Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

I always do the same.  Carb still busted :(

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Apr 6, 2016 8:42 PM, "Bill Prince"  wrote:

> We have a generator that we've had for almost 20 years. I always run the
> carb dry and/or drain the fuel when I shut it down. Still seems to be
> working.
>
> bp
> 
>
> On 4/3/2016 5:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>> a look at.
>>
>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>> 24 hour run time...
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Bill Prince]

We have a generator that we've had for almost 20 years. I always run the 
carb dry and/or drain the fuel when I shut it down. Still seems to be 
working.


bp


On 4/3/2016 5:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first 
pull.  Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing 
apart the old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have 
someone else take a look at.


Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't 
know if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 
gallons and 24 hour run time...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Casey | WISPA]

I got those too but they don't support the amperage necessary, do they? I had 
no luck with mine when I tried to recharge my APC ups and run the tower at the 
same time. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Apr 4, 2016, at 11:24 AM, Chris Fabien <ch...@lakenetmi.com> wrote:
> 
> I got a few of the $100 2-cycle generators from Harbor Freight. Connected to 
> a 10-gal fuel tank they will run for about 5 days with a light load. Cheap 
> enough to just have a few spares on hand. 
> 
>> On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 9:22 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:
>> Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.
>> 
>> Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large tank 
>> to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.
>> 
>> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat 
>> energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.
>> 
>> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the 
>> tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old 
>> ones up for smokers).
>> 
>> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a 
>> common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into 
>> the heated building if there is a heated building.  Generac was infamous for 
>> supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.
>> 
>> I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all 
>> generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.
>> 
>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>> Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>> 
>> 
>> Propane
>> 
>>> On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull. 
>>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the 
>>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take 
>>> a look at.
>>> 
>>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two wheels 
>>> but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd 
>>> buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24 hour 
>>> run time...
>>> 
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
> 

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Jason Wilson]

> the generator running.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer
>>>>>>         but you need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the
>>>>>> thing started.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at
>>>>>> the bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the
>>>>>> amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones up for
>>>>>> smokers).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter
>>>>>> motor battery is a common point of failure as is
>>>>>> charger.  I like to remote the battery into the heated
>>>>>> building if there is a heated building. Generac was
>>>>>> infamous for supplying a charger that failed and you
>>>>>> didn't know until you needed.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I started putting telemetry on all starter motor
>>>>>> batteries on all generators.  That is the most important
>>>>>> bit of data you need to monitor.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
>>>>>> To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Propane
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I've had a handful of generators that always started
>>>>>> on the first pull. Until today.  Got another one for
>>>>>> the site but started tearing apart the old one and I
>>>>>> think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone
>>>>>> else take a look at.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're
>>>>>> portable with two wheels but require two people or a
>>>>>> ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd buy
>>>>>> these size units again but I really do like the 8.5
>>>>>> gallons and 24 hour run time...
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Josh Luthman
>>>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 
>>>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 
>>>>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>>>>> Suite 1337
>>>>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Mathew Howard]

We actually have one of those in town here too... I think it's 110 octane,
unfortunately, I've never had a use for it :P

On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 2:46 PM, Robert Andrews <i...@avantwireless.com>
wrote:

> We have a station here in Reno that sells 110 and 114 Octane racing fuel
> at the pump...   Vro  And $$
>
> On 04/04/2016 11:14 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:
>
>> We have quite a few stations up here that sell ethanol free gas...
>> mostly 91 octane, but a few have 87 too... of course you pay quite a bit
>> extra for it.
>>
>> On Apr 4, 2016 1:10 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
>> <mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:
>>
>> Not in the midwest. All blends are E10.
>>
>> On 4/4/2016 12:55 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah anywhere where boating or motor sports are popular you might
>>> find ethanol free.
>>> I also seem to think the higher octane fuels won't have ethanol,
>>> but I can't remember why I think that.
>>>
>>> On 4/4/2016 1:51 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>>>
>>>> Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have
>>>> ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We
>>>> keep a couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares,
>>>> but we primarily use the Yamaha w/ propane.
>>>>
>>>> My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the
>>>> E10/87 (87 octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding
>>>> the timing. I'm running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent
>>>> added to try to clean it up. If I could find some of the old GM
>>>> Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the EPA banned it. So they
>>>> give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's nowhere near
>>>> enough detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not pulling
>>>> the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my
>>>> truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.
>>>>
>>>> On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> The labels say no ethanol!
>>>>>
>>>>> Josh Luthman
>>>>> Office: 937-552-2340 
>>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343 
>>>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>>>> Suite 1337
>>>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
>>>>> <mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F
>>>>> before. It can be a bitch to get started because of the
>>>>> protection valves in tanks now. We had one old tank without
>>>>> the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every time.
>>>>> Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.
>>>>>
>>>>> One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit
>>>>> gasoline is that small/carb engines were never designed to
>>>>> run the ethanol blends. The ethanol is corrosive to
>>>>> non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all FlexFuel
>>>>> certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a
>>>>> few problems.
>>>>>
>>>>> Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a
>>>>> very very large tank to generate enough vapor to keep
>>>>> the generator running.
>>>>>
>>>>> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer
>>>>> but you need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the
>>>>> thing started.
>>>>>
>>>>> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at
>>>>>     the bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the
>>>>> amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones up for
>>>>> smokers).
>>>>>
>>>>> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Ken Hohhof]

