date:20140731

That's a great marketing idea, but I bet some douche is going to ruin it... 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 9:38:42 AM 
Subject: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 


http://www.droid-life.com/2014/07/30/12-a-month-for-facebook-sprint-tramples-over-net-neutrality-with-new-prepaid-plan/?utm_source=feedburnerutm_medium=feedutm_campaign=Feed%3A+DroidLife+%28Droid+Life%29utm_content=FaceBook
 
Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 
___ 
Wireless mailing list 
Wireless@wispa.org 
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 

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Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

It has nothing to do with free speech. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Luthman j...@imaginenetworksllc.com 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 10:29:06 AM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 


Oh it's great for business. Terrible for free speech. 



Josh Luthman 
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St 
Suite 1337 
Troy, OH 45373 


On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 11:19 AM, Matt Hoppes  mhop...@indigowireless.com  
wrote: 


Or the beginning of new business opportunities for smaller companies. 


On 7/31/14, 11:07 AM, Clay Stewart wrote: 
 Or the beginning of new law suits 
 
 On Jul 31, 2014 10:38 AM, Josh Luthman  j...@imaginenetworksllc.com 

 mailto: j...@imaginenetworksllc.com  wrote: 
 
 http://www.droid-life.com/2014/07/30/12-a-month-for-facebook-sprint-tramples-over-net-neutrality-with-new-prepaid-plan/?utm_source=feedburnerutm_medium=feedutm_campaign=Feed%3A+DroidLife+%28Droid+Life%29utm_content=FaceBook
  
 
 Josh Luthman 
 Office: 937-552-2340 tel: 937-552-2340  
 Direct: 937-552-2343 tel: 937-552-2343  

 1100 Wayne St 
 Suite 1337 
 Troy, OH 45373 
 
 
 ___ 
 Wireless mailing list 
 Wireless@wispa.org mailto: Wireless@wispa.org  
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 


 
 
 
 ___ 
 Wireless mailing list 
 Wireless@wispa.org 
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless 
 
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Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

You don't need NetFlix to pay you for a fast lane... just meet them in their 
dozen or so facilities and get it for free instead of paying for it. Other than 
that, I agree with you. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Joe Fiero joe1...@optonline.net 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:15:04 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 



I don’t comment all that often here, but very much pay attention to the voices 
of experience. On Net Neutrality, I have plenty to say. As with most of my FCC 
comments, what I filed 2 weeks ago with them went against the grain. I am a 
purist who has been in telecom since I repaired my first CB radio for a 
neighbor at the age of 14. I helped launch Metromedia’s cellular system in NY, 
a company I was a part owner in was the first acquisition of Fleetcall in NY 
City. Anyone as old as me would remember that Fleetcall became NexTel, and for 
the real youngsters, they were acquired by Sprint for what turned out to be a 
total write-off of $35 billion in December of 2004. I have been using 
unlicensed radio to link communications sites since long before it went 
digital. 

One thing my experience and observations have taught me is that nothing 
promotes innovation like free market. We need not look beyond our own industry 
to prove that. When no one would service 40% of America, we collectively built 
an industry that matured into a recognized and respected market sector. I was 
involved in the previous formation of an industry that is both parallel and 
intertwined with WISPS, that of home satellite television. 

Back in the mid 1970’s a band of tenacious, adventurous experimenters took 
handfuls of surplus junk and built home earth stations. In short order we went 
from being pirates and thieves to an established medium to reach rural America. 
It wasn’t long before the big money found us and pushed us out of the way. We 
went from a place where we could make a respectable income to being lackeys for 
DirecTV and DISH who generously paid us a few dollars to do the job and then 
gave us a big residual of 50 cents to about two dollars, on subscribers that 
ARPU of $100 or more. 

WISPs have been struggling to keep up with the Netflix demand since they went 
to Internet delivery in 2009. Systems big and small quickly found their choke 
points. And like in highway design, if you upgrade one intersection, the 
traffic jam just moves to the next unimproved intersection. The problem is, 
unlike the highway department, we don’t run on tax revenue. We have to charge 
subscribers for a service that is both fair and responsive to their needs. 

The SPRINT concept in the article is the most fair and responsible way to 
assure that our infrastructure can meet the demand, and that those creating the 
demand are the ones paying for it. The FCC needs to stop cow-towing to the 
illiterate public who are still touting that they need to “protect the FREE 
Internet”. Who gets this for free? If you are in a coffee shop, the proprietor 
is paying for it. Public Wi-Fi is advertising or tax subsidized. Do we get 
power, water, heating for free? 

Ten years ago we projected a mass movement from the PSTN to VoIP. Even the 
industry experts never predicted a loss of 48% of copper lines in 10 years. 
What was built up over a century dissipated in the blink of an eye. We are 
again on the cusp of a shift in the paradigm that will see cable and satellite 
users shift to Internet based delivery on any device they desire. The same 
dramatic reduction witnessed in copper phone lines awaits the traditional 
Multichannel marketplace. And along with the big guns, we are on the front 
line. We will be expected to deliver copious amounts of data to subscribers as 
they stream HD video and music to multiple devices in their homes and offices. 

We, the WISP industry, need to step up our game if we are going to remain part 
of this. We are going to have to emulate the cellular industry with frequency 
reuse like we never imagined. We are going to have to replace our older radios 
with ones that can deliver the required bandwidth, and our backhauls are going 
to need enough capacity to handle all this. 

But how do we justify the cost, who do we charge, and how do we do it? The 
early agreement with Verizon and Netflix that received the FCC’s blessing was 
never going to benefit everyone. How long would it take for you and I to get 
Netflix to pay for our “fast lane”? My guess was never. 

Netflix, Hulu, and the like have created a business model where they have no 
cost to deliver a product to their users. They are using the infrastructure 
built and paid for by others, then stirring up the ignorant masses to complain 
to the FCC about the free Internet. I have learned the hard way that no matter 
what is done to increase bandwidth, the increase is negated in short

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread Greg Osborn

I don’t believe that to be most everyone’s gripe.  Internet and transport are 
cheap in comparison to backhaul and the labor required to implement.  We have 
around 250 links, if you take Netflix out of the equation, you are not chasing 
your tail upgrading them all the time.

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 1:31 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

 

You don't need NetFlix to pay you for a fast lane...  just meet them in their 
dozen or so facilities and get it for free instead of paying for it. Other than 
that, I agree with you.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

 https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL  
https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb  
https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions  
https://twitter.com/ICSIL 



  _  

From: Joe Fiero joe1...@optonline.net mailto:joe1...@optonline.net 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org mailto:wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:15:04 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

I don’t comment all that often here, but very much pay attention to the voices 
of experience.  On Net Neutrality, I have plenty to say.  As with most of my 
FCC comments, what I filed 2 weeks ago with them went against the grain.  I am 
a purist who has been in telecom since I repaired my first CB radio for a 
neighbor at the age of 14.  I helped launch Metromedia’s cellular system in NY, 
 a company I was a part owner in was the first acquisition of Fleetcall in NY 
City.  Anyone as old as me would remember that Fleetcall became NexTel, and for 
the real youngsters, they were acquired by Sprint for what turned out to be a 
total write-off of $35 billion in December of 2004.  I have been using 
unlicensed radio to link communications sites since long before it went 
digital.  

 

One thing my experience and observations have taught me is that nothing 
promotes innovation like free market.  We need not look beyond our own industry 
to prove that.  When no one would service 40% of America, we collectively built 
an industry that matured into a recognized and respected market sector.   I was 
involved in the previous formation of an industry that is both parallel and 
intertwined with WISPS, that of home satellite television. 

 

Back in the mid 1970’s a band of tenacious, adventurous experimenters took 
handfuls of surplus junk and built home earth stations.  In short order we went 
from being pirates and thieves to an established medium to reach rural America. 
 It wasn’t long before the big money found us and pushed us out of the way.  We 
went from a place where we could make a respectable income to being lackeys for 
DirecTV and DISH who generously paid us a few dollars to do the job and then 
gave us a big residual of 50 cents to about two dollars, on subscribers that 
ARPU of $100 or more.

