Which book was that? Just wondering.
Julia
I am away from home. I will send you the name next weekend
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Dan wrote:
Obtaining the oil production data from
http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/dnav/pet/pet_sum_crdsnd_adc_mbbl_m.htm
and the crude oil prices from
http://inflationdata.com/inflation/Inflation_Rate/Historical_Oil_Prices_Tabl
e.asp
We get the following table:
production
US imports
On 4/11/06, Doug Pensinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 08:33:08 -0700, Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Isn't it blindingly obvious that the bin Ladens of this world find
followers because of the social and economic conditions where they
recruit?
No, that's not
On 4/12/06, Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
On 4/12/06, The Fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Seriously? And what do you do with Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem?
Nick
Based on what I've read of the Fool's messages,
The Fool, in a sudden religious zeal, wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Seriously? And what do you do with Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem?
Does it effect the underlying math the all physics is based around?
I think it does - if the base is not
From: Alberto Monteiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]
The Fool wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is
nonsense.
Seriously? And what do you do with Goedel's Incompleteness
Theorem?
Does it effect the underlying math the all physics is based around?
I think it
-Original Message-
From: Alberto Monteiro [EMAIL PROTECTED]
To: Killer Bs Discussion brin-l@mccmedia.com
Sent: Thu, 13 Apr 2006 14:38:27 -0200
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
The Fool, in a sudden religious zeal, wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Charlie Bell
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 2:14 AM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
Socioeconomics or straight politics create the conditions in which
extremism
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
As I understand it the incompleteness theroem does not in any way
invalidate physics or the math that is used to study and support it.
Goedal was famously misunderstood (at least according to a book I
read recently). He did not believe that his work proved that the
On 12/04/2006, at 1:31 AM, Dave Land wrote:
One view -- a minority view in Christianity -- is that the Bible
is a human product, not a divine one.
Or that it is a divine one but with the errors inherent in human
transcription, which is a similar but distinct position to the one
that
On 12/04/2006, at 1:57 AM, Nick Arnett wrote:
I have discussed religion with a
number of Lutherans other than Nick (mainly Germanic Europeans,
either in Cyprus or in Australia), and all bar one of those still
practicing that I have met in the flesh (so 6 or 7) are biblical
literalists.
Are
On 12/04/2006, at 4:18 AM, Dan Minette wrote:
If one is Christian, then the Incarnate Word of God (Jesus) has the
greatest
authority.
Precisely what I was taught.
I never met someone who was really a literalist
concerning the whole of scriptures.they just don't count their
On 12/04/2006, at 7:45 AM, Dan Minette wrote:
I was saying that social, political and economic conditions in the
Middle
East have created an environment favorable to recruiting
terrorists by
demagogues. My point was to argue against focusing on religion as
the
reason there are
Dan Minette wrote:
One thing that struck methe fundamental reason for the last big European
war was simply elbow room.
Generally the term used is lebensraum, or living room, which is a
German word. It was not the reason for the war, but it was a large part
of Germany's policy
On 4/11/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Then what is it? Many Christians or theists have this idea of the
Bible's teachings as a moral guide, but much of the moral precept
they take from it (or imagine that's in there) is simply what they
want to take from it. There are good people
On 11 Apr 2006 at 15:31, Dave Land wrote:
On Apr 11, 2006, at 2:22 PM, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 11/04/2006, at 6:33 PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
He also seems to fail to recognize the difference between
irrational and
non-rational beliefs. And this statement, Religious moderation
is
At 04:35 PM Tuesday 4/11/2006, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 12/04/2006, at 12:33 AM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
Faith in a deity/deities/force/whatever is one thing. It's highly
personal. But faith in a book is something else, and that's where the
argument starts - if the book says one thing, but a
On 11 Apr 2006 at 7:22, The Fool wrote:
If you ingore some minor gibberish about buddism:
www.truthdig.com/report/item/20060403_sam_harris_interview
I find your faith in atheism is touching. I wonder why you need so
strongly not to believe. As I said to a communist friend of mine the
other
On 12/04/2006, at 8:59 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
One answer is that if there really is a God, you could try asking
Him what He wants you to do . . .
Sure. Like I say, it's highly personal.
Of course, it's possible that the answer you get will be RTF¹M . . .
Now there's a good shortcut
At 01:49 PM Wednesday 4/12/2006, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 12/04/2006, at 8:59 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
One answer is that if there really is a God, you could try asking
Him what He wants you to do . . .
Sure. Like I say, it's highly personal.
Of course, it's possible that the answer you
On 12/04/2006, at 7:09 PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
In Lutheranism and most of Protestantism, Christianity isn't about
doing
good in order to get into heaven, even though that's often how it
comes
across.
