Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
John Lussmyer via EV wrote: My problem is finding a LRR tire that fits a Ford F-250 truck... Interestingly enough, I've read that they *do* make low rolling resistance tires for heavy trucks. Fuel economy matters a lot to long-haul truckers! Now, how low their LRR tires are, I don't know. Normal car tires range from 0.006 to 0.015 rolling resistance. That's the ratio of the force needed to roll it divided by the load on the tire. I.e. a tire with a 0.01 RR means it takes 1 lb force to push for every 100 pounds of vehicle weight. -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
[EVDL] EVLN: ZOE EV is ideal for the semi-regular long-distance driver
% Type3/Level3 quick charging EVSE changes everything %
http://evfleetworld.co.uk/news/2014/Nov/Long-Termers-Renault-ZOE-Dynamique-Zen/0438017022
Long Termers: Renault ZOE Dynamique Zen
by Alex Grant 04 Nov 2014
[image
http://evfleetworld.co.uk/news/2014/Nov/images/0438017022-3693-ZOE_LTT_Oct14_jpg-640.jpg
Renault ZOE Dynamique Zen
]
Three years ago, I spent a week trying to cover my old 68-mile commute on
electricity. It was possible, but it was hard work.
A month using the ZOE for my 157-mile drive to the Fleet World Office in St
Albans from my house in Cardiff has shown just how much this has changed in
a relatively short timeframe.
Some of that comes down to range. Motorways offer few opportunities for
regenerative braking, and it’s the least efficient way to use an EV. Even
so, the ZOE easily covers 75-80 miles at 70mph, and it’s possible to run
ancillaries like the infotainment system, lights and ventilation without
denting that significantly.
But range anxiety is a bit of a red herring, because it’s charging
infrastructure which makes the real difference. The M4 is part of
Ecotricity’s Electric Highway and the ZOE can rapid charge, for free, at
most service stations, at around 12 times the speed of my home wallbox.
That’s around 1% of capacity per 20 seconds until it reaches 80%, after
which it halves to a speed that’s still three times faster than most public
units, and many other EVs, can manage.
These are so quick that it’s actually easier for me to factor in two stops
of less than 25 minutes, each time
leaving with 85%, than it would be to stretch the range and stop once at
Membury for a full charge. Significantly so – two stops saves about 20
minutes, and makes the journey more relaxing too.
Stopping to charge every 60 miles or so doesn’t make the ZOE an ideal
motorway workhorse, but it’s another reason why semi-regular long distance
drivers no longer need to dismiss an electric vehicle as a suitable method
of transport. They’d be surprised how quickly that range anxiety disappears.
[© evfleetworld.co.uk]
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http://www.mlive.com/auto/index.ssf/2014/10/see_which_states_allow_direct.html
See which states allow direct sales of Tesla cars
...
http://wallstcheatsheet.com/automobiles/free-market-10-republican-states-that-ban-tesla-sales.html/?a=viewall
Politicians decide where automakers can sell their vehicles
http://www.worldcarfans.com/114103083548/all-electric-range-rover-considered-to-rival-tesla-model
All-electric Range Rover considered to rival Tesla Model X
...
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/electric-range-rover-in-the-pipeline-88338.html
Blasphemy? Selling out? Leaving its muddy roots behind ...
http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/blog/atlantech/2014/10/georgia-power-to-invest-12m-in-driving-electric.html
Georgia Power investing $12M public EVSE purchase incentives
+
EVLN: Selling Leaf EVs by giving away free-petrol? (video)
{brucedp.150m.com}
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[EVDL] EVLN: Selling Leaf EVs by giving away free-petrol? (video)
http://ecomento.com/2014/11/04/nissan-gives-away-gasoline-but-only-to-sell-leafs/
Nissan gives away gasoline (but only to sell LEAFs)
November 4, 2014 – Richard Lane
[video
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hmCOAHJdOCw
Nissan LEAF Kick Gas Nov 3, 2014
Watch as Nissan gives drivers of gas-powered cars a taste of what it feels
like to go 100% electric. Then find out how much you could save when you
kick gas by using the Nissan LEAF savings calculator at
http://www.nissanusa.com/leaf-calculator
]
Nissan’s latest 30-second spot for the electric LEAF has dropped any
references to the car’s ecological credentials and focuses on something
everybody can relate to: money.
