On 08/01/2016 18:34, Walter Bright wrote:
On 1/7/2016 5:32 AM, Russel Winder via Digitalmars-d wrote:
On Wed, 2016-01-06 at 16:52 +, Joakim via Digitalmars-d wrote:
Sure, COBOL is still around on some mainframe somewhere too, but
almost nobody knows it exists! :D
But those that do get
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 04:24:05 UTC, Joakim wrote:
How is it "political?" My prediction is entirely geared around
hardware and software realities.
No, businesses don't want P2P, client-server is the ultimate
dongle...
_are_ very useful. Having an online map with my GPS location
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 14:01:20 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
Or maybe there would have been a market for commercial
browsers, like Opera.
This timeline is quite telling:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/7/74/Timeline_of_web_browsers.svg
It is rather obvious that the
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 10:13:01 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 04:24:05 UTC, Joakim wrote:
How is it "political?" My prediction is entirely geared
around hardware and software realities.
No, businesses don't want P2P, client-server is the ultimate
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 13:43:09 UTC, Joakim wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 10:13:01 UTC, Ola Fosheim
Grøstad wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 04:24:05 UTC, Joakim wrote:
How is it "political?" My prediction is entirely geared
around hardware and software realities.
No,
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 17:29:34 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 16:58:15 UTC, Joakim wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 14:01:20 UTC, Ola Fosheim
Grøstad wrote:
Copy protection. Anti-piracy measure in hardware.
Heh, the web had none until very
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 14:01:20 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 13:43:09 UTC, Joakim wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 10:13:01 UTC, Ola Fosheim
Grøstad wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 04:24:05 UTC, Joakim wrote:
How is it "political?" My
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 16:58:15 UTC, Joakim wrote:
On Saturday, 9 January 2016 at 14:01:20 UTC, Ola Fosheim
Grøstad wrote:
Copy protection. Anti-piracy measure in hardware.
Heh, the web had none until very recently, and that's something
most businesses don't use.
If you run a
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:31:37 UTC, Joakim wrote:
He has categorically refused to add volatile or VLA...
Because he prefers other solutions for those problems.
But programmers don't. Heap allocation is not a solution to VLA.
VLA provides a bound on execution time, malloc doesn't.
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:01:39 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 04:10:58 UTC, Joakim wrote:
OK, not a full C competitor, but taking some of the
higher-level work. I think D could take all of C's domain,
Walter certainly knows how.
He has categorically
On 1/7/2016 5:32 AM, Russel Winder via Digitalmars-d wrote:
On Wed, 2016-01-06 at 16:52 +, Joakim via Digitalmars-d wrote:
Sure, COBOL is still around on some mainframe somewhere too, but
almost nobody knows it exists! :D
But those that do get £150k+ and almost all are over 60.
I'm a
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:34:54 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
On 1/7/2016 5:32 AM, Russel Winder via Digitalmars-d wrote:
On Wed, 2016-01-06 at 16:52 +, Joakim via Digitalmars-d
wrote:
Sure, COBOL is still around on some mainframe somewhere too,
but
almost nobody knows it exists! :D
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 04:10:58 UTC, Joakim wrote:
OK, not a full C competitor, but taking some of the
higher-level work. I think D could take all of C's domain,
Walter certainly knows how.
He has categorically refused to add volatile or VLA...
Yes, which is why many apps that are
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:34:54 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
On 1/7/2016 5:32 AM, Russel Winder via Digitalmars-d wrote:
On Wed, 2016-01-06 at 16:52 +, Joakim via Digitalmars-d
wrote:
Sure, COBOL is still around on some mainframe somewhere too,
but
almost nobody knows it exists! :D
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:34:54 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
I'm a little surprised that there aren't more young programmers
seeing that money and learning some COBOL. It's not a hard
language.
I've often been tempted but would have to move at least 8 hours
away to find any kind of
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:34:54 UTC, Walter Bright wrote:
I'm a little surprised that there aren't more young programmers
seeing that money and learning some COBOL. It's not a hard
language.
