Re: [Biofuel] wind and current power
Hi Zeke,On 9/14/05, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That monitoring station suggested to me that such a flying platform could... On a philosophical level, I often wonder why people are so excitedabout fancy new ideas like fusion, or flying wind turbines, etc.Isit that we hope to engineer a technological solution to ourenvironmental/social problems?As an engineer, I happen to like technology too.But scientists have already made PV modules, carsthat can get 80mpg on vegetable oil, superefficient lighting, etc.Pretty neat stuff I think, but for the most part, no one uses them!!! Why would we assume that the next new technology to save us from ourselves would be accepted any better than what has already beeninvented?I just find this societal facination with new technology, at the sametime we refuse to actually use new technology, rather paradoxical. Oh man, it's a fair cop! You're absolutely right. I'm an engineer and constant tinker, love the blue sky tech. but try to make my production designs as simple and sturdy as possible. Remember all those wacko ideas that showed up in the pulp magazines? I loved to spend time at my grandparent's place, partly because they had a huge cache of post-war Popular Mechanics, along with the usual cubic yard of National Geographic. I pored over those rags as a little girl, wondering why the personal gyrocopter, invented 25 years before, still wasn't in everyone's driveway. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel Manufacture using KOH
Hello Ken, Sean Sean Brady writes: I am using KOH as catalyst, and most of the literature I have read is based on using NaOH as catalyst. I believe that 3,5g NaOH per litre oil is the minimum amount of catalyst needed for unused oil and increases as your feedstock oil is more used (WVO). Correct, although some informal studies suggest that yields increase, even with clean oil, up to about 4.5g NaOH per liter oil. Ho-hum. The basic lye quantity -- 3.5 grams? http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#lye3.5 From what I can determine, 9g KOH per litre unused oil is the minimum amount of catalyst needed. Has anybody tried using KOH to confirm this? I use it all the time, and 9g/l is way too much for clean oil, unless you're using ethanol instead of methanol. An OH- concentration equivalent to 3.5g/l NaOH only requires 4.9g/l KOH. We also use it all the time, and indeed 9g/l is way too much for new oil. 3.5g/l NaOH is equivalent to 4.9g/l KOH at 100% strength, but KOH is never 100%, highest is 92%, or 85%, which works just fine. So you have to adjust for purity as well. KOH is not as strong as NaOH -- use 1.4 times as much KOH (actually 1.4025 times). Titration is the same, just use a 0.1% w/v KOH solution instead of NaOH solution, and use 1 gm of KOH for every milliliter of 0.1% solution used in the titration. But instead of the basic 3.5 grams of NaOH lye per liter of oil, use 3.5 x 1.4 = 4.9 grams of KOH. So, if your titration was 5 ml, use 5 + 4.9 = 9.9 gm KOH per liter of oil. One more complication -- check the purity of your KOH, it's generally not as pure as NaOH. Anhydrous grade KOH flake is usually about 92%, sometimes less -- check the label. We use half-pearls assayed at 85%. Adjust the basic quantity accordingly: the basic 4.9 grams would be 5.8 (5.775) grams for 85% KOH, or 5.3 (5.33) grams for 92% KOH. KOH dissolves in methanol much more easily than NaOH does, and doesn't clump together as NaOH can do. http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_make2.html#lye More about lye Also, I recently read on J to F about the concept of back cracking when too much catalyst is used in the reaction I doubt this is really much of a problem in the real world -- I defer to others' FIRSTHAND exper- ience here. My guess is the excess of alcohol plus the tendency of OH- to drop out of the picture into the aqueous phase will usually guarantee the forward direction of the reaction we want. This is what it says at JtF about back cracking, on a page about home-brewers meeting the US ASTM standards: E) Kinematic viscosity (1.9 - 6.0 mm2/s at 40 deg C) will also be a non-problem if the total glycerin content (Items C D) has been resolved and the acid number is not elevated by imprudent use of caustic, causing back cracking of esters to FFAs (higher viscosity than B-100). http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_ASTM.html Standards and the homebrewer: Journey to Forever Another way to make the reaction go into reverse is to remove the excess methanol at the end of the process before settling and draining the glycerine by-product. Otherwise, yes Ken, I also like the real world. :-) Best wishes Keith -K ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Draft US Defense Paper Outlines Preventive Nuclear Strikes
Yeah no doubt Pat Robertson could think of ways to kill two birds with one stone.. Joe David Miller wrote: Tom Irwin wrote: Someone ought to tell them that nuclear winter doesn't negate global warming. Are you sure about that? Maybe they'd balance each other out. ;-) Let's not suggest it as a possibility or we'll have people suggesting nuclear war as a solution to global warming. --- David ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Wash speed
Hello everyone I'm asking for solutions in decreasing the time required for the wash stage in biodiesel manufacturing. In the present I use bubble wash and a quantity of water of 0,3 liters per liter of biodiesel. Is this correct? Normaly in three washes the product is ready for the next step, but the time required for this slows down the process. Any sugestions? Thanks __ Porque insiste em pagar o dobro? Compare o preço da sua ligação à Internet http://acesso.portugalmail.pt/maisbarato ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Wash speed
Hello everyone I'm asking for solutions in decreasing the time required for the wash stage in biodiesel manufacturing. In the present I use bubble wash and a quantity of water of 0,3 liters per liter of biodiesel. Is this correct? Normaly in three washes the product is ready for the next step, but the time required for this slows down the process. Any sugestions? Thanks See: Stir washing http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash.html#stir Frequently Asked Question: Is there a way to speed-up the water-biodiesel wash? I've read the bubble washing techniques and understand it, but for the best quality of biodiesel, it can take up to a week, with several washes. Answer: You can speed up the washing process considerably. It involves the following... Subsequent comment: Todd, I had a chance to try your 'fast' wash method today (35 gal white poly drum) with a simple 55 gal drum mixer and wanted to thank you for the time you just gave back to me! Success! At least for me, this procedure is much better and faster to wash biodiesel this way, compared to the bubble-wash method. Just five minutes of 'appearing homogenous' and allowing the 1 hour settling, drained-off and replaced the water and repeated for a total of three wash cycles. The water and biodiesel layers are currently clear and it's settling for 24 hours. Excellent separation, no emulsion! -- Kevin Shea at the Biofuel mailing list. [more] Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC
Hello, Is there anyone out there that makes biodiesel in upstate SC or northeast Georgia? I am just starting to become interested in making biodiesel and I would really like to see the process first hand if possible. If there is no one, then wish me luck in becoming one of the firsts in my region to do this! I will have many questions, so I hope there are plenty out there that are willing to help. Thanks, Bobby Clark ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC
Hi Bobby, I'd be glad to help you. I'm very near Columbus, GA. Your choice. I have lots of room for you to camp at my place. Michael Lendzian CINS Network Support Team Columbus State University CINS/Center for Commerce Technology Room 105 706.569.3044 (help desk) - Original Message - From: Bobby Clark [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thursday, September 15, 2005 9:58 am Subject: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC Hello, Is there anyone out there that makes biodiesel in upstate SC or northeast Georgia? I am just starting to become interested in making biodiesel and I would really like to see the process first hand if possible. If there is no one, then wish me luck in becoming one of the firsts in my region to do this! I will have many questions, so I hope there are plenty out there that are willing to help. Thanks, Bobby Clark ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.or g Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Crack computer input with tape of typing
Average person has no idea of how they have no security. --Kirk http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~tygar/papers/Keyboard_Acoustic_Emanations_Revisited/preprint.pdf Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] It's come to this?
http://slashdot.org/articles/05/09/14/2355223.shtml?tid=133tid=126 ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] It's come to this?