I remember filling up with Sunoco 260 around 1970 for less than 25 cents per 
gallon - plus S Green Stamps!  I remember it as being 100 octane, but 
Wikipedia says more like 97 octane.



-Original Message- 
From: Robert Andrews

Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 2:46 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

We have a station here in Reno that sells 110 and 114 Octane racing fuel
at the pump...   Vro  And $$

On 04/04/2016 11:14 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

We have quite a few stations up here that sell ethanol free gas...
mostly 91 octane, but a few have 87 too... of course you pay quite a bit
extra for it.

On Apr 4, 2016 1:10 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:

Not in the midwest. All blends are E10.

On 4/4/2016 12:55 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

Yeah anywhere where boating or motor sports are popular you might
find ethanol free.
I also seem to think the higher octane fuels won't have ethanol,
but I can't remember why I think that.

On 4/4/2016 1:51 PM, George Skorup wrote:

Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have
ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We
keep a couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares,
but we primarily use the Yamaha w/ propane.

My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the
E10/87 (87 octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding
the timing. I'm running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent
added to try to clean it up. If I could find some of the old GM
Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the EPA banned it. So they
give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's nowhere near
enough detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not pulling
the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my
truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.

On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:


The labels say no ethanol!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F
before. It can be a bitch to get started because of the
protection valves in tanks now. We had one old tank without
the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every time.
Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit
gasoline is that small/carb engines were never designed to
run the ethanol blends. The ethanol is corrosive to
non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all FlexFuel
certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a
few problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a
very very large tank to generate enough vapor to keep
the generator running.

Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer
but you need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the
thing started.

And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at
the bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the
amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones up for
smokers).

And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter
motor battery is a common point of failure as is
charger.  I like to remote the battery into the heated
building if there is a heated building. Generac was
infamous for supplying a charger that failed and you
didn't know until you needed.

I started putting telemetry on all starter motor
batteries on all generators.  That is the most important
bit of data you need to monitor.

-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
    Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started
on the first pull. Until today.  Got another one for
the site but started tearing apart the old one and I
think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone
else take a look at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're
portable with two wheels but require two people or a
ramp to put in the truck.  I don'

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Robert Andrews]

Wow, Ethanol for free...  Got to convert those generators   ( yeah I 
got what he meant, but it was right there for the taking...


On 04/04/2016 01:21 PM, Ken Hohhof wrote:

I would have thought it would be 3.2% like your “beer”.
*From:* Chuck McCown <mailto:ch...@wbmfg.com>
*Sent:* Monday, April 04, 2016 12:52 PM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
In Utah, one of our larger gas station chains sells ethanol free at the
pump.
*From:* George Skorup <mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>
*Sent:* Monday, April 04, 2016 11:51 AM
*To:* af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
*Subject:* Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have
ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a
couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily
use the Yamaha w/ propane.

My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87
octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm
running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it
up. If I could find some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that,
but the EPA banned it. So they give us shit gas and no means to clean
it. There's nowhere near enough detergent in any of the regular
gasolines. I'm not pulling the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I
did find out that my truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.

On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:


The labels say no ethanol!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It
can be a bitch to get started because of the protection valves in
tanks now. We had one old tank without the valve and it would fire
up on the first pull every time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the
choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline
is that small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol
blends. The ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems.
This is why all FlexFuel certified systems are stainless delivery,
injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few
problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very
very large tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator
running.

Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you
need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.

And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the
bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk
in those tanks (I cut old ones up for smokers).

And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor
battery is a common point of failure as is charger.  I like to
remote the battery into the heated building if there is a
heated building. Generac was infamous for supplying a charger
that failed and you didn't know until you needed.

I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on
all generators.  That is the most important bit of data you
need to monitor.

-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started on
the first pull. Until today.  Got another one for the site
but started tearing apart the old one and I think it's a
bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a look at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're
portable with two wheels but require two people or a ramp
to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd buy these size
units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24
hour run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Chuck McCown]

Hey, it is 4.0% ABV...

From: Ken Hohhof 
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 2:21 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

I would have thought it would be 3.2% like your “beer”.

From: Chuck McCown 
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 12:52 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

In Utah, one of our larger gas station chains sells ethanol free at the pump.  

From: George Skorup 
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 11:51 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have ethanol-free 
gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a couple cheap gas 
inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily use the Yamaha w/ 
propane.

My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87 octane 
my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm running some 
Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it up. If I could find 
some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the EPA banned it. So 
they give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's nowhere near enough 
detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not pulling the heads to clean 
the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my truck shuts down at 98MPH too. 
Lame.


On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

  The labels say no ethanol!

  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be a 
bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We had one 
old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every time. 
Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is that 
small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. The ethanol 
is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all FlexFuel certified 
systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.

  Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large 
tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.

  Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat 
energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.

  And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the 
tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones 
up for smokers).

  And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a 
common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into the 
heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was infamous for 
supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.

  I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all 
generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.

  -Original Message- From: George Skorup
  Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

  Propane

  On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull. 
Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the old 
one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a look 
at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if 
I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24 hour 
run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Ken Hohhof]

I would have thought it would be 3.2% like your “beer”.

From: Chuck McCown 
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 12:52 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

In Utah, one of our larger gas station chains sells ethanol free at the pump.  

From: George Skorup 
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 11:51 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have ethanol-free 
gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a couple cheap gas 
inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily use the Yamaha w/ 
propane.

My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87 octane 
my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm running some 
Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it up. If I could find 
some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the EPA banned it. So 
they give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's nowhere near enough 
detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not pulling the heads to clean 
the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my truck shuts down at 98MPH too. 
Lame.


On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

  The labels say no ethanol!

  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be a 
bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We had one 
old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every time. 
Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is that 
small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. The ethanol 
is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all FlexFuel certified 
systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.

  Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large 
tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.

  Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat 
energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.

  And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the 
tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones 
up for smokers).

  And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a 
common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into the 
heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was infamous for 
supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.

  I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all 
generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.

  -Original Message- From: George Skorup
  Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

  Propane

  On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull. 
Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the old 
one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a look 
at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if 
I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24 hour 
run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Robert Andrews]

We have a station here in Reno that sells 110 and 114 Octane racing fuel 
at the pump...   Vro  And $$


On 04/04/2016 11:14 AM, Mathew Howard wrote:

We have quite a few stations up here that sell ethanol free gas...
mostly 91 octane, but a few have 87 too... of course you pay quite a bit
extra for it.

On Apr 4, 2016 1:10 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:

Not in the midwest. All blends are E10.

On 4/4/2016 12:55 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:

Yeah anywhere where boating or motor sports are popular you might
find ethanol free.
I also seem to think the higher octane fuels won't have ethanol,
but I can't remember why I think that.

On 4/4/2016 1:51 PM, George Skorup wrote:

Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have
ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We
keep a couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares,
but we primarily use the Yamaha w/ propane.

My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the
E10/87 (87 octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding
the timing. I'm running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent
added to try to clean it up. If I could find some of the old GM
Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the EPA banned it. So they
give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's nowhere near
enough detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not pulling
the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my
truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.

On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:


The labels say no ethanol!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F
before. It can be a bitch to get started because of the
protection valves in tanks now. We had one old tank without
the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every time.
Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit
gasoline is that small/carb engines were never designed to
run the ethanol blends. The ethanol is corrosive to
non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all FlexFuel
certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a
few problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a
very very large tank to generate enough vapor to keep
the generator running.

Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer
but you need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the
thing started.

And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at
the bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the
amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones up for
smokers).