Maybe he is referring to programmers that has intimate knowledge
of the spaghetti-like
On 1/8/16 1:34 PM, Walter Bright wrote:
On 1/7/2016 5:32 AM, Russel Winder via Digitalmars-d wrote:
On Wed, 2016-01-06 at 16:52 +, Joakim via Digitalmars-d wrote:
Sure, COBOL is still around on some mainframe somewhere too, but
almost nobody knows it exists! :D
But those that do get
On Fri, Jan 08, 2016 at 06:33:52PM -0500, Steven Schveighoffer via
Digitalmars-d wrote:
> On 1/8/16 1:34 PM, Walter Bright wrote:
> >On 1/7/2016 5:32 AM, Russel Winder via Digitalmars-d wrote:
> >>On Wed, 2016-01-06 at 16:52 +, Joakim via Digitalmars-d wrote:
> >>>Sure, COBOL is still around
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 19:21:30 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Friday, 8 January 2016 at 18:31:37 UTC, Joakim wrote:
decide that for yourself. In any case, since it's still using
the same client-server approach as the web, I don't think it
matters: that entire approach is doomed.
On Thursday, 7 January 2016 at 04:43:28 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Eh, those removals are all well though-out and sensible, D has
similar opinions. I was impressed that most of the stuff they
say they _won't_ remove is related to C-style syntax:
Well, I am not complaining, but they seem to focus on
On Thursday, 7 January 2016 at 09:12:05 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Thursday, 7 January 2016 at 04:43:28 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Most programmers have a C-style parser wired into their
heads: you cannot replace it.
You get used to a different syntax rather fast if it is
reasonably close
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 16:54:32 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 15:20:53 UTC, Joakim wrote:
D probably should aim for a lower ceiling and keep focus on
"advanced features". Go and Swift will try to stay "dumbed
down", like Java and C# to remain attractive
On Wednesday, 6 January 2016 at 18:52:05 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Wednesday, 6 January 2016 at 16:52:34 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Swift is dumbed down?
Yes, they are streamlining for apps. It is ARC through and
through. They are removing things like "++", currying and
C-style for-loops;
On Wednesday, 6 January 2016 at 16:52:34 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Swift is dumbed down?
Yes, they are streamlining for apps. It is ARC through and
through. They are removing things like "++", currying and C-style
for-loops; in order to make the language simpler for programmers.
Cutting
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 15:20:53 UTC, Joakim wrote:
I think Go's hitting its ceiling now. It will be interesting
to see what Swift's ceiling is: we'll find out if and when they
ever get it on Android.
The graphs for Go does not show a ceiling yet, but the
"theoretical" ceiling for Go
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 15:20:53 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Walter seems against ARC anyway.
Andrei does not seem to be, however.
D's GC is a failure, the amount of effort needed/given to work
around it should be proof enough of this.
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 17:10:51 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
D's GC is a failure, the amount of effort needed/given to work
around it should be proof enough of this.
Coming from a Java background and being an application rather
then systems developer one thing that attracted me to D was the
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 17:10:51 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 15:20:53 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Walter seems against ARC anyway.
Andrei does not seem to be, however.
D's GC is a failure, the amount of effort needed/given to work
around it should be proof enough of this.
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 17:42:15 UTC, Gerald wrote:
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 17:10:51 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
D's GC is a failure, the amount of effort needed/given to work
around it should be proof enough of this.
Coming from a Java background and being an application rather
then
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 18:02:39 UTC, Suliman wrote:
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 17:10:51 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 15:20:53 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Walter seems against ARC anyway.
Andrei does not seem to be, however.
D's GC is a failure, the amount of effort
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 10:49:06 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 04:19:33 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Because they're much higher up.
Yes, but the languages that are on the rise are cutting into
the existing languages. It is difficult to predict when they
hit a
Here is an overview of ES6, ES7:
http://kangax.github.io/compat-table/es6/
http://kangax.github.io/compat-table/es7/
As you can see, even ES6 has features that D lacks, like
destructuring, and it brings ES close to existing scripting
languages.
With ES7 you also get SIMD and language level
On Tuesday, 5 January 2016 at 04:19:33 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Because they're much higher up.
Yes, but the languages that are on the rise are cutting into the
existing languages. It is difficult to predict when they hit a
ceiling though.
