Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Sergey Alembekov]

On 29.12.2009 23:30, Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
no

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
yes (fbreader and listening music)

> What distribution you run most of the time?
shr


> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
At the summer, after 1024 and buzz fixes i tried to use it for a two 
weeks as daily phone, but i lost several important calls and need to 
reboot twice a day. Will try it with new kernel.

-- 
Regards, Sergey Alembekov
ALTLinux Team
xmpp: r...@jabber.ru

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Warren Baird]

I haven't turned my FR on since I got a nokia n900 a few weeks back.  It has
all of the things that appeal to me about the FR - I can 'apt-get install'
the software I want, I can ssh into it, etc. *BUT* it's better in so many
ways.   The UI is so much more responsive, the phone is so much more
reliable.  I can confidently make and receive calls!   It has fantastic
built-in email and IM apps, and I can run pidgin for IRC.   Evince works
great, and the wide screen display is gorgeous for reading e-books.  It very
reliably connects to wifi...  It does a great job of playing SD TV episode
video.  I could go on for a while longer...

About the only real negative I've noticed is that the battery life isn't
great - I get maybe 12-14 hours on a charge --- it doesn't seem to be
suspending at all in the sense that the FR does - I think it just blanks the
screen and maybe slows the processor down...

Oh, and the equivilent app to 'openmoocow' isn't quite as nice - which is
almost a deal-breaker for my 2.5 year old daughter - she definitely prefers
the FR.

Warren

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
> --
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
> ___
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>
>
>
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-- 
Warren Baird - Photographer and Digital Artist
http://www.synergisticimages.ca
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Neil Brown]

On Tue, 9 Feb 2010 23:55:09 +0100
Marcus Bauer  wrote:

> On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 09:33:03 +1100
> Neil Brown  wrote: 
> > The recent innovation of compiling the kernel with the go-slow straps
> > removed has had a significant improvement on my experience.  Now if
> > only I could figure out why the gprs is not reliable I'd be on my way
> > to being happy.
> 
> I have never tested GPRS for more than 12 hours but I always felt that
> it was rocking stable, keeping the connection while moving around. At
> least on hackable1, rev4 which basically is Debian Lenny.

I have never had any problem when browsing on the phone itself.  But whenever
I try to  use it as an internet connection for my notebook (usb from notebook
to freerunner, with all the appropriate SNAT and routing tables set up) it
works for a few hundred K and then just seizes up.  I wonder if it is some
sort of flow-control issues over the serial link to the GSM device, but that
is all supposed to be hardware flow-control and certainly seems to be set up
properly.

> 
> But then maybe your phone is unhappy because it expects your to run SuSE
> on it ;-)

Maybe it is :-)

NeilBrown


> 
> Marcus (who -for the records- used SuSE before they had version numbers
> and were simply called November 1994, coming in ugly brown boxes with
> some green thingy on them)
> 
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Neil Brown]

On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 13:05:30 +1300
Andrew Stephen  wrote:

> On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Neil Brown  wrote:
> >
> > (any New Zealand residents out there?  I visited NZ in Jan, bought a 
> > 2degrees
> > SIM can and found that I couldn't send SMS messages though receiving and
> > calls were fine.  SIM worked fine in another phone. Does anyone else
> > experience that?)
> 
> I have used a 2degrees SIM with my Freerunner successfully under
> SHR-u/t  for both sending and receiving SMS.

Maybe it was specific to my particular SIM (or a batch of SIMs).
I tried bypassing all the UI stuff, connected to the GSM device with
mickeyterm, issued:
  AT+CMGS="phonenumber"
  >  some text goes here

and then never got the second '>' prompt to enter "^Z" to.  It is not an
issue for me any more but it did drop my confidence a little bit.

> 
> Were you here for LCA?
> 

Yes, that and a holiday to escape the hot Sydney summer :-)
Nice country you've got there.

NeilBrown

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Mihai Donțu]

On Tuesday 29 December 2009 22:30:53 Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

No.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

No.

> What distribution you run most of the time?

I tried android, qtmoko & shr.

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
> 

I bought an iphone before the freerunner and I have chosen to stick to the 
iphone until android gets better. There are a number of qualities which are _a 
must_ for me:
 * good keyboard with i18n support;
 * perfectly working phone app;
 * perfectly working contact app;
 * perfectly working SMS app;

On both shr and qtmoko I can not use the keyboard. If I'm going from touching 
the screen (iphone) to using a pen to tap on the screen (shr), the keyboard 
_must_ kick ass. Currently the shr kb is geekish and while I find it 
interesting, I'm not often in the mood for it. On qtmoko I have something like 
three kb-s (mmm ...). I'm not even going to talk about i18n support.

Then comes the way the phone behaves when I'm receiving a call. I totally hate 
it when the ring tone (that 1964 ring bell) stutters. There are so many hints 
you can give to the Linux kernel in order to keep an app "tight" (ie. have all 
its resources close and ready to use), I just don't get why this _still_ 
happens in 2010.

The last thing is related to the buttons used to send shr/qtmoko into standby 
and back. Sometimes they work, sometimes they don't, sometimes I need a 
crystal ball.

Android is the only distro which is extremely close to what I need (and very 
close to what iphone offers). It's just a bit too slow at the moment (I have 
not tested the latest release, with the no-debug kernel).

I'm afraid I do not share your views on what should be free and what not. I'm 
satisfied with what Apple offers me right now (though I'm looking forward to 
buying a Nexus One too). I used to do embedded programming back in the 
Symbian-boom days and now I realize I kind of lost my patience with phones.

-- 
Mihai Donțu

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Andrew Stephen]

On Wed, Feb 10, 2010 at 11:33 AM, Neil Brown  wrote:
>
> (any New Zealand residents out there?  I visited NZ in Jan, bought a 2degrees
> SIM can and found that I couldn't send SMS messages though receiving and
> calls were fine.  SIM worked fine in another phone. Does anyone else
> experience that?)

I have used a 2degrees SIM with my Freerunner successfully under
SHR-u/t  for both sending and receiving SMS.

Were you here for LCA?

-- 
Andrew Stephen
http://www.evil.geek.nz/

It is absurd to divide people into good and bad. People are either
charming or tedious.
  - Oscar Wilde

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Marcus Bauer]

On Wed, 10 Feb 2010 09:33:03 +1100
Neil Brown  wrote: 
> The recent innovation of compiling the kernel with the go-slow straps
> removed has had a significant improvement on my experience.  Now if
> only I could figure out why the gprs is not reliable I'd be on my way
> to being happy.

I have never tested GPRS for more than 12 hours but I always felt that
it was rocking stable, keeping the connection while moving around. At
least on hackable1, rev4 which basically is Debian Lenny.

But then maybe your phone is unhappy because it expects your to run SuSE
on it ;-)

Marcus (who -for the records- used SuSE before they had version numbers
and were simply called November 1994, coming in ugly brown boxes with
some green thingy on them)

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Neil Brown]

On Tue, 9 Feb 2010 13:17:17 -0800 (PST)
Mike Crash  wrote:

> 
> No
> Yes
> Debian

Yes
No
Debian


The recent innovation of compiling the kernel with the go-slow straps removed
has had a significant improvement on my experience.  Now if only I could
figure out why the gprs is not reliable I'd be on my way to being happy.
I guess we cannot hope for the GSM firmware being made open-source...

(any New Zealand residents out there?  I visited NZ in Jan, bought a 2degrees
SIM can and found that I couldn't send SMS messages though receiving and
calls were fine.  SIM worked fine in another phone. Does anyone else
experience that?)

NeilBrown

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Mike Crash]

No
Yes
Debian
-- 
View this message in context: 
http://n2.nabble.com/Quick-e-mail-poll-Still-using-your-Freerunner-tp4229399p4543942.html
Sent from the Openmoko Community mailing list archive at Nabble.com.

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RE: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Gay, John (GE Infra, Energy, Non-GE)]

> On Mon, 08 Feb 2010 21:37:23 +0100 GNUtoo  said:
> 
> On Wed, 2009-12-30 at 11:37 +1100, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
> > 1. i'd like something not crawlingly slow 2. i'd like to use the 3g 
> > data rates telcos offer here, but where their 2g data rates are much

> > more expensive 3. i'd like it to work when i travel (going to korea 
> > and japan for example only 3g phones will work).
> > 4. i want a touchscreen that is large enough to be really usable (as

> > such the 2.8" lcd is really more like 2.2 or 2.4" thanks to the 
> > bezel - for input).
> > 5. again speed, capacity, screen, baseband, usability.
> Did you hear about recent palm pre progress?
> It could be the first of the phones-running-semi-free-software to be 
> usable.

I find the Flow G1.5 from http://www.gizmoforyou.net quite an
interesting dev-kit. Wish I had 520 Euro spare to play with. Also the
Daughter VX 1.0 and the PXA Gaming Platform look almost as fun. Again,
if I had some spare cash, I'd have both of these as well.

I do have a GP2X, which was the forerunner of Pandora. It's not
vaporware, despite appearances.

Unfortunately, I don't have enough money to play with all these emerging
embedded toys and test gravity regularly, and I'd prefer to test
gravity. I get less abuse from the wife testing gravity than playing
with code.

Cheers,

John Gay

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[-= Apertum =-]

* Shashank Bharadwaj wrote, Il 09/02/2010 11:01:
> Adding Android Community into the loop :)
> Common guys right now survey says only 2 people use Android as they
> primary OS. Time to change that?
>   
I really dont' like the dev model behind Android.
It's not a shared developing and knowledge, also if it's formally
opensource.
And i dont' like the idea to make OSs, browsers, and generally any apps,
all Google/onebrand/company centered. IMHO it's also a _lot_ dangerous.

I don't like it, so I don't use it.