Yep, a Friend sent me this story as well. I asked, Is this another magic box similar to changing world technology's? http://www.globalfinest.com/tech/ Brian Rodgers ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Question about E85
Does anyone know if anything has to be done to the fuel system if you're planning on running E-85 in your vehicle? I have heard conflicting stories. I have a 2001 Chevy Impala that I would fill up with E85. I've been using 10% Ethanol with no problems. Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thank you! Angela Cook ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] It's come to this?
Hmmm... maybe we can start using roadkill instead of cats? That is, unless you are from WV and decide to eat yours instead... Drew On 9/15/05, Mike Weaver [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: http://slashdot.org/articles/05/09/14/2355223.shtml?tid=133tid=126 ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] BD anti gel
As it is mid September in Wisconsin our temperature this morning was 45F/ 7C. I have been using BD for the past several months with good results. I would like to continue using BD into the colder months. After looking at the antigel products listed at JTF the Wintron product seems to be cost prohibitive. The Lubrizol rep. quoted me a price of $22 per gal. A good price but the only package they offer is a 55 gallon drum. Artic Express has a 2-2.5 gallon package. I am having a hard time with thedealer that handles their product in my area. Does anyone have a source for any of these products? Is there someone out there that bought 55 gallons of Lubrizol that would be willing to sell 5 gallons? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC
Lot's of us lurking, but haven't tried it yet... :-) I know of at least five here in Greenville, SC. Jerry ---Original Message--- From: Bobby Clark Date: 09/15/05 10:29:58 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC Hello, Is there anyone out there that makes biodiesel in upstate SC or northeast Georgia? I am just starting to become interested in making biodiesel and I would really like to see the process first hand if possible. If there is no one, then wish me luck in becoming one of the firsts in my region to do this! I will have many questions, so I hope there are plenty out there that are willing to help. Thanks, Bobby Clark ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.25/102 - Release Date: 9/14/2005 . ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Wash speed
I'm Famous! Yes this way has worked for me. I can only stress to be sure to have your completed wash batch free of water in the end. Mainly due to damage to your injector-pump and engine components (over time). It is the fuel that lubricates the injector pump and poor lubrication could lead to a replacement injector pump. Ex. my pump on my Isuzu NPR is made by Bosch and if for some reason if it fails, I cannot repair myself. I must bring the whole vehicle to an authorized Bosch location for removal as it requires special tools. A bench test of the pump is $500.00 to replace it is $2500.00. This was quoted by Isuzu Motor Corp I'm not sure what it would cost for other diesel makes and models, so I can only relate to what has warned me produce good quality (dry) fuel. My advice would to make several lots of BD fuel and let them sit after the wash process for 2-weeks. Decanter from the top and leave the base! Water is the enemy! -Kevin Shea - Original Message - From: Keith Addison [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 8:43 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Wash speed Hello everyone I'm asking for solutions in decreasing the time required for the wash stage in biodiesel manufacturing. In the present I use bubble wash and a quantity of water of 0,3 liters per liter of biodiesel. Is this correct? Normaly in three washes the product is ready for the next step, but the time required for this slows down the process. Any sugestions? Thanks See: Stir washing http://journeytoforever.org/biodiesel_bubblewash.html#stir Frequently Asked Question: Is there a way to speed-up the water-biodiesel wash? I've read the bubble washing techniques and understand it, but for the best quality of biodiesel, it can take up to a week, with several washes. Answer: You can speed up the washing process considerably. It involves the following... Subsequent comment: Todd, I had a chance to try your 'fast' wash method today (35 gal white poly drum) with a simple 55 gal drum mixer and wanted to thank you for the time you just gave back to me! Success! At least for me, this procedure is much better and faster to wash biodiesel this way, compared to the bubble-wash method. Just five minutes of 'appearing homogenous' and allowing the 1 hour settling, drained-off and replaced the water and repeated for a total of three wash cycles. The water and biodiesel layers are currently clear and it's settling for 24 hours. Excellent separation, no emulsion! -- Kevin Shea at the Biofuel mailing list. [more] Best wishes Keith ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Question about E85
Angela, the fuel system of your car will most likely not tolerate more than 30% E85 in gasoline. The "black box" has to be adjusted to increase the highest possible fuel amount to be injected. I think that the easiest way is to get a car with a carburettor, and enlarge the main injector to a proper size, which means making it 30-40% wider. But that car will not be able to run on pure gasoline again, unless you switch back to the original main injector. Be aware that some fuel pums disapprove of ethanol showing this by stop working. Best of luck to you Jan - Original Message - From: Angela Cook To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 5:10 PM Subject: [Biofuel] Question about E85 Does anyone know if anything has to be done to the fuel system if you're planning on running E-85 in your vehicle? I have heard conflicting stories. I have a 2001 Chevy Impala that I would fill up with E85. I've been using 10% Ethanol with no problems. Any information would be greatly appreciated. Thank you! Angela Cook ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Crack computer input with tape of typing
On 9/15/05, Kirk McLoren [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Average person has no idea of how they have no security.
--Kirk
http://www.cs.berkeley.edu/~tygar/papers/Keyboard_Acoustic_Emanations_Revisited/preprint.pdf The link leads to a PDF full-text file of a research paper:
Keyboard Acoustic Emanations Revisited
Li Zhuang, Feng Zhou, J. D. Tygar
University of California, Berkeley
{zl,zf,[EMAIL PROTECTED]
ABSTRACT
We examine the problem of keyboard acoustic emanations. We
present a novel attack taking as input a 10-minute sound recording
of a user typing English text using a keyboard, and then recovering
up to 96% of typed characters. There is no need for a labeled
training recording. Moreover the recognizer bootstrapped this way
can even recognize random text such as passwords: In our experiments,
90% of 5-character random passwords using only letters can
be generated in fewer than 20 attempts by an adversary; 80% of 10-
character passwords can be generated in fewer than 75 attempts.
Our attack uses the statistical constraints of the underlying content,
English language, to reconstruct text from sound recordings
without any labeled training data. The attack uses a combination
of standard machine learning and speech recognition techniques,
including cepstrum features, Hidden Markov Models, linear classi-
fication, and feedback-based incremental learning.
Kirk, the Average Person has nothing to fear from this kind of
attack. The computers and users which might be subject to an attack of
this complexity are far from average. That kind of target,
probably supported by intelligence and encryption professionals*, is
not likely to be in a situation where high quality sound recordings can
be collected from the keyboard over long sessions of typing.
You are correct in saying that the Average Person has no security.
But the average target is subject to much simpler attacks,
because of these sorts of vulnerabilities (more or less in order of
ease of attack):
Social engineering
Low quality passwords
Poor network habits, e.g. using misconfigured or untrustworthy
browsers and mail tools, surfing to untrusted sites, identical passwords on many
sites, opening junk mail, opening mail attachments, trusting phish
mail,
Physical access to target system
Vulnerable targets, e.g. all variants of Windows, Mac OS9 and earlier, poorly administered Unix and Linux systems.
Poor encryption techniques, e.g. WEP, SMS, and A5
http://www.google.com/search?q=WEP+encryption+flawedbtnG=Search
http://www.google.com/search?q=GSM+encryption+flawsbtnG=Search
This list is hardly complete. I just wanted to stress that adequate
risk assessment is always the first step in any kind of security
effort, whether it's for personal security or national security.**
taryn
http://ornae.com/
*Granted this is often an oxymoron.
**The complete indifference to, lack of, and/or failure of, risk assessment may be the
single most infuriating feature of the current administration. Billions
spent chasing straw men as our infrastructure crumbles.