 

WISPs have been struggling to keep up with the Netflix demand since they went 
to Internet delivery in 2009.  Systems big and small quickly found their choke 
points.  And like in highway design, if you upgrade one intersection, the 
traffic jam just moves to the next unimproved intersection.  The problem is, 
unlike the highway department, we don’t run on tax revenue.  We have to charge 
subscribers for a service that is both fair and responsive to their needs.

 

The SPRINT concept in the article is the most fair and responsible way to 
assure that our infrastructure can meet the demand, and that those creating the 
demand are the ones paying for it.  The FCC needs to stop cow-towing to the 
illiterate public who are still touting that they need to “protect the FREE 
Internet”.  Who gets this for free?  If you are in a coffee shop, the 
proprietor is paying for it.  Public Wi-Fi is advertising or tax subsidized.  
Do we get power, water, heating for free?  

 

Ten years ago we projected a mass movement from the PSTN to VoIP.  Even the 
industry experts never predicted a loss of 48% of copper lines in 10 years.  
What was built up over a century dissipated in the blink of an eye.  We are 
again on the cusp of a shift in the paradigm that will see cable and satellite 
users shift to Internet based delivery on any device they desire.  The same 
dramatic reduction witnessed in copper phone lines awaits the traditional 
Multichannel marketplace.  And along with the big guns, we are on the front 
line.  We will be expected to deliver copious amounts of data to subscribers as 
they stream HD video and music to multiple devices in their homes and offices.  

 

We, the WISP industry, need to step up our game if we are going to remain part 
of this.  We are going to have to emulate the cellular industry with frequency 
reuse like we never imagined.  We are going to have to replace our older radios 
with ones that can deliver

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread James Howard

Do you get the connection to that facility for free?  This is just like every 
time the bandwidth cost discussion comes up.  The prices that people post that 
they’re paying in carrier hotels never include the cost of the connection 
they’re using to get there, much less the cross connect and rack fees.

Just saying……

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:31 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

You don't need NetFlix to pay you for a fast lane...  just meet them in their 
dozen or so facilities and get it for free instead of paying for it. Other than 
that, I agree with you.


-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

[http://www.ics-il.com/images/fbicon.png]https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL[http://www.ics-il.com/images/googleicon.png]https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb[http://www.ics-il.com/images/linkedinicon.png]https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions[http://www.ics-il.com/images/twittericon.png]https://twitter.com/ICSIL


From: Joe Fiero joe1...@optonline.netmailto:joe1...@optonline.net
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.orgmailto:wireless@wispa.org
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:15:04 PM
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end
I don’t comment all that often here, but very much pay attention to the voices 
of experience.  On Net Neutrality, I have plenty to say.  As with most of my 
FCC comments, what I filed 2 weeks ago with them went against the grain.  I am 
a purist who has been in telecom since I repaired my first CB radio for a 
neighbor at the age of 14.  I helped launch Metromedia’s cellular system in NY, 
 a company I was a part owner in was the first acquisition of Fleetcall in NY 
City.  Anyone as old as me would remember that Fleetcall became NexTel, and for 
the real youngsters, they were acquired by Sprint for what turned out to be a 
total write-off of $35 billion in December of 2004.  I have been using 
unlicensed radio to link communications sites since long before it went digital.

One thing my experience and observations have taught me is that nothing 
promotes innovation like free market.  We need not look beyond our own industry 
to prove that.  When no one would service 40% of America, we collectively built 
an industry that matured into a recognized and respected market sector.   I was 
involved in the previous formation of an industry that is both parallel and 
intertwined with WISPS, that of home satellite television.

Back in the mid 1970’s a band of tenacious, adventurous experimenters took 
handfuls of surplus junk and built home earth stations.  In short order we went 
from being pirates and thieves to an established medium to reach rural America. 
 It wasn’t long before the big money found us and pushed us out of the way.  We 
went from a place where we could make a respectable income to being lackeys for 
DirecTV and DISH who generously paid us a few dollars to do the job and then 
gave us a big residual of 50 cents to about two dollars, on subscribers that 
ARPU of $100 or more.

WISPs have been struggling to keep up with the Netflix demand since they went 
to Internet delivery in 2009.  Systems big and small quickly found their choke 
points.  And like in highway design, if you upgrade one intersection, the 
traffic jam just moves to the next unimproved intersection.  The problem is, 
unlike the highway department, we don’t run on tax revenue.  We have to charge 
subscribers for a service that is both fair and responsive to their needs.

The SPRINT concept in the article is the most fair and responsible way to 
assure that our infrastructure can meet the demand, and that those creating the 
demand are the ones paying for it.  The FCC needs to stop cow-towing to the 
illiterate public who are still touting that they need to “protect the FREE 
Internet”.  Who gets this for free?  If you are in a coffee shop, the 
proprietor is paying for it.  Public Wi-Fi is advertising or tax subsidized.  
Do we get power, water, heating for free?

Ten years ago we projected a mass movement from the PSTN to VoIP.  Even the 
industry experts never predicted a loss of 48% of copper lines in 10 years.  
What was built up over a century dissipated in the blink of an eye.  We are 
again on the cusp of a shift in the paradigm that will see cable and satellite 
users shift to Internet based delivery on any device they desire.  The same 
dramatic reduction witnessed in copper phone lines awaits the traditional 
Multichannel marketplace.  And along with the big guns, we are on the front 
line.  We will be expected to deliver copious amounts of data to subscribers as 
they stream HD video and music to multiple devices in their homes and offices.

We, the WISP industry, need to step up our game if we are going to remain

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

Drop transport at more places in your network is good for resiliency and 
performance. ;-) 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Greg Osborn gregwosb...@gmail.com 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:40:40 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 



I don’t believe that to be most everyone’s gripe. Internet and transport are 
cheap in comparison to backhaul and the labor required to implement. We have 
around 250 links, if you take Netflix out of the equation, you are not chasing 
your tail upgrading them all the time. 



From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 1:31 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 


You don't need NetFlix to pay you for a fast lane... just meet them in their 
dozen or so facilities and get it for free instead of paying for it. Other than 
that, I agree with you. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 




- Original Message -


From: Joe Fiero  joe1...@optonline.net  
To: WISPA General List  wireless@wispa.org  
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:15:04 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 
I don’t comment all that often here, but very much pay attention to the voices 
of experience. On Net Neutrality, I have plenty to say. As with most of my FCC 
comments, what I filed 2 weeks ago with them went against the grain. I am a 
purist who has been in telecom since I repaired my first CB radio for a 
neighbor at the age of 14. I helped launch Metromedia’s cellular system in NY, 
a company I was a part owner in was the first acquisition of Fleetcall in NY 
City. Anyone as old as me would remember that Fleetcall became NexTel, and for 
the real youngsters, they were acquired by Sprint for what turned out to be a 
total write-off of $35 billion in December of 2004. I have been using 
unlicensed radio to link communications sites since long before it went 
digital. 

One thing my experience and observations have taught me is that nothing 
promotes innovation like free market. We need not look beyond our own industry 
to prove that. When no one would service 40% of America, we collectively built 
an industry that matured into a recognized and respected market sector. I was 
involved in the previous formation of an industry that is both parallel and 
intertwined with WISPS, that of home satellite television. 

Back in the mid 1970’s a band of tenacious, adventurous experimenters took 
handfuls of surplus junk and built home earth stations. In short order we went 
from being pirates and thieves to an established medium to reach rural America. 
It wasn’t long before the big money found us and pushed us out of the way. We 
went from a place where we could make a respectable income to being lackeys for 
DirecTV and DISH who generously paid us a few dollars to do the job and then 
gave us a big residual of 50 cents to about two dollars, on subscribers that 
ARPU of $100 or more. 

WISPs have been struggling to keep up with the Netflix demand since they went 
to Internet delivery in 2009. Systems big and small quickly found their choke 
points. And like in highway design, if you upgrade one intersection, the 
traffic jam just moves to the next unimproved intersection. The problem is, 
unlike the highway department, we don’t run on tax revenue. We have to charge 
subscribers for a service that is both fair and responsive to their needs. 