I really like QtMoko, and any weeks it's always a better piece of
software :-)

--
Andrea

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Benjamin Donnachie]

I found the FR too unstable and went back to using my ancient Nokia.

However, Android was one of better OSes I tried.

Ben

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Shashank Bharadwaj]

Adding Android Community into the loop :)
Common guys right now survey says only 2 people use Android as they
primary OS. Time to change that?

On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 2:00 AM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
> --
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
>
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-- 
Regards
Shashank
As our circle of knowledge expands, so does the circumference of
darkness surrounding it - Albert Einstein

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Shashank Bharadwaj]

On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 2:00 AM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?

Android (Cupcake now, hoping that eclair will become much more usable
in a few weeks)

Thanks
Shashank

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[The Rasterman]

On Mon, 08 Feb 2010 21:37:23 +0100 GNUtoo  said:

> On Wed, 2009-12-30 at 11:37 +1100, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
> > 1. i'd like something not crawlingly slow
> > 2. i'd like to use the 3g data rates telcos offer here, but where
> > their 2g data
> > rates are much more expensive
> > 3. i'd like it to work when i travel (going to korea and japan for
> > example only
> > 3g phones will work).
> > 4. i want a touchscreen that is large enough to be really usable (as
> > such the
> > 2.8" lcd is really more like 2.2 or 2.4" thanks to the bezel - for
> > input).
> > 5. again speed, capacity, screen, baseband, usability.
> Did you hear about recent palm pre progress?
> It could be the first of the phones-running-semi-free-software to be
> usable.

yes. i know. :) if its the sdl stuff for webos - then thats doable as its "in
the future" a supported mechanism for pre's. if its the fso reverse engineering
and making modem etc. work - then thats an anti-vendor port .. and will be of
limited value in the long run. as the vendor will never help you - if anyting
they will actively thwart you over time. vendors need to support such work and
consider at a minimum of adopting it in future for it to be viable.

-- 
- Codito, ergo sum - "I code, therefore I am" --
The Rasterman (Carsten Haitzler)ras...@rasterman.com


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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Robin Paulson]

On 7 February 2010 10:16, Ed Falk  wrote:
> I bought my Freerunner over a year ago.  On the first boot, it made a
> very loud raucus sound which, as far as I know, blew out the speaker, as
> I have never heard an undistorted sound come out of it.

am i still using my fr?

i realised that mobile phones are another pointless gadget that
ultimately doesn't make my life any better, and are only there to
funnel more money and control to vodafone/other bad telcos.

so, no i'm not using my fr, or any phone. and loving it! and probably
about to unsubscribe from here

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Al Johnson]

On Monday 08 February 2010, Edward Falk wrote:
> >> I bought my Freerunner over a year ago.  On the first boot, it made a
> >> very loud raucus sound which, as far as I know, blew out the speaker,
> >> as I have never heard an undistorted sound come out of it.
> >
> > If your speaker really is broken, your Freerunner will probably not be
> > much use as a phone unless you use hands-free with it. I suggest you
> > install the latest software so you can be sure it's not a software
> > problem. If it isn't you'll either have to get the speaker repaired or
> > live without sound.
> 
> Is it repairable?

Potentially, though I suspect it was just distorted because the volume 
controls were set too high rather than being permanently damaged.

> > If you want more control, then currently the best
> > idea is to run alsamixer yes, either remotely or from local terminal.
> 
> Glad to hear that there's been progress on volume control, but more than
> a year later and we still need alsamixer for some things?  This is not a
> good sign.

There are a couple of GUI mixers for FSO-based distros. Both are mentioned in 
the wiki now. fso-simplemixer may need a small edit to work with recent fso 
versions though.

http://wiki.openmoko.org/wiki/Neo_Freerunner_audio_subsystem#Volume_Control

> >> I tried to develop a GPS application for it, but GPS would not work
> >> if there was an SD card installed.
> >
> > I have not heard of such a problem so if It's not exclusive to your
> > hardware, it is fixed by now.
> 
> http://n2.nabble.com/Reason-for-GPS-problems-found-tp528814ef1958.html
> 
> In a nutshell, electrical noise from the SD card slot interfered with
> the GPS.  Your choices were either to remove the SD card or solder in a
> tiny little capacitor between two of its pins.  I also understand that
> there's a software work-around which turns the SD card off when it's not
> being used.

The software change is a proper fix, not a workaround, and the capacitor is 
unnecessary even with rootfs on SD. If you read that thread in full you will 
see that the fix was to properly use the chipset's SD drive strength control 
rather than just set it to maximum.

> > Currently, using the Freerunner as both a phone and a PDA I usually can
> > go for two days before plugging it in overnight. If I use a lot of GPS
> > for example, the time is shorter but it's not bad at all and suspending
> > works very well currently.
> 
> Excellent news.  Hopefully, this is because of improved software (which
> I can install) and not improved hardware (which I can't do anything about).
> 
> > Well, my suggestion would be to start playing around with the latest
> > SHR-Unstable.
> 
> Thanks for the pointers.  If I can find the time, I'll give it a try.
> 
>   -ed falk
> 
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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Edward Falk]

>> I bought my Freerunner over a year ago.  On the first boot, it made a 
>> very loud raucus sound which, as far as I know, blew out the speaker,
>> as I have never heard an undistorted sound come out of it.
> If your speaker really is broken, your Freerunner will probably not be
> much use as a phone unless you use hands-free with it. I suggest you
> install the latest software so you can be sure it's not a software
> problem. If it isn't you'll either have to get the speaker repaired or
> live without sound.

Is it repairable?

> If you want more control, then currently the best
> idea is to run alsamixer yes, either remotely or from local terminal.

Glad to hear that there's been progress on volume control, but more than 
a year later and we still need alsamixer for some things?  This is not a 
good sign.


>> I tried to develop a GPS application for it, but GPS would not work
>> if there was an SD card installed.
> I have not heard of such a problem so if It's not exclusive to your
> hardware, it is fixed by now.

http://n2.nabble.com/Reason-for-GPS-problems-found-tp528814ef1958.html

In a nutshell, electrical noise from the SD card slot interfered with 
the GPS.  Your choices were either to remove the SD card or solder in a 
tiny little capacitor between two of its pins.  I also understand that 
there's a software work-around which turns the SD card off when it's not 
being used.


> Currently, using the Freerunner as both a phone and a PDA I usually can
> go for two days before plugging it in overnight. If I use a lot of GPS
> for example, the time is shorter but it's not bad at all and suspending
> works very well currently.

Excellent news.  Hopefully, this is because of improved software (which 
I can install) and not improved hardware (which I can't do anything about).


> Well, my suggestion would be to start playing around with the latest
> SHR-Unstable.

Thanks for the pointers.  If I can find the time, I'll give it a try.

-ed falk

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[GNUtoo]

On Wed, 2009-12-30 at 11:37 +1100, Carsten Haitzler wrote:
> 1. i'd like something not crawlingly slow
> 2. i'd like to use the 3g data rates telcos offer here, but where
> their 2g data
> rates are much more expensive
> 3. i'd like it to work when i travel (going to korea and japan for
> example only
> 3g phones will work).
> 4. i want a touchscreen that is large enough to be really usable (as
> such the
> 2.8" lcd is really more like 2.2 or 2.4" thanks to the bezel - for
> input).
> 5. again speed, capacity, screen, baseband, usability.
Did you hear about recent palm pre progress?
It could be the first of the phones-running-semi-free-software to be
usable.

Denis.



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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[GNUtoo]

On Tue, 2009-12-29 at 22:30 +0200, Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
I often switch the sim card from freerunner to 100%free-on-the-main-cpu
version of android in my htcdream,and vice versa:
*when shr-unstable is broken I switch to the htcdream
*When I need headphones I use htcdream because it stops playing music
and play a sound notification,so nice to have when:
-->I realy need to be reachable
-->The place is noisy

But recently(after the last breakage which had no working sliders and
no) I used freerunner,until the next breakage

I can't use shr-stable because I need something that follows closely
org.openembedded.dev branch,because I need to test things that I commit
in org.openembedded.dev and I don't want to backport only for testing
things.

>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
yes along with an eeepc that is running angstrom
> What distribution you run most of the time?
SHR-unstable

by the way I also use an old phone as alarm clock.

Denis.



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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Rui Miguel Silva Seabra]

Em 29-12-2009 20:30, Risto H. Kurppa escreveu:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

No (if PDA == PIM).

> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-u

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

n/a

Rui

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Al Johnson]

> I'm looking for a distro that can do BT headset and keyboard. ATM, I've
> only got the keyboard working, my headset pairs, and I think it talks,
> but I can't hear anything. Doesn't look like anyone has got a BT headset
> work on FR with any distro???

It depends what you mean by 'working'. If you mean a clean GUI-only experience 
then no. If you can accept editing a few files, and restarting a service when 
you want to go between headset and handset, shr can do it, or could last time 
I tried.

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RE: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Gay, John (GE Infra, Energy, Non-GE)]

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Yes

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?
Hackable:1

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change

> over to, and why?
I'm looking for a distro that can do BT headset and keyboard. ATM, I've
only got the keyboard working, my headset pairs, and I think it talks,
but I can't hear anything. Doesn't look like anyone has got a BT headset
work on FR with any distro???

> Thank you :)


> r

> -- 
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Ben Wilson]

On 30/12/2009 9:30 a.m., Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>
no i use my Neo1973
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
same as above
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
SHR unstable
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
I'm seriously looking at buying an n900 due to 2G GPRS just being too slow.
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
>
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
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>

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Gennady Kupava]

В Втр, 29/12/2009 в 22:30 +0200, Risto H. Kurppa пишет:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
No, I am understanding and experimenting with kernel, my latest
touchscreen/adc race understanding quest render it unusable for most of
recent time. Also I'm far from finishing userland setup.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
No, same reason :(

> What distribution you run most of the time?
Debian/GNU linux

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
I am using spare phones around :) Openmoko is nice small computer which
can fit all mobile needs it's clear and have software and hardware
upgrade path, I think then I'll finally 'set it up', it will be just
best thing around.