___
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Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
One major way acceleration hurts is that engines are set to richen the mixture during hard acceleration in order to prevent detonation (knocking, pinging) at high cylinder pressures. Also, carburated engines richen the mixture to compensate for fuel vapour condensing on the intake manifold walls as manifold pressure increases when the throttle is opened. Doug Woodard St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada On Tue, 13 Sep 2005, Joe Street wrote: Zeke Yewdall wrote: Snip I think for otherwise identical cars, a medium sized engine (but smaller than what most cars come with nowdays) will get better mileage, because it can accellerate fast enough to get out of the fuel dumping acceleration, and into more fuel efficient cruising faster. If you accelerate you are doing work. If you accelerate slowly you use less fuel per unit time but for a longer time. If you use high acceleration you use more fuel per time but for a shorter time. However definitely the frictional losses are higher when the engine is asked to produce high torque, thus dropping the efficiency. But if it's to large, it's less efficient at cruising speed because of low part load efficiency. And if it's too small, it it always trying futiley to accellerate, instead of cruising. Also, due to real fixed ratio transmissions, a less powerful engine may spend more time at a higher RPM, where the fuel efficiency in grams/kWh is less, whereas a higher power engine could downshift sooner. The engine turning at higher rpm is not necessarily using more fuel. It depends on the power the engine is producing and other factors including thermal efficiency, bearing friction etc. There are a family of curves for the engine showing torque vs rpm, power vs rpm and fuel consumption vs rpm at a given load. For instance years ago one of the bikes I used to ride got better fuel economy on the highway by driving in 4th gear at higher rpm than in 5th gear at a lower rpm for the same highway speed. Joe ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Charles Lindberg did some of this training for P-38 pilots in the Pacific. For gasoline engines, high BMEP is good as long as you stay below the range where you have to richen the mixture to avoid detonation. Operation at lean mixtures is good as long as combustion is fast enough so that you can exploit nearly all of the expansion ratio. Too lean and you burn the valves, because combustion slows down and you can't extract enough energy from the combustion gases. Doug Woodard St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada On Tue, 13 Sep 2005, David Miller wrote: [snip] What I found fascinating when studying piston engines is that it all boils down to piston speed and brake mean effective pressure. There would seem to be no logical way to compare a chainsaw engine and a marine diesel, but their piston speeds and BMEP's are generally within a factor of 2 of each other. From an engineering perspective - clean sheet of paper - you increase efficiency by increasing BMEP. That gets more HP per cubic inch displacement, unit weight of engine, whatever measure you want - without increasing friction. Someone - James Dolittle? made this famous during world war II. They had adjustable propellers on long range bombers, and they didn't have enough range to bomb some pacific islands. Jamie? Jimmy? showed them they could change the propeller settings and lug the engines down. Lowering the RPM on the engines (and increasing the BMEP of the engine) increased efficiency enough they could reach the island they wanted to bomb. Apologies to all for mangling the story - I forget the islands name but took the fuel efficiency lesson away. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
One major way acceleration hurts is that engines are set to richen the mixture during hard acceleration in order to prevent detonation (knocking, pinging) at high cylinder pressures. Does this apply to diesel engines which almost always operate with excess oxygen? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] changing trash into fuel
The plasma torch system of changing trash into fuel appears to be catching on in Japan. This article says it can produce three to four times as much energy in carbon-rich gas, and 50% more energy than it uses in the form of hydrogen gas. Does anyone know more about it? htmttp://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2004-02-26-hot-garbage _x.htm Hot trash-to-fuel technology gathering steam By Timothy Gardner, Reuters NEW YORK ó Got garbage? Toxic trash? Zap it with a torch three times hotter than the sun and gather the resulting gas to fuel pollution-free cars and home power units. It may seem like an idea out of a mad scientist's notebook, but the method ó known as plasma torch technology ó is gaining acceptance with governments and corporations, especially those with growing waste problems. If you can reduce trash and at the same time produce a valuable gas, more power to you, said Charles Russomanno, a U.S. Department of Energy renewable energy expert. Hospital waste, municipal trash and polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs), an industrial compound suspected of causing cancer, all can be blasted with a plasma torch to make gases that can be burned to produce electricity. Companies including privately owned Westinghouse Plasma Corp., spun off from Westinghouse Corp., Georgia-based Geoplasma, LLC, and British-based Tetronics Plasma ionize air or other gases until they conduct electricity. The process is similar to what goes on in a fluorescent lightbulb ó only at an extreme temperature of 30,000 degrees Fahrenheit. Plasma torches break waste into an obsidian-like stone, heavy metals that can be recovered for resale, and carbon and hydrogen-rich gases that burn like natural gas. One company, Startech Environmental, takes the process a step further, refining the gas through a membrane to make pure hydrogen gas for fuel cells. Hydrogen quest Automobile and energy companies have invested billions of dollars in hydrogen fuel cells that produce power through a chemical reaction, with water vapor as the only byproduct. President Bush has encouraged the race to hydrogen by seeking for next year's budget $228 million, a 43% increase, to develop fuel cell cars and suitable service stations. Last year, he launched a five-year, $1.2 billion research initiative with the aim of reducing dependence on foreign oil and putting fuel cell cars on the road by 2020. Japan, where dumping costs are high, is becoming a world leader in plasma technology. In 2002, Hitachi Metals along with Utashinai City, helped build the first plasma plant, which produces 8 megawatts of power by torching auto waste. Startech signed a $1.3 million contract last fall with Japan's Mihama Inc. to break down PCBs. In February, it signed a $34 million deal with Italian company FP Immobiliare to torch computer waste. It has also offered to operate a free test unit to treat some of New York City's waste. Where we put trash gets more expensive every day, said Carmen Cognetta, a counsel to the NYC Department of Sanitation. New Mariners Hydrogen is like seawater to the thirsty Ancient Mariner ó it's everywhere, but not in a usable form. It's the most abundant element in the universe, but separating it from oxygen in water takes large amounts of energy. Currently, most hydrogen is produced at oil refineries to meet petrochemical refining needs, although the process is expensive and the yields are small. The cheapest energy source for separating hydrogen is coal, but burning it can produce hazardous amounts of greenhouse gases and toxic compounds. In the future, energy may be provided by solar and wind power, which for now are too pricey. So, torch technologies have potential, says Columbia University geophysicist Klaus Lackner. They will provide an additional niche and if your hydrogen turns out to be cheaper than that of your competitor, then you have a great market. Owen Connolly, director of product marketing at New York-based Plug Power Inc., a producer of fuel cell power systems, said 25 cubic feet of hydrogen produces 1 kilowatt hour (KWH) of electricity from its power units. If the 225 million U.S. car tires disposed of annually were zapped by Startech units, enough hydrogen would be produced to supply 500,000 homes with electricity for an entire year. The more toxic the garbage, the higher the tipping fees for municipalities and the more torch processors can collect. New York City, which produces 12,000 tons of garbage per day and trucks it as far away as Ohio, will soon be seeking a cost evaluation from Startech and other companies, said Cognetta. Some argue that using the torch requires almost as much energy as it produces. Startech's Chief Operating Officer Joseph Longo, however, said the system can produce three to four times as much energy in carbon-rich gas, and 50% more energy than it uses in the form of hydrogen gas. That makes the technology, along with nuclear, wind
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel
Greetings greasy-ones, Some clarification please, I'm not sure if I'm reading this correctly. 10 micron is .000394 inch, that's pretty darn small. Even 20 micron at .00079 inch is vey small. For perspective (for me anyway), the thickness of paper is around .004 inch (100 micron) and human hair is about half that at .0025 inch (70 micron). At .0016 inch, 20 micron seems to be adaquate. Yet many people seem to be filtering down to 5 micron. Are the tolerances in the fuel pump that close? Someone on this sight rated typical restaurant paper cone grease filters at about 25 micron, is that accurate? Your thoughts, 10 microns is a normal filter size for diesel engines, unless equipped with a common-rail system. So, filtering at 10 microns is good, 5 microns even better assuming that the biodiesel has an abnormal content of solids which will lead to filter clogging very rapidly. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] changing trash into fuel