Offering drivers free gasoline to tempt them into going electric seems a
strange tactic, but the prospect of $3,800 savings annually seems to hit the
spot. Electricity isn’t free, of course, but it’s far cheaper per mile than
fossil fuels and rates are often fixed.
Based on 646,844,585 miles driven by US LEAF owners, Nissan estimates that
more than $94 million has been saved at the pumps. Impressive.
From Nissan
Watch as Nissan gives drivers of gas-powered cars a taste of what it
feels like to go 100% electric. Then find out how much you could save when
you kick gas by using the Nissan LEAF savings calculator at
http://www.nissanusa.com/leaf-calculator.
[© ecomento.com]
For EVLN posts use:
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http://www.mlive.com/auto/index.ssf/2014/10/see_which_states_allow_direct.html
See which states allow direct sales of Tesla cars
...
http://wallstcheatsheet.com/automobiles/free-market-10-republican-states-that-ban-tesla-sales.html/?a=viewall
Politicians decide where automakers can sell their vehicles
http://www.worldcarfans.com/114103083548/all-electric-range-rover-considered-to-rival-tesla-model
All-electric Range Rover considered to rival Tesla Model X
...
http://www.autoevolution.com/news/electric-range-rover-in-the-pipeline-88338.html
Blasphemy? Selling out? Leaving its muddy roots behind ...
http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/blog/atlantech/2014/10/georgia-power-to-invest-12m-in-driving-electric.html
Georgia Power investing $12M public EVSE purchase incentives
+
EVLN: ZOE EV is ideal for the semi-regular long-distance driver
{brucedp.150m.com}
--
View this message in context:
http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/EVLN-Selling-Leaf-EVs-by-giving-away-free-petrol-video-tp4672518.html
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[EVDL] fastned.nl L3 Quick : ... charging in The Netherlands
[ref http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Fast-charging-in-The-Netherlands-tp4672396.html Fast charging in The Netherlands From:Cor van de Water via EV Date:Thu, 6 Nov 2014 I received a link to a new company website who claim to bring fast charging throughout the country of The Netherlands: http://www.fastned.nl/en ] Being a charging nut, I am interested in new EVSE. Looking at the URL Cor provided (above) ... [corrections or comments are welcome] A BMW i3 EV is shown plugged in and charging on their main page. I am going to assume they only offer SAE-combo/ccs L3 quick EVSE (want CHAdeMO or Mennekes? go elsewhere) http://www.fastned.nl/en/170733/Rates.html EUR.69pkWh or EUR100/mo EUR.69= US$.85 BMW i3 has a 22kWh pack L3 charging scenario: charge to 80%SOC, disconnect and go 80% of 22kWh from empty requires ~17.6kWh Cost: 17.6kWh * $0.85= ~US$15 Cost comparison @ U.S. Combo L3 EVSE rates (using plugshare): http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/38369 Reyes Station, CA, 94956 L3 is $0.89/kWh and uses Greenlots/Sunspeed ... $16.67 per session http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/51792 Nob Hill Foods Mountain View CA 94040 eVgo SAE Combo DCFC http://www.nrgevgo.com/san-francisco-bay-area/ Flex ($.20/min) 17.6kWh/50kWh-L3-EVSE * 60min, ~21min * US$.2 = $4.25 a session http://api.plugshare.com/view/location/20501 Woodbury Town Center Irvine, CA 92620 EVpump Quick Charge $5/session via credit card [*Note complaints found on plugshare about the eVgo SAE coupler: clip breaks off unusable, coupler not seating not-charging 'Stephen 5 days ago Someone broke the sae coupler clip again ... The charger will not work without the clip.' 'Rocco 6 days ago It gave me an error saying it could not lock the connector and I tries reconnecting three times with no luck. I tried two more times with the combo SAE and it finally worked.' ] Below are some newswires I found mentioning the company, the first is in English, the others are not but take a look at the images I linked. The curved look EVSE station reminds me of the whooshy futuristic U.S. gas-stations of the past: [images http://www.steelmasterusa.com/assets/uploads/heb-steel-gas-station-roof.JPG http://www.oddee.com/_media/imgs/articles2/a97037_64.jpg http://img.gawkerassets.com/img/17m8pzo7mlngrjpg/original.jpg http://media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/b1/8f/2d/b18f2def1a4754fc186394e8d845889f.jpg http://www.cityofart.net/Googie%20Gas%20Station,%20Beverly%20Hills.JPG https://c1.staticflickr.com/7/6030/5972437273_752002c543_z.jpg https://www.laconservancy.org/sites/default/files/styles/hero_partial/public/images/heroes/Union76Gas_MichaelLocke.JPG http://img.weburbanist.