The SPRINT concept in the article is the most fair and responsible way to 
assure that our infrastructure can meet the demand, and that those creating the 
demand are the ones paying for it. The FCC needs to stop cow-towing to the 
illiterate public who are still touting that they need to “protect the FREE 
Internet”. Who gets this for free? If you are in a coffee shop, the proprietor 
is paying for it. Public Wi-Fi is advertising or tax subsidized. Do we get 
power, water, heating for free? 

Ten years ago we projected a mass movement from the PSTN to VoIP. Even the 
industry experts never predicted a loss of 48% of copper lines in 10 years. 
What was built up over a century dissipated in the blink of an eye. We are 
again on the cusp of a shift in the paradigm that will see cable and satellite 
users shift to Internet based delivery on any device they desire. The same 
dramatic reduction witnessed in copper phone lines awaits the traditional 
Multichannel marketplace. And along with the big guns, we are on the front 
line. We will be expected to deliver copious amounts of data to subscribers as 
they stream HD video and music to multiple devices in their homes and offices. 

We, the WISP industry, need to step up our game if we are going to remain part 
of this. We are going to have to emulate the cellular

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

Transport is generally less expensive than transit from the same provider. Not 
free, but certainly less expensive. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: James Howard ja...@litewire.net 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:45:07 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 



Do you get the connection to that facility for free? This is just like every 
time the bandwidth cost discussion comes up. The prices that people post that 
they’re paying in carrier hotels never include the cost of the connection 
they’re using to get there, much less the cross connect and rack fees. 

Just saying…… 



From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Mike Hammett 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:31 PM 
To: WISPA General List 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 


You don't need NetFlix to pay you for a fast lane... just meet them in their 
dozen or so facilities and get it for free instead of paying for it. Other than 
that, I agree with you. 



- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 




- Original Message -


From: Joe Fiero  joe1...@optonline.net  
To: WISPA General List  wireless@wispa.org  
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:15:04 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 
I don’t comment all that often here, but very much pay attention to the voices 
of experience. On Net Neutrality, I have plenty to say. As with most of my FCC 
comments, what I filed 2 weeks ago with them went against the grain. I am a 
purist who has been in telecom since I repaired my first CB radio for a 
neighbor at the age of 14. I helped launch Metromedia’s cellular system in NY, 
a company I was a part owner in was the first acquisition of Fleetcall in NY 
City. Anyone as old as me would remember that Fleetcall became NexTel, and for 
the real youngsters, they were acquired by Sprint for what turned out to be a 
total write-off of $35 billion in December of 2004. I have been using 
unlicensed radio to link communications sites since long before it went 
digital. 

One thing my experience and observations have taught me is that nothing 
promotes innovation like free market. We need not look beyond our own industry 
to prove that. When no one would service 40% of America, we collectively built 
an industry that matured into a recognized and respected market sector. I was 
involved in the previous formation of an industry that is both parallel and 
intertwined with WISPS, that of home satellite television. 

Back in the mid 1970’s a band of tenacious, adventurous experimenters took 
handfuls of surplus junk and built home earth stations. In short order we went 
from being pirates and thieves to an established medium to reach rural America. 
It wasn’t long before the big money found us and pushed us out of the way. We 
went from a place where we could make a respectable income to being lackeys for 
DirecTV and DISH who generously paid us a few dollars to do the job and then 
gave us a big residual of 50 cents to about two dollars, on subscribers that 
ARPU of $100 or more. 

WISPs have been struggling to keep up with the Netflix demand since they went 
to Internet delivery in 2009. Systems big and small quickly found their choke 
points. And like in highway design, if you upgrade one intersection, the 
traffic jam just moves to the next unimproved intersection. The problem is, 
unlike the highway department, we don’t run on tax revenue. We have to charge 
subscribers for a service that is both fair and responsive to their needs. 

The SPRINT concept in the article is the most fair and responsible way to 
assure that our infrastructure can meet the demand, and that those creating the 
demand are the ones paying for it. The FCC needs to stop cow-towing to the 
illiterate public who are still touting that they need to “protect the FREE 
Internet”. Who gets this for free? If you are in a coffee shop, the proprietor 
is paying for it. Public Wi-Fi is advertising or tax subsidized. Do we get 
power, water, heating for free? 

Ten years ago we projected a mass movement from the PSTN to VoIP. Even the 
industry experts never predicted a loss of 48% of copper lines in 10 years. 
What was built up over a century dissipated in the blink of an eye. We are 
again on the cusp of a shift in the paradigm that will see cable and satellite 
users shift to Internet based delivery on any device they desire. The same 
dramatic reduction witnessed in copper phone lines awaits the traditional 
Multichannel marketplace. And along with the big guns, we are on the front 
line. We will be expected to deliver copious amounts of data to subscribers as 
they stream HD video and music to multiple devices in their homes and offices. 

We, the WISP industry, need to step up our game if we are going to

[WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the number
of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would expect.
Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure routers,
and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get complaints of
choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what others are using
successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure to try to find out
where the issue is, but if anybody has success stories and example setups
that would be great.

 

I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work and get
our Support Calls down.

 

Matt - NC Wireless

 

___
Wireless mailing list
Wireless@wispa.org
http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless

Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?


Is the VOIP traffic encapsulated in any way, such as EoIP, PPPoE, etc?

If so, AirMax will not be able to prioritize it correctly, assuming the 
correct DSCP value is assigned to the traffic to begin with.


Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 11:56 AM, Matt Brendle wrote:


So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the 
number of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I 
would expect.  Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik 
infrastructure routers, and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity 
accounts.  We get complaints of choppiness and other issues, and I 
wanted to see what others are using successfully.  I am currently 
making a test procedure to try to find out where the issue is, but if 
anybody has success stories and example setups that would be great.


I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work 
and get our Support Calls down.


Matt – NC Wireless



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[WISPA] credit card processors

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
-- 

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

Nope.  Public IP on the CPE.  CPE is set to router mode and then we are
doing DMZ to the ATA.  Customer router sits behind ATA so local QOS is being
handled by the ATA.

 

I am doing traffic shaping in the CPE, but with VoIP customers we disable
bursting.  Other than that I don't do any prioritizing.

 

-Matt

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:00 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

 

Is the VOIP traffic encapsulated in any way, such as EoIP, PPPoE, etc?

If so, AirMax will not be able to prioritize it correctly, assuming the
correct DSCP value is assigned to the traffic to begin with.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com http://www.spitwspots.com 

On 07/31/2014 11:56 AM, Matt Brendle wrote:

So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the number
of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would expect.
Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure routers,
and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get complaints of
choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what others are using
successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure to try to find out
where the issue is, but if anybody has success stories and example setups
that would be great.

 

I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work and get
our Support Calls down.

 

Matt - NC Wireless

 






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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

IP-Pay 
They work with my billing system. 
Low enough for me to not care. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:09:14 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors 

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates? 
-- 

Josh Reynolds, CIO 
SPITwSPOTS 
www.spitwspots.com 

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors


mmm needs to be compatible with quickbooks

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 12:10 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

IP-Pay
They work with my billing system.
Low enough for me to not care.



-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

https://www.facebook.com/ICSILhttps://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalbhttps://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutionshttps://twitter.com/ICSIL


*From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
*To: *WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
*Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:09:14 PM
*Subject: *[WISPA] credit card processors

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
--

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

I use QuickBooks, but not for CCs. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:12:22 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] credit card processors 


mmm needs to be compatible with quickbooks 



Josh Reynolds, CIO 
SPITwSPOTS 
www.spitwspots.com On 07/31/2014 12:10 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: 



IP-Pay 
They work with my billing system. 
Low enough for me to not care. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com 
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:09:14 PM 
Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors 

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates? 
-- 

Josh Reynolds, CIO 
SPITwSPOTS 
www.spitwspots.com 

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

2014-07-31 Thread Jon Hebb

True Merchant
www.truemerchant.com

These guys are very straight forward (something you don't find with a lot
of merchant processing companies)  have great rates.