http://www.nrel.gov/csp/lab_capabilities.html#hfsf I had read a few years ago about NREL using their solar furnace to turn waste into plasma. At the time they were just trying new ideas to get rid of toxic waste, but solar is a possible fuel source for a plasma reduction unit that doesn't use electricity. At the time they were saying that this concentrator could produce the hottest man made temperature outside of a hydrogen bomb. I saw a piece of 1/2 high strength steel sheet with a 2 hole blasted through the middle in about two and a half seconds. On 9/15/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The plasma torch system of changing trash into fuel appears to be catching on in Japan. This article says it can produce three to four times as much energy in carbon-rich gas, and 50% more energy than it uses in the form of hydrogen gas. Does anyone know more about it? htmttp://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2004-02-26-hot-garbage _x.htm Hot trash-to-fuel technology gathering steam By Timothy Gardner, Reuters NEW YORK ó Got garbage? Toxic trash? Zap it with a torch three times hotter than the sun and gather the resulting gas to fuel pollution-free cars and home power units. It may seem like an idea out of a mad scientist's notebook, but the method ó known as plasma torch technology ó is gaining acceptance with governments and corporations, especially those with growing waste problems. If you can reduce trash and at the same time produce a valuable gas, more power to you, said Charles Russomanno, a U.S. Department of Energy renewable energy expert. Hospital waste, municipal trash and polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs), an industrial compound suspected of causing cancer, all can be blasted with a plasma torch to make gases that can be burned to produce electricity. Companies including privately owned Westinghouse Plasma Corp., spun off from Westinghouse Corp., Georgia-based Geoplasma, LLC, and British-based Tetronics Plasma ionize air or other gases until they conduct electricity. The process is similar to what goes on in a fluorescent lightbulb ó only at an extreme temperature of 30,000 degrees Fahrenheit. Plasma torches break waste into an obsidian-like stone, heavy metals that can be recovered for resale, and carbon and hydrogen-rich gases that burn like natural gas. One company, Startech Environmental, takes the process a step further, refining the gas through a membrane to make pure hydrogen gas for fuel cells. Hydrogen quest Automobile and energy companies have invested billions of dollars in hydrogen fuel cells that produce power through a chemical reaction, with water vapor as the only byproduct. President Bush has encouraged the race to hydrogen by seeking for next year's budget $228 million, a 43% increase, to develop fuel cell cars and suitable service stations. Last year, he launched a five-year, $1.2 billion research initiative with the aim of reducing dependence on foreign oil and putting fuel cell cars on the road by 2020. Japan, where dumping costs are high, is becoming a world leader in plasma technology. In 2002, Hitachi Metals along with Utashinai City, helped build the first plasma plant, which produces 8 megawatts of power by torching auto waste. Startech signed a $1.3 million contract last fall with Japan's Mihama Inc. to break down PCBs. In February, it signed a $34 million deal with Italian company FP Immobiliare to torch computer waste. It has also offered to operate a free test unit to treat some of New York City's waste. Where we put trash gets more expensive every day, said Carmen Cognetta, a counsel to the NYC Department of Sanitation. New Mariners Hydrogen is like seawater to the thirsty Ancient Mariner ó it's everywhere, but not in a usable form. It's the most abundant element in the universe, but separating it from oxygen in water takes large amounts of energy. Currently, most hydrogen is produced at oil refineries to meet petrochemical refining needs, although the process is expensive and the yields are small. The cheapest energy source for separating hydrogen is coal, but burning it can produce hazardous amounts of greenhouse gases and toxic compounds. In the future, energy may be provided by solar and wind power, which for now are too pricey. So, torch technologies have potential, says Columbia University geophysicist Klaus Lackner. They will provide an additional niche and if your hydrogen turns out to be cheaper than that of your competitor, then you have a great market. Owen Connolly, director of product marketing at New York-based Plug Power Inc., a producer of fuel cell power systems, said 25 cubic feet of hydrogen produces 1 kilowatt hour (KWH) of electricity from its power units. If the 225 million U.S. car tires disposed of annually were zapped by Startech units, enough hydrogen would be produced to supply 500,000 homes with electricity for an
[Biofuel] ethanol method
Does anybody know how to do a biofuel usin ethanol? I mean 92% ethanol, not dry ethanol. I've read that it is possible. O maybe somebody knows how to easily dry ethanol? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Fuel can be made from dead cats
I thought this was amusing and interesting, about a new technology to make fuel from common waste materials. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/15/cats_fuel_diesel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] wind and current power
Zeke Yewdall, Your point is well taken. I like to think the humanities are more important than technology. That people are more important than things. You ask, "Is it that we hope to engineer a technological solution to ourenvironmental/social problems?" I say, yes. I think some wind solutionsis better than oil being the only solution. I have seen big oil sabotage other solutions with their wealth. I have been involved in environmental cleanup of spilled oil and the fascistbeauracraciesthat governments has installed to solvethe resulting environmental problems. I see some downsides to an economy totally dependent on oil. I think we need some alternatives. But on a philosophical level, I think societal issues are more on the humanities side than technology. That is where we need the most solutions. Leon - Original Message - From: Taryn To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: 9/15/05 2:57:16 AM Subject: Re: [Biofuel] wind and current power Hi Zeke, On 9/14/05, Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: That monitoring station suggested to me that such a flying platform could... On a philosophical level, I often wonder why people are so excitedabout fancy new ideas like fusion, or flying wind turbines, etc.Isit that we hope to engineer a technological solution to ourenvironmental/social problems?As an engineer, I happen to like technology too.But scientists have already made PV modules, carsthat can get 80mpg on vegetable oil, superefficient lighting, etc.Pretty neat stuff I think, but for the most part, no one uses them!!!Why would we assume that the next new technology to "save" us from ourselves would be accepted any better than what has already beeninvented?I just find this societal facination with new technology, at the sametime we refuse to actually use new technology, rather paradoxical. Oh man, it's a fair cop! You're absolutely right. I'm an engineer and constant tinker, love the blue sky tech. but try to make my production designs as simple and sturdy as possible.Remember all those wacko ideas that showed up in the pulp magazines? I loved to spend time at my grandparent's place, partly because they had a huge cache of post-war Popular Mechanics, along with the usual cubic yard of National Geographic. I pored over those rags as a little girl, wondering why the personal gyrocopter, invented 25 years before, still wasn't in everyone's driveway.___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Ok, given the same vehicle ( and about the same weight ), how does one go about picking a replacement engine and perhapsthe replacing thetransmission as well? The reason I ask, is that I would like to replace the engine I have with a better engine, but, I don't want to over power. Greg H. - Original Message - From: Michael Redler To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 13:07 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? I knew it wouldn't take long for these (good) questions to come up. I'm just concerned that we don't get too hung up on cars designed for maximum efficiencyvs maximum power. Some of the methods used to get fuel and air to high horsepower engines resemble toilet bowls and a lot of that fuel ends up not getting burned. The biggest question I have is; If you are including the vehicle as a whole, weight has to be part of the discussion unless (perhaps) if you assume regenerative breaking on all cars. It's tough to ignore the transformation of energy into heat at the brakes. MikeZeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are we comparing exactly the same weight/aerodynamics/rollingresistance car here, with just different powered engines? Or completedifferent cars like a metro, corolla, and a ferarri.I think for otherwise identical cars, a medium sized engine (butsmaller than what most cars come with nowdays) will get bettermileage, because it can accellerate fast enough to get out of the fueldumping acceleration, and into more fuel efficient cruising faster. But if it's to large, it's less efficient at cruising speed because oflow part load efficiency. And if it's too small, it it always tryingfutiley to accellerate, instead of cruising. Also, due to real fixedratio transmissions, a less powerful engine may spend more time at ahigher RPM, where the fuel efficiency in grams/kWh is less, whereas ahigher power engine could downshift sooner.There is also the human factor, that a more powerful car will enticelead footedness and speeding, and thus get worse gas mileage than anunderpowered car that you just accept your slowness ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fuel can be made from dead cats
