[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Hello Gil, on 30-Mär-00 you wrote : ...snipp [Intro - much about V³, IB and AWeb] » And, when I can afford it, I WILL buy AWeb... Before you'll do so, buy a gfx-board. ;-) [snip] Does your Pentium also run on an 8 color screen or perhaps the iMac? ;-) [Not really ment as an offence.] To be serious, you can't expect an computer with an 10 year old gfx-system to be up to date, therefor you have to accepts shortcuts. BTW, I don't expect to surf the net with my old Apple computers, so... You're new to the list aren't you ? every now and then Gil speaks about his 8color miga and there's always someone to tell him 'buy a gfx card' (generally it's Shane :).. Then there is a thread about 'when you can', 'low end machines should or shouldn't'... 'aga is the past' and so on... What I suggest is just continue to be positive, and let Gil browse the web whith his 8color miga... and consult the archive for all the good reason to behave like this.. Gil I'm not trying to bug you, but someday I've the weird impression I've already lived that.. Phil. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
I would like to see some more plug-ins ;-) QT4 Quicktime is 'owned' by Apple and you have to pay for a license to include the technology into a third party player (or similar). I would guess that you would have to pay too :) Even the beta of Live Motion (www.adobe.com) didn't include a QT4 export function, as they would have had to pay Apple and, as the beta was free, they couldn't justify the QT4 export function ;) Chris. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Somewhat incomplete HTML support (especially alignment). Yep, but I think we require more 'specifics', where possible. ie. if HTML is incomplete, what tags are missing and, where tags are missing, which ones do you want adding/supporting? + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? Table rendering speed up along with image decoding, Mozilla spoofing. I would say table rendering is amazing, considering the speed of an 680x0 processor! Hell, even Netscape 4.x, on my Apple G3 (ie. many many times faster than an 060) is much (and I mean, much!) slower than V's :) When I go back to V, running on an 060, it always amazes me just /how/ fast it is, considering the CPU considerations. If V was running natively, on my G3, I wouldn't be able to keep up :) Chris. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
5. Yes! I Do! You MUST!, exclude it from the NetConnect3 package, and develop it Eh? Why 'exclude it from the NC package'? For your information: 1. The reason V3 even exists...is due to NC (VNG was developed, originally for NC v1 and I pushed Olli to work on JS for NC3, last year!). 2. NC sells and sells quite well. Due to this, and that the V3 programmers receive money from NC, is one large factor why V3 is actively developed today :) 3. NC 1, 2 and 3 brought together a lot of new V users and created good publicity for V, which in turn created more sales for the standalone V. Chris. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Chris, Quicktime is 'owned' by Apple and you have to pay for a license to include the technology into a third party player (or similar). I would guess that you would have to pay too :) Figures... The question then is: how much do they want and is there a justifyable means to bring it to the Amiga? Even the beta of Live Motion (www.adobe.com) didn't include a QT4 export function, as they would have had to pay Apple and, as the beta was free, they couldn't justify the QT4 export function ;) Now that makes it sound expensive... So instead of making QT4 support for us, we should go to the websites that have it and "bitch". ;-) Could we have a Nuking option? You know if we go to a website that says "IE only" or "Nutscrape only", we could hit a button and low-level format the server's hdd? ;-} Dave Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Gil, I tried to send you a dtype that would make AWeb a little better, but your email addy bounced it. So, go to the Aminet and look for Jpeg Datatype 35 - it uses the Jpeg library in os3.5 and gives you a preferences editor.. might make it better for you. Dave Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Hi Ben, On 29-Mar-00 you wrote: [voyager] What do you want in Voyager? + What's your biggest problem with V? Random crashes or lockups when quitting V3. Sometimes, when I have the Cookie Browser window open and load a new site, the window gets trashed (as if something was randomly rendering into it's RastPort with Draw() a few hundred times). + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? JS, TearOffs and HTML