RE: Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[authfriend]

Careful, Share, Barry isn't likely to keep defending you if you criticize the 
tactics he uses against his "enemies."
  
 

---In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 turq, that Puritanical, anti-body, anti-life streak runs so deep in some of us 
and goes back way farther than the Puritans. Notice how often FFL posters try 
to shame their enemies with sexual references. It's insidious to a horrifying 
degree. Ha, I'm on a mission now!
 

 
 
 On Friday, November 15, 2013 8:52 AM, TurquoiseB  wrote:
 
   --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ann wrote:
 >
 > > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
 > >
 > > Emily, it is and has been a pleasure for me to read posts
 > > from just about all the men on FFL The posts of the
 > > MGC? Not so much. Silly me!.
 >
 > Men! Listen up. You are providing a necessary community
 > service when you 'stimulate' Share with your attention and
 > ideas. Keep up the good work. Mean Girls need not apply.
 
 Mean Girls need not apply for membership in the human
 race. They don't qualify.
 
 > Are all the girls here "mean" BTW?
 
 The only ones we can be fairly certain fall into the Mean Girls
 category are the ones who have been piling on to Share ever
 since one of them got called on being a faux feminist. That
 would be Judy, Ann, and Emily.
 
 This behavior is about as *anti-feminist* as it gets. Personally
 I think Share should just write all three of them off as if they
 don't exist, but she compassionately still interacts with them,
 as she does with the other attention troll, Willytex. Waste 'o
 fuckin' time, if you ask me, but so be it, and better her than me.
 
 
 
 

 
 



 
 
 
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Share Long  wrote:
>
> turq, that Puritanical, anti-body, anti-life streak runs so deep in
some of us and goes back way farther than the Puritans. Notice how often
FFL posters try to shame their enemies with sexual references. It's
insidious to a horrifying degree. Ha, I'm on a mission now!

I've always assumed that for the people who do this, it's just been so
long since any of them have ever *had* sex of any kind that their only
ideas of it are shameful.  :-)

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Share Long]

turq, that Puritanical, anti-body, anti-life streak runs so deep in some of us 
and goes back way farther than the Puritans. Notice how often FFL posters try 
to shame their enemies with sexual references. It's insidious to a horrifying 
degree. Ha, I'm on a mission now!





On Friday, November 15, 2013 8:52 AM, TurquoiseB  wrote:
 
  
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  Ann wrote:
>
> > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>  >
>  > Emily, it is and has been a pleasure for me to read posts
> > from just about all the men on FFL The posts of the
> > MGC? Not so much. Silly me!.
>
>  Men! Listen up. You are providing a necessary community
> service when you 'stimulate' Share with your attention and
> ideas. Keep up the good work. Mean Girls need not apply.

Mean Girls need not apply for membership in the human
race. They don't qualify.

> Are all the girls here "mean" BTW?

The only ones we can be fairly certain fall into the Mean Girls
category are the ones who have been piling on to Share ever
since one of them got called on being a faux feminist. That
would be Judy, Ann, and Emily.

This behavior is about as *anti-feminist* as it gets. Personally
I think Share should just write all three of them off as if they
don't exist, but she compassionately still interacts with them,
as she does with the other attention troll, Willytex. Waste 'o
fuckin' time, if you ask me, but so be it, and better her than me.

[FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[awoelflebater]

Aww, poor sport and a monstrous hypocrite not to mention blind - that Barry is. 
 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, Ann 
wrote:
 >
 > > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 > > sharelong60@ wrote:
 > >
 > > Emily, it is and has been a pleasure for me to read posts
 > > from just about all the men on FFL The posts of the
 > > MGC? Not so much. Silly me!.
 >
 > Men! Listen up. You are providing a necessary community
 > service when you 'stimulate' Share with your attention and
 > ideas. Keep up the good work. Mean Girls need not apply.
 
 Mean Girls need not apply for membership in the human
 race. They don't qualify.
 
 > Are all the girls here "mean" BTW?
 
 The only ones we can be fairly certain fall into the Mean Girls
 category are the ones who have been piling on to Share ever
 since one of them got called on being a faux feminist. That
 would be Judy, Ann, and Emily.
 
 This behavior is about as *anti-feminist* as it gets. Personally
 I think Share should just write all three of them off as if they
 don't exist, but she compassionately still interacts with them,
 as she does with the other attention troll, Willytex. Waste 'o
 fuckin' time, if you ask me, but so be it, and better her than me.
 

[FairfieldLife] Re: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  Ann wrote:
>
> > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>  >
>  > Emily, it is and has been a pleasure for me to read posts
> > from just about all the men on FFL The posts of the
> > MGC? Not so much. Silly me!.
>
>  Men! Listen up. You are providing a necessary community
> service when you 'stimulate' Share with your attention and
> ideas. Keep up the good work. Mean Girls need not apply.

Mean Girls need not apply for membership in the human
race. They don't qualify.

> Are all the girls here "mean" BTW?

The only ones we can be fairly certain fall into the Mean Girls
category are the ones who have been piling on to Share ever
since one of them got called on being a faux feminist. That
would be Judy, Ann, and Emily.

This behavior is about as *anti-feminist* as it gets. Personally
I think Share should just write all three of them off as if they
don't exist, but she compassionately still interacts with them,
as she does with the other attention troll, Willytex. Waste 'o
fuckin' time, if you ask me, but so be it, and better her than me.

