, approaching car, or joggers, any jitters or unsteadiness in speed 
> can wreak havoc on the group. In a good, properly rotating paceline, you 
> are going >20 mph, your tire is inches away from the next rider's tire, and 
> your bars are also inches from another person's bars as you rotate back or 
> forward. Riding in echelons in a side-wind can be even trickier. 
> I've ridden plenty when training and racing on the road, and riding with 
> people who can maintain a straight line, steady speed without any 
> speedometers or inclines / declines in the road is simply more enjoyable. 
> You learn to stay the heck away from riders who are yoyo-ing back and 
> forth, riders who "leave their wheel behind" when they stand up to climb, 
> riders whose shorts and bikes are a little bit too torn up (potential for 
> frequent crashes), and *riders who for whatever other stupid reason may 
> appear like they're different enough from you that you can't 110% rely on 
> them to keep their line and predictability in a tight bunch*. I'm not 
> saying that you exhibit any of those functional foibles, but when you don't 
> know the other riders all that well, as seems to be the occasional 
> situation you're running into on these club rides, people tend to pay more 
> attention to various secondary indicators / cues. 
> If you think about the risks and people's nature when riding in tight 
> groups on the road, it's literally life-and-death (or 
> life-and-serious-injury) type considerations that drive these behaviors. 
> In a well-run club ride, a leader will gently guide new riders in these 
> unspoken rules and behaviors, and a welcoming approach can result in more 
> trust and discipline than these gruff attitudes... It's unfortunate that 
> there didn't seem to be a sufficiently experienced and authoritative 
> "patron" on the ride to keep the skittish / insecure newbies in line and 
> ensure there's a nurturing approach. But at the same time, do try to see it 
> from another perspective. There are very good reasons to encourage 
> diversity in cycling, but there are also instances / situations, where 
> uniformity and conformity is the safest (and most enjoyable) way to go. If 
> you ever get to ride with experienced and strong riders that can maintain a 
> proper rotating paceline going at 20-25 mph, with very little work, 
> relatively speaking, it's an exhilirating experience!
>
> - Max "mostly reformed roadie racer who still lik

Re: [RBW] Club Rides On A Racing Platypus

[Max S]

Roadies are snobby, but potentially with good reason. Let me explain... 
While there CAN be plenty of groupthink and cultishness / exclusivity in 
road biking and club cycling that I don't care for, there are some good 
reasons to enforce a certain amount of conformity when riding fast on paved 
roads in a tight formation (e.g., a paceline). 
Going fast in a long, rotating paceline, on a narrow shoulder of a road 
with cars zooming by, with potential for potholes causing pinch flats with 
skinny tires, you have to be very disciplined as a group, and you have to 
have a lot of trust in those in your paceline. Any failure to point out a 
pothole, approaching car, or joggers, any jitters or unsteadiness in speed 
can wreak havoc on the group. In a good, properly rotating paceline, you 
are going >20 mph, your tire is inches away from the next rider's tire, and 
your bars are also inches from another person's bars as you rotate back or 
forward. Riding in echelons in a side-wind can be even trickier. 
I've ridden plenty when training and racing on the road, and riding with 
people who can maintain a straight line, steady speed without any 
speedometers or inclines / declines in the road is simply more enjoyable. 
You learn to stay the heck away from riders who are yoyo-ing back and 
forth, riders who "leave their wheel behind" when they stand up to climb, 
riders whose shorts and bikes are a little bit too torn up (potential for 
frequent crashes), and *riders who for whatever other stupid reason may 
appear like they're different enough from you that you can't 110% rely on 
them to keep their line and predictability in a tight bunch*. I'm not 
saying that you exhibit any of those functional foibles, but when you don't 
know the other riders all that well, as seems to be the occasional 
situation you're running into on these club rides, people tend to pay more 
attention to various secondary indicators / cues. 
If you think about the risks and people's nature when riding in tight 
groups on the road, it's literally life-and-death (or 
life-and-serious-injury) type considerations that drive these behaviors. 
In a well-run club ride, a leader will gently guide new riders in these 
unspoken rules and behaviors, and a welcoming approach can result in more 
trust and discipline than these gruff attitudes... It's unfortunate that 
there didn't seem to be a sufficiently experienced and authoritative 
"patron" on the ride to keep the skittish / insecure newbies in line and 
ensure there's a nurturing approach. But at the same time, do try to see it 
from another perspective. There are very good reasons to encourage 
diversity in cycling, but there are also instances / situations, where 
uniformity and conformity is the safest (and most enjoyable) way to go. If 
you ever get to ride with experienced and strong riders that can maintain a 
proper rotating paceline going at 20-25 mph, with very little work, 
relatively speaking, it's an exhilirating experience!

- Max "mostly reformed roadie racer who still likes to make an effort, even 
if mostly on dirt roads" in A2 

PS: Take a day or weekend to visit A2 (a 2-3 hr drive from KZoo) and you'll 
discover lots of nice rides and friendly riders here. Happy to host. 

On Wednesday, May 18, 2022 at 8:09:41 AM UTC-4 Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:

> Last night was the worst yet. There are a lot of group rides in the Club, 
> and once they all get used to seeing me I have hope of a normal, non-judgy 
> experience. But last night was brutal.
>
> This is a women’s ride. You would think women would be more welcoming than 
> men, but I’m finding I have a better time with the men. They are better at 
> keeping their thoughts to themselves. We huddled up at the start to discuss 
> routes, rules, and break up into groups. Here comes a 20-something, whom I 
> recognize from the Friday ride. She rode with the slow group that day. She 
> approaches me and says, “How tall are you?”
>
> “5’6”.
>
> “Great. I felt so bad that you had to turn back on Friday’s ride because 
> you didn’t have a road bike. We just all felt so bad! My Dad collects road 
> bikes in my size and I have one for you!”
>
> I was so embarrassed. She thinks I can’t afford a road bike. She thinks I 
> can’t do the ride. I am not the woman she is thinking of, and she’s saying 
> out loud what a lot of them are thinking already - that woman on the retro 
> bike isn’t going to make it. I protested. Told her she must be thinking of 
> someone else; I hadn’t turned back on the ride, I had finished. We hadn’t 
> even ridden in the same group! “But I recognize your bike”, she insisted. I 
> could not convince her, but she let it go as we rolled out of the parking 
> lot.
>
> After that, I had a LOT to prove. I got into the front of that peloton so 
> that al the doubters behind me would see that I’m not limited by my 
> bike. That morning I had ridden 23 miles with Marc (Sam rider and kindred 
> spirit), lifted weights, 

[RBW] Re: Craigslist (and others) Bikes For Sale: 3

[Max S]

I'd buy that Yves in Seattle – could anyone facilitate?.. 

- Max "Yves for my one-and-only" in A2

On Tuesday, May 10, 2022 at 12:50:07 PM UTC-4 Matthew Williams wrote:

> Yves Gomez
> 52cm
> 1000
> Seattle, WA
> https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1418193641964641
>
>
> Clem Smith Jr. H
> 59cm
> 1200
> Grand Rapids, MI
> https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/720864229090374
>
>
> A. Homer Hilsen
> 63cm
> 1500
> Fairhope, AL
> https://www.facebook.com/marketplace/item/1164260631083222
>
>
> A. Homer Hilsen
> 59cm
> 2600
> West Los Angeles, CA
>
> https://losangeles.craigslist.org/wst/bik/d/los-angeles-rivendell-bicycle-works/7479040662.html
>
>
> Rambouillet
> 54cm
> 2250
> Arcata, CA
>
> https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/bik/d/arcata-rivendell-rambouillet/7475750041.html

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Re: [RBW] FS: Choco handlebar cockpit- Nitto, SunRace, MicroShift, etc.

[Max S]

I'm very interested in the bars, but to a much lesser extent in everything 
else... Anyone want the other stuff? :-) 

- Max "just the bars" in A2 

On Thursday, May 5, 2022 at 9:11:45 AM UTC-4 esoter...@gmail.com wrote:

>
> Happy Cinco de Mayo, bump for this cockpit. It's a great setup, I just 
> don't have a frame I can use it with. Cheers,
>
> ~Mark
>
>
> On Apr 24, 2022, at 10:27, esoterica etc  wrote:
>
> Happy weekend all!
>
>
> I've got a cockpit for sale taken off my Atlantis which I bought several 
> years ago as a demo directly from Riv HQ, and I figured that since the new 
> batch of Atlantises just went on sale, someone might be interested in this 
> cockpit. Pics are here: 
>
>
> https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1NCHBsk20wJWy-L-CScb-N8evKAC3W4Xq?usp=sharing
>
> Included with the cockpit are the following:
>
> Choco heat-treated bars (retail $115)
> Nitto Tallux stem with 120mm reach (retail $84)
> SunRace V-brake levers (retail ~$25)
> MicroShift 9-speed thumb shifters (retail $60)
> Newbaums + felt bar wrap wrapped by Grant himself ($priceless)
>
> Asking $230 shipped anywhere in the US, or local pick up in the 
> Raleigh/Triangle area. Payment through PayPal friends & family please,  
> Thanks for looking and have a great day!
>
> ~Mark
> Raleigh, NC
>
>
>
> -- 
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>  
> 
> .
>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: 52cm Clem L complete

[Max S]

Thanks, I'll check it out. Though I (actually, my SO) would be much more 
partial to the older, mustard version. 

- Max "" in A2

On Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 11:05:34 PM UTC-4 Johnny Alien wrote:

> Max, its not a mustard but Crust bikes has a complete lime green one 
> available right now.
>
> On Wednesday, March 23, 2022 at 11:04:15 PM UTC-4 Max S wrote:
>
>> Lovely bike, Marc, and whoever bought it. 
>>
>> If there's another 52 cm mustard Clem L that someone wants to sell, 
>> please drop me a note! 
>>
>> - Max "I step away from the list for a week and this happens!.." in A2
>>
>> On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 3:19:26 PM UTC-4 Marc R wrote:
>>
>>> Sold
>>>
>>> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 10:33:42 PM UTC-7 Marc R wrote:
>>>
>>>> SPF,  thanks for the interest and inquiries
>>>>
>>>> On Friday, March 18, 2022 at 2:29:29 PM UTC-7 Friend wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Got any more pictures?
>>>>>
>>>>> On Friday, March 18, 2022 at 4:03:53 PM UTC-4 zac.te...@gmail.com 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> pm sent
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thursday, March 17, 2022 at 4:07:11 PM UTC-7 Marc R wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Purchased new (2016) from RBW, ridden around town only.
>>>>>>> I bought a larger size so am selling this one.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Standard Riv build, mustard color, with:
>>>>>>> Rene Hearse Switchback Hill tires
>>>>>>> SKS fenders
>>>>>>> Wald Clem Bosco Basket
>>>>>>> $1600
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> prefer local (NorCal) sale
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>> Marc
>>>>>>> Davis, CA
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [image: IMG_0253.jpeg]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>

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[RBW] Re: FS: 52cm Clem L complete

[Max S]

Lovely bike, Marc, and whoever bought it. 