layout speed. + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? Nope, not me. :) + What feature is your biggest want? Two things would be nice: The ability to reject/accept cookies from certain servers using AmigaDOS pattern matching. i.e. Reject all cookies from DoubleClick.com using "#?doubleclick#?". A small window that allows you to list all of a webpage's components and their sizes, allowing you to quickly save or view individual components. For example, HTML, Frames, GIF Images, JPEG Images, PNG Images, Flash anims, etc. + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? No. Keep you comments sensible please! This is no unsubtle hint that we've got nothing to do - Olli and Zapek have plenty to do - and the last thing I want is anyone to expect me to act on something - it ain't gonna happen, we work hard as it is Understood. :) Regards, Andrew Bell. -- ++ email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://www.andrewb.exl.co.uk ++ Who gets the most line noise of all?...we do Chucky, we do... Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
On 30-Mar-00 13:59:49, Michael Butler wrote: Really? Voyager looks great here. I'm sure it looks fabulous on a graphics card but for those of us without IBs image decoder kicks Vs ass on ECS and AGA. V doesn't dither GIF pictures. That's why. It's on the todo list. -- David Gerber Please tell me if you don't get this message. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Due to an incorrect date setting I have auto-deleted all of todays postings (although I did get to read them first), so I hope I'm not repeating too many comments here: On *29 Mar 2000 20:58:06 +0100* In message *[voyager] What do you want in Voyager?* *Ben Preece* wrote: + What's your biggest problem with V? JavaScript and printing. Printing works but the quality is poor. I know this is in part due to the OS, but support for Scalable fonts would be nice, like the way you can use bitmap fonts for viewing but scalable fonts for printing in IBrowse. + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? JavaScript. + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? It's much faster on image intensive sites although the image quality is too grainy in IBrowse and it's colour selection is not as good, I know me and Gil disagree here ;) + What feature is your biggest want? Better JS support. So many sites rely on it now even for things like clicking a link that a more complete implementation is very important. I guess it's also one of the hardest things to do well. + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? It's still my browser of choice although I have been playing about with IBrowse 2.2 alot lately. V has the best interface of all the browsers, it's also the most stable and what it does it does very well. More frequent updates would be nice. I don't mean more releases (though that /would/ be nice), but I mean, for example, twice weekly updates along the lines of "we've fixed this, current est. for a release is 4 weeks"."we've found a big bug, may be a few weeks delay". I'm of the camp that likes to hear all the news even if it's bad. All the best, Matt -- Visit My New Website http://www.tthewb.u-net.com For information on Nanci Griffith, Lucy Kaplansky and me! Coming Soon - My New Amiga Pages Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Den 30-Mar-00 skrev Chris Wiles: Somewhat incomplete HTML support (especially alignment). Yep, but I think we require more 'specifics', where possible. ie. if HTML is incomplete, what tags are missing and, where tags are missing, which ones do you want adding/supporting? The by far most prominent missing HTML-support is the ALIGN parameter. Even though V will align the content of the tag correctly, it will not put anything next to it: HTML TABLE ALIGN=RIGHT TR.../TR TR.../TR /TABLE This is som text /HTML Should render to something like this: This is some text +---+ | | | Table | | | +---+ But what actually happens is this: +---+ | | | Table | | | +---+ This is some text The problem is rather annoying at Yahoo. Otherwise V is just great :-) Regards Robert -- Member of Team *AMIGA* Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Ben Preece worte on 29 Mar 2000 20:58:06 +0100 about [voyager] What do you want in Voyager? + What's your biggest problem with V? The 'Cache' managment. I would like a league system taken up; where the user sets the number of websites they wish to hold and the number of days between sort-outs, when the least visited sites, above the number the user wishes to hold, are deleted. Also each time a site is loaded from the cache, and the user is on line, a check is made with the site to see if it has