Gennady



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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Neil Jerram]

On 6 February 2010 21:16, Ed Falk  wrote:
> I bought my Freerunner over a year ago.  On the first boot, it made a
> very loud raucus sound which, as far as I know, blew out the speaker, as
> I have never heard an undistorted sound come out of it. [...]

Hmm, sounds like a few possible hardware issues there.  However...

> Is there a "how to" document on the wiki that might tell someone in my
> shoes how to bring the device up to date so that I can try again?

Step 1: Try turning it on and plugging in the wall charger - to find
out if it is working well enough to get charged up.  (In the early
days, there were serious problems if the battery became completely
empty...)

Step 2: Once fully charged, follow the instructions for flashing and
trying out SHR-Testing.

Regards,
Neil

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Yogiz]

Hi Ed,

On Sat, 06 Feb 2010 13:16:05 -0800
Ed Falk  wrote:

> I bought my Freerunner over a year ago.  On the first boot, it made a 
> very loud raucus sound which, as far as I know, blew out the speaker,
> as I have never heard an undistorted sound come out of it.
If your speaker really is broken, your Freerunner will probably not be
much use as a phone unless you use hands-free with it. I suggest you
install the latest software so you can be sure it's not a software
problem. If it isn't you'll either have to get the speaker repaired or
live without sound.
 
> I discovered that the only way to adjust the volume was to log in 
> remotely and run a command-line volume control application.
SHR is currently the most popular distribution on the Freerunner. The
latest version ships with decent volume defaults and call volume can be
changed during calls. If you want more control, then currently the best
idea is to run alsamixer yes, either remotely or from local terminal.

> I tried to develop a GPS application for it, but GPS would not work
> if there was an SD card installed.
I have not heard of such a problem so if It's not exclusive to your
hardware, it is fixed by now.
 
> The device drew so much power that the battery was only good for an
> hour or so, and the device grew too hot in my hand to hold.
Currently, using the Freerunner as both a phone and a PDA I usually can
go for two days before plugging it in overnight. If I use a lot of GPS
for example, the time is shorter but it's not bad at all and suspending
works very well currently.

> At this point, I realized that the Freerunner was not yet ready for 
> prime time.  I put it back in its box and put the box on a shelf.
> The battery is surely dead by now.
> 
> I hope someday that the software will become mature enough for me to
> try again, but unfortunately, I just don't have the time to work on
> it.
> 
> So no, I'm not still using my Freerunner.
> 
> Is there a "how to" document on the wiki that might tell someone in
> my shoes how to bring the device up to date so that I can try again?
Well, my suggestion would be to start playing around with the latest
SHR-Unstable. You can get the filesystem image and the kernel from
http://build.shr-project.org/shr-unstable/images/om-gta02/. Download
the full-om-gta02.jffs2 and uImage-om-gta02-latest.bin to get the
latest versions. To flash them to your Freerunner you'll need dfu-util.
It's in the repository in Ubuntu so you can just apt-get install it,
if it's not in the repo, you can download it from
http://downloads.openmoko.org/distro/releases/Om2008.9/dfu-util. It
seems like an old version but I doubt that would be a problem. I
realised that you might be a Windows user, I don't know how you should
flash in that case, maybe someone else can comment. Anyway on Linux, to
make flashing more comfortable, you should also download neotool from
http://users.on.net/~antisol/neotool. Just put it somewhere and run it,
it presents a nice GUI for the flashing options. You'll have to select
the rootfs image and kernel images that you downloaded and should
select the jffs2 file and bin file respectively. Then connect your
Freerunner with USB cable and while keeping the top-left button
pressed, press the power button. You should be presented with a boot
menu. Now just start flashing from neotool. Once both images are
copied, which may take quite a while, disconnect and reboot the
Freerunner and SHR should run. I'd suggest you to keep an eye on the
mailing lists to see, when anything new and interesting appears for the
Freerunner, until then just play around with the different software in
the repos and packages all over the net. 

I realise that all this info is already probably written down somewhere
but I had enough time at the moment : ). If there are any other
questions, do ask.

Yogiz

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Ed Falk]

I bought my Freerunner over a year ago.  On the first boot, it made a 
very loud raucus sound which, as far as I know, blew out the speaker, as 
I have never heard an undistorted sound come out of it.

I discovered that the only way to adjust the volume was to log in 
remotely and run a command-line volume control application.

I tried to develop a GPS application for it, but GPS would not work if 
there was an SD card installed.

The device drew so much power that the battery was only good for an hour 
or so, and the device grew too hot in my hand to hold.

At this point, I realized that the Freerunner was not yet ready for 
prime time.  I put it back in its box and put the box on a shelf.  The 
battery is surely dead by now.

I hope someday that the software will become mature enough for me to try 
again, but unfortunately, I just don't have the time to work on it.

So no, I'm not still using my Freerunner.

Is there a "how to" document on the wiki that might tell someone in my 
shoes how to bring the device up to date so that I can try again?

-ed falk

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your FreeRunner?

[Brolin Empey]

Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes.

>
> What distribution you run most of the time?

I use only QtMoko.


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Re: Bootloaders - part 2 (Was: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Al Johnson]

On Tuesday 05 January 2010, Torfinn Ingolfsen wrote:
> On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 1:51 AM, Al Johnson
> 
> wrote:
> > I guess Android only needs a forked Qi because it needed different boot
> > parameters, and Qi can't read them from file when booting from NAND.
> 
> It makes me wonder why the missing functionality (ability to read
>  parameters from a file o something else in nand) wasn't implemented in the
>  main Qi instead of forking it.
> 
> > I find uboot very easy for multibooting.
> 
> Interesting. Care to tell more about your setup?
> Which distributions are yu multibooting? Android, SHR, QtMoko, Hackable?
> One in NAND and three or four on a sd card?
> If you decide to switch sd card, do you hve to update uboot settings?

i have an old Android in NAND that I keep meaning to get rid of, but not 
getting round to. The 8GB uSD is:
mmcblk0p1: 0.5G vfat for Android
mmcblk0p2: 0.5G ext3 for Android
mmcblk0p3: 0.5G ext3 for a rootfs
mmcblk0p5: 0.5G ext3 for a rootfs
mmcblk0p6: 2G ext3 for a rootfs
mmcblk0p7: 4G ext3 for shared storage (navit and tangogps maps, music, 
swapfile etc.)

I configured boot parameters for NAND, p3, p5 and p6 using the uboot cli soon 
after I got the FR, and tweaked it to work with kernels >2M when that became 
an issue. I have rarely touched it since. When I want to  try a new image I 
untar the rootfs to p3, 5 or 6, tweak the fstab and network settings to suit 
my setup, and select the partition form the uboot menu. So far I've used 
various Om, FSO and SHR images without problems. I doubt Debian, Hackable or 
QtMoko would be significantly more difficult, and if I got rid of Android I 
could use the first couple of partitions for more rootfs.


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Koolu's Qi fork (was: Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Paul Fertser]

Al Johnson  writes:
>> I only know about Android needing forked Qi. Which other distro also
>> requires you to have custom bootloader?
>
> I guess Android only needs a forked Qi because it needed different boot  
> parameters, and Qi can't read them from file when booting from NAND. I find 
> uboot very easy for multibooting.

First of all, i do not exactly understand why koolu decided that they
really need another MTD partitioning scheme. There was never any
discussion about that.

Second, they should have warned their users in a big bold letters.

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Rui Miguel Silva Seabra]

Em 03-01-2010 06:10, Ken Young escreveu:
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

There's no decent PDA software for the FR, and I have no other, so No.

>> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-u

Rui

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Kosa]

 On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 12:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Yes
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes
> What distribution you run most of the time?
shr-u


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Bootloaders - part 2 (Was: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Torfinn Ingolfsen]

On Thu, Dec 31, 2009 at 1:51 AM, Al Johnson
wrote:

> I guess Android only needs a forked Qi because it needed different boot
> parameters, and Qi can't read them from file when booting from NAND.


It makes me wonder why the missing functionality (ability to read parameters
from a file o something else in nand) wasn't implemented in the main Qi
instead of forking it.


> I find uboot very easy for multibooting.
>
>
Interesting. Care to tell more about your setup?
Which distributions are yu multibooting? Android, SHR, QtMoko, Hackable?
One in NAND and three or four on a sd card?
If you decide to switch sd card, do you hve to update uboot settings?

-- 
Regards,
Torfinn Ingolfsen
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bootloaders (Was: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Torfinn Ingolfsen]

On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 9:57 PM, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak  wrote:

> On 12/30/09, Torfinn Ingolfsen  wrote:
>
> I only know about Android needing forked Qi. Which other distro also
> requires you to have custom bootloader?
>


None that I know of. But the main problem is that you can't (as a user)
easily multiboot between one image in NAND and sevaral images on SD card.
Let's see:
- Qi is missing the so-called "multiboot partition" that was proposed to fix
this. There has been a few attempts to create a write up that explains how
to set up all this, but AFAIk, today there isn't a complete ow-to anywhere.
In my eyes, this makes qi incomplete.

- uboot has problem with bigger kernels, and besides you still have to
configure it by hand for each partition you want to boot (whoever thought
that up? an ex-grub developer? Why can't uboot figure out this on its own?
Why does it nedd the help of a human for such a simple task?)

- you have already mentioned the forked Qi that Android needs.

Have I forgotten anything?
-- 
Regards,
Torfinn Ingolfsen
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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Helge Hafting]

Sebastian Krzyszkowiak wrote:

> AFAIR there was some problem like that with GSM firmware. Do you have
> it upgraded?