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 4:09 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote:

 Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
 --

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

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Jon Hebb
Hebb Networks

www.hebbnetworks.com
Cell: 304.680.6777
Office: 304.460.5533
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Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

2014-07-31 Thread Matt Jenkins


http://www.netsys-direct.com/Ethernet_Extenders_s/1814.htm

Matthew Jenkins
SmarterBroadband
m...@sbbinc.net
530.272.4000

On 07/29/2014 03:59 PM, Brett Woollum wrote:
We've used the StarTech ones with a lot of success. They've worked 
well for us in cases where running a new Ethernet line would be very 
time consuming, or in cases where it's too far for Ethernet.


http://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-VDSL2-Ethernet-Extender-Single/dp/B002CLKFTG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8qid=1406674722sr=8-1keywords=startech+vdsl

Unfortunately Amazon is about $35 more per pair now... Not sure what 
changed.


Brett Woollum
Senior Sales Engineer
br...@tekify.com

*Tekify Broadband Internet Services*
Web: http://www.tekify.com
Phone: 510-266-5800, ext 6200


*From: *Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com
*To: *WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
*Sent: *Tuesday, July 29, 2014 3:54:41 PM
*Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

Will try, thanks!



Gino A. Villarini
President
Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
www.aeronetpr.com
@aeronetpr



From: Jon Hebb j...@hebbnetworks.com mailto:j...@hebbnetworks.com
Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
mailto:wireless@wispa.org

Date: Tuesday, July 29, 2014 at 6:41 PM
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org mailto:wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

To add to what Chris said, these VDSL2 extenders are very reliable and 
probably your best bet. I've used a few them in a rural summer camp 
install.



On Tue, Jul 29, 2014 at 6:39 PM, Chris Ruschmann ch...@scsalaska.net 
mailto:ch...@scsalaska.net wrote:


Look at using some VDSL2 extenders. Easiest way and we get around
70Mbps over 1 pair.

We using theplanet extenders


http://www.dsl-warehouse.com/product_info.php?cPath=55products_id=295osCsid=e2bffc541684f5e30d8ffd031df783a0

*From:*wireless-boun...@wispa.org
mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On Behalf Of *Gino Villarini
*Sent:* Tuesday, July 29, 2014 2:37 PM
*To:* WISPA General List
*Subject:* [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

Any options for a 600’ cat3 Ethernet solution with over 50mbps
capacity for download?

Gino A. Villarini

President

Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.

www.aeronetpr.com http://www.aeronetpr.com

@aeronetpr


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--
Best Regards,
Jon Hebb
Hebb Networks

www.hebbnetworks.com http://www.hebbnetworks.com
Cell: 304.680.6777
Office: 304.460.5533

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

2014-07-31 Thread Zach Mann

Accept Bitcoin and save :)


On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 3:13 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net
wrote:

 I use QuickBooks, but not for CCs.




 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com

 https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL
 https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb
 https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions
 https://twitter.com/ICSIL

 --
 *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
 *To: *wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:12:22 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors


 mmm needs to be compatible with quickbooks

  Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com
  On 07/31/2014 12:10 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

 IP-Pay
 They work with my billing system.
 Low enough for me to not care.



 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com

  https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL
 https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb
 https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions
 https://twitter.com/ICSIL

  --
 *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com j...@spitwspots.com
 *To: *WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:09:14 PM
 *Subject: *[WISPA] credit card processors

 Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
 --

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

 ___
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 Wireless@wispa.org
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless



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 Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

2014-07-31 Thread Nick Olsen

You'll want to make sure you're tagging the Voip traffic with a DSCP tag. So 
the UBNT gear will give it a dedicated timeslot. This should improve the call 
quality if your issue is related to the RF side.

 If your issue is your connection to Vitelity, Or something else in the path, 
It won't make much of a difference.

 Off question.. Does anyone know if MT Radios do any type of automatic 
classification like airmax does as part of Nstream? Can this be changed with 
DSCP tags? Or would you have to just mark the DSCP tags and queue it yourself 
on the link?

 Nick Olsen
Network Operations  (855) FLSPEED  x106




 From: Matt Brendle mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:10 PM
To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

Nope.  Public IP on the CPE.  CPE is set to router mode and then we are doing 
DMZ to the ATA.  Customer router sits behind ATA so local QOS is being handled 
by the ATA.



I am doing traffic shaping in the CPE, but with VoIP customers we disable 
bursting.  Other than that I don't do any prioritizing.



-Matt



From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:00 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?



Is the VOIP traffic encapsulated in any way, such as EoIP, PPPoE, etc?

If so, AirMax will not be able to prioritize it correctly, assuming the correct 
DSCP value is assigned to the traffic to begin with.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 11:56 AM, Matt Brendle wrote:

So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the number of 
Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would expect.  Our 
basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure routers, and 
CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get complaints of 
choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what others are using 
successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure to try to find out where 
the issue is, but if anybody has success stories and example setups that would 
be great.



I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work and get 
our Support Calls down.



Matt - NC Wireless





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 Wireless@wispa.org

 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless




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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

2014-07-31 Thread TJ Trout

I own another company where we do merchant services, if you want to email
me a copy of your current processing statement I can have one of my guys
see if we can save you any money


On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 1:26 PM, Zach Mann zma...@gmail.com wrote:

 Accept Bitcoin and save :)


 On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 3:13 PM, Mike Hammett wispawirel...@ics-il.net
 wrote:

 I use QuickBooks, but not for CCs.




 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com

 https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL
 https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb
 https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions
 https://twitter.com/ICSIL

 --
 *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
 *To: *wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:12:22 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors


 mmm needs to be compatible with quickbooks

  Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com
  On 07/31/2014 12:10 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

 IP-Pay
 They work with my billing system.
 Low enough for me to not care.



 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com

  https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL
 https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb
 https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions
 https://twitter.com/ICSIL

  --
 *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com j...@spitwspots.com
 *To: *WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:09:14 PM
 *Subject: *[WISPA] credit card processors

 Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
 --

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

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 Wireless@wispa.org
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless



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 Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

2014-07-31 Thread lar

On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 15:56:33 -0400
  Matt Brendle mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com wrote:
 So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the number
 of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would expect.
 Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure routers,
 and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get complaints of
 choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what others are using
 successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure to try to find out
 where the issue is, but if anybody has success stories and example setups
 that would be great.
 

We've been doing VOIP across dsl, dedicated and wireless circuits for years.
It's a fairly simple engineering task that is very detail oriented. Jitter is
the killer. I have and am using Cisco, Force 10, Mikrotik, UBNT, Radwin
and MRV equipment. They all work but you have to look for any possible spot
where there can be congestion and plan a way through. Mikrotik's are 
particularity
difficult because they don't re-order packets. You make room by throwing 
something
else away. Like everything Mikrotik it takes some middle to both edges thinking.

Regularly sniff your voice traffic and be sure that the dscp/tos codes are 
there. Some
switches/ providers will remove them. You can build an entire network with a
pristine voice channel in it to find your voip running best effort. I have had
that happen more than once.

Also remember adding bandwidth on one link can create two or more new 
congestion points
someplace else. details, details, details but once you get it right it's 
something to behold.

 
 
 I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work and get
 our Support Calls down.
 
 
 
 Matt - NC Wireless
 
 
 

Larry Ash
Network Administrator
Mountain West Telephone
123 W 1st St.
Casper, WY 82601
Office 307 233-8387
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

Larry,

Thanks for the feedback.  I have a mix of ATAs deployed, but I am going to
make sure they all have the right DSCP flags set for Airmax to prioritize.
I will also take your advice on sniffing and include in my testing.  That
way I can make sure the flag isn't getting stripped off somewhere on my
network.

Anybody else with suggestions/info?  I welcome all input no matter how minor
or critical it may seem.

-Matt

-Original Message-
From: l...@mwtcorp.net [mailto:l...@mwtcorp.net] 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:59 PM
To: WISPA General List; Matt Brendle
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 15:56:33 -0400
  Matt Brendle mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com wrote:
 So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the 
 number of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would
expect.
 Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure 
 routers, and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get 
 complaints of choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what 
 others are using successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure 
 to try to find out where the issue is, but if anybody has success 
 stories and example setups that would be great.
 

We've been doing VOIP across dsl, dedicated and wireless circuits for years.
It's a fairly simple engineering task that is very detail oriented. Jitter
is the killer. I have and am using Cisco, Force 10, Mikrotik, UBNT, Radwin
and MRV equipment. They all work but you have to look for any possible spot
where there can be congestion and plan a way through. Mikrotik's are
particularity difficult because they don't re-order packets. You make room
by throwing something else away. Like everything Mikrotik it takes some
middle to both edges thinking.