been updated, if it has, then the site is refreshed automatically, or a requester is popped to ask the user if they wish update the cached pages. Also the ability to delete a site and it's associated images from the cache browser. The 'Tearoff' strips need some work, as the end results are some what hit or miss. And the way that the images grey'ed out looks poor, why not take leaf out of the 'glowicon' idea, and dim the image by an adjustable amount. Or the ability to handle single or multiple image animations would give 'V³' an extra special touch. + What feature is your biggest want? Continued improvments in the audio and visual aspects. The layout engine given improved ablities in the handling of excentric code. A 'cookie' browser, where you view and remove the held 'cookies'. + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? The closer ties with Contact Manager. + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? I would have liked to have seen 'html' and 'javascript' moved outside of the main executable and become plugins. If a new language is adopted then having them as external modules would make this easier to implement. This I believe would make development faster and easier. Thank you for asking. -- Regards Jules -- I will not hang donuts on my person. -- Bart Simpson Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
I worte on 29 Mar 2000 23:50:18 +0200 about [voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager? A 'cookie' browser, where you view and remove the held 'cookies'. What on earth was I talking about? Strike it from the record. -- Regards Jules Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
In a message of 29-Mar-00 Ben Preece wrote: + What's your biggest problem with V? + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? + What feature is your biggest want? + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? A bit funny, because my answer to the above question would be "JavaScript" in more or less all cases. The important part for me is that I can use Voyager when visiting a majority of sites, and over the past one or two years JavaScript is starting to be used more and more intensively. Today you very often see a non-JavaScript site suddenly becoming a JavaScript site for no apparent reason -- one is http://www.dds.dk which I previously was able to visit without any problems -- now I have to search the source and the JavaScript code to find the links I need and paste them to the location gadget. Shockwave/Flash, Real Audio, PDF and etc. support is surely nice, but I find it to be of less importance compared to JavaScript. Lack of any of these features doesn't prevent me from ordering a new book or CD. Similarly I find the entry of JavaScript in Voyager last summer to be the most important improvement. Surely it is great that Voyager has become ultra fast and so forth, but JavaScript was the big step forward. Now we just need to have it working properly. Similarly JavaScript would be the main reason for me to move to IBrowse. I have never liked IBrowse (or AWeb), but if either of them can offer a better useability, then it is perhaps worth to consider finding a new browser. So JavaScript is also my biggest want. I really don't have many comments about the way you develop Voyager. Surely I would prefer to see updates appearing more frequently, but we have to recognize that we are using an obsolete computer that can't support full-time development, and I don't think we can ask for much more than what we get today in this respect. Uffe Holst Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Hello Ben On 30-Mar-00, you wrote: BP + What's your biggest problem with V? javascript as others have stated BP + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? Stability comes to mind and the tear-off feature plus the over all look BP + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? i use all three. If i have a problem with one i use one of the others BP + What feature is your biggest want? Java support BP + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? Personally i think you all do a great job. Can't comment on how you develop V as i can't even write an Arexx script Good to see you have changed your secure payment method. Regards -- Shane Cracknell Perth Western Australia ICQ 12263904 Jako Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Greetings... Ben On 29-Mar-00, Ben Preece wrote: The conversation on this list is being driven off-topic and is at this point in time not exactly must use to anyone. I propose to change this by trying to kick off some talk about V, and what you would like and expect of it. NO PROMISES! - but I'd rather see some