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/04/alum-rock-gas-station.jpg http://pleasurephoto.files.wordpress.com/2012/03/enco-gas-station-palm-springs-california-by-albert-frey-1965.jpg ] http://www.nltimes.nl/2014/10/07/amsterdam-firm-bets-big-electric-car-fast-charging-stations/ AMSTERDAM FIRM BETS BIG ON ELECTRIC CAR FAST-CHARGING STATIONS Oct 7, 2014 [image http://www.nltimes.nl/wp-content/uploads/2014/10/BzCalnkIQAAyKg8.jpg Picture: Twitter/@advandermeer ] The Dutch company FastNed is trying to make it possible for electric cars to charge along the highway within half an hour with so called fast-charging stations. After a hesitant start, everything is now moving quickly for FastNed. Every week the construction of a new station starts. And their pace is so high that every week a station is completed. This week the 13th station is ready – Knorrestein, along the A12 near Zoetermeer. The stations are very recognizable with yellow arches and a battery of solar panels that serve as a roof. FastNed promises that by the end of this year nationwide coverage will be in sight. FastNed was founded by Michiel Lagezaal and Bart Lubbers a few years ago. It is a small company with the feel of a start-up. They have eighteen people working at their headquarters in Amsterdam. Lubbers, the son of the former prime minister, compares the breakthrough of the electric car with the advent of digital cameras. “No one has photographic film anymore. So it will go with cars too. In time almost everyone will by driving electric and we are responding to that. We will become the new Shell.” FastNed still has a lack of money. “Roughly one third of the 400 thousand shares were sold to believers. These are people who believe in our company and our plans. Now it’s up to us to [convince] investors and find investors. We are working hard on it. We need 40 million euro.” [© nltimes.n] ... https://www.google.com/search?q=Fastnedtbm=ischsource=lnmssa=Xei=GPtbVP-RJ5P9yQT2k4GoCgved=0CAgQ_AUoAzgK images ... [in Norwegian] http://www.noordhollandsdagblad.nl/stadstreek/enkhuizen-westfriesland/article27198245.ece/Snellaadstation-bij-de-A7_ Snellaadstation bij de A7 Door Coen van der Luytgaarden - 10-10-2014 [image
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
Nothing voodoo about it. Minimizing energy use and maximizing percent energy regained with regen are two different things. I said you get more energy back into the pack stopping faster with regen. Of course net energy use increases with more stops/starts, but percentage energy regained with regen increases. Similarly, higher constant speed between start/stops also increases net energy use but it also increases energy regained with regen. So, if you are looking for where you would get the greatest difference in energy used with regen versus without, it would be a driving pattern that has many start/stops with higher speeds in between. The calculations describe my car's performance quite well. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Range-vs-Speed-tp4672366p4672520.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
LRR is code for labeled for high pressure. No 35 psi tire is LRR. Load range E truck tires (80 psi) in a highway tread are almost all rated as LRR. So I am confused when you say you can't find a LRR tire for your truck? And yes, I have personally run 44 psi car tires at 75 psi for their entire life with no problems even on rocky Montana back roads. That was the only way to get over 30 mpg with awd 96 Subaru. As for my truck and trailer I keep them right at 80 psi though I am confident they can safely handle much more. On my 36 International hot rod I will likely be testing big truck tires on 17.5 rims. These are real truck tires and come in load range G at 120 psi! There is a weight penalty for stop and start, but just cruising I predict better efficiency than car tires. On Nov 10, 2014 8:02 AM, tomw via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Nothing voodoo about it. Minimizing energy use and maximizing percent energy regained with regen are two different things. I said you get more energy back into the pack stopping faster with regen. Of course net energy use increases with more stops/starts, but percentage energy regained with regen increases. Similarly, higher constant speed between start/stops also increases net energy use but it also increases energy regained with regen. So, if you are looking for where you would get the greatest difference in energy used with regen versus without, it would be a driving pattern that has many start/stops with higher speeds in between. The calculations describe my car's performance quite well. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Range-vs-Speed-tp4672366p4672520.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20141110/5a9ba8a6/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