If there's another 52 cm mustard Clem L that someone wants to sell, please 
drop me a note! 

- Max "I step away from the list for a week and this happens!.." in A2

On Monday, March 21, 2022 at 3:19:26 PM UTC-4 Marc R wrote:

> Sold
>
> On Sunday, March 20, 2022 at 10:33:42 PM UTC-7 Marc R wrote:
>
>> SPF,  thanks for the interest and inquiries
>>
>> On Friday, March 18, 2022 at 2:29:29 PM UTC-7 Friend wrote:
>>
>>> Got any more pictures?
>>>
>>> On Friday, March 18, 2022 at 4:03:53 PM UTC-4 zac.te...@gmail.com wrote:
>>>
 pm sent

 On Thursday, March 17, 2022 at 4:07:11 PM UTC-7 Marc R wrote:

> Purchased new (2016) from RBW, ridden around town only.
> I bought a larger size so am selling this one.
>
> Standard Riv build, mustard color, with:
> Rene Hearse Switchback Hill tires
> SKS fenders
> Wald Clem Bosco Basket
> $1600
>
> prefer local (NorCal) sale
>
> Cheers,
> Marc
> Davis, CA
>
> [image: IMG_0253.jpeg]
>


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[RBW] Re: Roaduno 2022 concepts

[Max S]

http://www.63xc.com/scorcher/nakash.jpg

[image: Ibis Scorcher.jpg]

- Max "mic drop" in A2

On Tuesday, March 8, 2022 at 4:30:17 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> Will responded to my email, explaining my mistake.  I saw instagram photos 
> of prototypes.  I mistakenly thought that meant Riv has them.  The builder 
> has them.  Then they will be painted.  Then they will be shipped.  Then 
> they will be assembled.  Then somebody can ride them.  
>
> I'll be patient...
>
> BL in EC
>
> On Tuesday, March 8, 2022 at 8:06:38 AM UTC-8 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> There was an Instagram post showing that Riv has prototype samples of all 
>> sizes of RoadUno, inviting us to come test ride them.  I just emailed Will 
>> to find out if they really have a 57 ready to test ride for me.  Has 
>> anybody ridden one at RBWHQ?
>>
>> I haven't seen numbers yet, but since they say "designed for swept bars" 
>> I'm going to take them at their word that I won't be putting drops on a 
>> RoadUno.  I think my urbanscorcher version of a RoadUno might have Riv 
>> Bullmoose bars.  What would you run?  
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS(Bay Area): 58? Quickbeam

[Max S]

Great bike... The slight rise in the top tube makes it more like a +2 cm 
trad. frame size. Which I like. Clearance is good. Color is fast. Price is 
good! GLWS! 

- Max "a few thousand happy kms on my 58" in A2

On Wednesday, March 2, 2022 at 6:47:22 PM UTC-5 diekaiser wrote:

> Hey all, since I'm heading up to Oregon I wanted to open it up to anyone 
> that may be interested along my route. I'll be heading up to Brookings, OR 
> from San Francisco on Sunday or Monday. Then up to Scottsberg, OR (3 hours 
> south of PDX/45 mins from Eugene) on Tuesday. I'll be there for most of the 
> week until I head back home - likely Friday/Saturday. I'd be happy to drive 
> a bit to make someone's journey a bit shorter. If there are no takers I'll 
> consider shipping once I get back home, but my March and April are pretty 
> busy.
>
> Here are the details again:
> 56cm Quickbeam
> Tange Levin headset
> Shimano BB
> Nitto 83 seat post
> 36h Dura-Ace 7600 track hubs (fixed/fixed)
> White Industries 19t freewheel
> 36h Velocity Atlas rims (non-machined)
> 700x38 Panaracer Gravelking EXTs (if you would like them).
>
> On Monday, February 28, 2022 at 4:20:48 PM UTC-8 diekaiser wrote:
>
>> Hey all. With regret, I'm selling my Quickbeam. Unfortunately living in a 
>> studio doesn't accommodate owning 4+ bikes and the Quickbeam didn't make 
>> the cut. I'm heading up to SF on March 5th for a birthday roadtrip to 
>> Oregon and will be there for the weekend if you would like to check it out.
>>
>>  I was having a hard time figuring out which size model it is from the 
>> Riv catalogs but it has a 57cm top tube and a 56cm seat tube (I measured 
>> center to center) which I believe puts it at the 58cm model. 
>>
>> Sale includes Frame, fork, headset, bottom bracket, seat post, and wheel 
>> set. Unfortunately, I don't have a spare set of brakes as they are moving 
>> to a different bike along with the crankset. I figured the cockpit would be 
>> purely preferential. With that said, I have a selection of nitto bars if 
>> someone would like to inquire. 
>>
>> I'd say the condition is great as in there are no dents, large scratches, 
>> etc but the decals are a bit scratched up from locking etc. The only other 
>> thing that I didn't know about when I bought it was that the front-left 
>> fender eyelet may be stripped. I'll investigate more closely soon but just 
>> wanted to mention it.
>>
>> *Details*
>> Tange Levin headset
>> Shimano BB (I don't remember the exact width but I believe it is the one 
>> that came stock)
>> Nitto 83 seat post
>> 36h Dura-Ace 7600 track hubs (fixed/fixed)
>> White Industries 19t freewheel
>> 36h Velocity Atlas rims (non-machined)
>> 700x38 Panaracer Gravelking EXTs (if you would like them).
>>
>> $1300, but if that doesn't sound reasonable I'm more than happy to chat 
>> about it.
>>
>> Here are some photos of the different iterations in which it has been set 
>> up 
>> .
>>
>> I'll add some more detail photos to the same link shortly.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: New Bike-Trade Day - A(nother) Quickbeam

[Max S]

"No one asked, but I thought I'd share that the rear fender is mounted 
using these safety tabs 
.
 
They look nice enough and allow for easy-enough wheel removal with the 
rear-facing dropouts. Handy for the (very) occasional hill out here on 
which I would enjoy 'shifting' from 44x16 to 44x19." 

I noticed that and for a moment thought you had them backwards, but this is 
an interesting idea! I use them with my front metal fender, but not the 
rear. (For that I have been using a Paul SS/Fixed hub that uses bolts, upon 
removal of which the wheel can be dropped out vertically. There are some 
other hubs that use a similar set-up. Retrogression sells many of them.) 

- Max "learn something new today" in A2

On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 2:53:38 PM UTC-5 Patch T wrote:

> Thanks folks - truly an honor to get an 'APPROVE' from Bill! I'm a huge 
> fan of his whole stable, to the extent that he's shared it here or iBob 
> over the last few years... 
>
> I thought I really liked orange; but I think I prefer the QB in silver 
> now. Orange may be the fastest color but silver is the plane-iest!
>
> No one asked, but I thought I'd share that the rear fender is mounted 
> using these safety tabs 
> .
>  
> They look nice enough and allow for easy-enough wheel removal with the 
> rear-facing dropouts. Handy for the (very) occasional hill out here on 
> which I would enjoy 'shifting' from 44x16 to 44x19.
>
> Patch
>
>
> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 2:50:50 PM UTC-5 Dave Grossman wrote:
>
>> That is a great story!  Only Riv's would have such a history!  Matt has 
>> my old green 58 and I'm currently on Jamisons old 62 so this is the 
>> carousel of QBs!
>>
>> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 11:39:35 AM UTC-6 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> Laing pointed out the FJSr has a "smaller diameter tube set".  
>>>
>>> It's just the downtube that is smaller diameter, but I agree with you 
>>> that the planing zealots should love that.  That said, the planing zealots 
>>> generally scoff at long chainstays and/or easily find other things to 
>>> complain about.  
>>>
>>> If that $1500 MSRP frameset was being sold used for $750, I'd grab it.  
>>> I don't think I could part out that $2800 build to get it down to $750 for 
>>> a F/F/HS.  
>>>
>>> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 9:22:12 AM UTC-8 lconley wrote:
>>>
 I would classify the FJ Sr as the Rivendell most likely to "plane" of 
 any recent Rivendell bike doe to it's smaller diameter tube set, that is, 
 if I had any idea what "planing" was. 

 Laing

 On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 12:11:11 PM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:

> Thanks Doug, but that's out of my price range.  It may be naive of me, 
> but I think used-anything should be half-retail.  $2800 for that build 
> strikes me as a fair bit more than half retail, even though it is a 
> high-end build.  Add to that the fact that the FJ Senor has essentially 
> zero cult following.  Maybe it's collectors prices for the Paul Racer 
> brakes?  HAHA
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 7:54:44 AM UTC-8 Doug H. wrote:
>
>> Bill,
>> There is a 57 cm Frank Jones Sr. on eBay if that interests you. I'll 
>> post the link in case you hadn't seen it. 
>> https://www.ebay.com/itm/185245621839?mkevt=1=1=0=711-53200-19255-0=20008=5335981329=with-subcat
>> Doug
>>
>> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 10:46:59 AM UTC-5 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>>
>>> APPROVE!
>>>
>>> I want a silver 58cm Quickbeam.  There's a green 60cm locally, but I 
>>> don't like British Racing Green on bikes.  I might end up with it 
>>> anyway, 
>>> but I'm not going to cry if somebody else buys it.  If that 60cm green 
>>> was 
>>> a 58cm silver, I'd already have it...
>>>
>>> Bill Lindsay
>>> El Cerrito, CA
>>>
>>> On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 6:28:48 AM UTC-8 Patch T wrote:
>>>
 Hi Bunch,

 *tl:dr - Kyle's Quickbeam was too big. Mine was maybe too small. We 
 swapped. Photos.*

 I've ridden an orange Quickbeam for about 5 years. It's seen all 
 sorts of builds, all sorts of rides, camping trips, commutes; the slow 
 end 
 of a toxic relationship and the start of a healthy one, an engagement, 
 a 
 cross-country move (again), a pandemic a career change... As you can 
 imagine, I'm in love with the bike. My first and only Rivendell (so 
 far) 
 but I don't really feel the itch for another. Ok maybe a Mountain 
 Mixte. Or 
 Roadeo. Or Saluki, maybe. I digress. 