decent suggestions and feeling come out of this list than anything else. So... + What's your biggest problem with V? Somewhat incomplete HTML support (especially alignment). + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? Table rendering speed up along with image decoding, Mozilla spoofing. + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? Not here. I gave up on IBrowse quite some time ago. + What feature is your biggest want? Put in some of the missing HTML elements (ordered lists, alignment). In my opinion, these are more important than adding new features. + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? I think the way you're going about it is great. I like the whole plan idea, it lets coders give a bit of info without having to actually stop for too long from coding. I like the fact that many of the Vaporware apps share components so improvements in one carry over to another. I would suggest concentrating on the HTML portion of the browser a bit more. Thanks for all the great work. Keep you comments sensible please! This is no unsubtle hint that we've got nothing to do - Olli and Zapek have plenty to do - and the last thing I want is anyone to expect me to act on something - it ain't gonna happen, we work hard as it is The point is to be constructive, so don't get carried away :) Thanks for the opportunity. Ben Fare thee well, Carlos Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
The thing I'd like to see is CSS support. I believe IB2.2 has CSS support now, and the sites I visit with it look great. Thanks in advance, Stephen Lebed [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
On 29-Mar-00, Ben Preece wrote: .. NO PROMISES! - but I'd rather see some decent suggestions and feeling come out of this list than anything else. + What's your biggest problem with V? Printing multiple pages to laser printers. + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? Flash plugin + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? I don't plan to + What feature is your biggest want? Java, Javascript (without errors-no working) and be able to import Netscape bookmarks + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? Just that we need a working Java/Javascript engine Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
On 29-Mar-00, Ben Preece wrote: + What's your biggest problem with V? Printing any pages to laser printers, and the fact that the printout is pretty bad compared to the iMacs I use at our school... yes they are printing to PostScript, but I DO have a postscript printer here at home! I have not managed to get anything close to what I would consider great... + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? Flash plugin, I guess, and the speed increases and reliability + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? I use IBrowse 80% of the time *MOSTLY* because the screen images are far, *far* superior... I can even tell what the danged things are... I often cannot even guess what I am looking at with V or AW!!!... (on my 8 colour system.) IBrowse works like a charm in that area! Yes, I do have an ECS system, and probably will for at least a year more! Not all of us can afford the PPC and graphics systems I see listed with some of the .sigs. Some people must have rich relatives... mine are all dead, and they died broke! : ((( + What feature is your biggest want? Javascript without any errors; to be able to go anywhere that my Pentium can, with the ease that makes an Amiga the OS it is! + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? NOTHING negative IN spite of my whining about the lack of good image rendering, I do like a lot about V... MOSTLY, though, I absolutely love the effort and attitude you all seem to *keep* *up* even when we grumps out here cry and cry and cry after you have spent 123,456,001.44 hours on the program, and seem to be only negative about it anyway. We Amigan's seem to be like that. : (( I would like to make it official, at least from me, that I thank you from the bottom of my heart and soul for your support of the Amiga. Without people like you, my favourite machine would be pushing up daisies!!! You deserve some sort of award... However, so do the other Amiga supporting programmers. YOU a.. are a very special, wonderful group of people ... *AND* so are the support staff you have collecting all the bugs and handling the complaints from this peanut gallary... : ) Gil -- ~~ Gil Knutson's Pride and Joy ~~~ [EMAIL PROTECTED] - OS3.5 - Sardis, BC, Canada A3000/30/2+16 RAM + 240 meg Quantum + 1.06 gig Seagate + ZIP Drive MFCardIII+GVC 56k Speakerphone+Lexmark 4039 10R w/16meg THOR2.6, MUI3.8, MWB, Voyager3, AmIRC 2.0, AmFTP 