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Richard J. Williams]

Thanks for the information, but Card already provided the definition of 
'duHkham' from the Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon in his original post, so it 
looks like you're just making more stuff up and avoiding Card's 
question. "Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and 
advaita-vedaanta?" Go figure.


But, your whole argument about Sanskrit speakers and chariots in India 
falls apart when we realize that the Aryans didn't invade India in 
chariots and didn't have chariots with a wheel and an axle. And, even if 
the Aryans did invade India, chariots are not the typical conveyance of 
nomads or cattle and sheep herders. Can you imagine driving a 
spoke-wheeled chariot over the snow-capped Trans-Himalaya mountains and 
then down the mountainside and into a flock of sheep and cattle? It's 
difficult to imagine but go figure.


Works cited:

Thapar, Romila. A History of India. Penguin Books.
p. 28-49.

Frawley, David. The Myth of the Aryan Invasion.
http://www.hindunet.org/hindu_history/ancient/aryan/aryan_frawley.html

Read more:

Hooker, Richard. Ancient India – The Aryans.
http://www.wsu.edu:8080/~dee/ANCINDIA/ARYANS.HTM 



Wheel and axle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wheel_and_axle

Evolution of the Chariot:
http://www.nytimes.com/remaking-the-wheel-evolution-of-the-chariot.html 



On 11/14/2013 8:02 AM, emptyb...@yahoo.com wrote:


Now you can understand how the local dravidians ported over the word 
"ho" to apply to their gender opposites.





---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

emptybill, thanks for taking the time to explain this in more detail. 
I think of space, etc. as simple so couldn't connect that to chaos. 
But maybe to primitive peoples the skies seemed very chaotic with 
changing weather patterns, etc. I like to imagine those moments when 
the first cave person had a different association with a sound like 
kha. I like to wonder about the journey from hole to sky/ether/space 
to chaos.




On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:49 PM, "emptybill@..." 
 wrote:

Professor Troll couldn't read so here are some Wiki Holes.

Sukah and Dukha: the good and bad of it (FWIW).

Contemporary scholar Winthrop Sargeant explains the etymological roots 
of these terms as follows:^[45] 
 



The ancient Aryans who brought the Sanskrit language to India were
a nomadic, horse- and cattle-breeding people who travelled in
horse- or ox-drawn vehicles. /Su/ and /dus/ are prefixes
indicating good or bad. The word /kha/, in later Sanskrit meaning
"sky," "ether," or "space," was originally the word for "hole,"
particularly an axle hole of one of the Aryan's vehicles. Thus
/sukha/ … meant, originally, "having a good axle hole," while
/duhkha/ meant "having a poor axle hole," leading to discomfort.



---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

So, you don't know any Tibetan - I thought so.

This has got to be one of the most misleading and silly answers to a 
simple yoga question I've ever read on FFL or a.m.t. You'd expect a 
guy that has spent almost his entire adult life studying with gurus 
and rinpoches to at least know one single word in Tibetan. Go figure.


According to the Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon, the term 'dukkha' in 
Sanskrit, Pali and Tibetan is a Buddhist term commonly translated as 
'suffering', one of the most important concepts in the Buddhist 
tradition. In the Yoga Sutras the term vivek means 'a wise man'.


"All is suffering for the wise man" (Y.S. 2.15).

The most ancient sustained expression of yogic ideas is found in the 
early discourses of the historical Buddha, thus Patanjali's conception 
of freedom is related to the ancient Buddhist view that the source of 
suffering is the craving for permanence in a universe of impermanence.


Both the 'Four Noble Truths' and the 'Eightfold Path' articulated in 
the Buddha's first discourse are elements that underlie the yoga 
system. Two striking examples of this are Patanjali's use of the word 
'nirodha' in the opening definition of yoga as 'citta-vrtti-nirodha', 
that is, 'Yoga is the cessation of the turnings of thought' and the 
statement that "all is suffering, dukkha, for the wise man."


According to Stoler-Miller, dukkha, suffering, and nirodha, cessation, 
are crucial terms in Buddhist vocabulary and the doctrine of suffering 
is the core of what Buddhists believe the Buddha taught after gaining 
enlightenment. Patanjali's ashtang eight-limbed practice is parallel 
to the eight-limbed path of Buddha.


Work cited:

'Yoga: Discipline of Freedom'
by Barbara Stoler-Miller
Acclaimed translator of the Bhagavad Gita.
Bantam Wisdom Editions 1998
p. 5, 52.

On 11/12/2013 8:48 PM, emptybill@...  wrote:


Musta meant axle-rod.



---In fair

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Richard J. Williams]

Apparently several people missed out on the tantric implications of the 
'bad axel-hole' reference posted by emptybill. My question is: why would 
Uncle Tantra want to play a pun on emtybill's axel-rod with a comment 
about his own 'axel-hole'? Is this a dating site now? Go figure.


On 11/13/2013 12:22 PM, Share Long wrote:
Richard-san, so sorry but you are totally missing the tantric 
implications of all this. imho (-:




On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 12:19 PM, Richard J. Williams 
 wrote:
It looks like you've posted the most insightful reply to Card's query. 
Good work, Share!


Now this is funny, you've got to admit: a discussion group composed of 
numerous wise men (vivekins), tantrics, yogis, adepts, fakirs, and 
life-long seekers apparently didn't even know the primary word in 
Hinduism or Buddhism. One guy thought it meant a 'bad axel-hole', and 
the other guy got offended, now the first guy said it was 'axel-rod'. 
Now that's really funny!