That's D's corner of the market, it was there long
On Monday, 4 January 2016 at 11:12:49 UTC, Joakim wrote:
I don't think Go's even hit the second tier yet, ie python and
ruby, certainly not in the first tier with Java and C, though
tough for such a young language to get up there.
Well, Go and Swift are the two languages that are having a
On Monday, 4 January 2016 at 08:34:06 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Monday, 4 January 2016 at 05:47:40 UTC, Joakim wrote:
according to github, which has nothing to do with D (there are
several more miscategorized like that, look at #22 in the
above list).
Yes, DTrace files also end with
On Monday, 4 January 2016 at 05:47:40 UTC, Joakim wrote:
according to github, which has nothing to do with D (there are
several more miscategorized like that, look at #22 in the above
list).
Yes, DTrace files also end with ".d"...
Those are good hypotheses, not sure you can say OSS usage is
On Monday, 4 January 2016 at 20:25:09 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Monday, 4 January 2016 at 11:12:49 UTC, Joakim wrote:
I don't think Go's even hit the second tier yet, ie python and
ruby, certainly not in the first tier with Java and C, though
tough for such a young language to get up
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 17:25:13 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 16:56:46 UTC, Joakim wrote:
It's more than not being neutral: I pointed out that github
suffers from similar categorization errors to the ones you
list below. But yes, github stats are really
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:17:46 UTC, Joakim wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:22:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:15:46 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
[...]
because it's not in any way accurate
e.g,
https://github.com/golang/go/wiki/GoUsers
vs
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:43:00 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
1 Java21.465% +5.94%
2 C 16.036% -0.67%
3 C++ 6.914% +0.21%
4 C# 4.707% -0.34%
5 Python 3.854% +1.24%
6 PHP 2.706% -1.08%
7 Visual Basic .NET 2.582% +1.51%
8
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:13:01 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 20:38:31 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
Good news...
Well I'll stop this discussing about this list. I just posted
this because I thought It would be good for the users.
By the way, the Jan 2016 list is out and
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:34:13 UTC, Basile B. wrote:
and that's there is never great wins or major decays. Their
ranking is only meaningful on a long scale...
It is only meaningful for tiobe.com's SEO ranking. Any other use
is completely and utterly _delusional_.
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:17:46 UTC, Joakim wrote:
As Bubba says, in what way is it not accurate? You list
corporate usage of Go and D, but his comment wasn't about that.
In every way!!! Tiobe is a cultural viral marketing phenomenon,
but a statistical and scientific disaster.
Go may
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 12:43:13 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 23:12:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
doesn't seem very reliable
TIOBE is completely unreliable. It's basically a hoax, IMO. I
guess the company only keeps it alive as a means of marketing
for their
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:54:53 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:17:46 UTC, Joakim wrote:
As Bubba says, in what way is it not accurate? You list
corporate usage of Go and D, but his comment wasn't about that.
In every way!!! Tiobe is a cultural viral
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 16:10:49 UTC, Joakim wrote:
I have no real opinion on the validity of TIOBE
That's sad!!!
but I think you overrate the importance of github and
overestimate use of javascript. Of course, there's no good way
to settle that question.
Actually there is. If you
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:43:00 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
9 Assembly language 2.095% +0.92%
10 Ruby2.047% +0.92%
This... haha... Do you really think people spend more time
writing assembly code in 2015 than Ruby?
2% assembly? That's highly unlikely.
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:50:48 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:43:00 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
9 Assembly language 2.095% +0.92%
10 Ruby2.047% +0.92%
This... haha... Do you really think people spend more time
writing assembly code in
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:50:48 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:43:00 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
9 Assembly language 2.095% +0.92%
10 Ruby2.047% +0.92%
This... haha... Do you really think people spend more time
writing assembly code in
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 20:38:31 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
Good news...
Well I'll stop this discussing about this list. I just posted
this because I thought It would be good for the users.
By the way, the Jan 2016 list is out and D rose 2 positions, now
is 21th.
Bubba.
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:22:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:15:46 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 12:43:13 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
Github gives a better perspective on actual engagement
outside the close source commercial sector.
Well if
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:13:01 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 20:38:31 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
Good news...
Well I'll stop this discussing about this list. I just posted
this because I thought It would be good for the users.