1.65 (all reg) ~~~ The Amiga Shall Inherit the Earth Man will occasionally stumble over the truth, but most times he will pick himself up and carry on... -- Winston Churchill Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Hi all. + What's your biggest problem with V? V 3.0.52: pressing any special key (ctrl,A,Shift or Alt) results in a weird entry (B§?o) in the location field and a requester pops up. The requester reads: "An error occured! Unable to open page B§?o Unknown URL transfer method "***NULL POINTER***"." This effect didn`t occur up to V 3.0.37. + What has been the best improvement or addition in the last year? The best improvement is using tearoff. And as eyecandy: the new transferanim. 8-) + If you decide to use IBrowse instead of V, why is that? Because it`s the last available browser on earth. I`ve tested AWeb, IBrowse, Netscape in variations, lynx and w3m. I prefer sticking to V and lynx. + What feature is your biggest want? - a button to deny target=_blank or to substitude target=_blank with target=_top - CSS, RealAudio and PDF. - Better cookie handling with an accept/deny list. - German catalog files. (I volunteer for doing these.) - I would like to be able to configure the fastlinks to be vertical for all windows at once without using tearoff. ++ I would like to see the automated popup of the SASG-registration program being removed. + Have you got any general comments about the way we develop V? I would like to see more betas or at least some interim progress postings. Keep the good work up. -- Best wishes and regards Joachim "Joooch" Nink Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
Gil :))) Yer kidding, right? No I'm not. Voyager and AWeb are constantly being upgraded, and it had been many a moon since IB2.1 was first seen. Why would you think that? The usage of it is larger than Voyager... maybe by only 5 or 10 percent, but still the more popular of the two. I know that on my system the graphics of IBrowse beat the living snot out of both AWeb and Voyager... and goes to as many sites... Really? Voyager looks great here. well, it did until just this last update, then Voyager took a big step forward... but still has horribly ugly graphics. When I go to eBay, 80% of the time I cannot tell what the images ARE, let alone enjoy them. This I cannot believe!! AND, I have fiddled and changed settings until I am blue in the face and done the same on AWeb... but their choice to use datatypes leaves a hell of a lot to be desired on a stock ECS machine Aaah. Don't know anything about ECS. I went directly from OCS to AGA when I first upgraded, and I use CV64/3D.. Go forth my son, and acquire a GFX card!!! Scoff at the minimum 800x600 sites :) To my understanding IB does dither better than AWeb or V³, but I don't dither:) Don't get me wrong, I like Voyager too, am not really fond of AWeb, but do like how IBrowse looks and feels Actually, AWeb is the most capable browser of the three. It has functioning JS and the most configurable. Most AWeb problems are contained in people having the wrong settings. Too bad they have the absolute worst demo. AWeb is the *only* web-browser that was designed from the ground up to be unique. Voyager has by far the slickest interface--bar none. IB is a very reliable browser, but I just haven't seen any real upgrades in quite a while. Also, IB is no longer on the "front page" of HiSoft's web-site. compared to any of the others, including NS and IE5... which we have now installed on our iMacs at school. in the words of my friends.. *quack* To each his own... I am very, very sure others will disagree with me. : Nothing against IB, and no offense taken. But, V is still my favorite browser with AWeb a close second. Besides, the only thing that IB does that is really new I can't see in action from their demo. And, when I can afford it, I WILL buy AWeb... I did not use it much before because it did not do what I wanted, in a way I want. I do not feel badly about :)) Yeah, there demo really stinks. using it now because it is part of my 3.5 package, but because I do not need it, I have not registered it. I think I have used it a total of 5 times all together... and that was just to check "new" versions to see if they did what my Pentuim will not do... or what my iMac at school will do. I believe I will buy IB2 at the St. Louis show :) We should all buy everything we can... there's not many of us left. I'm not saying to go hungry (bet someone *will* disagree with that!). Dave A4000 040/40 CV64-3D Canon BJC4100 HyperCom3+ Aceex56kmodem CheezySpeakers And a $20-thriftStore-Special-VGA-monitor Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What do you want in Voyager?
