el shenenigans.
[1] The former MacOS maintiner walked away in early 2021. Nobody left
even has _access_ to a Mac, much less the necessary skills to solve the
outstanding issues.
- Solomon
--
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t of Humanity's history.
No metrics necessary, because who cares what the peasants actually want?
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park
etty small pile of issues from what I normally see.
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL speachy (libera.chat)
signat
r, uh, (3) Port/add this functionality to Plasma/Wayland?
(There's nothing in Wayland that precludes this from working; just
nobody's bothered to implement it)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
you just conflated volunteer Free Software package
maintainers with literal genocidal rapists and murders.
...That is a bad strategy in _any_ world.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:sha
urces. (Granted most of those users are on EL/LTS-type distros..)
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL speachy (libera.chat)
On Fri, Dec 22, 2023 at 02:18:54PM +0100, Florian Weimer wrote:
> gutenprint jpopelka jridky twaugh zdohnal
...FWIW as of a few minutes ago this should be resolved upstream.
- Solomon
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een the operating policy for
two decades seems pretty silly.
- Solomon
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL speachy (libera.cha
ectively stalled indefinitely, the fact remains is
said migration is still the plan of record.
So, if it's effectively dead, let's make it official?
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaft
ted was that this was already a done deal,
and we could either accept it or GTFO.
- Solomon
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL spea
now rely on a proprietary
version of Gitlab?
- Solomon
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL speachy (libera.chat)
signature.asc
Descript
into behavioral changes.
I have twenty-year-old perl scripts that still work just fine, but in my
experience, even couple-years-old python code most likely won't.
If perl is "write once, read nowhere" python is "write once, fix forever".
/rant
- Solomon
--
S
2ban
would result in some serious teeth-gnashing if it got dropped.
- Solomon
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL speachy (libra.chat
e installed
- fail2ban-sendmail-1.0.2-3.fc38.noarch from @System does not belong to a
distupgrade repository
- sos-4.5.1-1.fc38.noarch from @System does not belong to a distupgrade
repository
F38 server #3: Clean upgrade
F38 snowflake RPi3: Clean upgrade
- Solomo
Samsung and
Crucial's official updaters appear to be self-contained linux ISOs. So
clearly the technical capability is there...
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot
ll's chance
in hell that said vendors will ever embrace lvfs given that they
steadfastly refuse to publicly acknowledge that Linux exists, despite
invariably selling a Linux-based print server appliance of some sort.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
[1] Off the top of my head: Logitech wireless stuff, Jabra conference
speaker, synaptics fingerprint sensor, (Samsung?) NVME storage, and
probably more..
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
far more
common threat of corruption or data loss)
- Solomon
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL speachy (libra.chat)
#x27;s make things better for those before worry about mitigating APTs
that need lots of system-specific awareness in order for an attack to
succeed?
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:sh
ere (ie right after the "enable freshrpms and
install modern video codecs" step), becuase it's a usability nightmare.
In the "usability vs security" tradeoff, usability/convenience *always*
wins unless you're at a place that
for remuneration.
Under the GPLv3, there is no "obligation" to provide you, as the author,
with anything, bug reports or otherwise. Their only obligations are to
ensure that everyone they send binaries to also receives the complete
corresponding source code to those binaries, all unde
both are set up to use the same place for
the users' mail spool.
So I'm curious as to the problems you're running into with dovecot
specifically, and I may be able to help.
(I switched from UW-IMAP to dovecot to facilitate a migration to Maildir)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peac
e're
going to be having this conversation again in the not-so-distant future
once RH finishes switching over to Jira and stops funding our Bugzilla
instance's upkeep..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
upstream, it's no
different than the situation we have with our mailman3 today, where
we're literally years behind the curve.
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (ma
idelines are actually followed and as another check that nothing malicious
> sneaks in), but they are the barrier to entry, not the communication
> platform.
I completely agree, at least on the "packagers" side. I don't know what
barriers non-packaging contributors face, but
e after the
initial configuration)" document is produced, that's probaby sufficient
to overcome most of these objections, because then the setup cost is
one-off, and the ongoing "interact with Fedora-devel" cost won't be any
greater than it already is. (It's
in "developing Fedora" like
they once did to ensure their interests were represented, and instead
get to focus more fully on the stuff they build on top. That's a good
thing, I think, but it also takes away what was probably the primary
participation funnel.
- Solomon
--
So
er volume of meritocrous contributions)
> We think the communication channels change is one of the initiatives which
> helps with that. Mentorship is the other.