On 11/13/2013 9:50 AM, Share Long wrote:
Richard a prayer for you: Lord, please grant me the serenity to 
accept the things I cannot change; the courage to change the things I 
can; and the wisdom to know the difference.


PS Do you really want us to all post alike?! Why not enjoy the buffet 
that is FFL?




On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:28 AM, Richard J. Williams 
  wrote:
What would it take to get you guys to look something up before you 
post your message and waste our time and take up band space? Not all 
of us are here just to make fun of Hindus.


Are there  any serious writers on this forum - I mean other than an 
editor, a few coders, and a baker? I'm beginning to think nobody, 
except the Cardmiester, on this list has ever even read Patajali's 
Yoga Sutras - even in English translation. This is starting to look 
like a total waste of time anymore. Have any of you guys ever thought 
about using Twitter for your one-liners? Go figure.


"Dukkha (Pali; Sanskrit: dukkha; Tibetan sdug bsngal) is a Buddhist 
term commonly translated as "suffering", "anxiety", "stress", or 
"unsatisfactoriness". The principle of dukkha is one of the most 
important concepts in the Buddhist tradition. The Buddha is reputed 
to have said: "I have taught one thing and one thing only, dukkha and 
the cessation of dukkha." The classic formulation of these teachings 
on dukkha is the doctrine of the Four Noble Truths, in which the 
Truth of Dukkha (Pali: dukkha saccã; Sanskrit: du?kha-satya) is 
identified as the first of the four truths."


Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha

On 11/12/2013 8:52 PM, Share Long wrote:

Well, empty, good to keep those rods and holes connected, imho



On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:48 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
  
 wrote:

Musta meant axle-rod.



---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com 
,  
 wrote:


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
, wrote:


>
> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
> It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.

Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)


> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com
, sharelong60@ wrote:
>
> Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One
possible

meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.

>
> In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the

danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.

>
>
> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@"
cardemaister@

wrote:

>
> According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam

vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.

>
>
> duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written
%{duS-kha}

and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,

>
>
> Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination
(viveka) all

is misery...

>
>
> So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>
>
> Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and

advaita-vedaanta?

> 

[FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[emptybill]

Now you can understand how the local dravidians ported over the word "ho" to 
apply to their gender opposites. 

 

 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 emptybill, thanks for taking the time to explain this in more detail. I think 
of space, etc. as simple so couldn't connect that to chaos. But maybe to 
primitive peoples the skies seemed very chaotic with changing weather patterns, 
etc. I like to imagine those moments when the first cave person had a different 
association with a sound like kha. I like to wonder about the journey from hole 
to sky/ether/space to chaos. 
 

 
 
 On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:49 PM, "emptybill@..."  wrote:
 
   Professor Troll couldn't read so here are some Wiki Holes.
 

 Sukah and Dukha: the good and bad of it (FWIW).

 

 Contemporary scholar Winthrop Sargeant explains the etymological roots of 
these terms as follows:[45] 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha#cite_note-FOOTNOTESargeant2009303-73 
 The ancient Aryans who brought the Sanskrit language to India were a nomadic, 
horse- and cattle-breeding people who travelled in horse- or ox-drawn vehicles. 
Su and dus are prefixes indicating good or bad. The word kha, in later Sanskrit 
meaning "sky," "ether," or "space," was originally the word for "hole," 
particularly an axle hole of one of the Aryan's vehicles. Thus sukha … meant, 
originally, "having a good axle hole," while duhkha meant "having a poor axle 
hole," leading to discomfort.  
 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 So, you don't know any Tibetan - I thought so. 
 
 This has got to be one of the most misleading and silly answers to a simple 
yoga question I've ever read on FFL or a.m.t. You'd expect a guy that has spent 
almost his entire adult life studying with gurus and rinpoches to at least know 
one single word in Tibetan. Go figure.
 
 According to the Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon, the term 'dukkha' in Sanskrit, Pali 
and Tibetan is a Buddhist term commonly translated as 'suffering', one of the 
most important concepts in the Buddhist tradition. In the Yoga Sutras the term 
vivek means 'a wise man'. 
 
 "All is suffering for the wise man" (Y.S. 2.15). 
 
 The most ancient sustained expression of yogic ideas is found in the early 
discourses of the historical Buddha, thus Patanjali's  conception of freedom is 
related to the ancient Buddhist view that the source of suffering is the 
craving for permanence in a universe of impermanence. 
 
 Both the 'Four Noble Truths' and the 'Eightfold Path' articulated in the 
Buddha's first discourse are elements that underlie the yoga system. Two 
striking examples of this are Patanjali's use of the word 'nirodha' in the 
opening definition of yoga as 'citta-vrtti-nirodha', that is, 'Yoga is the 
cessation of the turnings of thought' and the statement that "all is suffering, 
dukkha, for the wise man."
 
 According to Stoler-Miller, dukkha, suffering, and nirodha, cessation, are 
crucial terms in Buddhist vocabulary and the doctrine of suffering is the core 
of what Buddhists believe the Buddha taught after gaining enlightenment. 
Patanjali's ashtang eight-limbed practice is parallel to the eight-limbed path 
of Buddha.
 
 Work cited:
 
 'Yoga: Discipline of Freedom'
 by Barbara Stoler-Miller
 Acclaimed translator of the Bhagavad Gita.
 Bantam Wisdom Editions 1998
 p. 5, 52.
 