 I sold a few frames so I could purchase it, used, from an angel 
 named John who even let me pay in 

[RBW] Re: My new Clem in Seoul

[Max S]

That purple bar tape goes well with the frame color! I miss visiting 
Korea... Didn't seem like much of a bike scene there, except for a large 
number of mini-velos I'd see inside of buildings and on campuses. How's the 
riding? 

- Max " 'bap and beef knee garlic soup? you have my number" in A2 

On Monday, January 31, 2022 at 12:19:14 PM UTC-5 marcusg...@gmail.com wrote:

> Looking at all the Clems in this group helped with my long wait for mine 
> to arrive in South Korea. So here are some pics of my Clem for you!
>
> [image: 20220127_070825.jpg][image: 20220127_154821.jpg]
>

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Re: [RBW] Show me some bikes with black components

[Max S]

*"Max: I beg forgiveness for using a puerile word, but that bike is neat!  
I did note the ass saver. 50 X 18 with those tires -- I'd guess 27" tall: 
75 or 76 gi? Just right for what I assume is a very light and efficient 
bike Whatzit Weigh?" *

Yep, just about 76 inch gear. Tires are Specialized 32 mm cross tubulars, 
latex tubes, so not too heavy for that size tire. The wheelset isn't much 
lighter, if at all, than my regular DA hubs with Reflex rims. A 50 mile 
ride on dirt roads around here will net only about 2,000 ft of elevation 
gain, so weight isn't a big priority. With those tires, rack, heavy bb and 
crank (by modern standards), spare tire, repair kit, full pump, lights, 
it's over 20 lbs. But the fit on the bike is good, and thanks to the wheel 
aerodynamics, I do manage a half-mph more on this than on other set-ups. 

The rear dropouts on the frame had been spread to 130 mm, so I can swap 
wheels with other bikes without too much trouble. I do have a wheel with a 
long-axled Surly fixed/fixed hub that I run sometimes, and riding fixed is 
somehow just as fast for me (but a bit more tiring). 

- Max "less whining, more fix(edgearrid)ing" in A2 

On Wednesday, December 15, 2021 at 2:54:49 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:

> Garth: Either your eyes or your monitor are better than mine. When I blow 
> up the image on my *$1K hi rez 42" work monitor* I can make out a fuzzy, 
> "maybe" Selle Italia, but that's it.
>
> Max: I beg forgiveness for using a puerile word, but that bike is *neat!*  
> I did note the ass saver. 50 X 18 with those tires -- I'd guess 27" tall: 
> 75 or 76 gi? Just right for what I assume is a very light and efficient 
> bike.
>
> Whatzit Weigh?
>
> My 1999 custom Joe gofast fixie is 18 event, but with heavy pedals (DA 
> SPDs at 360 grams the pair) and heavy Phil hubs F, and 2 Iris cages. 
> Original edition Flite saddle,
>
> On Wed, Dec 15, 2021 at 8:01 AM Max S  wrote:
>
>> Garth is correct – Selle Italia SLR, one of the later models, 135 grams, 
>> no cutout. There's an "Ass Saver" on there. The wheels are Enve 6,7 – 60 
>> and 70 mm deep rims, front and rear, respectively, on DT Swiss 350 hubs. I 
>> was running a White Industries crank with a 50 t ring and 18 t rear cog (in 
>> aluminum) by Endless Cogs. Eriksen Ti seatpost, Ibis Ti stem. 
>>
>> - Max "the Fastest Pumpkin" in A2
>>
>> On Wednesday, December 15, 2021 at 3:56:44 AM UTC-5 Garth wrote:
>>
>>> Oo  I wanna play "name that saddle" Patrick !  
>>>
>>> If you zoom into the photo you can see at the rear of the saddle the 
>>> stylistic remnants of *Italia *, and below forward of that 3 little 
>>> symbols which spell out SLR. That'd be a Selle Italia SLR saddle . 
>>> (((  for the cookie !   
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, December 14, 2021 at 8:07:14 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>>>
>>>> Max: Please explain (in excruciating detail): Fixed or ss? Gear inches? 
>>>> What are those wheels, and especially, why? And explain radial. 2-cross 
>>>> rear? What is that ass hatchet? (I don't doubt you find it comfortable; 
>>>> I've been loving original issue Flites since 1990.) Custom decals 
>>>> ...???!!! 
>>>> And gravel tires and front rack to complete the package. 
>>>>
>>>> The list demands explanations!
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Dec 14, 2021 at 2:06 AM Max S  wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Wow, many nice bikes. Gonna link to my Halloween Special Scary Riv... 
>>>>> I've got a black stem and seatpost I might swap in for the next 
>>>>> Halloween, 
>>>>> but in the meantime, I will put back some gray-finish wheels and cranks 
>>>>> back on, because gray & orange is a bit less "on the nose" :-) 
>>>>>
>>>>> - Max "sotto voce" in A2
>>>>>
>>>>> https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/K9RbCHAtCzE 
>>>>> [image: image.jpeg]
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Patrick Moore, grimly bottom-cropping in ABQ, NM 
>>>>
>>> -- 
>>
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
>> "RBW Owners Bunch" group.
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>>
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>>  
>> <https://groups.google.com/d/msgid/rbw-owners-bunch/296e0d35-9797-430f-8d94-e0efd02f4157n%40googlegroups.com?utm_medium=email_source=footer>
>> .
>>
>
>
> -- 
>
> ---
> Patrick Moore
> Alburquerque, Nuevo Mexico, Etats Unis d'Amerique, Orbis Terrarum
>
>

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Re: [RBW] Show me some bikes with black components

[Max S]

Garth is correct – Selle Italia SLR, one of the later models, 135 grams, no 
cutout. There's an "Ass Saver" on there. The wheels are Enve 6,7 – 60 and 
70 mm deep rims, front and rear, respectively, on DT Swiss 350 hubs. I was 
running a White Industries crank with a 50 t ring and 18 t rear cog (in 
aluminum) by Endless Cogs. Eriksen Ti seatpost, Ibis Ti stem. 

- Max "the Fastest Pumpkin" in A2

On Wednesday, December 15, 2021 at 3:56:44 AM UTC-5 Garth wrote:

> Oo  I wanna play "name that saddle" Patrick !  
>
> If you zoom into the photo you can see at the rear of the saddle the 
> stylistic remnants of *Italia *, and below forward of that 3 little 
> symbols which spell out SLR. That'd be a Selle Italia SLR saddle . 
> (((  for the cookie !   
>
> On Tuesday, December 14, 2021 at 8:07:14 PM UTC-5 Patrick Moore wrote:
>
>> Max: Please explain (in excruciating detail): Fixed or ss? Gear inches? 
>> What are those wheels, and especially, why? And explain radial. 2-cross 
>> rear? What is that ass hatchet? (I don't doubt you find it comfortable; 
>> I've been loving original issue Flites since 1990.) Custom decals ...???!!! 
>> And gravel tires and front rack to complete the package. 
>>
>> The list demands explanations!
>>
>> On Tue, Dec 14, 2021 at 2:06 AM Max S  wrote:
>>
>>> Wow, many nice bikes. Gonna link to my Halloween Special Scary Riv... 
>>> I've got a black stem and seatpost I might swap in for the next Halloween, 
>>> but in the meantime, I will put back some gray-finish wheels and cranks 
>>> back on, because gray & orange is a bit less "on the nose" :-) 
>>>
>>> - Max "sotto voce" in A2
>>>
>>> https://groups.google.com/g/rbw-owners-bunch/c/K9RbCHAtCzE 
>>> [image: image.jpeg]
>>>
>>
>> Patrick Moore, grimly bottom-cropping in ABQ, NM 
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: LF Single Speed Frame

[Max S]

62 cm SimpleOne in Coleman green here… thinking of passing this on, as I’ve 
got 3 other fixies. 

Let me know if that’s of interest. 

- Max 

On Friday, November 5, 2021 at 11:21:32 AM UTC-4 Bones wrote:

> The Wabi I've been commuting on is perfect in spirit but it's just too 
> small. If anyone has a frame for sale (i.e. 62-64 Quickbeam, Simpleone ~ 
> whatever for 80cm saddle height), I'd be interested. Similarly, if anyone 
> can point to something else that might fit the bill, I'd appreciate it. The 
> forthcoming Roaduno looks like it would be perfect, but I'm not sure I can 
> hold out that long. I've got lots of single speed stuff and my commute is 
> short and flat so I'd really like to stick with a SS frame.
>
> Thanks!
> Bones
>

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[RBW] Re: The scariest Rivendell - Halloween Special - Pumpkin QuickBeam and Carbon

[Max S]

Punted out ~40 pretty bumpy miles on this purgatory pumpkin at a prompt 
pace on this pair of punchy hoops. Quite a few segment PRs set, probably 
from attempting to avoid the utter embarrassment of riding too slowly with 
such deep rims. 
It was a good fun Halloween bike dress-up project. Not sure what I'll do 
with them now. Maybe I can build up another non-sequitur of a bike, like a 
murdered-out Ebisu with SRAM brifters. 