Mentorship is necessary (from leaders to the middle, and the middle to
the newbs) but doesn't scale well due to the mutual tim
post
> emails that are easier to read.
Not to mention these problems won't go away just because it's now hosted
on a web page..
- Solomon
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Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet
yield tangible improvements for the _existing_
contributor base. Otherwise you're just going to trade away _current_
contributors for the _possibility_ of attracting new ones.
(In a volunteer context, that is)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org
already mentioned,
I have plenty of other things to do, both in the F/OSS world and in
(gasp) meatspace where I won't have to look at yet another screen.
> > [1] Splitting into the "core" developers (ie those paid/compensated for
> > participa
th anything other than abuse. "Who
cares about distros? I just use Docker containers!"
[1] Splitting into the "core" developers (ie those paid/compensated for
participating) and an endless summer of newbs seeking help/support;
the middle gets completely hollowed out.
-
prised that "Free Software for Everything" Red Hat is
chosing to base something so fundamental to their business on a highly
proprietary tool. I suppose O365 is just a matter of time...)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
327 k
F37 server #1 & #2
Success! (same fwupd downgrade as above)
I have a few other systems but they're buried/offline in preparation for
a home office move. Only one that's remotely unusual is an RPi3.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
meaningful control over how often ABRT is
tripped and needs to send a report to the mothership...)
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Dowling Park, FL
rden, not the act of running the TCK for each
build -- but is the TCK (or upstream JDK) really that _brittle_?
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Spr
ted from
iw, but it's a lot less convenient. (Plus some of us have muscle memory
going back to when iwconfig was the new hotness...)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org
ages like this one, or
> something better. The Java applications ecosystem being packaged on Fedora
> will not be resurrected.
Yep; automate (to compensate for upstream culture) or die.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at
set with the hplip and gutenprint applications too?
https://github.com/OpenPrinting/hplip-printer-app/
https://github.com/OpenPrinting/gutenprint-printer-app/
The latter in particular is of considerable interest to me, and I'd
prefer to not have to deal with the snap ecosystem.
- So
Time to start auditing the php stuff I have deployed everywhere.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL speachy (libra.chat)
sig
.rpm.html
There's been a bugzilla ticket open since June about this:
https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=1971202
I rely on php-imap for authentication purposes on a _lot_ (using php
packages that remain included with Fedora!) so this is actually a major
blocking issue
list. I only mentioned it because starting the list with "problem 2"
may lead to questions about what happened to problem 1.
The other 13 or so problems, however, are purely with fedora-supplied
PHP packages, which is why I _did_ include them in my report of the
upgrade fai
r(pear.horde.org/Horde_Perms) >= 2.0.0, but none of the providers can be
installed
- package php-horde-Horde-OpenXchange-1.0.1-7.fc33.noarch requires
php-pear(pear.horde.org/Horde_Perms) < 3.0.0, but none of the providers can be
installed
- php-pear-Image-Text-0.7.0-12.f
d support for SSE4.1 starting with their Nano
3000 series in 2009.
Anyway. Personally, I only have one Fedora system still in use that
isn't at least x86_64v2 -- a dual-socket pre-Bulldozer Opteron server
that is probably the single most important system I have.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
;
> setup printers @ dhcp/dns explicitly, and avoid autodiscovery 'surprises'
> altogether.
cups-browsed isn't enabled by default, FWIW.
But disabling mDNS altogether might cause undesired regerssions
elsewhere. If all you want to do is prevent CUPS from auto-discovering
ufficient, but
anything _less_ than that is clearly insecure and inherently untrustable.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL spe
so they can capture a document *you* want to print, but if there's that
level of persistant hostile presence on your local network, you're
already completly screwed.
[1] "local" means the local broadcast domain.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
continuing to function until the as-of-yet-theoretical Gutenprint
Printer Application is usable.
[1] I haven't actually _tested_ them this way yet.
[2] two by lprint, one by ipp-usb, and one by ps-printer-app.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
at least as well as it ever
did, heh.
(I've beeen around long enough to remember similar arguments being made
about a new shiny upstart called CUPS over lpr[ng] and printcap. And
look where we are today...)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet do
uires it or the application supplies it.
pdftopdf transforms proved to be a lot more robust than pstops due to
PDF's semantics being far better defined.
(Incidently, Fedora 19 is also when the switch to using mDNS for printer
discovery happened..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
will keel over if you specify attributes in a
different order than the conformance test. We have clients that won't
ever get updated, and printers that won't ever get updated. And through
it all, users that just want to print something, and get quite irate
when it inevitally
edora routinely does this, why should printers be any
different?