 On 11/12/2013 8:48 PM, emptybill@... mailto:emptybill@... wrote:
 
   Musta meant axle-rod. 
 
 
 
 
 
 ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 mailto:turquoiseb@... wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
wrote:
 >
 > Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
 > It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.
 
 Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
 
 
 > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 > sharelong60@ wrote:
 >
 > Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
 meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
 finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
 CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
 rather than of permanent bliss.
 >
 > In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
 danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
 >
 >
 > On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
 wrote:
 >
 > According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
 vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
 >
 >
 > duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
 and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
 probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
 uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
 R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
 difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
 >
 >
 > Taimni: 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Share Long]

emptybill, thanks for taking the time to explain this in more detail. I think 
of space, etc. as simple so couldn't connect that to chaos. But maybe to 
primitive peoples the skies seemed very chaotic with changing weather patterns, 
etc. I like to imagine those moments when the first cave person had a different 
association with a sound like kha. I like to wonder about the journey from hole 
to sky/ether/space to chaos. 





On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:49 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
 wrote:
 
  
Professor Troll couldn't read so here are some Wiki Holes.

Sukah and Dukha: the good and bad of it (FWIW).


Contemporary scholar Winthrop Sargeant explains the etymological roots of these 
terms as follows:[45] 
The ancient Aryans who brought the Sanskrit language to India were a nomadic, 
horse- and cattle-breeding people who travelled in horse- or 
ox-drawn vehicles. Su and dus are prefixes indicating good or bad. The word 
kha, in later Sanskrit meaning "sky," "ether," or "space," was originally 
the word for "hole," particularly an axle hole of one of the Aryan's 
vehicles. Thus sukha … meant, originally, "having a good axle hole," while 
duhkha meant "having a poor axle hole," leading to discomfort.
 


---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:


So, you don't know any Tibetan - I thought so. 

This has got to be one of the most misleading and silly answers to
  a simple yoga question I've ever read on FFL or a.m.t. You'd
  expect a guy that has spent almost his entire adult life studying
  with gurus and rinpoches to at least know one single word in
  Tibetan. Go figure.

According to the Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon, the term 'dukkha' in
  Sanskrit, Pali and Tibetan is a Buddhist term commonly translated
  as 'suffering', one of the most important concepts in the Buddhist
  tradition. In the Yoga Sutras the term vivek means 'a wise man'. 

"All is suffering for the wise man" (Y.S. 2.15). 

The most ancient sustained expression of yogic ideas is found in
  the early discourses of the historical Buddha, thus Patanjali's 
  conception of freedom is related to the ancient Buddhist view that
  the source of suffering is the craving for permanence in a
  universe of impermanence. 

Both the 'Four Noble Truths' and the 'Eightfold Path' articulated
  in the Buddha's first discourse are elements that underlie the
  yoga system. Two striking examples of this are Patanjali's use of
  the word 'nirodha' in the opening definition of yoga as
  'citta-vrtti-nirodha', that is, 'Yoga is the cessation of the
  turnings of thought' and the statement that "all is suffering,
  dukkha, for the wise man."

According to Stoler-Miller, dukkha, suffering, and nirodha,
  cessation, are crucial terms in Buddhist vocabulary and the
  doctrine of suffering is the core of what Buddhists believe the
  Buddha taught after gaining enlightenment. Patanjali's ashtang
  eight-limbed practice is parallel to the eight-limbed path of
  Buddha.

Work cited:

'Yoga: Discipline of Freedom'
by Barbara Stoler-Miller
Acclaimed translator of the Bhagavad Gita.
Bantam Wisdom Editions 1998
p. 5, 52.


On 11/12/2013 8:48 PM, emptybill@... wrote:
>
  
>Musta meant axle-rod. 
>
>
>
>
>
>---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:
>
>
>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote:
>
>>
>>> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos
(khaos).
>>> It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good
(su) axle-hole.
>>
>>
Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
>
>
>
>> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>>>
>>> Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret
this quote. One possible
>>
meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
>finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery.
OR the person in
>CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of
change, misery
>rather than of permanent bliss.
>
>>
>>> In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham
as danger: avert the
>>
danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
>
>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM,
"cardemaister@" cardemaister@
>>
wrote:
>
>>
>>> According to YS II 15: [blah blah
blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
>>
vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
>
>>
>>>
>>> duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians
properly written %{duS-kha}
>>
and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
>probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.)
uneasy ,
>uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv.
(compar. %{-tara} MBh.
>R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow ,
trouble ,
>difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
>
>>
>>>
>>> Taimni: To the people who have developed

[FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[emptybill]

Professor Troll couldn't read so here are some Wiki Holes.
 

 Sukah and Dukha: the good and bad of it (FWIW).

 

 Contemporary scholar Winthrop Sargeant explains the etymological roots of 
these terms as follows:[45] 
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha#cite_note-FOOTNOTESargeant2009303-73 
 The ancient Aryans who brought the Sanskrit language to India were a nomadic, 
horse- and cattle-breeding people who travelled in horse- or ox-drawn vehicles. 
Su and dus are prefixes indicating good or bad. The word kha, in later Sanskrit 
meaning "sky," "ether," or "space," was originally the word for "hole," 
particularly an axle hole of one of the Aryan's vehicles. Thus sukha … meant, 
originally, "having a good axle hole," while duhkha meant "having a poor axle 
hole," leading to discomfort.  
 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 So, you don't know any Tibetan - I thought so. 
 