That I know - I was raised C of E, and was heavily involved in
Christian fellowship
The Fool wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Humans are fundamentelly evil creatures who deserve to die.
You must be great fun at parties.
Jim
___
Join Excite! - http://www.excite.com
The most personalized
On 12/04/2006, at 10:17 PM, Jim Sharkey wrote:
The Fool wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Humans are fundamentelly evil creatures who deserve to die.
You must be great fun at parties.
*snort* Lucky I wasn't drinking just then. :D
Charlie
On 12/04/2006, at 10:01 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
Of course, it's possible that the answer you get will be
RTF¹M . . .
Now there's a good shortcut to atheism. :-)
Not necessarily, if as some have suggested the Bible is a record of
God's dealings with other humans. Then it might
From: Andrew Crystall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 11 Apr 2006 at 7:22, The Fool wrote:
If you ingore some minor gibberish about buddism:
www.truthdig.com/report/item/20060403_sam_harris_interview
I find your faith in atheism is touching. I wonder why you need so
strongly not to believe.
At 02:20 PM Wednesday 4/12/2006, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 12/04/2006, at 10:01 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
Of course, it's possible that the answer you get will be
RTF¹M . . .
Now there's a good shortcut to atheism. :-)
Not necessarily, if as some have suggested the Bible is a record of
Sure. But, I guess you're just as likely to find that smiting and
stoning is recommended as a solution as kiss-and-make-up is...
That's when it is advisable to request further light and knowledge
in the form of another hint . . .
Lord, what sort of rock should I lob at his head?
;)
From: Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 12/04/2006, at 10:01 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
Of course, it's possible that the answer you get will be
RTF¹M . . .
Now there's a good shortcut to atheism. :-)
Not necessarily, if as some have suggested the Bible is a record of
God's dealings
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Charlie Bell
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 1:43 AM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
Really? What was the Inquistion all about then?
There was a lot
From: Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED]
But, they were not fundamentalists. The two great doctors of the
church
(Agustine and Aquinis) did not emphasize a literal interpretation of
scripture. The authority of the Church was the keys of the kingdom
being
passed on from Peter to his successors,
On 4/12/06, The Fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Seriously? And what do you do with Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem?
Nick
--
Nick Arnett
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Messages: 408-904-7198
___
On 4/12/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
There was a lot of payback of collaborators with the Moors,
No, no. It was the Moops!
Fundamentalism found it's foundation in the Reformation. Luther, Calvin,
et. al. needed to find an authority apart from the Catholic church. It was
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of The Fool
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 3:12 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
The most disastrous consequences must follow upon our believing that
anything
--
From: Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 4/12/06, The Fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Seriously? And what do you do with Goedel's Incompleteness Theorem?
-
Does it effect the underlying math the all physics is
On Apr 12, 2006, at 12:20 PM, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 12/04/2006, at 10:01 PM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
Of course, it's possible that the answer you get will be
RTF¹M . . .
Now there's a good shortcut to atheism. :-)
Not necessarily, if as some have suggested the Bible is a record
of
I don't think it's good to mention sola scriptura and leave out Luther's
other two -- sola fide and sola gratia. It wasn't just scripture, but
faith and grace as well.
I was thinking in terms of teaching authority...Church teachings were not to
be used.
As an aside, would you agree with
Jim Sharkey wrote:
The Fool wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything else is nonsense.
Humans are fundamentelly evil creatures who deserve to die.
You must be great fun at parties.
Jim
That assumes he goes to parties. He might not.
Julia
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Julia Thompson
Sent: Wednesday, April 12, 2006 3:55 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
That assumes he goes to parties. He might not.
From what I understand, he
The Fool said:
Does it effect the underlying math the all physics is based around?
Yes, it does. It applies to any mathematical system that includes
ordinary arithmetic.
Rich
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http://www.mccmedia.com/mailman/listinfo/brin-l
The Fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I believe only in the purity of math. Everything
else is nonsense.
Humans are fundamentally evil creatures who deserve
to die.
My cats and horses would disagree with those
statements:
Mice, voles, birds and deer (yes, deer!) are not
nonsense.
Grass and
The Fool wrote:
From: Andrew Crystall [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On 11 Apr 2006 at 7:22, The Fool wrote:
If you ingore some minor gibberish about buddism:
www.truthdig.com/report/item/20060403_sam_harris_interview
I find your faith in atheism is touching. I wonder why you need so
strongly not to
Nick Arnett wrote:
On 4/12/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
There was a lot of payback of collaborators with the Moors,
No, no. It was the Moops!
Considering my primary meaning of MOOP, matter out of place, that's
interesting.
Julia
On 4/11/06, The Fool [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
If you ingore some minor gibberish about buddism:
www.truthdig.com/report/item/20060403_sam_harris_interview
For anyone who is wondering, as I was, who the heck Sam Harris is...