- Max "it's a long winter coming" in A2 

On Friday, October 29, 2021 at 3:39:26 PM UTC-4 Max S wrote:

> Thank you all for your comments, questions, and apologies for the delay – 
> I've been absolutely slammed with work and family obligations. 
>
> *Bill:*  Yes, I've seen that picture of Grant... But Spinergies... Yikes! 
> :-) 
> *Dave:*  Indeed!.. In seriousness, I have fairly low flexibility 
> naturally, and sit too much at work, so my lower back doesn't tolerate well 
> more saddle-to-bar drop than ~1-2 inches. I might also have a shorter torso 
> for my height. Whatever the biometrics, this 58 cm QB fits great. 
> *John:* Yes. This past couple of years I've been re-discovering 
> single-speeding / fixed gear riding, and it's somehow more fun for me. 
> *Eric:* I did build a commuter bike for my oldest using BSPs and, for a 
> moment, used Schraeder tubes. Then got a new wheelset on iBOB and 
> prest(a)-change-o! 
> *Wally:* I've been riding the QB off and on with different wheels, 
> including some aluminum rim tubulars. To be perfectly honest, I've not had 
> the chance to glue these specific ones yet (see above about work, etc.), so 
> I only rode the bike around the neighborhood. But I've some tubular tape on 
> order and want to give it a go with the crabon hoopz. 
> *Matthew:* Yes, post and stem are Ti, brushed finish. Post is an Eriksen 
> setback. Stem is an Ibis, 90° / 95 mm or thereabout. I've had them on my 
> Ibis Spanky, but alas, not enough stack on that bike anymore. Saddle is a 
> Selle Italia SLR 135g version. 
> *Joe:* Thank you. More than 11 - wow! Must be the spicy color. :-) 
> *Ryan:* Currently geared 50x18. There are definitely days where it's too 
> much, but I've also set some nice PRs for 40+-mile rides on it on dirt, but 
> elevation gain around here is maybe 1,500-2,000 ft over that distance, with 
> occasional < 5% short kickers. It's the downhills that get me more. :-) 
> *Matt:* The rear mount is actually what came with a Cyclic Fly6 rear 
> camera / light. Not sure if it's strictly Garmin compatible, but possible. 
> I think DCRainMaker might have more info on that?.. 
> *Rob:* Yes, the wheelset came to me *via* another forum, and the original 
> owner had it custom-built by Vanilla to match his custom frame. The red 
> stripe ends up looking a close enough match for the deep orange of the QB 
> that it somehow works. I can get unduly neurotic about color combos, so 
> there's a good chance that after a few rides on these wheels I'll go back 
> to my gray-painted Mavic Reflex tubies to match the post and stem. 
> Otherwise I'll end up having to swap in a black post and black Salsa stem 
> and black SRAM levers, and... well, you get the idea. Although, the winter 
> is long here... 
>
> - Max "will the tape arrive in time to glue the tires before it's 
> officially 10/31??" in A2 
>
> On Friday, October 29, 2021 at 1:16:56 PM UTC-4 robkr...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> I like it. Are those hubs from a Vanilla/Speedvagen? Looks sort of like 
>> their paintwork.
>>
>> RK
>>
>> On Friday, October 29, 2021 at 8:59:20 AM UTC-4 Matt Beecher wrote:
>>
>>> Is that a garmin mount at the rear?  Is it for their radar/rear light?  
>>> Where did you get it...or did you fabricate it?  
>>>
>>> Best regards,
>>> Matt Beecher
>>> Oswego, IL
>>>
>>> On Thursday, October 28, 2021 at 7:50:37 AM UTC-5 Max S wrote:
>>>
>>>> Don't let Grant and the Riv gang see this, okay?.. 
>>>>
>>>> - Max "Well, don't say I didn't warn ya in the subject line..." in A2 
>>>>
>>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve 67 carbon wheels - drive side.jpeg]
>>>> [image: QuickBeam - carbon wheels - threequarter.jpg]
>>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve Endless Bike DT Swiss White Ind 
>>>> drivetrain.jpeg]
>>>> [image: QuickBeam - carbon wheels - chainline.jpg]
>>>> [image: QuickBeam - carbon Ti - seat cluster.jpeg]
>>>>
>>>

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[RBW] Re: The scariest Rivendell - Halloween Special - Pumpkin QuickBeam and Carbon

[Max S]

Thank you all for your comments, questions, and apologies for the delay – 
I've been absolutely slammed with work and family obligations. 

*Bill:*  Yes, I've seen that picture of Grant... But Spinergies... Yikes! 
:-) 
*Dave:*  Indeed!.. In seriousness, I have fairly low flexibility naturally, 
and sit too much at work, so my lower back doesn't tolerate well more 
saddle-to-bar drop than ~1-2 inches. I might also have a shorter torso for 
my height. Whatever the biometrics, this 58 cm QB fits great. 
*John:* Yes. This past couple of years I've been re-discovering 
single-speeding / fixed gear riding, and it's somehow more fun for me. 
*Eric:* I did build a commuter bike for my oldest using BSPs and, for a 
moment, used Schraeder tubes. Then got a new wheelset on iBOB and 
prest(a)-change-o! 
*Wally:* I've been riding the QB off and on with different wheels, 
including some aluminum rim tubulars. To be perfectly honest, I've not had 
the chance to glue these specific ones yet (see above about work, etc.), so 
I only rode the bike around the neighborhood. But I've some tubular tape on 
order and want to give it a go with the crabon hoopz. 
*Matthew:* Yes, post and stem are Ti, brushed finish. Post is an Eriksen 
setback. Stem is an Ibis, 90° / 95 mm or thereabout. I've had them on my 
Ibis Spanky, but alas, not enough stack on that bike anymore. Saddle is a 
Selle Italia SLR 135g version. 
*Joe:* Thank you. More than 11 - wow! Must be the spicy color. :-) 
*Ryan:* Currently geared 50x18. There are definitely days where it's too 
much, but I've also set some nice PRs for 40+-mile rides on it on dirt, but 
elevation gain around here is maybe 1,500-2,000 ft over that distance, with 
occasional < 5% short kickers. It's the downhills that get me more. :-) 
*Matt:* The rear mount is actually what came with a Cyclic Fly6 rear camera 
/ light. Not sure if it's strictly Garmin compatible, but possible. I think 
DCRainMaker might have more info on that?.. 
*Rob:* Yes, the wheelset came to me *via* another forum, and the original 
owner had it custom-built by Vanilla to match his custom frame. The red 
stripe ends up looking a close enough match for the deep orange of the QB 
that it somehow works. I can get unduly neurotic about color combos, so 
there's a good chance that after a few rides on these wheels I'll go back 
to my gray-painted Mavic Reflex tubies to match the post and stem. 
Otherwise I'll end up having to swap in a black post and black Salsa stem 
and black SRAM levers, and... well, you get the idea. Although, the winter 
is long here... 

- Max "will the tape arrive in time to glue the tires before it's 
officially 10/31??" in A2 

On Friday, October 29, 2021 at 1:16:56 PM UTC-4 robkr...@gmail.com wrote:

> I like it. Are those hubs from a Vanilla/Speedvagen? Looks sort of like 
> their paintwork.
>
> RK
>
> On Friday, October 29, 2021 at 8:59:20 AM UTC-4 Matt Beecher wrote:
>
>> Is that a garmin mount at the rear?  Is it for their radar/rear light?  
>> Where did you get it...or did you fabricate it?  
>>
>> Best regards,
>> Matt Beecher
>> Oswego, IL
>>
>> On Thursday, October 28, 2021 at 7:50:37 AM UTC-5 Max S wrote:
>>
>>> Don't let Grant and the Riv gang see this, okay?.. 
>>>
>>> - Max "Well, don't say I didn't warn ya in the subject line..." in A2 
>>>
>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve 67 carbon wheels - drive side.jpeg]
>>> [image: QuickBeam - carbon wheels - threequarter.jpg]
>>> [image: QuickBeam - Enve Endless Bike DT Swiss White Ind drivetrain.jpeg]
>>> [image: QuickBeam - carbon wheels - chainline.jpg]
>>> [image: QuickBeam - carbon Ti - seat cluster.jpeg]
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Clem Lotto

[Max S]

Aha... Thank you, John, for that note. Must have been a glitch. I just 
clicked on that link and was able to purchase. 
Winter is fast approaching here in MI, so we'll prob. have to pickle it 
until late Spring. 

- Max " pickles" in A2

On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 2:50:59 PM UTC-4 John A. Bennett wrote:

> >> Alas, 1.5 hrs between that email being sent and when I checked was 
> apparently more time than it took for all 200 of the lottery tickets to 
> sell out. Maybe >> later folks will start to auction off their "lottery 
> tickets"?.. 
>
> Not to worry. The lottery tickets are NOT sold out, as of Thursday, 
> October 7, at 11:49AM (PDST)
>
> Get 'em here: 
> https://www.rivbike.com/products/clem-smith-lotto-ticket-z?variant=40615872757871
>
> Thanks! 
>
> john(at)rivbike(dot)com
>
>
>
>
> On Thursday, October 7, 2021 at 9:40:12 AM UTC-7 Max S wrote:
>
>> *Johnny Alien wrote:*
>>
>>> I think the word "presale" is a bit misleading as to what is being 
>>> suggested here.  The suggestion is that they should start a list like 
>>> custom builders do. Lay down that $50 and you are added to the list.  When 
>>> you are up they contact you and if you have changed your mind in the year 
>>> that it has taken they can move on to the next name.
>>
>>
>> Agreed. What Riv is currently devising seems convoluted... But the 
>> approach seems to work for the company and, really, is not different from 
>> what advertising has done in the past and continues to do. 
>>
>> I'm awash in bikes, but wanted to snag a Clem L in a warm color for my 
>> spouse. Alas, 1.5 hrs between that email being sent and when I checked was 
>> apparently more time than it took for all 200 of the lottery tickets to 
>> sell out. Maybe later folks will start to auction off their "lottery 
>> tickets"?.. 
>>
>> I am curious how well the supply chain is going to recover, and what 
>> it'll do to the demand and prices for bikes. Not that I'm selling or buying 
>> mine anytime soon, just curious. 
>>
>> - Max "emotionally overly attached to certain tangible objects on two 
>> wheels" in A2
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: Clem Lotto

[Max S]

*Johnny Alien wrote:*

> I think the word "presale" is a bit misleading as to what is being 
> suggested here.  The suggestion is that they should start a list like 
> custom builders do. Lay down that $50 and you are added to the list.  When 
> you are up they contact you and if you have changed your mind in the year 
> that it has taken they can move on to the next name.


Agreed. What Riv is currently devising seems convoluted... But the approach 
seems to work for the company and, really, is not different from what 
advertising has done in the past and continues to do. 

I'm awash in bikes, but wanted to snag a Clem L in a warm color for my 
spouse. Alas, 1.5 hrs between that email being sent and when I checked was 
apparently more time than it took for all 200 of the lottery tickets to 
sell out. Maybe later folks will start to auction off their "lottery 
tickets"?.. 

I am curious how well the supply chain is going to recover, and what it'll 
do to the demand and prices for bikes. Not that I'm selling or buying mine 
anytime soon, just curious. 