Yes, but I upgraded it long before the first time I tried GPRS. So
perhaps there were problems before that. The phone functionality
improved with the GSM firmware update - no more people complaining
they called me while nothing happened on the device.

Helge Hafting



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Re: Buzz fix (Was: Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[-= Apertum =-]

* Davide Scaini wrote, Il 04/01/2010 23:05:
>
> " The fix will remove that buzz but won't fix other issues
> like rustling, echo or low volume. Those issues can mostly be
> addressed with
> software. "
> The same happened to me, but i didn't find a viable software
> cnfiguration to use the fr as a phone. What about you? I'm really
> looking forward to replace my nokia N70 with fr for calls...
>

I agree.

Me too i have especially the "low volume" problem (i'm with QtMoko). I
tried everything via mixer software, but without any success: phone
calls are always with tiny volume, in an open space or also in a car,
it's really difficult to ear the call. My phone it's a V6 release and
without any buzzfix.

Any suggestion?

-- 
Andrea

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Re: Buzz fix (Was: Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Davide Scaini]

On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 6:53 PM, Michael Zanetti wrote:

> On Friday 01 January 2010 20:35:03 Jens Seidel wrote:
> > On Fri, Jan 01, 2010 at 07:26:37PM +0100, Esben Damgaard wrote:
> > > Yes and no. I have two Freerunners (and a gta01 that collects dust).
> One
> > > without buzzfix. Using it for testing, programming and playing.
> > > Other one with buzzfix and using it as primary phone.
> >
> > I'm curious, do you notice any difference between the buzz fixed one and
> >  the other? I read that only a few phones are affected by the buzz
> problem
> >  but nearly all (including the buzz fixed ones) have major problems with
> >  audio quality (noise, echo).
>
> I own a rev. A5 freerunner and was seriously affected by the buzz problem.
> After applying the hardware fix the audio quality improved a lot. Before
> the
> fix there was no chance to use the FR as a phone.
>
> However, the audio quality was never as good as on a friends rev A7 FR
> (without buzz-fix).  I did a lot of experimenting and tweaking with all
> possible audio parameters but the volume has always been either too low or
> distorted. He just uses the default audio configs and has nearly no
> problems
> with sound quality.
>
> >
> > So I wonder whether it's worth to get such a fix.
> >
>
> It is definetly worth it if you, or better said your call partner
> expierences
> a rather loud buzz. The fix will remove that buzz but won't fix other
> issues
> like rustling, echo or low volume. Those issues can mostly be addressed
> with
> software.
>

" The fix will remove that buzz but won't fix other issues
like rustling, echo or low volume. Those issues can mostly be addressed with
software. "
The same happened to me, but i didn't find a viable software cnfiguration to
use the fr as a phone. What about you? I'm really looking forward to replace
my nokia N70 with fr for calls...
d


> Hope that helps,
> Michael
>
>
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Esteban Monge]

Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Yes
Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes

What distribution you run most of the time?
QtMoko

If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
over to, and why?

Sometime ago I has two phones, a Nokia 5130 and a Nokia 5310, but I think in
the complete change to the clear side of the force, and sold together and
bought another Neo Freerunner for diary use and one for experiments!!!
Actually have one for diary use and for experiments...


Thank you :)
-- 
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Linux user number 478378
Linux machine number 386687
Tec. Esteban Monge Marín
Tel: (506) 8379-3562

“No habrá manera de desarrollarnos y salir de
la pobreza mientras los pocos negocios
grandes de nuestro medio se entreguen a las
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mientras en vez de ser propietarios de nuestro
propio país nos convirtamos en un ejército de
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Re: Buzz fix (Was: Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Michael Zanetti]

On Friday 01 January 2010 20:35:03 Jens Seidel wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 01, 2010 at 07:26:37PM +0100, Esben Damgaard wrote:
> > Yes and no. I have two Freerunners (and a gta01 that collects dust). One
> > without buzzfix. Using it for testing, programming and playing.
> > Other one with buzzfix and using it as primary phone.
> 
> I'm curious, do you notice any difference between the buzz fixed one and
>  the other? I read that only a few phones are affected by the buzz problem
>  but nearly all (including the buzz fixed ones) have major problems with
>  audio quality (noise, echo).

I own a rev. A5 freerunner and was seriously affected by the buzz problem. 
After applying the hardware fix the audio quality improved a lot. Before the 
fix there was no chance to use the FR as a phone.

However, the audio quality was never as good as on a friends rev A7 FR 
(without buzz-fix).  I did a lot of experimenting and tweaking with all 
possible audio parameters but the volume has always been either too low or 
distorted. He just uses the default audio configs and has nearly no problems 
with sound quality.

> 
> So I wonder whether it's worth to get such a fix.
> 

It is definetly worth it if you, or better said your call partner expierences 
a rather loud buzz. The fix will remove that buzz but won't fix other issues 
like rustling, echo or low volume. Those issues can mostly be addressed with 
software.

Hope that helps,
Michael



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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Esben Stien]

Ken Young  writes:

> there is really no hope at that a group of people such as the
> gta02-core team, working part time with no large corporate sponsor,
> will ever produce a product with hardware on a par with what the big
> players are contemporaneously offering.

Do you still don't know to never underestimate enthusiasts?. 

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[-= Apertum =-]

* Ken Young wrote, Il 03/01/2010 07:10:
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>> 

Yes, but always with some problems.

The *biggest* problem is battery life of my FR, because some times i
cannot finish a day with a full charge, doing only some short calls.
It's a big issue from day 0, IMHO, never really solved. I'm very happy
of the screen and solid design of the FR, but his graphic speed and
responsiveness (with QtMoko, at least) some times it's not good.

>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>> 
Yes, but without the copy/paste fuction and "a still not so good" touch
keyboard, also here i've some problem.
But using  it as a pure GPS device, it's really good.

>> What distribution you run most of the time?
>> 
QtMoko (latest version compilad and maintained by the great Radek
Polak), that is Qt based over a Debian (as i understand).

-- 
Andrea

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Xavier Vens]

no
no
shr-u


On Mon, Jan 4, 2010 at 3:25 PM, Bernd Prünster
 wrote:
> jeremy jozwik wrote:
>> On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 12:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
>>
>>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>>> What distribution you run most of the time?
>>>
> yes
> yes
> shr-u
>
>
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Bernd Prünster]

jeremy jozwik wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 12:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
>   
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>> What distribution you run most of the time?
>> 
yes
yes
shr-u


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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Xavier Cremaschi]

Risto H. Kurppa a écrit :
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Yes, since july 2008 (rev5, buzzfixed one year later)

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes.
> 
> What distribution you run most of the time?
SHR for a long time, Android currently (very comfy + great browser/wifi)

> 
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
> 
> 
> Thank you :)
You're welcome.



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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Olivier Migeot]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 9:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes, though my use of a PDA is a bit scarce. Mostly GPS-based
functions (OSM tracks and the such).

> What distribution you run most of the time?

A (somewhat outdated) shr-u.

Happy new year to all of you.

-- 
Olivier

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Michael Smith]

On Tue, 29 Dec 2009 22:30:53 +0200
"Risto H. Kurppa"  wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

No

> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-U

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

I still use my palm pilot as my PDA through I am writing an application for SHR 
to replace the palm pilot.
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Network Applications
www.netapps.com.au   | +61 (0) 416 062 898
Web Hosting  | Internet Services

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Re: Whither open hardware ? (was Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Werner Almesberger]

Laszlo KREKACS wrote:
> Is it unsuitable for a phone because of power inefficiency?
> Can be the "ARM Cortex-A8 600Mhz" used in a future phone?

There are many component choices for future phones. Things to consider
when choosing chips include:

- do they fit the intended purpose ?
- are they open enough for our purposes ?
- are they available (to us) ?
- will they be available as long as we need them ?
- are they affordable ?
- what are the integration costs ?
- what are the opportunity costs ?
- do they work as intended ?
- how do they fit our technical capabilities ?
- what legal exposures do they cause ?

Of course, you don't see companies advertize much on the issues listed
above. Quite to the contrary - how often does one see a feature
presented as "patented proprietary technology" as if this was a good
thing ?

- Werner

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Re: Whither open hardware ? (was Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Joerg Eesmann]

Hi,
I would love to have an open phone with OMAP processor like OpenPandora
and BeagleBoard. Both have the OMAP 3530 with 3D acceleration and DSP.
Maybe a phone doesn't need the DSP. But it is amazingly powersufficient,
IMO. The phone would be up to date from processor power, and there
should not be a resource problem so soon, I guess. BeagleBoard and
OpenPandora are both well supported in OE, so from SW-side there should
not be so much effort (in theorie, you kow...).
>From HW-side another nicy is the POP (package on package). In the
BeagleBoard they are using a variant, where the RAM and NAND (both in
one Chip) is soldered on top of the processor, so the high speed lines
to DDR-RAM are not going through the PCB (on the other of course, you
have the process of soldering...).
... just dreaming ...
Joerg

On Sun, 2010-01-03 at 20:39 +0100, Laszlo KREKACS wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 3, 2010 at 3:47 PM, Werner Almesberger  
> wrote:
> > The 2442 is now about five years old, and it shows all over the
> > place. In an updated but similar design, unlike gta02-core suitable
> > for mass-production, I would use something like the 2450, which has
> > high-speed USB, 2D acceleration, and other goodies.
> 
> There is also the openpandora project:
> http://www.open-pandora.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=2&Itemid=2〈=en
> 
> Is it unsuitable for a phone because of power inefficiency?
> Can be the "ARM Cortex-A8 600Mhz" used in a future phone?
> 
> Laszlo
> 
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Re: Whither open hardware ? (was Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Laszlo KREKACS]

On Sun, Jan 3, 2010 at 3:47 PM, Werner Almesberger  wrote:
> The 2442 is now about five years old, and it shows all over the
> place. In an updated but similar design, unlike gta02-core suitable
> for mass-production, I would use something like the 2450, which has
> high-speed USB, 2D acceleration, and other goodies.