As for losing 10 mpg by switching to different LRR tires, I bet $50 they had the pressure at 32psi front, 28 psi back. That is only way to lose 10 mpg. Two different LRR tires might be 1-3 mpg different, not 10 mpg! On Nov 10, 2014 8:27 AM, Marcus Reddish marcus.redd...@gmail.com wrote: LRR is code for labeled for high pressure. No 35 psi tire is LRR. Load range E truck tires (80 psi) in a highway tread are almost all rated as LRR. So I am confused when you say you can't find a LRR tire for your truck? And yes, I have personally run 44 psi car tires at 75 psi for their entire life with no problems even on rocky Montana back roads. That was the only way to get over 30 mpg with awd 96 Subaru. As for my truck and trailer I keep them right at 80 psi though I am confident they can safely handle much more. On my 36 International hot rod I will likely be testing big truck tires on 17.5 rims. These are real truck tires and come in load range G at 120 psi! There is a weight penalty for stop and start, but just cruising I predict better efficiency than car tires. On Nov 10, 2014 8:02 AM, tomw via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Nothing voodoo about it. Minimizing energy use and maximizing percent energy regained with regen are two different things. I said you get more energy back into the pack stopping faster with regen. Of course net energy use increases with more stops/starts, but percentage energy regained with regen increases. Similarly, higher constant speed between start/stops also increases net energy use but it also increases energy regained with regen. So, if you are looking for where you would get the greatest difference in energy used with regen versus without, it would be a driving pattern that has many start/stops with higher speeds in between. The calculations describe my car's performance quite well. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Range-vs-Speed-tp4672366p4672520.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20141110/92a66e75/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
You lose.. it looks like you owe me $50... you can paypal me at e...@tucson.com This has been substantiated by many Insight owners on the Insightcentral.net list. None of the other LRR tires work as well as the Potenza RE 92's on the Insight. Rush www.TucsonEV.com -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Marcus Reddish via EV Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 8:51 AM To: tomw; Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed As for losing 10 mpg by switching to different LRR tires, I bet $50 they had the pressure at 32psi front, 28 psi back. That is only way to lose 10 mpg. Two different LRR tires might be 1-3 mpg different, not 10 mpg! On Nov 10, 2014 8:27 AM, Marcus Reddish marcus.redd...@gmail.com wrote: LRR is code for labeled for high pressure. No 35 psi tire is LRR. Load range E truck tires (80 psi) in a highway tread are almost all rated as LRR. So I am confused when you say you can't find a LRR tire for your truck? And yes, I have personally run 44 psi car tires at 75 psi for their entire life with no problems even on rocky Montana back roads. That was the only way to get over 30 mpg with awd 96 Subaru. As for my truck and trailer I keep them right at 80 psi though I am confident they can safely handle much more. On my 36 International hot rod I will likely be testing big truck tires on 17.5 rims. These are real truck tires and come in load range G at 120 psi! There is a weight penalty for stop and start, but just cruising I predict better efficiency than car tires. On Nov 10, 2014 8:02 AM, tomw via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: Nothing voodoo about it. Minimizing energy use and maximizing percent energy regained with regen are two different things. I said you get more energy back into the pack stopping faster with regen. Of course net energy use increases with more stops/starts, but percentage energy regained with regen increases. Similarly, higher constant speed between start/stops also increases net energy use but it also increases energy regained with regen. So, if you are looking for where you would get the greatest difference in energy used with regen versus without, it would be a driving pattern that has many start/stops with higher speeds in between. The calculations describe my car's performance quite well. -- View this message in context: http://electric-vehicle-discussion-list.413529.n4.nabble.com/Range-vs -Speed-tp4672366p4672520.html Sent from the Electric Vehicle Discussion List mailing list archive at Nabble.com. ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ( http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev- evdl.org/attachments/20141110/92a66e75/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