When the boulder-biodiesel crew was down in Colombia working on the biodiesel processor for gaviotas, they did try a batch of chicken scraps, boiling all the grease off and turning it into biodiesel. They said it worked fine, but smelled the lab up so bad that none of them felt like eating for a few days. If we could turn non-oil sources into biodiesel through heat assisted catalytic reforming, that would be pretty cool though. On 9/15/05, John Donahue [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I thought this was amusing and interesting, about a new technology to make fuel from common waste materials. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/15/cats_fuel_diesel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
H. Are you sure you want to get that applied? The academics will be appalled. :) I am doing that right now with a VW rabbit, and I have settled on a SVO engine, vs an electric motor (with renewable energy to charge the batteries). The size and design of the engine is more dictacted by what is available, rather than what would be ideal. Same with the transmission. Luckily there are different transmission options that fit this vehical, so I can choose one which will be more efficient with the diesel engine than the stock transmission which was optimized for fast acceleration. This will not be the ideal solution based soley on engineering -- but it the one that is the best I can come up now with based on the constraints of finances, DOT regulations, fuel availability and characteristics, and a commute with lots of elevation change On 9/15/05, Greg and April [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, given the same vehicle ( and about the same weight ), how does one go about picking a replacement engine and perhaps the replacing the transmission as well? The reason I ask, is that I would like to replace the engine I have with a better engine, but, I don't want to over power. Greg H. - Original Message - From: Michael Redler To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 13:07 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? I knew it wouldn't take long for these (good) questions to come up. I'm just concerned that we don't get too hung up on cars designed for maximum efficiency vs maximum power. Some of the methods used to get fuel and air to high horsepower engines resemble toilet bowls and a lot of that fuel ends up not getting burned. The biggest question I have is; If you are including the vehicle as a whole, weight has to be part of the discussion unless (perhaps) if you assume regenerative breaking on all cars. It's tough to ignore the transformation of energy into heat at the brakes. Mike Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are we comparing exactly the same weight/aerodynamics/rolling resistance car here, with just different powered engines? Or complete different cars like a metro, corolla, and a ferarri. I think for otherwise identical cars, a medium sized engine (but smaller than what most cars come with nowdays) will get better mileage, because it can accellerate fast enough to get out of the fuel dumping acceleration, and into more fuel efficient cruising faster. But if it's to large, it's less efficient at cruising speed because of low part load efficiency. And if it's too small, it it always trying futiley to accellerate, instead of cruising. Also, due to real fixed ratio transmissions, a less powerful engine may spend more time at a higher RPM, where the fuel efficiency in grams/kWh is less, whereas a higher power engine could downshift sooner. There is also the human factor, that a more powerful car will entice lead footedness and speeding, and thus get worse gas mileage than an underpowered car that you just accept your slowness ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fuel can be made from dead cats
I followed a link in another thread to www.slashdot.org and found this: BERLIN, Germany (Reuters) -- A German inventor said he has developed a method to produce crude oil products from waste that he believes can be an answer to the soaring costs of fuel, but denied a German newspaper story implying he also used dead cats. http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/09/14/germany.catfuel.reut/index.html Brian Rodgers ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] ethanol method
It is not easy, due to the fact that ethoxide, can't be made by the combination of sodium or potassium hydroxide and ethanol, as one does with base plus methanol to form methoxide. It can be done however via alternative ways of making the ethoxide: K + EtOH --- K(+) (-)OEt + 1/2 H2 KH + EtOH --- K(+) (-)OEt + H2 (don't try this at home- wildly flammable materials involved) or for someone with good laboratory skills: combine EtOH (absolute) + KOH, then distill off 95% Ethanol/5% water azeotrope to remove water, shifting the equilibrium to form the ethoxide ion. The problem is that you remove a lot of ethanol to get a small amt of water out. (there are ways to recover absolute ethanol via a ternary azeotrope, but I seriously doubt if it is either cost or energy effective. Kuba-tlen wrote: Does anybody know how to do a biofuel usin ethanol? I mean 92% ethanol, not dry ethanol. I've read that it is possible. O maybe somebody knows how to easily dry ethanol? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves — Richard Feynman ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Very interesting discussion here. How many people here are swapping engines? I was giving some thought to removing the 351 ci gasaholic in my Ford f150 and replacing it with a diesel engine. Years ago (before I saw the advantage of diesel) I pulled a engine from my Mercedes 240d and did major mods to convert it to gas fuel injected V6. Looking for more projects. right??? Brian Rodgers ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Too underpowered and the vehicle will be too slow to overtake and pass other vehicles. KirkGreg and April [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, given the same vehicle ( and about the same weight ), how does one go about picking a replacement engine and perhapsthe replacing thetransmission as well? The reason I ask, is that I would like to replace the engine I have with a better engine, but, I don't want to over power. Greg H. Yahoo! for Good Click here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Uh. Passing other vehicles? My first car was an old subaru that took several miles to hit 70mph on the highway. I don't think I'll be disapointed by a diesel rabbit. But seriously, if the average automobile engine nowadays has 40% more power than it needs for cruising at the speed limit (my estimate), just for passing and accelerating, how much gas are we wasting just because we are obsessed with the bigger better syndrome. It's pretty amazing what the new diesel cars can do, while still getting 50mpg, compared to the old diesel cars -- double or triple the power. But imagine if they had focussed on increasing the gas mileage instead of just increasing the power for the last 15 years. The Lupo TDI is a possible example of this. Even the new hybrids get lousy gas mileage, because the hybrid design is optimized for adding power, not increasing mileage like the insight and prius were. As a culture, we'd be better off if we'd stop being so impatient with everything anyway and just relax. Not only would we use less gas, but maybe have less hypertension and heart disease too. I admit that there is a legitimate safety arguement that having some reserve power is good. But that arguement can rapidly turn into an arms race to the bottom (e.g. SUV's) if we aren't careful. Plus, it's so tempting to speed if your car has the power to do so. Which probably wipes out the safety advantage of having reserve power, and uses even more gas. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
No, diesels are not susceptible to detonation which is a non-applicable concept in its pure form. You want a diesel to burn the fuel wherever the fuel is, as soon as it is injected. The problem is to get it to burn fast enough. Diesels do generate smoke from incomplete combustion as the air excess grows less. I imagine that a fair amount of smoke can be produced on without affecting efficiency much - but I don't *know*. All other things being equal, the leaner the mixture, the more efficient. The ideal is air standard efficiency, heat with no fuel. In practice a diesel engine has to be designed for reliability at a certain power density/ mixture strength/BMEP (brake mean effective pressure) level, and if you go too much below this BMEP level, the mass of the moving engine components and the areas subject to friction, required by the designed maximum power, will start to impose excessive losses. The friction of the piston rings during compression and expansion even without combustion pressures, is also a source of loss, and there are other motoring (zero combustion operation as in turning over the engine with outside power) losses. Doug Woodard St. Catharines, Ontario, Canada On Thu, 15 Sep 2005, Zeke Yewdall wrote: One major way acceleration hurts is that engines are set to richen the mixture during hard acceleration in order to prevent detonation (knocking, pinging) at high cylinder pressures. Does this apply to diesel engines which almost always operate with excess oxygen? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] ethanol method