There is also the openpandora project:
http://www.open-pandora.org/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=2&Itemid=2&lang=en

Is it unsuitable for a phone because of power inefficiency?
Can be the "ARM Cortex-A8 600Mhz" used in a future phone?

Laszlo

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Whither open hardware ? (was Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Werner Almesberger]

Ken Young wrote:
> My two cents:   If I were dictator of the gta02-core team (instead of
> someone who doesn't even contribute), I would repurpose the device as a
> GPS PDA.   I would remove all the radio components except for the WiFi,
> and try to optimize for the longest battery life possible.

Companies who were looking for a device for some project often asked
Openmoko Inc. if they could have a GTA02 with some features removed
or with other - often small - changes. Unfortunately, Openmoko Inc.
did not have the resources for making such derivatives.

However, this is a promise the approach chosen for gta02-core holds:
with the whole design out in the open (Open Design Hardware [1]),
anyone can independently define, implement, and produce derivatives.

[1] http://people.openmoko.org/werner/openness/odhwdr-v1.pdf

This doesn't mean that everyone is forced to fight all alone. To the
contrary, there are many possible synergies along the way that are
not visible as such in the traditional product development process,
such as shared sourcing or shared manufacturing.

For example, if you want to make your GPS PDA, you may choose a set
of changes that fits your budget, e.g., by staying with the overall
platform and physical shape but removing subsystems you don't need.

When it then comes to sourcing components and manufacturing, the
same facilities used for making the phone could offer their services
also to your project. The incremental cost for them would be very
small, much smaller than running a completely different product of
similar complexity.

Also the "core company" (or whatever form of organization) in charge
of the base design would benefit. If it has spare engineering
resources to put into derivative projects, it can choose to do so,
favouring projects that best suit its agenda.

If not, others can help out. Thus, the business opportunity is not
wasted - it only goes to someone else you could think of as an ally.
Even better, resources that can be shared contribute back to the
whole ensemble of projects. E.g., if your PDA is wildly successful,
sourcing may be able to get much getter conditions for parts than
they did with just the phone. Or a new type of subsystem gets
researched and is then available as a possible building block for
the entire architectural family. Thus also the phone benefits.

Now some may say that this is crazy and that anyone handing out
designs so liberally would be robbed by competitors. In my
experience, it's surprisingly hard to get people to "steal" your
cool new ideas. Eventually, the thieves and parasites will show up,
but you have to be successful for an awfully long time before they
even notice you.

> [...] but rather to point out that there
> is really no hope at that a group of people such as the gta02-core team,
> working part time with no large corporate sponsor, will ever produce a
> product with hardware on a par with what the big players are
> contemporaneously offering.

I agree on the point that there's no hope to mass-produce a phone
without suitable resources. The resources don't have to be in one
hand (e.g., you could have a consortium of entities each
contributing their own capabilities and splitting the proceeds),
but they have to be available.

However, I don't think it's necessary to compete on leading edge
technology. Often enough, less advanced components will yield an
equally satisfying product. Besides, companies that don't have the
sexiest product in their sector of the market are often much
friendlier towards openness than those who do.

Please don't take the poor performance of GTA01 or GTA02 as too much
of an indicator of what "second best" can do. Both are based on very
conservative designs (e.g., no DDR) and GTA02 has two thirds of its
high-throughput peripherals share an incredibly slow bus.

(Think of a first-generation PCI-based PC where someone chooses to
use ISA cards for video and the SCSI controller. Would such a system
properly represent the typical performance of the PCI architecture ?)

The 2442 is now about five years old, and it shows all over the
place. In an updated but similar design, unlike gta02-core suitable
for mass-production, I would use something like the 2450, which has
high-speed USB, 2D acceleration, and other goodies.

> In contrast, I think there still might be an unexploited niche in the
> GPS-PDA arena.

I think there is a whole universe full of unexplored niches. It's
hidden from us by a tall wall called "high cost of entry". If we can
find ways to lower that wall, a lot of interesting things should
happen.

- Werner

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Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Ken Young]

>Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Not anymore.   I did for several months.

>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes, I still find it to be a wonderfully fun GPS-enabled PDA.   I just
got an N900, and I was quite surprised to find that the Freerunner's
display is nicer.   The N900 has 25% more pixels, but the Freerunner's
display is brighter, and seems to have higher contrast.

>What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-u

My two cents:   If I were dictator of the gta02-core team (instead of
someone who doesn't even contribute), I would repurpose the device as a
GPS PDA.   I would remove all the radio components except for the WiFi,
and try to optimize for the longest battery life possible.

Those of us who have been following the Openmoko phones since before the
release of the gta01 will remember that Sean Moss-Pultz use to give
presentations in which one of the slides said that one of his big itches,
one of the things that lead him to work on a phone, was the desire to be
able to execute

[quote]

 An adaptation of my favorite command in all of computing

root> apt-get install

[end quote]

Many of us read or heard those words and were hooked.  But the cell
phone world has changed dramatically since the introduction of the gta01.

When the gta01 was announced, GPS hardware was quite rare in a phone (the
first generation iPhone didn't have it, for example), and those few phones
which did have it had often been intentionally crippled by the wireless
service providers (at least in the US), so that they could offer
additional-fee location based "services" which were uniformly terrible.
Needless to say, third parties were not encouraged to write GPS enabled
software for those phones.   Today, it goes without saying that any new
smartphone will have GPS, and on many platforms, application developers
have access to the GPS information.

Today, you can buy an N900 from Nokia, and "apt-get install ..." will work
like a charm.   Nokia allows the user to run as root.   Their OS on that
phone is pretty familiar to Debian users.   I know that many of the
critical components on that phone are closed, and that owners are at the
mercy of Nokia's decision as to whether or not to support new kernel
releases, etc.   But on the other side of the equation, the phone works
well now, is 3G-enabled, has a good camera, has an audio system that does
not clip bass frequencies, has USB 2 rather than 1.1, has a much faster
processor, an FM transmitter/receiver, more RAM, GSM quad-band (not tri-band),
etc., ad nausium.   My point is not to be a shill for Nokia (though I'm
sure that's exactly what I sound like), but rather to point out that there
is really no hope at that a group of people such as the gta02-core team,
working part time with no large corporate sponsor, will ever produce a
product with hardware on a par with what the big players are
contemporaneously offering.   That wasn't really as clear when the gta01
was offered.   It had hardware that was better than average in some
respects (GPS, high resolution display), and worse than average in others
(CPU and connectivity).   The gta01 could hold its own against a Treo.
I don't think we'll see an openmoko phone that can hold its own against a
modern smartphone.

In software too, the situation has changed dramatically.  When the gta01
was announced, other smartphones were running terrible OSs like PalmOS,
or early versions of whatever the hell Microsoft was calling Windows
CE that week.  Now there's WebOS, Android, Maemo and OS X availble on
phones, all based on some Unix-like OS.   Are they free?   No.   But they
aren't simply hopeless for multi tasking like PalmOS was.

I'm sure there are people reading this who won't care about that.   The
mere fact that there are many people reading this mailing list who still
care about the Freerunner, even though they don't use it as their "real
phone" is a testiment to the loyalty of the openmoko community, and how
much we all wanted the Freerunner to succeed.   If a gta02-core or gta03
phone is ever offered for sale to the general public, I'll buy one.   But
I don't think there is any chance at all that such a phone will sell even
at the volume the Freerunner did.   And that was not enough to keep
Openmoko Co. in the phone business.If you read the posts to this list
that were made shortly after the Freerunner went on sale, it's clear that
the phone was bought by some people who really just wanted a high-end
smartphone, and who were not geeks who enjoyed reading about ALSA files on
the wiki site.   The IRC channel was a lively beehive, with participants
of widely varying skills.   If another openmoko phone ever goes on sale, I
predict it will be bought only by the most fanatic FOSS enthusiasts.

In contrast, I think there still might be an unexploited niche in the
GPS-PDA arena.   Everyone knows the Freerunner has excited geocachers,
hikers, bikers, etc.   I don't know of any company such as Garmin or
Magellen o

Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Sebastian Krzyszkowiak]

On 1/2/10, Helge Hafting  wrote:
>>
>>  >Does anyone else have trouble doing opkg ugrade over gprs? mine hangs
>>  >after a bit.
>>  I never tried that - but make sure the thing doesn't suspend.
>>  
>>
>> The problem happens somewhere between the wget application and the kernel
>> stack.
>> It shows up with larger files being downloaded. Not too large, a few dozen
>> kB is enough.
>> When I see it happening,  I repeat the wget download that opkg was trying
>> to do, and I can see that wget is
>> actually in "stalled" state after the first kB. If I retry the download
>> with the "continue" option, it
>> eventually downloads the whole file, retry after retry, chunk by chunk.
>> This only happens with GPRS, so I assume it is related to kernel or pppd
>> or around this...
>
> Have you tried a different kernel? The kernel is in a separate flash, so
> upgrading the root filesystem
> doesn't change the kernel, it must be installed separately. It could help -
> if it is a kernel problem.
>
> If nothing helps, consider trying a different phone company. The problem
> could be there too.
>
> Helge Hafting

AFAIR there was some problem like that with GSM firmware. Do you have
it upgraded?

-- 
Sebastian Krzyszkowiak
dos

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Cédric Berger]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 21:30, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Not anymore

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
No

> What distribution you run most of the time?
Android

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
HTC Magic (Android)
because it works
and brings some freedom anyway

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Petr Vanek]

>That can be bug then, I'll try to check it (I'm sure it doesn't happen
>when sending from opimd-utils)

hmm, all my test sms messages to myself eventually arrived during the
evening*. i haven't heard notify (but the phone was tucked in my
pocket), so most probably not a fr bug unless somewhere deep in
framework-calypso communication causing some delays in receiving. but
the GSM signal here is quite weak so who knows...