On 29-Mar-00,* David C.*, of Planet Eros, wrote these Wise Words: Yer kidding, right? No I'm not. Voyager and AWeb are constantly being upgraded, and it had been many a moon since IB2.1 was first seen. BUT, on my machine, IBrowse works many times better than the other two... except when AW got JS first. Really? Voyager looks great here. And, you are using a stock, EGS machine as well? Maybe on a 1200 or something with a graphics card, V and AW look ok, but on my 3000, nothing that uses datatypes look acceptable. IBrowse, as I have said 34,567 times here, beats the other two hands down. well, it did until just this last update, then Voyager took a big step forward... but still has horribly ugly graphics. When I go to eBay, 80% of the time I cannot tell what the images ARE, let alone enjoy them. This I cannot believe!! Believe it. If I want to see what the graphic really is with V or AW, I save it and view it with FastView... which is the best viewer for an ECS machine. I have used the Amiga since 1986, in various forms, and have tried almost everything in them except for 040's, 060, PPCs and graphics cards. I have tried every possible graphic configuration, from dithering and whatnot, to even changing the pallette to many great and ugly choices. I like the particular pallette I use now... others may hate it, but I have to live with the beast... and no matter what, most of the colour choices that dithering and viewers give me is really not very good... at least to my eye. I do not know what chance there would be of you being able to see the same screen as I if I took a screen grab of the same site with V and IBrowse and sent them to you, but if you are game, let me know and we can give that a whirl. Then, if you could see what is on my screen you would not say you disbelieve it. AND, I have fiddled and changed settings until I am blue in the face and done the same on AWeb... but their choice to use datatypes leaves a hell of a lot to be desired on a stock ECS machine Aaah. Don't know anything about ECS. I went directly from OCS to AGA when I first upgraded, and I use CV64/3D.. Go forth my son, and acquire a GFX card!!! Scoff at the minimum 800x600 sites :) To my understanding IB does dither better than AWeb or V³, but I don't dither:) As I said, any idiot knows that! Just because you can afford to do that, does not mean that I can. A graphics card is way beyond my reach for quite a while yet. Not all of us have unlimited funds... fact is, if someone offered me a PIV for $100 tomorrow, I could not afford it. Period! Don't get me wrong, I like Voyager too, am not really fond of AWeb, but do like how IBrowse looks and feels Actually, AWeb is the most capable browser of the three. It has functioning JS and the most configurable. Most AWeb problems are contained in people having the wrong settings. You should see what the buttons look like on my system with AWeb! I could not believe it!!! I am told that if I convert them to .gif, they will look fine, but the time involved is not encouraging... I have other things to do with my time. However, I do agree that it is a capable browser... but I do not really like its "feel" or layout. Too bad they have the absolute worst demo. Maybe that is the problem. AWeb is the *only* web-browser that was designed from the ground up to be unique. I have used various versions of it since it first came out. I can recall the bitter words and things said about MUI and why Yvon just "had" to make a better, faster browser. Fact is, I like MUI, and do not find it as bad as many claim. Voyager has by far the slickest interface--bar none. I cannot say that I feel that way I really like the layout and look of IB... IB is a very reliable browser, but I just haven't seen any real upgrades in quite a while. Like I said, upgrades to me do not indicate a "better" browser. I found it very stable on my system... I think I can count the crashes I got with it on one hand since I first got it years ago. Certainly no more than 10 times. Hell, Thor has crashed more often on me, and that is basically bulletproof on most systems. : )) Also, IB is no longer on the "front page" of HiSoft's web-site. And ? compared to any of the others, including NS and IE5... which we have now installed on our iMacs at school. in the words of my friends.. *quack* ??? Not sure what the quack is for I have no choice about the iMac... I do have to know it, and do instruct people on the use of the MAC in general... NOT by choice, as I said To each his own... I am very, very sure others will disagree with me. : Nothing against IB, and no offense taken. But, V is still my favorite browser with AWeb a close second. Besides, the only thing that IB does that is really new I can't see in action from their demo. You lost me on this one. I believe I will
[voyager] Re: What will happen with dithering?
Splatt , On 23-Feb-00, Splatt wrote: Will dithering ever work in Voyager? At the moment it does not seem to work at all (!) Do you have a gfx card? No -if I had one, then I would not have to use dithering:) Anyway, afai can understand, dithering only works if I select "ordered" dithering and "single" jpeg image pass Regards -- Christos Dimitrakakis [EMAIL PROTECTED] http://members.xoom.com/cdimita Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What will happen with dithering?