 This has got to be one of the most misleading and silly answers to a simple 
yoga question I've ever read on FFL or a.m.t. You'd expect a guy that has spent 
almost his entire adult life studying with gurus and rinpoches to at least know 
one single word in Tibetan. Go figure.
 
 According to the Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon, the term 'dukkha' in Sanskrit, Pali 
and Tibetan is a Buddhist term commonly translated as 'suffering', one of the 
most important concepts in the Buddhist tradition. In the Yoga Sutras the term 
vivek means 'a wise man'. 
 
 "All is suffering for the wise man" (Y.S. 2.15). 
 
 The most ancient sustained expression of yogic ideas is found in the early 
discourses of the historical Buddha, thus Patanjali's  conception of freedom is 
related to the ancient Buddhist view that the source of suffering is the 
craving for permanence in a universe of impermanence. 
 
 Both the 'Four Noble Truths' and the 'Eightfold Path' articulated in the 
Buddha's first discourse are elements that underlie the yoga system. Two 
striking examples of this are Patanjali's use of the word 'nirodha' in the 
opening definition of yoga as 'citta-vrtti-nirodha', that is, 'Yoga is the 
cessation of the turnings of thought' and the statement that "all is suffering, 
dukkha, for the wise man."
 
 According to Stoler-Miller, dukkha, suffering, and nirodha, cessation, are 
crucial terms in Buddhist vocabulary and the doctrine of suffering is the core 
of what Buddhists believe the Buddha taught after gaining enlightenment. 
Patanjali's ashtang eight-limbed practice is parallel to the eight-limbed path 
of Buddha.
 
 Work cited:
 
 'Yoga: Discipline of Freedom'
 by Barbara Stoler-Miller
 Acclaimed translator of the Bhagavad Gita.
 Bantam Wisdom Editions 1998
 p. 5, 52.
 
 On 11/12/2013 8:48 PM, emptybill@... mailto:emptybill@... wrote:
 
   Musta meant axle-rod. 
 
 
 
 
 
 ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 mailto:turquoiseb@... wrote:
 
 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
wrote:
 >
 > Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
 > It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.
 
 Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
 
 
 > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 > sharelong60@ wrote:
 >
 > Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
 meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
 finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
 CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
 rather than of permanent bliss.
 >
 > In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
 danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
 >
 >
 > On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
 wrote:
 >
 > According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
 vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
 >
 >
 > duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
 and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
 probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
 uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
 R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
 difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
 >
 >
 > Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all
 is misery...
 >
 >
 > So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
 >
 >
 > Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and
 advaita-vedaanta?
 > 
 
 
 
 
 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Share Long]

Richard-san, so sorry but you are totally missing the tantric implications of 
all this. imho (-:





On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 12:19 PM, Richard J. Williams 
 wrote:
 
  
It looks like you've posted the most insightful reply to Card's query. Good 
work, Share!

Now this is funny, you've got to admit: a discussion group
  composed of numerous wise men (vivekins), tantrics, yogis, adepts,
  fakirs, and life-long seekers apparently didn't even know the
  primary word in Hinduism or Buddhism. One guy thought it meant a
  'bad axel-hole', and the other guy got offended, now the first guy
  said it was 'axel-rod'. Now that's really funny! 

On 11/13/2013 9:50 AM, Share Long wrote:

  
>Richard a prayer for you: Lord, please grant me the serenity to accept the 
>things I cannot change; the courage to change the things I can; and the wisdom 
>to know the difference.
>
>PS Do you really want us to all post alike?! Why not enjoy
  the buffet that is FFL?
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:28 AM, Richard J. Williams 
> wrote:
> 
>  
>What would it take to get you guys to look something up before you post your 
>message and waste our time and take up band space? Not all of us are here just 
>to make fun of Hindus. 
>
>Are there  any serious writers on this
  forum - I mean other than an editor, a
  few coders, and a baker? I'm beginning
  to think nobody, except the
  Cardmiester, on this list has ever
  even read Patajali's Yoga Sutras -
  even in English translation. This is
  starting to look like a total waste of
  time anymore. Have any of you guys
  ever thought about using Twitter for
  your one-liners? Go figure.
>
>"Dukkha (Pali; Sanskrit: dukkha;
  Tibetan sdug bsngal) is a Buddhist
  term commonly translated as
  "suffering", "anxiety", "stress", or
  "unsatisfactoriness". The principle of
  dukkha is one of the most important
  concepts in the Buddhist tradition.
  The Buddha is reputed to have said: "I
  have taught one thing and one thing
  only, dukkha and the cessation of
  dukkha." The classic formulation of
  these teachings on dukkha is the
  doctrine of the Four Noble Truths, in
  which the Truth of Dukkha (Pali:
  dukkha saccã; Sanskrit: du?kha-satya)
  is identified as the first of the four
  truths."
>
>Source:
>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha
>
>On 11/12/2013 8:52 PM, Share Long
  wrote:
>
>  
>>Well, empty, good to keep those rods and holes connected, imho
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:48 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
>> wrote:
>> 
>>  
>>Musta meant axle-rod. 
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:
>>
>>
>>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote:
>>
>>>
 Dukha is
  the opposite
  of sukha. Kha
  as in Chaos
  (khaos).
 It
  literally
  means a bad
  (du) axle-hole
  vs good (su)
  axle-hole.
>>>
>>>
Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
>>
>>
>>
>>> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:

 Card, I
  can see at
  least 2 ways
  to interpret
  this quote.
  One possible
>>>
meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
>>finite non
  Self and that
  duality itself
 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Richard J. Williams]

It looks like you've posted the most insightful reply to Card's query. 
Good work, Share!