Hi Bob and all, I seem to be having fairly good success drying 95% ethanol with 3A molecular sieve. I still have horrible problems making BioD with 100% ethanol (purchased)but I´m still working on it. Tom Irwin From: bob allen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 18:23:08 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] ethanol methodIt is not easy, due to the fact that ethoxide, can't be made by the combination of sodium or potassium hydroxide and ethanol, as one does with base plus methanol to form methoxide. It can be done however via alternative ways of making the ethoxide:K + EtOH --- K(+) (-)OEt + 1/2 H2KH + EtOH --- K(+) (-)OEt + H2(don't try this at home- wildly flammable materials involved)or for someone with good laboratory skills:combine EtOH (absolute) + KOH, then distill off 95% Ethanol/5% water azeotrope to remove water, shifting the equilibrium to form the ethoxide ion.The problem is that you remove a lot of ethanol to get a small amt of water out. (there are ways to recover absolute ethanol via a ternary azeotrope, but I seriously doubt if it is either cost or energy effective.Kuba-tlen wrote: Does anybody know how to do a biofuel usin ethanol? I mean 92% ethanol, not dry ethanol. I've read that it is possible. O maybe somebody knows how to easily dry ethanol? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- Bob Allenhttp://ozarker.org/bob"Science is what we have learned about how to keepfrom fooling ourselves" — Richard Feynman___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Fuel can be made from dead cats
Hi All, This reminds me of a thought I forgot to write down weeks ago. IfBioD made from french fry oil smells like French fries what does BioD made from Castor oil smell like? Tom Irwin From: Zeke Yewdall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 17:44:44 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Fuel can be made from dead catsWhen the boulder-biodiesel crew was down in Colombia working on thebiodiesel processor for gaviotas, they did try a batch of chickenscraps, boiling all the grease off and turning it into biodiesel. They said it worked fine, but smelled the lab up so bad that none ofthem felt like eating for a few days.If we could turn non-oil sources into biodiesel through heat assistedcatalytic reforming, that would be pretty cool though.On 9/15/05, John Donahue <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>wrote: I thought this was amusing and interesting, about a new technology to make fuel from common waste materials. http://www.theregister.co.uk/2005/09/15/cats_fuel_diesel/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel
Hi Ed, I think standard coffee filters are 10 micron. I have filters in the lab that filter down to 1.22 microns and others for sterilizing media that are .22 microns so it would not surprise me about automotive filters or restaurant filters. Tom Irwin From: Ed Hall [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.orgSent: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:33:21 -0300Subject: Re: [Biofuel] BiodieselGreetings greasy-ones,Some clarification please, I'm not sure if I'm reading this correctly.10 micron is .000394 inch, that's pretty darn small. Even 20 micron at .00079 inch is vey small.For perspective (for me anyway), the thickness of paper is around .004 inch (100 micron) and human hair is about half that at .0025 inch (70 micron). At .0016 inch, 20 micron seems to be adaquate. Yet many people seem to be filtering down to 5 micron. Are the tolerances in the fuel pump that close?Someone on this sight rated typical restaurant paper cone grease filters at about 25 micron, is that accurate?Your thoughts,10 microns is a normal filter size for diesel engines, unless equipped with a common-rail system. So, filtering at 10 microns is good, 5 microns even better assuming that the biodiesel has an abnormal content of solids which will lead to filter clogging very rapidly.___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] ethanol method
Tom, two questions, 1. how do you know the ethanol is being dried? and 2. what procedure are you using for bioD from ethanol? Tom Irwin wrote: Hi Bob and all, I seem to be having fairly good success drying 95% ethanol with 3A molecular sieve. I still have horrible problems making BioD with 100% ethanol (purchased)but I´m still working on it. Tom Irwin *From:* bob allen [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] *To:* Biofuel@sustainablelists.org *Sent:* Thu, 15 Sep 2005 18:23:08 -0300 *Subject:* Re: [Biofuel] ethanol method It is not easy, due to the fact that ethoxide, can't be made by the combination of sodium or potassium hydroxide and ethanol, as one does with base plus methanol to form methoxide. It can be done however via alternative ways of making the ethoxide: K + EtOH --- K(+) (-)OEt + 1/2 H2 KH + EtOH --- K(+) (-)OEt + H2 (don't try this at home- wildly flammable materials involved) or for someone with good laboratory skills: combine EtOH (absolute) + KOH, then distill off 95% Ethanol/5% water azeotrope to remove water, shifting the equilibrium to form the ethoxide ion. The problem is that you remove a lot of ethanol to get a small amt of water out. (there are ways to recover absolute ethanol via a ternary azeotrope, but I seriously doubt if it is either cost or energy effective. Kuba-tlen wrote: Does anybody know how to do a biofuel usin ethanol? I mean 92% ethanol, not dry ethanol. I've read that it is possible. O maybe somebody knows how to easily dry ethanol? ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org javascript:kh6k0(new,Biofuel@sustainablelists.org) http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves — Richard Feynman ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org javascript:kh6k0(new,Biofuel@sustainablelists.org) http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ Internal Virus Database is out-of-date. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.323 / Virus Database: 267.10.19/92 - Release Date: 9/7/2005 -- Bob Allen http://ozarker.org/bob Science is what we have learned about how to keep from fooling ourselves - Richard Feynman ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] ethanol method
--- Tom Irwin [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: I still have horrible problems making BioD with 100% ethanol (purchased)but I'm still working on it. You probly know this already, but adding even 10-15% methanol to the anhydrous ethanol makes the reaction go markedly better. -K __ Yahoo! Mail - PC Magazine Editors' Choice 2005 http://mail.yahoo.com ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] Fuel from dead cats
There was a company doing something similar, working next to a turkey processing plant, turning the entrails, feet, heads, feathers, etc into oil, gas, and minerals. Cats are not unique in their carbonaceous make up. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Hi Zeke, On Sep 15, 2005, at 5:59 PM, Zeke Yewdall wrote: ... Even the new hybrids get lousy gas mileage, because the hybrid design is optimized for adding power, not increasing mileage like the insight and prius were. ... Oh man, this just burns my a*s. I was so excited a few years ago when we started hearing the rumblings about hybrids from american automakers and lexus, et al. Then to discover that the electrics were being coupled to gas engines to add acceleration, not to improve overall performance and efficiency. It's disgusting to think that they're strapping a half ton of batteries and electrics to some mondo SUV, betting that the american buyer just wants another second shaved off the 1/4 mile times. Sometimes I just hate the priorities of my countrymen. And they're all gasoline powered! The only way to get a diesel electric hybrid in this country is to build it yourself. I swear, before, I'm dead, I'm going to build a solar-svo-diesel-electric-regenerative hybrid out of some old school bus or airport shuttle! Taryn http://ornae.com/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] pussy makes car Purrrrrr
http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=2ObjectID=10345772 A German has angered animal rights groups by inventing an organic fuel containing run-over cat remains. Inventor Christian Koch, 55, of Saxony, told the Bild newspaper he had gone 170,000km without a problem in his car on the biofuel. A 50-litre tank used about 20 cats and cost a fifth of usual diesel to produce, he said. Bede Meredith Phone +64 21 892 801 Email [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://www.codesmith.info ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
[Biofuel] changing trash into fuel