Will dithering ever work in Voyager? At the moment it does not seem to work at all (!) It does work. Set your settings to ordered, with single pass colour quant. and it goes all dithery. If you set it to ordered, two pass, the decoder defaults to Floyd-Steinberg dithering anyway, IIRC. The best results come from - for me - using f-s, one pass, fast integer decoding. Higher quality colour quantization reduces the need for dithering images. In actual fact, it can be said that Voyager's colour quant. routine is so good that it doesn't splatter a noisy fuzz over each and every image it finds whether it can find the right colours or not: like another browser we could mention ;) Just play with the settings. And if you're using less than 256 colours then don't be surprised if the 'quality' is shit, because it's more a factor of colour depth than quality of algorithms. Or summink ;) -- Matt Sealey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Distributed Systems Support Computer Centre University of Leicester Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What will happen with dithering?
On 23-Feb-00,* Sealey, M.*, of Planet Eros, wrote these Wise Words: Will dithering ever work in Voyager? At the moment it does not seem to work at all (!) It does work. Set your settings to ordered, with single pass colour quant. and it goes all dithery. If you set it to ordered, two pass, the decoder defaults to Floyd-Steinberg dithering anyway, IIRC. The best results come from - for me - using f-s, one pass, fast integer decoding. Higher quality colour quantization reduces the need for dithering images. I can certainly say, that on my 3000, Voyager cannot show anything like a reasonable graphic. I have tried every single combination... spending a few hours changing one thing at a time and looking at the results, and NONE of them look even close to IBrowse 2.1. I can tell what the colours must be at least with IBrowse, but with AWeb or Voyager, it is total ugliness, and seems restricted to 4-8 colours. With the colours I have, it is shades of blue and grey. Don't tell me to try the various settings, cuz I have done so, and had varying shades of very bad results. IBrowse worked correctly right off the Net. Yes, I have only a stock 3000 using ECS, but that is what a lot of people use, and from what I see with IBrowse, it can be done very easily. Fact is, neither V or AWeb have the same graphics power of IB. Period! IBrowse seems to ignore the colour settings I have in my system when it comes to displaying images, and uses what the image itself seems to say. The others use what I have selected via the Pallette Prefs. Gil -- ~~ Gil Knutson's Pride and Joy ~~~ [EMAIL PROTECTED] - OS3.5 - Sardis, BC, Canada A3000/30/2+16 RAM+245 meg Maxtor+1.06 gig Seagate+ZIP Drive MFCardIII+GVC 56k Speakerphone+Lexmark 4039 10R w/16meg THOR2.5a, MUI3.8, MWB, Voyager3.xbeta AmIRC 2.0, AmFTP 1.65 (all reg) ~~~ The Amiga Shall Inherit the Earth How many of you believe in telekinesis? Raise my hands Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
Hello. Any news on the voyager update that Chris Wiles mentioned on the 30th/31st Jan on the Netconnect list. He said it would be out in a week...or two ie. 6th to 13th Feb. That's well overdue now. Dear oh dear - In fact I said 'a new AmIRC and Flash module...due soon', which is what I was told by the programmers at the time. Besides, when coding, you always need to bear in mind that: 1) unexpected problems result in extended delays. 2) the fact that the software hasn't been released...indicates the software isn't *ready* for release. As soon as it is ready for release, it will be released. Unfortunately you just need to be patient, but there will be a release soon - along with fixes and a few new features (etc). Chris. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
On Tue, 22 Feb 2000 10:55:00 +, Chris Wiles [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Chris, Nice to have you back. Please, could you tell me if someone will ever get round to fixing mftpII? Please? I like the concept, but it refuses to connect to UKonline. Any help most welcome. Yeah, I know I should have posted this on the mftpII mailing list, but posting on there and getting a reply, well, that is bigger odds than winning the lottery ;) Regards Mikey C Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What will happen with dithering?