And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter
motor battery is a common point of failure as is
charger.  I like to remote the battery into the heated
building if there is a heated building. Generac was
infamous for supplying a charger that failed and you
didn't know until you needed.

I started putting telemetry on all starter motor
batteries on all generators.  That is the most important
bit of data you need to monitor.

-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
    Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started
on the first pull. Until today.  Got another one for
the site but started tearing apart the old one and I
think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone
else take a look at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're
portable with two wheels but require two people or a
ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd buy
these size units again but I really do like the 8.5
gallons and 24 hour run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Mathew Howard]

We have quite a few stations up here that sell ethanol free gas... mostly
91 octane, but a few have 87 too... of course you pay quite a bit extra for
it.
On Apr 4, 2016 1:10 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:

> Not in the midwest. All blends are E10.
>
> On 4/4/2016 12:55 PM, Adam Moffett wrote:
>
> Yeah anywhere where boating or motor sports are popular you might find
> ethanol free.
> I also seem to think the higher octane fuels won't have ethanol, but I
> can't remember why I think that.
>
> On 4/4/2016 1:51 PM, George Skorup wrote:
>
> Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have
> ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a
> couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily
> use the Yamaha w/ propane.
>
> My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87
> octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm
> running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it up.
> If I could find some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the
> EPA banned it. So they give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's
> nowhere near enough detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not
> pulling the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my
> truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.
>
> On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> The labels say no ethanol!
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:
>
>> We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be a
>> bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We had
>> one old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every
>> time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.
>>
>> One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is that
>> small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. The
>> ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all
>> FlexFuel certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.
>>
>> On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.
>>>
>>> Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large
>>> tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.
>>>
>>> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat
>>> energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.
>>>
>>> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of
>>> the tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut
>>> old ones up for smokers).
>>>
>>> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a
>>> common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into
>>> the heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was infamous for
>>> supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.
>>>
>>> I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all
>>> generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>>> Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>>>
>>> Propane
>>>
>>> On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>>>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>>>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>>>> a look at.
>>>>
>>>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>>>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>>>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>>>> 24 hour run time...
>>>>
>>>> Josh Luthman
>>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>>> Suite 1337
>>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

Buy a new truck.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 1:51 PM, George Skorup <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:

> Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have
> ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a
> couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily
> use the Yamaha w/ propane.
>
> My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87
> octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm
> running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it up.
> If I could find some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the
> EPA banned it. So they give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's
> nowhere near enough detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not
> pulling the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my
> truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.
>
> On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
> The labels say no ethanol!
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
> On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:
>
>> We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be a
>> bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We had
>> one old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every
>> time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.
>>
>> One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is that
>> small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. The
>> ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all
>> FlexFuel certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.
>>
>> On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>>
>>> Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.
>>>
>>> Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large
>>> tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.
>>>
>>> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat
>>> energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.
>>>
>>> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of
>>> the tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut
>>> old ones up for smokers).
>>>
>>> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a
>>> common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into
>>> the heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was infamous for
>>> supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.
>>>
>>> I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all
>>> generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.
>>>
>>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>>> Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
>>> To: af@afmug.com
>>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>>>
>>> Propane
>>>
>>> On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>>>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>>>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>>>> a look at.
>>>>
>>>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>>>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>>>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>>>> 24 hour run time...
>>>>
>>>> Josh Luthman
>>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>>> Suite 1337
>>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Adam Moffett]

Yeah anywhere where boating or motor sports are popular you might find 
ethanol free.
I also seem to think the higher octane fuels won't have ethanol, but I 
can't remember why I think that.


On 4/4/2016 1:51 PM, George Skorup wrote:
Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have 
ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep 
a couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares, but we 
primarily use the Yamaha w/ propane.


My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87 
octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm 
running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it 
up. If I could find some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do 
that, but the EPA banned it. So they give us shit gas and no means to 
clean it. There's nowhere near enough detergent in any of the regular 
gasolines. I'm not pulling the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I 
did find out that my truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.


On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:


The labels say no ethanol!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com 
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:


We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It
can be a bitch to get started because of the protection valves in
tanks now. We had one old tank without the valve and it would
fire up on the first pull every time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls
using the choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline
is that small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol
blends. The ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems.
This is why all FlexFuel certified systems are stainless
delivery, injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few
problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very
very large tank to generate enough vapor to keep the
generator running.

Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but
you need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.

And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the
bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk
in those tanks (I cut old ones up for smokers).