Now this is funny, you've got to admit: a discussion group composed of 
numerous wise men (vivekins), tantrics, yogis, adepts, fakirs, and 
life-long seekers apparently didn't even know the primary word in 
Hinduism or Buddhism. One guy thought it meant a 'bad axel-hole', and 
the other guy got offended, now the first guy said it was 'axel-rod'. 
Now that's really funny!


On 11/13/2013 9:50 AM, Share Long wrote:
Richard a prayer for you: Lord, please grant me the serenity to accept 
the things I cannot change; the courage to change the things I can; 
and the wisdom to know the difference.


PS Do you really want us to all post alike?! Why not enjoy the buffet 
that is FFL?




On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:28 AM, Richard J. Williams 
 wrote:
What would it take to get you guys to look something up before you 
post your message and waste our time and take up band space? Not all 
of us are here just to make fun of Hindus.


Are there  any serious writers on this forum - I mean other than an 
editor, a few coders, and a baker? I'm beginning to think nobody, 
except the Cardmiester, on this list has ever even read Patajali's 
Yoga Sutras - even in English translation. This is starting to look 
like a total waste of time anymore. Have any of you guys ever thought 
about using Twitter for your one-liners? Go figure.


"Dukkha (Pali; Sanskrit: dukkha; Tibetan sdug bsngal) is a Buddhist 
term commonly translated as "suffering", "anxiety", "stress", or 
"unsatisfactoriness". The principle of dukkha is one of the most 
important concepts in the Buddhist tradition. The Buddha is reputed to 
have said: "I have taught one thing and one thing only, dukkha and the 
cessation of dukkha." The classic formulation of these teachings on 
dukkha is the doctrine of the Four Noble Truths, in which the Truth of 
Dukkha (Pali: dukkha saccã; Sanskrit: du?kha-satya) is identified as 
the first of the four truths."


Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha

On 11/12/2013 8:52 PM, Share Long wrote:

Well, empty, good to keep those rods and holes connected, imho



On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:48 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
  
 wrote:

Musta meant axle-rod.



---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com 
,  
 wrote:


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
, wrote:


>
> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
> It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.

Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)


> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com
, sharelong60@ wrote:
>
> Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One
possible

meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.

>
> In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the

danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.

>
>
> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@"
cardemaister@

wrote:

>
> According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam

vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.

>
>
> duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}

and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,

>
>
> Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination
(viveka) all

is misery...

>
>
> So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>
>
> Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and

advaita-vedaanta?

> 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Share Long]

Richard a prayer for you: Lord, please grant me the serenity to accept the 
things I cannot change; the courage to change the things I can; and the wisdom 
to know the difference.

PS Do you really want us to all post alike?! Why not enjoy the buffet that is 
FFL?





On Wednesday, November 13, 2013 8:28 AM, Richard J. Williams 
 wrote:
 
  
What would it take to get you guys to look something up before you post your 
message and waste our time and take up band space? Not all of us are here just 
to make fun of Hindus. 

Are there  any serious writers on this forum - I mean other than
  an editor, a few coders, and a baker? I'm beginning to think
  nobody, except the Cardmiester, on this list has ever even read
  Patajali's Yoga Sutras - even in English translation. This is
  starting to look like a total waste of time anymore. Have any of
  you guys ever thought about using Twitter for your one-liners? Go
  figure.

"Dukkha (Pali; Sanskrit: dukkha; Tibetan sdug bsngal) is a
  Buddhist term commonly translated as "suffering", "anxiety",
  "stress", or "unsatisfactoriness". The principle of dukkha is one
  of the most important concepts in the Buddhist tradition. The
  Buddha is reputed to have said: "I have taught one thing and one
  thing only, dukkha and the cessation of dukkha." The classic
  formulation of these teachings on dukkha is the doctrine of the
  Four Noble Truths, in which the Truth of Dukkha (Pali: dukkha
  saccã; Sanskrit: du?kha-satya) is identified as the first of the
  four truths."

Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha

On 11/12/2013 8:52 PM, Share Long wrote:

  
>Well, empty, good to keep those rods and holes connected, imho
>
>
>
>
>
>
>On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:48 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
> wrote:
> 
>  
>Musta meant axle-rod. 
>
>
>
>
>
>---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:
>
>
>--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, wrote:
>
>>
>>> Dukha is the
  opposite of sukha. Kha
  as in Chaos (khaos).
>>> It literally
  means a bad (du)
  axle-hole vs good (su)
  axle-hole.
>>
>>
Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
>
>
>
>> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>>>
>>> Card, I can see
  at least 2 ways to
  interpret this quote.
  One possible
>>
meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
>finite non Self and that
  duality itself causes
  misery. OR the person in
>CC realizes that all,
  meaning the world, is a
  field of change, misery
>rather than of permanent
  bliss.
>
>>
>>> In another quote,
  Maharishi translates
  dukham as danger:
  avert the
>>
danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
>
>>
>>>
>>> On Tuesday,
  November 12, 2013 2:31
  AM, "cardemaister@"
  cardemaister@
>>
wrote:
>
>>
>>> According to YS
  II 15: [blah blah
  blah...]...duHkham eva
  sarvam
>>
vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
>
>>
>>>
>>> duHkha 1 mfn.
  (according to
  grammarians properly
  written %{duS-kha}
>>
and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
>probably a Pra1kritized
  form for %{duH-stha} q.v.)
  uneasy ,
>uncomfortable , unpleasant
  , difficult R. Hariv.
  (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
>R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A})
  uneasiness , pain , sorrow
  , trouble ,
>difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
>
>>
>>>
>>> Taimni: To the
  people who have
  developed

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Richard J. Williams]

What would it take to get you guys to look something up before you post 
your message and waste our time and take up band space? Not all of us 
are here just to make fun of Hindus.