- Max "emotionally overly attached to certain tangible objects on two 
wheels" in A2

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Re: [RBW] Share More Riv Riding Pics

[Max S]

Indeed, Beatifully set up bike, Paul. Always enjoy your builds and 
photography. 

- Max “how was your ride?.. more than bokeh” in A2

On Saturday, September 25, 2021 at 11:32:13 AM UTC-4 RichS wrote:

> Hello Paul,
>
> Gorgeous bike and photos to boot. Thank you for the component details as 
> well. 
>
> Your description of the CX-70 front derailer touching the chainstay is 
> particularly timely. I'm doing a build now where the derailer/chainstay 
> kiss each other - or within a whisker or two of that so I've wondered, how 
> close is too close? Like you, I have the option of a perfectly functional 
> but less attractive shorter cage der but would prefer using the vintage 
> (silver of course) longer cage model. From the pictures it would appear the 
> CX-70-chainstay marriage is working out well so I have hopes for my combo.
>
> Thanks in advance for your thoughts!
>
> Best,
> Rich n ATL
>
> On Saturday, September 25, 2021 at 10:00:58 AM UTC-4 Paul Brodek wrote:
>
>> Forgot to mention the cassette spec is 10spd 11-30t, so 11/40 high and 
>> 30/24 low. High enough for me, plenty low for a mostly unloaded sled.
>>
>> 22.3lbs as is, with several spec subs that would get it into the 21lb+ 
>> range. Could go more modern and down in the 20s, but I like the older 
>> school look.
>>
>> And yeah, better to say "...clearance for 30mm tires..." since 32s are 
>> getting dicey.
>>
>> I had issues posting the photos, gotta click to view 'em, will see if 
>> cutting the [img] tags fixes that...
>>
>> Paul Brodek
>> Hillsdale, NJ USA
>>
>> On Friday, September 24, 2021 at 6:06:25 PM UTC-4 Paul Brodek wrote:
>>
>>> Old School time, a day late for Throwback Thursday, if that's still a 
>>> thing.
>>>
>>> '98 Riv Custom, built by Joe Starck, back in the day when 
>>> designing/building a short-reach caliper frame with rock-bottom brake shoes 
>>> ("Look out, Courageous, it's Rock Bottom!!!") and clearance for 32mm 700c 
>>> tires was a big f'in deal...
>>>
>> [snip] 
>>
>>>
>>> https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51218631413_cc5a80d181_k.jpg 
>>> 
>>>
>>> https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/51217707602_31d1bfcc06_k.jpg 
>>> 
>>>
>>> https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50365316941_c7a4475dda_k.jpg 
>>> 
>>>
>>> https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50440286627_b8fb4c3792_k.jpg 
>>> 
>>>
>>> https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/50440286327_bd34374447_k.jpg 
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>>

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Re: [RBW] brompton in airports and airlines

[Max S]

When I travelled internationally with a Brommie, I put it inside the Ikea 
tyvek bag you mentioned, with a bit of cardboard around it to provide some 
protection from bumps, etc. We had to check ours, however, possibly due to 
the fact there were two flights involved. Would be very curious to hear 
from others what their experience has been. 

- Max "unfolding events" in A2 

On Wednesday, July 14, 2021 at 5:55:54 PM UTC-4 boru...@gmail.com wrote:

> Thanks
> This is encouraging
> Thanks again
> Bo
>
> On Jul 14, 2021, at 11:15 AM, J L  wrote:
>
> Bo,
>
> This depends so much on the airline and the staff. That said, I have more 
> than once seen a brompton stashed in the overhead bin, no bag or anything. 
>
> I would stash mine in a tyvek bag. As long as it fits the size 
> requirements for carry on it should be alright. 
>
> Jason
>
> On Jul 14, 2021, at 11:00 AM, bo richardson  wrote:
>
> what do airlines typically do about bromptons
> i intend to travel to europe on condor
> if i take my brompton will they accept it in a ikea tyvec bag?
> i have the brompton travel case with wheels
> but it is heavy and  bulky
> and a sea anchor after i arrive.
>
> Or does one build a cardboard box around it?
>
> Thoughts experiences advice
>
> Thanks
>
> Bo
> Bellingham
>
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[RBW] Re: What draws you to a single speed bike?

[Max S]

Roberta, 
   I'd ridden SS / Fixed off and on just for the heck of it in past years – 
initially as a way to get a rideable bike out of a dumpster bike that had a 
busted derailer... Then in grad school, 'cos I wanted to tool around NYC 
all cool-like, as the messengers... "NOBR...AKES" 
Anyhow, I've recently got back into it again, mostly out of curiosity to 
keep up with a riding buddy who was riding his fixie a lot, nearly 
exclusively. Well... I've done close to 300 miles on a SS this year, about 
half (?) my miles so far. (In Michigan, the riding season is on the short 
side.) Rode 50 miles, only 1,500 ft of elevation gain total, on Sunday in 
single-speed mode, and 23 miles this morning in fixed... My average speeds 
have been mostly the same as on a geared bike similarly configured. 
One thing I noticed when riding fixed is that my position / fit on the bike 
gets sorted out real quick. I also noticed my pedaling load and cadence 
ranges expand. Aside from that, it's just got a nice simplicity :-) 

- Max "just one" in A2

On Monday, April 19, 2021 at 5:21:28 PM UTC-4 Tom Palmer wrote:

> Hi Roberta,
>
> The others have covered it well. For me it is just fun, like when I was a 
> kid riding my bike everywhere.
> I especially enjoy single speed mountain biking. 
>
> Tom Palmer
> Twin Lake, MI
>
> On Sunday, April 18, 2021 at 11:55:54 PM UTC-4 Roberta wrote:
>
>> I am truly curious.  How is it different than just not shifting?  How is 
>> it more fun?  When I was looking for a second Riv, Will (at Riv) suggested 
>> their single speed (I didn't do it).
>>
>> I had a 49 lb Raleigh LTD-3 for a few months prior to Riv, which had been 
>> converted it to a single speed.   I rode the bike around downtown for 
>> errands.  It was tons of fun, but Philadelphia is flat downtown, so SS was 
>> OK. I'd be concerned about any hills.
>>
>> Roberta
>>
>

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[RBW] Re: FS: Rivendell Starter Set for the 84PBH Person... Bundle... It's All The Craze

[Max S]

These are great great great bikes. Amazing deal! 

- Max "it took me years to get to this point" in A2

On Friday, April 9, 2021 at 11:17:24 AM UTC-4 Dave S wrote:

> ...and if someone wants to pedal that Hubba from Nashville to the jersey 
> shore, I'll take it off your hands when you get here!
>
> Dave
>
> On Thursday, April 8, 2021 at 6:48:21 PM UTC-4 Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
>> Man, what a haul.  If somebody picks up the bundle and wants to sell me 
>> the 58cm Quickbeam, I'm willing to play along...
>>
>> Bill Lindsay
>> El Cerrito, CA
>>
>> On Thursday, April 8, 2021 at 1:18:08 PM UTC-7 Karl wrote:
>>
>>> OK! So last year I began purging bikes and frames I had not ridden in 
>>> the past year. At first, it was painful... then I began feeling even better 
>>> about what I had kept and rode even more. So, this years effort:
>>>
>>> Must be picked up... I cannot ship all of this! I really want to sell it 
>>> all in one swoop! I can take better photos etc, but prefer to just let it 
>>> ride! I also sometimes miss reply here, so PM works best. 
>>>
>>> *Hubbuhubbuh- Small-* Complete Bike built by Rivendell. We were at WHQ 
>>> a few years back and bought this on a whim! I can attest to my marriage 
>>> surviving 3 rides! Good quality Rivendell stuff.
>>>
>>> *Rivendell Road Frame- 58cm*- fits 28's comfortably. Would make a great 
>>> go-go bike!
>>>
>>> *Rivendell Quickbeam Frame- 58cm*- This was a backup frame for "What if 
>>> something happens to my other one" but who am I kidding! 
>>>
>>> *Price: $3,000* picked up in Nashville or meet me close-ish I will 
>>> even throw in the dust for free!
>>>
>>> What's that, you say you would like wheels for both frames?? How about a 
>>> set of Phil Wood Cassette wheels for the 700 and a set of OG Quickbeam 
>>> wheels for the frame for an *[image: IMG_1325.jpeg]*... and I will 
>>> throw in a Baggins or Sackville bag. 
>>>
>>> Thanks for looking and as always... love all y'all!
>>>
>>> Karl 
>>> Nashville, TN
>>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: FS: customized '87 62cm FW Evans Frameset + Extras

[Max S]

Such a nice looking bike! If I wasn't flush, I'd def. would've gone for it 
– the size is about right for me... 

- Max "my flexibility varies with season" in A2

On Thursday, April 8, 2021 at 1:29:12 PM UTC-4 Andrew Turner wrote:

> After rebuilding the bike (new frame is stuck in customs) for a ride this 
> weekend, I've decided to keep it for now. Cheers! 
> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 7:48:11 PM UTC-5 Andrew Turner wrote:
>
>> actually, 57.5-58 TT. C-C. for both TT & ST. 
>>
>> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 7:45:39 PM UTC-5 Andrew Turner wrote:
>>
>>> Sorry, corrections on the frame measurements: 
>>> 63cm ST 
>>> 57cm TT 
>>> 21.5cm Headtube 
>>> Hub spacing: 100f, 130r 
>>> On Monday, April 5, 2021 at 2:29:56 PM UTC-5 Andrew Turner wrote:
>>>
 I'm going from having one multi-tool bike to two purpose-specific bikes 
 so I've decided to pass this one on. 
 It's an '87ish FW Evans, Reynolds 531 frame + fork, measuring 62cm ST, 
 58cm TT. It takes a 27.0 seatpost. It's been stripped and powdercoated RAL 
 8023. I created new downtube graphics and a matching brass headbadge. 
 Paint 
 is in decent shape, some chipping here and there from getting rowdy. 

 Frame modifications from Amigo Frameworks: 

- added pump peg to the seat stay
- thread the hole on the bottom bracket shell for the cable guide 
(the old one was riveted) 
- Chase bottom bracket threads 
- add a third waterbottle cage brazeon on the downtube for an 
anything cage or just to raise the bottle a bit.   
- add chainstay / seatstay*** bridge brazeons for easier fender 
install 
- add a front derailleur brazeon (lowered all the way fits well 
with a 46t big ring so you probably have a range from 44-50t if you 
 wanted 
a 2x or 3x setup.