And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor
battery is a common point of failure as is charger.  I like
to remote the battery into the heated building if there is a
heated building. Generac was infamous for supplying a charger
that failed and you didn't know until you needed.

I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on
all generators.  That is the most important bit of data you
need to monitor.

-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
        Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started on
the first pull. Until today.  Got another one for the
site but started tearing apart the old one and I think
it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a
look at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're
portable with two wheels but require two people or a ramp
to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd buy these size
units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24
hour run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Chuck McCown]

In Utah, one of our larger gas station chains sells ethanol free at the pump.  

From: George Skorup 
Sent: Monday, April 04, 2016 11:51 AM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have ethanol-free 
gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a couple cheap gas 
inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily use the Yamaha w/ 
propane.

My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87 octane 
my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm running some 
Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it up. If I could find 
some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, but the EPA banned it. So 
they give us shit gas and no means to clean it. There's nowhere near enough 
detergent in any of the regular gasolines. I'm not pulling the heads to clean 
the cylinders, F that. I did find out that my truck shuts down at 98MPH too. 
Lame.


On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

  The labels say no ethanol!

  Josh Luthman
  Office: 937-552-2340
  Direct: 937-552-2343
  1100 Wayne St
  Suite 1337
  Troy, OH 45373

  On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be a 
bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We had one 
old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every time. 
Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is that 
small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. The ethanol 
is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all FlexFuel certified 
systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

  Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.

  Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large 
tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.

  Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat 
energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.

  And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the 
tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old ones 
up for smokers).

  And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a 
common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into the 
heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was infamous for 
supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.

  I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all 
generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.

  -Original Message- From: George Skorup
  Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
  To: af@afmug.com
  Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

  Propane

  On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull. 
Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the old 
one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a look 
at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if 
I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24 hour 
run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[George Skorup]

Yup. If you have a marina near you, they will most likely have 
ethanol-free gas. You'll pay a little bit more for it though. We keep a 
couple cheap gas inverter generators around for spares, but we primarily 
use the Yamaha w/ propane.


My truck is apparently so carbon'd up that I cannot run the E10/87 (87 
octane my ass) without knocking and the PCM retarding the timing. I'm 
running some Shell Nitro with extra detergent added to try to clean it 
up. If I could find some of the old GM Top Engine Cleaner, I'd do that, 
but the EPA banned it. So they give us shit gas and no means to clean 
it. There's nowhere near enough detergent in any of the regular 
gasolines. I'm not pulling the heads to clean the cylinders, F that. I 
did find out that my truck shuts down at 98MPH too. Lame.


On 4/4/2016 12:21 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:


The labels say no ethanol!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com 
<mailto:geo...@cbcast.com>> wrote:


We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It
can be a bitch to get started because of the protection valves in
tanks now. We had one old tank without the valve and it would fire
up on the first pull every time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the
choke to get that valve open.

One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline
is that small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol
blends. The ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems.
This is why all FlexFuel certified systems are stainless delivery,
injector rails, etc.

On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few
problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very
very large tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator
running.

Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you
need heat energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.

And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the
bottom of the tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk
in those tanks (I cut old ones up for smokers).

And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor
battery is a common point of failure as is charger.  I like to
remote the battery into the heated building if there is a
heated building. Generac was infamous for supplying a charger
that failed and you didn't know until you needed.

I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on
all generators.  That is the most important bit of data you
need to monitor.

-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com <mailto:af@afmug.com>
        Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:

I've had a handful of generators that always started on
the first pull. Until today.  Got another one for the site
but started tearing apart the old one and I think it's a
bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a look at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're
portable with two wheels but require two people or a ramp
to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd buy these size
units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24
hour run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340 
Direct: 937-552-2343 
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

The labels say no ethanol!

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Apr 4, 2016 12:57 PM, "George Skorup" <geo...@cbcast.com> wrote:

> We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be a
> bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We had
> one old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first pull every
> time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that valve open.
>
> One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is that
> small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. The
> ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all
> FlexFuel certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.
>
> On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:
>
>> Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.
>>
>> Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large
>> tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.
>>
>> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat
>> energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.
>>
>> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the
>> tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old
>> ones up for smokers).
>>
>> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a
>> common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into
>> the heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was infamous for
>> supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.
>>
>> I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all
>> generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.
>>
>> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
>> Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
>> To: af@afmug.com
>> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>>
>> Propane
>>
>> On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>>
>>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>>> a look at.
>>>
>>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>>> 24 hour run time...
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[George Skorup]

We've started our little Yamaha on a 20# tank at -15F before. It can be 
a bitch to get started because of the protection valves in tanks now. We 
had one old tank without the valve and it would fire up on the first 
pull every time. Now it takes 5-6 pulls using the choke to get that 
valve open.