Are there  any serious writers on this forum - I mean other than an 
editor, a few coders, and a baker? I'm beginning to think nobody, except 
the Cardmiester, on this list has ever even read Patajali's Yoga Sutras 
- even in English translation. This is starting to look like a total 
waste of time anymore. Have any of you guys ever thought about using 
Twitter for your one-liners? Go figure.


"Dukkha (Pali; Sanskrit: dukkha; Tibetan sdug bsngal) is a Buddhist term 
commonly translated as "suffering", "anxiety", "stress", or 
"unsatisfactoriness". The principle of dukkha is one of the most 
important concepts in the Buddhist tradition. The Buddha is reputed to 
have said: "I have taught one thing and one thing only, dukkha and the 
cessation of dukkha." The classic formulation of these teachings on 
dukkha is the doctrine of the Four Noble Truths, in which the Truth of 
Dukkha (Pali: dukkha saccã; Sanskrit: du?kha-satya) is identified as the 
first of the four truths."


Source:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dukkha

On 11/12/2013 8:52 PM, Share Long wrote:

Well, empty, good to keep those rods and holes connected, imho



On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:48 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
 wrote:

Musta meant axle-rod.



---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
, wrote:


>
> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
> It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.

Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)


> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com
, sharelong60@ wrote:
>
> Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One
possible

meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.

>
> In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the

danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.

>
>
> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@

wrote:

>
> According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam

vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.

>
>
> duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}

and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,

>
>
> Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all

is misery...

>
>
> So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>
>
> Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and

advaita-vedaanta?

> 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Richard J. Williams]

So, you don't know any Tibetan - I thought so.

This has got to be one of the most misleading and silly answers to a 
simple yoga question I've ever read on FFL or a.m.t. You'd expect a guy 
that has spent almost his entire adult life studying with gurus and 
rinpoches to at least know one single word in Tibetan. Go figure.


According to the Cologne Sanskrit Lexicon, the term 'dukkha' in 
Sanskrit, Pali and Tibetan is a Buddhist term commonly translated as 
'suffering', one of the most important concepts in the Buddhist 
tradition. In the Yoga Sutras the term vivek means 'a wise man'.


"All is suffering for the wise man" (Y.S. 2.15).

The most ancient sustained expression of yogic ideas is found in the 
early discourses of the historical Buddha, thus Patanjali's conception 
of freedom is related to the ancient Buddhist view that the source of 
suffering is the craving for permanence in a universe of impermanence.


Both the 'Four Noble Truths' and the 'Eightfold Path' articulated in the 
Buddha's first discourse are elements that underlie the yoga system. Two 
striking examples of this are Patanjali's use of the word 'nirodha' in 
the opening definition of yoga as 'citta-vrtti-nirodha', that is, 'Yoga 
is the cessation of the turnings of thought' and the statement that "all 
is suffering, dukkha, for the wise man."


According to Stoler-Miller, dukkha, suffering, and nirodha, cessation, 
are crucial terms in Buddhist vocabulary and the doctrine of suffering 
is the core of what Buddhists believe the Buddha taught after gaining 
enlightenment. Patanjali's ashtang eight-limbed practice is parallel to 
the eight-limbed path of Buddha.


Work cited:

'Yoga: Discipline of Freedom'
by Barbara Stoler-Miller
Acclaimed translator of the Bhagavad Gita.
Bantam Wisdom Editions 1998
p. 5, 52.

On 11/12/2013 8:48 PM, emptyb...@yahoo.com wrote:


Musta meant axle-rod.




---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com 
, wrote:


>
> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
> It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.

Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)


> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com
, sharelong60@ wrote:
>
> Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One
possible

meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.

>
> In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the

danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.

>
>
> On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@

wrote:

>
> According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam

vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.

>
>
> duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}

and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,

>
>
> Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all

is misery...

>
>
> So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>
>
> Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and

advaita-vedaanta?

> 

[FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[awoelflebater]

 
 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
wrote:
 >
 > Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
 > It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.
 
 Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
 

 Barry, you may be human after all, and funny at that.
 
 
 > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 > sharelong60@ wrote:
 >
 > Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
 meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
 finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
 CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
 rather than of permanent bliss.
 >
 > In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
 danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
 >
 >
 > On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
 wrote:
 >
 > According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
 vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
 >
 >
 > duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
 and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
 probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
 uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
 R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
 difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
 >
 >
 > Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all
 is misery...
 >
 >
 > So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
 >
 >
 > Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and
 advaita-vedaanta?
 > 
 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Share Long]

Well, empty, good to keep those rods and holes connected, imho





On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:48 PM, "emptyb...@yahoo.com" 
 wrote:
 
  
Musta meant axle-rod. 




---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:


--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

>
>> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
>>  It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.
>
>Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole?  :-)



> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>>
>>  Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
>meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.

>
>>  In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
>danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.

