Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread John Woodgate
In message 007101cd7f30$6f3eb230$4dbc1690$@cox.net, dated Mon, 20 Aug 2012, Ed Price edpr...@cox.net writes: All this discussion would be moot if we had true peak reading broadband field strength sensors, and if the immunity standards were all referenced in terms of peak applied field

Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread John Woodgate
In message 00ba01cd7f49$5053c5e0$f0fb51a0$@cox.net, dated Mon, 20 Aug 2012, Ed Price edpr...@cox.net writes: Thus, I often used modulations beyond the popular 1 kHz, 100 Hz, 1 Hz, 1 uS, 50% pulses  and AM stuff. (Which is all probably pretty boring to the commercial and EN guys on this list,

Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread Pawson, James
Hi and thanks for all the insightful emails. The way we perform the test in-house is... unmodulated frequency set level set from cal (instant application, no ramp) apply modulation dwell time unmodulated next freq I think we are all agreed that different test methods can result in

Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread Cortland Richmond
Hi, Brent, From the work I did in the NW I'd say they need to add 16 2/3 Hz to it; the papers on AED susceptibility to railway power fields were a little scary -- for folks in train stations, anyway. Cheers, Cortland Richmond On 8/21/2012 0003, Brent G DeWitt wrote: Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3:

[PSES] Commercial Safety Requirments

2012-08-21 Thread Rick Busche
I am looking for suggestions for commercial (UL, CSA, etc) standards that might apply to ITE RF rack mounted equipment, antennas, all mounted on a flatbed trailer. As mentioned most of the hardware is ITE with the more typical safety standards applied. Once those products get hard mounted to a

Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread Kunde, Brian
James, We run primarily two different types of Radiated Immunity scans depending on the desires of our customer. 1.Unmodulated frequency set level from forward power apply modulation dwell time unmodulate next freq. 2.Setup Sig Gen with Modulation Turned On Always Set

Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread Don_Borowski
Ed- I have seen stuff like this. My company makes protective relays that control the power system. That means that these relays work with signals at 60 Hz (or 50 Hz for many parts of the world outside of North America). The test standards call for the use of 1 kHz amplitude modulation. The

Re: [PSES] 61000-4-3: Rate of application of field

2012-08-21 Thread Kunde, Brian
Ed, You have a good handle on this topic and have pointed out several of the assumptions that are required to be made in this type of testing to make it reasonable to be performed with reasonable equipment by reasonable people. Non-linearity and not knowing exactly what your equipment is doing

Re: [PSES] Commercial Safety Requirments

2012-08-21 Thread Brian Oconnell
I have not do not have experience with rolling-stock ITE. But have done power converters for trailer-mounted ITE systems for semi-permanent static installs. NEC would apply if the intended end-use is a static install at fixed site. NFPA, so far, has only published stuff for EVs and HEVs. In

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Knudsen, Patricia
Could a self-declaration 'system' function well in North America without public safety reduction? For just discrete, narrow classes of goods? You would probably see an initial increase in non-compliant products. However, this being the U.S., that would correspond to an increase in lawsuits

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Brian Ceresney
To add to the discussion, I believe that in 2009, the Province of Ontario, Canada intended to initiate a program forcing manufacturing electrical products to register with the Province, for a yearly fee. This was in addition to the third-party approvals held by most products. The program seemed

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Peter Tarver
Brian – When ice storms took out the power lines in the Montreal metro area, a number of US generator manufacturers donated use of truck scale generators to get locals up on at least a subsistence level of power. These trucks were denied entry into Canada because they didn't bear CSA marks,

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Kaz Gawrzyjal
The working documents providing background info on the registration scheme that were posted on the Ontario website, touched on the plan and it's relation as a source of revenue to fund the activities if I recall correctly. There has been activity at the federal level to address consumer

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread John Woodgate
In message 4532b7d6b39370164f98f16a9a6a3...@mail.gmail.com, dated Tue, 21 Aug 2012, Peter Tarver ptar...@enphaseenergy.com writes: When ice storms took out the power lines in the Montreal metro area, a number of US generator manufacturers donated use of truck scale generators to get locals up

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Doug Nix
All, This is pretty interesting, since CBSA (Canadian Border Services Agency, formerly Customs), does not have the authority to inspect for regulatory compliance. If this is true, the CBSA Agents were acting well outside their authority. Only the AHJ, in this case Hydro Québec, has the

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Ted Eckert
Canada excels at domestic ice and snow production and doesn't need to import them. Domestic prices are already so low that Canada doesn't have to impose excessive tariffs or regulations on imported ice and snow. Ted Eckert Compliance Engineer Microsoft Corporation ted.eck...@microsoft.com The

Re: [PSES] CE Marking Provoqium

2012-08-21 Thread Ed Price
I heard that Canada sneaks excess ice into the USA by floating it across the Great Lakes. And as for their snow, well, the border is completely unprotected. Ed Price El Cajon, CA USA   The opinions expressed are my own and do not necessarily reflect those of the other voices in my head.

[PSES] CE Marking of Power Cables

2012-08-21 Thread Monrad Monsen
Must power cables imported and sold in Europe have a CE mark and manufacturer's name address starting 3 January 2013 in accordance with the recast RoHS Directive 2011/65/EU? Similarly, must the power cable have its own declaration of conformity (DOC)? It appears that AC power cables shipped

Re: [PSES] CE Marking of Power Cables

2012-08-21 Thread IBM Ken
Would this be for molded power cords only, or does it include assembled power cords, for Pluggable type B equipment, for example, made up of discrete connectors typically attached to cord via screw terminals and strain relief glands? -Ken On Tue, Aug 21, 2012 at 7:50 PM, Monrad Monsen

Re: [PSES] Commercial Safety Requirments

2012-08-21 Thread Pete Perkins
Rick PSNet, This has been a topic of discussion in the US/TAG TC108 sessions recently. In addition to the usual ITE requirements, there are many Code issues that apply to such a trailer load of equipment which will be directly powered. Perhaps one of the members who

Re: [PSES] CE Marking of Power Cables

2012-08-21 Thread Mathan Raj A
Is it only for AC power cable? Thanks and Regards Mathan From: IBM Ken [mailto:ibm...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 22, 2012 9:04 AM To: EMC-PSTC@LISTSERV.IEEE.ORG Subject: Re: [PSES] CE Marking of Power Cables Would this be for molded power cords only, or does it include assembled power