- *** I drilled through the seatstay brazeon and did some filing to 
raise the fender line high enough to fit a 32mm tire comfortably so 
 there's 
some raw steel under the fender. 

 Frameset includes everything you see in the pictures: 

- A painted to match VO 31.8 80mm stem. Note that I cut the stem 
down and replaced the expander bolt with a titanium one. The top cap is 
 the 
green one SimWorks makes. This is as high as the stem can go! Sorry not 
sorry. 
- VO alloy 45mm fenders cut and filed to fit this frame. 
- Waxwing Bag Co mudflaps 
- Nitto M12 front rack 
- Dia-Compe 980 brakes w/ koolstop pads with plenty of life 
- VO 118mm bottom bracket (english threaded) 
- Paul gold moon units 
- Stronglight 1" threaded headset  
- everything else that's in the pictures but I forgot to mention

 Frame ride review: 
 A very comfortable, planted bike. Descending is easy and predictable. 
 Handles smallish loads very well. Without a load, the bike is sprightly 
 with easy steering. The bike can fit 35mm tires but it performs best with 
 32mm tires and lower..less pneumatic trail. Note that with 32mm tires and 
 fenders, you have to deflate the tire to remove the wheel. Overall, this 
 bike feels pretty similar to the Roadini but maybe less fork dampening. 
 Just a great, do everything kinda bike. I've done many 80 mile rides on it 
 coming home feeling A-Okay and ready for more. 

 Here  are the photos

 I'm asking $820 including shipping (CONUS)...it might take me a little 
 while to find a box but I'll get it out ASAP. I'm having a frame 
 (hopefully) delivered this week so I'm hoping to reuse that box. It'll 
 also 
 come more disassembled than what's pictured.

 Cheers! 
 Andrew



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Re: [RBW] Re: FS: Brand New Nitto RM-3 Drop Bars

[Max S]

What's the clamp diameter spec on this version?.. 

- Max "dirt that droppy bar" in A2

On Sunday, March 21, 2021 at 1:13:21 AM UTC-4 bria...@gmail.com wrote:

> Hey Philip,
>
> let me know if you want to pick it up. As you know, they're great bars. 
> just gotta divert these funds to break even on this canceled build i was 
> working on 
>
>
> thanks 
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> On Mar 20, 2021, at 9:04 PM, Philip Williamson  
> wrote:
>
> That’s a good bar and a good price.
>
> I’m tempted, but trying not to hoard or swoop on the good deals.
> There are two of them in my bike setup survey here: 
> https://www.instagram.com/p/CMno5xNBI60/?igshid=uz3s7r4nde5g, but the OG 
> WTB bar is exactly the same, and the the Midge bar is very similar. 
>
> Philip
> Santa Rosa, CA
>
>
>
> On Saturday, March 20, 2021 at 1:08:27 PM UTC-7 bria...@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> $78 shipped OBO. CONUS only. 
>>
>> Payment via Paypal friends and family (or add the fee).
>>
>> Pic: https://imgur.com/3RfKs6p
>>
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Re: [RBW] Re: To My Platypus People!

[Max S]

Congrats, Joyce! 

I inquired by phone this morning if I could just pay for one now, but was 
told that there ain't no such possibility until the frames are actually 
there "in a couple of weeks." I didn't press the issue. 

If anyone's got a Mustard Clem L in 52cm size to get rid of, ping me. 

- Max "I thought I had good phone manners, but..." in A2 

On Thursday, February 25, 2021 at 10:16:49 PM UTC-5 JAS wrote:

> I called Rivendell today, Grant answered the phone and I expressed my 
> sincere desire to get a Platypus and my worry that I’d miss out.  I asked 
> how I could make sure I got one and then this happened.he took my 
> credit card info right then and there for a frame of the size and color I 
> want.  YES!  Blue/green (sea foam green?), size 55cm.  Happy birthday to 
> me!  I won’t be riding it until long after my birthday, but it will always 
> be my birthday bike.
>
> So if you’re like me and can’t wait to get this process rolling, make the 
> call with your credit card in hand.  Grant said it helps to demonstrate 
> some bit of angst about making sure to get a frame (which apparently I did 
> in my opening comments to him).  You don’t have to beg, just show your 
> interest.  Good luck!
>
> #RivSisters Forever!
> —Joyce
>
> On Thursday, February 25, 2021 at 2:22:43 AM UTC-8 ascpgh wrote:
>
>>
>> I guess this is the modern version of what I experienced after going all 
>> in for an orange Rambouillet. I had a hard date (May 5, 2002) in Yorktown, 
>> VA where I was meeting three others to ride across the country. We'd 
>> planned for about a year and as I got serious, so did my concern for the 
>> fit of my Bridgestone RB--1 and days of 8-12 hour riding.
>>
>> I sought Grant's insight for fit advice and  possibly a custom but the 
>> Riv queue was longer. than my calendar. He mentioned a bike about to join 
>> to the Atlantis as a stock model with some French audax design inspiration 
>> that addressed some of my fit issues and sounded right for my needs. I 
>> bought in on a complete build and began the test of patience as I called 
>> for updates and learned about bare frame shipments, checking and prepping 
>> for paint, the whole finishing process in bulk and arrival of such finished 
>> stock to a small business who manually preps and builds bikes to then ship 
>> to paid customers. 
>>
>> This up front example of a new model information frees up the phones and 
>> the pandemic constrained personnel doing the work at Rivendell. I can't 
>> imagine the amount of effort necessary to keep all of us up to date, 
>> mindfully informed and satisfied with the clarity that they insist upon for 
>> everything else they are doing. I would think that each inquiring phone 
>> call would be almost as detail requisite as each actual sale and the energy 
>> that could be building bikes and physically moving endeavors forward would 
>> pale to their interest in meeting they concerned customers' questions about 
>> incoming goods. 
>>
>> I had great assistance from Grant et al when I chose my Rambouillet, I 
>> think I used an inordinate amount of their time following up on the process 
>> prior to it shipping to me painted, prepped and ready to ride. I think this 
>> has been a nice information forward process throughout.
>>
>> Andy Cheatham
>> Pittsburgh
>> On Wednesday, February 24, 2021 at 3:43:45 PM UTC-5 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>> Ding! wrote:
>>
>>> You know what I want to know? What happens next. 
>>>
>>> It seems to me that with this Platypus we have been let in on the secret 
>>> workings of things at Rivendell. I haven’t been around as long as many of 
>>> you, but I don’t remember being let behind the scenes like we have been 
>>> with this model. 
>>>
>>> We started with the drawings of the Anniversary Mixte, which then 
>>> morphed into a “fancy Cheviot” which then became the Platypus. It was an 
>>> interesting evolution, and fun to speculate over. Until this bike, I didn’t 
>>> know what color tubes were, but Will is holding them in the sunlight in 
>>> Blilver and Limolive on the product page and now we know how Rivendell 
>>> judges color samples. We were provided the tracking for the cargo ship, the 
>>> Unicorn, so we could watch the bikes’ arrival to American shores. And...now 
>>> what happens next?
>>>
>>> The ship is “at anchor” near LA. Does it have to sit out in the harbor 
>>> until it takes its turn at the dock? Who fetches the cargo? UPS? How long 
>>> does it take for cargo to make its way to Walnut Creek? And when it 
>>> arrives, how soon can it be sorted and sent out to PlatyPeople? 
>>>
>>> Leah
>>>
>>> Sent from my iPad
>>>
>>> On Feb 23, 2021, at 9:16 AM, Ride for Fun  wrote:
>>>
>>> 
>>>
>>> From Taiwan to Japan is a lot faster & easier than to the US.  
>>>
>>> On Tue, Feb 23, 2021 at 1:08 AM Michael Baquerizo  
>>> wrote:
>>>
 As a product person - it's wild that Blue Lug is getting these frames 
 and releasing them into the wild before Riv has a chance 

Re: [RBW] Re: WTB: Clem Smith Jr. L 59cm Mustard

[Max S]

Nice example, Gabe. If it was a Medium (52cm) L, I'd be callin'! :-) 

- Max "what food fits between orange creamsicle and key lime soufflé?.." in 
A2

On Friday, February 12, 2021 at 6:14:40 PM UTC-5 Gabe Thompson wrote:

> I've got a Clem L 59 in mustard. I would maybe sell it if the price is 
> right. PM me if interested[image: 
> 3C0DD250-4C3B-4F90-9707-5A561E10555C.jpeg]
>
>
> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 6:24:14 AM UTC-8 Ray wrote:
>
>> Joe -- That's very interesting. I don't think that would have done it in 
>> my case, but it's good to know for the future.
>>
>> Collin -- Yes! It is the one you sold me. No worries, I got it sorted out 
>> and thanks again. Some might disagree with this move, but I actually had my 
>> LBS ream out just a small amount of material from the downtube so that a 
>> 27mm fit the lug/clamp as well. I did talk to someone at Riv who generously 
>> offered to do the same knurling for free even though it was secondhand. But 
>> I change my fit too often and sometimes my partner or guests borrow my 
>> bikes so I wanted it to function at more than just one height. All worked 
>> out in the end--no issues at all anymore.
>>
>> On Thursday, February 11, 2021 at 7:17:42 AM UTC-6 Mark Roland wrote:
>>
>>> At that price, shipped overseas (again) you could start to consider a 
>>> Susie. Truly beautiful bikes in person, and can do everything a Clem can, 
>>> plus a bit more tire room.  Considering how long you will have the bike, 
>>> worth it no question. Also splits the difference top tube-wise between a 
>>> Clem L and a Clem H!
>>>
>>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 6:22:30 PM UTC-5 BRETT ROBINSON wrote:
>>>
 Whoa, nice. Quite the premium for mustard, but may go this route if 
 nothing better pops up. Thanks!