Marcus Reddish via EV wrote: As for losing 10 mpg by switching to different LRR tires, I bet $50 they had the pressure at 32psi front, 28 psi back. That is only way to lose 10 mpg. Two different LRR tires might be 1-3 mpg different, not 10 mpg! Part of the problem is that LRR is too often just marketing doubletalk -- it doesn't mean anything. Tire companies know what the rolling resistance is; but they certainly don't want consumers to get their hands on the data. They might base their purchases on (gasp! choke!) objective facts rather than advertising, appearance, and price! :-O The automakers really *do* care about LRR, because it helps them meet government mandated fuel economy standards and sell cars. They test tires themselves, and demand performance from the tire companies. As a result, the tire on a new car has better rolling resistance than the same (apparently) identical tire from a tire store. You can tell if they are different by the DOT code on the tire, which identifies who and where it was actually made. You are absolutely correct that many car service people routinely underinflate tires, and often blindly use 32psi no matter what the vehicle calls for. On a 10mpg difference due to tires: That can easily happen with a high-mpg vehicle like the Insight. A 10 mpg drop (from 60mpg to 50mpg) is a 17% drop. The same 17% drop on a 15 mpg vehicle would only reduce it by 2.5 mpg (to 12.5 mpg). PS: Interesting info on the truck tires. Thanks! :-) -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
jerry freedomev via EV wrote: Hi Lee and All, I'm using some early Mazda Miata front hubs, brakes that has retraction V shaped springs that with just a couple tiny holes drilled in the pad for the wire spring end to fit, could fit many disc brakes that don't have them stock. Likely able to do it with just removing the tire. That's a great idea. I'll have to look into that. My LeCar EV always has dragging brakes. Like many, they depend on the roll-back of the rubber piston seals as their spring to pull back just a tiny bit. Then the calipers are supposed to be floating on pins, so that the slight runout of the rotor and play in the wheel bearing are enough to push the pads away from the rotor. It doesn't work. The o-ring pullback is too little, the pad is just loose between the piston and rotor (and tends to lay against the spinning rotor), and the floating pins always rust up and won't move. On Tire LRR common car tires are bad but MC tires are 2x's worse I found on my Streamliner MC low CG chassis !! I'll have to find better before doing the EV Streamliner, maybe even adapting LRR car tires if I can't find a LRR MC tire. I wonder why motorcycle tires are so much worse. Bicycle tires are obviously very good. What is different about motorcycle tires. Is there some fundamental reason for the higher rolling resistance, or is it just that the manufacturers don't bother (and customers don't care)? -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
I am guessing that most MC riders are interested in performance and in particular, stick-to-the-road performance, because unlike a car, any loss of traction on a bike will usually crash you (and there are no airbags). My suggestion would be to look at what other (production) EV bikes have done to get good range, Zero Motorcycles comes to mind. Cor van de Water Chief Scientist Proxim Wireless Corporation http://www.proxim.com Email: cwa...@proxim.com Private: http://www.cvandewater.info Skype: cor_van_de_water Tel: +1 408 383 7626 -Original Message- From: EV [mailto:ev-boun...@lists.evdl.org] On Behalf Of Lee Hart via EV Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 10:56 AM To: jerry freedomev; Electric Vehicle Discussion List Subject: Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed jerry freedomev via EV wrote: Hi Lee and All, I'm using some early Mazda Miata front hubs, brakes that has retraction V shaped springs that with just a couple tiny holes drilled in the pad for the wire spring end to fit, could fit many disc brakes that don't have them stock. Likely able to do it with just removing the tire. That's a great idea. I'll have to look into that. My LeCar EV always has dragging brakes. Like many, they depend on the roll-back of the rubber piston seals as their spring to pull back just a tiny bit. Then the calipers are supposed to be floating on pins, so that the slight runout of the rotor and play in the wheel bearing are enough to push the pads away from the rotor. It doesn't work. The o-ring pullback is too little, the pad is just loose between the piston and rotor (and tends to lay against the spinning rotor), and the floating pins always rust up and won't move. On Tire LRR common car tires are bad but MC tires are 2x's worse I found on my Streamliner MC low CG chassis !! I'll have to find better before doing the EV Streamliner, maybe even adapting LRR car tires if I can't find a LRR MC tire. I wonder why motorcycle tires are so much worse. Bicycle tires are obviously very good. What is different about motorcycle tires. Is there some fundamental reason for the higher rolling resistance, or is it just that the manufacturers don't bother (and customers don't care)? -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] New EV trike pickup.