Regularly sniff your voice traffic and be sure that the dscp/tos codes are
there. Some switches/ providers will remove them. You can build an entire
network with a pristine voice channel in it to find your voip running best
effort. I have had that happen more than once.

Also remember adding bandwidth on one link can create two or more new
congestion points someplace else. details, details, details but once you get
it right it's something to behold.

 
 
 I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work 
 and get our Support Calls down.
 
 
 
 Matt - NC Wireless
 
 
 

Larry Ash
Network Administrator
Mountain West Telephone
123 W 1st St.
Casper, WY 82601
Office 307 233-8387

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Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

2014-07-31 Thread Matthew Jenkins

http://www.netsys-direct.com/Ethernet_Extenders_s/1814.htm

Matthew Jenkins
SmarterBroadband
m...@sbbinc.net
530.272.4000

On 07/29/2014 03:59 PM, Brett Woollum wrote:
 We've used the StarTech ones with a lot of success. They've worked 
 well for us in cases where running a new Ethernet line would be very 
 time consuming, or in cases where it's too far for Ethernet.

 http://www.amazon.com/StarTech-com-VDSL2-Ethernet-Extender-Single/dp/B002CLKFTG/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8qid=1406674722sr=8-1keywords=startech+vdsl

 Unfortunately Amazon is about $35 more per pair now... Not sure what 
 changed.

 Brett Woollum
 Senior Sales Engineer
 br...@tekify.com

 *Tekify Broadband Internet Services*
 Web: http://www.tekify.com
 Phone: 510-266-5800, ext 6200

 
 *From: *Gino Villarini g...@aeronetpr.com
 *To: *WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Tuesday, July 29, 2014 3:54:41 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

 Will try, thanks!



 Gino A. Villarini
 President
 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.
 www.aeronetpr.com
 @aeronetpr



 From: Jon Hebb j...@hebbnetworks.com mailto:j...@hebbnetworks.com
 Reply-To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org 
 mailto:wireless@wispa.org
 Date: Tuesday, July 29, 2014 at 6:41 PM
 To: WISPA General List wireless@wispa.org mailto:wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

 To add to what Chris said, these VDSL2 extenders are very reliable and 
 probably your best bet. I've used a few them in a rural summer camp 
 install.


 On Tue, Jul 29, 2014 at 6:39 PM, Chris Ruschmann ch...@scsalaska.net 
 mailto:ch...@scsalaska.net wrote:

 Look at using some VDSL2 extenders. Easiest way and we get around
 70Mbps over 1 pair.

 We using theplanet extenders

 
 http://www.dsl-warehouse.com/product_info.php?cPath=55products_id=295osCsid=e2bffc541684f5e30d8ffd031df783a0

 *From:*wireless-boun...@wispa.org
 mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
 [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
 mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] *On Behalf Of *Gino Villarini
 *Sent:* Tuesday, July 29, 2014 2:37 PM
 *To:* WISPA General List
 *Subject:* [WISPA] Ethernet over cat3 options

 Any options for a 600’ cat3 Ethernet solution with over 50mbps
 capacity for download?

 Gino A. Villarini

 President

 Aeronet Wireless Broadband Corp.

 www.aeronetpr.com http://www.aeronetpr.com

 @aeronetpr


 ___
 Wireless mailing list
 Wireless@wispa.org mailto:Wireless@wispa.org
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless




 -- 
 Best Regards,
 Jon Hebb
 Hebb Networks

 www.hebbnetworks.com http://www.hebbnetworks.com
 Cell: 304.680.6777
 Office: 304.460.5533

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 Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

2014-07-31 Thread Chris Ruschmann

I don't have anything to offer, but we are planning a limited rollout of
VOIP and would be interested in feedback as well.

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Matt Brendle
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 1:11 PM
To: 'WISPA General List'
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

Larry,

Thanks for the feedback.  I have a mix of ATAs deployed, but I am going to
make sure they all have the right DSCP flags set for Airmax to prioritize.
I will also take your advice on sniffing and include in my testing.  That
way I can make sure the flag isn't getting stripped off somewhere on my
network.

Anybody else with suggestions/info?  I welcome all input no matter how
minor or critical it may seem.

-Matt

-Original Message-
From: l...@mwtcorp.net [mailto:l...@mwtcorp.net]
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:59 PM
To: WISPA General List; Matt Brendle
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 15:56:33 -0400
  Matt Brendle mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com wrote:
 So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the
 number of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I
 would
expect.
 Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure
 routers, and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get
 complaints of choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what
 others are using successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure
 to try to find out where the issue is, but if anybody has success
 stories and example setups that would be great.

We've been doing VOIP across dsl, dedicated and wireless circuits for
years.
It's a fairly simple engineering task that is very detail oriented. Jitter
is the killer. I have and am using Cisco, Force 10, Mikrotik, UBNT, Radwin
and MRV equipment. They all work but you have to look for any possible
spot where there can be congestion and plan a way through. Mikrotik's are
particularity difficult because they don't re-order packets. You make room
by throwing something else away. Like everything Mikrotik it takes some
middle to both edges thinking.

Regularly sniff your voice traffic and be sure that the dscp/tos codes are
there. Some switches/ providers will remove them. You can build an entire
network with a pristine voice channel in it to find your voip running best
effort. I have had that happen more than once.

Also remember adding bandwidth on one link can create two or more new
congestion points someplace else. details, details, details but once you
get it right it's something to behold.

 I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work
 and get our Support Calls down.

 Matt - NC Wireless

Larry Ash
Network Administrator
Mountain West Telephone
123 W 1st St.
Casper, WY 82601
Office 307 233-8387

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

2014-07-31 Thread Chris Ruschmann

We use Propay for our WISP stuff. I believe it's around 2.5

Starting up Authorize.net with processing through chase for some of our
Unifi stuff. No rates yet, still negotiating.

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 12:09 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
-- 

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

2014-07-31 Thread Rubens Kuhl

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Matt Brendle 
mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com wrote:

 So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the number
 of Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would
 expect.  Our basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure
 routers, and CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get
 complaints of choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what others
 are using successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure to try to
 find out where the issue is, but if anybody has success stories and example
 setups that would be great.



 I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work and
 get our Support Calls down.




Besides the air side of the question, how is the network side ? How good is
the connection from your network to the Vitelity SIP and media servers ?
Although I would guess your issue is on the air side, good diagnosing
starts by not assuming anything...

Rubens
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[WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

2014-07-31 Thread Gino Villarini

So I have been reading on this topic lately

On the financial side the FCC is going to fund for 10 years on monthly 
installments what?

All the locations on a high cost census track that you deployed or the ones 
that actually subscribe?

Sent from my Motorola Startac... 

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

Deployed to.

The whole thing sounds like a freaking play to the cable cos (imagine that).

 From my understanding, if you were a very large provider and wanted to 
maintain market-share and not let a competitor build out in your area 
with federal funding, you could submit a bid for the competitor's 
proposed market (and a bit more) for freaking $1 for the entire project. 
You *would* have to have the whole project bankrolled by your company, 
and done in something like 18 months I believe... but you would 
theoretically win the bid (which conveniently, amounts bidded and 
received are never announced).

The bid submission system is 100% automated, from the way they described it.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:10 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 So I have been reading on this topic lately

 On the financial side the FCC is going to fund for 10 years on monthly 
 installments what?

 All the locations on a high cost census track that you deployed or the ones 
 that actually subscribe?

 Sent from my Motorola Startac...

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

2014-07-31 Thread Gino Villarini

Why would you bid $1 , if you wanted to lock the area. You would have build out 
already?

Sent from my Motorola Startac... 


 On Jul 31, 2014, at 7:26 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote:
 
 Deployed to.
 
 The whole thing sounds like a freaking play to the cable cos (imagine that).
 
 From my understanding, if you were a very large provider and wanted to 
 maintain market-share and not let a competitor build out in your area 
 with federal funding, you could submit a bid for the competitor's 
 proposed market (and a bit more) for freaking $1 for the entire project. 
 You *would* have to have the whole project bankrolled by your company, 
 and done in something like 18 months I believe... but you would 
 theoretically win the bid (which conveniently, amounts bidded and 
 received are never announced).
 