Meanwhile. The ultimate goal has not yet been realized, but with each
incremental milestone along the way, it's getting closer. Ironically,
the existing Legacy CUPS + cups-filters + drivers printing flow h
exing printer, a decade-plus-old
Brother HL-5340D. Along with 31 others, though only 26 are plugged in
at the moment. Isn't driver development/regression testing fun?)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
the elder gods.
> Introducing a new API -> implementing new apps for all available printers ->
> deprecating the old API -> removing the old API.
>
> ^ this strategy should be used.
Fortunately, it is!
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaf
On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 12:33:45PM +0200, Vitaly Zaitsev via devel wrote:
> On 24.05.2021 12:30, Solomon Peachy wrote:
> > Not only is it possible, it's been done.
>
> For all existing printers in the world? I don't believe.
For all printers? Of course not. But that
t routinely exceed a decade.
Instead, dyesub makers have opted to sell little appliances to provide
network connectivity, including SMB for "hot folder" support. Of the
devices I'm aware of, all but one is running Linux + CUPS + Gutenprint.
(The exception still running CUPS,
er
> > developers who wants to implement their printer application faster[2][3].
>
> I don't think this is even possible in theory.
Not only is it possible, it's been done.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
er
Two x86_64 F33 servers upgraded fine
One aarch64 (RPi) F33 system upgraded fine
One x86_64 workstation upgraded fine
(I have two more systems I can test with, but they're nearly stock
Fedora Workstation installs, so I don't anticipate any issues)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
te proposed changes, not as they
are currently written, but as they might be written at some unspcecified
later date.
(Which, oddly enough, is the same problem us naysayers have with the
actual change request...)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet
igful testing with my actual desktop
environment and applications.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL
you volunteering to do all of this coding/porting yourself? If not,
why do you seem to believe that developer time is without cost?
I hate to break it to you, but 98% of what is in Fedora is "without
commercial gains" -- and I can promise you that one year is nowhere near
enough ti
Given that Beta Freeze is 2021-03-16, barely over a month is frightfully
little time to adequately test something that has such an impact on the
end-user experience.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
must me maintained nearly indefinitely!
Meanwhile, as another data point, softare that was written using the
sound API included with the first Win32 implementation (ie Windows NT
3.1) will still generate sound with current Windows 10 builds, *27*
years later.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
endpoints connected via GigE.
(I need to see how well it handles smaller transfers, this is where SCP
gets pretty crappy..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
Hig
n arms about Red Hat, especially now that it's wholly
owned by, which is itself another massive data miner?
This seems to be a strange hill to fight over, especially for a
last-ditch fallback that will only get used under an intentional
[mis-]configuration of the network a
g about here)
>
> They are not, and that is why people use Linux.
In other words, this has nothing to do with legal (eg GPDR) compliance.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
Great, more things for the user to click through *every single time*.
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL speachy (freenode
- package perl-libs-4:5.30.3-455.module_f33+10047+8c6c443b.x86_64 is filtered
out by modular filtering
- package perl-libs-4:5.32.0-461.module_f33+9996+d5a76496.x86_64 is filtered
out by modular filtering
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org
DNS lookups, the general default can easily be wrong.
- Solomon
--
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@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL spea
away at any time.
So users needing a non-volatile resolv.conf already have to take extra
steps to achieve that. Under this proposal, different (but simpler!)
steps will be necessary to achieve the same result.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at s
ly not what we want
> people to try using.
Yes and no -- having it available on the fedora installer media is quite
useful, and since that's going to have to support dual BIOS/UEFI
booting, there's not really any downside.
(beyond keeping it building anyway..
tantial
> > profit.
> Really?
Yeah, yeah.. :)
Even if I've lost the ability to do basic math, I think my point is
still valid. If the NRE is less than the marginal BOM cost multiplied
out by the expected production run, it's considered a net win.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
physical button vs pure digital implementation reduces the _support_
costs, so it's better to stick with a button, but if we're being honest
here most of the time post-sales lifecycle implications are rarely given
any consideration at all.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
> things the manufacturer disagreees with.
s/manufacturer/device owner/
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL s
seems to say that if
you're going to ship a 64-bit Windows install it needs to default to,
and be certified with, CSM-less UEFI booting. Secure boot is not a
requirement for servers.
[1]
https://docs.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-hardware/design/compatibility/
think Fedora should only start considering dropping BIOS support
> once the default is UEFI on most virtualization platforms.