* hey, that storage is great, now only the sent view is missing :))

cheers
Petr


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RE: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Helge Hafting]

>
>   >Does anyone else have trouble doing opkg ugrade over gprs? mine hangs
>   >after a bit.
>   I never tried that - but make sure the thing doesn't suspend.
>   
>
> The problem happens somewhere between the wget application and the kernel 
> stack.
> It shows up with larger files being downloaded. Not too large, a few dozen kB 
> is enough.
> When I see it happening,  I repeat the wget download that opkg was trying to 
> do, and I can see that wget is 
> actually in "stalled" state after the first kB. If I retry the download with 
> the "continue" option, it 
> eventually downloads the whole file, retry after retry, chunk by chunk.
> This only happens with GPRS, so I assume it is related to kernel or pppd or 
> around this...

Have you tried a different kernel? The kernel is in a separate flash, so 
upgrading the root filesystem
doesn't change the kernel, it must be installed separately. It could help - if 
it is a kernel problem.

If nothing helps, consider trying a different phone company. The problem could 
be there too.

Helge Hafting



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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Juergen Schinker]

Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
> 
> What distribution you run most of the time?

Yes since 26c3
Yes
H:1


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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Klaus 'mrmoku' Kurzmann]

On Tue, 29 Dec 2009, Risto H. Kurppa wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
yes
yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
SHR unstable


> Thank you :)


> r
-- 
Klaus 'mrmoku' Kurzmann

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Sebastian Krzyszkowiak]

On Sat, Jan 2, 2010 at 19:33, Petr Vanek  wrote:
>>> WTF?
>
> Not necessary here IMHO.

Sorry, I'm not native speaker, so this doesn't have such strong
meaning for me, maybe WTH could be better ;)

>>>Sent sms storage is implemented for quite long time... They are
>>> just displayed together with incoming ones, as there is no different
>>> view for sent messages yet.
>>>
>>> And thanks for reminding us about 386, it probably should be closed
>>> now :)
>
> thanks for reopening the bug for the missing view. i am testing this
> now and for some reason i can receive sms from other people, i can also
> send sms and yes, can see them in the inbox (great, thank you) but when
> sending sms to myself, never seem to receive (or perhaps just see?) the
> message in inbox. this led me to the conclusion sent messages are not
> saved because for a message from me to me i can see just one message
> and not two. this is on shr-u, upgraded today.

That can be bug then, I'll try to check it (I'm sure it doesn't happen
when sending from opimd-utils)

>>And that strange GPRS issue (which is even more strange to me, because
>>I never had that on my FR :x) is going to be resolved soon with
>>ogsmd->fsogsmd transition (which is also going to give us nice
>>performance boost)
>
> just because you never had it does not mean it doesn't exist. i know

I perfectly know that, read again what I wrote and don't worry :P

> about the ogsmd->fsogsmd transition and am eagerly waiting for it,
> holding by breath and wishing Mickey will manage to have it done before
> jumping to his other duties.
>
> strangely enough, i didn't have the GPRS issue for some time before
> Christmas, now it bites every time i use gprs.
>
>> And >to not spread FUD :P)
>
> looking at the tickets (reopened and existing), i am aware of being
> constructively critical but not FUD spreading.

Well, both of SHR tickets you mentioned were closed when you wrote
that mail. One of them I reopened after I read it, but due to other
reasons than mentioned in your mail (as I removed storing sent
messages and also few other already implemented things from this
ticket). Maybe, again, FUD is too strong wording, but still your point
wasn't valid ;)

> cheers
>
> Petr

-- 
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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Petr Vanek]

>> WTF? 

Not necessary here IMHO.

>>Sent sms storage is implemented for quite long time... They are
>> just displayed together with incoming ones, as there is no different
>> view for sent messages yet.
>>
>> And thanks for reminding us about 386, it probably should be closed
>> now :)

thanks for reopening the bug for the missing view. i am testing this
now and for some reason i can receive sms from other people, i can also
send sms and yes, can see them in the inbox (great, thank you) but when
sending sms to myself, never seem to receive (or perhaps just see?) the
message in inbox. this led me to the conclusion sent messages are not
saved because for a message from me to me i can see just one message
and not two. this is on shr-u, upgraded today.

>And that strange GPRS issue (which is even more strange to me, because
>I never had that on my FR :x) is going to be resolved soon with
>ogsmd->fsogsmd transition (which is also going to give us nice
>performance boost)

just because you never had it does not mean it doesn't exist. i know
about the ogsmd->fsogsmd transition and am eagerly waiting for it,
holding by breath and wishing Mickey will manage to have it done before
jumping to his other duties.

strangely enough, i didn't have the GPRS issue for some time before
Christmas, now it bites every time i use gprs.

> And >to not spread FUD :P)

looking at the tickets (reopened and existing), i am aware of being
constructively critical but not FUD spreading.

cheers

Petr 


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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Sebastian Krzyszkowiak]

On Sat, Jan 2, 2010 at 16:44, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak
 wrote:
> On Sat, Jan 2, 2010 at 14:07, Petr Vanek  wrote:
>> P> Perhaps some remaining users and developers
>> P> from others FreeRunner distributions will be persuaded by the result
>> P> to also migrate to SHR.
>>
>> and that would be a good thing? not sure everybody would want to reboot
>> everytime after gprs usage [1] and not have sent sms storage [2],[3]...
>>
>> Petr
>>
>> [1] http://trac.freesmartphone.org/ticket/474
>> [2] http://trac.shr-project.org/trac/ticket/231
>> [3] http://trac.shr-project.org/trac/ticket/386
>
> WTF? Sent sms storage is implemented for quite long time... They are
> just displayed together with incoming ones, as there is no different
> view for sent messages yet.
>
> And thanks for reminding us about 386, it probably should be closed now :)

Ok, looked at that ticket more carefully and edited it. But still, it
doesn't make your point valid ;)

And that strange GPRS issue (which is even more strange to me, because
I never had that on my FR :x) is going to be resolved soon with
ogsmd->fsogsmd transition (which is also going to give us nice
performance boost)

(But I don't think it's good to have everyone using one distro. Of
course as SHR developer I would like more users, but as free software
developer in general I think it's really important to have choice. And
to not spread FUD :P)

--
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Risto H. Kurppa]

On Sat, Jan 2, 2010 at 5:36 PM, Petr Vanek  wrote:
> Hi Risto,
>
> what would be your answers?
>
> Here is a quick sum up of the answers. Including answers from shr-user
> list as well:
>
> responded 81
>
>>Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>
> Yes 55, No 26
>
>>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> Yes 58, No 23
>
>>What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> (some gave more then 1 distro, max 2 were counted)
>
> SHR 63
> QTMoko 10
> Debian 6
> H:1 4
> Gentoo 2
> Android 2
> om2008 2
>
> Kind Regards
> Petr

Wow, thanks for this summary!!


r



-- 
| risto h. kurppa
| risto at kurppa dot fi
| http://risto.kurppa.fi

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Risto H. Kurppa]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 10:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes (GPS and GPRS&IRC, for other tasks I use my eeepc)

> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-testing

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

I had to go back to my wife's old Nokia but after #1024 fix
(http://risto.kurppa.fi/blog/2009/12/fixing-openmoko-hardware-bug-1024/)
I upgraded to latest SHR-testing and got many issues fixed (battery
life and audio quality improved a lot).

> Thank you :)

Thank you :)


-- 
| risto h. kurppa
| risto at kurppa dot fi
| http://risto.kurppa.fi

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Petr Vanek]

Hi Risto,

what would be your answers?

Here is a quick sum up of the answers. Including answers from shr-user
list as well:

responded 81

>Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes 55, No 26

>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes 58, No 23

>What distribution you run most of the time?

(some gave more then 1 distro, max 2 were counted)

SHR 63
QTMoko 10
Debian 6
H:1 4
Gentoo 2
Android 2
om2008 2

Kind Regards
Petr


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Re: Buzz fix (Was: Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[jeremy jozwik]

On Fri, Jan 1, 2010 at 11:35 AM, Jens Seidel  wrote:
> I'm curious, do you notice any difference between the buzz fixed one and the
> other? I read that only a few phones are affected by the buzz problem but
> nearly all (including the buzz fixed ones) have major problems with audio
> quality (noise, echo).

im curious how many people have played around with there mickeyterm settings.
my phones audio is just as bad as any other phone ive had. not buzz fix.

with audio as low as it may be.

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Buzz fix (Was: Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?)

[Jens Seidel]

On Fri, Jan 01, 2010 at 07:26:37PM +0100, Esben Damgaard wrote:
> Yes and no. I have two Freerunners (and a gta01 that collects dust). One 
> without buzzfix. Using it for testing, programming and playing.
> Other one with buzzfix and using it as primary phone.

I'm curious, do you notice any difference between the buzz fixed one and the
other? I read that only a few phones are affected by the buzz problem but
nearly all (including the buzz fixed ones) have major problems with audio
quality (noise, echo).

So I wonder whether it's worth to get such a fix.

Jens

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Linus Gasser]

Le 29.12.09 21:30, Risto H. Kurppa a écrit :
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

No

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

No

> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR or hackable:1

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

The most simple Nokia money can buy. I need to be able to answer phones, 
not:
- scream because buzzing makes it impossible for anybody to understand me
- taking 4 times as much time for writng an SMS compared to the most 
cheap Nokia
- constantly loosing SMS or having long SMS cut in two
- rebooting two or three times a day before receiving calls or being 
able to make
- taking 5 minutes to write an appointement when it takes me 10 seconds 
to do with my do-it-yourself-paper-agenda

I still like it as GPS and GPRS modem, and as mp3-player, though. I'm 
planning to fix it in my car as that...