By the way, the Jan 2016 list is out and
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:58:21 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Github has the same problem, btw. I recently spent some time
going through the top repositories in this list, and it's
surprising how many are miscategorized as D, despite having the
source:
Yep, Github isn't neutral, but it is the
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 12:43:13 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
Github gives a better perspective on actual engagement outside
the close source commercial sector.
Well if you take for example Linux, which is one of big open
source project out there and I use it, but if you compare
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 23:12:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
doesn't seem very reliable
TIOBE is completely unreliable. It's basically a hoax, IMO. I
guess the company only keeps it alive as a means of marketing for
their services.
Languages like "D" and "rust" will have so many false
On Saturday, 2 January 2016 at 05:19:49 UTC, Joakim wrote:
As for D, with more talks on youtube and certainly many more
books coming out this year, it likely trended up on the youtube
and amazon search components.
If we look at the search trend for "D tutorial" and "D compiler",
the interest
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:15:46 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 12:43:13 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
Github gives a better perspective on actual engagement outside
the close source commercial sector.
Well if you take for example Linux, which is one of big open
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:15:46 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
Some are shocked because Go language, but most of the time that
I see an article about Go on Hackernews or Reddit for example,
I see a lot of bad commentaries against it. IE: Generics.
Yes, Go is more of a business language than a
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 14:22:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
because it's not in any way accurate
I can't tell with that list is 100% accurate or not, but wouldn't
agree that Java as first place? Even with all mobile trend and so
on? Or C in second, Swift ahead of Object-C?
You showed a link
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:38:11 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:34:13 UTC, Basile B. wrote:
and that's there is never great wins or major decays. Their
ranking is only meaningful on a long scale...
It is only meaningful for tiobe.com's SEO ranking. Any
I just discovered another interesting trending list on Github,
trending developers. Let's see why they are popular.
1. FreeCodeCamp: JavaScript
2. Google: JavaScript (traceur), Go, C++...
3. Facebook: JavaScript (react)
4. hacksalot: JavaScript
5. oneuijs: JavaScript
6. sindresorhus: n/a
7.
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 18:19:27 UTC, Basile B. wrote:
I just meant that nobody will ever be able to see a new
industry standard raising from a month to another but rather on
60 monthes...Even if artifact existed, like Go, which's been
already mentioned.
Yep, sure. Traditionally it has
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 16:19:49 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 15:58:21 UTC, Joakim wrote:
Github has the same problem, btw. I recently spent some time
going through the top repositories in this list, and it's
surprising how many are miscategorized as D,
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 16:56:46 UTC, Joakim wrote:
It's more than not being neutral: I pointed out that github
suffers from similar categorization errors to the ones you list
below. But yes, github stats are really only good for
languages used in open source, and OSS is still a small
Ok, my last dump of statistics:
This one clearly shows that people are learning Go (covers
searches for "golang array" etc), while the interest in Java
tutorials is falling:
https://www.google.com/trends/explore#q=golang%2C%20%22java%20tutorial%22=1%2F2011%2061m=q=Etc%2FGMT-1
This one
On Sunday, 3 January 2016 at 19:35:28 UTC, Ola Fosheim Grøstad
wrote:
This one clearly shows a noticable drop for "c++", with peaks
at march and october, probably because of higher education
student projects or something similar. But the oscillation
Or is it conferences?
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 20:38:31 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
Good news!
D rose from 28th to 23th!
2015 -
http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
2014 -
http://web.archive.org/web/20141230025738/http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
Good news!
D rose from 28th to 23th!
2015 -
http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
2014 -
http://web.archive.org/web/20141230025738/http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
Bubba.
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 23:12:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
doesn't seem very reliable
haskell at 39? go at 50?
doesn't even seem remotely close to Google Trend's data for
programming languages, for example
https://www.google.com/trends/explore#cmpt=q=/m/01kbt7,+/m/03j_q,+/m/09gbxjr=0-5-31
I see
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 23:12:39 UTC, rsw0x wrote:
On Friday, 1 January 2016 at 20:38:31 UTC, Bubbasaur wrote:
Good news!
D rose from 28th to 23th!
2015 -
http://www.tiobe.com/index.php/content/paperinfo/tpci/index.html
2014 -
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