 On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 2:07:23 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding 
 Ding! wrote:

>
> https://global.bluelug.com/rivendell-clem-smith-jr-frame-set-h-style-mustard.html
>
>
> Sent from my iPad
>
> On Feb 10, 2021, at 1:58 PM, BRETT ROBINSON  wrote:
>
> In that case, anyone have a 59cm Clementine/Clem L (any color), OR, a 
> 59cm Clem H in mustard? Wanting a step through but I'd consider a 59 H in 
> mustard.
>
>
> Also interested in a Rosco Bubbe mixte if anyone is selling.
>
> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:12:25 PM UTC-8 Joe Bernard wrote:
>
>> Brett,
>>
>> No mustard L's that I'm aware of. My recollection is there was a 
>> mustard H and orange L in that batch. 
>>
>> On Wednesday, February 10, 2021 at 1:05:06 PM UTC-8 BRETT ROBINSON 
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Leah
>>>
>>> It's well loved, does duty most days as a school bus or errand 
>>> runner.
>>>
>>> By the way, anyone know if 59cm Clem L in mustard was a combo Riv 
>>> produced? Realizing I've never seen a pic of one. Did they only make 
>>> this 
>>> in the H version, or are there L's floating around out there?
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 7:52:47 PM UTC-8 Bicycle Belle Ding 
>>> Ding! wrote:
>>>

 Things That Warm the Heart of Leah Peterson: that’s where to file 
 this. ♥️ I’m so glad the Betty is loved. That was at the top of my 
 list. 
 L
 On Tuesday, February 9, 2021 at 7:19:15 PM UTC-8 BRETT ROBINSON 
 wrote:

> Looking for a 59 cm Clem L, in mustard (butterscotch? butternut? 
> whatever it's called, you know the one!). My wife is tired of me 
> stealing 
> her Betty Foy that I bought for her from bicyclebelle last year.

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Re: [RBW] Tubing Specs for Riv Frames

[Max S]

Resurrecting an old thread – Mainly wondering about the differences between 
Simple One and Quick Beam frames, and also if there were any step-ups in 
thickness with frame size (e.g. 58 to 60 to 62). Anyone know? 

- Max "where's the ultrasound probe when you need one" in A2

On Friday, August 26, 2011 at 11:50:04 AM UTC-4 Matt B. wrote:

> While tubing names may not matter among high-quality tubes, I think wall 
> thickness can be good to know, especially with OS tubing which IMO can be 
> dent-prone if the walls are too thin.There's a post on the Rivendell 
> site somewhere about the specs for the AHH-   IIRC it has 8/5/8 top and 
> down tubes and has .76 wall chainstays.The Atlantis, Simple One, and SH 
> frames I think all use 9/6/9 guage tubing.I think the Quickbeam has 
> 8/5/8 tubing like the AHH, and the Bombadil has either 1/7/1 or 
> straight-guage tubing, I'm not sure.   I hope it's straight guage though.   
> The Roadeo has the thinnest wall tubing but I'm not sure how thin... 
> .65/.45/.65? for the top and down tubes maybe.
>

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[RBW] ISO: Orange or Mustard Clementine in 52cm

[Max S]

This close to taking up Laing's offer of a step-through, but there's a 
THIIS big of a chance it'd get repainted, so wondering... anyone want 
to sell their warm-colored Clementine in anticipation of the Plat or 
otherwise?.. 

- Max "step through to something new" in A2 

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[RBW] WTB: Susie (56) / Cheviot (60) in a warm color

[Max S]

If anyone wants to unload their Susie (56) / Cheviot (60) in a warm color 
(yellow mustard orange red purple), in anticipation of the Platypus, let me 
know. :-) 

Thanks! 

- Max "Platypus would be ok too but the color..." in A2 

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[RBW] Cantilever brake recommendations

[Max S]

On the eBay, even the old Alivio / STX / LX low profile cantis work great and 
can be had cheap cheap cheap. With the right set of tools and instructions 
(e.g. an Allen key, a 10mm box wrench, a rubber band for toe-in, and maybe a 
3-rd hand tool), set up can be systematic and trouble-free. Using the “cross” 
pads in posted holders means you can simply slide new pads in as they wear. 

Of the newer choices, Tektro 720 are fine, Shimano CX-50 are good, too. TRP or 
Avid Ultimate Shorty have their followers and are not quite as pricey as Paul. 

I do like the direct wiring and super simple set up of V / mini-V brakes more 
than all this extra stuff of cable stops and straddle wires, but choice of 
suitable drop bar brake levers can be quite limited. 

- Max “they all work, might as well try and see what you like” in A2 

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[RBW] PSA: Cheap fenders killed my bike.

[Max S]

Big bummer. Glad you’re ok! 

Couple of BOBs down-under might help sort out rebuild possibilities, but maybe 
give Darrell a call?.. Even if location doesn’t work, he could suggest 
alternatives?.. 

http://llewellynbikes.com/

- Max “keep it rubber side centripetally oriented” in A2

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[RBW] Touring the Highland Cathedral's flowers with the Little Flower of Lisieux

[Max S]

Lovely. Thank you for turning your mind, eye, and lens to the beautiful. And 
sharing. 

- Max “...” in A2

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[RBW] Quickbeam Custom Paint Color Help

[Max S]

The Japanese color palette is just lovely. Highly recommend. Check out some 
Ebisu bikes for examples of how it looks on a bike. 

- Max “pea soup green, oxidized mustard, ox blood, periwinkle, light gray, 
burnt orange...” in A2

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Re: [RBW] Tubulars on Rivendells

[Max S]

Well... a few (somewhat) younger folks still riding them, I should hope, self 
included! 

I’ve ridden tubulars off and on for ~25 years now, mostly 22 mm road tires. In 
the last 3-4 years, I’ve been really enjoying 32 mm Vittoria XN, intended for 
dry hardpack cross courses, riding them on a mix of dirt roads and paved roads. 
I recently also tried a clincher version of the same tire, albeit with butyl 
tubes (the sewups have latex). They’re nice, but the sewups are cushier and the 
whole wheelset is a bit lighter, FWIW. 

If you’re a handy and curious sort and haven’t tried tubulars, I do recommend 
giving them a try. Plenty of rim brake wheels should be available for 
relatively cheap, as folks switch to disc brakes and tubeless, and high quality 
tires 27 mm and wider are available for good prices. If you’d like to get a 
racer-y type of bike with narrow clearances to handle a wider range of terrain, 
or give it more comfort, tubulars with latex tubes may be a good way to go. 

Sourcing tubulars from the UK shops used to be very cost-effective (e.g. 4+ at 
a time), but even Excel offers decent prices from time to time. For glue, I 
recommend Mastik 1, which has been found in a scientific study to work best. 
(Carogna tubular mounting tape has been popular lately, for its relative speed 
and cleanliness, but I enjoy the meditative hour or so it takes to refresh the 
glue in a rim, a couple of coats on the tires, and mounting.) 

Enjoy the ride! 

- Max “old skool” in A2 

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Re: [RBW] Just Pics from Your Good Ride Thread

[Max S]

Highly endorse looking through classic photo books and learning by osmosis. A 
few instructional books from the library (when they reopen?), or something 
like: “Why Photographs Work” might help you find your style. Also recommend a 
simple digital camera — iPhone with the grid enabled is one extreme, a Fuji XT 
in full manual mode is another that forces the learning process. (Everything 
else is too expensive and takes too long - and I own and still shoot 4 film 
cameras, in addition to digital.) 

Even aesthetic endeavors are not without rules or best practices! 

- Max “picture this” in A2 

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Re: [RBW] Re: WTB quickbeam or simple one

[Max S]

One data point to the contrary:  Green SO with 3 sets of eyelets front and 3 
rear. But it’s monochromatic - no cream HT, so maybe a repaint?.. 

- Max “if only the farmers market could open” in A2

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Re: [RBW] Nitto wire guard

[Max S]

Ha! I was the one that pointed to the device, only because I was hoping to 
order one from Riv a week ago when placing an order for other things. Alas they 
didn’t have it in stock, and I - unexpectedly - was able to source one locally. 

Max “hurrah for little wires bent in intricate ways” in A2 

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[RBW] Re: Bucephalus

[Max S]

Nice read. Thank you! 

Stopped to fix a flat yesterday and was passed by an older gentleman on a 
bike much like the one Birchmore rode. :-) 

- Max "no school like old skool" in A2

On Tuesday, May 26, 2020 at 3:31:42 PM UTC-4, Tom M wrote:
>
> This article (
> https://lithub.com/the-amateur-cyclist-who-biked-around-the-world/) talks 
> about Fred Birchmore, who biked around the world on a single-speed bike. 
> Remarkable man. The bike pictured in the article appears to my eye to have 
> similar clearances to current Riv models, though a level top tube. 
> Handlebars above the seat, sprung saddle, rack and fenders, bottle dynamo 
> light.
> Tom Milani
> Alexandria, VA
>

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[RBW] Re: Clem PreSale

[Max S]

Or "plapytus" – I do like the silly sound of it. :-) 

- Max "what's in a name?" in A2

On Monday, May 25, 2020 at 8:56:26 AM UTC-4, Mark Roland wrote:
>
> With  Grant's fondness for anagrams, maybe Patyplus? Could spell it Patti 
> Pluss on the other side...
>
> On Monday, May 25, 2020 at 5:32:33 AM UTC-4, Garth wrote:
>>
>>
>> Platypus bottles are a trademark of Cascade Designs, the company that 
>> makes Therma-Rest sleeping pads and who holds a bunch of other trademarks 
>> for their brands and products. 
>>
>> https://trademarks.justia.com/750/33/platypus-75033060.html
>>
>> https://trademarks.justia.com/owners/cascade-designs-inc-199596/
>>
>> Searching for the name Playpus lists a whole lotta trademarks. 
>> https://trademarks.justia.com/search?q=platypus
>>
>> So clearly CD designs doesn't have sole "rights" to use the name 
>> Platypus. CD's classification is under "Environmental control apparatus".
>>
>> Under "Sporting Goods and Toys" there a fishing tackle brand named 
>> Platypus, that's all. 
>>
>>
>> Well that was fun ! 
>>
>>
>>
>>

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[RBW] Re: Handling Effects of Shorter Stems (from the OT discussion in a previuos post on the New Sams in Sept)

[Max S]

He does build all these things himself and does his own test 
<https://www.peterverdone.com/cushcore/> "flights" and isn't shy about 
relating failures (can't find the link, but there was a recent crash 
involving his own carbon/metal bar and broken bones). 

If you scroll down in this post, he shows a good comparison of rider 
contact points and where the wheels end up: 
https://www.peterverdone.com/baron-review-offroad/ 

In some ways, I agree that his style is a bit more cocky / confident / 
declarative than warranted. In other ways, I find it a bit more palatable 
than the all-too-non-committal, "everything is subjective" style that I 
think is more the current trend. But we're getting into philosophy... I'd 
love to ride one of his bikes, although my riding currently doesn't include 
"getting rad" offroad. 

