Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Från: EV för Hoegberg via EV Skickat: den 5 december 2017 06:23 Till: Electric Vehicle Discussion List Kopia: Hoegberg Ämne: Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

I really dont get this , but many many people now talk about this instead of ev:s: Toyota here(Sweden) tries hard to push the Mirai as the "future" of cars, (yes it seems to be a nice hybrd EV, but the battery is ultra small!!) , So, Mirai..a car that might be using something like 4 times(?)

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Right, those are all comments related to EVs. For an alternative to pump storage, batteries, and other means to store non-peak-use-time renewables production, and at a scale that eliminates ALL non renewable generation continentally or globally), hydrogen becomes much more attractive even given

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

There is an interesting point of overlap between hydrogen energy storage and battery energy storage. The nickel-hydrogen battery has been used for decades. They are capable of very long life, and high energy density, and can work in extreme environments. The International Space Station uses

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Hey Mark, I’m not arguing with you! I was trying to relate what I heard Elon say. I could be wrong but he seemed to be talking in general not just focused on EVs. We used Hydrogen in the Space Shuttle and they even had a Hydrogen fuel cell on board but it you notice Space X used RP1. Sent

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Hydrogen might be useful for grid storage. Looking at roughly 50% efficiency is a big hit but if you have surplus energy and no other practical way to store it, H2 is an alternative. Pumped storage, on the other hand, is estimated to be 70-80% efficient. A better alternative if you can create

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

On 31 October 2017 at 06:37, Mark Abramowitz via EV wrote: > Inefficient energy storage device? How so? In the way that efficiency is defined; Energy out of the system, divided by energy into the system, multiplied by 100. > Compared to batteries, they can store energy much

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Inefficient energy storage device? How so? Compared to batteries, they can store energy much longer. Batteries are in their sweet spot for energy storage for a number of hours, hydrogen for longer periods. Batteries are for small scale storage, hydrogen can be used up to grid level storage.

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

Actually, Elon said that hydrogen was an inefficient energy storage device. In addition, it has many technical drawbacks. I just think that they're extremely sillyit's just very difficult to make hydrogen and store it and use it in a car," Musk said. "If you say took a solar panel and use

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

I certainly concur with your analysis: fuel cells are not a good option for cars, but large scale energy storage is a much more likely possibility On Sun, Oct 29, 2017 at 9:37 AM, Michael Ross via EV wrote: > I believe Musk has only slammed H2 in the context of EVs. There

Re: [EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

I believe Musk has only slammed H2 in the context of EVs. There certainly is a great public misunderstanding that H2 can be a source of energy which it absolutely is not, rather than its true role as a storage and transport medium. I suspect this misunderstanding gave momentum to Toyota's

[EVDL] OT Toyota admits 'Elon Musk is right'> that fcvs are incredibly dumb

https://electrek.co/2017/10/26/toyota-elon-musk-fuel-cell-hydrogen/ Toyota admits ‘Elon Musk is right’ about fuel cell, but moves forward with hydrogen anyway Oct. 26th 2017 Fred Lambert [image