FWIW, I completely agree with this.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
etire the older of the two in a few weeks,
replacing it with a machine only half its age.
(There's also a small pile of VMs too, generally used as build hosts or
for QA-type work. Nearly all are considered disposable and can be easily
recreated)
For the record, I think any notion of auto-migrat
ot up.
So using the absense of chromebooks in the numbers I referenced actually
boosts, rather than undermines, my argument. Oh, there were supposedly
17 million chromebooks shipped in 2019, versus 261 million "PCs" and
12-ish million "servers".
...Is this horse su
in 2004, because it used custom
hardware that relied on drivers that didn't run on anything newer. This
same line had a reflow oven powered by a 386 running DOS..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
omeone has numbers that show the actual install base of in-use
BIOS-boot and BIOS-only systems, I'd love to see them. And I'll gladly
donate the contents of my wallet to the EFF if the BIOS numbers are
still growing in absolute terms -- ie new systems being de
IOS-only systems represent a *miniscule* portion of the market
today, and that will only decrease further. Pretending otherwise is
delusional.
I stand by what I've written, and I've backed it up with actual numbers
and only a minor amount of conjecture.
Please, prove me wrong.
- S
etending otherwise is delusional, and delusions are no basis for
technical decisions.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL speachy (f
single-purpose" is suddenly a
bad thing when it's in systemd's favor..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL
ystemd-boot is the lean, tightly-focused do-only-one-thing
tool without any reported CVEs.
(seriously, the most recent systemd tarball is over 2.5MB smaller than
the most recent grub2 tarball)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org
eaking for myseelf, I still have two
running systems that that lack UEFI; both are AMD-platform server
boards, and the newer of the two was first made in 2007 and was EOL'd
in 2011. Plus a small pile of VMs..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
g that aside, for the past several years CSM/BIOS has been
slowly bitrotting due to a lack of real testing, as the last few Windows
releases have mandated use of UEFI for preinstalled systems, plus the
EOLing of Windows 7 and (especially) XP.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachy
s (not on Fedora though, IIUC)
So yes, I think an explicit "let's all test btrfs (as anaconda
configures it) before we make it default" period is warranted.
Perhaps one can argue that Fedora has already been doing that for the
past two years (since 2018-or-later-btrfs is what ev
btrfs systems to
gain confidence that btrfs is indeed ready. (In any case, the
traditional beta period is _way_ too short for something like this!)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet
re, aka the
device manufacturer. For that equipment, btrfs is an implementation
detail, completely hidden from the user.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (m
int of removing support for it? And what has changed since then?
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL speachy (freenode)
On Fri, Jun 26, 2020 at 12:38:40PM -0400, Ben Rosser wrote:
> The -t/--tempfile switch for nano (and pico) does exactly this:
> https://linux.die.net/man/1/nano
Yeah, I've had EDITOR='nano -t -r 72' set in my .profile for as long as
I can remember.
- Solom
n use.
(Plus perhaps the underlying hardware; I suspect the server-class
hardware facebook uses is a grade above the typical desktop..)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (m
complete filesystem loss across clean shutdown/restart cycles. Hardware
is still in use, and other than a failed fan, hasn't so much as
hiccupped since scrapping btrfs)
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
ed at, oh, gedit when
running under X/Wayland could actually be quite useful and consistent
with the experience they're already used to.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot o
commit
things. Because git is just short for github!)
- Solomon [who greatly prefers emacs]
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL sp
y to n00bs it is very much not.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmpp)
@pizza:shaftnet dot org (matrix)
High Springs, FL speachy (freenode)
signature.asc
D
quite useful, far
more so for "developers" than "normal" folks whose command line
interaction is limited to pasting things in from random web pages or
"curl | bash" invocations.
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at shaftnet dot org (email&xmp
s... you'll end
up with this meta-container thing of disparate, optionally-installable
software that's sorta configured to generally work together. I know, we
can call this thing "An Older Fedora Linux Distribution"
- Solomon
--
Solomon Pea
r "kept updated with
security fixes"
And "broken" in this context means nothing more than "failed to
package/build", because "packaged" doesn't mean "it actually
works/runs".
- Solomon
--
Solomon Peachypizza at s
default is, it's going to be wrong when
applied across the board.
(Of the dozen-ish Fedora installs I'm responsible for, exactly one would
be fine with this new policy. Every other one, workstation and server
alike, is a special snowflake. Folks not running sn
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