I still think it's a great experiment on open-source development, and I 
don't mind having paid the money for it. Furthermore I get very 
impressed by the quality of simple Nokia or other phones ;)

Linus

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Petr Vanek]

answering for two people here:


>Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
yes
>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
yes
>What distribution you run most of the time?
android, shr

---

>Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
no
>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
yes
>What distribution you run most of the time?
shr


Petr


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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Enaut Waldmeier]

2010/1/1 qu kai 

>
>
> >Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>
yes! but I use i the mobile as often as i used it before i had the moko.
(had no other mobile) So not to often.

>
>
> >Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
 Yes! pretty much the same here.

>
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>

SHR


>
> --
> 活着！
>
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>
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[qu kai]

>Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
yes!!

>Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes!

What distribution you run most of the time?

Debian!!


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RE: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Helge Hafting]

-Original Message-
From: shr-user-boun...@lists.shr-project.org on behalf of Vasco Névoa
Sent: Thu 12/31/2009 7:20 PM
Cc: List for Openmoko community discussion; shr-u...@lists.shr-project.org
Subject: Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[...]
> Adjusting the call volume is a sorely missed feature, though.

The new SHR-U has that for you. :-)
[...]
> GPRS and WIFI are too unstable for any real connection, so no web or email.

My experience is that GPRS has been stable for a long time, and WIFI
is fine _if_ the phone don't suspend. So keep it on, either by
plugging in power, or by turning suspend off in shr-settings.

There is one annoying problem if several of GPRS/USB/WIFI
is used - the last one to be used changes /etc/resolv.conf,
and if that connection quits then the remaining ones
may fail to look up names. Can be fixed by restarting 
the remaining connection.

>And bluetooth is just not there (no GUI == not there for the user).
>Does anyone else have trouble doing opkg ugrade over gprs? mine hangs 
>after a bit.

I never tried that - but make sure the thing doesn't suspend.
Plug in power, or turn suspend off.


Helge Hafting

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RE: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Helge Hafting]

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Yes
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?
SHR-unstable. I upgrade often, except that I wait when others
run into some new problem. Then I wait for resolution, which normally
don't take long.

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

If I change, it will be to correct various problems:
* Buzz and bass problems. Can be fixed with capacitors, but
  that won't be free and it won't help with the slowness problem.
  A BT headset will probably solve my sound issues, and can be carried
  over to future phones. But it means an extra device to bring, and another
  battery to charge. :-/
* Slowness. Of course, the new SHR-U helped. And we may still see
  improvements in X and elsewhere. Still, it seems the device
  has a slow memory bus, a slow connection to its SDcard, and
  slow graphics.  It is useable, but a really snappy phone could be
  tempting. IF it runs a user-modifiable linux, that is!

Helge Hafting
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Neil Jerram]

2009/12/29 Risto H. Kurppa :
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Partly - i.e. reading my gmail with links2.  Other email is elsewhere,
and I don't do electronic calendaring or task tracking.

> What distribution you run most of the time?

Debian.

  Neil

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Davide Scaini]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 9:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>

Not yet hoping to fix the audio quality issue (I had a buzz fix but still
not usable in calls - if you have some idea how to configure frameworkd.conf
please reply to the thread on shr-users list "[shr-user] fine tuning audio")


> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> Yes


> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> SHR-U (and shr-t on nand).
I have to say that i used a lot debian (but missing a confortable input
system, because of very old illume); tried several times android, and latest
one from community was great, but I don't want to flash it on my nand.


> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
> A dumb phone just to call. I hate smartphones and fr can't place a call
with good quality (and i suspect i'm affected from 1024 bug).


>
> Thank you :)
>
> you're welcome :P

>
> r
>
> --
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
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> http://lists.shr-project.org/mailman/listinfo/shr-user
>
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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Dan Staley]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 3:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>

Yes


> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> YesI guess.  Though I don't use it in the PDA sense for much other than
playing games and ssh'ing into my home pc.


> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
>
SHR-U/T until recently.  I've started trying some of the other distros
available.  Currently am playing with Android.


> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
> --
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Vasco Névoa]

Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>   
YES.
It's my only phone for over a year. I did the buzzfix and gps cap myself 
and got no complaints there.
Adjusting the call volume is a sorely missed feature, though.
But the slowness of the software does tend to screw up things when more 
than one thing happens at the same time (simultaneous incoming calls, etc.)
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>   
YES.
GPS, password vault, the occasional Mokomaze.
GPRS and WIFI are too unstable for any real connection, so no web or email.
And bluetooth is just not there (no GUI == not there for the user).
Does anyone else have trouble doing opkg ugrade over gprs? mine hangs 
after a bit.
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>   
SHR-U (currently the old one from September, which works stable enough 
as a phone.)
The new Testing is quite broken, and I couldn't understand why the new 
Unstables where older than the Testing ones. Now that I see a lot of 
people is using the Unstable, it's probably meant to be like that -- and 
just opkg upgrade all the time. Will try it today...
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>   
I haven't switched out because it is good enough as a simple working 
phone and a very basic GPS. Other than that, it is crap.
I don't blame the community for the state of things; I think that 
Openmoko.com started by biting off much more than it could chew, failed 
to build a solid community, then realized the dead end which they put 
themselves into, and backed out on all of us into "plan B". I understand 
the economics that forced OM to reboot and start over with the 
Wikireader, but I will always resent the fact that I spent 300 EUR on a 
badly designed and even worse tested hardware. I cannot forgive them for 
releasing this HW into the public without a fully patched kernel and 
drivers and a full list of known caveats after an honest effort to 
completely test the device. They somehow thought that time-to-market was 
more important than quality and reliability. Personally, I think there 
is no forgiveness for them because of this. Having said that, I am 
admired at this community that still keeps kicking the dead horse with a 
passion, and there is a small thread of hope inside my heart that this 
brick will someday fulfill at least half of its promises. And if it 
does, it will all be due to the work of these last few heroes - and I 
thank you so much.
The Openmoko project is to me a disappointment as big as the 
cancellation of SG-1 and Firefly: there was still so much to do and say, 
but economics had the last word. Well, at least there are positive 
things left behind like the FSO and the colorful ecosystem of other 
distros and apps.
Have a nice 2010 everyone!! :D
May the source always be with you.
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
>   

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Thomas Zimmermann]

Am Dienstag 29 Dezember 2009 21:30:53 schrieb Risto H. Kurppa:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
No
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
No
> What distribution you run most of the time?
SHR unstable
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
Palm Pre (but never used FR as primary phone), i'm seeing the FR as my toy.

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[rixed]

yes
yes
H:1


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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Rafael Campos]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 9:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
NO
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
SHR-Unstable with own apps

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
A little more stabilitiy, but i consider it as a hacking device, and
you could not hack it if you are using it as a daily phone ;)
Maybe with some distro evolution I lack time to test all the distros.
>
>
> Thank you :)
>
You are wellcome
>
> r
>
> --
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
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>



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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Ian Stephen]

Quoting "Risto H. Kurppa" :

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?

Yes
No
SHR

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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Hans Zimmerman]

Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

yes

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

yes

> 
> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-Testing

> 
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
> 

I need to switch to another phone when calling my grandmother, surely 
she doesn't hear very well any more but there still seems to be a 
audio/voice quality. I'm surprised so many people in this thread mention 
this.


Hans


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RE: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Russell Dwiggins]

|Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Sometimes

|Do you use FR as your primary PDA?


No

|What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-U

|If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
|over to, and why?

No changes yet, but still use Treo 650 because of PIM and Bluetooth headset.
Once these things are stable, I think I can make the daily move.  Since my
Treo is falling apart, and since the distros are taking a long time to be
ready (I don't blame anyone), the n900 is looking attractive.  I'd rather
stay open, though.
|
|Thank you :)

Thank YOU!
 [Russell Dwiggins] 
|
|


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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[David Wagner]

jeremy jozwik a écrit :
> On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 12:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>> What distribution you run most of the time?

yes

no

hackable:1 , rev5

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Al Johnson]

On Wednesday 30 December 2009, Sebastian Krzyszkowiak wrote:
> On 12/30/09, Torfinn Ingolfsen  wrote:
> > On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 9:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> >> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> >
> > No.
> > I still test stuff on it when time permits.
> >
> > Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
> >
> >
> > No. Currently, I don't have a PDA. The only thing I need from a PDA is to
> > sync with my calendar at work (Exchange mailbox), and the FreeRunner
> > can't do that (yet?).
> >
> >> What distribution you run most of the time?
> >
> > QtMoko.
> > Note: I would have tested more distributions had there existed an _easy_
> > way to boot several distributions  (multi-boot) from one SD card.
> > Currently it seems that each distribution requires a different
> > bootloader.
> 
> I only know about Android needing forked Qi. Which other distro also
> requires you to have custom bootloader?

I guess Android only needs a forked Qi because it needed different boot  
parameters, and Qi can't read them from file when booting from NAND. I find 
uboot very easy for multibooting.

> >> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> >> over to, and why?
> >
> > Nokia E61, then a Nokia basic model (the E61 died(
> >
> > I never switched _to_ the FreeRunner, because of the short battery life.
> > Having to charge it one or more times during 8 hours is to much hassle
> > for me, and impractical, as I don't carry a computer with me at all
> > times.
> 
> Strange, maybe your QtMoko just doesn't do well power management. Here
> I need to recharge every ~2 days of normal usage, and battery time
> when using GPS is also just nice, for instance for GSM cell logging (I
> have second battery from my old Nokia and I don't need more)

I get ~2days between charges most of the time too. GPS tracklogs cut it a lot, 
more because of not suspending than the GPS power itself, but see below for 
how this compares to a coupe of other handsets.

> > I really wanted to use the FreeRunner as a GPS (for tracking), but the
> > short battery life (even shorter with GPS active all the time) makes it
> > impractical.