>
>>
>>  On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
>wrote:

>
>>According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
>vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.

>
>>
>>   duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
>and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,

>
>>
>>  Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all
>is misery...

>
>>
>>  So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>>
>>
>>  Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and
>advaita-vedaanta?

> 

[FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[emptybill]

Musta meant axle-rod. 

 

 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 --- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com mailto:FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com, 
wrote:
 >
 > Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
 > It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.
 
 Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole? :-)
 
 
 > ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com mailto:fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, 
 > sharelong60@ wrote:
 >
 > Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
 meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
 finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
 CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
 rather than of permanent bliss.
 >
 > In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
 danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
 >
 >
 > On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
 wrote:
 >
 > According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
 vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
 >
 >
 > duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
 and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
 probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
 uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
 R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
 difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
 >
 >
 > Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all
 is misery...
 >
 >
 > So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
 >
 >
 > Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and
 advaita-vedaanta?
 > 
 

Re: [FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Richard J. Williams]

That makes sense, I guess, if you're trying to maintain a chariot. But, 
it doesn't tell us much about Yoga.


There are just a few little-bitty points that I would like to clarify 
concerning the your definition. In the Bhagavad Gita, which forms part 
of the Mahabharata, it is the Buddhist teaching against the wickedness 
of warfare which is implicitly opposed. The Bhagavad Gita is a polemic 
indicating the Hindu opposition to pacifism. Though Buddhism is not 
mentioned, Arjuna's initial objection to war are couched in typically 
Buddhist terms. The doctrine of the imperishable Atman is used to combat 
Arjuna's scruples.


Yoga - 1. the act of yoking. 2. A system taught by Patanjali and called 
the Yoga philosophy; it is the second of the two Samkhya systems, its 
chief aim being to teach the means by which the human spirit may attain 
complete Knowledge of Ishvara or the Supreme Spirit. 3. in the practice 
of meditation it is closely connected with Buddhism. 4. in Samkhya the 
identity of soul with matter.



On 11/12/2013 8:26 AM, emptyb...@yahoo.com wrote:


Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).

It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.



---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible 
meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and 
the finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the 
person in CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of 
change, misery rather than of permanent bliss.


In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the 
danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.



On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@..." 
 wrote:
According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam 
vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.


 duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha} 
and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more 
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy , 
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} 
MBh. R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble , 
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,


Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all 
is misery...


So, is a vivekin at least in CC?

Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and 
advaita-vedaanta?

Re: [FairfieldLife] Re: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[Share Long]

Oy, I didn't even get that turq til your comment. Sounds like empty (hole?) was 
saying that hole=chaos which traditionally is how many men on spiritual paths 
see holes of all sorts (-:





On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 8:35 AM, TurquoiseB  wrote:
 
  
--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:
>
> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
>  It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.

Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole?  :-)

> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>
>  Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.
>
>  In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
>
>
>  On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
wrote:
>
>According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
>
>
>   duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
>
>
>  Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all
is misery...
>
>
>  So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>
>
>  Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and
advaita-vedaanta?
>

[FairfieldLife] Re: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[TurquoiseB]

--- In FairfieldLife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:
>
> Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
>  It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole.

Who exactly are you calling an axle-hole?  :-)


> ---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com, sharelong60@ wrote:
>
>  Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible
meaning is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the
finite non Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in
CC realizes that all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery
rather than of permanent bliss.
>
>  In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the
danger which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.
>
>
>  On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@" cardemaister@
wrote:
>
>According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam
vivekinaH ... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin.
>
>
>   duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha}
and said to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more
probably a Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy ,
uncomfortable , unpleasant , difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh.
R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , pain , sorrow , trouble ,
difficulty S3Br. xiv ,
>
>
>  Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all
is misery...
>
>
>  So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
>
>
>  Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and
advaita-vedaanta?
>

[FairfieldLife] RE: OMG: viveka, vivekin?

[emptybill]

Dukha is the opposite of sukha. Kha as in Chaos (khaos).
 It literally means a bad (du) axle-hole vs good (su) axle-hole. 

 

---In fairfieldlife@yahoogroups.com,  wrote:

 Card, I can see at least 2 ways to interpret this quote. One possible meaning 
is that for the person in CC, there is the infinite Self and the finite non 
Self and that duality itself causes misery. OR the person in CC realizes that 
all, meaning the world, is a field of change, misery rather than of permanent 
bliss.
 

 In another quote, Maharishi translates dukham as danger: avert the danger 
which has not arisen. Heyam dukham anagatam.

 
 
 On Tuesday, November 12, 2013 2:31 AM, "cardemaister@..."  
wrote:
 
   According to YS II 15: [blah blah blah...]...duHkham eva sarvam vivekinaH 
... everything (sarvam) [is] only (eva) duHkha for a vivekin. 
 

  duHkha 1 mfn. (according to grammarians properly written %{duS-kha} and said 
to be from %{dus} and %{kha} [cf. %{su-kha4}] ; but more probably a 
Pra1kritized form for %{duH-stha} q.v.) uneasy , uncomfortable , unpleasant , 
difficult R. Hariv. (compar. %{-tara} MBh. R.) ; n. (ifc. f. %{A}) uneasiness , 
pain , sorrow , trouble , difficulty S3Br. xiv , 
 

 Taimni: To the people who have developed discrimination (viveka) all is 
misery...
 

 So, is a vivekin at least in CC?
 

 Is the meaning of viveka approximately the same in yoga and advaita-vedaanta?