One thing I found out with all of my truck woes and shit gasoline is 
that small/carb engines were never designed to run the ethanol blends. 
The ethanol is corrosive to non-stainless fuel systems. This is why all 
FlexFuel certified systems are stainless delivery, injector rails, etc.


On 4/4/2016 8:22 AM, Chuck McCown wrote:

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very 
large tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.


Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need 
heat energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.


And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of 
the tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I 
cut old ones up for smokers).


And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is 
a common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery 
into the heated building if there is a heated building. Generac was 
infamous for supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until 
you needed.


I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all 
generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.


-Original Message- From: George Skorup
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first 
pull. Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing 
apart the old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have 
someone else take a look at.


Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't 
know if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 
gallons and 24 hour run time...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Chris Fabien]

I got a few of the $100 2-cycle generators from Harbor Freight. Connected
to a 10-gal fuel tank they will run for about 5 days with a light load.
Cheap enough to just have a few spares on hand.

On Mon, Apr 4, 2016 at 9:22 AM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

> Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.
>
> Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large
> tank to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.
>
> Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat
> energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.
>
> And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the
> tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old
> ones up for smokers).
>
> And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a
> common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into
> the heated building if there is a heated building.  Generac was infamous
> for supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.
>
> I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all
> generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.
>
> -Original Message- From: George Skorup
> Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
> To: af@afmug.com
> Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>
>
> Propane
>
> On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
>
>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>> a look at.
>>
>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>> 24 hour run time...
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Chuck McCown]

Yeah, I have run lots of propane generators.  Here are a few problems.

Temperature.  If it is -20F outside, you have to have a very very large tank 
to generate enough vapor to keep the generator running.


Conversely you can use a liquid pickup and a vaporizer but you need heat 
energy for the vaporizer to get the thing started.


And liquid pickups also pick all the dirt and sludge at the bottom of the 
tank.  You would not believe the amount of gunk in those tanks (I cut old 
ones up for smokers).


And no matter what kind of fuel you use, the starter motor battery is a 
common point of failure as is charger.  I like to remote the battery into 
the heated building if there is a heated building.  Generac was infamous for 
supplying a charger that failed and you didn't know until you needed.


I started putting telemetry on all starter motor batteries on all 
generators.  That is the most important bit of data you need to monitor.


-Original Message- 
From: George Skorup

Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 9:43 PM
To: af@afmug.com
Subject: Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull. 
Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the 
old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take 
a look at.


Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know 
if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 
24 hour run time...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[can...@believewireless.net]

We switched to all propane and we test every generator every quarter. We
keep a lot of full bottles around
and have Y adapters so we can deploy two tanks at a time. This gives us
days of run time if need be but
it's never gone that long.

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[George Skorup]

Propane

On 4/3/2016 7:09 PM, Josh Luthman wrote:
I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first 
pull.  Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing 
apart the old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have 
someone else take a look at.


Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two 
wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't 
know if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 
gallons and 24 hour run time...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

To be fair I hadn't tested it in a couple of years...it was moved from a
tower we had to leave "urgently" that is up years later.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 11:15 PM, Chuck McCown <ch...@wbmfg.com> wrote:

> Classic generator problem.  They only fail when you really need them.
>
> *From:* Josh Luthman <j...@imaginenetworksllc.com>
> *Sent:* Sunday, April 03, 2016 6:09 PM
> *To:* af@afmug.com
> *Subject:* [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!
>
> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
> a look at.
>
> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
> 24 hour run time...
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Chuck McCown]

Classic generator problem.  They only fail when you really need them.  

From: Josh Luthman 
Sent: Sunday, April 03, 2016 6:09 PM
To: af@afmug.com 
Subject: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.  Until 
today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the old one and 
I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take a look at. 

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two wheels but 
require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd buy 
these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24 hour run 
time...