 The bid submission system is 100% automated, from the way they described it.
 
 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com
 
 On 07/31/2014 03:10 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 So I have been reading on this topic lately
 
 On the financial side the FCC is going to fund for 10 years on monthly 
 installments what?
 
 All the locations on a high cost census track that you deployed or the ones 
 that actually subscribe?
 
 Sent from my Motorola Startac...
 
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Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

It depends. I know of large ISPs with heafty cash reserves set aside for 
various projects, and it wouldn't be outside of their realm of 
morality to pull a stunt like that.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:44 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 Why would you bid $1 , if you wanted to lock the area. You would have build 
 out already?

 Sent from my Motorola Startac...


 On Jul 31, 2014, at 7:26 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote:

 Deployed to.

 The whole thing sounds like a freaking play to the cable cos (imagine that).

  From my understanding, if you were a very large provider and wanted to
 maintain market-share and not let a competitor build out in your area
 with federal funding, you could submit a bid for the competitor's
 proposed market (and a bit more) for freaking $1 for the entire project.
 You *would* have to have the whole project bankrolled by your company,
 and done in something like 18 months I believe... but you would
 theoretically win the bid (which conveniently, amounts bidded and
 received are never announced).

 The bid submission system is 100% automated, from the way they described it.

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

 On 07/31/2014 03:10 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 So I have been reading on this topic lately

 On the financial side the FCC is going to fund for 10 years on monthly 
 installments what?

 All the locations on a high cost census track that you deployed or the ones 
 that actually subscribe?

 Sent from my Motorola Startac...

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

2014-07-31 Thread Chris Ruschmann

I can think of one company off the top of my head that would pull a stunt
like that here in Alaska.

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:50 PM
To: wireless@wispa.org
Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

It depends. I know of large ISPs with heafty cash reserves set aside for
various projects, and it wouldn't be outside of their realm of morality
to pull a stunt like that.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:44 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 Why would you bid $1 , if you wanted to lock the area. You would have
build out already?

 Sent from my Motorola Startac...

 On Jul 31, 2014, at 7:26 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
wrote:

 Deployed to.

 The whole thing sounds like a freaking play to the cable cos (imagine
that).

  From my understanding, if you were a very large provider and wanted
 to maintain market-share and not let a competitor build out in your
 area with federal funding, you could submit a bid for the
 competitor's proposed market (and a bit more) for freaking $1 for the
entire project.
 You *would* have to have the whole project bankrolled by your
 company, and done in something like 18 months I believe... but you
 would theoretically win the bid (which conveniently, amounts bidded
 and received are never announced).

 The bid submission system is 100% automated, from the way they
described it.

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

 On 07/31/2014 03:10 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 So I have been reading on this topic lately

 On the financial side the FCC is going to fund for 10 years on monthly
installments what?

 All the locations on a high cost census track that you deployed or the
ones that actually subscribe?

 Sent from my Motorola Startac...

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 Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

2014-07-31 Thread Steve Barnes

Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would stop that 
practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for AP and GL.

Steve Barnes
PCSWIN.com

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?
-- 

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

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Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

:)

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:54 PM, Chris Ruschmann wrote:
 I can think of one company off the top of my head that would pull a stunt
 like that here in Alaska.


 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On
 Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
 Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 3:50 PM
 To: wireless@wispa.org
 Subject: Re: [WISPA] FCC Broadband experiments phase 2 funding question

 It depends. I know of large ISPs with heafty cash reserves set aside for
 various projects, and it wouldn't be outside of their realm of morality
 to pull a stunt like that.

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

 On 07/31/2014 03:44 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 Why would you bid $1 , if you wanted to lock the area. You would have
 build out already?
 Sent from my Motorola Startac...


 On Jul 31, 2014, at 7:26 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
 wrote:
 Deployed to.

 The whole thing sounds like a freaking play to the cable cos (imagine
 that).
   From my understanding, if you were a very large provider and wanted
 to maintain market-share and not let a competitor build out in your
 area with federal funding, you could submit a bid for the
 competitor's proposed market (and a bit more) for freaking $1 for the
 entire project.
 You *would* have to have the whole project bankrolled by your
 company, and done in something like 18 months I believe... but you
 would theoretically win the bid (which conveniently, amounts bidded
 and received are never announced).

 The bid submission system is 100% automated, from the way they
 described it.
 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

 On 07/31/2014 03:10 PM, Gino Villarini wrote:
 So I have been reading on this topic lately

 On the financial side the FCC is going to fund for 10 years on monthly
 installments what?
 All the locations on a high cost census track that you deployed or the
 ones that actually subscribe?
 Sent from my Motorola Startac...

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 Wireless@wispa.org
 http://lists.wispa.org/mailman/listinfo/wireless
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 Wireless@wispa.org
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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

Yes, we've been doing it for about... 10 years now.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:56 PM, Steve Barnes wrote:
 Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would stop that 
 practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for AP and GL.

 Steve Barnes
 PCSWIN.com

 -Original Message-
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On 
 Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
 Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM
 To: WISPA General List
 Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors

 Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

I second Steve's comment. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:05:30 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] credit card processors 

Yes, we've been doing it for about... 10 years now. 

Josh Reynolds, CIO 
SPITwSPOTS 
www.spitwspots.com 

On 07/31/2014 03:56 PM, Steve Barnes wrote: 
 Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would stop that 
 practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for AP and GL. 
 
 Steve Barnes 
 PCSWIN.com 
 
 -Original Message- 
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On 
 Behalf Of Josh Reynolds 
 Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM 
 To: WISPA General List 
 Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors 
 
 Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates? 

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

May I ask why?

Most of our subs are on autopay, so we set it and forget about it.

We also do all of our company stuff in quickbooks, and have inhouse
billing/accounting people.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 04:08 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

I second Steve's comment.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

https://www.facebook.com/ICSILhttps://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalbhttps://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutionshttps://twitter.com/ICSIL

*From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
*To: *wireless@wispa.org
*Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:05:30 PM
*Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

Yes, we've been doing it for about... 10 years now.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:56 PM, Steve Barnes wrote:
Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would
stop that practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for AP
and GL.

Steve Barnes
PCSWIN.com

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org]
On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds

Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

When they don't pay they get shut off. 
They can review their payment histories. 
They can change their billing information (and do one-time payments) without 
affecting your employees. 
You could probably drop the in-house billing/accounting people. 
Hotspot type services can integrate right into the same platform (without 
needing UniFi's walled garden). 

I suspect most of us still use QuickBooks, just not for our recurring business. 
I still use it for turn-key, consulting, etc. 

Even if you don't buy, I'd recommend having each of the billing platforms take 
you on a tour. You may notice other things to improve your operation. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:09:39 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] credit card processors 


May I ask why? 

Most of our subs are on autopay, so we set it and forget about it. 

We also do all of our company stuff in quickbooks, and have inhouse 
billing/accounting people. 



Josh Reynolds, CIO 
SPITwSPOTS 
www.spitwspots.com On 07/31/2014 04:08 PM, Mike Hammett wrote: 



I second Steve's comment. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:05:30 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] credit card processors 

Yes, we've been doing it for about... 10 years now. 

Josh Reynolds, CIO 
SPITwSPOTS 
www.spitwspots.com 

On 07/31/2014 03:56 PM, Steve Barnes wrote: 
 Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would stop that 
 practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for AP and GL. 
 
 Steve Barnes 
 PCSWIN.com 
 
 -Original Message- 
 From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [ mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org ] On 
 Behalf Of Josh Reynolds 
 Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM 
 To: WISPA General List 
 Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors 
 
 Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates? 

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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

The in house billing / accounting people - we have several, most are
multi-role.

One is our office manager, and deals primarily with billing issues, new
account sales, equipment purchasing, etc. He is also our main
office-based POC for tech support.

Then we have a bookkeeper, she deals with things on the interior
business side... employee pay stuff, shareholder/board functions, stock
certificate crap, meeting minutes, etc.