I've seen this before, and it works. Worked about a year on a similar project. The problem, as I see it, is what energy source is strong enough to create the plasma? If you believe in the law of conservation of energy (which I do) then you need either a big wire to the power plant, or else a VERY LARGE solar collection system to make enough power. We experimented with a 450kw marine diesel generator. I don't remember the numbers but can tell you this: starting with say, 10-20 gallons of (water, anti-freeze, pig manure, whatever) you could run creating about 15-20 SCFM of Hydrogen gas with CO and other trace hydrocarbon gases. A great amount of heat is also generated (about 400kW). So, unless you have a use for the heat, you have created 400 kW worth of (waste) heat and about 50 kW worth of gas. And that assumes no other losses. Then you must collect, filter and compress the collected gas. Is that free? Anyone who says they have an operational unit is looking for stock 'investors', and I would be leery of giving more than 10 cents. Yes, it can be done, but is economically infeasible, IMHO. Also note: the waste material you are reacting in the plasma reactor doesn't go away fast. Run all day and you'll loose about 5 gallons? (maybe 10? OK, 20) We're talking about running a half meg generator to make 10 gallons (if that) go away? If interested, I can find links to those doing it. Andy Message: 7 Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 14:31:36 -0600 From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] Subject: Re: [Biofuel] changing trash into fuel To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 http://www.nrel.gov/csp/lab_capabilities.html#hfsf I had read a few years ago about NREL using their solar furnace to turn waste into plasma. At the time they were just trying new ideas to get rid of toxic waste, but solar is a possible fuel source for a plasma reduction unit that doesn't use electricity. At the time they were saying that this concentrator could produce the hottest man made temperature outside of a hydrogen bomb. I saw a piece of 1/2 high strength steel sheet with a 2 hole blasted through the middle in about two and a half seconds. On 9/15/05, [EMAIL PROTECTED] [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: The plasma torch system of changing trash into fuel appears to be catching on in Japan. This article says it can produce three to four times as much energy in carbon-rich gas, and 50% more energy than it uses in the form of hydrogen gas. Does anyone know more about it? htmttp://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/2004-02-26-hot-garbage _x.htm Hot trash-to-fuel technology gathering steam By Timothy Gardner, Reuters NEW YORK ? Got garbage? Toxic trash? Zap it with a torch three times hotter than the sun and gather the resulting gas to fuel pollution-free cars and home power units. It may seem like an idea out of a mad scientist's notebook, but the method ? known as plasma torch technology ? is gaining acceptance with governments and corporations, especially those with growing waste problems. If you can reduce trash and at the same time produce a valuable gas, more power to you, said Charles Russomanno, a U.S. Department of Energy renewable energy expert. Hospital waste, municipal trash and polychlorinated biphenyls (PCBs), an industrial compound suspected of causing cancer, all can be blasted with a plasma torch to make gases that can be burned to produce electricity. Companies including privately owned Westinghouse Plasma Corp., spun off from Westinghouse Corp., Georgia-based Geoplasma, LLC, and British-based Tetronics Plasma ionize air or other gases until they conduct electricity. The process is similar to what goes on in a fluorescent lightbulb ? only at an extreme temperature of 30,000 degrees Fahrenheit. Plasma torches break waste into an obsidian-like stone, heavy metals that can be recovered for resale, and carbon and hydrogen-rich gases that burn like natural gas. One company, Startech Environmental, takes the process a step further, refining the gas through a membrane to make pure hydrogen gas for fuel cells. Hydrogen quest Automobile and energy companies have invested billions of dollars in hydrogen fuel cells that produce power through a chemical reaction, with water vapor as the only byproduct. President Bush has encouraged the race to hydrogen by seeking for next year's budget $228 million, a 43% increase, to develop fuel cell cars and suitable service stations. Last year, he launched a five-year, $1.2 billion research initiative with the aim of reducing dependence on foreign oil and putting fuel cell cars on the road by 2020. Japan, where dumping costs are high, is becoming a world leader in plasma technology. In 2002, Hitachi Metals along with Utashinai City, helped build the first plasma plant, which produces 8 megawatts of power by torching auto waste. Startech signed a $1.3 million
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
True. OTOH, if the job must be done, then you have to choose the best tool available from the limited selection that is available. Agreed. And that was my point. Pick the (most) right tool for the job. That is why you bother to learn what the best alternative is. If one size of engine is inefficient, replacing it with a more efficient engine is more cost effective than replacing the entire vehicle. This is not what I understood as your intent from your original post, which seemed to me could be seeking a justification for using overpowered vehicles, and too generic to provide a substantive response that could reliably guide decisions on engine selection. True or False Underpowered vehicles can be just as inefficient as overpowered vehicles. Why or why not? Greg H. - Original Message - From: Darryl McMahon [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 6:40 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? Why bother? The wrong tool for the job is the wrong tool for the job. If you want to split a diamond, neither a sledge hammer nor a feather duster will work. Instead of fostering a debate about which of two wrong answers is less wrong, let's put our energies into finding correct answers, and implementing them. If all goes according to plan today, the pickup truck I acquired at the end of June will get its first tankful of B20. It's been a long road, but even slow progress is still progress. Darryl McMahon ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ rom [EMAIL PROTECTED] Thu Sep 15 16:32:57 2005 Return-Path: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Received: from server6.emwd.com (server6.emwd.com [70.85.95.186]) by mailbox1.igs.net (8.13.1/8.13.1) with ESMTP id j8FKWtu7063109 for [EMAIL PROTECTED]; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:32:57 -0400 (EDT) (envelope-from [EMAIL PROTECTED]) Received: from localhost ([127.0.0.1] helo=server6.emwd.com) by server6.emwd.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EG0NI-0003KX-N1; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:30:29 -0400 Received: from [209.225.28.156] (helo=mxsf32.cluster1.charter.net) by server6.emwd.com with esmtp (Exim 4.52) id 1EFzy3-0002Db-UE for Biofuel@sustainablelists.org; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:04:32 -0400 Received: from mxip18a.cluster1.charter.net (mxip18a.cluster1.charter.net [209.225.28.148]) by mxsf32.cluster1.charter.net (8.12.11/8.12.11) with ESMTP id j8FK4FWl014314 for Biofuel@sustainablelists.org; Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:04:16 -0400 Received: from 66-214-231-79.dhcp.lnbh.ca.charter.com (HELO [192.168.0.33]) (66.214.231.79) by mxip18a.cluster1.charter.net with ESMTP; 15 Sep 2005 16:04:16 -0400 X-IronPort-AV: i=3.97,114,1125892800; d=scan'208; a=1564574096:sNHT18410424 Message-ID: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 13:15:00 -0700 From: John Donahue [EMAIL PROTECTED] User-Agent: Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7.11) Gecko/20050830 X-Accept-Language: en-us, en MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org X-EMWD-MailScanner: Not scanned: please contact your Internet E-Mail Service Provider for details, Not scanned: please contact your Internet E-Mail Service Provider for details X-EMWD-MailScanner-SpamCheck: , X-Mailman-Approved-At: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 16:29:32 -0400 Subject: [Biofuel] Fuel can be made from dead cats X-BeenThere: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org X-Mailman-Version: 2.1.6 Precedence: list Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org List-Id: biofuel_sustainablelists.org.sustainablelists.org List-Unsubscribe: http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Archive: http://sustainablelists.org/pipermail/biofuel_sustainablelists.org List-Post: mailto:Biofuel@sustainablelists.org List-Help: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] List-Subscribe: http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org, mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Sender: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Errors-To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-EMWD-MailScanner-Information: Please contact the ISP for more information X-EMWD-MailScanner-From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] X-AntiAbuse: This header was added to track abuse, please include it with any abuse report X-AntiAbuse: Primary Hostname - server6.emwd.com X-AntiAbuse: Original Domain - econogics.com X-AntiAbuse: Originator/Caller UID/GID - [0 0] / [47 12] X-AntiAbuse: Sender Address Domain - sustainablelists.org X-Source: X-Source-Args: X-Source-Dir: X-Virus-Scanned: ClamAV
Re: [Biofuel] ethanol method