With the publication of his 2004 New York Times bestseller, The End
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick Arnett
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 10:33 AM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
Harris argues that terrorists apparently aren't thinking about poverty
On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 08:33:08 -0700, Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote:
Isn't it blindingly obvious that the bin Ladens of this world find
followers because of the social and economic conditions where they
recruit?
No, that's not obvious at all. I'm pretty sure that many of his recruits
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Doug Pensinger
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 12:43 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
On Tue, 11 Apr 2006 08:33:08 -0700, Nick Arnett [EMAIL PROTECTED]
wrote
On 11 Apr 2006, at 4:33PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
But
there's no doubt in my mind that I also choose my theology because
of my
political and social beliefs. They are inseparable and
intertwined, as I
suspect is true for people all over the world.
So religion is just believing whatever you
On Apr 11, 2006, at 11:36 AM, William T Goodall wrote:
On 11 Apr 2006, at 4:33PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
But
there's no doubt in my mind that I also choose my theology because
of my
political and social beliefs. They are inseparable and
intertwined, as I
suspect is true for people all
On 11/04/2006, at 6:33 PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
He also seems to fail to recognize the difference between
irrational and
non-rational beliefs. And this statement, Religious moderation
is just a
cherry-picking of scripture, ultimately, is ridiculous. It
implies that
fundamentalism is
At 04:22 PM Tuesday 4/11/2006, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 11/04/2006, at 6:33 PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
He also seems to fail to recognize the difference between
irrational and
non-rational beliefs. And this statement, Religious moderation
is just a
cherry-picking of scripture, ultimately, is
On 12/04/2006, at 12:33 AM, Ronn!Blankenship wrote:
Faith in a deity/deities/force/whatever is one thing. It's highly
personal. But faith in a book is something else, and that's where the
argument starts - if the book says one thing, but a follower
disagrees and does something else, where's
On Apr 11, 2006, at 2:22 PM, Charlie Bell wrote:
On 11/04/2006, at 6:33 PM, Nick Arnett wrote:
He also seems to fail to recognize the difference between
irrational and
non-rational beliefs. And this statement, Religious moderation
is just a
cherry-picking of scripture, ultimately, is
On 4/11/06, Doug Pensinger [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
No, that's not obvious at all. I'm pretty sure that many of his recruits
are middle/upper income types. I would argue that it is the wealth of the
region that stimulates terrorism and that if the Middle East was
economically and
On 4/11/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Supporting that, we don't have a major concern with Bangladesh terrorists
or
Zambian terrorists (two countries that have been poor for a long time).
I didn't say that poverty results in or correlates to terrorism. It's not
that simple.
On 4/11/06, Charlie Bell [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I have discussed religion with a
number of Lutherans other than Nick (mainly Germanic Europeans,
either in Cyprus or in Australia), and all bar one of those still
practicing that I have met in the flesh (so 6 or 7) are biblical
literalists.
Nick wrote:
I wrote:
No, that's not obvious at all. I'm pretty sure that many of his
recruits
are middle/upper income types. I would argue that it is the wealth of
the region that stimulates terrorism and that if the Middle East was
economically and politically irrelevant there would
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Doug Pensinger
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 7:03 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
Nick wrote:
I wrote:
No, that's not obvious at all. I'm pretty sure
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Dave Land
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 5:31 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
One view -- a minority view in Christianity -- is that the Bible is
a human
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Charlie Bell
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 4:23 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
So how do you decide which parts of scripture to follow and which
Nick Arnett wrote:
Plenty of Christians go astray by worshiping the Bible.
I suppose I get kinda wierd on this subject. But I agree with Nick's
statement above.
IMO, the study of Man and the study of the Universe are much more
important than the study of the Bible and are much more likely to
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick Arnett
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 5:47 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
On 4/11/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Supporting that, we don't
Dan wrote:
While conservation policies would have some effect, one can see a much
better correlation between changes in prices and changes in oil usage
than in governmental policies and the use of oil.
In the eight years following Carter's moral equivelent of war, during a
period of
On 4/11/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I didn't say that poverty results in or correlates to terrorism. It's
not
that simple.
But without correlation, then it's hard to identify it as a major cause.
I don't think you're following me. I didn't say that poverty is a major
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Doug Pensinger
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 10:17 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
Dan wrote:
While conservation policies would have some effect, one can
-Original Message-
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On
Behalf Of Nick Arnett
Sent: Tuesday, April 11, 2006 11:05 PM
To: Killer Bs Discussion
Subject: Re: Great Sam Harris Interview
On 4/11/06, Dan Minette [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I didn't say that poverty
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