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

I'm all gas, but thanks :)

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Apr 3, 2016 9:59 PM, "Eric Kuhnke"  wrote:

> For diesel generators, if you're not consuming the fuel, don't forget the
> fungicide. Here's a good general reference for long term diesel storage:
>
>
> http://www.bp.com/content/dam/bp-country/en_au/media/fuel-news/long-term-storage-diesel.pdf
>
> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 5:09 PM, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>> a look at.
>>
>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>> 24 hour run time...
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Eric Kuhnke]

For diesel generators, if you're not consuming the fuel, don't forget the
fungicide. Here's a good general reference for long term diesel storage:

http://www.bp.com/content/dam/bp-country/en_au/media/fuel-news/long-term-storage-diesel.pdf

On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 5:09 PM, Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
> a look at.
>
> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
> 24 hour run time...
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

Those units are 8 years old.  3/4 are first pull.

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373
On Apr 3, 2016 9:07 PM, "Jeremy"  wrote:

> Weird.  My snowblower always started on the 1st try until I forgot fuel
> stabilizer.  Needed a full carb kit/rebuild.  The gas in my generator has
> been in there for three years.  It still starts...but I really need to put
> some new fuel in it.
>
> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 6:23 PM, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> I always do fuel stabilizer.  Drained the tank and did brand new gas.
>>
>> If I blow on the gas tube and "push" it through the carb it'll run for a
>> bit.
>>
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 8:22 PM, Jeremy  wrote:
>>
>>> Bad gas?  Did you use fuel stabilizer?
>>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 6:09 PM, Josh Luthman <
>>> j...@imaginenetworksllc.com> wrote:
>>>
 I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first
 pull.  Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart
 the old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else
 take a look at.

 Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
 wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
 if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
 24 hour run time...

 Josh Luthman
 Office: 937-552-2340
 Direct: 937-552-2343
 1100 Wayne St
 Suite 1337
 Troy, OH 45373

>>>
>>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Jeremy]

Weird.  My snowblower always started on the 1st try until I forgot fuel
stabilizer.  Needed a full carb kit/rebuild.  The gas in my generator has
been in there for three years.  It still starts...but I really need to put
some new fuel in it.

On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 6:23 PM, Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> I always do fuel stabilizer.  Drained the tank and did brand new gas.
>
> If I blow on the gas tube and "push" it through the carb it'll run for a
> bit.
>
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>
> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 8:22 PM, Jeremy  wrote:
>
>> Bad gas?  Did you use fuel stabilizer?
>>
>> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 6:09 PM, Josh Luthman > > wrote:
>>
>>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>>> a look at.
>>>
>>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>>> 24 hour run time...
>>>
>>> Josh Luthman
>>> Office: 937-552-2340
>>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>>> 1100 Wayne St
>>> Suite 1337
>>> Troy, OH 45373
>>>
>>
>>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

I always do fuel stabilizer.  Drained the tank and did brand new gas.

If I blow on the gas tube and "push" it through the carb it'll run for a
bit.


Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373

On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 8:22 PM, Jeremy  wrote:

> Bad gas?  Did you use fuel stabilizer?
>
> On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 6:09 PM, Josh Luthman 
> wrote:
>
>> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
>> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
>> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
>> a look at.
>>
>> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
>> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
>> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
>> 24 hour run time...
>>
>> Josh Luthman
>> Office: 937-552-2340
>> Direct: 937-552-2343
>> 1100 Wayne St
>> Suite 1337
>> Troy, OH 45373
>>
>
>

Re: [AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Jeremy]

Bad gas?  Did you use fuel stabilizer?

On Sun, Apr 3, 2016 at 6:09 PM, Josh Luthman 
wrote:

> I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
> Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
> old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
> a look at.
>
> Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two
> wheels but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know
> if I'd buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and
> 24 hour run time...
>
> Josh Luthman
> Office: 937-552-2340
> Direct: 937-552-2343
> 1100 Wayne St
> Suite 1337
> Troy, OH 45373
>

[AFMUG] PSA - check your generators!

[Josh Luthman]

I've had a handful of generators that always started on the first pull.
Until today.  Got another one for the site but started tearing apart the
old one and I think it's a bad carb, something I'll have someone else take
a look at.

Mine are all sitting inside doing nothing, they're portable with two wheels
but require two people or a ramp to put in the truck.  I don't know if I'd
buy these size units again but I really do like the 8.5 gallons and 24 hour
run time...

Josh Luthman
Office: 937-552-2340
Direct: 937-552-2343
1100 Wayne St
Suite 1337
Troy, OH 45373