I used the FR for recording tracklogs while walking over the summer. Friends 
were using the GPS on a G1 and a Sony-Ericsson (don't know the model) and they 
ran into battery problems much faster than I did. I was pleasantly surprised 
that the FR outperfomed them convincingly in this situation. The S-E also had 
trouble getting a lock when it couldn't get a cell data connection. 

> > --
> > Regards,
> > Torfinn Ingolfsen
> 


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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Ali]

On Tue, 2009-12-29 at 22:30 +0200, Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
yes
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
> 
yes
> What distribution you run most of the time?
> 
SHR-U/qtmoko
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
> 
> 
> Thank you :)
> 
> 
> r
> 


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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Tony McKeehan]

Not my primary phone, but I use it form time to time to surf the 
web/play games with Hackable:1 or QtMoko (only distros that connect to 
web). Not  huge fan of SHR, because the interface does not lend itself 
well to a phone (can't even create+type+send an SMS in less than a 
minute, much less 15-20 seconds like every other phone ever).

My daily phone is the same phone I've had for years, a Motorolla L2 bar 
phone.

-Tonym

Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
>   


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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Laszlo KREKACS]

> "Risto H. Kurppa"  writes:
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Still yes.

>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Define PDA. I use it uniquely for listening music with lyrics, and my
own developed dictionary.

>> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-U from september.

I learned the caveats. I use my modified paroli too. It has bugs,
problems, but I know almost all of them.
If it starts with "cant init wifi service", I will not able to pick up
the incoming call for example.
The above bug I figured out in 2 months (why dont appear the incoming
call screen in paroli).

So there are bugs like this, but as I know all of them (never hang up
the same time as the other party, because paroli/fso just freezes), I
can workaround all of them.

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

I began seriously thinking to switching back to a normal phone. The
audio quality is unreliable and poor.

>
> The largest issue currently is sound quality during call. I have
> managed to get rid of buzz and echo but sometimes people complain that
> they can't hear what I am saying and sometimes the sound is amplified
> so much that it gets distorted. I have not been able to identify why
> this behavior seems to change.

My biggest issue too. It never really worked. I have awesome quality
with Motorola old Razor
phone (my gf has it), almost never have any issue (buzz, echo, etc)
and she is at the
same provider.

But for example with almost all Samsung phone, they can hardly understand me.
I have also problem with Nokia 6300, sometime my voice get chopped,
and the other party
too. So I hear from 1 sec only half sec, then nothing, another half
second, then nothing.
If I speak slooowly the other party can understand me. But I pretty
often need to guess what the
other party wanted to say.

Also I have problem with people who have different provider then me
(pannon vs. vodafone)

What is worst, it has a serious social impact. There are people, who
simply refuse to call me,
because, my phone is "shitty".
When the above "chopping" occurs, the other party starts to be really
angry, and starts
talking faster and louder, which makes the effect even worse.

Talking to landline has no issue in general.

So in my humble opinion the audio (hardware+software) on the
freerunner is seriously fucked up,
and what is worse, the key people never admitted the fact.

I tried everything, I fighted with the issue more then 6 months now
for a feature which is supposed
to JUST WORKs. And I think my settings are the best possible what can be made.

As the audio quality depends on the other party's phone (motorola is
the best in general), and
also the other's provider too, I dont think it can be ever adjusted
from software...


I only kept using this phone, because of the dictionary and the music
listening with lyrics.
Thats the only reason. And thats why I cant switch to an other phone

I also hate the fact that I need to charge every day my freerunner. I
will look into #1024 fix,
just the situation is so frustrating.

I also miss times to times the incoming call, because Im unable to
hear the ringing...

Best regards,
 Laszlo

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Sebastian Krzyszkowiak]

On 12/30/09, Torfinn Ingolfsen  wrote:
> On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 9:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
>
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>>
>
> No.
> I still test stuff on it when time permits.
>
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>>
>
> No. Currently, I don't have a PDA. The only thing I need from a PDA is to
> sync with my calendar at work (Exchange mailbox), and the FreeRunner can't
> do that (yet?).
>
>
>> What distribution you run most of the time?
>>
>
> QtMoko.
> Note: I would have tested more distributions had there existed an _easy_ way
> to boot several distributions  (multi-boot) from one SD card. Currently it
> seems that each distribution requires a different bootloader.

I only know about Android needing forked Qi. Which other distro also
requires you to have custom bootloader?

>> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
>> over to, and why?
>>
>
> Nokia E61, then a Nokia basic model (the E61 died(
>
> I never switched _to_ the FreeRunner, because of the short battery life.
> Having to charge it one or more times during 8 hours is to much hassle for
> me, and impractical, as I don't carry a computer with me at all times.

Strange, maybe your QtMoko just doesn't do well power management. Here
I need to recharge every ~2 days of normal usage, and battery time
when using GPS is also just nice, for instance for GSM cell logging (I
have second battery from my old Nokia and I don't need more)

> I really wanted to use the FreeRunner as a GPS (for tracking), but the short
> battery life (even shorter with GPS active all the time) makes it
> impractical.
> --
> Regards,
> Torfinn Ingolfsen
>

-- 
Sebastian Krzyszkowiak
dos

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Torfinn Ingolfsen]

On Tue, Dec 29, 2009 at 9:30 PM, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
>

No.
I still test stuff on it when time permits.

Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>

No. Currently, I don't have a PDA. The only thing I need from a PDA is to
sync with my calendar at work (Exchange mailbox), and the FreeRunner can't
do that (yet?).


> What distribution you run most of the time?
>

QtMoko.
Note: I would have tested more distributions had there existed an _easy_ way
to boot several distributions  (multi-boot) from one SD card. Currently it
seems that each distribution requires a different bootloader.


> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>

Nokia E61, then a Nokia basic model (the E61 died(

I never switched _to_ the FreeRunner, because of the short battery life.
Having to charge it one or more times during 8 hours is to much hassle for
me, and impractical, as I don't carry a computer with me at all times.

I really wanted to use the FreeRunner as a GPS (for tracking), but the short
battery life (even shorter with GPS active all the time) makes it
impractical.
-- 
Regards,
Torfinn Ingolfsen
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Giovanni]

Almost, I'm starting in these days.
Yes.
SHR-U


On Wed, Dec 30, 2009 at 9:08 PM, Xavier Bestel wrote:

> On Tuesday 29 December 2009 21:30:53 Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> > Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> > Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> Nope, sold it to buy an N900.
> I enjoyed the concept a lot, but I needed something that works.
>
>
>
>
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Xavier Bestel]

On Tuesday 29 December 2009 21:30:53 Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Nope, sold it to buy an N900.
I enjoyed the concept a lot, but I needed something that works.




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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Vincent Meurisse]

On Tuesday 29 December 2009 21:30:53 Risto H. Kurppa wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
Yes
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes
> What distribution you run most of the time?
QtMoko

-- 
Vincent Meurisse

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Vadim, Efimov]

On Tue, 29 Dec 2009 23:30:53 +0300, Risto H. Kurppa   
wrote:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
No

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
Yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?
SHR-U lastest

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
Missing some PIM (especially phonebook) functionality & integration  
(contact's sort order),
audio quality (volume level), battery,

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Adam Jimerson]

On Dec 30, 2009, at 1:08 AM, DRSp. wrote:

> Am 29.12.2009 21:30, schrieb Risto H. Kurppa:
>> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes

>> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes

>>
>> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-U latest


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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[dieeasy]

Il giorno Tue, 29 Dec 2009 22:30:53 +0200
la "Risto H. Kurppa"  cusku di'e:

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

not yet

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?

debian / qtmoko

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

never switched from my previous phone because of in-call audio quality
PIM is getting better, I like osmo very much
-- 
...all is relative, so don't think you're on the right side...

 :: send all your mail in plain ASCII text, please ::
   http://www.ebruni.it/docs/pippolone196/index.htm
GPGkey 0xCED2206BLinux counter registered user n° 356433
http://www.no1984.org/   http://www.againsttcpa.com/

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Michele Abbrescia]

Risto H. Kurppa ha scritto:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes.

> 
> What distribution you run most of the time?

SHR-U.

> 
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
> 
> 
> Thank you :)
> 
> 
> r
> 

-- 
Michele Abbrescia

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[tb]

Yes, although i wish it would be better with core phone services
Yes
SHR-unstable

2009/12/29 Risto H. Kurppa :
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
>
> Thank you :)
>
>
> r
>
> --
> | risto h. kurppa
> | risto at kurppa dot fi
> | http://risto.kurppa.fi
>
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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[arne anka]

> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

yes

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

yes

> What distribution you run most of the time?

debian

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Re: Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Gennady Kupava]

В Втр, 29/12/2009 в 22:30 +0200, Risto H. Kurppa пишет:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?

Yes.

> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?

Yes. But in fact I've not use pda before, so not much from that
functionality.

Most used non-phone functions is music player. Sound quality is nice for
phone, happy with upload method - just scp/mc, and with playing software
supporting any music formats. Intone in shr have own bugs and sometimes
annoyingly slow due to mmc speed, but exactly I want from player.
Mplayer in debian-based distributions (moved only soon).

> What distribution you run most of the time?

80% time were SHR-Unstable, QTmoko for some time, but recently switched
to H:1 for phone software, first flashed to test it, but found it better
that recent shr on my taste.

> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?

n/a. Problems with FR are not strong enough to switch.

Gennady


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Re: [Shr-User] Quick e-mail poll: Still using your Freerunner?

[Maksim 'max_posedon' Melnikau]

On 12/29/09, Risto H. Kurppa  wrote:
> Do you use FR as your daily/primary phone?
> Do you use FR as your primary PDA?
>
> What distribution you run most of the time?
>
> If you don't use FR as your daily phone/PDA, what phone did you change
> over to, and why?
>
>
> Thank you :)
Yes
Yes
SHR-U/playing with Gentoo

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