- Max "feeling fast in my WFH lounger" in A2


On Friday, May 22, 2020 at 2:29:53 PM UTC-4, Bill Lindsay wrote:
>
> That Peter Verdone guy has a very 2020 rhetorical style.  Paraphrasing:
>
> -Here's the way things are
> -Anybody who disagrees with me is uninformed
>
> He may be totally right on many/most points.  I guess if his objective is 
> to improve his designs for an audience of one (himself), then he doesn't 
> need to be persuasive or humble.  
>
> That said I'd totally love to ride that Bird of Prey bike.
>
> Bill Lindsay
> El Cerrito, CA
>
> On Friday, May 22, 2020 at 10:44:46 AM UTC-7, Max S wrote:
>>
>> http://www.peterverdone.com/some-bikes-are-more-evil-than-others/ 
>>
>> http://www.peterverdone.com/airspeeder/ 
>>
>> http://www.peterverdone.com/2018-pvd-bird-of-prey/ 
>>
>> - Max “color me intrigued” in A2
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Handling Effects of Shorter Stems (from the OT discussion in a previuos post on the New Sams in Sept)

[Max S]

http://www.peterverdone.com/some-bikes-are-more-evil-than-others/

http://www.peterverdone.com/airspeeder/

http://www.peterverdone.com/2018-pvd-bird-of-prey/

- Max “color me intrigued” in A2

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[RBW] Re: It’s dull around here, let me bring some color

[Max S]

Hope you are reunited with the bike soon! 

To be honest, this WFH period combined with a string of cold / rainy days 
and weeks devastated my bike-budget. Not because the bikes aren't "dialed 
in", but because this is basically my knitting. My better half knits with 
yarn and needles, I knit with bike frames and parts. It calms the nerves 
better than alcohol (e.g. without the drowsiness), and thus doubles as 
psychotherapy. 

- Max "gluing tubulars is my form of acid trip" in A2 

PS: I hear that in knitting circles, there's an acronym – SABLE (go look it 
up) – there is sometimes an equivalent side-effect of endless 
bike-tinkering. Good to know bike-nuts aren't the only ones with this 
problem... 


On Wednesday, May 20, 2020 at 9:41:10 PM UTC-4, Bicycle Belle Ding Ding! 
wrote:
>
> Friends, 
>
> I have one bike to ride. It’s a Clementine with mostly stock parts, and 
> it’s heavy. 
>
> I love it. 
>
> I have been riding nearly every day and I’ve got 997.9 miles on it for 
> 2020! The hills here are brutal, and the temps are approaching triple 
> digits. So, I want to ride at night, and I want to get up the hills more 
> easily. James and Candice at Analog Cycles in Vermont have showcased their 
> beautiful work on Instagram, and I’ve long been an admirer. #RivSister 
> Roberta knows them and had planned to have them do similar work on her 
> Appaloosa (I’m sure she’ll delight us with her story here when the time 
> comes), and because we girls tend to stick together, I got in touch with 
> Analog. Dyno lighting and lighter wheels with tubeless tires were what was 
> decided. 
>
> So, here’s one photo from Analog that can’t do these wheels one whit of 
> justice; the wheels arrived today and they are showstoppers in real life. I 
> am going to follow up right after this post with a video (2nd post 
> necessary for video to work, I don’t know why) that you can access if you 
> choose to download it. The video is the only way to really capture any of 
> the beauty in these wheels. I told them to go wild with color, and they 
> did. I think the bold colors and patterns capture the zany nature of a 
> Clem. 
>
> Don’t ask me what all the details are, who KNOWS, this is me you’re 
> talking to. I do know I got tubeless Gravel Kings (Evan Elliot, I think 
> these were your suggestion months ago), something about machined sidewalls, 
> Shutter Precision/Edelux II, Son rear light. Oh, enough, what really 
> matters here is there are COLORED SPOKE NIPPLES AND VALVE STEMS. And guess 
> what they do? They fade into other colors because Analog is a straight-up 
> master of color. These wheels are a lot, which is saying something for a 
> woman whose favorite color is sparkle. I LOVE them. More is more. Too much 
> is enough. And so on... 
>
> Tomorrow, I’m taking my bike in for a list of stuff I’m having done to it, 
> and I really hope the mechanics know how to set up dyno lighting - I’ve 
> been burned by Vegas bike shops before, and this is a new shop for me. See 
> the Wiggly Fender thread.  
>
> More later when everything is on the bike and I have gotten to ride it. 
>
> Thanks for looking, this is made even more fun in the presence of like 
> minds. 
> Leah 
>
>
>

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[RBW] Re: Help Pimp My Quickbeam

[Max S]

I will echo what Scott here said. I've converted a few bikes to single 
speed / fixed gear, and simplicity has been key. I personally rarely 
flipped the wheels or switched to a different chainring mid-ride – it sort 
of defeated the purpose of the whole thing for me. That said, maybe my 
conversions weren't really set up very well for the convenience of the 
"switching". 

I just got a SimpleOne (thanks, another Max!) and it's set up to do these 
switches more easily, so I'll experiment with it. Although my hunch is that 
for 99% of the rides I intend to do with it ("easy ride with family", "go 
get ice cream", "pick up coffee and bread and cheese", "quickie / 
pick-me-up at sunrise / sunset", 
"commute-to-work-in-too-low-a-gear-so-I-am-not-getting-all-sweaty"), 
picking one gear for the season (e.g. 63" for winter and 72" for summer) 
and sticking with it will be the way to go. 

The conundrum to me right now is what fenders to use – track ends are a 
royal pain with fenders, if you ask me. But if I'm "fixing" the gear, then 
it's less of a pain. 

- Max "don't break / brake it if it's fixed" in A2


On Thursday, May 21, 2020 at 9:57:41 AM UTC-4, greenteadrinkers wrote:
>
> I'd suggest keeping it as simple as you possible can. I have a SimpleOne, 
> which I do love. This past spring I commissioned my LBS to build a high end 
> wheel set, Paul track hubs, Cliffhanger rims, Compass Hurricane Pass tires. 
> There's a White Industries 16/19 in the back, Sugino 40/32 up front. For 
> flats, I've found the 40/16 is all I need. Trails, the 32/19, is great, 
> challenging, but great. For bars, the Jitensha flat bar, sounds like drops 
> suit your needs better. In Tucson, do you need fenders? For stuff, I throw 
> on a Carradice long flap hung off a B17, otherwise, I keep it simple, no 
> racks, none of the usual part barnacles (I'm a minimalist). The best 
> thing I did part-wise, was invest in a great wheel set. If you're doing 
> some long commutes, consider investing in a top shelf wheel set, possibly 
> with a nice dyno light rig. On another note, Riv. really had a winner 
> with the SimpleOne, it's a wonder it did't catch on, maybe folks wanted it 
> to be a QuickBeam, I know I did at the time. Now, with that wheel set, and 
> those Compass tires, I can't get off it. It's a juvenile delinquent BMX 
> time machine. Next up , I'd love to find a Hunqapillar, then, I'd have the 
> trifecta, SimpleOne, S. Hillborne (currently being built up at Analog), 
> Hunqapillar. Hope all this noise helps.
> Scott
>
>
> On Wednesday, May 20, 2020 at 9:00:05 PM UTC-4, Scott Calhoun wrote:
>
>> And by pimp I mean, "make into a functional and kinda handsome bicycle." 
>> I always wanted a Quickbeam, and I've just missed a few for sale here. Last 
>> week a friend alerted me that our own Reid Echols was putting out feelers 
>> on Instagram about selling his 64cm QB. Long story short, a frameset is 
>> headed my way.
>>
>> In preparation, I've been futzing in the parts bins, and thinking about 
>> the build. I realized that it's been a good long while since I built up a 
>> single speed--way back in 2011 when I did up a dumpster find Trek 720 frame 
>> for my daughter's college bike. I'm getting the F/F/HS, so I have some 
>> decisions to make. The frame has been re-spaced in the rear to 130mm OLN.
>>
>> A bit of info about my likely use-case scenarios. I live about 16 miles 
>> from the center of town, and almost all my rides are longish. I do run 
>> errands to the Post Office (7 miles round trip) and store (around 12), but 
>> most of my rides are at least 25 miles. I'll also jump on dirt roads when I 
>> can. Tucson is pretty flat in the valley, but we are surrounded on all 
>> sides by mountains. If I want to climb, I can. On my geared bikes, my 
>> average speed is16.5-18.5mph for rides up to 65 miles or so (I mention this 
>> only for purposes of helping me decide gearing--see below).
>>
>> Parts I have:
>>
>>- SKF 110 bottom bracket
>>- Beat up but functional Campy Record Double 172.5 crankset 135bcd 
>>with various rings, mostly of the 53/39 variety
>>- Nitto F32 front Rack just picked up from RBW member Joe Lonner
>>- A set of vintage Mafac Canti brakes f/r
>>- A nice light set silver set of Ritchey Classic tubeless compatible 
>>wheels (1440 grams!)
>>- Nitto Pearl 100mm stem, maybe a 110 too
>>- Nitto Noodle 46cm (or maybe 44cm?) bars
>>- Gravel King SK 38mm and 43mm TLC tires (a pair of each)
>>
>> Reid had it built at least two ways, both really attractive to my eye 
>> (photos to follow): one with drops, one with risers. Seeing that I have 
>> Noodles already, I'll likely just use those initially. I'm generally a drop 
>> bar guy anyhow. So, my main questions are drivetrain/gearing.
>>
>>- Should I keep the rear spacing at 130mm and use a Surly Speed 
>>Spacer kit: https://surlybikes.com/parts/spacer_kit
>>- Or respace to 120mm (I also have a 120 fixed/free hub 

[RBW] Re: PSA legolas

[Max S]

>From one Max to another, just buy the thing and live the dream! 

- Max "ask me how I know" in A2

On Wednesday, May 20, 2020 at 11:01:49 PM UTC-4, maxcr wrote:
>
> No connection to the seller, wish it was bigger: 
> https://boston.craigslist.org/bmw/bik/d/weston-rivendell-legolas-lugged-steel/7127317892.html
>  
> Max, lusting after a bike I don’t need

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