We have another part-timer who also helps with sales / collections /
etc, answering phones, (we have 4 lines plus tech support phone that
rotates between the salaried employees) [we do have a collections
company people get sent to after 90 days, we cut people off at 60 days]

People that want to review their payment histories, in our experience,
normally want an explanation of their billing cycle, etc... they come in
when they want that. One time payments are done online, but some people
keep an account with us and call to process (we don't keep their card info).

Paypal does all of our unifi hotspot stuff, and auto-drops right into
QuickBooks.

We're around 1500 subs, and incorporated.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 04:18 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

When they don't pay they get shut off.
They can review their payment histories.
They can change their billing information (and do one-time payments)
without affecting your employees.

You could probably drop the in-house billing/accounting people.
Hotspot type services can integrate right into the same platform
(without needing UniFi's walled garden).

I suspect most of us still use QuickBooks, just not for our recurring
business. I still use it for turn-key, consulting, etc.

Even if you don't buy, I'd recommend having each of the billing
platforms take you on a tour. You may notice other things to improve
your operation.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

https://www.facebook.com/ICSILhttps://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalbhttps://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutionshttps://twitter.com/ICSIL

*From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
*To: *wireless@wispa.org
*Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:09:39 PM
*Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

May I ask why?

Most of our subs are on autopay, so we set it and forget about it.

We also do all of our company stuff in quickbooks, and have inhouse
billing/accounting people.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 04:08 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

I second Steve's comment.

-
Mike Hammett
Intelligent Computing Solutions
http://www.ics-il.com

https://www.facebook.com/ICSILhttps://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalbhttps://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutionshttps://twitter.com/ICSIL

*From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com
*To: *wireless@wispa.org
*Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:05:30 PM
*Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

Yes, we've been doing it for about... 10 years now.

Josh Reynolds, CIO
SPITwSPOTS
www.spitwspots.com

On 07/31/2014 03:56 PM, Steve Barnes wrote:
Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would
stop that practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for
AP and GL.

Steve Barnes
PCSWIN.com

-Original Message-
From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org
[mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors

Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your
rates?

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Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

Correct.  I am not planning on assuming anything.  We have assumed the network 
from our NOC to the SIP servers was good in the past.  That is going to be step 
1 in my process.  I will verify good quality from there and work my way back to 
the CPE.

 

-Matt

 

From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf 
Of Rubens Kuhl
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 6:08 PM
To: WISPA General List
Subject: Re: [WISPA] VoIP - Who is using successfully?

 

 

 

On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 4:56 PM, Matt Brendle 
mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com mailto:mattagator.mailingli...@gmail.com  
wrote:

So a question for the masses.  We are selling VoIP services and the number of 
Support Calls we get about poor performance is more than I would expect.  Our 
basic setup is UBNT backhauls and APs, Mikrotik infrastructure routers, and 
CISCO/Linksys ATAs.  Primarily Vitelity accounts.  We get complaints of 
choppiness and other issues, and I wanted to see what others are using 
successfully.  I am currently making a test procedure to try to find out where 
the issue is, but if anybody has success stories and example setups that would 
be great.

 

I know that is a rather broad question, but I want to make this work and get 
our Support Calls down.

 

 

Besides the air side of the question, how is the network side ? How good is the 
connection from your network to the Vitelity SIP and media servers ? 

Although I would guess your issue is on the air side, good diagnosing starts by 
not assuming anything... 

 

Rubens

 

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread Clay Stewart

Joe, I may or may not totally agree with you... but damn I hope you post a
little more often. Thanks for the insight from your experience.

I agree the market place is where this issue will be resolved, not us, not
the government. If the top 2 streaming companies end up with 90% of the
business in a couple years, going down Sprint's type of marketing path,
history says costs to consumer will increase and a backlash will occur.
Perhaps that backlash will happen earlier in the form of unfair lawsuits
directed towards providers by some of the other free enterprise streaming
companies losing their base. I cannot see as an example, Apple sitting back
as Verizon, Sprint, Comcast and others favor delivering only Netflix and
Sony TV or what have you... something will have to give in the free
market place. Or maybe Apple TV or others lose customer base due to simply
the added costs favors one over another by price or marketing policy.

Will be another interesting time in the evolution of the Internet.


On Thu, Jul 31, 2014 at 1:15 PM, Joe Fiero joe1...@optonline.net wrote:

 I don’t comment all that often here, but very much pay attention to the
 voices of experience.  On Net Neutrality, I have plenty to say.  As with
 most of my FCC comments, what I filed 2 weeks ago with them went against
 the grain.  I am a purist who has been in telecom since I repaired my first
 CB radio for a neighbor at the age of 14.  I helped launch Metromedia’s
 cellular system in NY,  a company I was a part owner in was the first
 acquisition of Fleetcall in NY City.  Anyone as old as me would remember
 that Fleetcall became NexTel, and for the real youngsters, they were
 acquired by Sprint for what turned out to be a total write-off of $35
 billion in December of 2004.  I have been using unlicensed radio to link
 communications sites since long before it went digital.



 One thing my experience and observations have taught me is that nothing
 promotes innovation like free market.  We need not look beyond our own
 industry to prove that.  When no one would service 40% of America, we
 collectively built an industry that matured into a recognized and respected
 market sector.   I was involved in the previous formation of an industry
 that is both parallel and intertwined with WISPS, that of home satellite
 television.



 Back in the mid 1970’s a band of tenacious, adventurous experimenters took
 handfuls of surplus junk and built home earth stations.  In short order we
 went from being pirates and thieves to an established medium to reach rural
 America.  It wasn’t long before the big money found us and pushed us out of
 the way.  We went from a place where we could make a respectable income to
 being lackeys for DirecTV and DISH who generously paid us a few dollars to
 do the job and then gave us a big residual of 50 cents to about two
 dollars, on subscribers that ARPU of $100 or more.



 WISPs have been struggling to keep up with the Netflix demand since they
 went to Internet delivery in 2009.  Systems big and small quickly found
 their choke points.  And like in highway design, if you upgrade one
 intersection, the traffic jam just moves to the next unimproved
 intersection.  The problem is, unlike the highway department, we don’t run
 on tax revenue.  We have to charge subscribers for a service that is both
 fair and responsive to their needs.



 The SPRINT concept in the article is the most fair and responsible way to
 assure that our infrastructure can meet the demand, and that those creating
 the demand are the ones paying for it.  The FCC needs to stop cow-towing to
 the illiterate public who are still touting that they need to “protect the
 FREE Internet”.  Who gets this for free?  If you are in a coffee shop, the
 proprietor is paying for it.  Public Wi-Fi is advertising or tax
 subsidized.  Do we get power, water, heating for free?



 Ten years ago we projected a mass movement from the PSTN to VoIP.  Even
 the industry experts never predicted a loss of 48% of copper lines in 10
 years.  What was built up over a century dissipated in the blink of an
 eye.  We are again on the cusp of a shift in the paradigm that will see
 cable and satellite users shift to Internet based delivery on any device
 they desire.  The same dramatic reduction witnessed in copper phone lines
 awaits the traditional Multichannel marketplace.  And along with the big
 guns, we are on the front line.  We will be expected to deliver copious
 amounts of data to subscribers as they stream HD video and music to
 multiple devices in their homes and offices.



 We, the WISP industry, need to step up our game if we are going to remain
 part of this.  We are going to have to emulate the cellular industry with
 frequency reuse like we never imagined.  We are going to have to replace
 our older radios with ones that can deliver the required bandwidth, and our
 backhauls are going to need enough capacity to handle all this.



 But how do we justify the

Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread Tim Densmore


  
  
On 07/31/2014 11:15 AM, Joe Fiero wrote:
Netflix,

Hulu, and the like have created a business model where they have
no cost to deliver a product to their users.  They are using the
infrastructure built and paid for by others, then stirring up
the ignorant masses to complain to the FCC about the free
Internet.
Hi Folks,

Just a question - is this the general consensus among list members? 
I ask because in a recent similar thread on the NANOG list there was
a WISP owner presenting the same argument.  I'm curious whether this
is the viewpoint held by many WISPs.

Thanks,

Tim Densmore
  

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

I don't, no. 