Hi all, I thought we can dry up alkohol using CaO or Zeolite. Is it true ? So what's wrong with that method ? And by using CaO / Zeolite, is it possible to dry alkohol 70% v/v to 99% v/v ? Thank You -daniel On 9/16/05, bob allen [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Tom, two questions, 1. how do you know the ethanol is being dried?and 2. what procedure are youusing for bioD from ethanol?Tom Irwin wrote: Hi Bob and all, I seem to be having fairly good success drying 95% ethanol with 3A molecular sieve. I still have horrible problems making BioD with 100% ethanol (purchased)but I´m still working on it. Tom Irwin ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Greg and April wrote: Ok, given the same vehicle ( and about the same weight ), how does one go about picking a replacement engine and perhaps the replacing the transmission as well? The reason I ask, is that I would like to replace the engine I have with a better engine, but, I don't want to over power. My advice from a practical standpoint is to put one of whatever was in it back in. If you put a 4 cylinder in place of a 6, or a 6 in place of an 8 everything will be different, assuming something made within the last 20 years. The computer hookup and wiring harness will be all different, exhaust will be custome, fuel delivery will be different. If your time is worth anything to you I doubt you'd ever make it back on a $$ basis for the fuel saved. The transmission might be a slighly different proposition. Gearing it so the engine RPM is slower will probably raise your mileage a little, as long as you're not slowing the engine down into a less efficient mode. There's no sure way to tell without looking at the same kind of car with the different options. A manual transmission should give you a little better mileage as well, but if you've got an automatic now it would seem like a nightmare to setup the clutch and shifting linkage so that it works well. My thoughts, worth at least what you paid for them:) --- David ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
With a GVWR of 5360, an 80-85 HP 4 banger, grades of up to 8% and stop signs stop lights that stop you in the middle of the hill, going to a smaller engine is not what I have in mind. Greg H. - Original Message - From: Kirk McLoren To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 15:35 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? Too underpowered and the vehicle will be too slow to overtake and pass other vehicles. KirkGreg and April [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, given the same vehicle ( and about the same weight ), how does one go about picking a replacement engine and perhapsthe replacing thetransmission as well? The reason I ask, is that I would like to replace the engine I have with a better engine, but, I don't want to over power. Greg H. Yahoo! for GoodClick here to donate to the Hurricane Katrina relief effort. ___Biofuel mailing listBiofuel@sustainablelists.orghttp://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.orgBiofuel at Journey to Forever:http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.htmlSearch the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages):http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Zeke Yewdall wrote: One major way acceleration hurts is that engines are set to richen the mixture during hard acceleration in order to prevent detonation (knocking, pinging) at high cylinder pressures. Does this apply to diesel engines which almost always operate with excess oxygen? Not if the diesel is setup properly. When the black smoke (soot) starts coming out it's because there's not enough oxygen for all the fuel. Short of that you're all set. --- David ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC
Really, Five people that haven't tried it. When I get started, I'll be happy to help you, but if you know anyone who is already making it, I would like to know. Thanks, Bobby Clark From: Jerry Eyers [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC Date: Thu, 15 Sep 2005 11:09:13 -0400 (Eastern Standard Time) Lot's of us lurking, but haven't tried it yet... :-) I know of at least five here in Greenville, SC. Jerry ---Original Message--- From: Bobby Clark Date: 09/15/05 10:29:58 To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Subject: [Biofuel] Biodiesel in SC Hello, Is there anyone out there that makes biodiesel in upstate SC or northeast Georgia? I am just starting to become interested in making biodiesel and I would really like to see the process first hand if possible. If there is no one, then wish me luck in becoming one of the firsts in my region to do this! I will have many questions, so I hope there are plenty out there that are willing to help. Thanks, Bobby Clark ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ -- No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Anti-Virus. Version: 7.0.344 / Virus Database: 267.10.25/102 - Release Date: 9/14/2005 . ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
Bingo! Greg H. - Original Message - From: Brian Rodgers [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 15:27 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? Very interesting discussion here. How many people here are swapping engines? I was giving some thought to removing the 351 ci gasaholic in my Ford f150 and replacing it with a diesel engine. Years ago (before I saw the advantage of diesel) I pulled a engine from my Mercedes 240d and did major mods to convert it to gas fuel injected V6. Looking for more projects. right??? Brian Rodgers ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
I don't think that the transmission was optimized for fast acceleration, that little 4 banger diesel with only about 85 Hp is only capable of so much.The transmission is geared so low, that it doesn't take any effort to start from a dead stop in 2nd gear if necessary. Greg H. - Original Message - From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 14:55 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? H. Are you sure you want to get that applied? The academics will be appalled. :) I am doing that right now with a VW rabbit, and I have settled on a SVO engine, vs an electric motor (with renewable energy to charge the batteries). The size and design of the engine is more dictacted by what is available, rather than what would be ideal. Same with the transmission. Luckily there are different transmission options that fit this vehical, so I can choose one which will be more efficient with the diesel engine than the stock transmission which was optimized for fast acceleration. This will not be the ideal solution based soley on engineering -- but it the one that is the best I can come up now with based on the constraints of finances, DOT regulations, fuel availability and characteristics, and a commute with lots of elevation change On 9/15/05, Greg and April [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Ok, given the same vehicle ( and about the same weight ), how does one go about picking a replacement engine and perhaps the replacing the transmission as well? The reason I ask, is that I would like to replace the engine I have with a better engine, but, I don't want to over power. Greg H. - Original Message - From: Michael Redler To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Tuesday, September 13, 2005 13:07 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? I knew it wouldn't take long for these (good) questions to come up. I'm just concerned that we don't get too hung up on cars designed for maximum efficiency vs maximum power. Some of the methods used to get fuel and air to high horsepower engines resemble toilet bowls and a lot of that fuel ends up not getting burned. The biggest question I have is; If you are including the vehicle as a whole, weight has to be part of the discussion unless (perhaps) if you assume regenerative breaking on all cars. It's tough to ignore the transformation of energy into heat at the brakes. Mike Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Are we comparing exactly the same weight/aerodynamics/rolling resistance car here, with just different powered engines? Or complete different cars like a metro, corolla, and a ferarri. I think for otherwise identical cars, a medium sized engine (but smaller than what most cars come with nowdays) will get better mileage, because it can accellerate fast enough to get out of the fuel dumping acceleration, and into more fuel efficient cruising faster. But if it's to large, it's less efficient at cruising speed because of low part load efficiency. And if it's too small, it it always trying futiley to accellerate, instead of cruising. Also, due to real fixed ratio transmissions, a less powerful engine may spend more time at a higher RPM, where the fuel efficiency in grams/kWh is less, whereas a higher power engine could downshift sooner. There is also the human factor, that a more powerful car will entice lead footedness and speeding, and thus get worse gas mileage than an underpowered car that you just accept your slowness ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/ ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement?
I know what you are talking about. At 55 mph ( on the flats, no headwind, no cargo other than the spare tire, and 1 passenger ), I have a little reserve.At 65 mph I have almost none. Greg H. - Original Message - From: Zeke Yewdall [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: Biofuel@sustainablelists.org Sent: Thursday, September 15, 2005 15:59 Subject: Re: [Biofuel] Debatable statement? Uh. Passing other vehicles? My first car was an old subaru that took several miles to hit 70mph on the highway. I don't think I'll be disapointed by a diesel rabbit. SNIP I admit that there is a legitimate safety arguement that having some reserve power is good. But that arguement can rapidly turn into an arms race to the bottom (e.g. SUV's) if we aren't careful. Plus, it's so tempting to speed if your car has the power to do so. Which probably wipes out the safety advantage of having reserve power, and uses even more gas. ___ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