Hello C. On 23-Feb-00, you wrote: Will dithering ever work in Voyager? At the moment it does not seem to work at all (!) Do you have a gfx card? Regards Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
On Sun, 20 Feb 2000 07:37:54 -0400, Martin waffled: Any news on the voyager update that Chris Wiles mentioned on the 30th/31st Jan on the Netconnect list. He said it would be out in a week...or two ie. 6th to 13th Feb. I would have thought that you'd learned to ignore "release dates". It takes as long as it takes, sorry about that. There are no shortcuts in this business. -- Ben Preece - [EMAIL PROTECTED] V3 Webmaster and Development http://v3.vapor.com http://gamemusic.siliconcircus.co.uk Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
Hello. Any news on the voyager update that Chris Wiles mentioned on the 30th/31st Jan on the Netconnect list. He said it would be out in a week...or two ie. 6th to 13th Feb. And you BELEIVED him? ROTFLMAO! "An update for Voyager is coming RSN! Just One More Week (TM)!" That's well overdue now. Ignore any mention of release dates. ALL software slips these days. All we can do is hope for a quick death.. umm.. err.. release ;) -- Matt Sealey [EMAIL PROTECTED] Distributed Systems Support Computer Centre University of Leicester Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
Hi Martin, On 20-Feb-00 you wrote: [voyager] What happened to the next voyager update Any news on the voyager update that Chris Wiles mentioned on the 30th/31st Jan on the Netconnect list. He said it would be out in a week...or two ie. 6th to 13th Feb. That's well overdue now. I wouldn't worry about it. They're probably just trying to track down some outstanding bugs. I'd rather have a stable release than a quick release. Regards, Andrew Bell. -- ++ email: mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] web: http://www.andrewb.exl.co.uk ++ American politics, the best that money can buy. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
Hello Ben On 21-Feb-00, you wrote: Any news on the voyager update that Chris Wiles mentioned on the 30th/31st Jan on the Netconnect list. He said it would be out in a week...or two ie. 6th to 13th Feb. I would have thought that you'd learned to ignore "release dates". It takes as long as it takes, sorry about that. There are no shortcuts in this business. Are you the same Ben Preece that works on [.tv]? If you are, could you please fix Voyagers' JavaScript, so that it works with the forum pages on the [.tv] website. Thank you. Regards chris -- And what do you call Assassins, who accuse Assassins anyway? My Friend. -- Assassing, Marillion Powered by PowerPC Amiga in Dumfries Galloway A1200 Power Tower, 200Mhz PPC/060 50Mhz, BVision, 74Mb Ram, OS3.5, CGX V4.1 Panasonic 36" Wddeessccrreeennn TV, Pioneer 717 MultiRegion DVD, Denon AC3 Decoder, Mordaunt-Short Speakers, Marantz SubWoofer. Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What happened to the next voyager update
If you are, could you please fix Voyagers' JavaScript, so that it works with the forum pages on the [.tv] website. Javascript is a complex thing that Olli is still working on. As for www.tvchannel.co.uk itself, I find it bad enough in IE, and this is one of many sites that will hopefully be working in V as the interpreter becomes a more complete implementation. Given my relationship with [.tv] I will at least take a look at the source of the site for you ;) Ben -- Ben Preece [EMAIL PROTECTED] V3 Webmaster and Development http://v3.vapor.com Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
[voyager] Re: What would we do without Aweb ?
I had to go to the Control centre to modify my settings and also to manange my list when ... the dreaded " javascript got enabled " message came. Sounds like the JS is being used on form elements, which is NYI. Jason -- Jason Murray Webmaster, www.vapor.com [EMAIL PROTECTED] Voyager Mailing List - Info Archive: http://www.vapor.com/ For Listserver Help: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "HELP" To Unsubscribe: [EMAIL PROTECTED], "UNSUBSCRIBE"