- 
Mike Hammett 
Intelligent Computing Solutions 
http://www.ics-il.com 



- Original Message -

From: Tim Densmore tdensm...@tarpit.cybermesa.com 
To: wireless@wispa.org 
Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 9:31:54 PM 
Subject: Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end 

On 07/31/2014 11:15 AM, Joe Fiero wrote: 


Netflix, Hulu, and the like have created a business model where they have no 
cost to deliver a product to their users. They are using the infrastructure 
built and paid for by others, then stirring up the ignorant masses to complain 
to the FCC about the free Internet. 

Hi Folks, 

Just a question - is this the general consensus among list members? I ask 
because in a recent similar thread on the NANOG list there was a WISP owner 
presenting the same argument. I'm curious whether this is the viewpoint held by 
many WISPs. 

Thanks, 

Tim Densmore 

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread Mike Lyon

Not this WISP...

-Mike

On Thursday, July 31, 2014, Tim Densmore tdensm...@tarpit.cybermesa.com
wrote:

  On 07/31/2014 11:15 AM, Joe Fiero wrote:

 Netflix, Hulu, and the like have created a business model where they have
 no cost to deliver a product to their users.  They are using the
 infrastructure built and paid for by others, then stirring up the ignorant
 masses to complain to the FCC about the free Internet.

 Hi Folks,

 Just a question - is this the general consensus among list members?  I ask
 because in a recent similar thread on the NANOG list there was a WISP owner
 presenting the same argument.  I'm curious whether this is the viewpoint
 held by many WISPs.

 Thanks,

 Tim Densmore



-- 
Mike Lyon
408-621-4826
mike.l...@gmail.com

http://www.linkedin.com/in/mlyon
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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread Mike Lyon

And that was an extremely painful thread on NANOG, BTW

On Thursday, July 31, 2014, Mike Lyon mike.l...@gmail.com wrote:

 Not this WISP...

 -Mike

 On Thursday, July 31, 2014, Tim Densmore tdensm...@tarpit.cybermesa.com
 javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','tdensm...@tarpit.cybermesa.com'); wrote:

  On 07/31/2014 11:15 AM, Joe Fiero wrote:

 Netflix, Hulu, and the like have created a business model where they have
 no cost to deliver a product to their users.  They are using the
 infrastructure built and paid for by others, then stirring up the ignorant
 masses to complain to the FCC about the free Internet.

 Hi Folks,

 Just a question - is this the general consensus among list members?  I
 ask because in a recent similar thread on the NANOG list there was a WISP
 owner presenting the same argument.  I'm curious whether this is the
 viewpoint held by many WISPs.

 Thanks,

 Tim Densmore



 --
 Mike Lyon
 408-621-4826
 mike.l...@gmail.com javascript:_e(%7B%7D,'cvml','mike.l...@gmail.com');

 http://www.linkedin.com/in/mlyon






-- 
Mike Lyon
408-621-4826
mike.l...@gmail.com

http://www.linkedin.com/in/mlyon
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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

2014-07-31 Thread Adair Winter

We are half your size and two of us do everything you state, thanks to
powercode. We use quick books for payroll and odd invoicing/accounting
stuff.
On Jul 31, 2014 7:36 PM, Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com wrote:

  The in house billing / accounting people - we have several, most are
 multi-role.

 One is our office manager, and deals primarily with billing issues, new
 account sales, equipment purchasing, etc. He is also our main office-based
 POC for tech support.

 Then we have a bookkeeper, she deals with things on the interior
 business side... employee pay stuff, shareholder/board functions, stock
 certificate crap, meeting minutes, etc.

 We have another part-timer who also helps with sales / collections / etc,
 answering phones, (we have 4 lines plus tech support phone that rotates
 between the salaried employees) [we do have a collections company people
 get sent to after 90 days, we cut people off at 60 days]

 People that want to review their payment histories, in our experience,
 normally want an explanation of their billing cycle, etc... they come in
 when they want that. One time payments are done online, but some people
 keep an account with us and call to process (we don't keep their card info).

 Paypal does all of our unifi hotspot stuff, and auto-drops right into
 QuickBooks.

 We're around 1500 subs, and incorporated.

  Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com
  On 07/31/2014 04:18 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

 When they don't pay they get shut off.
 They can review their payment histories.
 They can change their billing information (and do one-time payments)
 without affecting your employees.
 You could probably drop the in-house billing/accounting people.
 Hotspot type services can integrate right into the same platform (without
 needing UniFi's walled garden).

 I suspect most of us still use QuickBooks, just not for our recurring
 business. I still use it for turn-key, consulting, etc.

 Even if you don't buy, I'd recommend having each of the billing platforms
 take you on a tour. You may notice other things to improve your operation.



 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com

  https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL
 https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb
 https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions
 https://twitter.com/ICSIL

  --
 *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com j...@spitwspots.com
 *To: *wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:09:39 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

 May I ask why?

 Most of our subs are on autopay, so we set it and forget about it.

 We also do all of our company stuff in quickbooks, and have inhouse
 billing/accounting people.

  Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com
  On 07/31/2014 04:08 PM, Mike Hammett wrote:

 I second Steve's comment.



 -
 Mike Hammett
 Intelligent Computing Solutions
 http://www.ics-il.com

  https://www.facebook.com/ICSIL
 https://plus.google.com/+IntelligentComputingSolutionsDeKalb
 https://www.linkedin.com/company/intelligent-computing-solutions
 https://twitter.com/ICSIL

  --
 *From: *Josh Reynolds j...@spitwspots.com j...@spitwspots.com
 *To: *wireless@wispa.org
 *Sent: *Thursday, July 31, 2014 7:05:30 PM
 *Subject: *Re: [WISPA] credit card processors

 Yes, we've been doing it for about... 10 years now.

 Josh Reynolds, CIO
 SPITwSPOTS
 www.spitwspots.com

 On 07/31/2014 03:56 PM, Steve Barnes wrote:
  Josh are you billing your Wisp customer with QuickBooks? I would stop
 that practice. Get a billing system and keep QuickBooks for AP and GL.
 
  Steve Barnes
  PCSWIN.com
 
  -Original Message-
  From: wireless-boun...@wispa.org [mailto:wireless-boun...@wispa.org
 wireless-boun...@wispa.org] On Behalf Of Josh Reynolds
  Sent: Thursday, July 31, 2014 4:09 PM
  To: WISPA General List
  Subject: [WISPA] credit card processors
 
  Who are using for credit card processing, and why? What are your rates?

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Re: [WISPA] Net neutrality, The beginning of the end

2014-07-31 Thread Tim Densmore


  
  
Absolutely - I didn't mean to rekindle it here.  I'm just surprised
when I see that kind of viewpoint, and I'm I'm trying to understand
it a little better, hopefully with a lot less saber rattling than in
that thread.  I currently agree with most of the posters in the
NANOG thread, but I've been wrong before.  Many, many times.

Tim

On 07/31/2014 08:42 PM, Mike Lyon
  wrote:

And that was an extremely painful thread on NANOG,
  BTW
  
  On Thursday, July 31, 2014, Mike Lyon mike.l...@gmail.com
  wrote:
  
Not this WISP... 


-Mike 

  On Thursday, July 31, 2014, Tim Densmore tdensm...@tarpit.cybermesa.com
  wrote:
  
 On 07/31/2014 11:15
  AM, Joe Fiero wrote:
  Netflix,


  Hulu, and the like have created a business model where
  they have no cost to deliver a product to their
  users.  They are using the infrastructure built and
  paid for by others, then stirring up the ignorant
  masses to complain to the FCC about the free Internet.
  Hi Folks,
  
  Just a question - is this the general consensus among list
  members?  I ask because in a recent similar thread on the
  NANOG list there was a WISP owner presenting the same
  argument.  I'm curious whether this is the viewpoint held
  by many WISPs.
  
  Thanks,
  
  Tim Densmore

  



-- 

  Mike Lyon
  408-621-4826
  
  mike.l...@gmail.com
  
  
  
  http://www.linkedin.com/in/mlyon
  
  
  
  
  
  


  
  
  
  -- 
  
Mike Lyon
408-621-4826

mike.l...@gmail.com



http://www.linkedin.com/in/mlyon






  
  
  
  
  
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Re: [WISPA] credit card processors