jerry freedomev via EV wrote: Hi All, Just got my new EV trike on the road. It went together rather fast in just 2 weeks! That's great! Got any pictures? I love Jerry's KISS design EVs. I'll add 2 more 120 amphr 12 deep cycle Johnson Controls sold under Duralast brand to the 4 already there Probably OK for testing, but I suspect they won't last long. Otherwise contactor controllers have been working fine for me. simple, low cost, reliable and easy to repair even roadside. Ain't that the truth. :-) They're the simplest kind of controller to build and service. I have some examples posted on my website at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm I also have a pile of surplus contactors that I've acquired over the years. Contact me offlist if you need some. -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
I wonder why motorcycle tires are so much worse. Bicycle tires are obviously very good. What is different about motorcycle tires. Is there some fundamental reason for the higher rolling resistance, or is it just that the manufacturers don't bother (and customers don't care)? Not 100% sure, but I think rolling resistance is mostly caused by the tire deforming as it contacts the ground.The lowest rolling resistance would be a solid steel wheel.Any rubber, inflated wheel will deform and have a flat contact spot where it contacts the ground. If this deformation results in heat and this heat is lost to the environment , then you lose the energy and it appears as rolling resistance The area of this flat spot is related to the air presure. It's also related to the sidewall strength.The energy used in this deformation is also related to the shape of this contact patch. I've heard that a wide tire can have lower rolling resistance than a small skinny tire, because if a wide tire's contact patch is the same area as a skinny tire but this makes the flat spot of the wide tire result in less overall deformation. (i.e. it doesn't look so flat from the side and more like a circle instead of a circle with a flat spot) Of course a wide tire will probably have more air resistance though. If the energy used in this deformation could be recovered, then it wouldn't matter -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20141110/bcfc0c0a/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
On a road bike (more efficient than thick tired MTB) bicycle tires are very thin. There is some heat generated in the rubber itself from weighting and de-weighting and side loads. The molecules are literally sliding across each other, unwinding and winding back up. Heat results. The fabric carcass also has some flexing and sliding around. Heat results. Because the bike is human powered weight is measured out in grams instead of kilos or pounds. In particular the rotating bits have inertia to overcome spinning up - light tires make the bike noticeable more responsive. Pumping the tires up hard reduces the flexing and decreases rolling resistance. But designing them with less thickness is always better for efficiency. Harder compounds where there is less internal flow helps too. If you could run a tire 1/8 inch thick you would get much better efficiency from it. On Mon, Nov 10, 2014 at 1:56 PM, Lee Hart via EV ev@lists.evdl.org wrote: jerry freedomev via EV wrote: Hi Lee and All, I'm using some early Mazda Miata front hubs, brakes that has retraction V shaped springs that with just a couple tiny holes drilled in the pad for the wire spring end to fit, could fit many disc brakes that don't have them stock. Likely able to do it with just removing the tire. That's a great idea. I'll have to look into that. My LeCar EV always has dragging brakes. Like many, they depend on the roll-back of the rubber piston seals as their spring to pull back just a tiny bit. Then the calipers are supposed to be floating on pins, so that the slight runout of the rotor and play in the wheel bearing are enough to push the pads away from the rotor. It doesn't work. The o-ring pullback is too little, the pad is just loose between the piston and rotor (and tends to lay against the spinning rotor), and the floating pins always rust up and won't move. On Tire LRR common car tires are bad but MC tires are 2x's worse I found on my Streamliner MC low CG chassis !! I'll have to find better before doing the EV Streamliner, maybe even adapting LRR car tires if I can't find a LRR MC tire. I wonder why motorcycle tires are so much worse. Bicycle tires are obviously very good. What is different about motorcycle tires. Is there some fundamental reason for the higher rolling resistance, or is it just that the manufacturers don't bother (and customers don't care)? -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/ group/NEDRA) -- Put this question to yourself: should I use everyone else to attain happiness, or should I help others gain happiness? *Dalai Lama * Tell me what it is you plan to do With your one wild and precious life? Mary Oliver, The summer day. To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. Thomas A. Edison http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/quotes/t/thomasaed125362.html A public-opinion poll is no substitute for thought. *Warren Buffet* Michael E. Ross (919) 550-2430 Land (919) 576-0824 https://www.google.com/voice/b/0?pli=1#phones Google Phone (919) 631-1451 Cell (919) 513-0418 Desk michael.e.r...@gmail.com michael.e.r...@gmail.com -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20141110/88d18b9b/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] Range vs Speed
-- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20141110/88d1 8b9b/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA) ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
Re: [EVDL] New EV trike pickup.
Hi Lee, Cor and All, From: Lee Hart leeah...@earthlink.net To: jerry freedomev freedo...@yahoo.com; Electric Vehicle Discussion List ev@lists.evdl.org Sent: Monday, November 10, 2014 2:03 PM Subject: Re: [EVDL] New EV trike pickup. jerry freedomev via EV wrote: Hi All, Just got my new EV trike on the road. It went together rather fast in just 2 weeks! That's great! Got any pictures? I love Jerry's KISS design EVs. -Actually I do but where does one put them up? I'll send them directly to you Lee. Remember it's still getting built. I'll add 2 more 120 amphr 12 deep cycle Johnson Controls sold under Duralast brand to the 4 already there Probably OK for testing, but I suspect they won't last long. I've been through a lot of them but these work very nicely at least in 600lb EV's. I'm only drawing 30-40 amps so not hard on them. After 6 months they are still within .03 volt from each other. This is unlike most a true deep cycle battery. I wonder why motorcycle tires are so much worse. Bicycle tires are obviously very good. What is different about motorcycle tires. Is there some fundamental reason for the higher rolling resistance, or is it just that the manufacturers don't bother (and customers don't care)? ---I think it's mostly the compound of soft rubber both sticks better but generates heat. And far more concerned about the wheel becoming unstuck than tire drag. And likely why gas MC's get such bad mileage besides it's terrible aero. I like older used LRR car tires as the aged rubber is like 10-20% better than a new tire. Otherwise contactor controllers have been working fine for me. simple, low cost, reliable and easy to repair even roadside. Ain't that the truth. :-) They're the simplest kind of controller to build and service. I have some examples posted on my website at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/controllers.htm I also have a pile of surplus contactors that I've acquired over the years. Contact me offlist if you need some. - Hard to beat them in so many ways. Jerry Dycus -- A designer knows he has achieved perfection not when there is nothing left to add, but when there is nothing left to take away. -- Antoine de Saint Exupery -- Lee Hart's EV projects are at http://www.sunrise-ev.com/LeesEVs.htm -- next part -- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://lists.evdl.org/private.cgi/ev-evdl.org/attachments/20141110/96012414/attachment.htm ___ UNSUBSCRIBE: http://www.evdl.org/help/index.html#usub http://lists.evdl.org/listinfo.cgi/ev-evdl.org For EV drag racing discussion, please use NEDRA (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/NEDRA)
